Small Light Programs Better

[mooreted]

Maybe I'm old-fashioned or just old. It seems to me small, efficient programs are better than big conglomerate programs that include everything but the kitchen sink. They run better and faster and they don't have a gagillion options I'll never use in my life. The same for desktop or window managers. For instance I like:

Audacious vs Rhythmbox/Amarok/iTunes
AbiWord vs Libre/Word
OpenBox vs Kde/Gnome/Unity/OSX/Windows

And so on.

Was just wondering how many of you feel that software went off the rails long ago with trying to include millions of "features" no one actually needs?

[Rodney9]

I agree. That's why I use Lubuntu on my laptop and Xubuntu on my desktop.

[TeoBigusGeekus]

Maybe I'm old-fashioned or just old. It seems to me small, efficient programs are better than big conglomerate programs that include everything but the kitchen sink. They run better and faster and they don't have a gagillion options I'll never use in my life. The same for desktop or window managers. For instance I like:

Audacious vs Rhythmbox/Amarok/iTunes
AbiWord vs Libre/Word
OpenBox vs Kde/Gnome/Unity/OSX/Windows

And so on.

Was just wondering how many of you feel that software went off the rails long ago with trying to include millions of "features" no one actually needs?

+1 for your thoughts.
More features == perhaps a bit more functionality (when present;)), some eye candy, but also TONS of additional bugs and more computing resources needed.

We've reached the point when (both in windows and linux) we need half a gig of ram (or more) to do exactly the same things we did a decade ago with 1/5 (1/10?) of that power.

[WasMeHere]

+1
Have fun :-)
Olle

[JRV]

You got that right.

[keithpeter]

+1 most of the time

I must use LibreOffice for presentations and writing handouts though (LibreOffice Maths formula handling is good and fast - yes I do know about LaTeX/TeX/Lyx). Gnumeric has nice graphs, Abiword is much better than it used to be but can't manage the layouts &c yet. I'm watching it though.

I like Firefox for the plugins (Zotero)

The rest is lightish

mtpaint can do the things I need to do to photographs in place of GIMP on the netbook

MOC is just a nice console music player period. I use that on all my linux computers.

[Naiki Muliaina]

I would not say they are generally better as thats subjective to the user. Give me GIMP over MSPaint any day. ;)

[ziekfiguur]

I would not say they are generally better as thats subjective to the user. Give me GIMP over MSPaint any day. ;)

He said mtpaint, not mspaint.

[Flymo]

@KeithPeter - what he said!

Sometimes on very lightweight hardware I find that Midori is the only browser option due to shortage of RAM. But even then, loading todays web pages can eat RAM up bigtime.

[3Miro]

For every task that I have I have a minimal number of features that I need to be efficient. Anything over that is bloat.

The problem is that people have different needs. What works for one person is not enough for another, a huge program would potentially serve more people.

Linux has so much diversity and many people are not taking advantage of it. At one point I was using 5 - 6 distros with all sorts of DE in any possible configuration. I settled at Gentoo + XFCE, but I do use a number of Gnome apps like evince and sometimes Gnome Mplayer.

I think people should do the same, try a whole bunch of stuff and see what works the best. Don't always settle for the defaults.

[Flymo]

@3Miro, good point.

For media I usually end up with VLC. Often need the range of CODECS.

[Naiki Muliaina]

He said mtpaint, not mspaint.

I wasn't really referring to him, just makin a point a point that I prefer a full art package rather than a small one. Though the same applies to MTPaint to be honest... Doesn't do what I need it to do ^^

Really got my eyes on Krita art packages at the moment ^^ Good contender for GIMP!

[mooreted]

Good, glad I'm not the only one.

I suppose if you're doing professional work you probably need a more sophisticated program, but I notice when helping my users with Word, for instance, there are layers and layers of GUI options and not one of my users ever use any of it. It just makes finding simple options that much more difficult.

As far as footprint; I suppose our modern super computers can handle pretty much whatever we throw at them, but how much power do I really need to post this?

[Flymo]

Yup!

We've been trying to re-use older & lower power machines that we own, scrounge, or just buy cheap. Three rugged P3 laptops for £90, anyone? We must have had a dozen of those over the years for the kids in our family and their young friends. Growing up now....

Xubuntu used to fly pretty well in 256MB RAM, but we've moved to Lubuntu in the last year and have been having great results with frugal installs of Puppy and (lately) Bodhi Linux.

[krapp]

Maybe I'm old-fashioned or just old. It seems to me small, efficient programs are better than big conglomerate programs that include everything but the kitchen sink. They run better and faster and they don't have a gagillion options I'll never use in my life. The same for desktop or window managers. For instance I like:

Audacious vs Rhythmbox/Amarok/iTunes
AbiWord vs Libre/Word
OpenBox vs Kde/Gnome/Unity/OSX/Windows

And so on.

Was just wondering how many of you feel that software went off the rails long ago with trying to include millions of "features" no one actually needs?

Audacious? Ditch the GUI!

[mooreted]

Audacious? Ditch the GUI!

I like how it looks, like old WinAmp.

[krapp]

If you like how it looks great.

But you can go lighter! Audio players should really just be a file manager that can play codecs. I use moc (looks a lot like Midnight Commander), but there's cmus, cplay, and a number of mpd frontends.

[mooreted]

If you like how it looks great.

But you can go lighter! Audio players should really just be a file manager that can play codecs. I use moc (looks a lot like Midnight Commander), but there's cmus, cplay, and a number of mpd frontends.

Haven't heard of most of those. Might check it out. I like MC.

[amjjawad]

Maybe I'm old-fashioned or just old. It seems to me small, efficient programs are better than big conglomerate programs that include everything but the kitchen sink. They run better and faster and they don't have a gagillion options I'll never use in my life. The same for desktop or window managers. For instance I like:

Audacious vs Rhythmbox/Amarok/iTunes
AbiWord vs Libre/Word
OpenBox vs Kde/Gnome/Unity/OSX/Windows

And so on.

Was just wondering how many of you feel that software went off the rails long ago with trying to include millions of "features" no one actually needs?

You are absolutely NOT alone :)
Lubuntu and LXDE addicted here and member of the team. I just love it.


"Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication." -- Leonardo da Vinci

[TeoBigusGeekus]

Haven't heard of most of those. Might check it out. I like MC.

Check out these pages:

https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Common_Applications

https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=111878

https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=88515

EDIT: Hi amjjawad!!!

[krapp]

...

Da Vinci did not say that.

[mooreted]

Check out these pages:

https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Common_Applications

https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=111878

https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=88515

EDIT: Hi amjjawad!!!

Cool, thanks.

[keithpeter]

Though the same applies to MTPaint to be honest... Doesn't do what I need it to do ^^

Then you are in the same position regarding photo editing packages as I find myself in with office apps!

I just have to have LibreOffice over Abiword. Gnumeric is promising and can do graphs that I'd have to use R for otherwise. It's all down to use cases and user choice.

[keithpeter]

Da Vinci did not say that.

Yup, no references available in English translation.

Remember that 'sophistry' and 'sophistication' had a different meaning then - confusion, deliberate hiding of information, to make the holder of the information seem important. Sort of like consultants :twisted:

Try this one...


Many will think they may reasonably blame me by alleging that my proofs are opposed to the authority of certain men held in the highest reverence by their inexperienced judgments; not considering that my works are the issue of pure and simple experience, who is the one true mistress. These rules are sufficient to enable you to know the true from the false--and this aids men to look only for things that are possible and with due moderation--and not to wrap yourself in ignorance, a thing which can have no good result, so that in despair you would give yourself up to melancholy

[MooPi]

Welcome to my world of minimal applications. I wrote this simple script and added it to /usr/bin called "playogg"

#!/bin/bash
ogg123 -r **.oggRuns in terminal.

[Naiki Muliaina]

Then you are in the same position regarding photo editing packages as I find myself in with office apps!

2 for you too try free.

http://www.calligra-suite.org/
Calligra Suite. Its sorta KOffice but being done well.

http://www-03.ibm.com/software/lotus/symphony/home.nsf/home
Loyus Symphony, IBMs office suite, originated from Open Office, looks and feels completely different now.

[amjjawad]

Hi amjjawad!!!

Hi my friend, great we finally on the same thread :D

[amjjawad]

Da Vinci did not say that.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KISS_principle

[keithpeter]

2 for you too try free.

http://www.calligra-suite.org/
Calligra Suite. Its sorta KOffice but being done well.

http://www-03.ibm.com/software/lotus/symphony/home.nsf/home
Loyus Symphony, IBMs office suite, originated from Open Office, looks and feels completely different now.

Thanks Naiki Muliaina

Calligra needs KDE and will bring shed loads of dependencies. I've been there before with Krita on a Gnome desktop.

Lotus Symphony is LibreOffice minus the patches!

Neither could be regarded as light, but I hope KDE Office/Calligra gets some development.

Cheers

[TREESofRIGHTEOUSNESS]

i tried Lubuntu on my OLD laptop, and a bunch of other distros... but the only one that has worked wonderfully has been Xubuntu.
I had figured Lubuntu would have run faster.... but for some reason Xfce4 runs lightning fast on this comp.
I like audacious for certain applications, but it lacks certain features of the i-tunes-like programs...

audacity is a great lightweight multi-track recorder!!

lmms runs well on my old comp too. very powerful, but still light enough to run well:guitar:

[krapp]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KISS_principle

Where's the citation there?

If you insist:

http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Leonardo_da_Vinci#Disputed

[amjjawad]

Where's the citation there?

If you insist:

http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Leonardo_da_Vinci#Disputed

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KISS_principle


The principle most likely finds its origins in similar concepts, such as Occam's razor (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam%27s_razor), and Albert Einstein (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein)'s maxim that "everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler".[6] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KISS_principle#cite_note-5) Leonardo da Vinci (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leonardo_da_Vinci)'s "Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication", or Antoine de Saint Exupéry (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antoine_de_Saint_Exup%C3%A9ry)'s "It seems that perfection is reached not when there is nothing left to add, but when there is nothing left to take away".

It's not my fault that Wikipedia is messed up beside, many google search will lead to the same.

Now, back to topic because it has nothing to do with what we are talking about here.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KISS_principle

:)

[krapp]

Just because it's been endlessly and mindlessly repeated throughout the Internet doesn't mean it exists in Da Vinci's writings. Nobody has been able to find a text for it. It's an imaginary quotation in what's very transparently late 20th-century language. KISS is a hacker/engineer ideology, not some perennial aesthetic or theoretical concern.

[Rodney9]

Welcome to my world of minimal applications. I wrote this simple script and added it to /usr/bin called "playogg"

#!/bin/bash
ogg123 -r **.oggRuns in terminal.

Cool, Thank You

[mooreted]

Cool, Thank You

Huh, that's pretty cool.