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collisionystm
October 7th, 2011, 09:32 PM
Okay this has to be the biggest and most annoying thing in Unity. (Obviously my opinion).

We have all used Docky, yes? (if not, try it)
Do you know what makes Docky so awesome? It friggin does everything. Obviously its not the same ballpark as cairo or others, but thats because its just accomplishing what it is supposed to. A simple dock that just works. No over-the-top bells and whistles.
Unity needs to steal a few ideas from docky. The biggest one is the ability to minimize and maximize a program by clicking on its icon in the dock. Right now you can only Maximize. I don't want to find a minimize button, I just like clicking the icon to shrink it. Docky has this, OSX has this... Unity needs this.

How about right clicking the dock and going to DOCK SETTINGS. Or Unity bar settings?? Why hide it in Compiz config?

With the new setup of 11.10's bar, we should be able to move the bar to another part of the screen now. The menu button is now located directly on it. This was in issue with 11.04's setup, but this is different. Its ready!

These things are so simple, but it makes it so much better.
Canonical wants to make Ubuntu simple for a brand new user... well these, things might help. I think. Unity is what it is, lets stop making big changes to it and start with the little annoyances.



11.10 has not been released yet! There is still time to fix this! Hurry developers! Hurry!!!! :)

ubudog
October 7th, 2011, 09:35 PM
I agree - Unity should be more customizable. If only we could (easily) move the bar to the bottom, that would be awesome.

collisionystm
October 7th, 2011, 09:45 PM
I agree - Unity should be more customizable. If only we could (easily) move the bar to the bottom, that would be awesome.

Yeah that would be great. Maybe a better looking default Icon theme?

One thing I never understood.... Ubuntu is free. It is 'Community' based. If all this is true, why on earth are icons like Faenza not made default for Ubuntu? Things like that deserve to be shown off!



How about including remmina remote desktop? How long has that problem been going on with Terminal Server client in Ubuntu where you close out of a Windows RDP and it says, ERROR. Wtf. I have been using Ubuntu since 8.04 and that has always happened.

... just stupid little annoyances. Blah. I think its the little things that matter the most in a system.

Krytarik
October 7th, 2011, 10:03 PM
One thing I never understood.... Ubuntu is free. It is 'Community' based. If all this is true, why on earth are icons like Faenza not made default for Ubuntu? Things like that deserve to be shown off!
Well, if they were wanted by most Ubuntu users - or users to be - , they would. ;-)
Depending on their license, of course.

sarton85
October 7th, 2011, 10:11 PM
Canonical wants to make Ubuntu simple for a brand new user... well these, things might help. I think. Unity is what it is, lets stop making big changes to it and start with the little annoyances.

I believe Canonical and independent Ubuntu developers are well aware of the fact that Unity is not as customizable as it should be. But I believe Unity in 11.10 came a long way since 11.04.

Yes there are small annoyances which have te be addressed. But I believe in Unity and prefer it over Gnome 2. I think we need to have some patience until 12.04 and hope Unity will be more mature around that time. Don't forget the hard job developers had to port Unity to a completely new version of Gnome.

Copper Bezel
October 7th, 2011, 10:21 PM
collisionystm, check this (http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2010/12/why-doesnt-unity-just-use-docky/) out.

collisionystm
October 8th, 2011, 02:44 AM
collisionystm, check this (http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2010/12/why-doesnt-unity-just-use-docky/) out.

Great link... Atleast I am not alone!
It still sounds a little ridiculous to me. Of course I don't develop, but the things I am asking for don't seem to be that hard to implement into whats already there, right? Obviously that article is talking Unity has a 'whole' interface. I am just talking about the Function of the bar. Thats it.

Copper Bezel
October 8th, 2011, 05:08 AM
I think it's funny that the window spread feature is cited as an example there, actually. The same trick can be managed through Compiz's dbus plugin, which is how DockBarX manages the same feature.

I don't think it's related directly to the feature of minimizing to the dock (or moving the launcher, for that matter) as Shuttleworth has actually weighed in personally on both of those issues for UX reasons. I have to admit, I think the left is the most logical place for a dock and that clicking a task item to minimize it is a nonsense feature, because it's exactly the opposite of what happens in any other case that the item is clicked, but I don't necessarily think it makes sense to micromanage users' workflows like that.

To expand on those ideas, briefly:

The dock on the left matches the "bookmark" navigation in file managers, the toolbar in many text and image editors, and the navigation bar in web design. For left-to-right-reading audiences, a vertical column at the left makes sense for top-level task management. Horizontal taskbars and tab bars have a different advantage, mostly in that they can display text names, but since Unity's Launcher is icon-driven, a vertical column on the left seems a logical choice for something that controls and navigates the "content pane" of the desktop.

Items in the Launcher represent applications, not windows. Clicking the item launches or brings forward the application, and if the application has multiple windows, it spreads them to allow you to select between them. At the core, it's not a window-level task manager, and clicking the icon always leads to interacting with the application, so minimizing, as a window management feature that does the opposite, seems unrelated and shouldn't occur by the same action.

Many docks include window lists, but Unity's does not. With a window list, window-specific features can be worked in, including closing and minimizing (and I much appreciate both in DockBarX, but I can see how they don't suit the Unity scheme.)

wolfen69
October 8th, 2011, 06:14 AM
Okay this has to be the biggest and most annoying thing in Unity. (Obviously my opinion).

We have all used Docky, yes? (if not, try it)
Do you know what makes Docky so awesome? It friggin does everything. Obviously its not the same ballpark as cairo or others, but thats because its just accomplishing what it is supposed to. A simple dock that just works. No over-the-top bells and whistles.
Unity needs to steal a few ideas from docky. The biggest one is the ability to minimize and maximize a program by clicking on its icon in the dock. Right now you can only Maximize. I don't want to find a minimize button, I just like clicking the icon to shrink it. Docky has this, OSX has this... Unity needs this.

How about right clicking the dock and going to DOCK SETTINGS. Or Unity bar settings?? Why hide it in Compiz config?

With the new setup of 11.10's bar, we should be able to move the bar to another part of the screen now. The menu button is now located directly on it. This was in issue with 11.04's setup, but this is different. Its ready!

These things are so simple, but it makes it so much better.
Canonical wants to make Ubuntu simple for a brand new user... well these, things might help. I think. Unity is what it is, lets stop making big changes to it and start with the little annoyances.



11.10 has not been released yet! There is still time to fix this! Hurry developers! Hurry!!!! :)

I'm not sure I completely understand you. If you want Ubuntu to be something for you, make it that way. Just because the default iso has unity doesn't mean you can't enjoy something else. Ubuntu can run all DE's and window managers.

mc4man
October 8th, 2011, 08:31 AM
The biggest one is the ability to minimize and maximize a program by clicking on its icon in the dock.
There was a proposed option for unity-3.x in 11.04 to do this - the design team rejected.

It is however still quite simple to enable in the 11.04 source & rebuild unity to have the option.
If inclined I have a patch I updated to work with the current unity source in 11.04. (at least last time I used 11.04, easy to readjust patch if current source has changed a bit

Keep it going for a bit in 11.10, then some significant source changes made it too much to keep up with.
Screen shows option

vehemoth
October 8th, 2011, 10:34 AM
The dock on the left matches the "bookmark" navigation in file managers, the toolbar in many text and image editors, and the navigation bar in web design. For left-to-right-reading audiences, a vertical column at the left makes sense for top-level task management. Horizontal taskbars and tab bars have a different advantage, mostly in that they can display text names, but since Unity's Launcher is icon-driven, a vertical column on the left seems a logical choice for something that controls and navigates the "content pane" of the desktop.
You forgot about us dual monitor users. I currently have my secondary monitor to the left of my primary one, I don't want to have to go over a dock to get to my secondary monitor, I'd much rather have it on the right side espicially if it autohides.

collisionystm
October 8th, 2011, 12:13 PM
I'm not sure I completely understand you. If you want Ubuntu to be something for you, make it that way. Just because the default iso has unity doesn't mean you can't enjoy something else. Ubuntu can run all DE's and window managers.

I know i can make it that way but still I wish the bar had a little more 'docky' to it by default. Even the windows 7 taskbar has more life to it. Like it or not but that bar is the signature of unity. It's the feature that, at first glance, makes ubuntu stand out. I just think canonical could take a little time from making the lens to making the bar itself better.

trivialpackets
October 8th, 2011, 01:06 PM
I think that as Unity evolves it will become more open for the users to customize. What they seem to be going for is continuity.

As to minimizing windows or moving the dockbar, it would be great if these things could be changed, but it really could be more of a conscious choice.

I find that in Unity, not only does it seem like you're encouraged to use everything in full screen mode (not that you don't have the option not to) but I have found that by effectively using the keyboard shortcuts and my multiple desktops that I really don't ever minimize anything.

What I mean is that if I want to see the desktop I can Super+D, otherwise a quick Super+number brings up my programs I use the most of, and CTRL-Alt-Direction brings me to another desktop. I normally have one desktop that I have any applications that I don't use in full screen, ie CHAT applications, terminal windows, etc. By reducing the size of my icons in my bar, I've found that I can have most every app that I use often there.

I guess what I think is that customization is probably coming, but I would personally be miserable if I didn't adapt before then.

collisionystm
October 8th, 2011, 01:14 PM
I think that as Unity evolves it will become more open for the users to customize. What they seem to be going for is continuity.

As to minimizing windows or moving the dockbar, it would be great if these things could be changed, but it really could be more of a conscious choice.

I find that in Unity, not only does it seem like you're encouraged to use everything in full screen mode (not that you don't have the option not to) but I have found that by effectively using the keyboard shortcuts and my multiple desktops that I really don't ever minimize anything.

What I mean is that if I want to see the desktop I can Super+D, otherwise a quick Super+number brings up my programs I use the most of, and CTRL-Alt-Direction brings me to another desktop. I normally have one desktop that I have any applications that I don't use in full screen, ie CHAT applications, terminal windows, etc. By reducing the size of my icons in my bar, I've found that I can have most every app that I use often there.

I guess what I think is that customization is probably coming, but I would personally be miserable if I didn't adapt before then.


Yeah, it seems as though we are supposed to work full screen. 'Never Minimize' so to speak. I guess that kind of goes along with the ideology behind a smart phone where you never close an app, you simply minimize it and it runs in the background. I guess I am to old school. I dont want things running. I want them dead unless I bring them to life!

I am using CrunchBang now (awesome distro) but when I was using Unity, I always set the bar to NEVER HIDE, and made the icons as small as they would go. This seems convenient to me. I just becomes a pain in the neck at that point to always hit the minimize button on a menu that always auto-hides itself.

trivialpackets
October 8th, 2011, 01:24 PM
Well if you're just mimimizing, then they are still running. :)

I do though also set the bar to never hide, mostly because I still need a visual cue when I am using Win+number to open or switch to an application. The other reason I do it is because of the Ubuntu menu button is on the top bar, so if I maximize the window while the bar is hidden, the close buttons are not lined up with the top left of the window. It always irritated me. That's gone in the 11.10!

I still have some problems with Unity, but I'm still on 11.04, so I'm hoping that 11.10 clears up a few of them. Overall, I'm a satisfied customer and am getting far more than my money's worth.

With that said though, I love #!. It's another great linux distribution. My wife...not so much. :) Ubuntu or Windows 7 it is in our house. Although, someone else said it earlier, the Windows 7 bar is well implemented.

collisionystm
October 8th, 2011, 01:30 PM
Well if you're just mimimizing, then they are still running. :)

I do though also set the bar to never hide, mostly because I still need a visual cue when I am using Win+number to open or switch to an application. The other reason I do it is because of the Ubuntu menu button is on the top bar, so if I maximize the window while the bar is hidden, the close buttons are not lined up with the top left of the window. It always irritated me. That's gone in the 11.10!

I still have some problems with Unity, but I'm still on 11.04, so I'm hoping that 11.10 clears up a few of them. Overall, I'm a satisfied customer and am getting far more than my money's worth.

With that said though, I love #!. It's another great linux distribution. My wife...not so much. :) Ubuntu or Windows 7 it is in our house. Although, someone else said it earlier, the Windows 7 bar is well implemented.

Yeah the Windows 7 bar is great.

My wife won't let me put linux on her computer lol. The funny part is, Windows crashed on her finally after 2 years. Which really is pretty good. I said, lets put a real OS on there! Nahh... so here I am downloading Win 7 pro from my MSDN.

trivialpackets
October 8th, 2011, 01:37 PM
Until we can play netflix on linux, we'll always have Windows on a laptop. Sure we can play it on the Wii, but that's all the way downstairs...in the living room... :)

collisionystm
October 8th, 2011, 01:41 PM
Until we can play netflix on linux, we'll always have Windows on a laptop. Sure we can play it on the Wii, but that's all the way downstairs...in the living room... :)

lol exactly.

So I was going to pull files from my wifes laptop to a usb drive using ubuntu live cd... my 1 year old son walked over and took it upon himself to start the installer and format her drive! :( lol. What a great Saturday morning....

collisionystm
October 8th, 2011, 01:43 PM
I guess with the way I am taking this conversation, this is about to moved to 'recurring discussions'

makitso
October 8th, 2011, 03:08 PM
I fully understand that Unity is in the growing stages -- so will not pass judgment yet. Having said that I also use a dock but its AWN. Yes, I have tried Docky and Cairo but AWN suits my needs. So, on Unity I have attempted to hide the Unity dock (autohide on the launcher). However, if i launch an app from AWN Unity pops open a bit. Also, on the desktop, if I have a folder and move it across the screen, Unity pops up. And, I can not use my entire desktop for folders, etc, the left margin is locked to Unity. As a result, I am forced to use Gnome 3 which does not have these characteristics.

So, my wish for Unity would be to:

1. Allow for the complete hiding of the Unity dock
2. Allow for using all the desktop for icons
3. Bring back the right click on the desktop for adding a launcher anywhere :-)

getpdh
October 8th, 2011, 03:36 PM
Just don't understand the need for UNITY. It seems to me, a relatively new user of ubuntu (2 years, and just about getting properly to grips with it now) that it goes against everything that made me convert in the first place. That kind of windows-esque arrogant assumption that this is the best your going to get, so use it. It's inflexible, un-systematic, confusing. I tried it for three weeks and it drove me mad. Went back to the joyous simplicity of Gnome, and I won't be trying unity again.

PuddingKnife
October 8th, 2011, 04:04 PM
I agree with OPs post. I also think Unity needs a 'hover-over' animation for the launcher, and that the behavior of the Dash should mimic the alt+Tab window behavior.