PDA

View Full Version : Water as an alternative fuel source



BWF89
May 29th, 2006, 12:32 PM
It works by combining H2O with electricity to form HHO gas. And after it burns it turns right back into water so you won't be wasting Earths most precious resource when you take your car out for a spin.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=CMovXzVOzc4

halfvolle melk
May 29th, 2006, 12:38 PM
I saw it a few days ago and found it quite amusing.

glotz
May 29th, 2006, 12:40 PM
Burning oil is madness, agreed. It can be used to produce millions of wonderful products. And once you burn it, it'll never be replaced. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrolysis#Electrolysis_of_water

red_Marvin
May 29th, 2006, 12:46 PM
However, watir isn't used as a source, it's just a temporary energy container, you would still need the electricity from somewhere...

Aewheros
May 29th, 2006, 12:47 PM
Exactly. The problem is you spend electric energy (high quality) to create a fuel (hydrogen) which when burnt releases heat energy (low quality). The effect must be considerable less than 100% too. It is better to just use that electricity to charge batteries.

Kvark
May 29th, 2006, 01:00 PM
Yeah this isn't an energy source. But you can fill up the car's tank with this gas in a minute while it takes a lot longer to charge batteries and a gas tank is also cheaper then a huge battery. So perhaps this is a better way to store energy then batteries. The big question is a tank full of this gas or a battery of the same size, which one would keep a car going the longest?

Bd0g
May 29th, 2006, 01:06 PM
What makes this interesting is that for the first time... a revolutionary method of getting energy isn't bought, tucked away for safe storage until it's forgotten.

The U.S patent service got alot of those ... :/ Especially from the power companys. There have been other methods earlier that uses water as a power source.. but as said, they got "lost".

Lets see how fast they can turn this into something global.. and ditch the middle east :P

halfvolle melk
May 29th, 2006, 01:10 PM
The big question is a tank full of this gas or a battery of the same size, which one would keep a car going the longest?
I'll bet that if you'd store it as compressed gas (which you really don't want to do) it will keep going longer than on a battery. However I'd like to see the structure formula of this HHO gas that supposedly is 'more stable' that a mixture of H2 and O2. I think it's a hoax.

Bd0g
May 29th, 2006, 01:18 PM
I think it's a hoax.
Hmmm.. maybe you should google around for a bit first before stating it as a hoax :P

halfvolle melk
May 29th, 2006, 01:33 PM
Hmmm.. maybe you should google around for a bit first before stating it as a hoax :P
Nah, I'd rather rely on what I learned in chemistry class than on scetchy articles like these (http://www.atsnn.com/article/158213). :)
It would be excelent though, as it can't be used for something as malicious as weapons. Something that burns anything but flesh! On the other hand, you can't power your barbeque with it either. ;)

Edit: Or am I missing that it aired on april th first or something?

Bd0g
May 29th, 2006, 01:37 PM
You turn away from it right away.. cause believing in what FOX reports is not an easy thing today ;P

Then they need a new reporter voice... badly...

Kimm
May 29th, 2006, 03:01 PM
HHO gas is something I'd like to call... steam.

HHO = H2O ;)

H2 on the other hand... we like that! (if we add some O2... then Weeee! xD)

RAV TUX
May 29th, 2006, 03:41 PM
What about the MDI Air car:

http://img127.imageshack.us/img127/1079/index0dr.th.jpg (http://img127.imageshack.us/my.php?image=index0dr.jpg)

"Welcome to the future!

After twelve years of reserch and development, Guy Negre has developed an engine that could become one of the biggest technological advances of this century. Its application to CAT vehicles gives them significant economical and environmental advantages. With the incorporation of bi-energy (compressed air + fuel) the CAT Vehicles have increased their driving range to close to 2000 km with zero pollution in cities and considerably reduced pollution outside urban areas.
As well, the application of the MDI engine in other areas, outside the automotive sector, opens a multitude of possibilities in nautical fields, co-generation, auxiliary engines, electric generators groups, etc. Compressed air is a new viable form of power that allows the accumulation and transport of energy. MDI is very close to initiating the production of a series of engines and vehicles. The company is financed by the sale of manufacturing licences and patents all over the world."

http://www.theaircar.com/

They could do a hybryd of bi-fuel, compressed air and water or compressed air and hydrogen.

borestes
January 18th, 2009, 06:41 PM
I found this company online selling Hydrogen Generator (http://www.fuelfromh2o.com) they seem to have a pretty decent product.. www.fuelfromh2o.com (http://www.fuelfromh2o.com)
I've been researching this subject for a while and some people wonder “how does the system create more energy than it uses?” The answer is that the introduction of HHO gas into the combustion mixture reduces waste of your primary fuel - energy that is already available but not put to full use. The vast majority of fuel that reaches the typical engine is wasted as it is not properly combusted. HHO works by mixing with and making more of that gasoline or diesel fuel ignite. The result is a more complete and cleaner burn, translating into a 15-50% increase in mileage. This way you get more power out of the fuel you already paid for, instead of it going out the tailpipe as emissions.

daftbeaker
January 19th, 2009, 12:59 AM
By converting water into its primary elements of Hydrogen and Oxygen (HHO) and introducing the hydrogen/oxygen gas in conjunction with your regular fuel, our Hydrogen Generator will improve the fuel economy of your engine from 15 - 45%+

It sounds like the generator splits water to give a stoichiometric hydrogen/oxygen mix, not a new 'HHO' gas. It then adds this mix to the standard fuel/air mix in the engine.

I'm sceptical of the claimed 15-45% increase in fuel efficiency though, even without taking into account the energy needed to split the water in the first place.

Proton Soup
January 20th, 2009, 04:00 AM
you should be skeptical, it's a scam

samden
January 22nd, 2009, 02:03 AM
It is far more efficient to use electricity to charge batteries than to produce hydrogen to run a car, or to compress air. Burning hydrogen (or petrol) in a conventional engine is only around 20% efficient, while an electric motor may be 90% efficient - in other words you'll save heaps of electricity using batteries.

By the way RAV TUX, compressed air cars are nothing new, the first recorded one was made in 1838:
http://www.dself.dsl.pipex.com/MUSEUM/TRANSPORT/comprair/comprair.htm

Endolith
January 23rd, 2009, 04:17 PM
It's a scam. Use your brain.

lykwydchykyn
January 23rd, 2009, 04:29 PM
I've been researching this subject for a while and some people wonder “how does the system create more energy than it uses?”

Must be that pesky first law of thermodynamics that has them confused.

Rumo
January 23rd, 2009, 04:49 PM
It is far more efficient to use electricity to charge batteries than to produce hydrogen to run a car, or to compress air.[/URL]

You actually don't have to burn hydrogen - you can transform it into electric energy directly with a fuel cell. The only real problem with hydrogen cars are the high costs of these cells and the problem of storing large quantities of hydrogen in a car safely.

That's why all the major german car companies were working on hydrogen cars. They are all switching to batteries now because they got so much better in the last decade (due to large investments in this field (laptops, cell phones...)). But the race is far from over, although batteries definitely have a lead right now.

loveandequality
January 26th, 2009, 03:37 AM
Neat.

daftbeaker
January 26th, 2009, 02:33 PM
It turns out water as a fuel source may not be as stupid as I thought. UK scientists attached a light-absorbing dye and a hydrogenase enzyme to a titanium oxide catalyst which produces hydrogen gas from sunlight and water.

Only small-scale at the moment but quite interesting potential.

Link - http://www.rsc.org/Publishing/Journals/CC/article.asp?doi=b817371k

samden
January 26th, 2009, 10:00 PM
You actually don't have to burn hydrogen - you can transform it into electric energy directly with a fuel cell. The only real problem with hydrogen cars are the high costs of these cells and the problem of storing large quantities of hydrogen in a car safely.
That is true. But most people interested in hydrogen seem to want to can run their current car on it - which is inefficient.

rajan
January 27th, 2009, 06:13 AM
Link - http://www.rsc.org/Publishing/Journals/CC/article.asp?doi=b817371k

very interesting article! it looks like it's doing something that Pt electrodes already do, but it is combined with a dye-sensitized solar cell to perform electrolysis. i agree, it looks like a ways off, but still very nice proof of concept.