16 "Anonymous" hackers arrested

[forrestcupp]

16 suspected hackers from the group called Anonymous were arrested. (http://www.foxnews.com/scitech/2011/07/19/exclusive-fbi-search-warrants-nationwide-hunt-anonymous/)

Let's see if we notice anyone not posting as much on here now. :)

[haqking]

16 suspected hackers from the group called Anonymous were arrested. (http://www.foxnews.com/scitech/2011/07/19/exclusive-fbi-search-warrants-nationwide-hunt-anonymous/)

Let's see if we notice anyone not posting as much on here now. :)

hey im still here ;-)

[KiwiNZ]

Good work

[SoFl W]

Is this the same group that was arrested for feeding the homeless in Orlando?

[Dry Lips]

Wonder how long it takes before any members of
LulzSec get arrested?

[Dustin2128]

Still annoyed that they're still being called hackers. They're script kiddies! Being called a hacker is too much a compliment for these people.

[3Miro]

Still annoyed that they're still being called hackers. They're script kiddies! Being called a hacker is too much a compliment for these people.

+1.

Hacker wannabes is a better name. I doubt the police can catch a real hacker.

[TheNosh]

Still annoyed that they're still being called hackers. They're script kiddies! Being called a hacker is too much a compliment for these people.

The general public doesn't know the difference.

If you don't know what LOIC is, then you probably don't know that you don't need to be a hacker to carry out a DDoS attack.

In terms of reporting, the distinction doesn't really matter. The main point is that there was malicious action involving computers.

[CraigPaleo]

That's almost funny considering it came from FOX news. :) Do you know what News of the World (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/News_of_the_World_phone_hacking_affair) has been accused of?

[Paradoxfox93]

They're not Anonymous.

Besides, these are just script kiddies. DDoSing is the equivalent of forming a digital crowd.

As for the government attacks. Well, Anti-sec philosophy is inherently self-contradictory. Smells like bull- propaganda marketing campaign.

Although they did pick good targets. Like AZ police. I mean for the love of... Those guys killed Big Daddy.

[SoFl W]

If you want to know what one of them looks like, then her picture is here (http://www.thesmokinggun.com/documents/internet/fbi-exposes-terrifying-face-anonymous-748293).

[jerenept]

That's almost funny considering it came from FOX news. :) Do you know what News of the World has been accused of?

You don't watch Fox News, do you?

[Paradoxfox93]

She's hot and her name is Mercedes. That is an Awesome Name.

[SoFl W]

She's hot and her name is Mercedes. That is an Awesome Name.

yeah, for a stripper.

[forrestcupp]

hey im still here ;-)

Lol. You're the first person I had in mind. :D

[Paradoxfox93]

yeah, for a stripper.

Or Axander Dumas. Or my daughter. It's a big world out there. Have mercy if not forgiveness. Besides, strippers are awesome.

[jerenept]

She's hot and her name is Mercedes. That is an Awesome Name.

Is this a Vice City reference?

[forrestcupp]

She's hot and her name is Mercedes. That is an Awesome Name.

It's funny to see the type of women that geeks call "hot". :)

She's not ugly, but I wouldn't call her "hot".

[CraigPaleo]

You don't watch Fox News, do you?

No, I don't. But if you want to see Mr. Murdoch being hit with a pie, here it is. I don't condone this behavior but I do enjoy watching it, if it happens to happen.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_68QgX9glTA

[NightwishFan]

It's funny to see the type of women that geeks call "hot". :)

Nope. Not very nice thing to say. :)

[Paradoxfox93]

Nope. Not very nice thing to say. :)

WHy not? Recognizing demographic trends and attraction habits is a perfectly valid scientific observation. He doesn't think she's hot? What's 'mean' about having an opinion. It's not his fault half of society is so egotistically fragile that half their self worth lays in someone else's eyes.

[NightwishFan]

WHy not? Recognizing demographic trends and attraction habits is a perfectly valid scientific observation. He doesn't think she's hot? What's 'mean' about having an opinion. It's not his fault half of society is so egotistically fragile that half their self worth lays in someone else's eyes.

I am pretty sure that is not what I was saying.

[Bandit]

Still annoyed that they're still being called hackers. They're script kiddies! Being called a hacker is too much a compliment for these people.

Agreed. :)

[Paradoxfox93]

I am pretty sure that is not what I was saying.

I know. I hijakced it.

[Primefalcon]

If you want to know what one of them looks like, then her picture is here (http://www.thesmokinggun.com/documents/internet/fbi-exposes-terrifying-face-anonymous-748293).

Blank page for me

[Khakilang]

The program they use to hack is open source. That is bad news.

[Dustin2128]

Why? Software is software is software. That it's open source is irrelevant as it's either a program written by a real hacker in a language that the SKs won't understand (read: anything besides java-like or VB) or it's written by one of them in visual basic or a java like language and it's so poorly done that the source code's not helping anyone. Too lazy to google LOIC, so meh.

[BrandonC19]

Why? Software is software is software. That it's open source is irrelevant as it's either a program written by a real hacker in a language that the SKs won't understand (read: anything besides java-like or VB) or it's written by one of them in visual basic or a java like language and it's so poorly done that the source code's not helping anyone. Too lazy to google LOIC, so meh.
Exactly.

[jerenept]

Why? Software is software is software. That it's open source is irrelevant as it's either a program written by a real hacker in a language that the SKs won't understand (read: anything besides java-like or VB) or it's written by one of them in visual basic or a java like language and it's so poorly done that the source code's not helping anyone. Too lazy to google LOIC, so meh.

LOIC? bahahahahahahaha.

That thing is so poorly programmed you can tell a LOIC attack from 50 miles off. I would be ashamed to have that kind of code in the public domain.

[3rdalbum]

Why? Software is software is software. That it's open source is irrelevant as it's either a program written by a real hacker in a language that the SKs won't understand (read: anything besides java-like or VB) or it's written by one of them in visual basic or a java like language and it's so poorly done that the source code's not helping anyone. Too lazy to google LOIC, so meh.

What's even worse is that the core of the program was originally meant for a legitimate purpose, and Anonymous took that and modified it to become a weapon.

I hope it teaches these fools a lesson: What they're doing IS illegal, and they WILL be caught.

[Dustin2128]

Really? What was it written for initially? I would have thought it started as a weapon with the name low orbit ion cannon. ;)

[NightwishFan]

My opinion on the matter is: No matter what their intentions are they are breaking the law. There are more positive ways to work toward your beliefs.

[Dustin2128]

Not when Rupert Murdoch and everyone in his media empire is most likely going to get off with little more than a legal slap on the wrist for the crimes they've committed.

[TheNosh]

Really? What was it written for initially? I would have thought it started as a weapon with the name low orbit ion cannon. ;)

It was to test how well a network could handle stress of several simultaneous connections.

[ZarathustraDK]

Honestly, I have a hard time seeing why Anonymous would warrant the flack that occurs. It seems like the status quo among internet-users is to put the diss on them for either 1) doing a little hacktivism that *shudders* at most requires a reboot of the affected server or 2) "NOT being elite enough Swordfish-haxxorz that can pwn a Gibson with the commandline".

Look beyond that and I think most people would appreciate what they're trying to accomplish, unless people like censorship, surveillance, wiretaps, indefinite copyright, Monsanto terminator-tech, non-taxed mega-corps, lobbyism, corruption etc.

[dasan]

Goooooooodddd:D

[jfreak_]

Doesn't anyone see that they are 'alleged' to have committed some crimes? innocent until proven guilty, isn't it? I don't think anyone of them has entered a guilty plea.

[SoFl W]

Not when Rupert Murdoch and everyone in his media empire is most likely going to get off with little more than a legal slap on the wrist for the crimes they've committed.

If Rupert Murdoch didn't commit the crimes, should he be punished for them? If he authorized the illegal activity I would agree but not if he ("and everyone") had nothing to do with it.

[forrestcupp]

Too lazy to google LOIC, so meh.
It's a program made to help any ignorant loser think they are a bad ice h@x0r.

[sydbat]

Maybe it's just me, but...Faux News as the original source makes me suspicious about any of these SK's being truly associated with Anonymous (or any other organized group outside WOW), except in the view of the technologically uneducated. I mean, anyone could claim to be a part of Anonymous, especially if they think it gives them street cred or look cool in the eyes of their peers.

[rg4w]

The program they use to hack is open source. That is bad news.
If they were using OS X's Terminal would people stop buying Final Cut Pro?

(Oh. Wait. They stopped buying it anyway <g>)

[forrestcupp]

Maybe it's just me, but...Faux News as the original source makes me suspicious about any of these SK's being truly associated with Anonymous (or any other organized group outside WOW)

There were a hundred news articles on this. The Fox News one just happened to be the one I clicked on. Nobody is saying for sure that they are a part of Anonymous.

[ZarathustraDK]

Maybe it's just me, but...Faux News as the original source makes me suspicious about any of these SK's being truly associated with Anonymous (or any other organized group outside WOW), except in the view of the technologically uneducated. I mean, anyone could claim to be a part of Anonymous, especially if they think it gives them street cred or look cool in the eyes of their peers.

You are part of Anonymous if you wish to be, it's not a club or an organisation anymore than a bunch of random people out of many people riding the same NY-subway and getting off at the same station is a club or an organisation.

It's actually kind of beautiful in a way, as it's not about leadership, but rather about making your case and having enough people agree by their own free will that its a good idea in order to make an impact, kinda what democracy should have been I guess :-|

[Dangertux]

When did DDoSing become cool? Do these guys realize it's 2011. I feel like I am stuck in 1994 and EFnet is the place to be.

IMO , anon and groups like them are pathetic.

[3rdalbum]

You are part of Anonymous if you wish to be, it's not a club or an organisation anymore than a bunch of random people out of many people riding the same NY-subway and getting off at the same station is a club or an organisation.

It's actually kind of beautiful in a way, as it's not about leadership, but rather about making your case and having enough people agree by their own free will that its a good idea in order to make an impact, kinda what democracy should have been I guess :-|

Trust me, I've done some time on 4chan. It's not about "making a case" or anything idealistic like that. It's "Hey guyz where doing this, its the FUNZ! Join us!".

Easily 90% of the people who join in the Anonymous stuff would help them attack redcross.org if other people were doing it. The other 10% would do it if the Anon leaders fabricated a "cause" for attacking the Red Cross.

[MonolithImmortal]

The Anonymous group is a loose collection of cybersavvy activists inspired by WikiLeaks and its flamboyant head Julian Assange to fight for "Internet freedom"

While Anonymous is largely a politically motivated organization, splinter group LulzSec -- which dominated headlines in the spring for a similar streak of cyberattacks -- was largely in it for the thrills.

This is coming from the same people who used footage of an exploding van (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9tNL0bRB2XQ) in their first report (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kkAngvkWVkk) on Anonymous.
Fox, it's so painfully obvious that you have no idea what you are talking about. So just stop. Please.

[forrestcupp]

This is coming from the same people who used footage of an exploding van (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9tNL0bRB2XQ) in their first report (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kkAngvkWVkk) on Anonymous.
Fox, it's so painfully obvious that you have no idea what you are talking about. So just stop. Please.

As I said earlier, Fox News was definitely far from being the only one covering this; it just happened to be the one I clicked on. I've learned my lesson. Never quote anything from Fox News because everyone here is so prejudice that they wouldn't even believe Fox if Fox told them their correct names.

Everybody will listen to The Register, though, won't they. ;)

[Eiji Takanaka]

I would imagine the best way to perform a distributed denial of service attack would be to write a program that sends modified packets of large size extremely rapidly towards multiple ports on the target network. Somewhat akin to ping -i 0.0001 -s 65000 www.unluckydesu.com, but that is merely my limited understanding of such things.

Sending Forged DNS lookup packets would be effective i would of thought. But i suppose any sort of packet could be forged somewhat easily.

I'm surprised there haven't been effective counter measures implemented to combat ddos'ing though.

I mean, for example, you could set a threshold for the number of packets per second e.t.c and drop all connections over that amount, but there are many different rules you could utilize to dramatically reduce the impact of such an attack.

I suspect its allready been done, but perhaps you would find what the normal 'fingerprint' is for connecting computers, and those that fall outside the nominal limits, either have a degree'd level of connection restriction put in place, at the low end of the spectrum, up to a total bandwidth block at the top for extremely dodgy behaviour.

This would create a bandwidth throttle so to speak, by implementing and acting upon simple heuristic anaylsis.

I imagine this has already been thought of though.

I suppose its a delicate balance between locking down the system and not impacting upon normal usability.

Meh who knows. =P

[Brad55]

Well I think I have seen it all now, so much bashing FOX News over a news report about hackers, but I guess some like CNN (Communist News Network) over the truth.

If people don't like a LAW then vote on it to change it, or the people putting that LAW in place, it's that simple.

The people that did the hacking should be in jail, there are to many legal ways to stop a company or to change how some things are done.

"We the People" have all the tools at hand to change things, we don't work for the government they work for us.

[mkendall]

If people don't like a LAW then vote on it to change it, or the people putting that LAW in place, it's that simple.

The people that did the hacking should be in jail, there are to many legal ways to stop a company or to change how some things are done.

"We the People" have all the tools at hand to change things, we don't work for the government they work for us.

Oh, you are adorable.

[handy]

I have my doubts about whether they really have got who they say they have. I don't think that those people would be so ignorant as to make themselves traceable.

I hope they hit another high profile capitalist icon of one kind or another real soon now, if for no other reason than to say nyah, nyah, you missed me!

[handy]

Well I think I have seen it all now, so much bashing FOX News over a news report about hackers, but I guess some like CNN (Communist News Network) over the truth.

If people don't like a LAW then vote on it to change it, or the people putting that LAW in place, it's that simple.

The people that did the hacking should be in jail, there are to many legal ways to stop a company or to change how some things are done.

"We the People" have all the tools at hand to change things, we don't work for the government they work for us.

How naive some people are to think that the law actually isn't incredibly corrupt these days.

Rupert Murdoch & his kind have been controlling politics in a number of countries for decades now.

In general, politicians are scared of the people that control the media. The more media control they have, the more control they have over politicians & their policies.

Anyone who can't see that, hasn't done enough research yet.

[Grenage]

Danger, Will Robinson; danger.

[SoFl W]

"News" is entertainment to sell commercials nothing more. (and/or government propaganda) Don't think that one news outlet is any better or any worse than another. Don't think that the news outlet that you pay attention to is good because it "tells the truth." It doesn't tell you the truth, you just agree with what they are telling you.


Now to get back on topic.
Online ‘Hacktivist’ gathering Anonymous claims it has breached the security of intergovernmental military alliance NATO (http://thenextweb.com/media/2011/07/21/anonymous-claims-to-have-hacked-nato-releases-supposedly-confidential-documents/).

[SoFl W]

"We the People" have all the tools at hand to change things, we don't work for the government they work for us.Oh, you are adorable.

They are SO CUTE when they are naive and think that.

[handy]

If the Fed's haven't got who they say they have, then there is going to be retaliation by the crackers.

The crackers will make it well & truly known that the Fed's have had their heads up their own RRRs, one way or another.

[sydbat]

As I said earlier, Fox News was definitely far from being the only one covering this; it just happened to be the one I clicked on. I've learned my lesson. Never quote anything from Fox News because everyone here is so prejudice that they wouldn't even believe Fox if Fox told them their correct names.

Everybody will listen to The Register, though, won't they. ;)Snap. Touché. Etc.

[handy]

Some of us don't consider the Republican media to be truthful.

I accept that there are views contrary to that. :)

[Dangertux]

Well , I would not make the assumption as to say that the authorities have gotten all of the so called hacktivists into custody yet.

However, the way these things generally work is an escalating failure within the group. Let's face it, no matter how much you believe in a cause or how much you don't want to "rat out your friends" when faced with a felony conviction , hundreds of thousands of dollars in fines, and a potential prison sentence. You are much more likely to divulge information about your "friends". Especially since several of the individuals apprehended are young and seem to have an otherwise good life ahead of them.

Fear is a powerful motivator.

[handy]

Well , I would not make the assumption as to say that the authorities have gotten all of the so called hacktivists into custody yet.

However, the way these things generally work is an escalating failure within the group. Let's face it, no matter how much you believe in a cause or how much you don't want to "rat out your friends" when faced with a felony conviction , hundreds of thousands of dollars in fines, and a potential prison sentence. You are much more likely to divulge information about your "friends". Especially since several of the individuals apprehended are young and seem to have an otherwise good life ahead of them.

Fear is a powerful motivator.

NATO has been cracked since these people have been taken into custody.

(See the link in post # 53 ?)

[uRock]

Well , I would not make the assumption as to say that the authorities have gotten all of the so called hacktivists into custody yet.

However, the way these things generally work is an escalating failure within the group. Let's face it, no matter how much you believe in a cause or how much you don't want to "rat out your friends" when faced with a felony conviction , hundreds of thousands of dollars in fines, and a potential prison sentence. You are much more likely to divulge information about your "friends". Especially since several of the individuals apprehended are young and seem to have an otherwise good life ahead of them.

Fear is a powerful motivator.

Yup, one of them was from a local university. The news didn't say so, but I hope they give her the boot, if and when she attempts to return.

[Dangertux]

NATO has been cracked since these people have been taken into custody.

(See the link in post # 53 ?)

Ever hear of a last stand?

[Brad55]

How naive some people are to think that the law actually isn't incredibly corrupt these days.

Rupert Murdoch & his kind have been controlling politics in a number of countries for decades now.

In general, politicians are scared of the people that control the media. The more media control they have, the more control they have over politicians & their policies.

Anyone who can't see that, hasn't done enough research yet.

You made my point. The fact is the people can change it.

You are right in saying law is corrupt and so is the media, but if the people demand it to change it will, and all with in the LAW. It can be done.

[dmn_clown]

Good work

Not really, all they did was trace IPs of the loic users, if it were "good work" they'd have been arrested earlier.

[handy]

Ever hear of a last stand?

I doubt that was it.

I expect we'll see plenty more activity from Anonymous & co. & if they weren't being extremely careful to maintain their anonymity before they certainly will be now.

[handy]

You made my point. The fact is the people can change it.

You are right in saying law is corrupt and so is the media, but if the people demand it to change it will, and all with in the LAW. It can be done.

Unfortunately, what is actually being done & what is equitable & fare for the lowest common denominator in societies are most commonly so very far away from each other these days.

The legal removal of corruption requires the removal of corporate controlled government.

Who has the power to make that change?

[edit:] I'm going to bed before I get this thread closed. :)

[ZarathustraDK]

If people don't like a LAW then vote on it to change it, or the people putting that LAW in place, it's that simple.

That is naive in the extreme. People seldom get to vote on laws, and the people they vote for seldom stick to their promises. Which politician do I vote for that delivers what Anonymous is currently delivering? Which politician would readily go against Murdoch, Monsanto etc. without the impending threat of being humiliated publicly by whistleblowers?

This is how it works. A hopeful politician promises that streets will be paved with gold and diamond, and the fountains spring with milk and honey --> people vote him into office --> Companies line up to fund his campaigns in exchange of favors/contracts etc. that go contrary to the wishes of the public/consumer --> nothing changes, meet the new boss, same as the old.


I have my doubts about whether they really have got who they say they have. I don't think that those people would be so ignorant as to make themselves traceable.


Ever hear of a last stand?

Anonymous has been waging a recruitment offensive lately on youtube, facebook and the rest of the internet, and declared that they will continue to do so into november. There are estimates of 31000+ "members" floating around if you care to look. Next to a figure like that it's almost laughable that the FBI has only managed to pick up 16 LOIC'ers (and taking about 5 months to do so); then again, far from everyone is participating in ddos'ing, lots of people are just regular activists, handing out fliers in the streets, creating videos etc.


However, the way these things generally work is an escalating failure within the group. Let's face it, no matter how much you believe in a cause or how much you don't want to "rat out your friends" when faced with a felony conviction , hundreds of thousands of dollars in fines, and a potential prison sentence. You are much more likely to divulge information about your "friends". Especially since several of the individuals apprehended are young and seem to have an otherwise good life ahead of them.

1) How do you rat out people who you do not know?
2) There is no single point of failure in the organisation (or lack thereof I should say, organisation that is), barring closing off the entire internet.
3) Most of Anonymous does not participate in what would be deemed criminal activities by todays laws, so what would you rat those out with?

On the subject of unbiased news/information, there isn't any, only peoples interpretation of what they view as reality and their general tendency to align themselves with the news-outlet that best supports this reality.
The best thing to do, IMHO, is to research the same news, interesting to you, from different sources; the greater the variety in the political/economical/<insert other bias here>, the better. It's nice and dandy to have an opinion of your own, but failing to understand why people opposed to your opinion is opposed to your opnion is only getting half the picture...unless pure cold 1+1 logic dictates that they are wrong, in which case I generally stay clear of it. But make up your own minds about it, don't take my word for it ;)

[Dangertux]

2) There is no single point of failure in the organisation (or lack thereof I should say, organisation that is), barring closing off the entire internet.
That's where you are wrong. That disorganization like every other in the world has the exact same single point of failure. Human imperfection.

Oh, and on the anonymity comment, anonymity is both an illusion, and a luxury nobody really has. The sooner the general populous starts realizing this the better off they are.

[ZarathustraDK]

That's where you are wrong. That disorganization like every other in the world has the exact same single point of failure. Human imperfection.

The impact of human imperfection is eradicated through ideas and the discussion thereof, much like bugs in open source are filtered out by having many eyes on the source.
How could human imperfection make anonymous fail, in your mind?


Oh, and on the anonymity comment, anonymity is both an illusion, and a luxury nobody really has. The sooner the general populous starts realizing this the better off they are.

I don't kid myself into believing that absolute anonymity is possible in this day and age, what people CAN do is make it sufficiently hard for anyone to bother. Something to the tune of having the FBI take 7 months to arrest 16 ddos'ers is a sufficient amount of anonymity to achieve their goal considering the ranks being refilled in less than half a day at the current pace.

[forrestcupp]

Guys, I suggest we steer this conversation back on track and away from politics before this thread gets closed. It was never meant to be about politics.


Also, no one ever claimed they arrested all of the Anonymous group. If these people really are a part of Anonymous, they're just a small part of it, and they're probably just the dispensable pawns that the real hackers are willing to sacrifice just to make The Man feel like they accomplished something. Of course we're still going to hear about Anonymous doing stuff.

[MasterNetra]

It's funny to see the type of women that geeks call "hot". :)

She's not ugly, but I wouldn't call her "hot".

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

Who you think is hot is only relevant to you. And what some else considers hot is neither greater or less then your opinion.

[forrestcupp]

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

Who you think is hot is only relevant to you. And what some else considers hot is neither greater or less then your opinion.

Very true. And that definitely works for my benefit, since for some crazy reason my wife thinks I'm hot. :)

[Dangertux]

The impact of human imperfection is eradicated through ideas and the discussion thereof, much like bugs in open source are filtered out by having many eyes on the source.


Yet there are still hundreds if not thousands of flaws in open source software, again speaking in absolutes is, for lack of a better word futile.



How could human imperfection make anonymous fail, in your mind?


Some one, some where, knows something about the inner workings of Anonymous. Find said someone, I guarantee something is of more value to them than their so called "cause". Threaten to take it from them, everything comes tumbling down like a house of cards.

[MonolithImmortal]

As I said earlier, Fox News was definitely far from being the only one covering this; it just happened to be the one I clicked on. I've learned my lesson. Never quote anything from Fox News because everyone here is so prejudice that they wouldn't even believe Fox if Fox told them their correct names.

Everybody will listen to The Register, though, won't they. ;)

It doesn't have anything to do with me believing Fox news or not believing them, it's just that it's evident that they don't know what Anonymous is at all. It's like listening to my grandmother trying to explain the internet.


Some one, some where, knows something about the inner workings of Anonymous. Find said someone, I guarantee something is of more value to them than their so called "cause". Threaten to take it from them, everything comes tumbling down like a house of cards.
I know about the inner workings of Anonymous, and without going into much detail about my (regrettable) past, I'll just say this. There is no inner workings of anonymous. Period. There is no leadership, there are no members, there are no names. Just ideas. If enough people get behind an idea for whatever reason that pleases them then whatever it is that needs to get done gets done. There is no centralized motive behind raids. Some people have ideals, some people just do it for fun.
If the government wanted anon to be done away with then they'd shut down the *chan's, starting with 4chan. That's were the rank and file LOIC'er comes from.

[wirepuller134]

The bad part I see from what they are doing by attacking websites that seem to oppose an open internet...is they are giving reasons for support of a more closed internet. It seems very counter productive to their "cause" to me. The other part I don't understand, is why attack the customers of these companies or even low level employees or their families?

[TheOutlier]

As pointed out in a previous post; Anonymous can be..well anybody. It's an ideal for some. For others, they claim the name to be part of a trend. The skill levels can vary vastly..since again, anybody could be Anonymous. It can't be destroyed, because..you can't destroy an idea. (And no, I'm not pro-Anonymous; I prefer to NOT go to prison..)

[Superkoop]

If the government wanted anon to be done away with then they'd shut down the *chan's, starting with 4chan.

Good idea. Criminal hangouts should be closed. They are in the physical world at least, why not the virtual world.

[SoFl W]

Good idea. Criminal hangouts should be closed. They are in the physical world at least, why not the virtual world.

And at the rate we are going in the United States, the definition of "criminal" is becoming very blurred, and could mean just about anyone.

[ZarathustraDK]

The bad part I see from what they are doing by attacking websites that seem to oppose an open internet...is they are giving reasons for support of a more closed internet. It seems very counter productive to their "cause" to me.

I'd argue that we're already halfway there in regards to a closed internet: DMCA, net-neutrality going down the tubes, PROTECT IP-act being drafted as we speak, and loads of other things. It's like drops of water dripping from the ceiling into the livingroom and going "nah, I'd better not mess with it lest I'll make it worse.


The other part I don't understand, is why attack the customers of these companies or even low level employees or their families?

You are most likely thinking of Lulzsec, not Anonymous. Until recently, as in "very recently", they and Anonymous were 2 different things, Lulzsec doing stuff solely for "teh lulz" and causing chaos. Those two have now banded together in an Anonymous subgroup called Antisec, where they, at most as far as I understand, ddos and deface webpages un lieu of the Anonymous' motives. Groups get mixed up a lot of times because the media report it without knowing the difference.

[Dangertux]

Well , I suppose everyone needs their Robin Hood.

My biggest objection with groups that are fighting for everyone's anything is that they make the assumption I want them to represent me.

Personally, I could care less. I highly doubt they will have an impact on much of anything other then the potential of ruining their own lives.

[Bodsda]

Well , I suppose everyone needs their Robin Hood.

My biggest objection with groups that are fighting for everyone's anything is that they make the assumption I want them to represent me.

Personally, I could care less. I highly doubt they will have an impact on much of anything other then the potential of ruining their own lives.

That's not the point. You don't refuse to pay a portion of your taxes just because you don't use every part of the service they pay for.

The government is violating our human rights to freedom and privacy, and some believe that this should be stopped. We do not care whether anyone in particular agrees with it, but the twitter followers ratings speak for themselves.

16 "people" have been arrested, the 'idea' behind those people is untouched. The sooner the government realise that they cannot lie to the people anymore, they will have a choice, either to be honest, or to be dictators. The choice is theirs. What they don't seem to understand is that our army of knowledge and experience of this technical era far outweighs any team they could try to hire to suppress us.

Bodsda

[t0p]

The people involved have been arrested. Their identities are known. Therefore they are not anonymous. Therefore to say '16 "Anonymous" hackers arrested' is a non sequitur.

Some folk (including some of this forum's members) seem to think that Anonymous is a real-life group, with a membership roll and probably special handshakes or something. Such people should read the definition of the word "anonymous" in a decent dictionary, then sit still in a quiet place and think about it.

"I am Sparticus". "Me too!"

[Thewhistlingwind]

Let's see if we notice anyone not posting as much on here now. :)

"Welcome, Thewhistlingwind (http://ubuntuforums.org/member.php?u=1275150).
You last visited: 3 Weeks Ago at 08:05 PM"

I'm surprised no one mentioned it.

[t0p]

"Welcome, Thewhistlingwind (http://ubuntuforums.org/member.php?u=1275150).
You last visited: 3 Weeks Ago at 08:05 PM"

I'm surprised no one mentioned it.

Hey, Thewhistlingwind, where you been?

[Thewhistlingwind]

Hey, Thewhistlingwind, where you been?

You see, I have this thing I call the "50 tabs rule". If your in one of my 50 tabs, I'll remember to contribute, once I need some space and delete you out of them, don't expect to see me for a while.

I only showed up because I felt like making some video tutorials and wanted to know what NEEDS a tutorial in the first place.

[koenn]

Originally Posted by Dangertux
My biggest objection with groups that are fighting for everyone's anything is that they make the assumption I want them to represent me.

That's not the point. You don't refuse to pay a portion of your taxes just because you don't use every part of the service they pay for.

You missed the point that a government is appointed by the people they govern. And although I'll agree that in reality that doesn't always work as well as it theoretically should, it's still a whole different concept from representation by self-appointed teenagers.


We do not care whether anyone in particular agrees with it, but the twitter followers ratings speak for themselves.

Bodsda

Democacry by tweet popularity.
A new low for civilization.

[el_koraco]

Who's hot? The FBI agent?

[Grenage]

Democacry by tweet popularity.
A new low for civilization.

So sadly true.

The sooner people stop regarding these groups as freedom-seeking digital saviours, but for the petulant children they are, the better. Change comes from public awareness, lobbying and voting; not from dossing servers.

[Bodsda]

You missed the point that a government is appointed by the people they govern. And although I'll agree that in reality that doesn't always work as well as it theoretically should, it's still a whole different concept from representation by self-appointed teenagers.



Democacry by tweet popularity.
A new low for civilization.

Why do you assume we are teenagers?

The government should be held accountable for their mistakes and failures, but who is going to ask them to fess up? At the moment, no one. The only thing done by the public is to not elect the same party next time... how does that help?

The arrests made is the government playing their hand and it can be interpreted two ways. Either they have arrested people for illegally gaining access to restricted computers, or they are trying to silence those whoare willing to stand up for themselves by threatening them with Prison sentances and fines.

I never said that what Anonymous and LulzSec are doing is right, or that the government should instantly do whatever twitter says. What I am saying is that the government is being shown that some people will stand up to them, and there are more than they where expecting.

I find it quite strange why some people who will happily say that democracy is a good thing, then say that Anonymous and LulzSec are a bad thing. The government currently employs democracy when and where it suits them, and will hide things it doesnt want to show you because they dont want anyone to question them. As soon as someone starts to reveal what it is they are hiding, they get upset and start swinging their Law Hammer. I'm sure there will be some new bill going through any day now to brand those who will stand up to them as terrorists or commiting an act of treason.

The next 12 months could potentially shape the next few decades. This will be fun!

Bodsda

[Paradoxfox93]

So sadly true.

The sooner people stop regarding these groups as freedom-seeking digital saviours, but for the petulant children they are, the better. Change comes from public awareness, lobbying and voting; not from dossing servers.

But if the latter stirs the former or is a declaration of an already stirred but ignored former then...?

The point is that the public is aware, the lobbying is not in the interest of the people, civil recourse is dwindling and NATO is already assisting in the training new Riot officers in major cities. Announcements have been made foreshadowing martial law and the institution of the same 20k troops obama is bringing home to be deployed at home.

From Children of Men:

"It's 2024, everyone's on antidepressants and it's legal to advertise suicide kits but ganja is still illegal."

And we wonder why Kali says "Well f- you too then." Like Carlin said, no one really cares about saving the planet because you can't because it doesn't need it. What they really mean is saving their own @$$, which may or may not include you.

The history of those that rule and their consistant attempts at genocide throughout the entire history of mankind doesn't exactly leave a lot to the imagination about what's really going on.

[Grenage]

But if the latter stirs the former or is a declaration of an already stirred but ignored former then...?

The point is that the public is aware, the lobbying is not in the interest of the people, civil recourse is dwindling and NATO is already assisting in the training new Riot officers in major cities. Announcements have been made foreshadowing martial law and the institution of the same 20k troops obama is bringing home to be deployed at home.

From Children of Men:

"It's 2024, everyone's on antidepressants and it's legal to advertise suicide kits but ganja is still illegal."

And we wonder why Kali says "Well f- you too then." Like Carlin said, no one really cares about saving the planet because you can't because it doesn't need it. What they really mean is saving their own @$$, which may or may not include you.

The history of those that rule and their consistant attempts at genocide throughout the entire history of mankind doesn't exactly leave a lot to the imagination about what's really going on.

I'm not getting into politics, saying that I don't believe such groups go about it the right way; I'd go as far as questioning the supposed motives - which are laughable, at best.

Maybe this sort of thing wouldn't happen if there were more parks and open spaces...

[koenn]

Why do you assume we are teenagers?

The most important word in that sentence was 'self-appointed'.
The "teenagers" was merely an allusion to the fact if you set out to recruit candidates for online vandalism, you'll most likely end up with a cohorte of mainly male teens (teenager defined by attitude and (lack of) maturity rather than strictly age).
But yes, it's largely an assumption.


[...]
I find it quite strange why some people who will happily say that democracy is a good thing, then say that Anonymous and LulzSec are a bad thing. The government currently employs democracy when and where it suits them,
[...]

I don't have a problem with protest, civil disobedience, activism, ... as such. Far from it.
I do, however,mistrust any group that appoints itself as revolutionary vanguard or spokesperson(s) for the "ignorant" masses.
Your "we do not care whether anyone in particular agrees with it" is telling, in that perspective.

[Bodsda]

I don't have a problem with protest, civil disobedience, activism, ... as such. Far from it.
I do, however,mistrust any group that appoints itself as revolutionary vanguard or spokesperson(s) for the "ignorant" masses.
Your "we do not care whether anyone in particular agrees with it" is telling, in that perspective.

Mistrust the group, but not the idea.

Bodsda

[uRock]

Thread has become political.

Thread Closed.