PDA

View Full Version : Need help with legality of MP3 codecs and CD ripping



arnab_das
July 1st, 2011, 04:12 PM
Correct me if I'm wrong. None of the CD rippers of Ubuntu allow one to rip audio CDs to mp3. Also, I believe using mp3 codecs in Ubuntu has certain restrictions. So basically if I somehow manage to rip my CDs to mp3 by installing additional codecs, I'd be rendering my perfectly legal music tracks illegal. Is that right?

Why is it that closed source OSes, Windows and OSX dont have such legal issues and most Linux distros do?

Thanks.

Smilax
July 1st, 2011, 04:49 PM
i' m pretty sure that if your computer had windows on it at some point in the past your covered for all such legal issues as the licence has been paid.

other wise, depends what country, i know the uk is changing the law to allow such behaviour and it's know that the owners of the mp3 codec won't go after users so that just leaves the rights holders for the track, and they'll not go after you for ripping a track you already paid for,

nothingspecial
July 1st, 2011, 04:54 PM
Rip to ogg, no problem ;)

beew
July 1st, 2011, 04:57 PM
Correct me if I'm wrong. None of the CD rippers of Ubuntu allow one to rip audio CDs to mp3. Also, I believe using mp3 codecs in Ubuntu has certain restrictions. So basically if I somehow manage to rip my CDs to mp3 by installing additional codecs, I'd be rendering my perfectly legal music tracks illegal. Is that right?

Why is it that closed source OSes, Windows and OSX dont have such legal issues and most Linux distros do?

Thanks.

I ripped a lot of CDs into mp3 with k3b. I believe other ripping softwares can do that too (as long as you have the codecs)

If that is illegal then the law is an a** . If such a law exists it is probably only in some parts of the U.S.A. so what do I care? I am not American and there are many things which are perfectly acceptable in my country (Canada) which would be considered mortal sin if not a crime in the U.S.A. I think in some parts of the U.S.A even VLC is illegal, if that bothers you then don't do it.

Henry Flower
July 1st, 2011, 05:12 PM
i' m pretty sure that if your computer had windows on it at some point in the past your covered for all such legal issues as the licence has been paid.

other wise, depends what country, i know the uk is changing the law to allow such behaviour and it's know that the owners of the mp3 codec won't go after users so that just leaves the rights holders for the track, and they'll not go after you for ripping a track you already paid for,

Two separate issues. Ripping CDs which are copyrighted is illegal in the UK, whatever codec you use. Yes, everyone knows it's absurd, no-one will ever be done for it, but the last government talked about changing it too - it may not be anytime soon. The problem is deciding what the changed law should allow.

Use of the mp3 codec is a separate legal issue. The prospective change in the UK law would not affect that, though again as regards end users it's a dead letter anyway.

nothingspecial
July 1st, 2011, 05:19 PM
Two separate issues. Ripping CDs which are copyrighted is illegal in the UK, whatever codec you use.

I thought you were allowed one digital copy in the UK. The stupidity being that once you put it on your portable music player you 'legally' have to delete it from your computer.

Henry Flower
July 1st, 2011, 05:57 PM
I thought you were allowed one digital copy in the UK. The stupidity being that once you put it on your portable music player you 'legally' have to delete it from your computer.

There's no such exception that I can find. Section 17 of the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988 says:



17 Infringement of copyright by copying.

(1)The copying of the work is an act restricted by the copyright in every description of copyright work; and references in this Part to copying and copies shall be construed as follows.
(2)Copying in relation to a literary, dramatic, musical or artistic work means reproducing the work in any material form.
This includes storing the work in any medium by electronic means.
(3)In relation to an artistic work copying includes the making of a copy in three dimensions of a two-dimensional work and the making of a copy in two dimensions of a three-dimensional work.
(4)Copying in relation to a film [F1 (http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1988/48/section/17#commentary-c1931723)or broadcast] includes making a photograph of the whole or any substantial part of any image forming part of the film [F1 (http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1988/48/section/17#commentary-c1931723)or broadcast].
(5)Copying in relation to the typographical arrangement of a published edition means making a facsimile copy of the arrangement.
(6)Copying in relation to any description of work includes the making of copies which are transient or are incidental to some other use of the work.



You may be thinking of one exception related to the last subsection, whereby temporary copies are permitted if they're made and necessary for a lawful purpose, but storing music on your computer is not one of those purposes. There are various provisions related to archiving, but they're restricted to libraries.

Dustin2128
July 1st, 2011, 06:03 PM
why would you rip it to mp3 in the first place? Flac is much higher quality, and free software. It's like png vs jpeg. Anyway, ripping CDs is completely legal everywhere as far as I know.

Bandit
July 1st, 2011, 06:09 PM
Correct me if I'm wrong. None of the CD rippers of Ubuntu allow one to rip audio CDs to mp3. Also, I believe using mp3 codecs in Ubuntu has certain restrictions. So basically if I somehow manage to rip my CDs to mp3 by installing additional codecs, I'd be rendering my perfectly legal music tracks illegal. Is that right?

Why is it that closed source OSes, Windows and OSX dont have such legal issues and most Linux distros do?

Thanks.

Closed source OS's do have restrictions, but their appropriate royalties have been paid under contract. Patents.. Patents.. Patents..


But if your looking for a good program, GRIP is the best, but for some reason it doesnt seem to be in the repositories anymore. Assunder CD Ripper is and is little more simpler. Both will RIP to mp3 as long as you have the libs installed. Think mpg123 is the file needed to encode, but its been a while so my memory could be off.

Swagman
July 1st, 2011, 06:09 PM
Yeah, I'm still waiting for a knock on the door for that BBC series I recorded on VHS in the 80's.... Aaaaaand what about those compilation cassettes I made up from my Vinyl collection?

If they raid my garage I'm sure they are still in there collecting dust & spiders.. But evidence is Evidence aint it !!

I in no way support "piracy" but if I've bought it legitimately then I sure as heck am going to back it up.. format shift it for my own personal usage.

I did go through an era of buying legit tapes instead of vinyl but inevitably the tape got chewed or that pad under the tape fell off or it (the sound) plain and simply went "dull" (yes I cleaned the heads regularly)

Actually that's a bone of contention as I have Legit "Split Enz - Enz of an Era" cassette in prime condition but can't be buggered climbing into the loft to drag out my tape deck just to try and rip to CD. I tried to buy it again (legit) on CD and it would cost my first born AND my right arm.

whatthefunk
July 1st, 2011, 06:09 PM
why would you rip it to mp3 in the first place? Flac is much higher quality, and free software. It's like png vs jpeg. Anyway, ripping CDs is completely legal everywhere as far as I know.

Really? Why do record companies go to such trouble to make it difficult to rip them?

Bandit
July 1st, 2011, 06:11 PM
why would you rip it to mp3 in the first place? Flac is much higher quality, and free software. It's like png vs jpeg. Anyway, ripping CDs is completely legal everywhere as far as I know.

Very few media devises support FLAC, my Pioneer Super Tuner III in my car does not. Although I agree it can be better quality, but its also still larger files.

Bandit
July 1st, 2011, 06:13 PM
Really? Why do record companies go to such trouble to make it difficult to rip them?

Never knew of any CD that couldnt be Ripped.

Besides most places have laws that allow you to make backups of media. So if your like me and never use your original CDs, those are your backups and the files on your computer are your usable media. You pay for the media (mostly), not the physical disc.

beetleman64
July 1st, 2011, 06:13 PM
It depends greatly where you live, but I wouldn't worry too much. In the UK, it's strictly illegal to rip music from a CD at all, but even the music industry says that should change.

As for whether you can, that depends on whether you have an MP3 codec installed. If you do, then Banshee will let you choose to save as an MP3, although I'd still recommend Ogg Vorbis due to the increased quality.

Dustin2128
July 1st, 2011, 06:27 PM
Really? Why do record companies go to such trouble to make it difficult to rip them?
because they want you to pay for stuff twice and the law for once is not on their side? I agree with bandit though, I've never had any trouble ripping cds, whether to mp3, ogg, or flac.

nothingspecial
July 1st, 2011, 06:34 PM
Yeah, I'm still waiting for a knock on the door for that BBC series I recorded on VHS in the 80's.... Aaaaaand what about those compilation cassettes I made up from my Vinyl collection?

If they raid my garage I'm sure they are still in there collecting dust & spiders.. But evidence is Evidence aint it !!

I in no way support "piracy" but if I've bought it legitimately then I sure as heck am going to back it up.. format shift it for my own personal usage.

I did go through an era of buying legit tapes instead of vinyl but inevitably the tape got chewed or that pad under the tape fell off or it (the sound) plain and simply went "dull" (yes I cleaned the heads regularly)

Actually that's a bone of contention as I have Legit "Split Enz - Enz of an Era" cassette in prime condition but can't be buggered climbing into the loft to drag out my tape deck just to try and rip to CD. I tried to buy it again (legit) on CD and it would cost my first born AND my right arm.

Buy vinyl. Most record companies offer a digital download free with purchase. That way, you have a legit digital copy.

Hats off to little Side One Dummy Records who offer wavs and flacs whereas most of the majors only offer mp3.

cariboo
July 1st, 2011, 07:10 PM
Closed source OS's do have restrictions, but their appropriate royalties have been paid under contract. Patents.. Patents.. Patents..


But if your looking for a good program, GRIP is the best, but for some reason it doesnt seem to be in the repositories anymore. Assunder CD Ripper is and is little more simpler. Both will RIP to mp3 as long as you have the libs installed. Think mpg123 is the file needed to encode, but its been a while so my memory could be off.

I agree Grip was a good CD ripper, but it was no longer maintained, and not many people used it, so it was removed from the repository.

Move to Canada if you want to legally rip your CDs, we pay a licensing fee on each blank CD for the right to be able to make copies of our music.

Swagman
July 1st, 2011, 07:19 PM
I'm a guitarist.. Does that mean that in Canada If I record my guitar choonz to optical media then I am effectively paying some corp to licence my own choonz back to me ?

cariboo
July 1st, 2011, 07:27 PM
I'm not sure how licensing fees get paid to the artists, but they do have to be a member of ASCAP/SOCAN to qualify.

nothingspecial
July 1st, 2011, 07:37 PM
I'm a guitarist.. Does that mean that in Canada If I record my guitar choonz to optical media then I am effectively paying some corp to licence my own choonz back to me ?

Depends wether or not it's a free format. :P

Seriously, this is like the English law that, if you are an able bodied male over 12 you have to do one hours archery practice every day......

that is law....

...but no judge ....ever.... is going to uphold it.

Technology moves faster than law, and the legal system know that.

arnab_das
July 1st, 2011, 07:59 PM
wow this is really complicated isnt it? and i thought it was as simple as inserting the cd in the tray and clicking "Rip".

to be honest, i am actually thinking of buying windows 7 because of these legal issues. i have quite a lot of CDs and the last thing i want is to do something which will render my collection "illegal". seems better to buy a copy of windows and rip everything via itunes/wmp, i get to keep my CDs and mp3s, all patents abided by, all dues paid. and i really dont want to have the clutter of having 2 OSes once i pay for a particular OS, so ubuntu would have to go, not something which i want to do. but i might be forced to.

but seriously, is there a way out? maybe if i could pay for just the mp3 codec itself and continue using ubuntu. any way of doing something like that?

thanks for all the replies guys. if i do indeed move to windows after so many years, this community is something i will definitely miss.

Swagman
July 1st, 2011, 08:20 PM
Yes you can buy the "Fluendo Codec pack" from Canonicals online store

http://shop.canonical.com/product_info.php?products_id=244

Zero2Nine
July 1st, 2011, 08:27 PM
Rip to ogg, no problem ;)

Exactly! And if one cares about quality rip to FLAC.

KiwiNZ
July 1st, 2011, 08:35 PM
Correct me if I'm wrong. None of the CD rippers of Ubuntu allow one to rip audio CDs to mp3. Also, I believe using mp3 codecs in Ubuntu has certain restrictions. So basically if I somehow manage to rip my CDs to mp3 by installing additional codecs, I'd be rendering my perfectly legal music tracks illegal. Is that right?

Why is it that closed source OSes, Windows and OSX dont have such legal issues and most Linux distros do?

Thanks.

This is an international Forum, laws differ from Nation to Nation therefore the advice here is going to differ depending on the members home.

Check with the appropriate authority in your country as to the legal requirements then make your choice.

Now due to COC and legal considerations, Thread closed.