He/She pronoun usage issues on forums

[PCaddicted]

What do you do when you don't know whether a user is male or female and need to refer to that person as "he" or "she"?(their username might not tell the gender).
Using "they" or "he/she" may be a solution but it isn't always suitable.Sometimes the context makes it "ear-scratching" or somewhat weird(especially when you have to refer to that user repeatedly).
Regarding me,I consider all users to be males(like me) and refer to anyone as "he"(please don't consider me a sexist!).Using only "he" is another solution,but it might still be somehow offending for female users.What an entanglement,isn't it?

[CharlesA]

I refer to them as "they."

Either that or "he" :rolleyes:

[jhonan]

hmm... I usually use 'they', but as you said, that doesn't always work.

How about following the lead of Silence of the Lambs and use 'it' ?

"It rubs the lotion on its skin, or else it gets the hose again"

[gopherofdoom]

Using slightly fewer characters, there's always "s/he", fairly easy to type. Which covers most situations, except for the rare possibility that they're gender-neutral...!

[s.fox]

I personally avoid gender on the internet.

[PCaddicted]

Originally Posted by s.fox
I personally avoid gender on the internet.
Me too.But,unfortunately,we often have to use pronouns!

Using slightly fewer characters, there's always "s/he", fairly easy to type. Which covers most situations, except for the rare possibility that they're gender-neutral...!
Then how do you call someone who is gender-neutral?"He" or "she"?Or in another way?:lolflag:

[gopherofdoom]

Then how do you call someone who is gender-neutral?"He" or "she"?Or in another way?
Erm, I would go ahead and say "they". I believe some people have made up some alternatives such as "ve"... but I find that a bit odd, though I'd use it if someone asked me to.

[Random_Dude]

I use "he", there's a higher probability that I get it right.
English is not a very complicated language in this aspect. In my mother language (like in many others) you have masculine and feminine for a lot more words, including adjectives.

Cheers :cool:

[NMFTM]

Using slightly fewer characters, there's always "s/he", fairly easy to type. Which covers most situations, except for the rare possibility that they're gender-neutral...!
That politically correct stuff just looks weird. It's like how "man" has to be replaced by "person". When in it's proper context it doesn't necessarily refer to a male Human, it refers to a HuMAN in general. Sometimes this stuff really breaks down (e.g. personhole cover).

(plus, this is the Internet, and there're no women on the internet ;))

[Zero2Nine]

99% chance of being correct when you use 'he' :p (in IT related forums)

[prshah]

I wish I had never read this b****y thread. I was fine until now, now I will be second guessing every post I make. Oh for a "scroll of amnesia". :)

[NormanFLinux]

"He" and "His" are traditionally understood to include the female as well as male. Same thing with all descriptive phrases with "man" in them. I don't feel the language excludes any one and the silly games feminists play with it does violence to its sense of expression.

There is no great need to change tradition.

[Merk42]

Use "he"
There are no women on the Internet

problem solved

[Nyromith]

When I learned MCSE from Microsoft's books, I noticed that a user always referred to as 'She'. Is it a new grammar rule?

[HoKaze]

Technically the male pronouns can also be used to refer to something regardless of gender, as has already been pointed out, but due to Political Correctness, society in general and the issue of offending people, "they" has to be used instead.
There are several gender-neutral pronouns I've seen thrown about online that have yet to reach widespread usage, but their rarity means using them is more likely to confuse and offend.

I generally use "they" but may slip-up sometimes and use "he" by mistake. On the whole I think trying to use "they" but not being too concerned if you slip up is probably the best approach to the issue. Of course, if people were better educated on the matter...

[PCaddicted]

Use "he"
There are no women on the Internet

problem solved
LOL :lolflag:
But how do you know that?:confused:

[PCaddicted]

When I learned MCSE from Microsoft's books, I noticed that a user always referred to as 'She'. Is it a new grammar rule?
Maybe that thing had been written by a woman.I think this is the only likely cause.

[cespinal]

INB4 no women on the interwebbbbbzzzz....

[PCaddicted]

INB4 no women on the interwebbbbbzzzz....
OK,but I think it's quite risky to say such things.An admin might come around and shut down this thread(which is mine,btw:mad:) because they'll think that you're a sexist.

[Random_Dude]

LOL :lolflag:
But how do you know that?:confused:

Rules number 29 and 30 of the Internet.


29. On the internet, all girls are men, and all kids are undercover FBI agents.
30. There are NO girls on the internet.

[Gerontion]

The English pronoun system is seriously crappy and unfortunately there's no answer. It's not acceptable to use he to refer to women or (singular) people in general and whilst it's tempting to use they, that is really a plural. Your options are either the ugly s/he, (possibly) causing offence, being ungrammatical, or really crazy sentence construction as you try to do away with your subjects altogether. Take your pick.

[PCaddicted]

The English pronoun system is seriously crappy and unfortunately there's no answer. It's not acceptable to use he to refer to women or (singular) people in general and whilst it's tempting to use they, that is really a plural. Your options are either the ugly s/he, (possibly) causing offence, being ungrammatical, or really crazy sentence construction as you try to do away with your subjects altogether. Take your pick.
Lost in the maze of English grammar.

[krapp]

The English pronoun system is seriously crappy and unfortunately there's no answer.

Why is it crappy?

As for the OP, a common strategy in contemporary academic writing is to use "she" exclusively when referring to a hypothetical subject. It's politically motivated, of course, but gets the point across, and the he's can't justly complain they're being excluded.

[Grenage]

It's always been a source of wonder for me; how the hell did we get this far without a real gender neutral pronoun?

If we make one up, maybe it will stick - I suggest Te.

[el_koraco]

The English pronoun system is seriously crappy and unfortunately there's no answer.

As opposed to?

[Gerontion]

Why is it crappy?

It's very restricted (some other languages allow you to package much more information in the pronouns you select) but then has an excess of distinct subject, object and possessive pronouns (as well as possessive adjectives), all of which are pretty much unnecessary.

[zealibib slaughter]

As it has been stated before the usage of he to refer to both genders in situations which the gender could not previously be determined was completely acceptable until the mid 1980's. It now is not politically correct, but seeing how I am politically incorrect then I will continue to use he to refer to both genders in these situations. Really why do we care so much if we offend over something which was not an offense not too long ago?

[Simian Man]

whilst it's tempting to use they, that is really a plural.
I use they. It sounds right to everyone but grammar Nazis (eg people who use the word "whilst"). The point of language is to express yourself clearly without sounding retarded, not following some rule book.


Rules number 29 and 30 of the Internet.
There are lots of girls on the internet, just maybe not the parts you frequent (eg here).


Why is it crappy?
Languages like German have singular, neutral pronouns that can refer to a man or woman. English doesn't.

[Random_Dude]

There are lots of girls on the internet, just maybe not the parts you frequent (eg here).


It's an internet meme (http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/rules-of-the-internet#.Td-wlkfI99M).

[krapp]

It's very restricted (some other languages allow you to package much more information in the pronouns you select) but then has an excess of distinct subject, object and possessive pronouns (as well as possessive adjectives), all of which are pretty much unnecessary.

Which pronouns are unnecessary? I'm trying to think which ones might be, and I can't come up with any.

English isn't an inflected language, hasn't been one for many, many centuries, so I feel your criticism may have more to do with personal preference (you are native speaker of an inflected language) than anything else.

[Gerontion]

Which pronouns are unnecessary? I'm trying to think which ones might be, and I can't come up with any.
You only really need one set of pronouns to do the work of subject, object and possessive pronouns (so I would do for me and mine, as well as my). If your language follows reasonably strict word order, then just where the pronoun appears in the sentence will probably tell you what it is and if not, then context almost certainly will. I speak Thai (not as well as I should but acceptably) and that has about 60 pronouns but with no distinction between the different types so, for example, in Thai, the normal first person pronoun for male speakers is ผม (phom), and that's both subject and object and possessive/possessive adjective (which can be marked with the equivalent of 'of' but isn't normally in informal speech). Because you have so many pronouns, you are able to show reasonably fine-grained levels of intimacy, familiarity, respect, social distance, etc just by this one choice.


It sounds right to everyone but grammar Nazis (eg people who use the word "whilst").
Whilst is perfectly normal British English.


The point of language is to express yourself clearly without sounding retarded,
Yes, but if you use a plural to refer to a singular you run the risk of sounding exactly that, at least to us grammar Nazis.

[krapp]

You only really need one set of pronouns to do the work of subject, object and possessive pronouns (so I would do for me and mine, as well as my). If your language follows reasonably strict word order, then just where the pronoun appears in the sentence will probably tell you what it is and if not, then context almost certainly will.

Well that would require I to be inflected somehow, which won't ever happen. At the moment "this is mine" can't be rendered any more simply. Are you suggesting "this is I's"?

[forrestcupp]

There was a move on these forums a year or two ago to always use "she". I thought that was kind of ridiculous.

I always use "he" when in doubt because up until recently, that was the standard, accepted way of handling this problem. In high school grammar class, I was always taught by female teachers to use "he" when the gender is unknown.

[rg4w]

The absence of a gender-independent third-person pronoun is one of the few true failings of the English language.

It's common to use "he", esp. in formal writing, but it's so common that many perceive it as exclusive and somewhat off-putting.

Many years ago MacTech magazine ran an issue in which they used "she" for all pronouns referring to a person of unidentified gender. It was an interesting experiment, because so much of tech writing uses "he" that "she" was seen as a refreshing change for some readers, while a distraction for others.

In my own writing I often use "she" simply to provide a little "equal time" in an industry still largely dominated by men. If it helps women readers better identify with tech roles all the better, but if nothing else it subtly raises awareness of gender roles in tech fields, and IMO this is a worthy thing to ponder even if it risks a subtle distraction from the content; any distraction is a bug in our culture, not in the use of "she". "She" is a feature, not a bug. :)

[krapp]

There was a move on these forums a year or two ago to always use "she". I thought that was kind of ridiculous.

I always use "he" when in doubt because up until recently, that was the standard, accepted way of handling this problem. In high school grammar class, I was always taught by female teachers to use "he" when the gender is unknown.

Sometime in the 90s American schools picked up on the idea (which dates from at least the 60s) that language is not simply a value-neutral medium of communication but the primary fountain of ideology. Language inflicts a real violence, racist, sexist, classist.


In my own writing I often use "she" simply to provide a little "equal time" in an industry still largely dominated by men.

Good man!

[forrestcupp]

Sometime in the 90s American schools picked up on the idea (which dates from at least the 60s) that language is not simply a value-neutral medium of communication but the primary fountain of ideology. Language inflicts a real violence, racist, sexist, classist.Well, I graduated in 1990, so I missed that. It's funny how no one really cared that much before they realized it was wrong.


Good man!
Lol.
http://files.sharenator.com/I_see_what_you_did_there_cat_RE_More_funnies_for_y ou_all-s480x360-106842-580.jpg

[krapp]

Well, I graduated in 1990, so I missed that. It's funny how no one really cared that much before they realized it was wrong.

Ignorance is bliss! But enlightenment can't be undone. You can't unsee it as the intertubes saying goes.

[timZZ]

What do you do when you don't know whether a user is male or female and need to refer to that person as "he" or "she"?(their username might not tell the gender).
Using "they" or "he/she" may be a solution but it isn't always suitable.Sometimes the context makes it "ear-scratching" or somewhat weird(especially when you have to refer to that user repeatedly).
Regarding me,I consider all users to be males(like me) and refer to anyone as "he"(please don't consider me a sexist!).Using only "he" is another solution,but it might still be somehow offending for female users.What an entanglement,isn't it?

I use their forum name.

[Barrucadu]

I usually use "they", but it doesn't really feel right when referring to a singular person. I would prefer to use "it" but that's not exactly socially acceptable.

[Simian Man]

Whilst is perfectly normal British English.
I know, but it's almost never used.



Yes, but if you use a plural to refer to a singular you run the risk of sounding exactly that, at least to us grammar Nazis.
Maybe, but to me, and most people I think, it sounds fine. Consider:

#1 "If a user corrupts their / partition, they are better off reinstalling."

#2 "If a user corrupts his or her / partition, he or she is better off reinstalling."

I *know* #2 is correct, but I still much prefer #1 and will always say it that way.

[aysiu]

There was a move on these forums a year or two ago to always use "she". I thought that was kind of ridiculous. There was no such move. It was solely my own personal choice to do so. Nobody was forcing or coercing others to do so. I'm amazed by how many people think it's so upsetting to use "she" to encompass males as well but find it perfectly acceptable to use "he" to encompass females.

Apart from some name-calling ("feminazi" "politically correct nonsense"), I haven't heard any logical objections to my justification for my own personal use of the feminine singular pronoun as the default (http://www.psychocats.net/ubuntucat/why-i-say-she/). Again, I am not saying anyone else has to do this. I'm just explaining why I do.

[el_koraco]

You only really need one set of pronouns to do the work of subject, object and possessive pronouns (so I would do for me and mine, as well as my). If your language follows reasonably strict word order, then just where the pronoun appears in the sentence will probably tell you what it is and if not, then context almost certainly will. I speak Thai (not as well as I should but acceptably) and that has about 60 pronouns but with no distinction between the different types so, for example, in Thai, the normal first person pronoun for male speakers is ผม (phom), and that's both subject and object and possessive/possessive adjective (which can be marked with the equivalent of 'of' but isn't normally in informal speech). Because you have so many pronouns, you are able to show reasonably fine-grained levels of intimacy, familiarity, respect, social distance, etc just by this one choice.


Yeah, but don't a lot of Asian languages follow these patterns of fine-grained distinctions? I don't see many (if any) Western languages that have more than the usual set of personal pronouns (I, you, he, she, it, they), so i don't see it as a failing on the part of the English language. The German pronoun "man", that Simian Man mentioned, is not used as gender-neutral, but rather as you use "one" to refer to an indefinite person in English.

[forrestcupp]

There was no such move. It was solely my own personal choice to do so. Nobody was forcing or coercing others to do so. I'm amazed by how many people think it's so upsetting to use "she" to encompass males as well but find it perfectly acceptable to use "he" to encompass females.
I know no one was forced. But it seems like wasn't only you. It may have begun with you, but it seems like it was catching on with other people, too.

It doesn't matter to me if you want to use "she", but I just don't identify with that myself. Until fairly recently, most women didn't have a problem in the world with the standard of using "he". And like I said, I was even taught that standard by women.

[KL_72_TR]

In 'ubuntuforums.org' we are 'Users' and 'Memebers'. It is better not to refer to gender. We must have in mind 'The user', 'The member' and not 'The male' or 'The female'....!
This is how I see it.

[Chronon]

I usually avoid gendered pronouns and simply refer to users by name.

[aysiu]

I usually avoid gendered pronouns and simply refer to users by name.
Same here, unless the username indicates a probable gender (john.chen or samanthaamandabasil)).

[danbuter]

I use "he" because it's proper English.

[earthpigg]

"He" unless you specifically know better.

If someone questions you, feign a romance language being your first language.

[PCaddicted]

Even worse,it's not a good idea to ask a user whether they're male or female.And there are thousands of users and you can't remember everyone's gender,anyway.

[Thewhistlingwind]

I use he, if they want to call me out for being "sexist" they're free to do so.

[Eldera]

"He" and "His" are traditionally understood to include the female as well as male. Same thing with all descriptive phrases with "man" in them. I don't feel the language excludes any one and the silly games feminists play with it does violence to its sense of expression.

There is no great need to change tradition.

I have used "he" for years and I am comfortable with it.

For the sake of this thread I will state that I am a female man (female human).

In my opinion there are so many issues that are more important than what we should call each other. Can't be more specific without getting political. To make a big deal on the he/she pronoun issue may be focusing on the wrong thing.

I am not a reactionary to the feminist movement. I have just moved in my own direction in my own way. In the 50's (That's before all the political push in the 60's), I was working a job that was traditionally a man's job. I have worked several since then. I have had a lot of mail addressed to Mr. I could care less.

What pronouns we feel comfortable using on the forum are influenced by the issues in our lives outside of the forum.

I think we should use whatever pronouns we are comfortable using. I also think that anyone that gets mis-named should ignore it. There are only hurt feelings when someone decides to be hurt. What's the big deal?
For most of our posts, gender is irrelevant.

[forrestcupp]

I also think that anyone that get mis-named should ignore it. There are only hurt feelings when someone decides to be hurt. What's the big deal?

Either that, or if I wrongly call you "he" and you just can't get past it, let me know. If you let me know, I'll never call you "he" again. If you don't want to let me know, then you should just ignore it.

Great insights from a female, by the way.

[oxf]

I use their forum name.

This is most sensible response of this thread.

You know I honestly don't know what the problem is with this. Most times it isn't necessary to use a gendered pronoun just use the user name as above. But when it is use some common sense and courtesy.

I'm not going to get too bent out of shape if someone makes an innocent mistake although it;s very annoying. Thats why I usually sign my name at the bottom of the post. But once that mistake has been pointed out I do expect to be addressed properly. And I've had guys still insisting on refering to me as "he" on occasions after it's been made obvious that I'm not.

What I do find sexist and rude is the comments previously on this thread along the lines of "there are no women on the internet" and "I refer to everyone as HE" I thought we had moved on from that a long time ago. Come on guys treat us with just a bit of respect please!

Katya

[AlphaLexman]

The English pronoun system is seriously crappy and unfortunately there's no answer. It's not acceptable to use he to refer to women or (singular) people in general and whilst it's tempting to use they, that is really a plural. Your options are either the ugly s/he, (possibly) causing offence, being ungrammatical, or really crazy sentence construction as you try to do away with your subjects altogether. Take your pick.
Actually one is the correct pronoun singular usage of they.

[forrestcupp]

Actually one is the correct pronoun singular usage of they.
That's true, but only if you're not talking about a specific person.

[PCaddicted]

This is most sensible response of this thread.

You know I honestly don't know what the problem is with this. Most times it isn't necessary to use a gendered pronoun just use the user name as above. But when it is use some common sense and courtesy.

I'm not going to get too bent out of shape if someone makes an innocent mistake although it;s very annoying. Thats why I usually sign my name at the bottom of the post. But once that mistake has been pointed out I do expect to be addressed properly. And I've had guys still insisting on refering to me as "he" on occasions after it's been made obvious that I'm not.

What I do find sexist and rude is the comments previously on this thread along the lines of "there are no women on the internet" and "I refer to everyone as HE" I thought we had moved on from that a long time ago. Come on guys treat us with just a bit of respect please!

Katya

Sexism is not allowed on Ubuntu Forums,anyway.Still,I'm one of the male users who consider all members to be males(because I think it's safest to do so) thus I refer to any user as "he" unless someone explicitly indicates they're female.
The original topic of this thread was not sexism,but usage of English pronouns.

[Thewhistlingwind]

"I refer to everyone as HE"

I thought that the condition "Unless told otherwise" was heavily implied.

[doas777]

i have no problem with using 'he', and generally find those who are frustrated by it, themselves frustrate me, so I pretend they don't exist.

to me the big problem with english pronouns is the lack of a 'plural you' that is not the same as the singular. I find that i have to use 'y'all' to speak precisely, but that makes me sound like i'm from south of the mason-dixon.

[oxf]

Sexism is not allowed on Ubuntu Forums,anyway.Still,I'm one of the male users who consider all members to be males(because I think it's safest to do so) thus I refer to any user as "he" unless someone explicitly indicates they're female.
The original topic of this thread was not sexism,but usage of English pronouns.

Well I suppose you are correct in a strictly statistical sense. I.E if no female indicator there's a high probability that the person is male. (although there are a few more of us here than people realise) But in that case why not just refer to the user name or something neutral until gender is established?

You are also correct that the original topic was not sexism and I'm not accusing you. However, a few comments quickly became sexist unfortunately.


I thought that the condition "Unless told otherwise" was heavily implied.

See above..

Katya

[el_koraco]

Katya

so, do you use the new version of Mint? :D

[Ric_NYC]

At least in English things have no gender like Latin languages, German etc.


"In English our nouns don't have genders, on the whole.... Exceptionally, when we refer to a ship as a she, we are assigning to it a gender, and, incidentally, the same gender the Romans assigned, feminine.* Our pronouns, however, do have gender.

3 Genders

Latin has three genders,

masculine
feminine, and
neuter" (Salon)


Let's see... the word "blood" in 3 Latin languages:

In Portuguese: Sangue (masculine)... O sangue.
In Spanish: sangre (feminine)... La sangre.
In French: sang... (masculine)... Le sang.


It doesn't make sense... You have to know word by word... Usually words ending in "o" are masculine in Portuguese and Spanish... feminine for words ending in "a"... But there are exceptions... :p

[el_koraco]

At least in English things have no gender like Latin languages, German etc.



Not things, nouns :D
And, yeah, this is one of the great advantages of English. Especially when it comes to declination. And when it comes to the casus thing, you're equally lucky. My language has seven. Finnish has 15, I think.

[PhilGil]

It appears to me that "they" is rapidly becoming a de facto gender-neutral pronoun (even though it's grammatically incorrect when referring to one person).

Unless I know the poster's gender, I try to use the user name or another gender neutral term (I've also been known to use "he/she" in posts).

[el_koraco]

IUnless I know the poster's gender, I try to use their user name or another gender neutral term

fixed that for ya.

[krapp]

What I do find sexist and rude is the comments previously on this thread along the lines of "there are no women on the internet" and "I refer to everyone as HE" I thought we had moved on from that a long time ago. Come on guys treat us with just a bit of respect please!

Katya

Unless I'm mistaken it was meant to be a joke, a self-deprecating one actually, like only nerdy men are actually interested in using the internet.

[oxf]

so, do you use the new version of Mint? :D

Not yet but I'm thinking of trying it.
Nice of them to name it after me :D
Katya

[Legendary_Bibo]

People should be happy I address them at all and be content with whatever I address them as. :P

[jrusso2]

I don't find being referred to as he as offensive of people who think their are no women on the internet of technical forums. now that idea is offensive.

[Swagman]

The correct British term for unknown gender is "He" by default.

The sex of an unborn child is always "he" unless you have absolute proof otherwise ie: Ultrasound scan and even when that scan is completed it is still known as a "he" until birth.

Which is quite ironic because all female eggs are X by default (it's why boys have nipples).

It's the addition of Y at fertilisation that creates XY (Male) or XX (Female)

So... Throughout history men having been blaming their wives for not giving them a son when it is THEM at fault for not supplying the Y !!



[edit]

I should add that even after we were told our second daughter was a boy by ultrascan we actually got the "other brand" at birth !!

[Kenc3]

I try to not talk about other people however, if I must, why not use the name?

[murderslastcrow]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender-neutral_pronoun

Until very recently (about 50 years ago), most textbooks prescribed 'he' as a rule when the gender is unknown, as saying 'it' was considered rude and 'they' was considered too ambiguous to be clear language. You can still see this in use today.

I usually use 'he' unless I'm around someone who exceptionally sensitive to these situations, since I do like to observe proper use of the English language. Of course, the point of language is to communicate, not merely to follow arbitrary rules that have little reason behind them, so I catch myself using it a lot.

Basically, if you're in a college English class, use 'he' to please your professor. Otherwise, use whatever seems appropriate, and make your best attempt to discover the gender of someone, or use their name if you want to refer to them in the forums (speaking as if he isn't there isn't very nice).

[sanderella]

I'm often called 'he'. I got used to it.

[krapp]

Basically, if you're in a college English class, use 'he' to please your professor.

Actually you got it backwards. For many American English professors the political effects of discourse make traditional forms of address unviable.

[DoktorSeven]

I've always advocated the classic use of the male pronoun to mean either. This "s/he" and "he or she" stuff is awkward to use in common speech and writing.

I like how the 2nd Edition AD&D Player's Guide put it:

Centuries of use have neutered the male pronoun. In written material it is clear, concise, and familiar. Nothing else is..

[forrestcupp]

and make your best attempt to discover the gender of someone

I agree with most of what you said. But the problem with this is that for some reason some women feel vulnerable if people know they are a woman, and they don't want people to know. Not everyone is like this, but some are. The internet is an easy place for predators to look nice.

[JDShu]

Actually using "he" or "she" should both work, and I've seen both in formal writing. Use whatever you want, the onus is on the person who knows the answer to tell you.

[Ric_NYC]

"Mankind".

[manzdagratiano]

I use "they"; so far, I believe that is the only acceptable solution to that problem

[Merk42]

"Mankind".
Oh but that has "man" in it, and as an irrational feminist womyn I have a problem with it

[murderslastcrow]

Actually you got it backwards. For many American English professors the political effects of discourse make traditional forms of address unviable.

Guess I ran into one of the odd ones. I'm not exactly attending the most prestigious college, I suppose. XD

Also, when I say 'try your best to discover their gender', I don't mean look through their mail for their name or anything. I just mean that, if it's immediately assessable, you should probably at least take a moment to try to understand their gender. But you're right, bringing an unordinary amount of attention to someone's gender isn't at all polite.

It really would be nice if we had something other than 'it' to call people in conversations where the gender's distinction isn't at all important. Then again, you are all things, so I guess I don't mind calling all of you 'it' consistently. XD Don't deny it, you animals! Look at your biology!

But really, just don't be overwhelmingly ignorant and I think people will usually give you the benefit of the doubt.