Why Linux is years away from general desktop use

[Xantros]

A few experience I have had today highlight the uncoordination and severity of Linux in reality.

I want to create a basic vector image... easily achievable in Microsoft Windows's Paint, here is my experience with Linux:

GIMP - cannot create squares
GNU Paint - does not have an undo function
Inkscape - does not have a pencil tool
KolourPaint - requires full KDE desktop environment to be installed.

LINUX ANNOYANCE!
There may be some other programs out there, but I can't be bothered with Linux right now enough to care as Windows in my virtual machine solve my problem.

Someone needs to create a simple vector image program that has a pencil tool, square creation tool, and an undo function to pair Linux with Windows 3.1 capability. Unfortunately I cannot program.

[ajankovic]

Maybe Libre Office Draw (http://www.libreoffice.org/features/draw/)?

[weasel fierce]

Yes. Your very specific situation is absolutely the reason that grandmothers aren't installing linux.

[Shmantiv_Radio]

A few experience I have had today highlight the uncoordination and severity of Linux in reality.

I want to create a basic vector image... easily achievable in Microsoft Windows's Paint, here is my experience with Linux:

GIMP - cannot create squares
GNU Paint - does not have an undo function
Inkscape - does not have a pencil tool
KolourPaint - requires full KDE desktop environment to be installed.

LINUX ANNOYANCE!
There may be some other programs out there, but I can't be bothered with Linux right now enough to care as Windows in my virtual machine solve my problem.

Someone needs to create a simple vector image program that has a pencil tool, square creation tool, and an undo function to pair Linux with Windows 3.1 capability. Unfortunately I cannot program.

I think there is a way to make squares in GIMP. It was really complicated if I remember.

[satanselbow]

GIMP - cannot create squares


That is such a ridiculous statement it really isn't worthy of comment... Darn! I just did! :confused:

[Shmantiv_Radio]

Rectangle/square how-to.

http://hubpages.com/hub/Creating-a-Rectangle-or-Rounded-Rectangle-Using-The-Gimp

Yes it's overcomplicated.

[user1397]

as far as i know, ms paint is a raster editor like gnu paint or kolourpaint, but inkscape is a vector editor.

o and inkscape does have a pencil tool, its called 'draw freehand lines' it's on the left side menu, it looks like a pencil

but yes, you do have a point, sometimes it is hard to find the right tool for the job in linux, and in this particular area it is weak (aka a simple yet quality raster image manipulation program built with no large dependencies, or at least a gnome or gtk+ equivalent of kolourpaint)

[Shmantiv_Radio]

Also try Pinta. Best paint program on Linux.

[giddyup306]

Getting in before recurring....

KolourPaint does NOT require full KDE desktop environment to be installed.

I just installed it a few hours ago on GNOME.

GNU Paint does kind of suck, especially if you have clumsy hands like I do.

FWIW, an hour or two ago I was looking for a way to make a blacked out rectangle in Gimp. I searched for probably an hour, and just installed KolourPaint. Game. Set. Match. I just switch from different photo programs to edit certain things. Like when I have to flip an image 90 or 180 degrees, I just use the image viewer. Same thing with KDEnlive and pitivi. I just install different programs for different specific functions.

[Lucradia]

I just installed it a few hours ago on GNOME.

Via software-center, synaptic or the terminal?

The last one, did you use --no-install-recommends?

You also forgot something about GIMP: Adjustment Layers.

You also forgot Good Flash support.

[NightwishFan]

Linux works fine on general desktops. Problem is we need some real use in order for developers to want to make decent software.

[alexan]

Good work to Microsoft in doing the excellent software called Photoshop then!



yes, I am sarcastic. How come that people still isn't able to make difference between application and OS software? :confused:



Virtualbox, Wine, Crossover and Cedega... these are your fix to the commercial stuff you need

[Lucradia]

Virtualbox, Wine, Crossover and Cedega... these are your fix to the commercial stuff you need

Sadly, Cedega sold itself to GameTree (now known as TransGaming)

Crossover, like Wine, is dodgy at best for a lot of applications. Still can't run newer flash environments in it very easily. Not that I would, I loved Flash 8 and before, now it's just blech.

[giddyup306]

Via software-center, synaptic or the terminal?



sudo apt-get install kolourpaint4


You also forgot Good Flash support.

Who said anything about flash? I use 64-bit Ubuntu 10.10. No issues.

[TeoBigusGeekus]

qcad, bricscad, etc.
Trying to draw vectors with gimp is like trying to create spreadsheets with word.

[KingYaba]

Also try Pinta. Best paint program on Linux.

I agree. Pinta is pretty good.

[user1397]

sudo apt-get install kolourpaint4
$ sudo apt-get install kolourpaint4
[sudo] password for user:
Reading package lists... Done
Building dependency tree
Reading state information... Done
The following extra packages will be installed:
appmenu-qt docbook-xsl exiv2 icoutils kdebase-runtime kdebase-runtime-data
kdelibs-bin kdelibs5-data kdelibs5-plugins kdoctools
kubuntu-debug-installer libattica0 libaudio2 libclucene0ldbl
libdbusmenu-qt2 libexiv2-10 libgif4 libiodbc2 libkatepartinterfaces4
libkcmutils4 libkdecore5 libkdesu5 libkdeui5 libkdewebkit5 libkdnssd4
libkemoticons4 libkfile4 libkhtml5 libkidletime4 libkio5 libkjsapi4
libkjsembed4 libkmediaplayer4 libknewstuff3-4 libknotifyconfig4 libkntlm4
libkparts4 libkprintutils4 libkpty4 libkrosscore4 libktexteditor4
libmysqlclient16 libnepomuk4 libnepomukquery4a libnepomukutils4
libntrack-qt4-1 libntrack0 libphonon4 libplasma3 libpolkit-qt-1-1
libqapt-runtime libqapt1 libqca2 libqimageblitz4 libqt4-dbus
libqt4-declarative libqt4-designer libqt4-network libqt4-opengl
libqt4-qt3support libqt4-script libqt4-sql libqt4-sql-mysql libqt4-svg
libqt4-xml libqt4-xmlpatterns libqtcore4 libqtgui4 libqtwebkit4 libraptor1
librasqal2 librdf0 libreadline5 libsolid4 libsoprano4 libssh-4
libstreamanalyzer0 libstreams0 libthreadweaver4 libvirtodbc0 mysql-common
ntrack-module-libnl-0 odbcinst odbcinst1debian2 oxygen-icon-theme phonon
phonon-backend-gstreamer plasma-scriptengine-declarative
plasma-scriptengine-javascript qapt-batch shared-desktop-ontologies
soprano-daemon virtuoso-minimal virtuoso-opensource-6.1-bin
virtuoso-opensource-6.1-common
Suggested packages:
docbook-xsl-doc-html docbook-xsl-doc-pdf docbook-xsl-doc-text
docbook-xsl-doc libsaxon-java libxalan2-java docbook-xsl-saxon fop xalan
dbtoepub libterm-readline-gnu-perl libterm-readline-perl-perl
djvulibre-bin nas hspell libqca2-plugin-cyrus-sasl libqca2-plugin-gnupg
libqca2-plugin-ossl libqca2-plugin-pkcs11 libqt4-dev qt4-qtconfig
raptor-utils rasqal-utils librdf-storage-postgresql librdf-storage-mysql
librdf-storage-sqlite redland-utils phonon-backend-xine phonon-backend-vlc
phonon-backend-mplayer gstreamer0.10-plugins-ugly
The following NEW packages will be installed:
appmenu-qt docbook-xsl exiv2 icoutils kdebase-runtime kdebase-runtime-data
kdelibs-bin kdelibs5-data kdelibs5-plugins kdoctools kolourpaint4
kubuntu-debug-installer libattica0 libaudio2 libclucene0ldbl
libdbusmenu-qt2 libexiv2-10 libgif4 libiodbc2 libkatepartinterfaces4
libkcmutils4 libkdecore5 libkdesu5 libkdeui5 libkdewebkit5 libkdnssd4
libkemoticons4 libkfile4 libkhtml5 libkidletime4 libkio5 libkjsapi4
libkjsembed4 libkmediaplayer4 libknewstuff3-4 libknotifyconfig4 libkntlm4
libkparts4 libkprintutils4 libkpty4 libkrosscore4 libktexteditor4
libmysqlclient16 libnepomuk4 libnepomukquery4a libnepomukutils4
libntrack-qt4-1 libntrack0 libphonon4 libplasma3 libpolkit-qt-1-1
libqapt-runtime libqapt1 libqca2 libqimageblitz4 libqt4-dbus
libqt4-declarative libqt4-designer libqt4-network libqt4-opengl
libqt4-qt3support libqt4-script libqt4-sql libqt4-sql-mysql libqt4-svg
libqt4-xml libqt4-xmlpatterns libqtcore4 libqtgui4 libqtwebkit4 libraptor1
librasqal2 librdf0 libreadline5 libsolid4 libsoprano4 libssh-4
libstreamanalyzer0 libstreams0 libthreadweaver4 libvirtodbc0 mysql-common
ntrack-module-libnl-0 odbcinst odbcinst1debian2 oxygen-icon-theme phonon
phonon-backend-gstreamer plasma-scriptengine-declarative
plasma-scriptengine-javascript qapt-batch shared-desktop-ontologies
soprano-daemon virtuoso-minimal virtuoso-opensource-6.1-bin
virtuoso-opensource-6.1-common
0 upgraded, 96 newly installed, 0 to remove and 1 not upgraded.
Need to get 68.5 MB of archives.
After this operation, 241 MB of additional disk space will be used.
Do you want to continue [Y/n]?

[satanselbow]

Good work to Microsoft in doing the excellent software called Photoshop then!

I don't think M$ had much to do with Photoshop and it is commercially more frequently found on Mac than Win...

High end graphic software is not really a block to "general desktop use" - there are plenty of stable image managers and basic touchup apps that the "general" camera user would be more than happy with compared with their win counterparts.

Hardware support - particularly printers/scanners is a much larger hurdle. Get Kodak / Epsom / HP / Canon to produce full Linux drivers and the lid will truly be blown off.

[Xantros]

Hey guys,

Yeah sorry I got confused between vector and raster. I meant raster.

Pinta looks ok from the screen shots, but its released as tarball only, like 99.9% of my experiences:

./configure

always brings some error that I am missing something, but doesn't tell me where to get it... and if I do manage to find and obtain it, its useally another tarball resulting in the same thing happens again, creating a massive tree of dependencies, headaches, where I cannot be bothered and abort trying to use the application, and coming onto a forum hoping a developer reads the way I feel.

In Windows, I execute a .exe/.msi and apps install and 'just work'. I don't know why 98% of Linux developers have to make installation so difficult. At least release a static installer package of the application for those people who don't have all day to compile.

Never the less, by this point most people new to Linux have just dumped it and returned to Windows, because under Windows their apps just worked, as 95% of Windows developers are 100 times more coordinated.
This is one reason why Linux is 5+ years away from general desktop use.

[el_koraco]

Pinta looks ok from the screen shots, but its released as tarball only, like 99.9% of my experiences:


Isn't it in the repos?

[Shmantiv_Radio]

Hey guys,

Yeah sorry I got confused between vector and raster. I meant raster.

Pinta looks ok from the screen shots, but its released as tarball only, like 99.9% of my experiences:

./configure

always brings some error that I am missing something, but doesn't tell me where to get it, and when I do go and get it, the same thing happens again, creating a massive tree of dependencies.

In Windows, I execute a .exe/.msi and apps install and 'just work'. I don't know why 98% of Linux developers have to make installation so difficult. At least release a static installer package of the application for those people who don't have all day to compile.

Never the less, by this point most people new to Linux have just dumped it and returned to Windows, because their under Windows their apps just worked as Windows developers are 100 times more coordinated.
This is one reason why Linux is 5+ years away from general desktop use.

On 11.04 it's just


sudo apt-get install pinta

Out of date version though.

[Xantros]

Isn't it in the repos?

I don't know, I didn't check as repo's are against my philosophy.

Oh, and another experience....

When I tried to configure Pinta, the ./configure error said this:



configure: error: XBuild not found


Ok, "XBuild"... so I tried to download "XBuild" from apt (just for this demonstration), but guess what?! "XBuild" doesn't exist!
If the bloody developer had any coordination, he would make it out "mono-xbuild" cannot be found, as this is actually what needs to be obtained!
Now, how many general people do you think are gonna know this?

Regardless, I consider myself an advanced user, but even so, why "assume the user knows everything"??? Linux developers seriously need to get over this bull **** ancient mentality.

What it should of said is something like:



configure: error: mono-xbuild not found
Please obtain mono-xbuild from the developer website: http://www.mono-project.com/Microsoft.Build

[satanselbow]

Pinta 0.61 is in the software centre - Pinta 1 is available at getdeb ;)

[Shmantiv_Radio]

I don't know, I didn't check as repo's are against my philosophy.

Oh, and another experience....

When I tried to configure Pinta, the ./configure error said this:



Ok, "XBuild"... so I tried to download "XBuild" from apt, but guess what?! "XBuild" doesn't exist!
If the bloody developer had any coordination, he would make it out "mono-xbuild" cannot be found, as this is actually what needs to be obtained!
Now, how many general people do you think are gonna know this?

Regardless, I consider myself an advanced user, but even so, why "assume the user knows everything"??? Linux developers seriously need to get over this bull **** ancient mentality.

What it should of said is something like:

Contradictory troll is contradictory.

[NightwishFan]

I don't know, I didn't check as repo's are against my philosophy.

http://donald-harris.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/picard-facepalm2.jpg

[satanselbow]

Oh really... get a grip...

Eating meat is against my philosophy but i've still got a knife and fork :confused:

[NightwishFan]

You must love Unity.

I think this chap was trying to offend us... :rolleyes:

[Shmantiv_Radio]

I think this chap was trying to offend us... :rolleyes:

Me or the OP?

[Irihapeti]

If he keeps trying, he'll offend a mod, with the usual consequences...

[jhonan]

The finest piece of UI design I've seen in a long time is the App Store on OSX (very similar to the app store on iPhone/iPod)

You click on it, and get all the featured software first, then you can go into categories, sort by free/paid/popularity, or you can keyword search.

And then, when you've found the software you want installed, seen the screenshot and read the reviews, you click on (guess what) the 'install' button. A little progress bar goes across the icon as it installs.

And finally, the icing on the cake, the icon 'flys' down from the app store window and adds itself to the dock. Right there, waiting for you to run it. So no searching your system wondering how to launch the app you just installed. No terminal, no command line, no unpacking, not even any dragging-dropping.

I think it works really well, and I don't see why it should be any more complicated than this.

[el_koraco]

I don't know, I didn't check as repo's are against my philosophy.

Oh, and another experience....



Ok :D

[giddyup306]

$ sudo apt-get install kolourpaint4
[sudo] password for user:
Reading package lists... Done
Building dependency tree
Reading state information... Done
The following extra packages will be installed:
appmenu-qt docbook-xsl exiv2 icoutils kdebase-runtime kdebase-runtime-data
kdelibs-bin kdelibs5-data kdelibs5-plugins kdoctools
kubuntu-debug-installer libattica0 libaudio2 libclucene0ldbl
libdbusmenu-qt2 libexiv2-10 libgif4 libiodbc2 libkatepartinterfaces4
libkcmutils4 libkdecore5 libkdesu5 libkdeui5 libkdewebkit5 libkdnssd4
libkemoticons4 libkfile4 libkhtml5 libkidletime4 libkio5 libkjsapi4
libkjsembed4 libkmediaplayer4 libknewstuff3-4 libknotifyconfig4 libkntlm4
libkparts4 libkprintutils4 libkpty4 libkrosscore4 libktexteditor4
libmysqlclient16 libnepomuk4 libnepomukquery4a libnepomukutils4
libntrack-qt4-1 libntrack0 libphonon4 libplasma3 libpolkit-qt-1-1
libqapt-runtime libqapt1 libqca2 libqimageblitz4 libqt4-dbus
libqt4-declarative libqt4-designer libqt4-network libqt4-opengl
libqt4-qt3support libqt4-script libqt4-sql libqt4-sql-mysql libqt4-svg
libqt4-xml libqt4-xmlpatterns libqtcore4 libqtgui4 libqtwebkit4 libraptor1
librasqal2 librdf0 libreadline5 libsolid4 libsoprano4 libssh-4
libstreamanalyzer0 libstreams0 libthreadweaver4 libvirtodbc0 mysql-common
ntrack-module-libnl-0 odbcinst odbcinst1debian2 oxygen-icon-theme phonon
phonon-backend-gstreamer plasma-scriptengine-declarative
plasma-scriptengine-javascript qapt-batch shared-desktop-ontologies
soprano-daemon virtuoso-minimal virtuoso-opensource-6.1-bin
virtuoso-opensource-6.1-common
Suggested packages:
docbook-xsl-doc-html docbook-xsl-doc-pdf docbook-xsl-doc-text
docbook-xsl-doc libsaxon-java libxalan2-java docbook-xsl-saxon fop xalan
dbtoepub libterm-readline-gnu-perl libterm-readline-perl-perl
djvulibre-bin nas hspell libqca2-plugin-cyrus-sasl libqca2-plugin-gnupg
libqca2-plugin-ossl libqca2-plugin-pkcs11 libqt4-dev qt4-qtconfig
raptor-utils rasqal-utils librdf-storage-postgresql librdf-storage-mysql
librdf-storage-sqlite redland-utils phonon-backend-xine phonon-backend-vlc
phonon-backend-mplayer gstreamer0.10-plugins-ugly
The following NEW packages will be installed:
appmenu-qt docbook-xsl exiv2 icoutils kdebase-runtime kdebase-runtime-data
kdelibs-bin kdelibs5-data kdelibs5-plugins kdoctools kolourpaint4
kubuntu-debug-installer libattica0 libaudio2 libclucene0ldbl
libdbusmenu-qt2 libexiv2-10 libgif4 libiodbc2 libkatepartinterfaces4
libkcmutils4 libkdecore5 libkdesu5 libkdeui5 libkdewebkit5 libkdnssd4
libkemoticons4 libkfile4 libkhtml5 libkidletime4 libkio5 libkjsapi4
libkjsembed4 libkmediaplayer4 libknewstuff3-4 libknotifyconfig4 libkntlm4
libkparts4 libkprintutils4 libkpty4 libkrosscore4 libktexteditor4
libmysqlclient16 libnepomuk4 libnepomukquery4a libnepomukutils4
libntrack-qt4-1 libntrack0 libphonon4 libplasma3 libpolkit-qt-1-1
libqapt-runtime libqapt1 libqca2 libqimageblitz4 libqt4-dbus
libqt4-declarative libqt4-designer libqt4-network libqt4-opengl
libqt4-qt3support libqt4-script libqt4-sql libqt4-sql-mysql libqt4-svg
libqt4-xml libqt4-xmlpatterns libqtcore4 libqtgui4 libqtwebkit4 libraptor1
librasqal2 librdf0 libreadline5 libsolid4 libsoprano4 libssh-4
libstreamanalyzer0 libstreams0 libthreadweaver4 libvirtodbc0 mysql-common
ntrack-module-libnl-0 odbcinst odbcinst1debian2 oxygen-icon-theme phonon
phonon-backend-gstreamer plasma-scriptengine-declarative
plasma-scriptengine-javascript qapt-batch shared-desktop-ontologies
soprano-daemon virtuoso-minimal virtuoso-opensource-6.1-bin
virtuoso-opensource-6.1-common
0 upgraded, 96 newly installed, 0 to remove and 1 not upgraded.
Need to get 68.5 MB of archives.
After this operation, 241 MB of additional disk space will be used.
Do you want to continue [Y/n]?


Since you didn't say what the point of your post is, I'm going to take a SWAG and assume that you imply that this is installing the KDE desktop. Not even close. Even after installing several KDE programs like KDEnlive, K3B, and Kolour...


giddyup306@giddyup306-G73Jh:~$ sudo apt-get install kubuntu-desktop
[sudo] password for giddyup306:
Reading package lists... Done
Building dependency tree
Reading state information... Done
The following extra packages will be installed:
akonadi-server akregator amarok amarok-common amarok-utils apport-kde
apturl-kde ark bluedevil dolphin dragonplayer gdebi-core gdebi-kde
gnupg-agent gnupg2 gstreamer0.10-pulseaudio gtk2-engines-qtcurve gwenview
ibus-qt4 jockey-kde kaddressbook kamera kate kcalc kde-config-gtk
kde-config-touchpad kde-window-manager kde-zeroconf kdebase-bin kdebase-data
kdebase-workspace kdebase-workspace-bin kdebase-workspace-data
kdebase-workspace-kgreet-plugins kdegraphics-libs-data
kdegraphics-strigi-plugins kdelibs5 kdemultimedia-kio-plugins kdepasswd
kdepim-groupware kdepim-kresources kdepim-runtime kdepim-strigi-plugins
kdepim-wizards kdepimlibs-kio-plugins kdesudo kdm kfind khelpcenter4
kinfocenter klipper kmag kmail kmix kmousetool knm-runtime knotes konsole
kontact kopete kopete-message-indicator korganizer kpackagekit kppp
krosspython ksnapshot ksysguard ksysguardd ksystemlog ktorrent ktorrent-data
kubuntu-default-settings kubuntu-docs kubuntu-firefox-installer
kubuntu-konqueror-shortcuts kubuntu-netbook-default-settings
kubuntu-notification-helper kvkbd kwalletmanager language-selector-qt
libakonadi-contact4 libakonadi-kabc4 libakonadi-kcal4 libakonadi-kde4
libakonadi-kmime4 libakonadiprivate1 libbluedevil1 libcln6 libdebconf-kde0
libepub0 libgpgme++2 libgps19 libibus-qt1 libindicate-qt0 libkabc4 libkblog4
libkcal4 libkdcraw8 libkdecorations4 libkdepim4 libkephal4 libkexiv2-8
libkholidays4 libkimap4 libkimproxy4 libkipi7 libkldap4 libkleo4 libkmime4
libknewstuff2-4 libkonq5 libkonq5-templates libkontactinterface4 libkopete4
libkpgp4 libkpimidentities4 libkpimtextedit4 libkpimutils4 libkresources4
libksba8 libkscreensaver5 libksgrd4 libksieve4 libksignalplotter4 libktnef4
libktorrent-l10n libktorrent2 libkunitconversion4 libkwineffects1a
libkworkspace4 libkxmlrpcclient4 liblastfm0 libloudmouth1-0
libmailtransport4 libmessagecore4 libmessagelist4 libmicroblog4 libmimelib4
libmsn0.3 libokularcore1 libotr2 libpackagekit-glib2-14 libpackagekit-qt-14
libplasma-geolocation-interface4 libplasmaclock4b libplasmagenericshell4
libpoppler-qt4-3 libprocesscore4a libprocessui4a libqalculate5
libqca2-plugin-ossl libqgpgme1 libqjson0 libqt4-sql-sqlite libqtscript4-core
libqtscript4-gui libqtscript4-network libqtscript4-sql libqtscript4-uitools
libqtscript4-xml libsolidcontrol4a libsolidcontrolifaces4 libsyndication4
libtag-extras1 libtaskmanager4a libweather-ion5 libzip1
mysql-client-core-5.1 mysql-server-core-5.1 network-manager-pptp-kde okular
okular-extra-backends openoffice.org-kde openoffice.org-style-oxygen
oxygen-cursor-theme packagekit packagekit-backend-aptcc pinentry-gtk2
pinentry-qt4 plasma-dataengines-addons plasma-dataengines-workspace
plasma-desktop plasma-netbook plasma-scriptengine-python
plasma-widget-facebook plasma-widget-folderview plasma-widget-kimpanel
plasma-widget-kimpanel-backend-ibus plasma-widget-kubuntu-feedback
plasma-widget-menubar plasma-widget-message-indicator
plasma-widget-networkmanagement plasma-widget-quickaccess
plasma-widgets-addons plasma-widgets-workspace plymouth-theme-kubuntu-logo
plymouth-theme-kubuntu-text polkit-kde-1 printer-applet pulseaudio
pulseaudio-esound-compat pulseaudio-module-bluetooth pulseaudio-module-x11
python-kde4 python-packagekit python-qt4-dbus quassel quassel-data rekonq
software-properties-kde system-config-printer-kde systemsettings
update-manager-kde usb-creator-kde userconfig
Suggested packages:
libxine1-ffmpeg libqt4-sql-psql moodbar p7zip-full rar ruby gnupg-doc
xloadimage kde-style-qtcurve plasma-scriptengines lame egroupware procmail
kleopatra clamav gnokii kjots knode kdeartwork-emoticons texlive-latex-base
kopete-gcall plasma-widget-ktorrent pi libjasper-runtime libotr2-bin
libqt4-dev texlive-binaries poppler-data kttsd konqueror openoffice.org-kab
kde-icons-oxygen oxygencursors packagekit-backend-apt
packagekit-backend-smart pinentry-doc network-manager-vpnc-kde
network-manager-openvpn-kde plasma-widget-lancelot pavumeter paman paprefs
The following NEW packages will be installed:
akonadi-server akregator amarok amarok-common amarok-utils apport-kde
apturl-kde ark bluedevil dolphin dragonplayer gdebi-core gdebi-kde
gnupg-agent gnupg2 gstreamer0.10-pulseaudio gtk2-engines-qtcurve gwenview
ibus-qt4 jockey-kde kaddressbook kamera kate kcalc kde-config-gtk
kde-config-touchpad kde-window-manager kde-zeroconf kdebase-bin kdebase-data
kdebase-workspace kdebase-workspace-bin kdebase-workspace-data
kdebase-workspace-kgreet-plugins kdegraphics-libs-data
kdegraphics-strigi-plugins kdelibs5 kdemultimedia-kio-plugins kdepasswd
kdepim-groupware kdepim-kresources kdepim-runtime kdepim-strigi-plugins
kdepim-wizards kdepimlibs-kio-plugins kdesudo kdm kfind khelpcenter4
kinfocenter klipper kmag kmail kmix kmousetool knm-runtime knotes konsole
kontact kopete kopete-message-indicator korganizer kpackagekit kppp
krosspython ksnapshot ksysguard ksysguardd ksystemlog ktorrent ktorrent-data
kubuntu-default-settings kubuntu-desktop kubuntu-docs
kubuntu-firefox-installer kubuntu-konqueror-shortcuts
kubuntu-netbook-default-settings kubuntu-notification-helper kvkbd
kwalletmanager language-selector-qt libakonadi-contact4 libakonadi-kabc4
libakonadi-kcal4 libakonadi-kde4 libakonadi-kmime4 libakonadiprivate1
libbluedevil1 libcln6 libdebconf-kde0 libepub0 libgpgme++2 libgps19
libibus-qt1 libindicate-qt0 libkabc4 libkblog4 libkcal4 libkdcraw8
libkdecorations4 libkdepim4 libkephal4 libkexiv2-8 libkholidays4 libkimap4
libkimproxy4 libkipi7 libkldap4 libkleo4 libkmime4 libknewstuff2-4 libkonq5
libkonq5-templates libkontactinterface4 libkopete4 libkpgp4
libkpimidentities4 libkpimtextedit4 libkpimutils4 libkresources4 libksba8
libkscreensaver5 libksgrd4 libksieve4 libksignalplotter4 libktnef4
libktorrent-l10n libktorrent2 libkunitconversion4 libkwineffects1a
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KolourPaint - requires full KDE desktop environment to be installed.




!=full KDE desktop environment

[YesWeCan]

The finest piece of UI design I've seen in a long time is the App Store on OSX (very similar to the app store on iPhone/iPod)

You click on it, and get all the featured software first, then you can go into categories, sort by free/paid/popularity, or you can keyword search.

And then, when you've found the software you want installed, seen the screenshot and read the reviews, you click on (guess what) the 'install' button. A little progress bar goes across the icon as it installs.

And finally, the icing on the cake, the icon 'flys' down from the app store window and adds itself to the dock. Right there, waiting for you to run it. So no searching your system wondering how to launch the app you just installed. No terminal, no command line, no unpacking, not even any dragging-dropping.

I think it works really well, and I don't see why it should be any more complicated than this.

++1

This is what really frustrates me about Canonical. They put all this effort into reinventing the desktop when they could be doing something really useful. The applications make the OS useful and desirable. Linux is still in some sort of stone age in the way apps are presented and quality is controlled. IMO.

Gimp is a fairly representative case in terms of usability. It is quirky to say the least and hard to figure out. I'm sure it is a work of genius but it should not require a genius to work it out. However, it is reliable from what I have experienced and so much linux software is both quirky and unreliable.

How is a new user meant to tell what is good, what is crummy, what is useful for what and so on? That is, without spending a lot of time on trial and error. Not all new/potential users are hobbyists like us who enjoy tinkering for the fun of it. And even I don't really find it that much fun.

[Johnsie]

I agree, there needs to be more focus on improving the actual applications. Making Evolution into a credible competitor to Outlook would help. This includes a GUI tidy up and better Exchange integration. Being able to work with Exchange is key to getting Ubuntu accepted in the office environment.

[speedwell68]

I agree, there needs to be more focus on improving the actual applications. Making Evolution into a credible competitor to Outlook would help. This includes a GUI tidy up and better Exchange integration. Being able to work with Exchange is key to getting Ubuntu accepted in the office environment.

I have said this before and I'll say it again Linux developers need to focus on promoting the apps that are available for all platforms. Evolution could be the best mail client/PIM in the world but no one has ever heard of it. Apps like Thunderbird on the other hand are in the mainstream and not pushed to their full potential. Why did I bother messing with Gwibber today it is not a patch on Tweetdeck which is available on all platforms and integrates into the Ubuntu desktop well.

[olafurg]

This is the main problem I'm having with Ubuntu, or Linux desktops in general. I love the OS but I need better apps. Features I need are spread across different apps so I need to do one thing here, the other thing there etc. etc.

That definitely is an annoyance but hopefully that will start being the focus soon. I think the new Software Center is a good start. I think that being able to see what's popular, highly rated etc. similar to the mobile app stores (market.android.com for example) will push people to agree on some nice programs that have great potential and the community will focus on making those better in place of always starting from scratch and making this problem even bigger.

Too many apps with too little functionality each, but together they could be great.

[YesWeCan]

Let me give a fresh example (also a ploy to get some help). I figured out today that the really nice computer status dashboard that I keep seeing in screenshots is called conky.

So I am in 11.04. I open the SW Centre and find conky. It is called a "transitional package". In the info section is says: "This is a dummy package to ease transition to the new packaging scheme. It may be safely removed after upgrade/installation." What the heck does that mean? So now I have doubt but no clarity. I install it and cannot find how to start it. Cannot find an icon in Unity. I open a terminal and type conky. I get this miserable, little white on black window which is not at all sexy like the ones I've seen.

It gets worse. I Google for "conky user guide" and the first hit is "manual - conky home". Looks promising. But is is a pile of undeciferable jargon text that is arranged like a man page. Useless for my needs.

So what now? I have to spend another 20 minutes searching? I have to visit Ubuntu forums and make an info request? Or shall I just abandon the whole thing for now and maybe come back to it some time if I am in a better mood. Yes, the latter, I think.

This is the "linux experience" for new linux users.
No amount of shouting how great linux is from the rooftops will fix this impression.

[Madspyman]

A few experience I have had today highlight the uncoordination and severity of Linux in reality.

I want to create a basic vector image... easily achievable in Microsoft Windows's Paint, here is my experience with Linux:

GIMP - cannot create squares
GNU Paint - does not have an undo function
Inkscape - does not have a pencil tool
KolourPaint - requires full KDE desktop environment to be installed.

LINUX ANNOYANCE!
There may be some other programs out there, but I can't be bothered with Linux right now enough to care as Windows in my virtual machine solve my problem.

Someone needs to create a simple vector image program that has a pencil tool, square creation tool, and an undo function to pair Linux with Windows 3.1 capability. Unfortunately I cannot program.

1. Create a square using the select tool and fill it in.
2. Plenty of other choices.
3. A pencil tool in a vector based drawing program? Maybe, but IMO it's better to carve out shapes when drawing in most vector based art software http://limitedcell.com/robotfizz/comics/2011-02-24-fizz.png all Inkscape no pencil tool needed.
4. See 2.

Also Photoshop can be made to run in Ubuntu with Wine. Linux isn't limited to open source software either, so don't blame the software, as different software is right for different people.

[Jay Car]

Yes. Your very specific situation is absolutely the reason that grandmothers aren't installing linux.

(you made me smile) :)

[Thewhistlingwind]

This is the "linux experience" for new linux users.
No amount of shouting how great linux is from the rooftops will fix this impression.

Am I the only person who installed Linux expecting it to be HARDER then it actually was?:neutral:

I was honestly expecting a stage one gentoo install, I went through the install, the applications, and so on waiting for 'The hard part".

[el_koraco]

Let me give a fresh example (also a ploy to get some help). I figured out today that the really nice computer status dashboard that I keep seeing in screenshots is called conky.

So I am in 11.04. I open the SW Centre and find conky. It is called a "transitional package". In the info section is says: "This is a dummy package to ease transition to the new packaging scheme. It may be safely removed after upgrade/installation." What the heck does that mean? So now I have doubt but no clarity. I install it and cannot find how to start it. Cannot find an icon in Unity. I open a terminal and type conky. I get this miserable, little white on black window which is not at all sexy like the ones I've seen.

It gets worse. I Google for "conky user guide" and the first hit is "manual - conky home". Looks promising. But is is a pile of undeciferable jargon text that is arranged like a man page. Useless for my needs.

So what now? I have to spend another 20 minutes searching? I have to visit Ubuntu forums and make an info request? Or shall I just abandon the whole thing for now and maybe come back to it some time if I am in a better mood. Yes, the latter, I think.

This is the "linux experience" for new linux users.
No amount of shouting how great linux is from the rooftops will fix this impression.

Not all new Linux users are crybabies.

[Elfy]

Thread closed - troll posted and got reactions.