Nasa 2012 solar flare

[sdowney717]

http://current.com/1fpu94c

So do you see the flare before it hits and wipes out the electrical grid and your electronics?

An interesting video that says the sun is waking up. But why mention 2012 again? Why not 2013. (see what I mean)


Could a superstorm generated by the sun destroy civilization as we know it in 2012?

No less than NASA thinks it's a distinct possibility. In a remarkable move the normally conservative US space agency has taken the extraordinary step of warning the world.

The headlines reverberating around the world speak volumes: 'Leaks discovered in Earth's magnetic field,' Solar storms to wreak havoc,' 'The end of life as we know it,' 'Magnetic shift to cause global superstorms.'

[3Miro]

Earth has gone without a magnetic field in the past and it didn't destroy life on it. There is fact and there is fiction and this is just fiction.

A solar flare could cause damage, but it will not wipe out civilization.

[Johnsie]

scaremongering

[sdowney717]

I was thinking if you knew one was coming perhaps disconnect your house from the grid and unplug your electric stuff from the walls.
That way when the power eventually came back, you could turn things on again. But it would be a serious life issue. Think of anyone sick or think of the food delivery to stores etc...water from city pumps. We use electric power and our life depends on it.

[_outlawed_]

Scare tactics is all. Is good to know I didn't get sucked into that whole 2012 end of the world propaganda scheme.

[3Miro]

I was thinking if you knew one was coming perhaps disconnect your house from the grid and unplug your electric stuff from the walls.
That way when the power eventually came back, you could turn things on again. But it would be a serious life issue. Think of anyone sick or think of the food delivery to stores etc...water from city pumps. We use electric power and our life depends on it.

Most of modern electronics uses silicon chips. Silicon ships are completely destroyed by EMP (electro magnetic pulse, the same idea as in the Matrix movie). Right now, we can generate a small EMP with a huge superconductor magnet. The only way we have to make a bug one is to get a nuclear blast (which in itself is way more destructive). The Sun being a gigantic thermonuclear reactor, can generate enormous EMP, however, when it comes to any real scientific data, I would trust NASA or Nova or BBC or Discovery and not a 2012 conspiracy nonsense site.

BTW: if an EMP is coming, unplugging the devices will not help at all.

[3Miro]

Here are some real scientist:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PusOwnxYuvw

[_outlawed_]

Here are some real scientist:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PusOwnxYuvw

Best video ever.

[jespdj]

http://current.com/1fpu94c
What a stupid nonsense fantasy news website. I'd advise you to not take anything on that website seriously.

[psusi]

Headlines are designed to sell paper, not tell truth.

Solar flares happen all the time. They introduce ionizing radiation into the upper atmosphere, which is deflected and by the earth's magnetic field, and pulled into the poles causing the Aurora Borealis. It has no affect whatsoever on electronics or the electric power grid.

/me digs out his Y2K tin foil hat.

[Tristam Green]

http://current.com/1fpu94c

So do you see the flare before it hits and wipes out the electrical grid and your electronics?

An interesting video that says the sun is waking up. But why mention 2012 again? Why not 2013. (see what I mean)

broseph, i think you need to stop reading that site.

[SonicSteve]

http://current.com/1fpu94c

So do you see the flare before it hits and wipes out the electrical grid and your electronics?

An interesting video that says the sun is waking up. But why mention 2012 again? Why not 2013. (see what I mean)


That is the worst excuse for a website I've seen.

[kostkon]

We are doooomed!!

[Rasa1111]

We are coming to a solar maximum.
it's not even a matter of "if" we get the big solar flare that kills our electronics, it is simply a matter of when.

Solar flares have knocked out technologies in the past..
it will happen again.

We don't even have to worry about a big one "killing us all"..
if all electronics go...
Many, many people will not survive anyway.

I am aware of the incidents in the past..
and I'm aware that it will happen again..
and it's just a matter of time before we get "the big one"
[ probably sooner than later] lol

As silly as it may sound to some..
and as illogical as it may be, for whatever/however many reasons..
I have already built quality faraday cages for my most prized electronics. :lol: lol

They work great to!
Couldnt get a signal into or out of them if you tried.
They've been well (enough) tested. lol

Sure, every electronic device that my devices depend on may be fried..
but when the day comes... I will be able to use them again. lol

I think we should all have at least one small faraday cage to toss our important data in, just in case. :lol:

No I don't have a tinfoil hat. :P

[Johnsie]

I would trust NASA or Nova or BBC or Discovery and not a 2012 conspiracy nonsense site.

I would leave the BBC out of that list lol. They are becoming more tabloid-like every year.

[Rasa1111]

I would leave the BBC out of that list lol. They are becoming more tabloid-like every year.

might as well leave NASA out of it also. lol :rolleyes:

[psusi]

We are coming to a solar maximum.
it's not even a matter of "if" we get the big solar flare that kills our electronics, it is simply a matter of when.

Solar flares have knocked out technologies in the past..
it will happen again.

No they haven't; you are confusing the SciFy channel with reality.


I have already built quality faraday cages for my most prized electronics. :lol: lol

A Solar flare is not an EMP.

[inobe]

first, no one can know unless we can see it coming, if we did know because we seen it coming, what would you do, hide under a rock?:P

seriously, every night we go to sleep, their are greater chances we'd never wake up:)

[Swagman]

2012 predictions aside a large solar flare wont do diddly to us physically.

Now look at the bigger picture.

Our nations foodstocks would probably run out within a fortnight if not perpetually being replaced as they are now.

So what about that combine harvester with the fried electronics. The samrt arses will immediately shout "Diesels don't need electrics"

That USED to be the case. Back then we used decompression levers and fuel pinch screws to shut off engines and the good ol hand crank to start the buggers. These days vehicles/machinery doesn't even have a crank socket and the fuel shut off switch is an electromagnetic stop gate

So you'll weld a crank socket on and bypass the fuel shutoff solenoid right ?

With what ? Your welder's fried !!

The machines that make the machines are buggered

How are you going to get the fuel to your food processing plant/machine anyway. Your vehicle may have miraculously survived but the eleventy billion cars/wagons/trains/planes/ships etc that didn't are all clogging the expressways !!

And.....

Your getting hungry !!

[3Miro]

2012 predictions aside a large solar flare wont do diddly to us physically.

Now look at the bigger picture.

Our nations foodstocks would probably run out within a fortnight if not perpetually being replaced as they are now.

So what about that combine harvester with the fried electronics. The samrt arses will immediately shout "Diesels don't need electrics"

That USED to be the case. Back then we used decompression levers and fuel pinch screws to shut off engines and the good ol hand crank to start the buggers. These days vehicles/machinery doesn't even have a crank socket and the fuel shut off switch is an electromagnetic stop gate

So you'll weld a crank socket on and bypass the fuel shutoff solenoid right ?

With what ? Your welder's fried !!

The machines that make the machines are buggered

How are you going to get the fuel to your food processing plant/machine anyway. Your vehicle may have miraculously survived but the eleventy billion cars/wagons/trains/planes/ships etc that didn't are all clogging the expressways !!

And.....

Your getting hungry !!

Like it happened during the enormous solar flare in 2003? Or you didn't watch the video that I linked to.

Without technology, millions if not billions will die. However, there is no evidence that a solar flare is capable of causing enough damage to destroy technology (or more accurately, there is not evidence that the Sun is capable of producing a big enough solar flare).

[Swagman]

I sincerely hope your correct <-- Not joking

Although in a weird way it would be kewl to see the ensuing chaos .. Although I don't fancy being a country bumpkin when millions of hungry City slickers descend on them like swarms of locusts

[Rasa1111]

No they haven't; you are confusing the SciFy channel with reality.



A Solar flare is not an EMP.

Lol!
First of all,
No I'm not 'confusing' anything..
Maybe do your research?
Second of all, I don't even have television, therefore no 'scify' channel. lol :rolleyes:

http://www.space.com/7224-150-years-worst-solar-storm.html

http://www.solarstorms.org/SRefStorms.html


Science News writes in its March 6, 1999 issue, Vol. 155, the following:
"On Aug. 4, 1972, a surge of electricity raced down a telephone cable in the midwestern United States, temporarily snarling long-distance phone service."
It took nearly 30 years for scientists to discover the cause. Canadian scientists say it is the "dark side of the sun's influence on Earth," that created the phone crisis then. It was a phone-cable problem generated by the solar blast at that time.

In 1989 [see Science News, March 6, 1999] "the electromagnetic storms (solar) caused power outages in Quebec and electrical malfunctions along the U.S. East Coast ... the storms caused a sudden intensification of electric currents...."

At that time in March, 1989, when the Hydro-Quebec power grid in Canada was shut down due to the atmospheric surge of electromagnetic energy, 6 million people were left without electrical power for days.

Last May, 1998, Galaxy 4 satellite was knocked out and it is generally felt that this was due to the solar flares (storms) at that time. The disruption lasted for three days, and, according to a March 18, 1999, Reuters article:

"forty million pagers stopped working, television and data broadcasts were disrupted, and many credit card transactions were blocked."


solar storm has the potential to knock out computers, cell phones, shut down the electric power grid, satellites (first hit by the incoming solar blast), as well as businesses, government offices, schools and homes. Other devices dependent upon electrical and electromagnetic energy could be adversely affected, due to the massive solar storms pummeling our planet---and this also includes the banking system with its electronic transfer of funds, world-wide.
http://www.ih2000.net/csbrocato/Solar.htm
(and the above bit doesnt even include the Solar storms of 1859 or 1889.)>see http://www.solarstorms.org/SRefStorms.html .<

http://science.nasa.gov/science-news/science-at-nasa/2003/23oct_superstorm/

It's a fact,
Solar storms have disabled our technology before,
and they will again.

Who's confused?

[Fedz]

Blah! it's just nonsense & I have been advised from a reliable source that Ubuntu & Ubuntu users are immune to solar flares & any potential negative adverse effects of such an event :p lol

[3Miro]

Lol!
First of all,
No I'm not 'confusing' anything..
Maybe do your research?
Second of all, I don't even have television, therefore no 'scify' channel. lol :rolleyes:

http://www.space.com/7224-150-years-worst-solar-storm.html

http://www.solarstorms.org/SRefStorms.html


(and the above bit doesnt even include the Solar storms of 1859 or 1889.)>see http://www.solarstorms.org/SRefStorms.html .<

http://science.nasa.gov/science-news/science-at-nasa/2003/23oct_superstorm/

It's a fact,
Solar storms have disabled our technology before,
and they will again.

Who's confused?

Sure, it just that is a localized event, like a bad winter storm or an earthquake. Those can be devastating, but they don't have the potential to threaten civilization, much less end the world.

There are things that are potentially powerful enough, like a super-volcano or a comet hitting the Earth, but it is not something to lose your sleep over nor is it something will happen in 2012.

[Rasa1111]

but it is not something to lose your sleep over nor is it something will happen in 2012.

Not sure I quite understand your post..

But the purpose of my post was to show that solar storms/flares have indeed knocked out our technologies in the past, a number of times, and will do so again. Posted in regards to "psusi" saying it has not happened and I was "confused". lol :rolleyes:
That's all.

Anyway, Yeah, I don't lose sleep over it. lol
But I won't speak in absolutes and pretend like i know when something will or won't happen.

"nor is it something that will happen in 2012"

lol, really?
How can one say that with such certainty?
Honestly, Without deluding oneself?

Tomorrow, next year, 5 years..
No one knows. Let's not pretend we do. lol
O:)

[psusi]

Lol!
First of all,
No I'm not 'confusing' anything..
Maybe do your research?
Second of all, I don't even have television, therefore no 'scify' channel. lol :rolleyes:

And I suppose that the Apollo moon landings were faked too? Seriously, you need to stop reading the wingnut conspiracy web sites and take a few classes on physics and electronics.


http://www.space.com/7224-150-years-worst-solar-storm.html

Hand waving and junk science, with no sources cited and no explanations given. All it does is fearmonger with dire predictions of what might happen.



http://www.solarstorms.org/SRefStorms.html


This is the kind of wingnut conspiracy site I'm talking about. Trying to follow a link to see if it lead to some actual sources or scientific explanation, I instead got this:



Error 404 ------- Oops!

The URL you used does not match anything on my website...at least not right now!

Here are some options:

1......Check your spelling and try again,

2......Hit the dinky little HOME button above,

3......Come back in a few years when the page is ready!

4......Write your Congressperson and demand an inquiry.

But whatever you do,

please don't look behind you!!!!

This site just has a a bunch of old news reports of past solar flares, most of which just mention the aurora caused. Some try to sensationally blame problems with telegraph and phone lines on it with no sources or explanation as to how, several of which actually do quote scientists as saying the storm had nothing to do with it.


"On Aug. 4, 1972, a surge of electricity raced down a telephone cable in the midwestern United States, temporarily snarling long-distance phone service."
It took nearly 30 years for scientists to discover the cause. Canadian scientists say it is the "dark side of the sun's influence on Earth," that created the phone crisis then. It was a phone-cable problem generated by the solar blast at that time.

So 30 years later someone thinks that this may have been related to the storm? Based on what? How about some references with facts and measurements recorded at the time and/or a plausible explanation as to how?


In 1989 [see Science News, March 6, 1999] "the electromagnetic storms (solar) caused power outages in Quebec and electrical malfunctions along the U.S. East Coast ... the storms caused a sudden intensification of electric currents...."

Again, no source or plausible explanation.


It's a fact,
Solar storms have disabled our technology before,
and they will again.

Not on the ground they haven't. The direct and unshielded bombardment by the charged particles of a satellite in space has caused some trouble as sensitive microprocessors can be damaged by them, and shortwave radio communications rely on the upper ionosphere to reflect the signals, which is disrupted by the charged particles, but that is it. They do not cause power surges. This isn't a guessing game; it is physics.

[Quadunit404]

Scare tactics is all. Is good to know I didn't get sucked into that whole 2012 end of the world propaganda scheme.

This!!! THIS!!!

[KiwiNZ]

I love this line about the 1859 event...

"Since the sun's last upheaval caused worldwide disruption and destruction in 1859, civilization has rapidly advanced a society based on a technological infrastructure that can be whisked away in moments by a severe geomagnetic storm."

The "Carrington event" caused Aurorae to be seen in unusual places like the Caribbean and Southern USA and caused a lot of problems to the unshielded copper telecoms networks but "worldwide destruction? no. What a load of bilge water.

[Ranko Kohime]

Solar flares happen all the time. They introduce ionizing radiation into the upper atmosphere, which is deflected and by the earth's magnetic field, and pulled into the poles causing the Aurora Borealis. It has no affect whatsoever on electronics or the electric power grid.
Not always, but sometimes. A storm equivalent to 1859 would destroy ANYTHING electronic that is not protected, most electronics aren't.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_storm_of_1859#Magnetic_storm

ETA:
Telegraph systems all over Europe and North America failed in some cases even shocking telegraph operators.[5] Telegraph pylons threw sparks and telegraph paper spontaneously caught fire.[6] Some telegraph systems appeared to continue to send and receive messages despite having been disconnected from their power supplies.

[Rasa1111]

And I suppose that the Apollo moon landings were faked too? Seriously, you need to stop reading the wingnut conspiracy web sites and take a few classes on physics and electronics.





:lol:

No, Moon landings not faked. :rolleyes:
and I did not link you to any "wingnut conspiracy" sites. :rolleyes:
I deal with enough people like yourself, and I won't waste time on it.
Half of my friends are scientists and physicists,
One of them played a major role in getting Cassini to Saturn..
If I want to talk "physics" , I'll do it with them. lol
Enjoy reminding yourself of your superior knowledge of it all though...
Whatever gets you through the day. :lol:
I know what I'm talking about, deal with it.

I'm out. lol


A storm equivalent to 1859 would destroy ANYTHING electronic that is not protected, most electronics aren't.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_s...Magnetic_storm

Bingo.

[3Miro]

"nor is it something that will happen in 2012"

lol, really?
How can one say that with such certainty?
Honestly, Without deluding oneself?


I am not the one claiming certainty here. People that claim the word is going to end 2012 are claiming certainty. Furthermore, they claim so on fake science and misunderstood myths from an ancient dead culture. Like Mayan's could figure out the thermonuclear reaction in the Sun with sufficient accuracy to pin-point a single flare over a thousand years in the future.

Is it possible that some flare would occur? Yes, it is. But there is a huge difference between "possibility", "probability" and "certainty". Many things are possible, yet not probable. Considering how rare gigantic flares are, the chance of getting a specific date right is virtually null. I can claim with good statistical certainty that nothing out-of-the-ordinary will happen on Dec 21 2012.

You can pin-point a date, but you need pretty good science for it. I will panic, when I see Neil DeGrasse Tyson and/or other qualified scientist panic.

Can a flare or super volcano or comet or something like that happen "eventually"? Sure, but eventually is something very vague. By the time the next super flare comes about, we may have developed a completely new set of technology immune to such interference (fiber optics are immune to flares and nano computers would be too). So, I am not losing sleep over this.

[sdowney717]

(fiber optics are immune to flares and nano computers would be too).

If anything you end up mixing a lot of conventional electronics and new gadgetry and it is still just as vulnerable as ever.

My question is not on the 2012 idea, I always knew that was ridiculous,
making any reference to that is odd even in the original article.
Did anyone listen to the astro physicist?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4_TzIUlaQok&feature=player_embedded

Michio Kaku I have seen before and appears to be a legitimate yet somewhat POP cultural physicist.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michio_Kaku


BUT what about seeing the flare coming, do we see it erupt from the sun before it gets here?

[madmax75]

http://www.2012hoax.org/

Pretty much trashes the whole 2012 doomsday hysteria into little pieces.

And here's their page on solar flares:

http://www.2012hoax.org/solar-flares

Just my two cents. Me not worry.

[forrestcupp]

What do you guys think happened to Atlantis?



Furthermore, they claim so on fake science and misunderstood myths from an ancient dead culture. Like Mayan's could figure out the thermonuclear reaction in the Sun with sufficient accuracy to pin-point a single flare over a thousand years in the future.
Don't go hating on the Mayans, now. The Mayans never predicted a massive solar flare or magnetic field reversal. The only thing the Mayans did is project their calendar out to the end of its cycle. They never had a need or a chance to create the next calendar.

Ridiculing the Mayans for this is like ridiculing any calendar company for creating calendars that only last until the end of the year.

[3Miro]

What do you guys think happened to Atlantis?

Don't go hating on the Mayans, now. The Mayans never predicted a massive solar flare or magnetic field reversal. The only thing the Mayans did is project their calendar out to the end of its cycle. They never had a need or a chance to create the next calendar.

Ridiculing the Mayans for this is like ridiculing any calendar company for creating calendars that only last until the end of the year.

You misunderstood my post.



Furthermore, they claim so on fake science and misunderstood myths from an ancient dead culture. Like Mayan's could figure out the thermonuclear reaction in the Sun with sufficient accuracy to pin-point a single flare over a thousand years in the future.


I am not saying that Mayans predicted anything, in fact, on the video that I posted, a historian clearly explains how the Mayans did not have a myth for the end of the world. In my post, I am ridiculing people that believe that Mayans made accurate predictions of the future.

As for Atlantis: We don't know for sure even if Atlantis existed and if it did, how much of what we have is fact and how much is fiction. The closes anyone has come to figuring out Atlantis is this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thera_eruption

It is the most likely explanation, but this is far form certainty.