Is the OS becoming irrelevant?

[mamamia88]

Just got an android phone and am realizing that what os I use is almost completely irrelevant. I use windows on my laptop because I was under the impression that I was going to use dreamweaver but felt bad about pirating it so I uninstalled it. I just realized that 99% of what I want to do can be done on any os with the exception of silverlight. I have a ps3 and xbox 360 for games and they can also play netflix. Sure windows has office, and even though I have office 2010 installed, I still find myself using google docs just for the fact I can edit on any computer anywhere in the world, and free up my flash drive for unetbootin. Besides the fact that mls streaming doesn't work on linux, (not a big deal I have season tickets, and an hdtv with all the games), Does anyone think that as of right now most people don't really care what operating system they are using? I used to be all about using linux exclusively, and was going at least go back to a dualboot on my laptop next week but really don't see the point. I run debian on my netbook and windows 7 on my laptop and it will probably stay that way for awhile until I can think of a compelling reason to change. And, this is coming from the guy who would switch operating systems once a month and was even considering a mac so i could have all 3 in the house.

[wolfen69]

I think to some people it does matter. If it wasn't for a couple games, I would never use windows, as I feel very uncomfortable using it.

[terrapin893]

An interesting thought. I first began dabbling with Ubuntu during Karmic and at that time there were still reasons that I would find myself going back to Windows. But with the way that Natty is shaping up I really dont see that necessity anymore. I'm not a gamer and there are not any applications that I can honestly say that I need to run on Windows.

One of the biggest things that has geared me towards spending more time in Natty is that finally I can easily establish RDP connections to my Server 2008 R2 box (Ive had problems in other releases). Career wise I'm going down the path of Windows Administrator so it is important for me to have easy access to my servers.

Microsoft as an operating system has gotten much better with Windows 7, and certainly much more secure. Tools such as Windows Firewall, IPSEC and PowerShell have made securing a Windows machine a very realistic task. But to be honest most of this is beyond the level of comfort of the majority of Windows users.

I can't wait to see remote PowerShell access replace the Windows Server GUI (such as Server Core 2008). Then you will have a server that can truly give a Linux box some competition.

[neu5eeCh]

Great question. To most users? - probably not. What people want is an OS that JUST WORKS and gets out of the way. People don't generally buy the OS for the OS, but how easily they can hook up peripherals and run applications. Ubuntu (Linux) has done extremely well playing catch up with Windows and MAC (in terms of hardware support) but for all the Bling and Bluster of Unity and Gnome 3 and KDE, end-users still can't hook up their 3-in-1 printer, scanner, phone modem (in Linux) and expect it to work. My G4010 HP Scanner still doesn't "just work" in Linux. Using IPODS in Linux can still be hit or miss - and not as convenient as ITunes even when it *does* work. Does Suspend and Hibernate work? In my case? No. Do my internal microphones work? No. Do they work in Windows? Yes.

Once Canonical has sorted out Unity & Wayland (a necessity), I hope they throw all their might behind drivers - across the board: scanners, Video cards, printers, digital cameras, MP3 players, etc., etc., etc... And don't forget Netflix and Amazon streaming video. These also don't work in Linux and no matter how swishy and swank Unity is, it's just not going to matter. Shuttleworth probably thinks the following: If he can just get Ubuntu adopted by enough users and OEM manufacturers, then the driver issues will begin to take care of themselves. Businesses won't be able to continue ignoring Linux.

It's when users can forget they're using Linux, when they can forget about the OS, that Linux will matter.

[trivialpackets]

Agreed. Unfortunately, Netflix is still one of the reasons that I use Windows.

[aysiu]

To most people, the OS is not immediately relevant but is only relevant insofar as it'll run the applications they need to run. Why should anyone, except computer programmers or power users, care about what OS lies underneath?

I know plenty of people who won't use Linux for their desktop/laptop/netbook, but they're more than happy to run a Linux-based Android phone or to run Linux on their TiVo. They don't care that Linux powers Google servers or various stock exchanges. They just want to get stuff done. If Linux can get that stuff done, they'll use Linux. If Linux can't, they won't. It's really that simple.

Just think about how for so long iPhone fanatics (as opposed to just normal people who happen to like the iPhone) touted how many more apps the iPhone had over Android. The point wasn't "Our OS is superior to your OS." The point was "Our OS can run what yours can't."

Even now, I think the applications a mobile OS can run should be part of a purchasing decision--again, not because of the underlying components but because of what the OS can support or what applications support the OS. If you're buying a phone and Netflix streaming matters to you, you're more likely to get an iPhone than an Android phone. If you're buying a phone and Google Voice and Navigation integration matter a lot to you, you're more likely to get an Android phone than an iPhone.

[user1397]

Using IPODS in Linux can still be hit or miss - and not as convenient as ITunes even when it *does* work.

I agree with your post except for this one line. Ipods work quite well under linux, although the ipod touch and the iphone are still somewhat hit-or-miss, the other generations work pretty darn well.

I much prefer rhythmbox to itunes with my ipod classic, it works the way I want it to and has some features which itunes doesn't. Of course itunes has features that rhythmbox doesn't, but I don't care about most of those so it doesn't bother me (such as itunes store, syncing, etc)

I can sum up why I love rhythmbox by explaining what I did the other day: I was waiting on the arrival of my new laptop, on which I wanted to put my music collection from my ipod. I have over 4000 songs, and there's no way in hell that could fit onto my 16gb SSD on my ubuntu netbook so I never bothered and just had my songs on my ipod for the time being. I also recently acquired a large external hard drive, so I thought hey why don't I backup my songs on my ipod to the external hard drive, so then later I can put them on my new laptop? I contemplated on how to do this, and the method was all too simple. I simply plugged in my ipod to the netbook (which automatically opened rhythmbox) as well as my external hard drive. Then I changed my music library folder in the preferences to point to my external HD, highlighted all the songs on my ipod, dragged-and-dropped to my 'library' and it seamlessly transferred all of the music to my external HD. Even though apple tries to encode all music you put on your ipods (a song is typically something like HQYD.mp3) rhythmbox somehow neatly copied all of my music with their rightful song names, and put them in their respective album and artist folders.

Try and do that with itunes :D

[uRock]

It matters when you are trying to find compatible hardware. I have been through two USB NICs this week and the second one was rated on one of the Ubuntu wikis as being plug n play. I bought the exact model listed and it doesn't work either. I am almost to the point of going back to running Windows as my primary OS.

Edit: Even if one of my machines becomes primarily Windows, I still have 3 more running Ubuntu as the primary OS.

[forrestcupp]

To the average user it doesn't matter. To me it matters a lot because I run some very important software that only works in Windows. If it weren't for that, I'd probably be running Linux only because I now do all of my gaming on a 360 (which isn't really very often).

Most importantly, I use Quickbooks set up with their payroll plan and 3rd party software that uses a Microsoft SQL server to file all of our paperwork electronically. There is absolutely no way in the world I could set that up successfully in Wine, and it's way too sensitive to even try. Even if I could, it's not easy to get a scanner working in my all-in-one printer, and that is a necessity. I also use special Windows only presentation software, and MS Access, which does not work with Wine. I like my Visual Studio, too. There is more, like Sony Vegas and other things, but these are the main things.

[jerenept]

HammerOS (http://hammeros.wordpress.com/) will always be relevant.

[Timmer1240]

I think to some people it does matter. If it wasn't for a couple games, I would never use windows, as I feel very uncomfortable using it.
I can testify that after using Linux for just over a year I NEVER want to go back to windows maybe for playing a few games thats it I too feel uncomfortable using Windows now.One thing about Linux it really grows on you after a while!

[disabledaccount]

Once Canonical has sorted out Unity & Wayland (a necessity), I hope they throw all their might behind drivers - across the board: scanners, Video cards, printers, digital cameras, MP3 players, etc., etc., etc... And don't forget Netflix and Amazon streaming video. These also don't work in Linux and no matter how swishy and swank Unity is, it's just not going to matter. Shuttleworth probably thinks the following: If he can just get Ubuntu adopted by enough users and OEM manufacturers, then the driver issues will begin to take care of themselves. Businesses won't be able to continue ignoring Linux.
Yes, 3 in 1 printers still have problems, but most of normal printers "just works" without special tricks and without installing bloated printer packages.
No, there are almost no problems with MP3, Digital Cameras, Video Cards, Wi-Fi, GSM etc, etc, etc - and if there are some problems, then not bigger than in windows. Especially GSM modems - You just plug it, enter PIN, choose Service provider - that's all (I've tested tons of modems, including ADSL) Even if Your country/service provider is not listed, then configuration is just trivial.

What Shuttleworth think does not really matter, because most existing drivers were not written for Ubuntu directly - f.e. CUPS. Most of drivers were written by volunteers (like many drivers for tv-cards, creative SB, USB audio, almost every xorg input driver, SATA/ATA lib and so on). Graphics cards are already supported very well, even ATI works quite good - and in fact offers better control over fan speed, clocks, and many other settings than NV.
However if linux becomes more popular on desktops then more drivers written by manufacturers will be available - that is obvious, but it's not neccesarily better option - most of closed-src drivers are buggy (more or less) and You can't fix them. Closed src leads to security holes - so personally I'm more interested in having HW specs attached to product - so I can write the driver myself or with help of related project team :) And most HW has available specs - thats why we have open src drivers.

If Ubuntu will start to clone windows I can switch to even to LFS - for me it does matter what engine is mounted in my car, not only possibility to move from point A to B :)

[Artemis3]

Thats funny, the other day i plugged an HP Deskjet F4480 (scanner/printer) and both things worked out of the box. It is listed as "paperweight" in openprinting but its supported by hplip...

[Lucradia]

Thats funny, the other day i plugged an HP Deskjet F4480 (scanner/printer) and both things worked out of the box. It is listed as "paperweight" in openprinting but its supported by hplip...

That's because the openprinting website doesn't get as updated as much as it should. Just a tip: It's actually an open database, anyone can submit test data.

For exa: http://www.openprinting.org/printer/HP/HP-LaserJet_M1522nf_MFP

I have this laserjet, and network, printing, copy, etc. all work. it shouldn't be listed as partially. This is because no one has tested it with hplip, thus it cannot be selected as a recommended driver.

You can also contribute to this list too: http://linuxhcl.com/

[tuebinger]

Yes. I use Windows at work but Ubuntu on both my laptop and desktop. I only use Windows at work because I need it to access the network, otherwise I'd probably use Ubuntu there too. We have Windows dual-booting on the desktop at home, just in case we need it, which is hardly ever.

[kiddfroster]

I think the OS is always going to be relevant, even with the push to cloud computing. As shown by the Amazon EC2 failure and PSN being down for so long already, I think it's giving everyone a reality check that we still need the OS, be it Windows, OS X, or Ubuntu to be able to always be productive in any situation.

[aysiu]

I think the OS is always going to be relevant, even with the push to cloud computing. As shown by the Amazon EC2 failure and PSN being down for so long already, I think it's giving everyone a reality check that we still need the OS, be it Windows, OS X, or Ubuntu to be able to always be productive in any situation.
The issue isn't whether we need an OS but whether what OS we use matters. If the OS is only to run a "web" application locally on locally backed-up files that then synced to the cloud once the cloud server has recovered from a crash, it won't matter what OS you're using.

[Blasphemist]

Remember all that we are the supposed 1%. We just aren't a very big part of the market. Most hardly can use windows and are much more comfortable on an iphone or android. Even email use is dropping, communication is commonly limited to 140 characters today. Browsers and "apps" are all most use. Netbooks don't need much power or peripherals to do all this. Keyboards are even on the way out.

Don't you think simple OS's that you don't even know your using are the way of the world? The good thing is that's built from Linux. That's also the gotcha. Everyone will be using Linux, and won't even know it.

Us dinosaurs will be the only one's looking for power, storage, graphics, peripherals and all that we think we can't get by without.

[wojox]

Remember all that we are the supposed 1%. We just aren't a very big part of the market. Most hardly can use windows and are much more comfortable on an iphone or android.

Now iPad owns more market share than Linux.

FYI: sometimes I log in on Windows Vista, which is a great OS. :-$

[Giraffemonster]

I'm guessing that OS does matter, except not as it may have mattered in earlier generations. I'm under the impression that right now, people are just looking for ease of use and lack of complication. Because so many people are already using Windows OS's, and not many people want to change, that's why Windows is still being used.

People do care about what Operating System they use, except instead of reliability and productivity that they look for, it's more like flashy desktop effects and what OS computer manufacturers ship with (Windows for 98% of them).

[Copper Bezel]

I've certainly had hardware issues in the past that have led me to clunky workarounds and tears. They tend to get fixed a year or so after I get the machine in question, which is obviously less than ideal.


Remember all that we are the supposed 1%. We just aren't a very big part of the market. Most hardly can use windows and are much more comfortable on an iphone or android. Even email use is dropping, communication is commonly limited to 140 characters today. Browsers and "apps" are all most use. Netbooks don't need much power or peripherals to do all this. Keyboards are even on the way out.

And you're right that this all puts Android in a good place, although I disagree about keyboards and e-mail. Computer literate people used to be a subset of literate people, and simpler OSs are simply reinfranchising people who never did any correspondence in the first place.


Don't you think simple OS's that you don't even know your using are the way of the world? The good thing is that's built from Linux. That's also the gotcha. Everyone will be using Linux, and won't even know it.

Simple and invisible aren't the same thing. I don't know that an OS can be invisible. There's a difference in the user experience between iOS and Android, where you don't even have a traditional windowing system, a panel, icon themes, etc. It's not a matter of having an OS that you don't know you're using but a user who doesn't care - and the recent history of the desktop computer already reflects that. There are plenty of Windows users out there who don't know what Windows is.


Us dinosaurs will be the only one's looking for power, storage, graphics, peripherals and all that we think we can't get by without.

I've never cared about any of those things (save perhaps peripherals.) Those aren't the reasons I tweak things. Nevertheless, I've put quite a bit of time into getting together the software and making the tweaks to make my install as responsive, attractive, and easy to navigate as possible. I don't think that you can assume that everyone who just wants a good desktop experience is automatically the sort of person who isn't going to be a hobbyist. There are car enthusiasts who supercharge engines and there are car enthusiasts who do body work and chintz up the interior, and they're not always the same people.


Now iPad owns more market share than Linux.

Than desktop Linux, as pointed out in that thread, which makes it a truly absurd comparison. Linux as a kernel runs everything that isn't a desktop except iOS - tablets, TVs, readers, servers, coffee machines, etc., as pointed out in another recent thread here. Android tablets are a relatively new thing under the sun, barely starting to compete with iPad, and Android already beats iOS in phones.


I'm guessing that OS does matter, except not as it may have mattered in earlier generations. I'm under the impression that right now, people are just looking for ease of use and lack of complication. Because so many people are already using Windows OS's, and not many people want to change, that's why Windows is still being used.

Right, and it's force of habit, because there's nothing simple about Windows, any more than desktop Linux or (certainly) OSX. At the community college where I work, two individuals from our IT office didn't know how to get a file out of the recycle bin without having the Trash icon enabled on the desktop.

[Blasphemist]

Good points Copper Bezel, and I LOVE the recycle bin bit :D

[ninjaaron]

Chrome OS is the future. It lets you get to the pr0n faster, and as we all know, the microprocessor was originally invented to support the democratization of adult entertainment.

The only thing that makes other OS's meaningful is the fact that you can save your porn, so in the event of a nuclear holocaust or other event that interrupts Internet access, you can run your computer off of a generator to at least access your carefully archived pornography until your connection is restored.

:popcorn:

[wojox]

Than desktop Linux, as pointed out in that thread, which makes it a truly absurd comparison. Linux as a kernel runs everything that isn't a desktop except iOS - tablets, TVs, readers, servers, coffee machines, etc., as pointed out in another recent thread here. Android tablets are a relatively new thing under the sun, barely starting to compete with iPad, and Android already beats iOS in phones.


What thread? iOS kills Android. Where do you get your facts?

[dmizer]

This thread has been trimmed.

Please keep things on topic; specifically, is the OS relevant?

Thank you.

[khelben1979]

For some it is and will always be irrelevant, not everyone is interested in what operating system they use and how it works.

For myself, I don't want to use an operating system where I cannot have control of what is happening inside it. I'd like to know what's going on. It's more than relevant what I want to use, and if a operating system gives me headaches (such as Windows) I seriously want to keep myself away from it as far as possible.

Linux has made me more interested in how an operating system works, and it's something I'm interested to keep on exploring every day, and this Ubuntu forum have contributed to that.

[Copper Bezel]

What thread? iOS kills Android. Where do you get your facts?

Sorry, I remembered a news item incorrectly. Sales of Android devices currently beat iPhone in the US. In terms of total userbase, yes, iPhone is still the leading mobile, and the Verizon deal could reverse the trend (if it hasn't already.) As I'd already noted, I wasn't referring to iOS compared against Android in general (I.e. including iPad, Xoom, etc.) but specifically the handsets, because I don't think comparing the tablets is relevant; as I'd said, Android is a latecomer to tablets by comparison and barely on the field.


I LOVE the recycle bin bit :D
I can't decide whether it was funny or depressing. = P One way in which "the OS is relevant" to me, personally: on Linux, I'm encouraged toward, rather than discouraged from, actually learning how it works.

[PhillyPhil]

Sales of Android devices currently beat iPhone in the US.

In the US Android now has the bigger total market share, not only higher sales.
Globally too it also outsells iOS (has done since 2010 Q3), but hasn't yet achieved higher global market share - that's expected to happen this year or 2012.
Global sales: http://www.gartner.com/it/page.jsp?id=1466313
EDIT: I may be using the term 'market share' incorrectly. I mean percentage of total number of devices in use. What term should I use?

I see the decline in relevance of OSs as a good thing. Making things cross platform means there's no leverage for an OS and its maker to be dominant - any number of small OSs will be able to compete with the big boys.

[Johnsie]

When hardware devices are all supplied with Linux drivers, and when commercial software is Linux compatible then it will become irrelevant. But right now I need Windows for many things that cannot be done on Linux at the moment.

Android will be the next Windows. Apple are already running out of ideas and locked to one hardware brand. The reason why Windows beat Apple in the 90's was that Windows could be installed on all different hardware. Apple on the other hand was locked into overpriced Apple hardware. History is repeating itself because Apple is doing exactly the same thing in the 21st century. The ipod generated some popularity, but it I think that has peaked now that Android has so much backing. Iphone is like a movie franchise, when you get to 3 or 4 people start to lose interest. It's the Myspace of phones.

[forrestcupp]

and the Verizon deal could reverse the trend (if it hasn't already.)

It hasn't already, and it doesn't look like it will. Android is starting to come out with all kinds of 4G phones, and the next iPhone coming out this fall still won't even be 4G.