[human] what are the fist-hammer chest compressions on movies?

[earthpigg]

ya know, where conventional chest compressions fail and (with a dramatic flip of the hair) the medical professional begins hammer-fisting the person's heart with an axe-like motion?

what is that?

(if linux can be installed on rodents, it can be installed on people. relevant to ubuntuforums.org.)

[Legeril]

I think it has to do with drama, when a situation is dramatic exceptional things happen i.e. imagine a scene where a man dies on the operating table, his family our outside (newly wed bride and 2 small twins) and the man is the only person they have in the world. The doctors father died in a similar situation leading the doctor to become emotionally involved in the situation. He is told he has done all he can do, but refuses to give up shouting "I won't let him die, there are to be more I can do!!" And begins hammering on the patient in frustrated desperation, the last desperate hammer-fist bumps the patients heart in such a way as to start the heart beating again. The family go home happy and the doctor laid his old ghosts to rest in the same instance.

100:1 situation is very likely 1,000,000:1 is certainty. Drama my friend, drama.

Or bad made-for-TV acting, either way..

I may have missed the point of your post entirely :P

[yetiman64]

ya know, where conventional chest compressions fail and (with a dramatic flip of the hair) the medical professional begins hammer-fisting the person's heart with an axe-like motion?

what is that?

(if linux can be installed on rodents, it can be installed on people. relevant to ubuntuforums.org.)

It is called the precordial thump (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Precordial_thump). I have actually been trained in its use as I am a qualified electrician with some experience in electrical transmission line work. If a sparky is electocuted while working up the top of a power pole it is impossible for rescuers to use normal chest compression until he is lowered to the ground by which time it may be too late for resuscitation, so the precordial thump as a CPR method is taught to transmission line workers.

In Australia only certain medical professionals and electrical linesmen in the circumstances I've noted above are legally allowed to perform it. It is very dangerous to the recipient if the heart is actually beating, even if very weakly (it can stop the heart totally).

[Legeril]

Wow, its an actual medical thing? I guess you learn something everyday..

[duanedesign]

Moved to Community Cafe

[Copper Bezel]

[human]

This thread made me happy. It looked like this: = D .

[treesurf]

It is called the precordial thump (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Precordial_thump). I have actually been trained in its use as I am a qualified electrician with some experience in electrical transmission line work. If a sparky is electocuted while working up the top of a power pole it is impossible for rescuers to use normal chest compression until he is lowered to the ground by which time it may be too late for resuscitation, so the precordial thump as a CPR method is taught to transmission line workers.

In Australia only certain medical professionals and electrical linesmen in the circumstances I've noted above are legally allowed to perform it. It is very dangerous to the recipient if the heart is actually beating, even if very weakly (it can stop the heart totally).


Very interesting, thank you. I am an arborist (tree worker/climber) and this may be valuable information that I can pass on to my colleagues that work trimming trees away from power lines. Too many tree climbers are killed every year by electrocution. It sounds like fairly high level training is necessary to perform the technique, though, so I'm not sure how accessible that training will be.

[Grenage]

Very interesting, thank you. I am an arborist (tree worker/climber) and this may be valuable information that I can pass on to my colleagues that work trimming trees away from power lines. Too many tree climbers are killed every year by electrocution. It sounds like fairly high level training is necessary to perform the technique, though, so I'm not sure how accessible that training will be.

An automated defibrillator would probably be a lot safer and easier; precordial thumps are really the last resort.

[yetiman64]

An automated defibrillator would probably be a lot safer and easier; precordial thumps are really the last resort.

Exactly, the VERY last resort as it is only about ~25% effective even when used correctly (and that is actually quite hard to do, even more so when you are 30-40 feet up a power pole - I shudder even today remembering that training).

I learnt about it as part of a pole top rescue course back in 1991. Back then I was told it is actually ILLEGAL to use in Australia except when used in pole top rescue situations and was VERY restricted under the law here for use by medical professionals. I'm out of touch with my trade nowadays but I suspect nothing has changed in regard to this technique.

The only reason reason linesmen get taught it here is because it is the ONLY possible means to give an electrocuted worker a fighting chance AND the electrocution must be directly witnessed by the rescuer. ONE EXTREMELY DANGEROUS PROCEDURE INDEED.

It is very easy to actually kill someone if used incorrectly, that is if there is a weak heartbeat present or the hit is even slightly misplaced.

@treesurf, please check your local laws with regard to this before even mentioning it to your co-workers. I can't stress strongly enough just how dangerous it is. You are just as likely to kill the recipient as save them, even with training. It has been removed from resuscitation training in most places, as far as I understand it.

[grahammechanical]

Thank you yetiman64 and earthpigg also for prompting this information

Regards.

[earthpigg]

marked as solved, thank you!

[Paqman]

An automated defibrillator would probably be a lot safer and easier; precordial thumps are really the last resort.

This. Modern automated defibrillators are all sorts of awesome.

[pricetech]

Back when I was young, and the earth was still cooling, they taught the precordial thump as a first step in CPR since it was thought at the time that it may be all that was needed.

It is no longer taught for the reasons mentioned above, but still shown heavily on television and in movies because of the aforementioned dramatic effect.

[forrestcupp]

It is called the precordial thump (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Precordial_thump).

Hmmm. I thought it was called the Kansas City Chiefs Dance. :)

[earthpigg]

Back when I was young, and the earth was still cooling, they taught the precordial thump as a first step in CPR since it was thought at the time that it may be all that was needed.

It is no longer taught for the reasons mentioned above, but still shown heavily on television and in movies because of the aforementioned dramatic effect.

funny how things change over time.

similarly, according to my girlfriend currently going through EMT training, doctrines on pressure bandages and direct pressure for severe bleeding have changed over the last year or two as a result of the experiences of combat medics in Iraq/Afghan.

According to these very new criteria/doctrines being adopted by civilian medicine, there are now many more cases than previously wherein tourniquet is the first step in treatment and not a last resort.

(Yes, i did ask my GF the question in my OP. She said it was pure hollywood shenanigans. I figured there must be a bit more to it, and was correct :P.)

[Paqman]

According to these very new criteria/doctrines being adopted by civilian medicine, there are now many more cases than previously wherein tourniquet is the first step in treatment and not a last resort.


Blimey. I was always taught that about the only time you ever used a tourniquet was for crush injuries.

[KiwiNZ]

If you are interested in learning about this do a professional First Aid or Paramedic course, this is not the place for training in what can be life threatening techniques.

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