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chessnerd
March 19th, 2011, 06:18 AM
Well, it's happened folks. Take a look at Dell's website page that shows all of their computers which currently feature Ubuntu Linux: http://www.dell.com/content/topics/segtopic.aspx/linux_3x?c=us&cs=19&l=en&s=dhs

Seems a tad bare, no? I honestly wonder why the page even still exists.

For a while I've seen Dell sell less and less Ubuntu systems. For the past couple months, it has been down to one desktop with Ubuntu 10.04 and that was it. Before that, there were 3 systems, 2 laptops and the desktop. Now, it seems that Dell has all but totally given up on selling Ubuntu systems...

johntaylor1887
March 19th, 2011, 06:31 AM
Oh well. Those that care to explore alternatives to MS will most likely do so of their own choosing. What Dell does or doesn't do makes no difference to me. Linux isn't going to die any time soon.

racie
March 19th, 2011, 06:46 AM
Well it obviously just wasn't profitable for them. Dell is a business.

ade234uk
March 19th, 2011, 06:48 AM
A couple of years back this would have been major news however as the user above me correctly states, Linux is not going to die anytime soon. I don't care, Linux is strong enough not to need Dell and to be quite honest Dells advertising of Ubuntu has been embarrassing and they have done more harm than good.

People find their way to Linux not because a company offers it, but because they are sick to the back teeth of Windows and are generally more experienced than the average Windows user and look around the internet for other options.

Whatever happens in the future, Windows will always be the first choice on the desktop because people who don't understand computers think that Windows is the PC.

Philsoki
March 19th, 2011, 06:56 AM
I think they finally realised that Ubuntu (And Linux in general) isn't ready to be a mainstream desktop OS yet.

busypuppy
March 19th, 2011, 06:58 AM
Well it obviously just wasn't profitable for them. Dell is a business.

So is Microsoft my friend..

johntaylor1887
March 19th, 2011, 07:33 AM
I think they finally realised that Ubuntu (And Linux in general) isn't ready to be a mainstream desktop OS yet.

That's an overly general statement. Not ready for who specifically?

I think that people are starting to realize it's windows that's not ready for the desktop. Windows has been around for much longer than linux, and it's still a pain in the butt for the average user to maintain and use. How is that friendly? Sure, MS has some good business apps and games, but there tons of non-business people and gamers out there. Then again, there is wine and VM's to help out.

I truly believe the average person would be much better served by linux any day. And if need be, just dual boot for the occasional windows only app. My .02

Copper Bezel
March 19th, 2011, 07:59 AM
I think they finally realised that Ubuntu (And Linux in general) isn't ready to be a mainstream desktop OS yet.

Y'know, folks didn't have to qualify that with "desktop" a couple years back. = ) Jus' sayin'.

handy
March 19th, 2011, 08:52 AM
Advertising isn't how you grow the Linux market share. People have to work harder to use Linux, they have to want to work harder, be capable of working harder, & most importantly think that it is worth working harder due to some perceived beneficial to themselves end result.

Most people do what they must, for whatever reason, so that hopefully they can do what they really like doing, preferably for as long as possible.

Why bash your head against a loop the loop learning curve when you can just go & do something that is fun?

Only a small percentage of us think that beating the loop the loop learning curve is fun.

It is best not to forget that I think.

Those other people are probably what is called normal. :lolflag:

Copper Bezel
March 19th, 2011, 09:15 AM
I think Canonical would disagree with you. The whole idea of Unity is to make Ubuntu as easy to use as a phone.

I'd agree - using Linux is the best puzzle video game ever, and the powerups you earn work in real life. = )

Spice Weasel
March 19th, 2011, 10:19 AM
Y'know, folks didn't have to qualify that with "desktop" a couple years back. = ) Jus' sayin'.

What? We have had a majority server share for more than 10 years.

handy
March 19th, 2011, 10:24 AM
What? We have had a majority server share for more than 10 years.

But that is not what the topic is about. :)

Spice Weasel
March 19th, 2011, 10:27 AM
But that is not what the topic is about. :)

Yeah, but we still would have needed to qualify that with destkop a couple of years back, because free OSes were dominating the server market. Linux was the mainstream server OS.

wormyblackburny
March 19th, 2011, 10:51 AM
I disagree with the whole "The world isn't ready for linux desktops" argument. I look at it from a needs based prospective. Say you are poor and somehow piece together a mish-mash system from spare parts, do you go drop $100 on a copy of Window$ or install a free OS? Conversely, if you have the cash to throw around to go buy a shiny new laptop/desktop, are you going to blow away that pretty little OS that comes installed with it, or keep using it until it breaks (and it WILL break....hehe)? When it breaks after a few years, you buy a new one, because guess what.....YOU CAN.

Thats how I got started with Ubuntu. I had an old laptop that Window$ died on, but needed it to be something other than a paperweight. I had no desire to spend $100 on a new copy of Window$ for a $50 laptop, and even less desire to try to find a "less than legit" way to get a copy. A friend of mine says "Try Ubuntu". Got 2 more years out of that laptop that I only fixed so my kids would stay off of my "good" machine (Window$ machine I had to use for work). Did they ever complain and say "Daddy, i want to use YOUR computer, because Bill Gates says he will buy me a pony if I do".....nope. A 10 and 11 year old used Ubuntu daily to do whatever it is that kids do with a computer.

We are TRAINED to love MS products due to the lack of companies offering alternatives. It's why there are so many Mac lovers out there that will let Jobbs bend them over the barrel because their computers are shiny and silver and NOT Micro$oft, even though the cost vs performance is ridiculous. So yes, it IS a big deal for Dell to dump Ubuntu. Anyone who believes that it only had to do with profitability and not MS tugging the puppet strings a little is crazy. You don't bite the hand that feeds you if you are Dell....

End rant :)

handy
March 19th, 2011, 11:06 AM
Very few poor people buy Windows, or Office, or whatever else they require.

So as far as individuals are concerned the price matters to only a few.

In that extremely large group of poor Windows users lays a commonality of support. Better or worse matters not, they know that they aren't alone, they are surrounded by others in much the same boat.

We know what a good community is, as this forum demonstrates it. Most computer users just want to get what they want to do done & get away from the computer so they can do what they really want to be doing.

forrestcupp
March 19th, 2011, 04:09 PM
I like how they say "Ubuntu keeps getting better" and then don't offer any computers.


I think they finally realised that Ubuntu (And Linux in general) isn't ready to be a mainstream desktop OS yet.It has nothing to do with not being ready for the desktop, and everything to do with no one wanting to buy it. The only people who even knew about it were Linux hobbyists, so it didn't really have a chance from the get go.


I think Canonical would disagree with you. The whole idea of Unity is to make Ubuntu as easy to use as a phone.
The bad thing is that phones are getting harder and harder to use. :)

Remember when you picked the phone up off of its base, dialed a number and talked to someone?

MasterNetra
March 19th, 2011, 04:19 PM
I like how they say "Ubuntu keeps getting better" and then don't offer any computers.

It has nothing to do with not being ready for the desktop, and everything to do with no one wanting to buy it. The only people who even knew about it were Linux hobbyists, so it didn't really have a chance from the get go.


The bad thing is that phones are getting harder and harder to use. :)

Remember when you picked the phone up off of its base, dialed a number and talked to someone?

I do, my cell phone works like that, minus the base.

jeffathehutt
March 19th, 2011, 04:24 PM
Remember when you picked the phone up off of its base, dialed a number and talked to someone?

I saw one of those in the antique store! :p

My phone still has buttons, instead of a touch screen. :)

Anyway, I can't say I am surprised that Dell doesn't sell many Ubuntu computers anymore. Many people care more about "fitting in" than changing their habits. Since Windows works for them and since all their friends use Windows, they see no need to change to linux. It's the same reason I don't switch to Windows... Linux does what I need and I am used to it, so why bother changing?

Johnsie
March 19th, 2011, 04:29 PM
Ubuntu wasn't selling well. Why?

1. Most people aren't familiar with Ubuntu
2. Most hardware comes with a windows driver installation cd, not and Ubuntu one
3. The quality of applications on Ubuntu is often very low
4. Ubuntu does not support many applications that people are familiar with

Ubuntu is good for some things... but it doesn't have what people know and expect from their computer.

Quadunit404
March 19th, 2011, 04:38 PM
using Linux is the best puzzle video game ever, and the powerups you earn work in real life. = )

"Broke X server, networking and corrupted everything in my /home in one go! NEW HIGH SCORE!"

OT: I wonder if this means Dell Hell stopped selling FreeDOS as well?

Timmer1240
March 19th, 2011, 05:03 PM
After using windows for 13 years I became very good at maintaining it and keeping it clean and secure.How I began using Ubuntu I first tryed live distros knoppix linspire ect ect. I began to realize I was getting tired of all the work and attention windows requires to keep it running decent.I used Ubuntu for about a year and it was great very trouble free unlike windows Im sold on linux now!Presently Im Using Linux Mint Debian liking that very much.I think People get interested in Linux and try it because they are people who arent afraid of change.All my friends still stick with Windows dont know how to fix it when something goes wrong and then they call me because I took the time to learn something about the systems I use most people dont!So Now Im using linux Learning more and more everyday and loving it!I cant really ask my friends to do the same because they dont want to know how to trouble shoot Windows.I dont think Linux will probably ever become mainstream but its great that its there for people like us!

NightwishFan
March 19th, 2011, 05:04 PM
Ubuntu is good for some things... but it doesn't have what people know and expect from their computer.

Sad but true. Though the good things are actually quite numerous it is not quite enough yet.

I think Ubuntu has a real shot of making this happen though. And as Ubuntu sticks pretty closely to upstream kernels and etc, I highly doubt the rest of open source will lag behind it once popularity is gained.

Merk42
March 19th, 2011, 05:19 PM
So is Microsoft my friend..
...and Canonical

Your point?

oldos2er
March 19th, 2011, 06:15 PM
Ubuntu wasn't selling well. Why?

1. Most people aren't familiar with Ubuntu
2. Most hardware comes with a windows driver installation cd, not and Ubuntu one
3. The quality of applications on Ubuntu is often very low
4. Ubuntu does not support many applications that people are familiar with


5. Dell kept the Ubuntu option well hidden on their site. Unless you knew what you were looking for, you likely wouldn't have noticed it.

disabledaccount
March 19th, 2011, 06:22 PM
Personally, I don't care how many peoples are using linux or who is selling PCs with linux preinstalled. Does it change anything?

mkendall
March 19th, 2011, 06:54 PM
Ubuntu wasn't selling well. Why?

1. Most people aren't familiar with Ubuntu
2. Most hardware comes with a windows driver installation cd, not and Ubuntu one
3. The quality of applications on Ubuntu is often very low
4. Ubuntu does not support many applications that people are familiar with

Ubuntu is good for some things... but it doesn't have what people know and expect from their computer.


5. Dell kept the Ubuntu option well hidden on their site. Unless you knew what you were looking for, you likely wouldn't have noticed it.
6. Dell maintained a "Dell recommends Windows" message on the Ubuntu pages.

kaldor
March 19th, 2011, 07:04 PM
Well, it's happened folks. Take a look at Dell's website page that shows all of their computers which currently feature Ubuntu Linux: http://www.dell.com/content/topics/segtopic.aspx/linux_3x?c=us&cs=19&l=en&s=dhs

Seems a tad bare, no? I honestly wonder why the page even still exists.

For a while I've seen Dell sell less and less Ubuntu systems. For the past couple months, it has been down to one desktop with Ubuntu 10.04 and that was it. Before that, there were 3 systems, 2 laptops and the desktop. Now, it seems that Dell has all but totally given up on selling Ubuntu systems...

Maybe if the selection of computers they sold were not hidden away and underpowered for today's standards. Why would I pay for an Ubuntu Dell PC when I can get a better one for a similar price from System76 (at least with Canada's selection).

Also it doesn't help that on the Dell Ubuntu page it has a Windows 7 ad. They just don't put in any effort.

areteichi
March 19th, 2011, 08:03 PM
They do still sell these laptops ;)
http://www.dell.com/us/business/p/vostro-v130/pd#TechSpec
http://www.dell.com/us/business/p/vostro-1015/pd#TechSpec
http://www.dell.com/us/business/p/vostro-1014/pd#TechSpec

aysiu
March 19th, 2011, 08:14 PM
They do still sell these laptops ;)
http://www.dell.com/us/business/p/vostro-v130/pd#TechSpec
http://www.dell.com/us/business/p/vostro-1015/pd#TechSpec
http://www.dell.com/us/business/p/vostro-1014/pd#TechSpec
How did you find those? I couldn't figure out where to find Ubuntu computers on the Dell website.

Icehuck
March 19th, 2011, 09:26 PM
How did you find those? I couldn't figure out where to find Ubuntu computers on the Dell website.

You go to the small and medium business section, and select vostro laptops.

forrestcupp
March 19th, 2011, 10:25 PM
Why would I pay for an Ubuntu Dell PC when I can get a better one for a similar price from System76 (at least with Canada's selection).
Because no one except a few people on these forums has even heard of System76.

areteichi
March 20th, 2011, 07:17 AM
How did you find those? I couldn't figure out where to find Ubuntu computers on the Dell website.


I just remembered reading this news not so long ago :p
http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2010/11/dells-new-vostro-v130-ultra-thin-ubuntu-laptop/

DeadSuperHero
March 20th, 2011, 09:30 AM
It's not like Dell's Ubuntu offerings were exactly gung-ho to begin with. On the contrary, I remember there constantly being talk of Dell not supporting Ubuntu enough.

fluteflute
March 20th, 2011, 09:43 AM
They also have a PC on the UK site:
http://www1.euro.dell.com/content/products/features.aspx/ubuntu_deals?c=uk&l=en&s=dhs&cs=ukdhs1

rvndmnmt
March 20th, 2011, 09:51 AM
One thing that kills me is the myth that Linux is only for geeks. I installed Ubuntu 9.10 on my sisters (read 0 computer experience) on her desktop. She did the upgrade, thus shattering the myth that Linux is hard to install. She still uses it. As a matter of fact she got past her first year in her photography degree with open source Linux photo editing software.

Look, as a explained before in another post. Linux is currently set to lead the market in the computers that are most certainly going to overtake the market. Tablets and smartphones with Android. It's not Ubuntu but it is Linux. Though a completely different distro. It doesn't matter if Dell gave up on Ubuntu. Ubuntu needs to get in a little tighter with the likes of Verizon, Sprint, ATT, and T-mobile. The PC desktop market is always going to have a share, but that share is going to be seriously reduced.

The thing I am jumping up and down about at this moment is porting Linux to smaller hand held devices and getting software out, oh dare I say it, "To the cloud". That is the future of computing. You beat Micro$oft in this area and you beat Microsoft since they can't play the same dirty games to accomplish dominance over the market. And since Linux has a 5-7 year head start in that area at least.

HappinessNow
March 20th, 2011, 01:12 PM
I disagree with the whole "The world isn't ready for linux desktops" argument....

wormyblackburny problem is more and more people simply are NOT using desktops anymore. Smartphones, tablets, notebooks, etc. dominate. Ubuntu initially was built for desktops, missed the mark and the momentum; as they built a wonderful desktop OS for a quickly less used breed.

More people are attracted to products that utilize Android OS that quickly outsold the iOS on iPhone. Apple retaliated and many people bought the iPad and then the iPad2. Even Google TV utilizes the Android OS and promises to help people shake the desktop habit...not to mention the new Chrome OS found in the Google Pilot program is changing the game completely and producing yet another death blow to the desktop.

Technology just advanced too rapidly for Ubuntu to keep up, as the Ubuntu Devs were focusing on making the perfect desktop OS people just simply stopped using desktop computers and moved on. Unity is playing catch-up as technology whizzes by even faster. For people who want innovation it is too little too late, and the masses just want something simple that works and the fashion conscience love Apple marketing and products.

Dell selling Ubuntu computers at all was nothing more then an insignificant blip on the overall technology radar in the bigger picture.

Ubuntu should have focused on competing with Apple first instead of Windows first, but hindsight is always 20/20.

That said Ubuntu is an awesome Desktop and even notebook OS but lacks foresight and marketing for the masses, it isn't too hard to see what Apple is doing right (& wrong) and to emulate and even exceed their success.

handy
March 25th, 2011, 05:52 AM
@HappinessNow: I agree.

Ubuntu got stoinked by MS on the netbooks, & stoinked by Google on the hand helds.

Dell is inconsequential.

I expect that there are those at Canonical that are working so hard to find a market that will financially sustain them into the future.

If they can't then Canonical will have a difficult time existing through to the end of the current decade.

kevin11951
March 25th, 2011, 06:11 AM
I think they finally realised that Ubuntu (And Linux in general) isn't ready to be a mainstream desktop OS yet.

I hate it when people say this, there is no such thing as "Ready For the Desktop"... Every OS is "Ready for the Desktop", all they need are drivers and apps, thats it... BSD is ready for the desktop, and so is Solaris, you just need third party apps, and drivers...

And let me tell you, Ubuntu will not get either of those until it is pushed by the major manufacturers... Ready for the desktop requires being on the desktop already... see the catch 22...

handy
March 25th, 2011, 06:32 AM
I hate it when people say this, there is no such thing as "Ready For the Desktop"... Every OS is "Ready for the Desktop", all they need are drivers and apps, thats it... BSD is ready for the desktop, and so is Solaris, you just need third party apps, and drivers...

And let me tell you, Ubuntu will not get either of those until it is pushed by the major manufacturers... Ready for the desktop requires being on the desktop already... see the catch 22...

Ready for the desktop (if that is what you think is important) means a great deal more than just having a desktop OS that can deal with all of the various hardware/peripheral configurations that people may want to use.

It means being able to provide comparable support to that of MS & Apple, for industry standard (taught & used at university, colleges & other educational institutions) software.

Software that is the standard for the multifaceted 2D/3D CAD/CAMM; for the movie industry; for the multifaceted print industry; for the multifaceted music industry; & on it goes.

Yes, I know, some movies & whatever else do occasionally use application that run on the Linux systems. These are a tiny minority.

The hill that this wheel has to be pushed up by those that are attempting to gain mass market desktop/workstation status for Linux is a very long, steep & jagged one; at this point in time Linux has not gone very far up that desktop/workstation mountain that leads to mass market acceptance, which means full software support form the likes of Adobe & Avid, for starters.

disabledaccount
March 25th, 2011, 07:11 AM
Smartphones, tablets, notebooks, etc. dominate. Ubuntu initially was built for desktops, missed the mark and the momentum; as they built a wonderful desktop OS for a quickly less used breed.I think the situation is a bit different - Yes, mobile market is growing rapidly, but mobile devices just can't replace workstations - that would never happen. Home PCs are coming more and more powerfull - games, CAD applications, Video editing need lots of computing power that mobile devices just can't offer.

I would say that it's more likely that everyone will have smartphone, laptop/netbook and 16-Core PC at home :) - electronic becomes more and more cheaper.

MooPi
March 25th, 2011, 07:46 AM
Only a small percentage of us think that beating the loop the loop learning curve is fun.

It is best not to forget that I think.

Those other people are probably what is called normal. :lolflag:
I'm slowly beginning to understand the psyche of the normal consumer. My small repair service is inundated by normal users who repetitively abuse computers. I have conversations with normal users with blank fixed stares as I explain what's wrong with their machines. Hmmmm loopty loop here I come :-)
Dell not selling Ubuntu Linux is alright by me........

Paqman
March 25th, 2011, 11:01 AM
It's not like Dell's Ubuntu offerings were exactly gung-ho to begin with. On the contrary, I remember there constantly being talk of Dell not supporting Ubuntu enough.

This.

The whole thing was a lacklustre effort at best. From the outside it looked like one part of the company was pulling against another. Whatever small unit within Dell wanted to push Ubuntu as an alternative OS clearly wasn't getting much support from up high, and the resources just weren't there. If they'd thrown a decent amount of marketing and resources at it, I personally think they could have done a lot better. That would have taken guts though, as it's quite likely they would have lost a lot of money.

At least Dell did the right thing and brought in a major distro to partner with, after the shambles of the early netbooks.

HappinessNow
April 12th, 2011, 09:18 AM
@HappinessNow: I agree.

Ubuntu got stoinked by MS on the netbooks, & stoinked by Google on the hand helds.

Dell is inconsequential.

I expect that there are those at Canonical that are working so hard to find a market that will financially sustain them into the future.

If they can't then Canonical will have a difficult time existing through to the end of the current decade.

handy, glad to hear that others can see clearly.

tlcstat
April 12th, 2011, 09:59 AM
Greetings,
Dell probably should just concentrate on trying to build a decent computer. I have a junk yard full of them that died way too early. I have been buying Toshiba that doesn't support Linux at all and they work just great. My L305 that I am typing this on has 1200Meg of Video RAM. If you want to see Unity flash before your eyes, try it on this machine. I'm waiting for the release to put it on my wife's Toshiba Netbook. She's not quite as tolerant of little messages popping up.
tlcstat

List of Canonical certified machines.
http://www.ubuntu.com/certification

Thewhistlingwind
April 12th, 2011, 10:05 AM
The desktop is fine. And will remain fine into the foreseeable future. It's not so much that desktop market share is shrinking, so much as it is that other markets (Netbooks, smartphones, etc.) are growing. For desktop adoption, the problem is that for major players in the industry (That produce CAD programs, Photo editing software, Animation suites, etc.) the money earned from sales to linux users isn't worth the cost of producing a linux port. Adding to this is FUD, the stigma of being "nerdy", and a whole slew of other issues that make adoption an uphill battle if theres ever been one.

Heres an example, my mom, a person who used to do transcription work, (HARDCORE typing, for the uninitiated.) used openoffice for about five minutes before asking me how I could manage to use it, as she pointed out "The formatting is terrible" I looked, and in a way she was right. Formatting issues with openoffice were one of my #1 complaints about the software. If theres anyone I could get to testify that it's inadequate, and has the background to give it credence, it's her. In addition, there was no easy way to switch from subscript to superscript. This wasn't a "Used to MS office and can't use the UI." this was "The feature doesn't exist." I even checked the documentation, the only option was to use a tedious method requiring four or so clicks every time (And looking through menus.) Her frustration was contagious.

In the end I felt so embarrassed that I wanted to go learn whatever languages OO.o is written in, and send a patch+bug report with foul language. First impressions count, and OO definitely failed it, hard. I suspect it's the same for most open source software out there that's not written for devs. For everyone below the professional level it's fine, but anyone above that will see it as pure trash.

SeijiSensei
April 12th, 2011, 12:39 PM
Try Abiword (http://www.abisource.com/). It has Ctrl key macros for sub/superscripts (see Format > Text Formatting). It's a pretty decent word processor and might meet your mother's needs. KDE has an office suite of its own called KOffice with Kword as the word processor. Its default interface is pretty busy though. For someone like your mom who just wants to enter a lot of text with occasional formatting, Abiword might fit the bill.

I'm glad the developers of these other office tools didn't furl their sails after OO became the darling of free software crowd.

Ctrl-Alt-F1
April 13th, 2011, 05:08 AM
So is Microsoft my friend..
So is Canonical my friend..

wolfen69
April 13th, 2011, 05:17 AM
People are still arguing what's better? It's about what you're into at the moment. It's about what makes you money. It's about what you enjoy. Any number of OS's can fulfill those those requirements. It's about what you prefer, not how good your computer is. Havn't we figured this out by now?

BertN45
April 13th, 2011, 06:04 AM
The main problem with the competition for Ubuntu is not Mac or Windows. it is the other operating systems you can download for free, the hacked versions of Windows.

Nobody seems to realize how dangerous it has become, because many hacks are provided by mafia related hackers, creating bot nets for major scams and theft.

wolfen69
April 13th, 2011, 06:10 AM
The main problem with the competition for Ubuntu is not Mac or Windows. it is the other operating systems you can download for free, the hacked versions of Windows.

Nobody seems to realize how dangerous it has become, because many hacks are provided by mafia related hackers, creating bot nets for major scams and theft.

Huh? Wow.

Darth Penguin
April 13th, 2011, 06:49 AM
The main problem with the competition for Ubuntu is not Mac or Windows. it is the other operating systems you can download for free, the hacked versions of Windows.

Nobody seems to realize how dangerous it has become, because many hacks are provided by mafia related hackers, creating bot nets for major scams and theft.Yes, many people are using zombie Windows PCs. They aren't getting anything for free however, they are using a kernel that has been modified to be a slave to a hacker.

Anyway, back on topic...

Dell would sell more laptops and desktops if they would offer Ubuntu and Windows dual boot preinstalled. Windows with Ubuntu dual boot beats Mac hands down any day.

tlcstat
April 13th, 2011, 09:14 AM
Greetings,
Original by Darth Penguin

Windows with Ubuntu dual boot beats Mac hands down any day.

You said that right! That Windows partition keeps me from being paranoid about what to do with all that extra hard drive space!

tlcstat

earthpigg
April 13th, 2011, 09:25 AM
The main problem with the competition for Ubuntu is not Mac or Windows. it is the other operating systems you can download for free, the hacked versions of Windows.

I think he is onto something, here.

It isn't significant that one 20 year old nerd thinks he has it made with cracked windows--

--it is significant, however, that he has the 4 or 6 people in his life that he sets up with that cracked version and that he provides the tech support for. The best operating system for any non-nerd is whatever OS their local nerd is willing and able to support, period.

I spent 20 minutes just last night explaining to my Ubuntu-using mother what a 'checkbox' looked like in nm-applet over the phone, and that the lack of a check in the box did not mean it was magically no longer a checkbox. Or something. I really have no idea what I was explaining to her, I got more confused the longer I talked to her. All I know is that she eventually clicked around enough that her wifi that had previously magically broken had suddenly magically started working again. I wish I could claim to have helped my mother, but I really have no idea what broke and what fixed it. Fairy dust is just as good a guess as any. The point is this: I told my mother that I was willing and able to support Ubuntu, and she thus uses Ubuntu.

Another example: My nerd girlfriend has a Mac and, thus, so do both of her parents and all of her siblings and a few of her other friends. Not because anyone did any rational cost-benefit analysis, but because that is what she told them to purchase because that is what she felt she was willing and able to support. One nerd willing and able to provide support to her loved ones translates directly and exactly into 6 or 7 computer sales. Impressive, huh?

Ubuntu needs to replicate that effect.



I hate to say it, but the best thing that could ever happen to Ubuntu's market share in the short term is that every cracked copy of Windows ceases to function tomorrow.

Few people will pay $200 for a start menu and facebook. Many will pay $0.99 to burn a CD-R for facebook - something that Ubuntu provides, like it or not.

earthpigg
April 13th, 2011, 10:00 AM
The main problem with the competition for Ubuntu is not Mac or Windows. it is the other operating systems you can download for free, the hacked versions of Windows.

Nobody seems to realize how dangerous it has become, because many hacks are provided by mafia related hackers, creating bot nets for major scams and theft.

for the second time in one day (http://ctmason.wordpress.com/2011/04/13/ubuntu-linux-sucks/), i was inspired to blog about a UF.org person's post.

tlcstat
April 13th, 2011, 10:04 AM
Greetings,
There is a Windows 7 serial number decal on the bottom of this Toshiba Laptop that allows me to run a single copy of Windows 7 Home Edition. Yet this computer has no Windows 7 partition. There has to be something in the mix other than just money. I get the point about the hacked copies of Windows and that does indicate that money plays into the motives of many Windows users regarding the hacked OS and probably hacked software also. I doubt that it has anything to do with Linux. Linux is used because some people want something different. I retired from supporting "Windows using" small businesses. But when I retired I wanted something different for myself. I had always wanted to try out Linux at some point when I had time. Money really didn't have anything to do with it. I have a dvd folder with just about every Windows OS available and thousands of dollars worth of software too. I just like Ubuntu! Period! Remember most of the linux drivers are backward engineered "hacked" drivers. We are going to use Linux in its many forms no matter what Dell, and all the other mfd's do. IMO! I don't care what Dell does because I don't like Dell. I use Ubuntu on my Toshiba even though Toshiba doesn't support Linux at all. Because it works! And its GOOD! Not because its cheap.
tlcstat

earthpigg
April 13th, 2011, 10:07 AM
but, tlcstat, you understand that you are at the edge of the bell curve? you are the exception, not the norm?

and that, economically, the person doing things differently and/or for different reasons than the 1000 persons around him or her.... doesn't matter. (im in that same boat as you).

KiwiNZ
April 13th, 2011, 10:41 AM
I think he is onto something, here.

It isn't significant that one 20 year old nerd thinks he has it made with cracked windows--

--it is significant, however, that he has the 4 or 6 people in his life that he sets up with that cracked version and that he provides the tech support for. The best operating system for any non-nerd is whatever OS their local nerd is willing and able to support, period.

I spent 20 minutes just last night explaining to my Ubuntu-using mother what a 'checkbox' looked like in nm-applet over the phone, and that the lack of a check in the box did not mean it was magically no longer a checkbox. Or something. I really have no idea what I was explaining to her, I got more confused the longer I talked to her. All I know is that she eventually clicked around enough that her wifi that had previously magically broken had suddenly magically started working again. I wish I could claim to have helped my mother, but I really have no idea what broke and what fixed it. Fairy dust is just as good a guess as any. The point is this: I told my mother that I was willing and able to support Ubuntu, and she thus uses Ubuntu.

Another example: My nerd girlfriend has a Mac and, thus, so do both of her parents and all of her siblings and a few of her other friends. Not because anyone did any rational cost-benefit analysis, but because that is what she told them to purchase because that is what she felt she was willing and able to support. One nerd willing and able to provide support to her loved ones translates directly and exactly into 6 or 7 computer sales. Impressive, huh?

Ubuntu needs to replicate that effect.



I hate to say it, but the best thing that could ever happen to Ubuntu's market share in the short term is that every cracked copy of Windows ceases to function tomorrow.

Few people will pay $200 for a start menu and facebook. Many will pay $0.99 to burn a CD-R for facebook - something that Ubuntu provides, like it or not.

Windows is on biggest percentage of PC's and Laptops because the purchasers demand it and the resellers deliver based on that demand.

The next group buy Apple Computers because they have chosen to do so because Apple meets their requirements.

The third group download and install alternative OS's because again this meets their needs.

All very simple, if the third alternative were to move towards the first then the resellers would react accordingly. Will this happen? who knows it's a big ask against strong good competition.

user1397
April 13th, 2011, 10:45 AM
I will say that I am not surprised that dell is giving up on ubuntu. They put out a public online voting system to brainstorm for a new company direction, and one of the most popular demands was ubuntu preinstalled computers. Maybe they didn't think that most of the linux users who petitioned for that were avid techies and were online all the time, so they obviously voted the most compared to other groups.

Either way, the profits were not enough, and business is business. At least for a while there one of the largest PC retailers had an ubuntu preinstalled option. That probably led to many more people being aware of ubuntu and linux in general, which is always a good thing.

I actually bought one of these machines last year, a dell mini 10v netbook with 1gb ram and a 16gb ssd. It's a nifty little machine (web browsing can sometimes be painful with multiple tabs) but all around decent. The one big beef I have with it is that the battery soon gave out and now it is all but useless. But oh well, it was less than $300 so I can't complain too much.

Lucradia
April 13th, 2011, 10:49 AM
It's not just ubuntu; Dell also wants to give up Alienware, and produce more business machines. Similar to IBM / Lenovo.

user1397
April 13th, 2011, 10:52 AM
Windows is on biggest percentage of PC's and Laptops because the purchasers demand it and the resellers deliver based on that demand.This is the only point to which I disagree. I would venture to say (and I am completely making this up on the spot, although I truly do believe it based on experience) that around >90% of people who buy computers are either extremely or at least quite computer illiterate.

To these people, a computer is just a computer, and they do not know or care what OS is installed. Most don't even know what an OS is.

So people don't "demand" windows, they demand computers, and since windows is preinstalled on 99% of PCs, that's what they get.

tlcstat
April 13th, 2011, 10:53 AM
Greetings,
Original post by earthpigg
doesn't matter. (im in that same boat as you).. What you say is true. That doesn't take away from the fact that most people buy Dell computers (or others) with Windows installed because that is what is mostly supported by the industries and the contracts they may have to enable a margin. All of those computers have components inside that have limited Linux support although I agree that Canonical does work with the component manufacturers especially in the server and small device market. Mac and Linux has made its own way. One of the hold backs in the Mac industry hasn't been quality it has been nailed shut expensive proprietary software and of course the price of the machine. There are people willing to pay for that and that is the nature of their business. Linux users are open source, non conformist, geeks (like me!). Don't get me wrong! I like my mostly open source software, though I do pay for a couple. What I have to deal with is the limited selection in "function" not quality. Some stuff just isn't available in a Linux package and thats a problem that is holding Linux back. It is the real problem that I had to wait until I retired to make the switch. There is actually municipal appraising and mapping internet based software that only works with Internet Explorer, not Firefox or Chrome and only on a Windows machine. That is a problem! That is what is holding Linux back, not hacked Windows systems. Heck, why not hack it. If you have to spend all your time fending off predators whats a little more time keeping the updates rolling with hacked dll files. Come on guys!! Just joking!! ...........or not!
tlcstat

user1397
April 13th, 2011, 10:53 AM
It's not just ubuntu; Dell also wants to give up Alienware, and produce more business machines.
source please?

Johnsie
April 13th, 2011, 11:02 AM
source please?

Lol, this isn't wikipedia ;-)

Lucradia
April 13th, 2011, 12:15 PM
source please?

Last year News at CNET reported that Dell would be closing Alienware (and it wasn't anywhere close to April fools, so it wasn't a joke.) Sadly, it seems CNET Removed that article, can't find it anywhere.

The same article also reported that Dell would be going more private, and less consumer brands would be pushed to retailers like Best Buy, etc.

_outlawed_
April 13th, 2011, 02:39 PM
System76 > Dell any day of the week for Linux preinstalled computers.

arisepeter
September 23rd, 2011, 02:48 PM
We have to realize a fact that Linux should not be constrained itself to an OS which like to see the end of Windows. I think we have to change our attitude in this matter. Linux has to realize its potential and we have to dig it also. There is no point in mimicking Windows, instead we have to explore a new way I will say in a 'Linux way' to make History. Yes, Linux is capable of doing much much more in this Computer Era.

sffvba[e0rt
September 23rd, 2011, 02:51 PM
... back to sleep thread ...


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