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NightwishFan
March 11th, 2011, 08:25 AM
http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/asiapcf/03/11/japan.quake/index.html?hpt=T1&iref=BN1

I hope that all of our friends in Japan are ok. :(

Lucradia
March 11th, 2011, 08:39 AM
Just heard about it too. Man, I'm tired :<

JDShu
March 11th, 2011, 08:49 AM
Watching the video now, the destruction is insane.

KiwiNZ
March 11th, 2011, 09:20 AM
My thoughts are with the people of Japan. The pictures of the tsunami's bring bad memories for me, I pray for those in the coastal areas of Japan and the Pacific areas at risk of Tsunami.

zenwalker
March 11th, 2011, 10:01 AM
Red cross says biggest concern is tsunami, wave now higher than some pacific islands

Lavahead
March 11th, 2011, 10:08 AM
We are on tsunami watch here in Hawai'i. The evacuation sirens have started up at 10pm HST. Most pole in my area are evacuating now. I am waiting until the last minute. Intial waves are to hit at 2:59am HST this morning. Current time is 11:07pm HST. I am enjoying an emergency breswki as we speak.

mips
March 11th, 2011, 12:07 PM
Google Person Finder setup for the earthquake:
http://japan.person-finder.appspot.com/?lang=ja Japanese
http://japan.person-finder.appspot.com/?lang=en English

mmix
March 11th, 2011, 01:12 PM
earthquake, sink hole, offshore oil drilling..

Grenage
March 11th, 2011, 01:16 PM
We are on tsunami watch here in Hawai'i. The evacuation sirens have started up at 10pm HST. Most pole in my area are evacuating now. I am waiting until the last minute. Intial waves are to hit at 2:59am HST this morning. Current time is 11:07pm HST. I am enjoying an emergency breswki as we speak.

You're brave, I'm not sure I'd want to hang around!

piquat
March 11th, 2011, 01:26 PM
You're brave, I'm not sure I'd want to hang around!

Ya, was it Indonesia where a bunch of people all ran out either see the wave or just check out the water running away from the beach.

When the ocean gets weird, RUN!

rowland
March 11th, 2011, 01:53 PM
My mother entered the room (scared face) and said like its the Apocalipsis:
A nuclear facility made a huge earthquake, and tsunamis are expected everywhere.

She just listened the most important news on the radio, but she didnt understand it all. What a scare she gave me.
Has happened something nuclear related?
Lets hope the destruction won't be destructive...

Tristam Green
March 11th, 2011, 02:14 PM
My mother entered the room (scared face) and said like its the Apocalipsis:
A nuclear facility made a huge earthquake, and tsunamis are expected everywhere.

She just listened the most important news on the radio, but she didnt understand it all. What a scare she gave me.
Has happened something nuclear related?
Lets hope the destruction won't be destructive...

No, the earthquake rocked the power plant, which automatically shut down its reactors and cooling systems following.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/42025882/ns/world_news-asiapacific/

No reactor leak. No apocalypse.

rowland
March 11th, 2011, 02:57 PM
No reactor leak. No apocalypse.

Thought so.
Thx for the vid.

samalex
March 11th, 2011, 04:17 PM
Yeah it's pretty crazy. I'm not sure when it's supposed to hit, but they're saying a 3-4 foot surge could hit the western US coast this morning from it. Anyone seeing this?

sydbat
March 11th, 2011, 04:23 PM
Yeah it's pretty crazy. I'm not sure when it's supposed to hit, but they're saying a 3-4 foot surge could hit the western US coast this morning from it. Anyone seeing this?They issue the warnings just in case but I think it will be a lot less than that. Historically, tsunamis tend to be more localized, even when there are seismic events significantly larger than this.

However, if I lived on the coast, I'd be making a trip inland...to higher ground.

My wife and I send the people of Japan, and anyone impacted by tsunami activity, our prayers.

Kirboosy
March 11th, 2011, 04:26 PM
I have several friends that live in Hawaii. I hope the island isn't hit with the tsunami...

I wonder how soon before the USA sends over help to Japan...cause you know that's the noble thing to do...

Quadunit404
March 11th, 2011, 07:48 PM
Hopefully not long. I've seen videos of the destruction the earthquake and tsunami did to Japan, and it's not pretty.

I wouldn't be surprised if countries around the world were already donating money and supplies to the Japanese people right now. May the best be with them.

EDIT: Christ, I cannot imagine how many lives were ruined by this (http://www.theatlantic.com/infocus/2011/03/earthquake-in-japan/100022/) anymore.

Old_Grey_Wolf
March 11th, 2011, 09:19 PM
They issue the warnings just in case but I think it will be a lot less than that. Historically, tsunamis tend to be more localized, even when there are seismic events significantly larger than this....

Just in case...larger than this?

This one is not a common occurrence. Here is the history of earthquakes that were larger:

1700.01.26 - Cascadia Subduction Zone spanning Canada/USA - Magnitude 9.0
1868.08.13 - Arica, Peru (Chile) - Magnitude 9.0
1952.11.04 - Kamchatka, Soviet Union - Magnitude 9.0
1960.05.22 - Chile - Magnitude 9.5
1964.03.28 - Prince William Sound, Alaska, USA - Magnitude 9.2
2004.12.26 - Sumatra-Andaman Islands, Indonesia - Magnitude 9.1

Not very many over a period of 300+ years for anyone to use for the bases of an impact estimate.

----

I really don't like what I am seeing in the News. I hope the best outcome for everyone in Japan.

fatality_uk
March 11th, 2011, 09:36 PM
Obviously my best wishes go to all those affected.

metalf8801
March 11th, 2011, 09:56 PM
No, the earthquake rocked the power plant, which automatically shut down its reactors and cooling systems following.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/42025882/ns/world_news-asiapacific/

No reactor leak. No apocalypse.

I hope they can get their cooling system running as soon as possible or there could be another huge disaster

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2011/03/11/AR2011031103673.html

Aquix
March 11th, 2011, 09:58 PM
My mother entered the room (scared face) and said like its the Apocalipsis:
A nuclear facility made a huge earthquake, and tsunamis are expected everywhere.

She just listened the most important news on the radio, but she didnt understand it all. What a scare she gave me.
Has happened something nuclear related?
Lets hope the destruction won't be destructive...

Japan has eartquakes quite often, so I'm sure there is seismographs that automatically shuts down the reactors. Their building codes calculates for earthquakes so I'm confident the nuclear power plants are incredible secure.

I hope the rescue efforts saves as many lifes as possible.

kungpo
March 11th, 2011, 10:40 PM
I hope they can get their cooling system running as soon as possible or there could be another huge disaster

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2011/03/11/AR2011031103673.html


That reactor is a hundred times more powerful than chernobyl, lets hope they quickly sort it.

A failure of that is something nobody needs.

Quadunit404
March 11th, 2011, 11:05 PM
I have heard that the US has shipped coolant fluid to Japan and the coolant fluid has been applied (is that the right word?) to the reactor, so it doesn't seem we'll experience Chernobyl Part 2 anytime soon... hopefully.

MisterGaribaldi
March 11th, 2011, 11:11 PM
Man, this just seems to get worse all the time. I'm certain there've been casualties, but my thoughts and prayers and best wishes are with all those in Japan.

beetleman64
March 11th, 2011, 11:15 PM
My thoughts go out to all those affected by the Tsunami. The devastation is on a truly insane level, and the casualties will only increase with time. I hope that the reports of thousands dead aren't true, but having seen the pictures, I wouldn't risk saying that they aren't.

It makes me glad that I live in a part of the world where such events don't happen. We may moan about the cold and rain, but we should put things into perspective.

reyfer
March 11th, 2011, 11:33 PM
They issue the warnings just in case but I think it will be a lot less than that. Historically, tsunamis tend to be more localized, even when there are seismic events significantly larger than this.

Are you sure? As far as I know, the tsunami that destroyed Hilo in Hawaii in 1960, was triggered by the big earthquake out of the Chile coast, so how does that fit with the "localized" theory?

mips
March 11th, 2011, 11:46 PM
I have heard that the US has shipped coolant fluid to Japan and the coolant fluid has been applied (is that the right word?) to the reactor, so it doesn't seem we'll experience Chernobyl Part 2 anytime soon... hopefully.

Dunno what they are on about. Reactors are cooled by circulating water.

kungpo
March 11th, 2011, 11:52 PM
Dunno what they are on about. Reactors are cooled by circulating water.


Yep, that's why they're built next to the see.

Quadunit404
March 11th, 2011, 11:58 PM
By the way, I heard an entire train filled with people is missing... anyone else heard of that?

NightwishFan
March 12th, 2011, 12:02 AM
I had heard the exact opposite that there were no derailings.

Quadunit404
March 12th, 2011, 12:10 AM
From another forum I go to:

http://s1.zetaboards.com/The_RX_Community/single/?p=467496&t=4170955

http://picardfacepalm.com/picard-facepalm-hotlink.jpg
Nothing else can be said to describe that. I would say my faith in humanity has failed me, but it already did.

pwnst*r
March 12th, 2011, 12:25 AM
Damn shame and some scary *** video footage.

pi3.1415926535...
March 12th, 2011, 01:01 AM
I have heard that it was felt in Tokyo, though was there any damage on the same scale?

TriBlox6432
March 12th, 2011, 01:07 AM
Can we please agree not to argue right now? There is new information all the time, and nothing is for sure. 2 hours ago, it was an 8.9 earthquake. Now, it's an 8.8. It may not seem a big difference, but it is. So please, we don't know that much about it now, so yeah. ;)

JDShu
March 12th, 2011, 01:22 AM
Just read up on the nuclear plant problem (http://abcnews.go.com/International/japanese-earthquake-stokes-nuclear-fears-damaged-power-plants/story?id=13114181).

Until today, I believed that nuclear power was safe, but I'm not so sure anymore. Seems analogous to the Deepwater Horizon oil spill... chances of a meltdown at any given time is minuscule and disaster only happens given incredibly rare conditions, but when it does, then we're screwed.

MasterNetra
March 12th, 2011, 01:34 AM
Just read up on the nuclear plant problem (http://abcnews.go.com/International/japanese-earthquake-stokes-nuclear-fears-damaged-power-plants/story?id=13114181).

Until today, I believed that nuclear power was safe, but I'm not so sure anymore. Seems analogous to the Deepwater Horizon oil spill... chances of a meltdown at any given time is minuscule and disaster only happens given incredibly rare conditions, but when it does, then we're screwed.

Actually according to the article its off-line the fuel is just so hot it needs continue cooling, it won't "blow" if its breached but it can leak radiation into outer containment building as well as into the environment. It would be a big disaster but not in the "it blowing up" kind that people seem to be sporting. I never supported Nuclear given its risks though as well as the fuel aspect, Uranium, isn't exactly the most abundant resource nor is it renewable. But I digress.

Quadunit404
March 12th, 2011, 01:43 AM
Goodbye, my faith in humanity. (http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/bbs/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=169922&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0)

I wish I made up the above URL. I really do. Why is anime and manga more important to those people than the hundreds of lives lost and the hundreds, maybe thousands, more who are struggling for their lives? WHY. At least there have been two sane posts found in that linked-to thread.

Sorry that I'm ranting so much. I'm not in a good mood right now.

pi3.1415926535...
March 12th, 2011, 01:49 AM
If anyone wants to see an off-topic debate about nuclear plant safety in the comments of an article about the Japanese nuclear plant (http://www.businessinsider.com/fukushima-nuclear-plant-2011-3) (quite offensive). I cannot believe that these people are wasting their time discussing the pro/cons of nuclear power when they are self-professed "experts", and could be devising solutions.

JDShu
March 12th, 2011, 02:08 AM
Actually according to the article its off-line the fuel is just so hot it needs continue cooling, it won't "blow" if its breached but it can leak radiation into outer containment building as well as into the environment. It would be a big disaster but not in the "it blowing up" kind that people seem to be sporting. I never supported Nuclear given its risks though as well as the fuel aspect, Uranium, isn't exactly the most abundant resource nor is it renewable. But I digress.

I suppose what might be useful to know is the cost of complete cooler failure. In the case of the oil spill, the cost of failure was clearly not calculated correctly. Perhaps in this case people have a bit more information.

NightwishFan
March 12th, 2011, 02:11 AM
Goodbye, my faith in humanity. (http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/bbs/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=169922&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0)

I wish I made up the above URL. I really do. Why is anime and manga more important to those people than the hundreds of lives lost and the hundreds, maybe thousands, more who are struggling for their lives? WHY. At least there have been two sane posts found in that linked-to thread.

Sorry that I'm ranting so much. I'm not in a good mood right now.

I'm sorry but I have no clue what you are talking about.


Here is a good report on the disaster I found.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-12307698

MisterGaribaldi
March 12th, 2011, 02:19 AM
Meaning absolutely no disrespect whatsoever to the many hurting people in Japan, it's hard to come away from that footage without having the impression it's some horror flick or Godzilla movie.

But it isn't, and it never will be. It's just one of those very tragic events which happens from time to time. I'm praying for all those there, and for the many who I know have or will rush in to do good, save lives, and restore order.

Doubtless Japan hasn't seen destruction on this scale in 66 years.

Quadunit404
March 12th, 2011, 02:26 AM
I'm sorry but I have no clue what you are talking about.

People are considering anime and manga to be more important than human lives. I wish I was making that up. I really do.

I'd be less ranty right now, but... urgh...

NightwishFan
March 12th, 2011, 02:31 AM
People are considering anime and manga to be more important than human lives.

A very small minority even of people that like anime I am sure.

reyfer
March 12th, 2011, 02:40 AM
The force of the quake was so strong that it moved the island of Honshu 8 feet to the east, said USGS geophysicist Ken Hudnut. It sped up the Earth's rotation by 1.6 microseconds, according to NASA.

http://hosted2.ap.org/APDEFAULT/386c25518f464186bf7a2ac026580ce7/Article_2011-03-11-US-SCI-Japan-Earthquake-Science/id-e9fbb5efba5c4974a96815053af9906f

MasterNetra
March 12th, 2011, 03:01 AM
News on the BBC News player mentioned the death toll at 400+. with over 700 others missing. And 4 trains are missing

mmix
March 12th, 2011, 12:06 PM
Just googling "fukushima fallout map"

I don't know this is true or not, but, just saw the real image on the news..

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-12720219

http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/51647000/jpg/_51647556_jex_984081_de55-1.jpg

http://fixitnow.posterous.com/core-melt-down-at-fukushima-daiichi-plant-nuc

http://posterous.com/getfile/files.posterous.com/fixitnow/lfvndBiijHDdhvyBjehcgtekGbqEnfhDuwIgqqabvbBqncAalw BsEHAxsAql/967AEF3E-46D0-4396-8DDA-3336C9D6E839.jpg

NightwishFan
March 12th, 2011, 12:16 PM
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-12720219
Edit: same link as above, sorry.

Yeah. Not sure how serious it is yet, my gut tells me it is very serious.

MibunoOokami
March 12th, 2011, 12:27 PM
Mother nature sure does seem peeved over the past several months, with earthquakes, hurricanes and floods it is unbelievable. I feel so sorry for the people of Japan and especially the poor USAR personnel who were here helping with our earthquake over the past few weeks and now have to go back their own country to do more of the same and it's going to take much longer than just a few weeks I imagine. Fortunately our Prime Minister seems to have the common courtesy to send some of our USAR personnel to Japan for their time of need.

May all the souls of the departed both in Japan and NZ, rest in peace. :cry:

ikt
March 12th, 2011, 02:51 PM
Mother nature sure does seem peeved over the past several months, with earthquakes, hurricanes and floods it is unbelievable.

These things are a regular occurrence on earth.


Just googling "fukushima fallout map"

I don't know this is true or not, but, just saw the real image on the news..

fake, no context, no nothing.



Yeah. Not sure how serious it is yet, my gut tells me it is very serious.

Well triple backup systems aren't supposed to all fail at once, also the explosion linked above was caused by:


Edano said due to the falling level of cooling water, hydrogen was generated and that leaked to the space between the building and the container and the explosion happened when the hydrogen mixed with oxygen there.

http://in.reuters.com/article/2011/03/12/idINIndia-55526220110312

"
We've decided to fill the reactor container with sea water. Trade minister Kaieda has instructed us to do so. By doing this, we will use boric acid to prevent criticality."

Edano said it would take about five to 10 hours to fill the reactor core with sea water and around 10 days to complete the process.

However this is a tad boring, feel free to link mass destruction images and end of the world conspiracy theories :)

Dr. C
March 12th, 2011, 05:38 PM
Mother nature sure does seem peeved over the past several months, with earthquakes, hurricanes and floods it is unbelievable. I feel so sorry for the people of Japan and especially the poor USAR personnel who were here helping with our earthquake over the past few weeks and now have to go back their own country to do more of the same and it's going to take much longer than just a few weeks I imagine. Fortunately our Prime Minister seems to have the common courtesy to send some of our USAR personnel to Japan for their time of need.

May all the souls of the departed both in Japan and NZ, rest in peace. :cry:

I could not agree more.

The nuclear fallout map is a fake designed to create panic, and can actually cost lives. Something we do not need at this time of crisis. As someone who lives right in the path of the supposed lethal nuclear fallout, 750 RAD is lethal, I am not going to panic but am very concerned that others may. To get that kind of radiation exposure from fallout one needs to be a few hundred km from a 20 megaton surface nuclear blast not over 10,000km from a reactor being filled with seawater and boric acid. Unfounded panic can cause deaths. The logo by the way belongs to http://www.australian-radiation-services.com.au, and is obviously pirated. I would guess that this map was also created with some pirated propriety software.

rg4w
March 12th, 2011, 05:58 PM
This tragic event serves as another reminder for us all to make sure we have our own emergency preparedness in place.

At a minimum one should have enough food and water for seven days; count on one gallon of water per person per day.

Also, keep a flashlight or headlamp, multi-tool, well-stocked first aid kit, and a battery-powered radio with spare batteries or a hand-cranked radio. Shortwave is a good option for a survival radio, since FM often doesn't carry far and your local stations may be unable to broadcast.

It's also useful to keep similar provisions in your car, since you can't know where you'll be when such an event occurs. In my car I keep at least a day's worth of food and three days' worth of water, along with a second first-aid kit and radio, headlamp, etc.

NCLI
March 12th, 2011, 09:27 PM
I'm going to Tokyo for a year on April 1st, hopefully everything will have calmed down by then.

Quadunit404
March 12th, 2011, 11:13 PM
Have any of you noticed comments like this on YouTube videos related to the earthquake and tsunami?


all of us are incredibly frightened here. researchers belonging to the institution of colorado have realized data the world will come to an end. this whole japan occurrence is absolutely linked. you can see a online video for you to prepare 4 the actual endat-[URL removed]


we are honestly starting to get really frightened. yesterday morning there was a small class of experts that are at a university in texas that have showed clearly the fact that world is without a doubt drawing near to it's finish. this total japan event is really linked. you can discover a video clip guide regarding precisely how to be able to survivefrom:[]

(No, I didn't remove the URL from the second comment. It was seriously like that.)

So now a "news" site is starting to spam YouTube about 2012 and is linking this occurrence to it. People have figured out the "evidence" presented on the site is fake mostly from the fact that the story was never featured on the big media names listed on the site, the broken English and how the group of researchers/experts/scientists/whatever and where they're from ALWAYS changes but yet they're still persistent in spamming YouTube just to increase visits to their site and its evidence lies.

NightwishFan
March 12th, 2011, 11:18 PM
Of course. Not to mention the fake "donate to japan" scams have already surfaced. Make sure you are donating to the right place, and dont click any sensationalist links. It might be malware of a sort also.

ZarathustraDK
March 12th, 2011, 11:51 PM
About the nuclear facility...

According to the authorities the reactor wasn't breached. Could someone enlighten me as to why radioactive material still got spread if it wasn't breached? (genuinely curious about that).

As far as I've read, the earthquake knocked out the coolant-system, the rising temperature somehow produced hydrogen (hydrolysis or...?), which filled the compartment between the reactor-room and the outer wall, then the whole shebang got set off by a spark or a fire somewhere.

mmix
March 13th, 2011, 12:32 AM
not sure but,

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/03/12/japanese_meltdown/



Update 2

In a short clarification published three and a half hours after its first report of an explosion at Fukushima No. 1's reactor No. 1, Kyodo News said that: "Japanese authorities have confirmed there was no explosion at the troubled No. 1 reactor of the Fukushima No. 1 nuclear power plant, top government spokesman Yukio Edano said. The chief Cabinet secretary also told an urgent press conference that the operator, Tokyo Electric Power Co. [TEPCO], has confirmed there is no damage to the steel container housing the reactor."

The blast reportedly occurred in the building housing the reactor, and not in the reactor itself. The news agency also noted that the evacuation area has now been expanded to a 20-kilometer radius around both Fukushima No. 1 and Fukushima No. 2, and that TEPCO has begun a "new cooling operation", filling the reactor with sea water mixed with boric acid

Khakilang
March 13th, 2011, 04:05 AM
Very sad indeed. First New Zealand and now Japan. It seem that our world is breaking up. For those people whose country do not face this kind of disaster should appreciate what they have instead of fighting each other. My hearts and thoughts goes out to the people of Japan.

Quadunit404
March 13th, 2011, 06:05 AM
Actually it's naturally occurring. Japan gets thousands of earthquakes per year.

EDIT: Looking through YouTube again, I found this gold on a Japanese earthquake video:


it is time that everybody starts preparation for what scientists have at the moment proven the beginning of the finish of our own entire world. for the 1st time over the last few years there has been a 2012 theory which has been discovered reality. a group that's functioning with the experts recently produced information about how you may cook from: (URL removed) If you can make a lick of sense out of that, you deserve an award :lolflag:

Cracklepop
March 13th, 2011, 06:33 AM
About the nuclear facility...

According to the authorities the reactor wasn't breached. Could someone enlighten me as to why radioactive material still got spread if it wasn't breached? (genuinely curious about that).

As far as I've read, the earthquake knocked out the coolant-system, the rising temperature somehow produced hydrogen (hydrolysis or...?), which filled the compartment between the reactor-room and the outer wall, then the whole shebang got set off by a spark or a fire somewhere.

They intentionally released radioactive steam to reduce pressure and prevent a meltdown.

Paqman
March 13th, 2011, 10:08 AM
About the nuclear facility...

According to the authorities the reactor wasn't breached. Could someone enlighten me as to why radioactive material still got spread if it wasn't breached? (genuinely curious about that).


The type of plant is called a Boiling Water Reactor, where the water cooling the core is sent directly to the turbines. Other light water reactors keep the water cooling the core and moderating the reaction separate from the water circulating to the turbines. The upshot of this is that the BWR has radioactive steam circulating all over the place.

Nuclear reactors can't just be switched off, and this type will keep generating a fair amount of heat even after you shut the plant down and stop generating power. All that heat has to be disposed of, and if your cooling system (and the multiple layers of backup) fail then you'll start to see rising heat and pressure in your coolant. Once that boils away the reactor can't cool itself and you get a meltdown, but even before that happens you could be facing dangerously high pressures and temperatures in your coolant, which is a danger in itself. If you vent this pressure, you're releasing radioactive steam to atmosphere. Which is not cool.

YesWeCan
March 13th, 2011, 12:05 PM
A 20km radius evac zone is a major upheaval of people. This alone proves that the authorities consider this to be a really risky situation.

It occured to me just now that building nuclear plants on the fault-line coast and therefore the tsunami coast, and right on the beach is asking for trouble. Is it because of prevailing winds that they did not build them on the west (Sea of Japan) coast?

Any radiation leak will be blown east towards Hawaii and the North American coast.

Rondonjin
March 13th, 2011, 12:19 PM
There was build-up of hydrogen gas in the reactor that caused the explosion. The same thing is happening to another reactor and there could be an explosion there. We have not been told whether the core has been exposed in the first reactor. There is speculation that it may have melted. Again, we have not been told anything.

If you can understand Japanese, there are experts giving advice that the Japanese government is unwilling to give. Right now it's bilingual.

http://www.ustream.tv/channel/iwakamiyasumi

The Met Office predicts a 70% chance of another Mag 7 earthquake within the next 3 days with up to mag 5 aftershocks possible for another 150 days. We are hoping for the best. I'm currently in Tokyo and am not relishing the next few days.

NCLI
March 13th, 2011, 01:04 PM
It looks like a nuclear meltdown will be averted, phew.

Paqman
March 13th, 2011, 01:08 PM
It occured to me just now that building nuclear plants on the fault-line coast and therefore the tsunami coast, and right on the beach is asking for trouble.

They're built on the shoreline so they can use seawater for cooling. It's less disruptive environmentally than using a river, and cheaper and less hideous than cooling towers.

I suspect you'll start seeing 15m earth ramparts around seafront nuke plants across the Pacific in the not too distant future. The Japanese do have tsunami walls along their coast, but this one was just too big, and washed over them.



Any radiation leak will be blown east towards Hawaii and the North American coast.

That's a pretty long way, dude. Jetstreams notwithstanding, you couldn't find a more opportune place (from a human perspective) for dispersing a plume of radioactivity than the Pacific Ocean. It's the part of the Earth's surface that's least heavily populated.

YesWeCan
March 13th, 2011, 01:23 PM
They're built on the shoreline so they can use seawater for cooling. It's less disruptive environmentally than using a river, and cheaper and less hideous than cooling towers.
I presume you don't need to be right on the coast in order to obtain sea water. Cosmetic and economic factors I can understand.


I suspect you'll start seeing 15m earth ramparts around seafront nuke plants across the Pacific in the not too distant future. The Japanese do have tsunami walls along their coast, but this one was just too big, and washed over them.
It seems to me that huge sea levels as the result of earthquakes are not news to anyone. Especially in Japan which has a long history of such things and is arguably in one of the most, if not the most earthquake prone region on the planet. 15m? Not very much if you ask me. Consider a recent example:

Wikipedia: For instance, the Okushiri, Hokkaidō tsunami which struck Okushiri Island of Hokkaidō within two to five minutes of the earthquake on July 12, 1993 created waves as much as 30 metres (100 ft) tall—as high as a 10-story building. The port town of Aonae was completely surrounded by a tsunami wall, but the waves washed right over the wall and destroyed all the wood-framed structures in the area. The wall may have succeeded in slowing down and moderating the height of the tsunami, but it did not prevent major destruction and loss of life.




That's a pretty long way, dude. Jetstreams notwithstanding, you couldn't find a more opportune place (from a human perspective) for dispersing a plume of radioactivity than the Pacific Ocean. It's the part of the Earth's surface that's least heavily populated.
I don't know how heavy particles are and how quickly then settle on the surface, but I think it only takes a day for the air over Japan to reach N. America.
[edit] I'm not sure that is true. Probably true for jet streams, but maybe it takes many days for lower air systems to cross.

Paqman
March 13th, 2011, 01:42 PM
I presume you don't need to be right on the coast in order to obtain sea water. Cosmetic and economic factors I can understand.

No, but piping it uphill reduces the efficiency of the system, which is expensive. We're talking about a phenomenal mass of water in the condensers of a steam turbine (ie: tens of thousands of tonnes per hour). There's always a formal quantification of risk involved in engineering decisions. Bottom line: it's cost/benefit.



It seems to me that huge sea levels as the result of earthquakes are not news to anyone. Especially in Japan which has a long history of such things and is arguably in one of the most, if not the most earthquake prone region on the planet. 15m? Not very much if you ask me.


Again, this will have been cost/benefit. Tsunamis certainly aren't news, but there would have been an assessment of the risk based on the frequency and height of tsunamis they could expect to face.

It's worth bearing mind that the objective of risk assessment isn't to design out the chance of an extreme event wiping you out. The objective is to weigh the potential damage and likelihood of it happening against the cost of prevention and the impact of it happening. The nuclear industry faces such potentially evil disasters that they tend to come down on the very conservative side regarding risk, but this was possibly an event way beyond what the models said could be reasonably expected.

They might be completely correct in this assessment. This quake was a whopper, and it's not reasonable to design for the really outlying events. Sometimes you're just going to have to lie down and take your beating from Mother Nature.



I don't know how heavy particles are and how quickly then settle on the surface, but I think it only takes a day for the air over Japan to reach N. America.

I don't know much about it either, but I know that Chernobyl (which released a lot more radiation than we're talking about here) really only affected areas within a few hundred km. The air in jetstreams will cross the Pacific pretty quick, but how much of this sea-level release is going to find its way up to that level? Not a lot, I suspect.

YesWeCan
March 13th, 2011, 01:56 PM
but this was possibly an event way beyond what the models said could be reasonably expected.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_earthquakes_in_Japan

Of course it isn't clear whether the power station designers did not expect this or whether the systems failed to cope properly with this rare, but inevitable, event. I have great sympathy for the design issues involved in this precarious geography.

Rondonjin
March 13th, 2011, 02:08 PM
Well, the French embassy is advising its nationals to clear out of the Kanto area and the Germans are saying people should leave the country if they can, especially if they have young children.

Paqman
March 13th, 2011, 02:40 PM
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_earthquakes_in_Japan


The Richter scale is logarithmic. A 9 would release ten times the energy of a 8, and a hundred times that of a 7. A lot depends on where and how deep it is too. The second Christchurch earthquake was actually smaller than the first one, which didn't cause nearly as much carnage. But it was close to the city and shallow.


Well, the French embassy is advising its nationals to clear out of the Kanto area and the Germans are saying people should leave the country if they can, especially if they have young children.

Not much comfort if you're Japanese, but i'm sure they're just being cautious. Any word on the government issuing iodine?

YesWeCan
March 13th, 2011, 03:00 PM
Geological statistics from CTV British Columbia:

Early data from Japan suggests the earthquake moved the island about 2.4 metres, according to Kenneth Hudnut of the U.S. Geological Survey. The agency compared information from a GPS station that had moved by more than two metres with satellite images from Japan.

Late Friday, scientists at NASA revealed the quake shaved more than a microsecond from the day. The quake, which lasted about two minutes, sped up the earth's rotation by about 1.6 microseconds. (One microsecond is one-millionth of a second.) NASA geophysicist Richard Gross said the quake shifted the Earth's mass, which caused the change in speed.

While the speed change was only slightly more than what was caused by last year's earthquake in Chile, it was considerably less than the quake in Sumatra in 2004. That quake sped up the Earth's rotation by 6.8 microseconds.

Meanwhile, a report from Italy's National Institute of Geophysics and Volcanology suggested Friday's quake shifted the Earth on its axis by an estimated 10 centimetres.

The quake was the fifth-largest recorded in the world since 1900. It occurred where the North American and Pacific tectonic plates intersect, in the northwest region of the "Ring of Fire," and was an estimated 299 kilometres long and 150 kilometres wide.

I also hard on NHK news yesterday that the northern end of Japan dropped 60cm to 70cm relative to to southern end. The implication was that some of the flooded areas would never fully drain.


I find it alarming that in the past 100 years or so there have been 5 earthquakes of at least this magnitude. On average, that is one every 20 years. The 2004 Indian Ocean quake was 9.3 (I think) and caused 30m high waves in places and some 250,000 people died.

NCLI
March 13th, 2011, 03:01 PM
The Richter scale is logarithmic. A 9 would release ten times the energy of a 8, and a hundred times that of a 7. A lot depends on where and how deep it is too. The second Christchurch earthquake was actually smaller than the first one, which didn't cause nearly as much carnage. But it was close to the city and shallow.



Not much comfort if you're Japanese, but i'm sure they're just being cautious. Any word on the government issuing iodine?

They say they're in the proces of issuing it now.

YesWeCan
March 13th, 2011, 03:13 PM
There's now a problem at Onagawa too:

IAEA: Japan declares state of emergency at second nuclear power facility after excessive radiation levels were detected at Onagawa plant.
8 minutes ago via SkyNews Alerts - Breaking

reyfer
March 13th, 2011, 03:39 PM
Watching NHK World live...the Miyagi prefecture police say the number of casualties could rise to 10,000 in that prefecture alone, and the Japanese Meteorological Agency says the earthquake was actually 9 magnitude

Rondonjin
March 14th, 2011, 06:10 AM
There were two explosions caused probably by hydrogen at the #3 reactor this morning. Apparently, the core of #2 is exposed and melting down. No real news on whether to evacuate the Kanto area, they're still suggesting a 20Km radius from the reactor. Obviously, they don't want people to panic.

Store shelves are empty. No bread, milk or bottled water. Also no cup noodles or instant noodles and no news of when new supplies will be coming.

A lot of foreigners working in Tokyo have already left the country. The German and French embassies are suggesting people leave Kanto or preferably the country, especially if they have small children. The Brit embassy expect us to keep a stiff upper lip and bend over and take a nuke rod up the jacksie and think of England! No concrete advice from them on whether to leave or not!

Still getting small shocks, although there was a bigger one in Ibaragi this morning.

I'm still unsure whether to make a run for it or not.

YesWeCan
March 14th, 2011, 03:09 PM
I'm still unsure whether to make a run for it or not.
No kidding.
And the British complain about their weather. :)
I can't imagine what it is like to be in Tokyo right now. I have been in Tokyo during an earthquake but nothing on this scale and no fear of radiation.
I would probably be thinking what is the realistic worst case scenario if I stay put and what is the realistic worst case scenario if I gain some distance. And how long is the nuclear threat likely to last.

mmix
March 14th, 2011, 07:42 PM
Scary story about fukushima reactor NO.1, NO.2. (Japanese)
http://www.iam-t.jp/HIRAI/

mmix
March 14th, 2011, 09:42 PM
Published: March 13, 2011

https://www.nytimes.com/2011/03/14/world/asia/japan-fukushima-nuclear-reactor.html?_r=2&src=tptw

60 miles == 96.54 km



But Pentagon officials reported Sunday that helicopters flying 60 miles from the plant picked up small amounts of radioactive particulates — still being analyzed, but presumed to include cesium-137 and iodine-121 — suggesting widening environmental contamination.

Quadunit404
March 14th, 2011, 09:54 PM
http://l.yimg.com/a/p/us/news/editorial/b/3c/b3c493d410cf9e10fb6dcafa4c3f3fad.jpeg

Just seeing that one ancient structure standing in the midst of all that destruction seems so hopeful...

mmix
March 14th, 2011, 10:57 PM
Radiation levels (Japanese)
http://www.japc.co.jp/pis/tokai/trend2.htm

YesWeCan
March 14th, 2011, 11:54 PM
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/japan/8381437/Japan-nuclear-threat-families-flee-again-as-meltdown-risk-increases.html

There are a lot of mixed messages. Not a reassuring sign.
Tepco say there may be a leak which is why the sea water levels aren't staying high enough. If so, where is the radioactive water leaking away too?
Just heard a report on the BBC that one reactor casing has been damaged.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/japan/8375373/Japan-earthquake-live.html

Quadunit404
March 14th, 2011, 11:57 PM
Reactor #1 before and after (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/picturegalleries/worldnews/8380342/Tsunami-and-earthquake-in-Japan-latest-pictures-of-the-damage.html?image=8)

And this was all because of an earthquake... damn nature, u scary.

Paqman
March 15th, 2011, 12:06 AM
Not a reassuring sign.


I wouldn't worry too hard, unless you get cores melting down and breaching their containment (hugely unlikely) then the kind of radiation you'll see will have a half-life of minutes or hours. The risk to the public is pretty minimal, especially compared to the other very real problems they're facing in the aftermath of the quake. I'd be more worried about clean water supplies than nuclear plants.

YesWeCan
March 15th, 2011, 12:12 AM
Just seen news that a third explosion has happened, this time in reactor #2...

[edit] Still waiting for details. Apparently Tepco are holding a press conference but don't seem to know what happened either.
@Paqman: I worry about damage to the inner containment because this morning I saw a huge box made of metre thick, missile grade concrete and steel get launched hundreds of metres into the sky!
On second thoughts those photos Quadunit404 posted don't make those buildings look like they are made of much concrete, if any. So I don't know.

I'm not sure anyone as any control of it anymore.

YesWeCan
March 15th, 2011, 03:13 AM
Good grief. Reactor #4 is now on fire.

400mSv near #3

NightwishFan
March 15th, 2011, 03:23 AM
This is a terrible tragedy. :(

Canime
March 15th, 2011, 05:56 AM
Its a real disaster for the people of Sendai and also those affected by the activity at the nuclear reactor. Such a powerful and destructive earthquake and tsunami, it is a shame for those people and families that lost their lives. I hope that the reactor cools and there will be no serious fallout or meltdown at the power station.

YesWeCan
March 15th, 2011, 05:06 PM
The situation at Fukushima Dai-ichi looks a little more under control today. :)
The brave plant workers deserve a medal, as do all those who have taken huge personal risks to avert disaster for others.

YesWeCan
March 15th, 2011, 11:08 PM
Spoke too soon. #4 on fire again.

Cracklepop
March 16th, 2011, 10:49 AM
It will be interesting to see the effect this has on future nuclear fission reactors.

It could see proliferation of reactors like Toshiba's 4S mini-reactors, and/or Thorium MSR reactors. I had no idea modern reactors could be so safe (the Japanese ones in question are a different story: old).

I think I could even see myself living a few 10's of kilometers from a modern reactor...

I have no expertise in this area, but the MSR reactors sound particularly appealing, because as I understand it they can use many radioactive waste products as fuel.

I read a good article on them yesterday, but can't find it now...:(

cprofitt
March 16th, 2011, 05:35 PM
I too hope folks in Japan are ok.

darrenn
March 16th, 2011, 08:22 PM
Thinking about K.Mandla hoping he is alright.

MattressVon
March 16th, 2011, 08:29 PM
I don't know if you guys have seen this but MIT has a really good blog on this:

http://mitnse.com/

Also it seems that a third of the refinery infrastructure has been knocked out in Japan meaning they need fuel, especially for heating and construction vehicles. What ever country you're in, contact your leaders about sending fuel their way.

Rondonjin
March 17th, 2011, 08:51 AM
No idea what's on their minds right now. First the emergency generators for the pumps failed, then the emergency battery power ran out, then they were filling it through a hole in the reactor. This morning SDF helicopters were dropping water on it but they couldn't get low enough for fear of radiation. But that's like trying to put out a fire by p*ss*ng on it! They've given up on that and now they are planning to use water cannon on it! They probably think it's some kind of riot!!! Meanwhile, the water left in the tanks is getting lower, exposing more of the cr*p to the atmosphere and the temperature of the rods is going up. Film now is showing steam coming out of the reactor as the water is boiling away! Looks like they've got it well under control! Not!

Next they'll be calling on all beer drinkers to not use the toilet but to hold it and get up to Fukushima as quickly as possible, stand around the tank and fill it "naturally"
__________________

NightwishFan
March 17th, 2011, 08:57 AM
Well what do you want them to do? Really. What else can they do?

Rondonjin
March 17th, 2011, 09:01 AM
Brit embassy has finally suggested nationals leave the Tokyo area, the French and Germans already did that a few days ago. They also repeat the US advice to be at least 80Km away from Fukushima and not the 30Km suggested by the Japanese govern-bent.

At the same time they're chartering buses to move Brits out of Sendai into Tokyo. Sorry, what was that about leaving Tokyo again? Ah, yes, left hand, right hand!

Me, I'm in Osaka! Having problems because my son's Japanese passport had expired and I didn't know it hadn't been renewed! To get his birth details down from Tokyo will take about a week and then a week for a new passport! Probably easier to get back up to Tokyo, get the birth documents straight away then head to the passport centre. Hopefully, they can issue an emergency travel document! His UK passport is still valid but as he is a Japanese citizen HERE he must leave on his J passport!

Khakilang
March 17th, 2011, 09:02 AM
Well we could just hope and pray that they can contain the radiation before it spread throughout Japan. Whatever they do I am sure they have done their very best.

KiwiNZ
March 17th, 2011, 09:04 AM
No idea what's on their minds right now. First the emergency generators for the pumps failed, then the emergency battery power ran out, then they were filling it through a hole in the reactor. This morning SDF helicopters were dropping water on it but they couldn't get low enough for fear of radiation. But that's like trying to put out a fire by p*ss*ng on it! They've given up on that and now they are planning to use water cannon on it! They probably think it's some kind of riot!!! Meanwhile, the water left in the tanks is getting lower, exposing more of the cr*p to the atmosphere and the temperature of the rods is going up. Film now is showing steam coming out of the reactor as the water is boiling away! Looks like they've got it well under control! Not!

Next they'll be calling on all beer drinkers to not use the toilet but to hold it and get up to Fukushima as quickly as possible, stand around the tank and fill it "naturally"
__________________

I suppose they could sit there and look at it :rolleyes:

inaction is of course vastly superior to what they are trying.

Given that a lot of the infrastructure in the are is destroyed I am surprised they can do what they are doing.

Lucradia
March 17th, 2011, 09:13 AM
It's like trying to advance a line of troops on an enemy they can't see. It's practically impossible. It's commendable; but I think they should leave nature to its course to be quite honest. The situation around Fukushima is deteriorating rapidly. By the time they think they might have it contained, Japan will literally be cut in half. Not that it isn't already from what I've seen in the cautionary map of the zones affected.

I wouldn't be surprised if Google Maps adds a new API feature called "NFZone" where it would be a transparent zone of yellow and black bars with a nuclear Symbol or caution symbol in the area.

Rondonjin
March 17th, 2011, 09:19 AM
The faces of the people on the idiot box are not the ones we should be thanking but the casual "roudousha" who are risking their lives for a day's work to contain the reactors are the ones we should be praising.

KiwiNZ
March 17th, 2011, 09:25 AM
The faces of the people on the idiot box are not the ones we should be thanking but the casual "roudousha" who are risking their lives for a day's work to contain the reactors are the ones we should be praising.

Those doing the relief and rescue work wont be looking for thanks, they will be looking survivors and asking only for help.

NightwishFan
March 17th, 2011, 09:27 AM
Those doing the relief and rescue work wont be looking for thanks, they will be looking survivors and asking only for help.

Real heroes.

KiwiNZ
March 17th, 2011, 09:34 AM
Real heroes.

I don't see myself a hero

sreekan
March 17th, 2011, 12:50 PM
My family friends in japan are also safe

t0p
March 17th, 2011, 01:44 PM
It will be interesting to see the effect this has on future nuclear fission reactors.

It could see proliferation of reactors like Toshiba's 4S mini-reactors, and/or Thorium MSR reactors. I had no idea modern reactors could be so safe (the Japanese ones in question are a different story: old).

I think I could even see myself living a few 10's of kilometers from a modern reactor...

I have no expertise in this area, but the MSR reactors sound particularly appealing, because as I understand it they can use many radioactive waste products as fuel.

I read a good article on them yesterday, but can't find it now...:(

I disagree. People in general won't care that modern MSRs or mini-reactors are "safer" than the older reactors currently threatening Japan. There's always been a perception that nuclear reactors are somehow "dangerous". The current situation will act to validate (in their minds) this link between nuclear power and danger. If anything, the situation will strengthen anti-nuclear feeling. If not in Japan, then certainly in other countries. For instance, the UK government want to build nuclear power stations to help meet CO2 emission reduction targets. But the Japanese experience will lead to people in general opposing new nuclear power stations, and the government will have to look to alternatives: eg. more "green" solutions like wind and tides, or abandoning the emission-reduction targets and continuing with fossil fuel burning power stations.

The facts are often irrelevant in arguments like this. The words "nuclear" and "atomic" have always pressed certain buttons with the public. Japan's tragedies will just keep pressing those buttons.

Cracklepop
March 18th, 2011, 07:32 AM
I disagree. People in general won't care that modern MSRs or mini-reactors are &quot;safer&quot; than the older reactors currently threatening Japan. There's always been a perception that nuclear reactors are somehow &quot;dangerous&quot;. The current situation will act to validate (in their minds) this link between nuclear power and danger. If anything, the situation will strengthen anti-nuclear feeling. If not in Japan, then certainly in other countries. For instance, the UK government want to build nuclear power stations to help meet CO2 emission reduction targets. But the Japanese experience will lead to people in general opposing new nuclear power stations, and the government will have to look to alternatives: eg. more &quot;green&quot; solutions like wind and tides, or abandoning the emission-reduction targets and continuing with fossil fuel burning power stations.

The facts are often irrelevant in arguments like this. The words &quot;nuclear&quot; and &quot;atomic&quot; have always pressed certain buttons with the public. Japan's tragedies will just keep pressing those buttons.

Yes, you could be right, but I hope you're not...;)

I would much rather my energy came from sun, waves and wind than nuclear fission (zero risk is always better than even the tiniest risk), but people have to be realistic: at the moment the most efficient way to get rid of fossil fuel burning power stations is with nuclear.

Modern reactors are incredibly safe, and even these these 40 year old ones took a 8.9 earthquake, *and* a tsunami flooding their cooling generators, to get them to 'just' a level 4 disaster

As with so many, many things, lack of knowledge is the problem. Humans fear what they don't know. A public better educated on nuclear power would be much more likely to accept it than they are now.

Johnsie
March 18th, 2011, 11:03 AM
The whole nuclear thing is overhyped. The risk of significantly dangerous radiation for Tokyo etc is actually very low. That's what all the scientists are saying, but the TV news people are too dumb to understand.

Gerontion
March 18th, 2011, 11:45 AM
I don't think the problem is that TV reporters/editors don't understand - it's that news always has a tendency to sensationalism. But there's also the fact that the nuclear industry, in cahoots with governments everywhere, has hardly been a model of good corporate governance so it's not surprising if, after a week of 'everything's under control' when it's quite clearly fingers-in-dykes stuff, the public doesn't feel reassured.

YesWeCan
March 18th, 2011, 03:17 PM
Never mind the media, this is a really serious situation and as far as I can see it has been getting worse and worse for 7 days.

Getting power back to the plant may get reactors 1 and 2 cooling under control, maybe, but #3 and especially #4 are a nightmare. #4 has its reactor core rods in its spare rods pond (which is exposed to the air) because they had removed them to do maintenance. The pond contains normal fuel rods ans well as so-called "spent" rods (which aren't spent at all). They are having serious problems getting any water into #4 pond. The radiation levels at the gate are 3.3mSv/hr today and I think that is 10x what it was yesterday.

The situation is far from under control and is getting worse. Make no mistake.

mmix
March 18th, 2011, 09:19 PM
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/2011/03/18/2011-03-18_radiation_from_japans_fukushima_daiichi_nuclear _plant_reaches_california_experts.html



Radiation from Japan's Fukushima Daiichi nuclear plant reaches California

sydbat
March 18th, 2011, 09:30 PM
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/2011/03/18/2011-03-18_radiation_from_japans_fukushima_daiichi_nuclear _plant_reaches_california_experts.html
Radiation from Japan's Fukushima Daiichi nuclear plant reaches California The sensationalized misinformation / disinformation spewing from the media and being parroted in this thread is getting out of hand.

The above quote has about as much scientific merit as saying "Radiation from the sun reaches California", but has to be sensationalized to the point of attempting to create panic where none should be.

Y'know, the people of Japan are having a hard enough time dealing with the earthquake and its aftershocks, and the tsunami devastation. We really need to stop making things worse by (unintentionally on our part, more intentionally on the media's part) vilifying the people and country of Japan.

Quadunit404
March 18th, 2011, 09:40 PM
The sensationalized misinformation / disinformation spewing from the media and being parroted in this thread is getting out of hand.

I agree, I mean it's not like the media in this world is terrible. They barely put in any actual news and instead over-sensualize everything. Most recently CNN said that radioactivity was detected on planes in Chicago that were coming in from Japan, but it was quickly discovered the radioactivity actually came from cargo aircraft coming in from Mexico #-o

And it isn't just a problem with US media alone... it's pretty much everywhere you look.

mmix
March 18th, 2011, 10:50 PM
The sensationalized misinformation / disinformation spewing from the media and being parroted in this thread is getting out of hand.

The above quote has about as much scientific merit as saying "Radiation from the sun reaches California", but has to be sensationalized to the point of attempting to create panic where none should be.


no. it is about fact.

mmix
March 18th, 2011, 11:29 PM
NIRS: Fukushima Fact Sheet

http://www.nirs.org/reactorwatch/accidents/Fukushimafactsheet.pdf

https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Nuclear_Information_and_Resource_Service

sydbat
March 18th, 2011, 11:50 PM
NIRS: Fukushima Fact Sheet

http://www.nirs.org/reactorwatch/accidents/Fukushimafactsheet.pdf

https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Nuclear_Information_and_Resource_ServiceLink 1 (nirs.org) is to an anti-nuclear advocacy group who has their own agenda to make things look worse than they are. Therefore, argument is invalid.

Link 2 - goes to aforementioned anti-nuke Wikipedia entry. Twice the argument invalidity.

Therefore, my assertion that there is undue sensationalism surrounding these tragic events is augmented and justified.

mmix
March 19th, 2011, 01:04 AM
different ppl, different see..

https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/1923_Great_Kant%C5%8D_earthquake

Cracklepop
March 19th, 2011, 03:55 AM
Fukashima has been upgraded to a level 5 thanks to the (tiny amounts of) radiation reaching the USA.

mmix
March 19th, 2011, 08:17 PM
The moment nuclear plant chief WEPT as Japanese finally admit that radiation leak is serious enough to kill people
By David Derbyshire
Last updated at 3:54 PM on 19th March 2011

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1367684/Japan-earthquake-tsunami-Fukushima-nulear-plant-radiation-leak-kill-people.html



Radioactive material found in Tokyo water

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/mar/19/japan-radiation-levels-spinach-milk

honeybear
March 19th, 2011, 10:25 PM
They say that the serious generated radioactivity will touch as well Europe and US. So be glad to eat radioactivity in your fish, meat, vegetables... say thanks to nuclear !! (cancer, and rapid death = nuclear in aliments)

honeybear
March 19th, 2011, 10:42 PM
I disagree. People in general won't care that modern MSRs or mini-reactors are "safer" than the older reactors currently threatening Japan. There's always been a perception that nuclear reactors are somehow "dangerous". The current situation will act to validate (in their minds) this link between nuclear power and danger. If anything, the situation will strengthen anti-nuclear feeling. If not in Japan, then certainly in other countries. For instance, the UK government want to build nuclear power stations to help meet CO2 emission reduction targets. But the Japanese experience will lead to people in general opposing new nuclear power stations, and the government will have to look to alternatives: eg. more "green" solutions like wind and tides, or abandoning the emission-reduction targets and continuing with fossil fuel burning power stations.

The facts are often irrelevant in arguments like this. The words "nuclear" and "atomic" have always pressed certain buttons with the public. Japan's tragedies will just keep pressing those buttons.

what do politicians is a shame. They want to meet CO2, then involve humans in the extinction of the humanity: voting for nuclear energy. Man, damn, why they simply do not build huge solar and wind plants!! Everybody want that. It costs a lot, produce nothing or low energy, but at least it will not eradicate the humans and life on earth.

Just for money, politicians will continue choosing nuclear. They should really care about their citizens, and really care about humanity. There is not only business or votes to keep the position, or better today's life, but they shall think about the future of all species on earth.

ikt
March 19th, 2011, 11:04 PM
what do politicians is a shame. They want to meet CO2, then involve humans in the extinction of the humanity: voting for nuclear energy. Man, damn, why they simply do not build huge solar and wind plants!! Everybody want that. It costs a lot, produce nothing or low energy, but at least it will not eradicate the humans and life on earth.

You think accidents don't happen while making wind turbines and solar pv panels?

Not to mention your "but at least it will not eradicate the humans and life on earth." is pretty sensational, you'd think the people in the reactor right now would be dying...


Six workers at a quake-stricken nuclear power plant have been exposed to high levels of radiation but are continuing working there, an official at the Tokyo Electric Power Co (TEPCO) said.

They have been exposed to more than 100 millisieverts of radiation.

"There has been no adverse effect on their health," TEPCO's Takeo Iwamoto said. It was not immediately known if they had been reassigned to different tasks.

honeybear
March 20th, 2011, 12:08 AM
You think accidents don't happen while making wind turbines and solar pv panels?

Not to mention your "but at least it will not eradicate the humans and life on earth." is pretty sensational, you'd think the people in the reactor right now would be dying...

100 mSv is like 4x regular computer tomography.... so tell me?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/X-ray_computed_tomography
no one really do care about radiations. Surely. X-ray_computed_tomography are too highly dangerous and everyone continue using such devices nowadays...

The first signs they will observe, the engineers that went close to the risk zones, will be: periodontitis. It will starts with that ... then other issues come. But no one talk about it, because otherwise it is money and important issues. If people would know everything, everyone would be in the street to complain about the system; what governments tolerate and allow. - Look: smoking is not prohibited, since it allow country to get some money with taxes.

- No one really want to talk about what the system does allow. All is about money, unfortunately.

I pray for them.

Rondonjin
March 21st, 2011, 08:56 AM
Things may slowly be improving:


Electricity returns to some Fukushima reactors

http://english.kyodonews.jp/news/2011/03/79854.html

But I believe since that article was written, the remaining reactors have been hooked up.

Still too early for celebration though!

mmix
March 21st, 2011, 08:08 PM
http://www.prisonplanet.com/fukusima-radiation-levels-being-covered-up.html

http://www.zerohedge.com/article/radioactive-cesium-content-japan-sea-water-25-times-limit-radioactive-iodine-127-times-maxim?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+zerohedge%2Ffeed+%28zero+hedg e+-+on+a+long+enough+timeline%2C+the+survival+rate+fo r+everyone+drops+to+zero%29



Kyodo has also reported that radioactive cesium found in sea water is 24.8 times over the safety limit and that radioactive Iodine found in sea water is 126.7 times over the limit.

honeybear
March 22nd, 2011, 08:16 PM
They have been exposed to more than 100 millisieverts of radiation, an official at the Tokyo Electric Power Co. said, adding he had no information on what tasks they were assigned to.

http://www.businesslive.co.za/Feeds/sapa/2011/03/19/six-workers-exposed-to-high-radiation-at-japan-plant


I saw that 100 mSv is equivalent to have a risk of 10% of cancer.
It is linear, a value of 200 mSv is equivalent to 20%. I hope the best and pray for the population.

Quadunit404
March 22nd, 2011, 08:40 PM
The radiation from Fukushima has reportedly reached the US, but since it was so diluted by the natural elements in the air it's barely strong enough to affect someone negatively, even just a little.

In Japan, radiation has been found in some food and water. Wonderful.

cmay
March 22nd, 2011, 08:48 PM
for those of you interested there is a compilation CD out that supports the victims. you can see the project here and download to support.
http://www.punk4japan.com/


the compilation was done as online album only to keep cost down so that ALL money that the album makes are donated to the red cross to help. no one of the bands will see any money for anything as they just donated right to use the material to help the victims of japan.

this is a punk album. its interesting enough to buy just to get to know a lot of new bands and artist from around the world and by buying this you support a really good cause. so please buy it .

anyway. I really dont use the forums anymore and though to myself since I still have my password and account
I might as well post this here too. its not to spam the forums. I really do hope that by posting this
just one will buy the album to support the punk4japan project.

I hope this is alright with the moderation team here :) .
else just close the account right away I really never use it anymore and doubt I will again,. as said it was just to hopefully
do something for the helping the people in japan anyway I can.

Cracklepop
March 23rd, 2011, 03:51 AM
http://www.businesslive.co.za/Feeds/sapa/2011/03/19/six-workers-exposed-to-high-radiation-at-japan-plant


I saw that 100 mSv is equivalent to have a risk of 10% of cancer.
It is linear, a value of 200 mSv is equivalent to 20%. I hope the best and pray for the population.

It's not that simple. The harm from radiation increases as the period in which it was delivered decreases.

I don't have a figure to correct your 10%, but as we all have around a 50% chance of cancer anyway, I would be hesitant to take it as fact without a reputable source.

I read somewhere (I wish I could find it) a claim that very small amounts of radiation could be beneficial, because the breakdown of molecules was encouraging more regeneration. But I guess that's not much help to someone with cancer...

cmay
March 23rd, 2011, 08:22 PM
this disaster is plain and simply awful. I wish I could do more to help than I already did. also there is worldwide focus on this right now and the whole discussion on nuclear plants has always been just as relevant as now. I remember the whole tjernobyl and nucklear fear from the 80ties when I was a kid. I made my mind up back then about what I feel about these things. the next generations have Japan to remember. sadly.

Doctor Mike
March 23rd, 2011, 08:42 PM
For much more detailed information on what's going on:

http://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=480200

DZ*
March 23rd, 2011, 09:11 PM
I saw that 100 mSv is equivalent to have a risk of 10% of cancer. It is linear, a value of 200 mSv is equivalent to 20%. I hope the best and pray for the population.

You've misinterpreted what it means. Here is the 10% figure: http://www.bmj.com/content/331/7508/77.full (search the text for "1.10").

It refers to the 10% increase in relative risk. For example, if the absolute risk of a certain cancer without radiation exposure is 1 in 10000, then 10% increase means that after radiation exposure of 100 mSv the risk becomes 1.1 in 10000.

In other words, the risk for an individual who was exposed to 100 mSv radiation is 1.1 in 10000.

Paqman
March 23rd, 2011, 09:53 PM
In other words, the risk for an individual who was exposed to 100 mSv radiation is 1.1 in 10000.

That's a pretty minuscule increase, and only one worker at the plant has been exposed to that much. Sounds like the whole thing is a bit of a storm in a teacup, really.

mmix
March 23rd, 2011, 10:30 PM
http://www.foxnews.com/world/2011/03/23/fukushima-fallout-reaches-europe-traces-tiny/



Fukushima fallout reaches Europe

Quadunit404
March 23rd, 2011, 11:43 PM
http://www.foxnews.com/world/2011/03/23/fukushima-fallout-reaches-europe-traces-tiny/


http://www.foxnews.com/


http://www.foxnews.com/


http://www.foxnews.com/


http://www.foxnews.com/


http://www.foxnews.com/

Faux News? Really? They're probably the last news source I'd trust relating to this disaster, considering how they love exaggerating everything and stretching the truth so much.

mmix
March 24th, 2011, 01:39 PM
http://www.sify.com/news/russia-halts-food-imports-from-japan-news-international-ldyr4fibadf.html



Russia halts food imports from Japan

honeybear
March 25th, 2011, 02:59 AM
http://www.sify.com/news/russia-halts-food-imports-from-japan-news-international-ldyr4fibadf.html

Geiger Counters & Radiation Detectors out of order. Rapid Massive demand...

mmix
March 25th, 2011, 08:44 PM
the earth is round, if the leak continues, it will accumulate.


http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn20285-fukushima-radioactive-fallout-nears-chernobyl-levels.html

http://www.sbs.com.au/news/article/1507216/Fukushima-radioactive-fallout-nears-Chernobyl-levels-

http://slashdot.org/story/11/03/25/0025219/Fukushima-Radioactive-Fallout-Nears-Chernobyl-Levels?from=rss




Fukushima radioactive fallout nears Chernobyl levels

mmix
March 25th, 2011, 10:36 PM
http://sankei.jp.msn.com/affairs/news/110325/dst11032519400078-n1.htm



Radioactive cesium-137 in Tokyo fell to the Fukushima No. 1 nuclear power plant accident, the rainfall reached a maximum 21 - 22 days, reached nearly three times the amount in one year fell within the atmospheric nuclear test ever made be found.

Deputy Director of the Institute of Radiological Sciences Itikawa Ryou yuan assets (environmental radioactivity) and the article, published data comparing the Ministry of Education. Ichikawa's "cooled fast reactor, let me calm down," he said.

According to Mr. Ichikawa of radioactive fallout cesium-137 was confirmed in 1963 in Tokyo, 52 millicurie per square kilometer per year. Equivalent to 1924 per square kilometer megabecquerel.

According to the ministry, after the 18th of this month, as the fallout cesium-137 was detected in Tokyo, at 9:00 am at the maximum was 21 per 24 hours at 9:00 am on October 22 5300 megabecquerel, a 38-year had doubled to about 2.8 years. Megabecquerel since decreased to less than 400 the next day.

DZ*
March 25th, 2011, 10:47 PM
the earth is round, if the leak continues, it will accumulate.

But it would accumulate even more if the earth was concave.

mmix
March 25th, 2011, 10:50 PM
But it would accumulate even more if the earth was concave.

round coz gravity, concave is close to zero gravity.

mmix
March 26th, 2011, 02:09 AM
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-03-22/nuclear-plant-s-fuel-rods-damaged-leaking-into-sea-tokyo-electric-says.html



Reactor Core May Be Breached at Damaged Fukushima Plant


https://earththreats.com/2011/03/water-radiation-10000-times-above-normal/



Water radiation 10,000 times above normal

DZ*
March 26th, 2011, 06:10 AM
round coz gravity, concave is close to zero gravity.

but if we had concave earth with lots of gravity that would sure accumulate lots of radiation.

BTW, I think you confuse ubuntuforums.org with twitter.

How about this: Why Fukushima made me stop worrying and love nuclear power
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/mar/21/pro-nuclear-japan-fukushima

mmix
March 26th, 2011, 12:15 PM
but if we had concave earth with lots of gravity that would sure accumulate lots of radiation.


water on round object(orb), flow, circle, cloud, rain.. idea?

mmix
March 26th, 2011, 12:31 PM
http://ecocentric.blogs.time.com/2011/03/25/fukushima-sick-workers-and-cracked-vessels-whats-true/



• Many outside experts have begun openly criticizing both TEPCO and the Japenese government for the lack of transparency and reliable information about the Fukushima crisis. It's an admittedly frenzied and difficult time for TEPCO and Japanese nuclear safety officials, but it's also difficult to disagree with the sentiment of Najmedin Meshkati, a USC engineering professor who has advised U.S. agencies on nuclear safety issues; he told the LA Times, "Information sharing has not been in the culture of Tepco or the Japanese government. This issue is larger than one utility and one country. It is an international crisis."

mmix
March 27th, 2011, 01:21 AM
http://search.japantimes.co.jp/cgi-bin/nn20110327a1.html



The level of radioactive iodine detected in seawater near the Fukushima No. 1 nuclear power plant was 1,250 times above the maximum level allowable, the Nuclear and Industrial Safety Agency said Saturday, suggesting contamination from the reactors is spreading.

mmix
March 27th, 2011, 02:09 AM
http://www.nishinippon.co.jp/nnp/item/233873



Chernobyl nuclear accident occurred in the former Soviet Union in 1986, 25 Russian scientists, Dr. Alexei Yablokov are investigating the environmental impact of people and a press conference in Washington, a nuclear accident situation of strong Hukushima expressed concern. Dr. summary statement is as follows.

Fallout of the Chernobyl accident but a total of about 50 million curie, the first nuclear power plant in Fukushima Curie much less two million so far to my knowledge. Chernobyl nuclear fuel burning continued for several days with the explosion in such a situation is rather different situation Fukushima clear.

However, the first located in densely populated Hashi Hukushima from Chernobyl, there is a huge metropolitan area population of 30 million people a distance of 200 km. In addition, the Unit 3 of the Fukushima No. 1 uranium-plutonium mixed oxide (MOX) fuel using plutonium-thermal power generation is. If it comes to things that are emitted in large quantities of plutonium from here, you cause very serious damage. Removal is impossible, people are born inhabitable. Are very concerned about it.

Estimation of the final death toll of the Chernobyl accident, International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) is "up to 9,000," but for that ridiculous. My research will be close to 100 million people, the effects of radiation spans seven generations.

Such as cesium and plutonium get into the soil by 1-3 cm a year, it sucked up the roots of food to release back into the atmosphere. For example, elk in Sweden last year from Chernobyl-affected, the amount of radioactive material was discovered 20 years ago, the same level. Should know these facts.

The Japanese government has underestimated the damage to the people of radioactivity. "Health is not immediately affected," say that is wrong. In the immediate, but that there is because it is affected.

luceerose
March 27th, 2011, 02:50 AM
I don't mean to sound insensitive, but I'm hoping this won't affect Nintendo.

areteichi
March 27th, 2011, 04:39 AM
In case anyone is interested in seeing the most recent catastrophe in light of more general problems Japan has been going through in the past couple decades:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hUjLCzvbUpQ

Just to correct the narrator, it should be pronounced 'hikikOmori (ひきこもり)' and not 'hikikImori'.

mmix
March 27th, 2011, 04:44 AM
http://www3.nhk.or.jp/news/html/20110327/t10014927701000.html



Nuclear power plant Fukushima Daiichi continues to be a serious condition, the pool of building the turbine of Unit 2, it was detected radioactive material high concentrations of times that about 10 million water reactors in operation I understand. This is the first unit at approximately 1000 times the concentration found in the No. 3, TEPCO and try radioactive material leaked from the reactor, flowed out in a hurry to identify the route.

The primary Fukushima Daiichi May 24, the exposure has three workers in the basement of a building is turbine of Unit 3, compared with water in the reactor during operation of the water in the field of radioactive concentration times the approximately 10,000 substance was detected. Then, we found similar levels of radioactive material from a pool of Unit. Therefore, TEPCO was caused by the earthquake, the building was also investigated in a puddle of Unit 2 were made during the same operation, 1cc and 2.9 billion becquerels per Unit 1, Unit 3, about 1000, during the operation is that radioactive material was detected with high concentrations of about 10 million times that of water reactors. This includes 1cc at a concentration of per Becquerel 2.9 billion in 134 iodine ▽ radioactive Both Becquerel 13 million iodine-131 ▽, and Becquerel 2.3 million with 137 Cs and 134 Cs ▽, when nuclear fission in a nuclear reactor radioactive material was included in the encounter. TEPCO Unit 1, damage to fuel nuclear reactors at No. 2 as the No. 3, in some way, try and poured water containing radioactive material, we decided to rush to identify the route water runoff . In contrast, primary Fukushima Daiichi, in order to prevent a poor flow of water built up salts by using seawater for cooling, fresh water from sea water is poured into the reactor of Unit 3 from Unit 1 by day 26 was switched, TEPCO, from as early as 27 well spent fuel pool at Unit 4 from Unit 2 is scheduled to begin an injection of fresh water.

honeybear
March 27th, 2011, 07:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by http://translate.google.com/
Nuclear power plant Fukushima Daiichi continues to be a serious condition, the pool of building the turbine of Unit 2, it was detected radioactive material high concentrations of times that about 10 million water reactors in operation I understand. This is the first unit at approximately 1000 times the concentration found in the No. 3, TEPCO and try radioactive material leaked from the reactor, flowed out in a hurry to identify the route.

The primary Fukushima Daiichi May 24, the exposure has three workers in the basement of a building is turbine of Unit 3, compared with water in the reactor during operation of the water in the field of radioactive concentration times the approximately 10,000 substance was detected. Then, we found similar levels of radioactive material from a pool of Unit. Therefore, TEPCO was caused by the earthquake, the building was also investigated in a puddle of Unit 2 were made during the same operation, 1cc and 2.9 billion becquerels per Unit 1, Unit 3, about 1000, during the operation is that radioactive material was detected with high concentrations of about 10 million times that of water reactors. This includes 1cc at a concentration of per Becquerel 2.9 billion in 134 iodine ▽ radioactive Both Becquerel 13 million iodine-131 ▽, and Becquerel 2.3 million with 137 Cs and 134 Cs ▽, when nuclear fission in a nuclear reactor radioactive material was included in the encounter. TEPCO Unit 1, damage to fuel nuclear reactors at No. 2 as the No. 3, in some way, try and poured water containing radioactive material, we decided to rush to identify the route water runoff . In contrast, primary Fukushima Daiichi, in order to prevent a poor flow of water built up salts by using seawater for cooling, fresh water from sea water is poured into the reactor of Unit 3 from Unit 1 by day 26 was switched, TEPCO, from as early as 27 well spent fuel pool at Unit 4 from Unit 2 is scheduled to begin an injection of fresh water.

Do you think that it can menace the sea, as well, for the whole pacific? The big bang of human could be eventually menaced if it continues.

What do US, cannot they use their super - ships or submarines to arrive fast and give assistance to eradicate the issues with the reactor? The longer it takes, the even worst it will be...
US help !

NightwishFan
March 27th, 2011, 07:12 PM
Do you think that it can menace the sea, as well, for the whole pacific?

The radiation has a half-life of only 8 days so soon after that it should not be dangerous.

honeybear
March 27th, 2011, 08:15 PM
The radiation has a half-life of only 8 days so soon after that it should not be dangerous.

are you really sure, cuz the half life is usually some 100 years, no?

NightwishFan
March 27th, 2011, 08:38 PM
are you really sure, cuz the half life is usually some 100 years, no?

This is what is leaked I believe:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iodine-131

mmix
March 27th, 2011, 11:47 PM
http://www.blindbatnews.com/2011/03/bill-nye-is-right-tokyo-electric-now-checking-for-plutonium-now/2036



TEPCO has not been able to detect plutonium

Cracklepop
March 27th, 2011, 11:54 PM
This is what is leaked I believe:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iodine-131

There's also caesium 137, with a half life of around 30 years.

mmix
March 28th, 2011, 09:15 PM
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=10715613



Traces of plutonium found near reactor


http://www.voanews.com/english/news/asia/Radioactive-Plutonium-Found-in-Soil-Around-Damaged-Japanese-Nuclear-Plant-118779069.html



Radioactive Plutonium Found in Soil Around Damaged Japanese Nuclear Plant

KiwiNZ
March 28th, 2011, 10:28 PM
Remember this is not just about facts and figures and is the level this or that. What really matters here is the terrible human tragedy that has occurred. The dreadful loss of life and suffering, the suffering that wont end just because the press has become bored with the event. The suffering that will go on for years. That is what really matters.:(

jwcalla
March 28th, 2011, 10:34 PM
Remember this is not just about facts and figures and is the level this or that. What really matters here is the terrible human tragedy that has occurred. The dreadful loss of life and suffering, the suffering that wont end just because the press has become bored with the event. The suffering that will go on for years. That is what really matters.:(

I've been streaming NHK almost non-stop since the earthquake and they've had a lot of the human stories interspersed with the news. They are very difficult to watch -- but necessary.

Rondonjin
March 29th, 2011, 06:12 AM
A lot of good links and info here:

http://www.google.co.jp/intl/en/crisisresponse/japanquake2011.html

http://english.kyodonews.jp/news/japan_nuclear_crisis/

mmix
March 29th, 2011, 07:24 PM
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1371236/Poison-particles-nuke-plant-AT-LEAST-12-U-S-states-Japan-maximum-radiation-alert.html



Poison particles from nuke plant found in AT LEAST 12 U.S. states as Japan is put on 'maximum' radiation alert

The Environment Protection Agency confirmed that radiation was found in air filters in Alabama and in rainwater in Pennsylvania and Massachusetts.


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1370682/Japan-nuclear-crisis-Mothers-flee-Fukushima-leak-radiation-alert.html



Radiation from the Fukushima leak has been detected across Britain, it was confirmed today as Japan was put on 'maximum' alert.

The Health Protection Agency revealed that radioactive iodine had already been discovered 5,500 miles from the stricken plant in Oxfordshire and Glasgow.


http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2011/mar/29/fukushima-raditation-found-across-uk



The readings peaked at 300 micro-becquerels per cubic metre but averaged at a barely detectable 11 micro-becquerels over that nine-day period - readings similar to findings by monitoring stations in Switzerland and Germany.

honeybear
March 31st, 2011, 09:58 PM
Finally, U.S. arrives. Luckily they are there. They could saved several times important issues. I am really glad, that they will soon arrive, because it is really alarming that daily it remains so bad ...

http://english.kyodonews.jp/news/2011/03/82318.html

U.S. military radiation control team to arrive in Japan soon

TOKYO, March 31, Kyodo

A 140-member U.S. military radiation control team will arrive in Japan soon to help deal with the nuclear crisis, the top uniformed officer of Japan said Thursday.

Japanese authorities and the plant's operator, Tokyo Electric Power Co., have been battling to bring the reactors at the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power plant under control since their cooling systems were knocked out by the March 11 earthquake and tsunami.

Gen. Ryoichi Oriki, chief of staff of the Self-Defense Forces' Joint Staff, said at a news conference that the unit specializes in monitoring radioactive materials, decontamination and medical treatment.

Nuclear radiations are now gaining all over the world, touching U.S., Europe, and other continents... :(

Fast guys, and may all wishes of earth sent you, to save the world !



Remember this is not just about facts and figures and is the level this or that. What really matters here is the terrible human tragedy that has occurred. The dreadful loss of life and suffering, the suffering that wont end just because the press has become bored with the event. The suffering that will go on for years. That is what really matters.:(

However I think that it will be for the next 25 years or 50 years, at least... so guys, you do not imagine how long will suffer humans of this thing... Iodine levels in bodies, or even in food travelling all over the world, will/can have humanity related dramatic proportions... And nothing about it will never help it because medicine today's skills/progresses are not really highly advanced and modern. Usually, you have pain somewhere, they cant fix it, they simply cut or send the people to ease the last days. That's pity but medicine has still lot of progresses to be made, in comparison with physics, mathematics, or other fields.


I do not believe what is said here. This is not right: "Any radiation below 100 millisieverts (mSv) is regarded as harmless, while any dose above 1,000 mSv can cause radiation sickness." from


SO WHAT ARE THE RISKS?

Experts say the levels of Fukushima radiation in Britain are far too small to pose a health threat.

And they are dwarfed by the background radiation that seeps out of rocks, soil and the sky 24 hours a day.

Any radiation below 100 millisieverts (mSv) is regarded as harmless, while any dose above 1,000 mSv can cause radiation sickness.

A typical Briton is exposed to 2.5 mSv every year from natural radiation in the environment. Fukushima radiation detected over the UK is between one 10,000th and one millionth of that level.

Nuclear physicist Paul Norman at Birmingham University estimated that a banana milkshake was more radioactive than a cubic metre of air in Oxfordshire yesterday.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1370682/Japan-nuclear-crisis-Radioactive-particles-detected-OXFORDSHIRE.html#ixzz1IDIsS1hY

Because 100-200 mSv is a limit for a lifetime to receive. So they just write this not to alarm people.
Please check here the values, 10-30 mSv are already dangerous (moderate)
http://www.radiologyinfo.org/en/safety/index.cfm?pg=sfty_xray

Is 2011, the earlier year predicted by Nostradamus (he calculated 2012) ?

DZ*
March 31st, 2011, 10:24 PM
you do not imagine how long will suffer humans of this thing... Iodine levels in bodies, or even in food travelling all over the world, will/can have humanity related dramatic proportions [...]

100-200 mSv is a limit for a lifetime to receive

How do you come up with this stuff? People get 100 mSv of plutonium radiation from less than 10 years of smoking. Not that I'm saying it's a good idea, but come on.

"The average dose received by all of us from background radiation is around 2.4 mSv/yr, which can vary depending on the geology and altitude where people live – ranging between 1 and 10 mSv/yr, but can be more than 50 mSv/yr. The highest known level of background radiation affecting a substantial population is in Kerala and Madras states in India where some 140,000 people receive doses which average over 15 millisievert per year from gamma radiation, in addition to a similar dose from radon. Comparable levels occur in Brazil and Sudan, with average exposures up to about 40 mSv/yr to many people.

Several places are known in Iran, India and Europe where natural background radiation gives an annual dose of more than 50 mSv and up to 260 mSv (at Ramsar in Iran)."

http://www.world-nuclear.org/info/inf05.html

Eqi
April 1st, 2011, 05:31 AM
My mom is going to Tokyo.

I HOPE SHE BUYS MANGA.

mmix
April 1st, 2011, 08:21 PM
http://www.seattlepi.com/local/6420ap_wa_japan_earthquake_milk.html



Radioactive milk could have come from across state



http://www.dailycal.org/article/112565/radioactive_traces_are_miniscule_team_finds



In the two weeks since they converted a laboratory in the basement of Etcheverry into a full-time radiation-testing center, the team has found within their samples the isotopes of iodine-131, tellurium-132, cesium-134 and cesium-137 - the same isotopes released from Japan's nuclear plants. Both iodine-131 and tellurium-132 have very short half-lives, meaning they fully decay and disappear in a matter of days.

Though both cesium-134 and cesium-137 levels increased slightly in recent days

reyfer
April 1st, 2011, 10:02 PM
The 311 Love Beyond Borders concert in Hong Kong raised over US$3 million dollars for the victims of Japan's earthquake/tsunami. More than 170 performers entertained an audience of 10,000 in Hong Kong's Victoria Park on the evening of April 1.

Concert was organized by Jackie Chan

http://jackiechan.com/news/1203257--311-Love-Beyond-Borders-Concert-in-Hong-Kong

mmix
April 2nd, 2011, 03:18 AM
http://news.xinhuanet.com/english2010/china/2011-04/01/c_13809565.htm



Low levels of radioactive iodine detected across Chinese mainland


http://connect.in.com/nasa-full-form/article-japan-fukushima-nuclear-plants-radiation-reaches-china-1eef1b3cc88b41b3cd4a35c31aee3b2acc72c747.html



The Chinese Ministry of Environmental Protection has confirmed the low levels of radiation being leaked into its densely populated eastern region.

mmix
April 4th, 2011, 10:50 PM
http://www.pjstar.com/news_free/x230253791/Workers-at-Japan-nuke-plant-pump-radioactive-water-into-sea



Workers began pumping more than 3 million gallons of contaminated water from Japan's tsunami-ravaged nuclear plant into the Pacific Ocean on Monday


https://foodfreedom.wordpress.com/2011/04/04/eu-secretly-ups-cesium-safety-level-in-food-20-fold/



EU secretly ups cesium safety level in food 20-fold

sydbat
April 4th, 2011, 11:02 PM
Every post I make = FUD designed to make the Japanese people ashamed of a natural disaster and to promote a fringe agenda.Please stop it.

You are minimizing a real tragedy. Plus, you are annoying those of us with legitimate scientific backgrounds with the garbage you keep posting that contains very little, if any, fact.

Paqman
April 4th, 2011, 11:05 PM
Please stop it.

You are minimizing a real tragedy. Plus, you are annoying those of us with legitimate scientific backgrounds with the garbage you keep posting that contains very little, if any, fact.

This.

Posting all these links is not contributing to any discussion. This thread is dead and should be locked.

honeybear
April 4th, 2011, 11:49 PM
This.

Posting all these links is not contributing to any discussion. This thread is dead and should be locked.

I do not think so at all. Those links are very interesting and keep the status on the japan story. He picked up really important information that are not mentioned on TV.

In addition it is difficult to say something because the topic is so important, and it is an hopeless situation that we all wish it goes better.

Thanks for posting

NightwishFan
April 5th, 2011, 01:42 AM
I posted this thread so that I could raise awareness of the disaster to folks that might not have known. Also a place where we can share respect for the tragedy and perhaps find ways to assist.

If the thread is going to go down the path to make light of this event, I will ask to have it locked.

honeybear
April 5th, 2011, 09:22 AM
I posted this thread so that I could raise awareness of the disaster to folks that might not have known. Also a place where we can share respect for the tragedy and perhaps find ways to assist.

If the thread is going to go down the path to make light of this event, I will ask to have it locked.

I think that it is nice to have a gate into this forum to talk about this tragedy. Everyone's post is welcome, and we also are bound to understanding.

I pray for the victims.

honeybear
April 5th, 2011, 12:20 PM
Another thing:

- What are the dangerous substances that one shall control + with which detektor??



Kalium + kalium detektor (device?, Unit?, health risks?)
iodium + kalium detektor (device?, Unit?, health risks?)
radiations X + geiger in mSv (device?, Unit?, health risks?)
...

Is there a specialist there that could make a short nice table into this thread?? thanks a lot

mmix
April 5th, 2011, 06:59 PM
Please stop it.


no this is very important information than your post.
http://www.epa.gov/japan2011/docs/rert/RadNet-Precipitation-Data-Public-Release-FINAL.pdf


http://blogs.forbes.com/jeffmcmahon/2011/04/05/first-u-s-drinking-water-samples-show-radiation-from-japan-boise-richland-wa/?utm_source=allactivity&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=20110405



First U.S. Drinking Water Samples Show Radiation from Japan: Boise, Richland Wa.


http://blogs.knoxnews.com/munger/2011/04/fukushima-fallout-arrives-in-o.html#more



The first evidence of Fukushima fallout in Oak Ridge has been confirmed, with radioactive I-131 measured in precipitation at three sampling sites, according to information posted on the Environmental Protection Agency's RadNet site.

mmix
April 5th, 2011, 07:08 PM
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/apr/05/fukushima-radioactivity-above-legal-limit



Fukushima radioactivity hit 7.5m times legal limit

KiwiNZ
April 5th, 2011, 07:23 PM
OK MMIX you have had your share of hijacking this thread. Stop it .

NightwishFan
April 5th, 2011, 07:28 PM
Edited.

honeybear
April 5th, 2011, 07:38 PM
OK MMIX you have had your share of hijacking this thread. Stop it .

come on, why? the guy mmix posts amazingly interesting information.
I mean water polluted in US by possible JP outcome... that's really new. He brings information faster than CNN even ;)

KiwiNZ
April 5th, 2011, 07:44 PM
The intent of this thread was to respect those lost in this dreadful tragedy and not to focus page after page on the radiation levels etc, that is hijacking.

honeybear
April 5th, 2011, 07:55 PM
The intent of this thread was to respect those lost in this dreadful tragedy and not to focus page after page on the radiation levels etc, that is hijacking.

- well, I do agree with you, you are right, but this only in some extent. I am not sure that it is fair, anyhow, to close the thread just because he posts too much and not so close to the thread in question. Maybe it would be fair to ask the first author of the thread...

The author of the thread is not you, but the author is : NightwishFan.

He should decide, and that s certainly the wiser choice and most fair choice. The author is NightwishFan, and his wish is the only one that has to be followed.

It is like anythign published. The responsible is always the first author. Think about it.

You are just moderating, and can try to help the forum... however authors are authors....that's my vision, however you would interfere in the threads...

edit:
tada: found: here is the magical reply.

I posted this thread so that I could raise awareness of the disaster to folks that might not have known. Also a place where we can share respect for the tragedy and perhaps find ways to assist.

If the thread is going to go down the path to make light of this event, I will ask to have it locked.


But could you kick some users from a thread instead of locking it? locking a thread is not good because it avoid all other users to continue posting. Please an update of the website forum rules, to allow kick some X users from a given thread .

NightwishFan
April 5th, 2011, 08:39 PM
As I said, as long as the discussion does not make light of the disaster I do not mind what is discussed. I am not a moderator so I have no decision about what others post. It was not the intention of the thread to be a discussion about the science of it endlessly. Or even so much the nuclear disaster, but the tsunami and earthquake. Which needs awareness and support.