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hpng
November 26th, 2010, 08:32 AM
I want to install Ubuntu 64 on my HP laptop.
It already has 4 primary (OEM) partitions:


Here it is:


Partitions on one and only HP laptop disk drive (DISK O):
Volume Layout Type File System Status Capacity Free Space % Free
(C:) Simple Basic NTFS Primary Partition 445.34 GB 403.53 GB 91
HP_TOOLS Simple Basic FAT32 Primary Partition 99 MB 92 GB 93
Recovery (D:) Simple Basic NTFS Primary Partition 20.12 GB 2.93 GB 15
System Simple Basic NTFS Primary Partition 199 MB 165 MB 83




As I understand it, I can only have a max of 4 primary partitions per disk drive.
I do not want to delete any OEM partition because they are critical to laptop recovery.


During Ubuntu 64 install, it gave me two choices:


Erase the entire disk, and 2) manual partioning.:



Since I already have a max of 4 primary partitions, so I cannot create any new partition.
This is the point where I have to abandon my install... because as I understand it, Kinux needs to reside in primary partition, and I do not have a new one for it.
Except for the C: partition, the other OEM ( factory) partitions are quite small.
Ouch!


NOTE: Someone mentioned I use Wubi to install. But I peek at the contents of Ubuntu AMD64 iso file and it already has Wubi.exe in it. So I assume Wubi ran when I start Ubuntu64 install.




Please advice.
I am a Linux newbie.


How do I get this forum to send me email when someone respond to my posting?



Thanks,
HP

conradin
November 26th, 2010, 08:54 AM
Heres a good explanation of why you cant have more than 4 primary partitions. What you will need is to use logical partitions.
http://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/linux-general-1/creating-more-than-4-primary-partitions-376698/

sikander3786
November 26th, 2010, 08:59 AM
Ubuntu doesn't need a primary partition. It can boot from an Extended/Logical partition as well. So what you need to do is choose manual partitioning and then create an Extended partition and inside that, I would recommend to create 3 Logical partitions. Remember, Extended Partition itself is a primary partition so you definitely need to delete one of your Primary Partitions to do that ;-)

1. Ubuntu partition, Mount point /, FS ext4 size > 8 GB

2. /home partition, Mount Point /home, FS ext4, size = custom as this is the partition you will be storing your personal files and settings to. The more the size, the comfortable you are.

3. Swap partition, size = RAM x 2.

Remember, /home is not absoulutely necessary and you can do well with only 2 partitions. /home is recommended in the sense that in case of a re-install, you don't lose your personal files and settings.

Wubi is intended for testing purposes only and it is a bit slower, bit problematic and has issues with some updates. So a proper dual-boot is the way to go.

Prior to installing Ubuntu, boot into a Live CD, test all your hardware with that and from Applications > Accessories > Terminal, post the output of this command.


sudo fdisk -lu

It would tell us more about your current partition setup.

hpng
November 26th, 2010, 09:37 AM
:Thanks.

Here is my current hard drive setup:


Partitions on one and only HP laptop disk drive (DISK O):
Volume Layout Type File System Status Capacity Free Space % Free
-(C :) Simple Basic NTFS Primary Partition 445.34 GB 403.53 GB 91
-HP_TOOLS Simple Basic FAT32 Primary Partition 99 MB 92 GB 93
-Recovery (D :) Simple Basic NTFS Primary Partition 20.12 GB 2.93 GB 15
-System Simple Basic NTFS Primary Partition 199 MB 165 MB 83


As I mentioned before and shown above, I already have 4 primary partitions on the disk.
So, how do I create an extended partition on this drive in addition to leaving the above 4 primary partition alone?
I am ok with shrinking the C: drive above since it has a lot of space.

wilee-nilee
November 26th, 2010, 10:07 AM
If you can't remove one of the partitions install with wubi just burn a cd of it and open it from computer in admin and install. A extended will only work with 3 basic primary types.

also when you post those partition descriptions put them in code tags look in my signature as to how to other wise it makes it easy to misread them. We need to see things lined up in order correctly.

You can't add a extended to what you have.

hpng
November 26th, 2010, 10:49 AM
I still have a problem with loosing linux data if I have to reinstall Win 7 since
Linux will now reside in C: drive if I use Wubi.
Here is an alternative idea with reference to my disk information below:



Partitions on one and only HP laptop disk drive (DISK O):

Volume Layout Type File System Status Capacity Free Space % Free
-(C:) Simple Basic NTFS Primary Partition 445.34 GB 403.53 GB 91
-HP_TOOLS Simple Basic FAT32 Primary Partition 99 MB 92 GB 93
-Recovery (D:) Simple Basic NTFS Primary Partition 20.12 GB 2.93 GB 15
-System Simple Basic NTFS Primary Partition 199 MB 165 MB 83


Windows defragment tool lets user resize (shrink or extend) a partition.
C drive and D (RECOVERY) drive are adjacent to each other as shown on defragment tool.
I can shrink C drive by 100 GB ro 200 GB, and then extend D partition by as much.
Then I can put all Linux install and all linux data on D drive.
Would that work?
if so, can i also access data on C: drive partition when linux is running on d drive?
Do I also loose linux data when I upgrade or reinstall linux on D: drive?
Is there a reason to not use D: drive?

dino99
November 26th, 2010, 10:55 AM
make room by shrinking partition(s), then you can create an extented partition. Ubuntu can be installed where you want, no matter.

here is how to install:


use gparted or partedmagic to create 3 partitions:
- / : root, bootable, ext4, ~ 12 Gb (take note of its name: /dev/sd? , will be asked when installing in manual mode by the "alternate" iso.
- swap : about 2 Gb (4 Gb if suspend/hibernate will be used)
- /home : ext3 or ext4 format, unlimited space to store your data and settings

http://partedmagic.com/

hpng
November 26th, 2010, 11:04 AM
I cannot create a new partition.


Partitions on one and only HP laptop disk drive (DISK O):
Volume Layout Type File System Status Capacity Free Space % Free
(C:) Simple Basic NTFS Primary Partition 445.34 GB 403.53 GB 91
HP_TOOLS Simple Basic FAT32 Primary Partition 99 MB 92 GB 93
Recovery (D:) Simple Basic NTFS Primary Partition 20.12 GB 2.93 GB 15
System Simple Basic NTFS Primary Partition 199 MB 165 MB 83



As I understand it, I can only have a max of 4 primary partitions per disk drive.
I do not want to delete any OEM partition because they are critical to laptop recovery.

that is why I rather shrink C partition, and extend D partition.
See my previous post.

thanks.

sikander3786
November 26th, 2010, 11:06 AM
Then I can put all Linux install and all linux data on D drive.

Installing Ubuntu to the D: drive would over-write any data previously present on it. If you can empty that some how, (you'll need to burn that recovery stuff to DVDs then) I'd recommend to create an Extended partition with 2 Logicals as the Ubuntu Root and Swap partitions.

You can access data from NTFS drives just fine in Linux.

And if you've a proper dual-boot install, updates shouldn't break it. And even if they do (very rare), it is fixable most of the time.

And there is no apparent reason not to use D: drive.

wilee-nilee
November 26th, 2010, 11:15 AM
176613

So here is my W7 set up one partition, I have the full image backed up and the install dvd, this is really if you want Ubuntu; the set up. You could have a extra NTFS for shared data if needed. The way your going about this is rather haphazard, and installing Wubi to other then the OS partition is asking for even more trouble then it is already, at least the local expert on wubi says this.;)

The full image back up slides back in still activated.

sikander3786
November 26th, 2010, 11:18 AM
Ok. I just wanted to clear up things a bit as I have been posting some crap in this thread :-)

1. You cannot add another partition whether primary or extended to your current setup.

2. If you want to add it, one way of doing that is to make DVD backups of your recovery partition and then delete that partition and create an extended in its place. Then you'd obviously need to rely on the DVDs for restoring your system anytime later.

3. Another workaround will be download a Windows 7 repair disc (easily available online), delete your System Reserved partition and then move your Windows 7 boot files to the C: drive instead. Thus you'll get rid of a primary partition and would be able to create a new extended partition. A bit dangerous to do if you don't feel confident. The system would become un-bootable until the boot gets fixed.

4. Most important of all that, if you are unsure of anything, if you don't feel confident about all that stuff. Don't do it.

The easiest workaround for you would be to install Ubuntu using Wubi as previously mentioned in the above posts. Or even to install it as a Virtual machine inside Windows (this would be a bit more slow and the 3d stuff would be choppy).

Hope this clears some of your doubts now.

wilee-nilee
November 26th, 2010, 11:23 AM
Ok. I just wanted to clear up things a bit as I have been posting some crap in this thread :-)


Hey welcome to the club its always nice to have a new member. The other person dino99 wont admit this and they are a experienced user.;)

wayne128
November 26th, 2010, 03:21 PM
Read your posts on HP laptop.
This is not the first time I read about this. Several people encountered this issue.
I learned from another forumer elsewhere, did it myself and helped some to overcome this 'limit of 4'. Here is what the simplified ideas and procedure I though you might be interested.

1. Copy out your HP_Tool, this is just some software.
One you copy these out to external USB stick, keep it, will bring back after partitioning.
Or just save it in window directory. You could check to see yourself what are these tools under windows OS.

2. Shrink your biggest partition, as there is no fdisk -l information I do not know which partition number, however it is not too important, as long as you get the correct method.

3. Now, delete the HP_Tool small partition, this is the way to "Free the hard disk from that limit of 4 Primary".
Because once you got rid of this partition, it has left 3 primary, and you can create the fourth which will become extended partition for your drive.

Do not worry too much, if you worried about this step then you just stop proceeding.
It is your call.
But many people get through this step and enjoy the 'freedom'.

4. Because of partition shrinking on step 2, you would see a big unallocated space, which is sandwitched between two primary partitions, this alone give you some trouble on partition manager. This is easier to see on gparted since it is Graphic interface.
What you do now is use gparted and 'shift' the higher number partition toward the small number partition so that the 'unallocated space' will move to the right hand side.
Make them adjacent to each other. leave no gap, or just a very small ( 1MegaByte).
Select 'cylinder' on gparted GUI so that you do not have overlapping cylinder.

5. Do the same for another partition (number 3) which hold your 'recovery'

at the end you would see that all the three primary partitions are now adjacent to each other, leaving one large unallocated partition on you 'right side' as viewed from gparted GUI.

6. Now, create or add the rest of unallocated space to be EXTENDED partition. Once this is done it will become /dev/sda4, just a container for all logical partitions to be added next few steps. you will not be using /dev/sda4.

7. Now add whatever you want for Linux partitions. such as Swap, /, etc.
it will automatically be assigned with /dev/sda5 then 6,7, and so on when you add more.

8. If you wish you could add a FAT32 partition and use it to copy those HP_Tool.
Alternatively create a directory in windows and copy there.

9. Next step is just install your preferred Linux OSes on these logical partitions.

OK below is my existing fdisk -l for one of the multi boot computers, you can see first three partitions are window 7 partitions but mine are boot, OS , data
After that extended and lots of Linux OS, at the end there are still 100G free space , I add new partition when I play with new release...test alpha or beta release, etc.

good luck on your adventure... and be :D when 'freedom' is achieved.



[root@localhost ~]# fdisk -l

Disk /dev/sda: 640.1 GB, 640135028736 bytes
255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 77825 cylinders
Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes
Disk identifier: 0x98000000

Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System
/dev/sda1 * 1 12 96358+ 6 FAT16
/dev/sda2 13 1110 8818795 7 HPFS/NTFS
/dev/sda3 1111 36806 286720000 7 HPFS/NTFS
/dev/sda4 36806 63526 214629460 5 Extended
/dev/sda5 36806 37201 3173896+ 82 Linux swap / Solaris
/dev/sda6 37202 39126 15461035 83 Linux
/dev/sda7 39127 41051 15462531 83 Linux
/dev/sda8 41052 43014 15767766 83 Linux
/dev/sda9 43015 44978 15775798+ 83 Linux
/dev/sda10 44979 46954 15872188+ 83 Linux
/dev/sda11 46955 49504 20482843+ 83 Linux
/dev/sda12 * 49505 53377 31109841 83 Linux
/dev/sda13 53378 55968 20812112 83 Linux
/dev/sda14 55969 58518 20482843+ 83 Linux
/dev/sda15 58519 59793 10241406 83 Linux
/dev/sda16 59794 61009 9764864 83 Linux
/dev/sda17 61010 62310 10450251 83 Linux
/dev/sda18 62311 63526 9767488+ 83 Linux
[root@localhost ~]#

hpng
November 26th, 2010, 10:04 PM
Wayne:


1. Copy out your HP_Tool, this is just some software.
One you copy these out to external USB stick, keep it, will bring back after partitioning.
Or just save it in window directory. You could check to see yourself what are these tools under windows OS.


Jut want tomake suer, I am using Win 7 64 bit.
I could not see HP_tools directory from
Partitions on one and only HP laptop disk drive (DISK O):
Volume Layout Type File System Status Capacity Free Space % Free
-(C:) Simple Basic NTFS Primary Partition 445.34 GB 403.53 GB 91
-HP_TOOLS Simple Basic FAT32 Primary Partition 99 MB 92 GB 93
-Recovery (D:) Simple Basic NTFS Primary Partition 20.12 GB 2.93 GB 15
-System Simple Basic NTFS Primary Partition 199 MB 165 MB 83


Here is the relative physical location of all the primary partitions
System | C: | RECOVERY D: | HP_TOOLS
199 MB | 445 GB | 20 GB | 99 MB


The above information viewed from Disk Management application.
I CANNOT see HP_Tools and SYSTEMS directory / partition from “COMPUTER” For some reason, HP did not put a partition letter like C D or E after the name of the partition for SYSTEM and HP_TOOLS.
.
It only display C: and Recovery D: partition.
However, I can see all the above partitions when I use computer management application
Issue: So how do I copy contents of HP_Tools partition to a CD if I cannot see it from Windows 7 with COMPUTER application ( similar to Windows explorer)

Is there an application that would let me see all files in all partitions / directories on Win 7?


Did you have the same partitions and setup as I do on my laptop?





Please advice.

wayne128
November 27th, 2010, 01:04 AM
oh, they made it hidden.
try clonezilla , partedmagic live cd, or even use command dd to copy the 'hidden partition'
google each term and read..
the key is you can always clone out anything, the whole drive, a hidden partition, etc

if you want to unhide, google something like "how to unhide window 7 file" "how to unhide window 7 folder" or similar phrase. here is one example
http://windows7themes.net/how-to-unhide-hidden-files-in-windows-7.html

no i do not have HP, mine is Dell, similar issue but I redo all partitions to look like earlier post and multi boot.

if you are interest to see another forumer who has HP laptop, go read this thread, . you can always join in and ask in detail how he did it
http://www.pclinuxos.com/forum/index.php/topic,82833.0.html

bcbc
November 27th, 2010, 04:14 AM
What I discovered on my Dell is this:
If you change the drive partitions as they shipped it, the recovery mechanism doesn't work.
If you remove the Dell specific bootloader, the recovery mechanism doesn't work.

I don't know what HP requires... but, if you intend to use the recovery feature, you should check what their restrictions are (and I'd backup the disk MBR as well)

In my case, I just reinstalled from DVD and downloaded the drivers I needed.

PS a lot of wubi users have accidentally installed grub to the MBR, so even using wubi is no guarantee that your HP bootloader is secure.