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swoll1980
October 27th, 2010, 03:12 PM
Link (http://money.cnn.com/2010/10/27/technology/microsoft_pdc/index.htm?eref=mrss_igoogle_cnn)

They post this story like it just happened today.

CharlesA
October 27th, 2010, 03:16 PM
Lawl.

There are already a ton of different phone manufactuers. Same goes for media and search engines (and browsers too!)

Not that many different types of consoles, but each has their own quirks and pitfalls. I've got a PS3 mostly due to the fact that it can play Bluray. >.>

Grenage
October 27th, 2010, 03:17 PM
Can they make it in the 21st century and compete with Google and Apple?"

Lol. This is Microsoft, the dominant home PC OS of choice (and as far as consoles go, damn good). Mobile phones are a side project for them.

Tristam Green
October 27th, 2010, 03:37 PM
xbox.

gunashekar
October 27th, 2010, 03:43 PM
A step towards debugging ubuntu's bg no. 1
http://money.cnn.com/2010/10/27/technology/microsoft_pdc/index.htm

RiceMonster
October 27th, 2010, 03:55 PM
A step towards debugging ubuntu's bg no. 1
http://money.cnn.com/2010/10/27/technology/microsoft_pdc/index.htm

lol

alexan
October 27th, 2010, 04:07 PM
From the article:
It's not like Microsoft didn't foresee the changes ahead. With a staff of almost 90,000, the company has many of the tech world's smartest minds on its payroll, and has incubated projects in a wide range of fields that later took off.
That's their solution; but if they keep act like they always doing (priority to market domination) they will lose if the game raise the pot.
There's a tiny magic string which tie hardware manufacturers to Microsoft: if that little string broke; they will lose nearly everything (also called "Windows").
They have only two option: hardware manufacturer keep doing what they did until now (subside their market/value/everything to Microsoft) or keep (finally) in good use the said "world's smartest mind" (and not silence them in a away to secure the "tiny magic string" with the HWMs.


If HWM begin doing by their own... big problem for Microsoft.

samalex
October 27th, 2010, 04:23 PM
Microsoft is diluting themselves, as is Apple. Both companies did a well enough job making computer operating systems and software, but both have gotten into other markets (music, phones, video games, set-top multimedia appliances, etc) and I think they've spread themselves way too thin.

Zzl1xndd
October 27th, 2010, 04:24 PM
I think this is the most important line

"Will it become the next IBM -- crucially important to businesses but an afterthought for consumers?"

I think this is the most likely out come as things stand right now.

Grenage
October 27th, 2010, 04:27 PM
I think it would be a hard to say that Apple are spreading themselves too thin, considering iphone/ipod market share.

Sporkman
October 27th, 2010, 05:47 PM
...oops, nm

era86
October 27th, 2010, 05:56 PM
Isn't this old news? Tech companies that are successful in selling consumer products eventually die if they don't cater to higher level institutions/organizations. IMHO, consumers buy fads and trends. Once the wave passes, the consumer will find something else that's shiny and new.

Even a company that lives off the consumer demand, Apple, knows this and is doing more to cater to the enterprise market. Microsoft's consumer line is slowly dying, but it doesn't need the consumer to stay afloat because it has a deathgrip on the enterprise market.

kaldor
October 27th, 2010, 06:16 PM
- Xbox
- DirectX
- MS Office
- Active Directory
- Windows
- Messenger
- Hotmail
- Microsoft Office Live
- Silverlight
- Internet Explorer
- Craploads of third-party Windows-only applications
- IIS
- Until recently, Halo.
- WINE (how many Linux users don't use this? I assume at least 60% of non-dualbooters do) Though not made by MS, shows that MS has a stronghold.

Dying? Really?

MasterNetra
October 27th, 2010, 06:29 PM
Microsoft is diluting themselves, as is Apple. Both companies did a well enough job making computer operating systems and software, but both have gotten into other markets (music, phones, video games, set-top multimedia appliances, etc) and I think they've spread themselves way too thin.

Not necessarily they're just trying to diversify there products. As the saying goes "Its not wise to put all your eggs in on basket". If MS say puts all their effort into just say the Windows OS, if that tanks they go with it. With a number of other things they could potentially stay a float with the tanking of their OS.

mamamia88
October 27th, 2010, 06:38 PM
The more and more I think about it what I do on a computer, I can do on any operating system. The differentiation for me is how reliable and how flexible the os is as well as price. Linux wins on all 3 fronts for me.

NightwishFan
October 27th, 2010, 08:06 PM
I do not agree with the Wine point. A lot of users I am sure just use Wine to run nostalgic programs such as old games. It does that amazingly.

KiwiNZ
October 27th, 2010, 08:13 PM
I do not agree with the Wine point. A lot of users I am sure just use Wine to run nostalgic programs such as old games. It does that amazingly.

I can speak for no one but me, but Wine was a total pain in the Gluteus Maximus and made me whine intensely about it. That is why I use VM Ware and run Linux in VM on my iMac and run Windows native and its Apps native on my Windows machines.

To me Wine come under the heading of things that add to ... "Why make IT more difficult than it has to be"

NightwishFan
October 27th, 2010, 08:14 PM
I should have to agree. It is nothing more than a utility for me and relying on it is something that will never happen.

donkyhotay
October 27th, 2010, 08:21 PM
I do not agree with the Wine point. A lot of users I am sure just use Wine to run nostalgic programs such as old games. It does that amazingly.

Agreed, I have wine for a few old windows games that I bought before migrating to linux. I rarely play them and if I didn't already own those games I wouldn't buy them and use them with wine.

Zzl1xndd
October 27th, 2010, 08:29 PM
I have to disagree with Kaldor on:

DirectX
Active Directory
Silverlight
Craploads of third-party Windows-only applications
IIS
Internet Explorer
WINE

The major reason being most of these are not consumer products and thats what this argument is about.

IE has been Slowly bleeding so yeah its dying.

The 3rd party Windows stuff is also not part of the MS brand and users Don't care where they are just as long as they can access them.

And Wine has already been covered by others.

Mark Phelps
October 27th, 2010, 10:26 PM
The same kind of "products we used to make but didn't sell well and are now history" assessment can be made against any company that branches out from its initial offerings into different things.

What about Apple's failures with Lisa and the Newton? Did Apple then become a "dying consumer brand"? No. They went on to bigger, better, and DIFFERENT other products.

MS is huge enough that is can afford to dabble in other areas outside its forte (OS, Office, and Enterprise software products) without risking the corporation. Some will succeed; others will fail.

MS just recently announced that it sold over 240 MILLION copies of Win7 in a year. Even if just a fraction of those were for personal desktops and/or laptops, that's still a lot of CONSUMERS that continue to buy products from MS.

You know, sometimes I think that these writers spit out articles intended to be ridiculous -- so we remember them and become excited to read what they write next!

Grenage
October 27th, 2010, 11:40 PM
You know, sometimes I think that these writers spit out articles intended to be ridiculous -- so we remember them and become excited to read what they write next!

I believe you are correct.

smellyman
October 28th, 2010, 01:05 AM
The same kind of "products we used to make but didn't sell well and are now history" assessment can be made against any company that branches out from its initial offerings into different things.

What about Apple's failures with Lisa and the Newton? Did Apple then become a "dying consumer brand"? No. They went on to bigger, better, and DIFFERENT other products.

MS is huge enough that is can afford to dabble in other areas outside its forte (OS, Office, and Enterprise software products) without risking the corporation. Some will succeed; others will fail.

MS just recently announced that it sold over 240 MILLION copies of Win7 in a year. Even if just a fraction of those were for personal desktops and/or laptops, that's still a lot of CONSUMERS that continue to buy products from MS.

You know, sometimes I think that these writers spit out articles intended to be ridiculous -- so we remember them and become excited to read what they write next!

so in other words. 240 million computers were sold in a year.

KiwiNZ
October 28th, 2010, 01:13 AM
so in other words. 240 million computers were sold in a year.

No,

Boxed retail editions are sold as well and multiple corporate licenses.

PhilGil
October 28th, 2010, 01:20 AM
No,

Boxed retail editions are sold as well and multiple corporate licenses.
Didn't we just have this discussion? OK, so 239,925,000 new computers and 75,000 boxed copies in New Zealand ;).

Just giving you a hard time KiwiNZ.

Going back to the original question, I have a hard time believing MS is dying in the consumer area when at least 90% of all computers sold still ship with Windows.

KiwiNZ
October 28th, 2010, 01:30 AM
Didn't we just have this discussion? OK, so 239,925,000 new computers and 75,000 boxed copies in New Zealand ;).

Just giving you a hard time KiwiNZ.

Going back to the original question, I have a hard time believing MS is dying in the consumer area when at least 90% of all computers sold still ship with Windows.

We may have just had it in another thread but there is still those who wrongly think that MS only sell their OS with new PCs

smellyman
October 28th, 2010, 02:29 AM
We may have just had it in another thread but there is still those who wrongly think that MS only sell their OS with new PCs

I understand it totally, but without putting in context of retail copies sold, it means very little to me.

It's like saying Linux has less than 1% of market share. Most likely not true, but no proof.

3rdalbum
October 28th, 2010, 03:13 AM
I think it would be a hard to say that Apple are spreading themselves too thin, considering iphone/ipod market share.

I don't think it's hard to say. Apple's engineers are working mostly on Steve Jobs' latest toys - the iPhone and iPad. Some of Apple's other lines are in desperate need of serious engineering resources. Desktop Mac OS needs a complete rewrite (already!) and Apple just doesn't have a good track record of being able to write an operating system from scratch. The AppleTV is dead - all major TV manufacturers are building TVs with media capabilities that embarrass the AppleTV, even the new AppleTV.

Apple's computers themselves could probably do with a new form factor as well, which doesn't appear to be on the horizon any time soon.

Microsoft is diluting itself with Bing, Zune and possibly Silverlight; but it has the resources to maintain the projects that it needs to maintain.

cammin
October 28th, 2010, 03:18 AM
What about Apple's failures with Lisa and the Newton? Did Apple then become a "dying consumer brand"?


Yes, they became a dying consumer brand. They barely avoided becoming a dead consumer brand.

smellyman
October 28th, 2010, 03:22 AM
I don't think it's hard to say. Apple's engineers are working mostly on Steve Jobs' latest toys - the iPhone and iPad. Some of Apple's other lines are in desperate need of serious engineering resources. Desktop Mac OS needs a complete rewrite (already!) and Apple just doesn't have a good track record of being able to write an operating system from scratch. The AppleTV is dead - all major TV manufacturers are building TVs with media capabilities that embarrass the AppleTV, even the new AppleTV.

Apple's computers themselves could probably do with a new form factor as well, which doesn't appear to be on the horizon any time soon.

Microsoft is diluting itself with Bing, Zune and possibly Silverlight; but it has the resources to maintain the projects that it needs to maintain.

Imacs and macbooks have had recent form factor changes.

and why does OS X need a rewrite?

KiwiNZ
October 28th, 2010, 03:26 AM
I don't think it's hard to say. Apple's engineers are working mostly on Steve Jobs' latest toys - the iPhone and iPad. Some of Apple's other lines are in desperate need of serious engineering resources. Desktop Mac OS needs a complete rewrite (already!) and Apple just doesn't have a good track record of being able to write an operating system from scratch. The AppleTV is dead - all major TV manufacturers are building TVs with media capabilities that embarrass the AppleTV, even the new AppleTV.

Apple's computers themselves could probably do with a new form factor as well, which doesn't appear to be on the horizon any time soon.

Microsoft is diluting itself with Bing, Zune and possibly Silverlight; but it has the resources to maintain the projects that it needs to maintain.

And that is why the iMac sales were up over 30% in Q4 2010 compared to Q4 2009 because they are no longer any good :rolleyes:

The OS is being refreshed early 2011 as announced.

pwnst*r
October 28th, 2010, 03:27 AM
Lol. This is Microsoft, the dominant home PC OS of choice (and as far as consoles go, damn good). Mobile phones are a side project for them.

This.

ubunterooster
October 28th, 2010, 03:51 AM
MS makes very decent Linux-compatible keyboards; I hope they stay around.

inobe
October 28th, 2010, 04:00 AM
microsoft will always be extremely useful as well to any other competitor.

without microsoft the world would literally suck and i thank them for what they've done, they created massive amounts of competition, in most cases the competition learned from their business tactics, without this the competition would fail.

so far they found their way into our vehicles, game consoles, phones, computers, tables, music and video players, they are apart of most peoples everyday activities.

the brand will always be good enough, although thanks to the competition i believe that that they are running side by side and the battle to be the best has only just begun.

themarker0
October 28th, 2010, 04:51 AM
Lets pretend CNN doesn't use Microsoft for a while. Then we can say that they are dying.

Khakilang
October 28th, 2010, 05:48 AM
They try to be Jack of all trade but master of none. It was the desktop and notebook that Window dominate the market. But you can't blame them for trying as the technology is constantly evolving. At least we got a free punching bag.

pwnst*r
October 28th, 2010, 06:03 AM
It was the desktop and notebook that Window dominate the market.

"was"? Lol?

3rdalbum
October 28th, 2010, 08:46 AM
Imacs and macbooks have had recent form factor changes.

and why does OS X need a rewrite?

Apple doesn't have much room to move with OS X - it's becoming difficult to make any decent modifications without breaking stuff.

OS X also possesses some security flaws that can't be merely 'patched', because the whole system is designed to use this flawed way.

How did the iMac's form factor change? I didn't hear about that.They still look the same that they have since 2007.

weasel fierce
October 28th, 2010, 09:01 AM
microsoft will always be extremely useful as well to any other competitor.

without microsoft the world would literally suck and i thank them for what they've done, they created massive amounts of competition, in most cases the competition learned from their business tactics, without this the competition would fail.


Yeah, Im sure PC users enjoyed waiting 10 years to have an OS that could do some level of half decent multitasking, when microsoft finally got around to catching up technically.

KiwiNZ
October 28th, 2010, 09:05 AM
Apple doesn't have much room to move with OS X - it's becoming difficult to make any decent modifications without breaking stuff.

OS X also possesses some security flaws that can't be merely 'patched', because the whole system is designed to use this flawed way.

.

Care to expand on that ?

Johnsie
October 28th, 2010, 09:41 AM
This article is a major exaggeration. Anyone who works anywhere knows that most businesses use Windows as their primary desktop OS. A few college students have macs but an overwhelming majority still use Windows and and you don't catch too many people in businesses or colleges using Open Office. People are becoming aware of alternatives but I wouldn't say Microsoft is a dying brand, they still dominate on the desktop and have never been overly concerned about the phone market. People are expecting them to try and dominate markets that they simply aren't that interested in. Microsoft's roots are as a software company.

NCLI
October 28th, 2010, 09:52 AM
xbox.
sucks.

KiwiNZ
October 28th, 2010, 09:57 AM
sucks.

This model certainly does not , very very quiet and with built in Wifi , awesome

Johnsie
October 28th, 2010, 10:19 AM
I got an xbox a few weeks ago and I love it. It nearly killed me handing money over for something proprietary but I'm glad I did it. Halo Reach is one of the best games I've ever played online and I think it broke some records when it was launched. Certainly NOT a dying brand.

Ps. I hate news sites that don't allow user comments on articles.

Spice Weasel
October 28th, 2010, 10:25 AM
sucks.

My Xbox Classic runs Debian.

http://xbox-linux.org < Good use for an unused Xbox.

pwnst*r
October 28th, 2010, 01:34 PM
sucks.

You're right - nobody plays games on it. Also, Live really sucks.

ubunterooster
October 28th, 2010, 01:59 PM
OS X also possesses some security flaws that can't be merely 'patched', because the whole system is designed to use this flawed way.

Care to expand on that ?The users are the problem. Computing will be insecure as long as unsafe users are at the helm.

pwnst*r
October 28th, 2010, 02:21 PM
The users are the problem. Computing will be insecure as long as unsafe users are at the helm.

That goes with any OS. Moot point.

3Miro
October 28th, 2010, 03:48 PM
This is an interesting article. I am surprised to see that IE is still the number one browser, if Netscape 5 didn't suck so much, IE would have never picked up. The only useful feature of IE is that it comes preinstalled on Windows so you can use ti to download FireFox or Chrome.

I am also surprised to see that most windows licenses are sold to businesses. One would think that Businesses would be the first to jump over to Linux, after all they only care about money and Linux is mostly free. Furthermore, they get much better security. I guess the CEOs are indeed technologically illiterate, also Linux marketing sux.

The article mentions 90,000 people working for MS. I wonder how many of those are in legal department and marketing and how many are actual engineers. On the other hand we should count how many engineers work for Canonical and RedHat (counting the volunteers as well).

Windows is crappy technology, what keeps them in business is the fact that most people don't know how to install an OS (and windows comes preinstalled), most people have never heard of alternatives, many hardware manufacturers make drivers exclusively for windows and they still have the heavy gaming market.

In order for the computer industry to move forward, windows has to either become Unix (or something better that has not been invented yet) or MS must die (or transform to where they are completely out of the OS market). This will happen, it is just that it takes very long time (another decade maybe).

kolby4078
October 28th, 2010, 03:58 PM
xbox.
witch unfortunately will never support blu ray

=(

JDShu
October 28th, 2010, 03:59 PM
This is an interesting article. I am surprised to see that IE is still the number one browser, if Netscape 5 didn't suck so much, IE would have never picked up. The only useful feature of IE is that it comes preinstalled on Windows so you can use ti to download FireFox or Chrome.

I am also surprised to see that most windows licenses are sold to businesses. One would think that Businesses would be the first to jump over to Linux, after all they only care about money and Linux is mostly free. Furthermore, they get much better security. I guess the CEOs are indeed technologically illiterate, also Linux marketing sux.


IE was also bundled with Windows while users had to buy/download Netscape.

Businesses may not switch to Linux because of inertia. Retraining all your staff to use Linux could cost more than what you pay for the licenses.

Personally I think that Microsoft is likely in need of some major internal restructuring if they are to compete in the future. For now though, they are just doing the safest strategy and mimicking their opponents.

RiceMonster
October 28th, 2010, 04:04 PM
One would think that Businesses would be the first to jump over to Linux, after all they only care about money and Linux is mostly free. Furthermore, they get much better security. I guess the CEOs are indeed technologically illiterate, also Linux marketing sux.

There are more costs than simply the cost of the OS. More difficulty hiring staff, retraining costs, support costs, etc.


Windows is crappy technology, what keeps them in business is the fact that most people don't know how to install an OS (and windows comes preinstalled), most people have never heard of alternatives, many hardware manufacturers make drivers exclusively for windows and they still have the heavy gaming market.

That's not true at all. Windows gives businesses features they need like Group Policy, Activy Directory, and Office (yes, Open Office is not suitable for many people). I'm going to guess you've never actually worked in industry if you're going to make comments like that. If what you said was true, there wouldn't be so many companies running Linux servers that use Windows desktops.


In order for the computer industry to move forward, windows has to either become Unix (or something better that has not been invented yet) or MS must die (or transform to where they are completely out of the OS market). This will happen, it is just that it takes very long time (another decade maybe).

In order for Linux to move forward, people need to drop this silly attitude and start looking at things realistically. They both have their strengths and weaknesses.

sydbat
October 28th, 2010, 06:05 PM
Retraining all your staff to use Linux could cost more than what you pay for the licenses.I disagree with this statement.

The reason is - with the shift to a completely new interface/way of doing things in the GUI that Microsoft has implemented, companies that are upgrading to Windows 7 (and those that decided to upgrade to Vista), are having significant retraining issues.

"This doesn't work the way it did before (in XP)", "I can't find where to do this thing i did before (in XP)", "Why isn't this essential program no longer working?", etc, etc, etc.

The retraining that IS occurring (not to mention the rewrites many have to do of specific software) is costing these companies much more than switching to an open source OS or other software.

<MS apologists, please insert your counter arguments here>

RiceMonster
October 28th, 2010, 06:30 PM
"Why isn't this essential program no longer working?", etc, etc, etc.

To be fair, the company should have tested all their apps before upgrading.

3Miro
October 28th, 2010, 07:43 PM
There are more costs than simply the cost of the OS. More difficulty hiring staff, retraining costs, support costs, etc.

Most employees don't have to know anything about the system other than "click here to start the program that you need to do your work". When I used to work in an office, all that people knew how to do was to turn the machine on and then enter the software they were using for work (that and Firefox). Retraining cost is not nearly as much as some try to make it, you don't have to know Linux to use Linux, just like most people that use Windows actually don't know Windows. There might be a higher one time cost, but over the long run, Linux will be cheaper. One needs fewer people to maintain a large number of Linux machines than the same number of Windows ones. (no business should be upgrading to the latest Ubuntu every 6 months, it is not like what most of us are doing on our machines).



That's not true at all. Windows gives businesses features they need like Group Policy, Activy Directory, and Office (yes, Open Office is not suitable for many people). I'm going to guess you've never actually worked in industry if you're going to make comments like that. If what you said was true, there wouldn't be so many companies running Linux servers that use Windows desktops.


Define "industry". I have not worked for places like financial institutions, my field is scientific computing, which is industry and cannot possibly live on Windows (there is a reason why Linux is the choice for supercomputers). When I say that Windows is garbage, I don't mean that it doesn't have some nice features or that there are nice programs written for it. My issue is that all of those features can be easily implemented under Linux (if they don't already exist), however, decent memory management and CPU scheduling is not something that can be easily implemented under Windows. Using windows is like buying a car not based upon gas mileage, safety and reliability, but on shiny dealership sign, car color and number of cup-holders.



In order for Linux to move forward, people need to drop this silly attitude and start looking at things realistically. They both have their strengths and weaknesses.

What do you mean by attitude? What would you change?

We are a community and I don't think that businesses and the community should directly work together. There should be Linux corporations like Red Hat, Mandriva and Novel that should work between the two sides.

KiwiNZ
October 29th, 2010, 03:09 AM
http://www.engadget.com/2010/10/28/microsoft-announces-a-record-first-quarter-revenue-of-16-20-bil/


"Microsoft announces a record first-quarter revenue of $16.20 billion, $5.41 billion in profit

Microsoft just beat analyst expectations, announcing $16.20 billion in revenue for the first quarter of its 2011 fiscal year, with $5.41 billion in profit. Microsoft cites Office 2010, the sustained "PC refresh cycle," and 38 percent growth in the Xbox 360 biz for its good news, with overall revenue up 25 percent over the same quarter last year and a 51 percent gain in profit. The Xbox 360 has been at the top of the console heap for four months running, which can't hurt."

I think that closes the issue for this thread.

Dr. C
October 29th, 2010, 04:41 AM
http://www.engadget.com/2010/10/28/microsoft-announces-a-record-first-quarter-revenue-of-16-20-bil/


"Microsoft announces a record first-quarter revenue of $16.20 billion, $5.41 billion in profit

Microsoft just beat analyst expectations, announcing $16.20 billion in revenue for the first quarter of its 2011 fiscal year, with $5.41 billion in profit. Microsoft cites Office 2010, the sustained "PC refresh cycle," and 38 percent growth in the Xbox 360 biz for its good news, with overall revenue up 25 percent over the same quarter last year and a 51 percent gain in profit. The Xbox 360 has been at the top of the console heap for four months running, which can't hurt."

I think that closes the issue for this thread.

Really? MSFT stock value has languished despite very strong earnings growth. So why are the markets worried here? http://finance.yahoo.com/echarts?s=MSFT+Interactive#chart4:symbol=msft;rang e=my;indicator=volume;charttype=line;crosshair=on; ohlcvalues=0;logscale=on;source=undefined. Ray Ozzie was a very senior person at Microsoft and he makes very valid points.

KiwiNZ
October 29th, 2010, 05:18 AM
Their share price is constant which means they are not volatile. The market has no concerns.

toupeiro
October 29th, 2010, 05:30 AM
To hit on something FineE pointed out,

Ray Ozzy was right about many things. The biggest being, Microsoft needs to move beyond it's PC focus. Peripherally, Microsoft makes some awesome things. Xbox 360 and Microsoft Sync being two huge points of interest. Have you ever used Microsoft Sync?? It's Brilliant, seriously!

And, I predict Microsoft will naturally trend the way Ray Ozzy is mentioning to be honest. Not tomorrow, but over the next 3-5 years perhaps. The PC market will become much more balanced amongst Linux/OSX/Windows, and Microsoft will concern itself more with endpoint peripherals that associate with PC's as a platform, not OSes as a platform, meaning the OS you run becomes transparent to the endpoint device because a realization will come that Microsoft can drive as much money, if not more, in the peripheral world as they have done strictly in the software world.

Even MS's old 2.1 sound system I bought over a decade ago held it's own to top-of-the-line 2.1's of today at a fraction of the retail price.

Maybe it's a pipe dream, but it will actually enable Microsoft to be way more agile in the peripheral market if they can accomplish this.

KiwiNZ
October 29th, 2010, 05:40 AM
To hit on something FineE pointed out,

Ray Ozzy was right about many things. The biggest being, Microsoft needs to move beyond it's PC focus. Peripherally, Microsoft makes some awesome things. Xbox 360 and Microsoft Sync being two huge points of interest. Have you ever used Microsoft Sync?? It's Brilliant, seriously!

And, I predict Microsoft will naturally trend the way Ray Ozzy is mentioning to be honest. Not tomorrow, but over the next 3-5 years perhaps. The PC market will become much more balanced amongst Linux/OSX/Windows, and Microsoft will concern itself more with endpoint peripherals that associate with PC's as a platform, not OSes as a platform, meaning the OS you run becomes transparent to the endpoint device because a realization will come that Microsoft can drive as much money, if not more, in the peripheral world as they have done strictly in the software world.

Even MS's old 2.1 sound system I bought over a decade ago held it's own to top-of-the-line 2.1's of today at a fraction of the retail price.

Maybe it's a pipe dream, but it will actually enable Microsoft to be way more agile in the peripheral market if they can accomplish this.

Xbox 360 , MS Surface, Silverlight and the mooted changed for Windows 8 indicate where they are going.

pwnst*r
October 29th, 2010, 06:02 AM
http://www.engadget.com/2010/10/28/microsoft-announces-a-record-first-quarter-revenue-of-16-20-bil/


"Microsoft announces a record first-quarter revenue of $16.20 billion, $5.41 billion in profit

Microsoft just beat analyst expectations, announcing $16.20 billion in revenue for the first quarter of its 2011 fiscal year, with $5.41 billion in profit. Microsoft cites Office 2010, the sustained "PC refresh cycle," and 38 percent growth in the Xbox 360 biz for its good news, with overall revenue up 25 percent over the same quarter last year and a 51 percent gain in profit. The Xbox 360 has been at the top of the console heap for four months running, which can't hurt."

I think that closes the issue for this thread.

Yeah, you can go ahead and close this now ^_^

Tristam Green
October 29th, 2010, 12:44 PM
witch unfortunately will never support blu ray

=(

which is why i bought a PS3. It does everything*

*except allow the user to install another OS

swoll1980
October 29th, 2010, 02:38 PM
Most of their revenue is from commercial licenses. I honestly don't know anyone that's ever gone out and bought a Windows upgrade. I'm not saying people don't buy upgrades. I just don't know any of them, and I know alot of people. I thought it was obvious that they were a dying consumer brand, but I guess it's not.

LowSky
October 29th, 2010, 02:40 PM
which is why i bought a PS3. It does everything*
*except allow the user to install another OS

Yeah because installing Linux worked so well on it anyway.. Sony locked down the hardware so tightly its wasn't worth using as a PC.

I love my PS3, its nearly 3 years old and it still gets a lot of use. Not much bluray playing, but I do rent a lot of movies using the store, and use netflix when I'm being poor, and use it to watch things from my MYthtv backend.. Very versatile.

ade234uk
October 29th, 2010, 05:12 PM
Microsoft are not dying, far from it. However Internet Explorer is. 7 years ago If I looked at my webstats 95% would show users using Internet Explorer. Look today its only about 65% with the rest made up of Firefox, Chrome, Safari and others. That is one big chunk.

There are good reasons Internet Explorer has failed we all know why, it only runs on Windows Machines and this has been Microsoft biggest downfall. If they had just opened up when people needed them, then people still be using it.

And to make things worse Internet Explorer causes the most problems if you are developing websites. Take for example today, I found a javascript that worked in Firefox, Chrome, Safari but did not work in Internet Explorer 7. Complete and utter headache.

And don't talk me about Silverlight, more and more sites seem to be using it, but if you use Ubuntu your screwed. And thats why Microsoft is falling. Double fail for websites that wish to use Silverlight because they are alienating a lot of users.

phrostbyte
October 29th, 2010, 07:48 PM
Until we solve the lock in problem Microsoft will be around for some time. You bet Microsoft will only make solving this problem even harder as time progresses.

KiwiNZ
October 29th, 2010, 08:01 PM
Until we solve the lock in problem Microsoft will be around for some time. You bet Microsoft will only make solving this problem even harder as time progresses.

Why do we need to "solve" it ? If MS were to collapse the snowball affect on the IT industry would be catastrophic . For those who want to use Linux or Apple the continued existence of MS does nothing to them, and those who chose MS products do so because they want to and its bloody arrogant to assume otherwise.

NightwishFan
October 29th, 2010, 08:12 PM
Microsoft does a lot of good too. I do not approve of their methods and policies for most things, but simply that does not mean somehow I want them to fail :/

I am glad there are alternatives and Microsoft is one of them.

pwnst*r
October 29th, 2010, 09:41 PM
I'm glad that the Bill Gates foundation doesn't donate any money!

aG93IGRvIGkgdWJ1bnR1Pw==
October 29th, 2010, 10:13 PM
Microsoft may not be "in" like that fashion accessory company that pretends to make computers, but it's the "default" people choose when buying a computer - or, more often, the default people are sold without their knowledge when buying a computer. It's like the faint smell of urine in the metro - it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it.

Grenage
October 29th, 2010, 10:50 PM
Microsoft may not be "in" like that fashion accessory company that pretends to make computers, but it's the "default" people choose when buying a computer - or, more often, the default people are sold without their knowledge when buying a computer. It's like the faint smell of urine in the metro - it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it.

It's more like the urinal itself, providing easy-to-use functionality in an otherwise useless room.

NightwishFan
October 29th, 2010, 10:54 PM
No, I think the years of dominance Microsoft had gave it way too big a hammer to smash stuff, but I will be honest and say there was no real alternative.

cgroza
October 29th, 2010, 11:02 PM
I guess its time for it to die. Everything has an end.

phrostbyte
October 29th, 2010, 11:57 PM
Why do we need to "solve" it ? If MS were to collapse the snowball affect on the IT industry would be catastrophic . For those who want to use Linux or Apple the continued existence of MS does nothing to them, and those who chose MS products do so because they want to and its bloody arrogant to assume otherwise.

Catastrophic in what way?

Dr. C
October 30th, 2010, 03:02 AM
Why do we need to "solve" it ? If MS were to collapse the snowball affect on the IT industry would be catastrophic . For those who want to use Linux or Apple the continued existence of MS does nothing to them, and those who chose MS products do so because they want to and its bloody arrogant to assume otherwise.

This really depends on the time frame. A sudden collapse of Microsoft would most certainly be catastrophic on a world wide basis affecting much more that the IT industry. We are talking about a doomsday scenario affecting vital infrastructure worldwide here. With the advent of DRM, namely product activation, Microsoft has created a massive single worldwide point of failure for Windows. What happens to Windows when the activation servers go down and Microsoft is not around to bring them back up? How much critical infrastructure is dependent on Microsoft Windows?

A slow collapse of Microsoft over a decade or two would actually be very beneficial, since it would eliminate the single point of failure for critical infrastructure, cause by the DRM in Microsoft Windows.

pwnst*r
October 30th, 2010, 02:17 PM
Catastrophic in what way?

How is that even a serious question?

donkyhotay
October 30th, 2010, 02:32 PM
This really depends on the time frame. A sudden collapse of Microsoft would most certainly be catastrophic on a world wide basis affecting much more that the IT industry. We are talking about a doomsday scenario affecting vital infrastructure worldwide here. With the advent of DRM, namely product activation, Microsoft has created a massive single worldwide point of failure for Windows. What happens to Windows when the activation servers go down and Microsoft is not around to bring them back up? How much critical infrastructure is dependent on Microsoft Windows?

A slow collapse of Microsoft over a decade or two would actually be very beneficial, since it would eliminate the single point of failure for critical infrastructure, cause by the DRM in Microsoft Windows.

While it would be a catastrophe in the short term in the long run it would be beneficial. I think it would help people to wake up and realize "hey, I don't really own this software I paid good money for so long as I'm dependent on some company to keep it working for me." The American/French revolutions were pretty bad but since that time there has been a large worldwide drop in monarchies and most countries (at least non third-world countries) have some sort of democractic/constitutional/republic type government system.

Grenage
October 31st, 2010, 02:27 AM
While it would be a catastrophe in the short term in the long run it would be beneficial. I think it would help people to wake up and realize "hey, I don't really own this software I paid good money for so long as I'm dependent on some company to keep it working for me." The American/French revolutions were pretty bad but since that time there has been a large worldwide drop in monarchies and most countries (at least non third-world countries) have some sort of democractic/constitutional/republic type government system.

It would be pure carnage, both long and mid term; Long term, another giant would likely emerge. That's just the way the world works - and it works quite well.

phrostbyte
October 31st, 2010, 03:15 AM
How is that even a serious question?

How is that not a serious question?

phrostbyte
October 31st, 2010, 03:17 AM
It would be pure carnage, both long and mid term; Long term, another giant would likely emerge. That's just the way the world works - and it works quite well.

Yes, and hopefully that giant would be GNU/Linux. :P

Anyways, I can only see benefit in Microsoft's demise at this point. They don't do anything useful for the computer industry at all.

v1ad
October 31st, 2010, 03:19 AM
i don't understand why they bring up the ipad, Microsoft is an all software company whereas Apple provides their own hardware. that can't even come into play.

NightwishFan
October 31st, 2010, 03:47 AM
Microsoft makes hardware as well, they just are not a primary pc vendor. Do not forget the Xbox either.

v1ad
October 31st, 2010, 03:49 AM
you are right there, sorry i forgot. (imo xbox was a failure) at least at the hardware layer.

thebarisaxkid
October 31st, 2010, 04:06 AM
I agree?

JDShu
October 31st, 2010, 04:44 AM
It would be pure carnage, both long and mid term; Long term, another giant would likely emerge. That's just the way the world works - and it works quite well.

If in the long term, the platform is something FOSS, then the problem of monopoly is solved.

kolby4078
November 5th, 2010, 04:05 PM
- Xbox
- DirectX
- Windows
- Craploads of third-party Windows-only applications
- IIS
- Until recently, Halo.
- WINE (how many Linux users don't use this? I assume at least 60% of non-dualbooters do) Though not made by MS, shows that MS has a stronghold.

Dying? Really?


fixed

weasel fierce
November 5th, 2010, 05:33 PM
If Microsoft were to collapse, something else would take its place.

If we're tying ourselves to the financial success of a single corporation, we deserve what we get if it fails.
Im sure politicians would be lining up to pour lots of money into it.

Gremlinzzz
November 5th, 2010, 09:23 PM
Microsoft is a dying consumer brand! Not likely Apple and Micro were there when the big bang happened. Like the universe they will expand forever.Linux wont surpass them but will survive like a planet.

giddyup306
November 5th, 2010, 10:50 PM
Doesnt surprise. Both of my computers use linux as well as my phone and even the DVD player in my car!

Chronon
November 5th, 2010, 11:38 PM
Microsoft is a dying consumer brand! Not likely Apple and Micro were there when the big bang happened. Like the universe they will expand forever.Linux wont surpass them but will survive like a planet.

Plenty happened in the world of computing before these two companies arrived on the scene.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_computing

Gremlinzzz
November 6th, 2010, 12:38 AM
Plenty happened in the world of computing before these two companies arrived on the scene.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_computing

yeah well my stories fiction all the names have been changed to protect the Innocent.

Chronon
November 6th, 2010, 02:31 AM
Carry on, then. ;)

guimaster
November 17th, 2010, 06:22 PM
I think this is the most important line

"Will it become the next IBM -- crucially important to businesses but an afterthought for consumers?"

I think this is the most likely out come as things stand right now.

The question then is, which "consumer" operating system will rise from Microsoft's ashes? Is Ubuntu ready? Is it user-friendly enough to start appearing on netbooks again? I haven't seen them for a couple of years now in any stores because of all of the returns back then... Is Linux software good enough to provide alternatives?

We know Mac isn't going to come down in price - as brilliant as that strategy would be for Apple right now - so there is definitely room for another OS to move in. Is Ubuntu ready?