Laptops - Brands - Old vs New Debate

[amjjawad]

I've never had a laptop before even though I'm so much obsessed about Computers and stuff. Perhaps it's time to get one.

As you may know, lots of companies nowadays are making laptops and they got into laptop business either recently of few years back.

My First Question is (from your own/personal experience):
Which brand shall I go for? forget about the specifications, I'm not talking about that, I'm asking about the brand itself.

I'm asking because personally, I trust (for example) Sony and Dell more than I trust Acer, LG, Samsung and other brands.
I know some may say "all made in China, dude" but still, I think there are some differences.

My Second Question is (from your own/personal experience):
Shall I buy a new or used laptop?

I know it depends on:
1- Me
2- My budget
3- the laptop I'm buying itself (whether it's used for very short period or not)
4- other factors (maybe)

Me? I always think, actually believe that NEW laptops or any other device is way better than used, simply because you have no idea what the other people did to that device when it was with him/her.

Above all, I believe that USED laptops have a major disadvantage which is the battery. Perhaps you can't use the battery and you need to plug the cable and use the A/C power. In my opinion, laptops should always be portable, otherwise what's the big deal of using PCs instead?

Not to mention more other stuff.

On the other hand, if you're short in money/budget and need a laptop, I think you have either to save for a better option or buy USED one.

It's an endless debate because eventually it's all up to what people think and what.
In my opinion, I think there are some standards that one has to take into consideration before buying a laptop.


I'd like to hear from you. What do you think about that?
Forget about me :) if I have lots of money, I'd go for Sony Viao for sure :) or Macbook :P I'm just trying to know how other people think about it.

Thank you :)

[TheNessus]

Your considerations should be these:

- Desired screen size - anywhere from 17" to 10". 15.6 is most common. I think 13.3 is ideal for portability because they're lighter and endure more battery time.

- Battery life - again, smaller means they last longer, but some have specially made power-conserving processors and have weak graphics card, some have strong processors and graphics card which would waste your battery.

- weight - 10" lappies may weigh a kilo. 15" usually weigh 3 kilos. 13" are somewhere in between.

- processor - do you play heavy-duty games or do you use it for word processors and a bit of surfing? do you use it for heavy applications that need a lot of processing power? discussed earlier in battery life.

- budget - heavy and big cost less. Small 'netbooks', i.e. Atom-based weak laptops within 10-12 inches, 10 hour battery life... these cost the least. 15" laptops with good processors and cards would cost a default price of 600$ or so, and have a weak battery life (2 hours). some 13" laptops incorporate power as well as good weight and good battery life, but may cost 1000$ or so, less or more depends on how good the processor is. some 12" lappies may cost even 5000$ if they're top-notch and made for business folk.

Personally, I have a dell N3010, it can reach 6 hours and has an i3 intel processor, so I'm very satisfied. I had a 15" before which caused me back pain since I use it for college and had a crappy bat life.

Brands don't matter as much. It's all pretty much the same.

[philinux]

I just bought an Acer 1410.

I was initially warned off Acer among others.

Can say I'm really happy with the build quality it is excellent.

I'm using Maverick and the model I bought hardly gets warm at all, has excellent battery life and everything works.

[Grenage]

I prefer HP, but have some Acers. Lenovo (IBM) are ok, but I rate their build quality with that of Acer. Apple's are very nice; I hate VAIO kit.

Personally, I go with whatever has the biggest screen and keyboard, and a decent processor. Battery life and weight aren't important to me; it's usually plugged in, and I'm not a small person.

[armageddon08]

I still love the Thinkpad workhorses from IBM/Lenovo.

[blueturtl]

More important than branding is that you buy a high-end model. This is because few brands besides Apple refuse to sell in the less than 1000 monetary unit price bracket. Build-quality is hit and miss with these machines, especially under 500 units.

I think the best deal is to get a system that is two or three years old and used to be high-end when it was new. This way you get a decent machine for a decent price.

If you must have a new system cheap you'll have to compromise on build-quality and specifications.

Business quality units from these brands have earned my trust as far as build quality goes:

HP
Toshiba
Dell
IBM (not Lenovo!)
Apple

In the lower price segment, I have not been impressed by any of the above.

[Grenage]

There are exceptions.

A few years ago I purchased a new HP business laptop on offer for £199! It was one of the best laptops I ever bought.

[amjjawad]

Thank you guys, I appreciate your replies :)

However, I'm still waiting for your opinion about Old vs New debate :)
I know the most important thing in this debate is "How much money do you have or can spend to buy a laptop?"
But ... my question isn't really about money, I'm talking about the "technical" side.
Used laptops means:
1- Battery could be dead and you have to plug it all the time..
2- You have no idea how the person before you was using that laptop.
3- The HDD could be dying - kind of related to #2.
4- Any other defect or something wrong.

As I mentioned before, I always advice my friends to get new machine (especially laptops) but again, I'd like to know what other people think and that's exactly why I started this thread :)

Also, still looking for more opinion regarding the brands. So far, brand doesn't matter but let's see maybe some other people have different opinion :)

[LowSky]

Dont buy used unless its a popular brand like a Lenovo Thinkpad where you can find replacement batteries years and years later. Actually that rule really applies to new as well.

Otherwise I would only be concerned about the screen. Hard drives are easily replaced if they go bad, but screen replacements can be a bit more tricky.

[amjjawad]

Your considerations should be these:

- Desired screen size - anywhere from 17" to 10". 15.6 is most common. I think 13.3 is ideal for portability because they're lighter and endure more battery time.

- Battery life - again, smaller means they last longer, but some have specially made power-conserving processors and have weak graphics card, some have strong processors and graphics card which would waste your battery.

- weight - 10" lappies may weigh a kilo. 15" usually weigh 3 kilos. 13" are somewhere in between.

- processor - do you play heavy-duty games or do you use it for word processors and a bit of surfing? do you use it for heavy applications that need a lot of processing power? discussed earlier in battery life.

- budget - heavy and big cost less. Small 'netbooks', i.e. Atom-based weak laptops within 10-12 inches, 10 hour battery life... these cost the least. 15" laptops with good processors and cards would cost a default price of 600$ or so, and have a weak battery life (2 hours). some 13" laptops incorporate power as well as good weight and good battery life, but may cost 1000$ or so, less or more depends on how good the processor is. some 12" lappies may cost even 5000$ if they're top-notch and made for business folk.

Personally, I have a dell N3010, it can reach 6 hours and has an i3 intel processor, so I'm very satisfied. I had a 15" before which caused me back pain since I use it for college and had a crappy bat life.

Brands don't matter as much. It's all pretty much the same.

I liked what you wrote, thanks a lot :)
I always care about these stuff but I forgot about it when I started this thread.
For me, I always prefer to go for a machine that has everything, not necessarily to be the latest but definitely all the options like Graphics Card, etc. However, in my case, always the budget was the reason why I don't go for full-option machine.
Why do I like to go for full-option machine? is because if I'll buy a machine now say without Graphics Card (I mean it's built-in and doesn't have dedicated one), webcam and 13" screen ... after 3 months, I come to know that I need another machine. You know what I mean?
But again, it's a loop. If you have money, you go for full-option and if you don't have money, you go for less options ...etc.
After one year or two years, your machine (laptop) is going to be old.

I know some people how buy new laptops every year but that's crazy if you ask me. My PC is 4.5 years old but I'm so happy with it.

[chessnerd]

Here is my personal experience:

1. Don't get used
I purchased a $190 laptop from my aunt's office. It wasn't great, but it wasn't terrible. However, after about a year and a half, both of the hinges broke on the laptop. From that point on, I had to use my external CD drive to prop up the lid when I was using (effectively making it a mobile desktop). Looking back, it's obvious. The person who owned it before didn't care about the laptop because it was their work laptop. They were going to be getting a new one in two years anyway, so they didn't treat it well. Unless you know the previous user, and know that they treated it nicely, I wouldn't get used.

2. Refurbished is fine
My sister bought a refurbished Dell and it has served her quite well. The only issue was that our dog chewed on the power cord and she dropped it, killing the hard drive. Easy fixes for both: new power cord and new hard drive respectively. Those were not the fault of any previous owner or the manufacturer.

3. Don't get an Acer
For the love of all that is good in this universe, don't ever get an Acer laptop. My experience with this Gateway has been less than satisfactory (to put it lightly). I only found out later that Gateway was bought out by Acer about a year before I got it. Ever since then, Gateway's quality has gone down the tubes. It really is a shame, because my family's three Gateway desktops all performed admirably. One is still in very regular service after 8 years and looks to have several more in it (despite being left on 24/7 for most of those years).

What would I recommend? A Dell, an HP, a Lenovo, or, if you can stomach the price and the taste, a Mac. (I hate Apple, but they make solid hardware.)

[amjjawad]

Thanks chessnerd :)
Looks like you hate Acer :P I don't like it too and I remember two of my friends have Acer Laptop. I used to fix their laptops but it was just formatting and installation so not that big deal anyway. I don't know why I don't like Acer, I just do.


A side note ... I can see that Sony Viao and HP are both expensive.
Toshiba's price is reasonable and Dell as well. Sometimes, I find good specifications (Dell) with amazing price. Always Dell is cheaper than HP.
Of course I'm talking about same specifications but different brands.
Weird thing is, I can't find IBM nowadays. Perhaps I need to look in somewhere else.

Apple? I wish I could buy one but ... it's very expensive for me!

[blueturtl]

Thank you guys, I appreciate your replies :)

However, I'm still waiting for your opinion about Old vs New debate :)
I know the most important thing in this debate is "How much money do you have or can spend to buy a laptop?"
But ... my question isn't really about money, I'm talking about the "technical" side.
Used laptops means:
1- Battery could be dead and you have to plug it all the time..
2- You have no idea how the person before you was using that laptop.
3- The HDD could be dying - kind of related to #2.
4- Any other defect or something wrong.

As I mentioned before, I always advice my friends to get new machine (especially laptops) but again, I'd like to know what other people think and that's exactly why I started this thread :)

Also, still looking for more opinion regarding the brands. So far, brand doesn't matter but let's see maybe some other people have different opinion :)

1. Batteries can be replaced
2. Does not matter unless they were psychotic
3. Can be replaced
4. Read my first post :)

Like I stated. Most of the hardware injuries used laptops sustain are those that have to do with wear. A portable that was designed for a reasonable life expectancy and built out of quality parts is still a safer bet then getting a new system that wasn't that expensive to begin with.

Unless the Thinkpad owner dunked his in a lake or something, you'd still be safer as far as quality goes. My father-in-law actually dropped his Thinkpad from a plane on takeoff (forgot to close the luggage hatch) and the machine lived.

If money is not an issue, why do you even ask such questions? Just buy a top end model new, that way you won't have to worry about what the previous owner did. edit: Ok so you wanted to know why someone's opinion might differ from yours. In summary, mine differs because I think it's crazy to pay two or three times the price for a machine that really isn't that much worse after two or three years of use.

[Grenage]

On the plus side, you can rearrange the keys on Acer laptops....

Most manufacturers (like HP) have one or two keys with slightly different or angled clips, for no good reason other than to p** me off. That's probably not going to affect most people.

[cartman640]

Personally I have a MacBook Pro (3,1 model, from 2007) which is still going strong. I'm not rough in the treatment of laptops, but I don't carry them round on a bed of feathers either. I expect that over the years they'll take a few knocks, and my MacBook Pro has certainly had its share of bumps. The only thing I've had to do is replace the battery (which spares are readily available), after it started loosing capacity.

I've also owned an Acer (not a cheap one either, was at their top end) and it lasted a bit over a year before literally falling to pieces. The casing broke around the screen hinges, battery life was reduced to less than 10 minutes, the screws fell out of it causing the DVD drive to fall out on occasion and it was very flimsy.

I'd certainly recommend buying high end/business laptops, they may just look like a lot of extra money at the time, but after 3 years you can expect a high end laptop (like the MacBook Pro) to still be running without any issues. Also look for features like drop sensors (these are pretty common on decent machines), if you've got a normal spinning HDD they can save your data on the off chance the machine gets pushed off a table or something.

Other brands that have impressed me are Sony, HP - but only their business models and IBM ThinkPads.

I'd be very wary buying second hand laptops, if you do factor in the cost of a new battery, power adapter and hard drive.

[sidzen]

old but valid --
http://www.tomshardware.com/news/most-least-reliable-notebooks-laptops,9102.html

[amjjawad]

1. Batteries can be replaced
2. Does not matter unless they were psychotic
3. Can be replaced
4. Read my first post :)

Then eventually the price of a used laptop will be almost the same as the price of new one :)



If money is not an issue, why do you even ask such questions? Just buy a top end model new, that way you won't have to worry about what the previous owner did.

edit: Ok so you wanted to know why someone's opinion might differ from yours. In summary, mine differs because I think it's crazy to pay two or three times the price for a machine that really isn't that much worse after two or three years of use.

I think you asked and you answered your question :)

Yes, that's all what I care about and would like to know so thanks for your opinion :)

[amjjawad]

old but valid --
http://www.tomshardware.com/news/most-least-reliable-notebooks-laptops,9102.html

Very nice one, really like it :)

Thanks!

[libssd]

If money is an issue, consider buying a manufacturer refurbished laptop. Computer components are most likely to fail in the first 48 hours; by getting a refurb, you save money, and it's already gone through the burn-in process. These are usually available through manufacturer web sites.

Size is a matter of personal preference; 15.7" laptops are the sweet spot for price, but they are too large for my taste. I travel by motorcycle a lot, so size is critical for me; I have an Acer D150 netbook, which I absolutely love. After replacing the 160gb HDD with a 32gb SSD (for speed and shock resistance), and popping in 2gb of RAM (not really needed with Linux, but you can never have too much memory), the little AA1 really flies.

At one time, Toshiba was one of the few laptop makers that actually provided Windows restore discs as part of the initial package. Ability to restore/reinstall Windows is important if you plan to partition and install Linux -- "stuff" happens, and dealers will often turn up their noses if they find a foreign OS on the machine -- even though it should have no impact whatsoever on hardware issues.

I haven't been impressed with the durability/reliability of Sony VAIOs, which I think are overpriced, like Macs, but without the distinctive qualities that allow Apple to charge premium prices. If you're going to run Linux, I don't see any reason to spend the extra money for a Mac.

But they are all pretty reliable these days; perhaps the most critical part is how a given machine "feels" to you, especially interaction with the keyboard and trackpad. Visit a store with a large selection, then pick whatever "fits" best, even if you end up buying online. Amazon is far and away my favorite online retailer for electronics and computers.

[blueturtl]

Then eventually the price of a used laptop will be almost the same as the price of new one :)

A new HDD for laptops is 50-100 euros. New battery closer to a 100. Let's assume a worst case scenario where you have to buy both. If it was a 1500 euro portable computer that you bought used for about 500-600 euros, these replacements still don't come near the alleged value of a new similar quality pc. If on the other hand you're talking about the 299,- original retail price laptop, then yes, probably not worth the trouble. Of course a computer that originally cost 299 is still more prone to all kinds of failures so the point is sort of moot.


I think you asked and you answered your question :)

Yes, that's all what I care about and would like to know so thanks for your opinion :)

Well look, so I did. Nah, I just didn't read your original post with enough thought it seems. Happens all the time with me. :D

[samalex]

For branding I've used Dell, HP, Apple, and System76 laptops, and I have to say System76 is great for Linux. They generally support the latest distro on day one and their support forum here on Ubuntu Forums is wonderful.

And for Used vs New, I think that depends on how long you plan on using it. From my experience most laptops (excluding Macs) will run solid for about 3 years, and after that you start seeing problems like plastic breaking, dead pixels, external ports just not being as snug as they once were, etc. I say excluding Macs because I have a 6 year old iMac G4 and 3 year old MacBook, and the iBook just a few months ago the power cord started to come loose from the brick so it won't charge well, but even running OSX 10.5 it runs great. And the PowerMac is as solid as the day we bought it running OSX 10.6 and hopefully 10.7 soon :)

My System76 laptop is alittle over one year old, and thus far the only problem I've had with it is the webcam quit working. It's detected but Linux picks it up as the wrong webcam so the drivers won't work. The System76 guys were more than happy to fix it since I called the day my warranty ran out, but I opted to just live with it as-is since I don't use the webcam much and I didn't want to part with my laptop for any extended amount of time since it's my primary system. I'll get an external webcam eventually.

Battery life is an issue, as you mentioned, but for comparison my 1 year old System76 laptop runs for about 90 minutes on a full charge but the 3 year old Macbook and 6 year old iBook both still get well over 3 hours on a full charge! But heck I have an 8088 Tandy laptop that'll run for 30 minutes on a charge and that battery is going on 20 years old now :)

With all this being said, if you can find a good 2-3 year old Intel-based MacBook or MacBook Pro I think you'd be happy. It gives you the best of all three worlds with the ability to run Linux, Windows, or OSX, plus those things are solid! Looks like EBay has several for $700-$800 which isn't bad. But if you're looking for something just to run Linux I can't say enough good about System76, and for around $1000 you can get a NICE laptop with all the bells and whistles with awesome support to boot.

Just some thoughts --

Sam

[3Miro]

Every Dell laptop that I have ever seen has been a piece of junk. That counts for their Desktops too. I don't trust Dell, I think they just made a name for themselves and now they sell overpriced garbage.

I have a Lenovo and that too is a piece of garbage. I knew that when I bought it, I simply got the cheapest that I can find at the time, so I am willing to give them the benefit of the doubt and consider their higher end products. (btw the Lenovo works and thanks to Linux it is very stable, my problem is that it is slow and couple of keys on the keyboard don't work)

My wife has a nice System76, I am not sure about their current Pangolin laptops with ATI video, I would rather wait for ATI Radoen 5xxx or Nvidia before I consider that line, but we are very happy with the older Nvidia Pangolin. I do recommend Sys76.

I wouldn't buy a used laptop. Lappies are very sensitive about heat and dust, if someone had it overheating all the time, there is not much live left in it (that counts for CPU, GPU and most importantly HDD). However, that is where money come to play too, if used is all you can afford, go for it (just be mindful of possible issues).

[amjjawad]

I just came back from the mall and I'm really surprised.
HP Laptops are much cheaper compared to other brands with same specifications or even better. I mean, I checked for example HP Core 5 with dedicated Graphics Card, 4GB RAM, 500GB HDD, 15.6" screen and not sure what else... it was cheaper than other brands with less specifications.
Also, I was a bit shocked that Acer is more expensive than HP.
Sony Viao is still the most expensive laptops.
Dell Laptops' prices are not bad too.

They don't have Mac and I'm not even thinking to get one because I don't have that budget.

I guess I'll go for a new one UNLESS I'll find a used one with very good price and condition.

After all, I'm thinking to spend less than 1000USD and I could find a very good laptop with less than this price.

[Khakilang]

Buying a used laptop has some disadvantages. You have to be aware of device like CD/DVD ROM, hard disk, battery and keyboard may fail overtime due to wear and tear. That may end up being have to spend extras to replace those devices and if they are available. But I bought a used IBM Thinkpad and its still working for over a year now running 9.10 although it say the hard disk is failing. Sometime its a matter of luck.

[amjjawad]

The latest update
I guess I found someone who has Sony Vaio Laptop and willing to sell it. I think it's 5 years old but regardless of this fact, I didn't see it yet and not sure what's its condition.

For those who are experienced with old laptops/PCs, how do I check the hard disk whether it has a problem or not? I know about Windows Tools but I'm asking if there's a better tool with more accuracy. Yes, I don't trust Windows :P

I was about to buy new laptop today but I got a call from a friend regarding that laptop. I'll wait until I see it.

[jhsu802701]

I think a new laptop is a better value than a used one. Laptop computers seem to depreciate very slowly, yet they are more vulnerable to wear and tear and have a battery that can be very expensive to replace. I once considered buying a used laptop but ended up buying a new one from Dell because the used laptops cost just as much or even more. Any used laptop on the market for substantially less than a new starter Dell was very old.

On the other hand, I think a used desktop is a better value than a new one. Desktop computers depreciate rapidly but are subject to less wear and tear than laptops. I recently bought a 4-year-old HP DC7600 with a 3.4 GHz Pentium D processor, 1 GB of RAM (expandable to 4 GB), and a 40 GB hard drive for only $45. As Linux users, we don't need the latest and greatest in computer hardware. Ubuntu, Mint, Fedora, etc. are bloatware by Linux standards but are no more demanding of computer resources than Windows XP, which was TWO operating systems ago in the Windows world.

[Shakz]

Buy New....Asus or Dell. Rock solid. Although Dells Broadcom wireless cards **** me off sometimes.

[amjjawad]

I didn't buy one yet :( I've been crazily busy for the last couple of months with real life-problems.

Anyway, to summarize the whole thread and put that in few words:



NEW Laptops BEAT Old Laptops


Now, I'm a bit confused when it comes to brand. Excluding Acer as lots of users agreed that it's bad idea to go for Acer even though some confirmed they have no problems with their Acer laptops.
Also, exclude Mac as I really can't offered to pay for it.

What do you think about these brands and how you rate them (I know one might think a brand doesn't really matter but when it comes to prices, one could find a better deal with different brand, same specifications.

Vote for the best brand or arrange according to what you think is better:



Dell
HP
Toshiba
Sony
LG
IBM
Samsung
Fujitsu
Asus
Other


Thank you :)

P.S.
I like to hear/read from others. I have my own standards but I care for the other opinion :)


Edit:
I made a poll to make it easier :)

[Spice Weasel]

Elonex. Their old ultraportables are tanks. Mine from 1999 still works fine, no issues, even the battery is still working.

[amjjawad]

Elonex.

Never heard about it.
I'm talking about universal brands that one could find it anywhere not only in the US or Europe :)

[aaaantoine]

I've personally had mixed results with Acer. On one hand my going-on-4-years-old Acer laptop, which is my primary work machine, still runs fine (except for the terrible performance of the GPU -- though that might be more KDE than anything else). Meanwhile, my wife's Acer laptop, which was a good 16 months newer than mine, suffered a motherboard power short (http://www.powerjackrepair.org/blinkinglaptopadapter.html) over the Summer, rendering it useless, which is a shame because it was a superior machine to mine on all fronts.

Personally when I've shopped laptops I've always gone for the cheapest one fitting a certain criteria (which, in general, is: no Celeron/Sempron CPUs, more than average amount of RAM, no Intel graphics). I guess that's why I always wind up buying Acer.

A friend of mine has historically had trouble with HP motherboards, so I generally avoid them.

I've never really seen Samsung, Fujitsu, or LG laptops, so I can't advise one way or the other on them.

I'm actually quite partial to the chiclet keys of Sony and Apple laptops, but I think that's more personal taste than anything else.

I take it you ruled out Gateway by their association to Acer?

I'd recommend that once you find a particular build you like, of any brand, read up on reviews of that brand and/or build. If you see just a disproportionate number of negative reviews (25% or more, I'd say), move on to another. Don't lock yourself into brand. A product's quality has more to do with the engineering of the product itself than the brand behind it.

[spoons]

All of them are pretty crappy to be honest. You have to choose between quality of the laptop, quality of the returns should you need it, specification suitability, etc. I don't like how laptops seem to have mammoth CPUs before they start giving you remotely useful graphics.

[amjjawad]

I take it you ruled out Gateway by their association to Acer?

We don't have it here, that's why I didn't mention it. Whatever I mentioned, is what I've seen here in the market, regardless where is here :)



I'd recommend that once you find a particular build you like, of any brand, read up on reviews of that brand and/or build. If you see just a disproportionate number of negative reviews (25% or more, I'd say), move on to another. Don't lock yourself into brand. A product's quality has more to do with the engineering of the product itself than the brand behind it.

Good advice, mate :)

Thanks for sharing your thoughts and experience :)

[amjjawad]

I'm not sure whether I asked that before or not but does anyone have any experience with LG and Samsung Laptops? I'm asking about Samsung because I'm seeing so good offers which are cheaper in price. I'm just concerned about the quality.

All what I know is Samsung is new in making Laptops while LG has been doing that for many years now.


As for the poll, I see HP is on the top :D

[Rachel_Eliason]

Well I've bucked the general trend on this list on two counts. I have always used either older or cheaper laptops. I'm a cheapskate. I had a Dell Inspiron that was from the 90's (96 I believe) that I used until about 03 or 04, and it worked fine. since then it's been an Assuss Ee Pc that lasted a good four years of hard work. I did have to replace the keyboard once, after my son spilled cream soda on it. Now the screen is out, but it still runs if you hook it to a monitor.

Currently I am using an Acer Aspire One. I've only had it a couple of months, so I can't comment on durability. however it gets a good five to six hours of battery life running Ubuntu.

Linux and cheaper machines seem to be a good combination for me. That's partially because I don't tax my machines heavily. I mostly do web surfing, a lot of it text based and writing.

[Austin25]

My HP has been breaking down I haven't used any other brand, but I must say, HP will not be getting my business.

[themarker0]

I love Acers, and Asus. Acer's Timeline series are just brillant. I had the original, loved it so much, put a recomendation in for them at work for last years pandemic H1N1 unit to use. 50 laptops or so, all of them still perfectly working after being abused. The worst has one missing key holder (Not an actual key but a blank one) and one screen died after it was pushed to far back,

[Guitar John]

I have bought my last 3 laptops used. A few good sources are:

http://www.thinkpaddepot.com/
http://www.laptopcloseout.com/


And, if you want to try Ubuntu on a used Mac:

https://www.usedmac.com/

I have had good luck with Dells that are 2-3 years old. Usually, the only hardware compatability issue I've had involves installing a Broadcomm 43xx driver to get the wireless working.

YMMV

[Rasa1111]

From my own experience...

I say IBM [Lenovo].
Thinkpads are the best laptops Ive ever used.
and the way the work with Linux is fantastic.

I've not seen one thinkpad, that will not just take any Linux OS, and install it, no problems.
Any Linux distro Ive ever thrown at a thinkpad~
is like butter.
Nice n smooth. lol

IBM/Lenovo, all the way. :KS

[amjjawad]

Thank you guys, appreciate that.

I see no one yet mentioned Samsung. I'm really looking for someone who used it. Apparently, it's still not that popular. I don't recall I've seen any post about Samsung here or perhaps there's but I didn't notice.

Thank you again :)

[Khakilang]

I had 1 IBM Thinpad, 2 IBM Think centre desktop and tower version and 1 Acer Aspier all been working great with various Distro like Ubuntu 9.10 for the laptop, PCLinuxOS XFCE, OpenSuse for IBM Think centre and Puppy Linux for Acer Aspire which has the lowest spec. I also had 1 Acerpower which hang frequently so I rule that one out. I will put my money on IBM anytime for used PC or laptop. Never had much experience with Lenovo though.

[Rasa1111]

I have not read or heard much about samsung laptops either.
Have you looked for any online reviews?

I see IBM is now on top!
as it should be. lol :P :D

[Rasa1111]

Khakilang~ I will put my money on IBM anytime for used PC or laptop. Never had much experience with Lenovo though.

Most definitely.

I have found though,
that I liked the IBM thinkpads/laptops better when they were IBM.
Now that they are owned by Lenovo , they feel a bit cheaper in quality to me..
but they are still great machines in my experience.

and you just cannot get a better pointing/control device than the track point! lol :D <3

[handy]

People use the laptop name inappropriately.

You guys (mostly) don't know what a laptop is, you have never seen one, let alone used or felt the weight of one.

Laptops were huge, they weighed in something like a portable sewing machine. Laptops were very big & heavy.

What you guys are talking about are notebooks, which even when large & heavy are very much light weights when compared to a genuine laptop.

What I do notice is happening, is due to the popular misconception of just what the definition of the word laptop means, the true meaning is slowly being eroded due to the inappropriate common usage to suit the erroneous public definition.

Therefore as time goes by, laptop is slowly coming to mean notebook. Even though in reality they are two very different things. (Have I said that already? :))

Funny that.

[NightwishFan]

No, I think Laptop and Notebook are the same thing. If they were not at one time they are now. Anyway...

Asus has never let me down.

[amjjawad]

I have not read or heard much about samsung laptops either.
Have you looked for any online reviews?

I see IBM is now on top!
as it should be. lol :P :D

Hahaha, well, let's wait and see :)

I did not yet because I need to eat something and drink my tea. First thing I do when I wake up and last thing I do before going to sleep is to come here and read/write posts :D

[linuxforartists]

I think the best deal is to get a system that is two or three years old and used to be high-end when it was new. This way you get a decent machine for a decent price.

I thought this was good advice. The best of both worlds: quality because it was a high-end machine, lower price because it's a little older. The other plus is better Linux compatibility, since it works better on older machines. With the latest hardware, it's a gamble whether there are Linux drivers (and whether they actually work).

Asus doesn't seem to be getting much love, so I'll put in a vote for them. I bought my current Asus almost by accident.

Screen proportions are important to me. At the time I bought my Asus, all the laptops in the shop had screens that were too wide and not tall enough. The Asus was the only one to have a more square-ish screen. I like that for watching videos.

While they're not well-known in America (how about Europe?), Asus is a major brand in Asia. (FYI: I bought my laptop in Taiwan, where Asus is based and where I lived at the time). They also specialize in high-end laptops. Asus has a line called Republic of Gamers (http://rog.asus.com/).

One of my friends is a hard-core gamer. He used to like Alienware, but swore off them after they were acquired by Dell. Now he only buys Asus laptops.

Asus really tries to push the limits in design and hardware. One example is their Bamboo Series (http://event.asus.com/notebook/bamboo/index2.html).

In a class by itself is the Asus NX90Jq (http://promos.asus.com/US/NX90Jq/). That monster has specs and looks that would make an Apple fanboy weep with envy.

Jeez, I should probably get a job in their marketing department. :tongue:

If I had to name a disadvantage, sometimes their computers are too cutting-edge. Many of their newer machines have switchable graphics cards, which Linux doesn't support yet, as far as I know.

The performance sometimes costs in shorter battery life. I joked to friends that the NX90Jq probably lasts 5 minutes when unplugged. They are actively working on this, though. Some of the newer non-gaming computers are claiming 10+ hours of battery life.

As if this wasn't detailed enough, I wrote a longer post on this thread: Most compatible brand of laptop for Linux (http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1620640&page=4). Mine is post #32.

Good luck with your choice!

[amjjawad]

People use the laptop name inappropriately.

You guys (mostly) don't know what a laptop is, you have never seen one, let alone used or felt the weight of one.

Laptops were huge, they weighed in something like a portable sewing machine. Laptops were very big & heavy.

What you guys are talking about are notebooks, which even when large & heavy are very much light weights when compared to a genuine laptop.

What I do notice is happening, is due to the popular misconception of just what the definition of the word laptop means, the true meaning is slowly being eroded due to the inappropriate common usage to suit the erroneous public definition.

Therefore as time goes by, laptop is slowly coming to mean notebook. Even though in reality they are two very different things. (Have I said that already? :))

Funny that.

For me, there are two laptops at home. Both are not mine but I fix and use both. Also, I used to fix my friends' laptops. It happened that those laptops were LG and other brands I can't remember now.

Anyway, not sure how huge, big and heavy you're talking about but I mean that machine with 14"-15.6" screen, etc etc. Definitely, I'm not talking about machines with 10" and 11" inch which you may refer to these as notebooks.
Also, IMB for example use: ThinkPad. Others may use different name.

[handy]

No, I think Laptop and Notebook are the same thing. If they were not at one time they are now. Anyway...

Asus has never let me down.

It would seem that you are obviously too young to know what you are talking about. If you knew the true history & had ever seen a genuine laptop you couldn't possibly have made that statement.

& by the way, Asus has certainly let me down, just like every other manufacturer has, even Gigabyte.

[handy]

For me, there are two laptops at home. Both are not mine but I fix and use both. Also, I used to fix my friends' laptops. It happened that those laptops were LG and other brands I can't remember now.

Anyway, not sure how huge, big and heavy you're talking about but I mean that machine with 14"-15.6" screen, etc etc. Definitely, I'm not talking about machines with 10" and 11" inch which you may refer to these as notebooks.
Also, IMB for example use: ThinkPad. Others may use different name.

None of what you speak are laptops, they are all notebooks. There is a huge difference in size & weight.

I owned genuine laptops, & was a computer tech for many years, so I know of what I speak.

The problem I'm currently facing is that in attempting to find valid history on the web to prove my points, I have found that it is surprisingly very thin & mostly erroneous.

So I'll have to do the best I can.

Here is a quote re. what may have been the first "laptop":

The Osbourne 1: As with nearly any technology, the laptop PC didn't come from one singular source, but rather was built upon the ideas of many. Some trace the first laptop back to the Osbourne 1, which was developed by book publisher turned computer engineer Adam Osbourne in 1981. The Osbourne 1 was portable, contained 2 floppy disk drives, had a fold-out keyboard and looked more like a piece of luggage than what we now expect out of a laptop. It had a tiny screen and weighed 24 pounds. With its high price tag and bulkiness, it never really had a chance.

Here are some words & pictures of the progression from laptop to notebook, that might give you an idea of the difference (even though the writer of the article is young enough to have an ambiguous idea of the true definitions of the word himself!):

http://www.cheaperlaptop.com/history.html

[edit:] Following is a link to some more on the history of the laptop, though once again, the writer is too young to know from experience what he is talking about so his definitions are inherited from the wiki instead of known from his experience:

https://www.mln.com.au/info/?type=laptophistory

[Rasa1111]

It would seem that you are obviously too young to know what you are talking about. If you knew the true history & had ever seen a genuine laptop you couldn't possibly have made that statement.

& by the way, Asus has certainly let me down, just like every other manufacturer has, even Gigabyte.

It would seem that it really is a moot point,
and kinda pointless/meaningless to get into here.
Who cares?
What does it matter?

what difference will it make?

None.

I mean really,
who cares what people call something by.
"notebook" "laptop"
"car" vehicle"
"plane" "aircraft"
etc
etc
etc

who cares!?!

Seems like only you.

But thanks for letting us know that your "laptop/notebook" knowledge is superior to all, it's fantastic that you shared that.
Great to know! :rolleyes:

anyway,
back to the actual thread..


Hahaha, well, let's wait and see


lol, let's! :P
<3

[handy]

I can tell that you have had a great deal of experience in the research & debating fields... lol

Due to my being well over 50 years old, I have seen a thing or two that you haven't.

Sometimes an obvious misinterpretation of a definition can rub me the wrong way a bit, but I agree, in the end it is an absolutely worthless topic to pursue, like most of the other stuff in the Cafe.

Most people are in the Cafe because they find TV (if they have one, I don't :)) dumb & boring & are looking for a more dynamic form of stimulation. :)

We carry on...

[Rasa1111]

I can tell that you have had a great deal of experience in the research & debating fields... lol

Due to my being well over 50 years old, I have seen a thing or two that you haven't.

Sometimes an obvious misinterpretation of a definition can rub me the wrong way a bit, but I agree, in the end it is an absolutely worthless topic to pursue, like most of the other stuff in the Cafe.

Most people are in the Cafe because they find TV (if they have one, I don't :)) dumb & boring & are looking for a more dynamic form of stimulation. :)

We carry on...


ok, so you are 50 and have seen some thing i have not!
Great!

again..

So? lol

I am 30 and have seen things you have not,
what is the point?

I don't have a television either..
not for the last 7 years or so. lol

Stay vigilant my friend. lol ;)

[handy]

@Rasa1111: I saw much of the 50's & all of 60's & the 70's; I remember Sputnik; I saw the live TV coverage of the Moon landing; the Vietnam war was in my time; both the Kenedy's were assassinated; Woodstock; Jimi Hendrix; pre-AIDS sexual freedom; legal LSD; I remember when rebellion, hope & idealism was the popular trend of the youth of the day!!!

Computer stuff moved into the world of every-man; Steve Jobs & Alan Kay, bought the GUI to the consumer market; the Amiga was born; as was the cumbersome laptop computer; you may have been born shortly after this...

In your time you'll get to see much more of the effects of the progression of global warming & the energy crisis re. our biosphere & humanity as a whole than I will, (that is if we both live to 80 or so years of age).

I must say that you still write like a person much younger than 30 though, (no offence intended) I actually have my doubts about your age, but, hey, I've been wrong before... lol

If you are actually younger than you say then what I say still holds true, you'll just probably get to experience more of it...

[Rasa1111]

:lol:

I've no need to lie about my age, mate.
that's just silly.

and no offence taken.. lol
it is true that I am not like most people my age.
and I am glad for it. ;)

Since we're already waayy off topic, what the hell,
my aplogies mods, and OP,
sorry mate.

But I do envy you, Handy~ for getting to experience all of the things that have made todays world what it is.

I have read a lot, and still read the great stuff i find,
pertaining to the "good ole days".

I often wish I could have been alive in those days.
50's, 60's, 70's.
All feel like they would have been very exciting times.

Not to say that times now are not "exciting".
they are definitely 'exciting',
to say the least... lol

But the 50's and 60's just seem...
I don't know...
Like I would really loved to have experienced it for myself,
at the age I am now...perhaps... :lol:

hmm...
Still not sure I see the point of this..
But that's fine. lol

Peace.

Sorry again OP.
ill stay on topic now. :P <3

[amjjawad]

None of what you speak are laptops, they are all notebooks. There is a huge difference in size & weight.

I owned genuine laptops, & was a computer tech for many years, so I know of what I speak.

The problem I'm currently facing is that in attempting to find valid history on the web to prove my points, I have found that it is surprisingly very thin & mostly erroneous.

So I'll have to do the best I can.

Here is a quote re. what may have been the first "laptop":

The Osbourne 1: As with nearly any technology, the laptop PC didn't come from one singular source, but rather was built upon the ideas of many. Some trace the first laptop back to the Osbourne 1, which was developed by book publisher turned computer engineer Adam Osbourne in 1981. The Osbourne 1 was portable, contained 2 floppy disk drives, had a fold-out keyboard and looked more like a piece of luggage than what we now expect out of a laptop. It had a tiny screen and weighed 24 pounds. With its high price tag and bulkiness, it never really had a chance.

Here are some words & pictures of the progression from laptop to notebook, that might give you an idea of the difference (even though the writer of the article is young enough to have an ambiguous idea of the true definitions of the word himself!):

http://www.cheaperlaptop.com/history.html

[edit:] Following is a link to some more on the history of the laptop, though once again, the writer is too young to know from experience what he is talking about so his definitions are inherited from the wiki instead of known from his experience:

https://www.mln.com.au/info/?type=laptophistory

Handy, I'm almost 30 years old and I've never seen such laptops in my whole life and it's really good to know the early generation of "laptops" as it's always good to know/learn about "history" but with all due respect and I don't mean to be rude or offend you but do we look like talking about the first generation about laptops here? :)

Perhaps you've seen and used these machines but most of the people did not. I'm just wondering what made you start that topic anyway?

Sorry, no hard feelings but I just want to stick with the topic of this thread.

Thank you for your understanding :)

[amjjawad]

Handy and Rasa1111,

Please, do me a favor and "stick" with the topic and don't go off topic, please!

Handy, I'm definitely from a different culture than you. In my country, we do respect old people a lot. No offense taken and I don't mean anyone at all, I'm just talking in general. I do respect your opinions the most but ... don't you think the topic that you've started is way behind the scope and the aim of this thread? perhaps I'm wrong but just think about it :)

Sorry guys, you're definitely free to speak your mind but let's do our best to stay within the topic of this thread.

Now, were where we? Samsung is the best latop/notebook/machine on earth and HP, IBM, Sony and Dell SUCK big time, right? wait a min, who said that? :)

Back to business ;)

[NCLI]

Where is Lenovo? I love me some Thinkpad!

[ukripper]

In past I had IBM, ASUS and now I am using 14.1" dell vostro 1400 core2duo since 3 years without any problem, hence consider it to be very reliable and 9 cell battery gives me good 6.5 hours with ubuntu, can't knock it. Therefore, my vote goes to Dell for its reliability,battery life, sturdiness and very usable performance for my development work.

[amjjawad]

Where is Lenovo? I love me some Thinkpad!

I thought they still with IBM so I used "IBM" word instead.
http://www.lenovo.com/lenovo/us/en/our_company.html

Few people are using it here so I perhaps didn't remember it thus didn't mention it much :)

[amjjawad]

In past I had IBM, ASUS and now I am using 14.1" dell vostro 1400 core2duo since 3 years without any problem, hence consider it to be very reliable and 9 cell battery gives me good 6.5 hours with ubuntu, can't knock it. Therefore, my vote goes to Dell for its reliability,battery life, sturdiness and very usable performance for my development work.

Beside the good/not bad reputation of Dell, the prices are really reasonable comparing to others Brand. Excluding Macbooks, Sony Viao machines are so expensive indeed. I used to find HP also expensive but for some reason I noticed lately that their prices are less now.

[handy]

@amjjawad: My apologies, it was not my intention to move the thread off topic, though I think I do that all over the place here. :)

Primarily I was pointing out that an old bloke like me sees the current use of the name laptop used on what are truly notebooks as a misnomer.

I am also seeing that due to the popular usage of this misnomer, it is gradually losing its true meaning & swallowing the name notebook.

So, in perhaps an obscure way, if we consider the names laptop & notebook to be brands, then what I am saying fits with the title of the thread. :)

If seen that way, the old brand name "laptop" is winning over the new much smaller technology that was branded "notebook".

I'll be quiet now, enjoy your thread. :)

[amjjawad]

@amjjawad: My apologies, it was not my intention to move the thread off topic, though I think I do that all over the place here. :)

Don't worry about it :)



So, in perhaps an obscure way, if we consider the names laptop & notebook to be brands, then what I am saying fits with the title of the thread. :)


Just to clear it to everyone here: I chose that title because:
1- I wanted to talk about Laptops
2- Brands of Laptops
3- Old Laptop vs New Laptops Debate
4- I know the title doesn't mention it but I want also to talk about the Prices of Laptops.

ALL together, we could come up with a nice thread that has lots of information related to Laptops.
Even if I won't buy one, I'd love to know what other things (now, I know how you think about it) and share my opinion with others. Sharing opinion is one of my interests.
Yes, I'm planning to get one but I'm just concerned that I'll stop eating and drinking soon with 3 machines at one place :)

[treesurf]

I've got a Lenovo Ideapad right now. It's been about a year and a half of fairly rough use and one of the hinges is starting to get a little wiggly. Other than that it's been quite good. Good specs for the price.


By the way, handy, my father wrote a book using one of these laptops. 2.5mhz processor!!:
http://oldcomputers.net/kayproii.html

[HankB]

My vote is for IBM/Lenovo. In fact, I'm typing this on a two year old Lenovo Thinkpad T500 which has keys and trackpad that are pretty shiny from use. They've retained good keyboard feel through the years. My first Thinkpad was a 750 Cs (33 Mhz 486, 12 MB RAM IIRC and I don't even remember how big the HD was.) But it was capable of running Linux at the time! Most of my Thinkpads still run. I also have an Asus Eee PC 901 which I like a lot.

[Guitar John]

From my own experience...

I say IBM [Lenovo].
Thinkpads are the best laptops Ive ever used.
and the way the work with Linux is fantastic.
<snip>
IBM/Lenovo, all the way. :KS

After my recent coffee mishap (http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1630516), I'll probably go with a ThinkPad next time. They are very well built. I like the roll cage, isolation mounted hard-drive, and definitely the spill resistant keyboard.

[beetleman64]

1. You're unlikely to go too far wrong with either Toshiba, DELL or Lenovo. Just avoid Fujitsu. I have one and it is a joke. Assuming you want to run Linux, you will encounter all manner of problems. See if you can get hardware which has been certified by Canonical.

2. Depends, but be warned that if anything goes wrong with a laptop you're on your own. I'd advise buying new, but don't shell out on an expensive warranty. I did and I just wasted my money.

[DrBunsen]

My advice would be to go for top-end business machines, bought refurbished at about 3-4 years old.

Contrary to what some have said, pick one brand, study it, and come up with a short list. Know the accessories (docking stations, optical drives, etc.), know the parts (like batteries), know what support the manufacturer gives in terms of drivers and documentation.

For some years I did the 'cutting edge' technology thing, and spent a lot of cash on machines/components that depreciated very quickly. I learned to rely on my employer for new tech, and weaned myself onto slightly older tech when buying with my own cash. In that way I'm a cheapskate, however I only buy top-end kit second hand and still benefit from excellent durability.

Manufacturers talk about the 'bathtub curve' for plotting failures. Generally there's a high initial rate of failures due to manufacturing or component faults, tailing off quickly, then a long run of near-zero failures, then a ramp-up as components/assembly exhibit end-of-life failures. The difference between brands, and indeed between business and consumer models within a brand, is the length of that flat-line. In my experience the IBM ThinkPads have one of the longest zero-failure phases... I expect 8-10 years before the curve heads up and things start failing.

Five years ago I bought a used ThinkPad X31. £1800 new, £300 used on ebay. Turned up looking even better than the photos, i.e. nearly new. Battery started to give up 2 years ago, so I bought a new one for about £50 posted. Back to 5+ hours battery life still. It's 8 years old now, the keyboard has been worn shiny by me, it's been all over the place with me, but still works as well as when I bought it.

Three months ago my girlfriend was looking for a laptop. Her old VAIO had died (power circuitry) and I never really liked it, having fixed it up several times - a bit plastic and a bit underwhelming. I steered her to ThinkPads and we settled on a T43, from a refurbisher selling on ebay. It turned up looking near perfect, with just one old asset sticker outline on the base to hint at a previous life. Battery fine, screen perfect, keyboard looked new. £150 for a machine that was £1700 new. Better than that, it turned up with the high-res screen, not the 1024x768 I was expecting.

Recently I've picked up three 'beaters' for tinkering, old X20/X21 ThinkPads for about £45 each posted. All were basically tidy and functional but being old I've added memory, picked up a 2nd docking station, upgraded CD-ROM to DVD-ROM, swapped mini-pci card to add ethernet to a poverty-spec model, replaced flagging CMOS batteries, etc. The bits cost pennies 2nd hand, but I knew the models inside out (literally!) and knew specific part numbers to search for. I'd done my homework ;)

The beauty of the really popular corporate business machines is that there are an awful lot of them about 2nd hand, broken for parts, etc., so if you need parts you can get them. Try searching on ebay and see how many parts and spares are available for your short-listed models.

If you go down the IBM route, know what type/model numbers are (e.g. 2672-1LG, my exact X31 model), where to download an HMM (Hardware Maintenance Manual) for your model (contains part listing, error codes & troubleshooting, parts replacement instructions with exploded diagrams). Use ThinkWiki (http://www.thinkwiki.org) for its excellent model overview and linux-centric approach to installation and compatibility. Know which ones were the low-end models (i-series, r-series), which were the desktop-replacements (A-series), etc. My advice would be to look at the T-series for general notebook, or X-series for ultraportable.

Enjoy :)

[TNT1]

I got no preference for brand. I've run Ubuntu on Dell, HP, Toshiba, Lenovo and Mac. As long as the machine has the power for what I need, and runs Ubuntu,it's all good.

[amjjawad]

I do love this thread and I'd like to THANK each and everyone of you for making it very informative and rich of tips and advices :)

Funny thing is, I bought two brand new HP Laptops for two members of the family and I did not get one for me yet, neither old nor new.
I'm kind of the Technical or the IT guy in the family so everyone is asking for help when it comes to buy new machines or troubleshooting.

HP Pavilion dv6: Intel Core i5 - 4GB RAM - 500GB HDD - 1GB ATI Graphics Card

HP Pavilion g6: Intel Core i5 - 3GB RAM - 320GB HDD

BOTH are really great and I loved g6. It's just perfect when it comes to the Keyboard. I do have problems when I type on laptops. I always do spelling mistakes but with g6, I chatted for 4 hours with very few mistakes. Beside, it's very much cheap compared to its specifications.

I'm still not sure yet about me. Someone is about to send me a gift so hope it will be a laptop :P I have to wait until that time ;)


BY THE WAY, I still see that IBM is on the top.

[ajsoulmate]

Mine is sony :)

[Antarctica32]

I still love the Thinkpad workhorses from IBM/Lenovo.

My old thinkpads still run like tanks. Back when IBM was still in the PC market they were all about super high quality, gota love um!

[Antarctica32]

Lawl, Apple is not even on here. God I hate Apple

[amjjawad]

Lawl, Apple is not even on here. God I hate Apple

I wish I could get one but it's too expensive.
I have heard that their Hardware is very good. Not to mention that their OS is based on Unix. After all, it's not Windows so big YES for that :)

[Wizb]

I only have experience with Toshiba and Asus. I bought an Asus high end laptop (over $1000) for my daughter. It ran very hot and the screen went bad after about 3 years (I think she dropped it, but she denies it). I replaced it with a cheep ($460) refurbished Toshiba from Microcenter and she has had no problems with it so far.
I also bought a Toshiba for my other daughter about 2 years ago from Newegg (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834114658) ($550 at the time, no longer available) and it is still going strong with no problems.
This April I found an even cheaper refurbished Asus for myself from Newegg (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834220873) ($380). So far it works great but I don't really use it much. It is mostly a back up for when I was having problems with my Desktop.
Both brands are OK for low end laptops. The Toshiba seem to be better quality, however you can get a more powerful laptop cheaper with the Asus. Also if you keep Windows as the OS Asus comes loaded with a lot more useless programs than Toshiba.
You might want to check the customer reviews at Newegg and Amazon for whatever model you are considering.

[wolfen69]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I've just read a whole lotta 'pinions. :p

I usually like the last one I had that ran good. Right now it's Toshiba with intel chipsets. Don't buy the amd version unless you like doing workarounds.

I'm not saying I don't like amd, as it's been my cpu of choice for a long time. I'm just not happy about the amd/video thing. I'll stay with nvidia as long as it keeps working.

[wolfen69]

My old thinkpads still run like tanks. Back when IBM was still in the PC market they were all about super high quality, gota love um!

I had a thinkpad (X31?) for a bit that had a screwed up ide port. No hard drives allowed. I had puppy running from a flash drive like it was made for it. That was a sweet little computer. Fast as heck too.

People are amazed when I come over their house and resurrecting stuff they were ready to throw away. Once they see linux can do most things without selling a kidney, they like it.

But the people that get into linux the most, are the people that are new to computers. Untainted, no pre-opinions.

I've heard stories before about people who have no experience with computers other than linux. Windows may as well be a foreign language.

I started with mac years ago, but eventually got sucked in around 98. Now I just try to learn and have some value in life. It's tough though.

[amjjawad]

I still do love this thread :D
I do love it even more when I see IBM on the top :D

Hmmm, after many many years of waiting and thinking, etc etc ... I finally GOT Lenovo G570. It was unbelievable deal that I've never dreamed about. In fact, I left my house after many days of hard work on many things (mainly related to Lubuntu as I'm involved in too many things now) and no sleep (4hours MAX a day), I was walking and I found a deal that I wasn't even looking for ... THANK GOD, I got what I really wanted :D

Thanks again and I'll keep this thread going for sometime :)

[Thewhistlingwind]

But the people that get into linux the most, are the people that are new to computers. Untainted, no pre-opinions.

I've heard stories before about people who have no experience with computers other than linux. Windows may as well be a foreign language.

I started with mac years ago, but eventually got sucked in around 98. Now I just try to learn and have some value in life. It's tough though.

I used windows for years.

I may as well have a map of the kernel on my wall. (Christmas present maybe?)

[Lucradia]

Lenovo / IBM, ASUS. Pretty much it.

[TerryP]

Compaq

[Lucradia]

Compaq

Vote HP then. Compaq got bought.