does anyone else feel like they're falling into the 'linux traditionalists' crowd?

[Dustin2128]

Just wondering. I used to be one of those linux newbies like almost everyone else here, 'there should only be one distro' or 'everyone should use linux' or 'all software should be distributed in this format' etc. But for the past few months, I've grown increasingly satisfied with linux's current standing, somewhat obscure but easy enough to use. In fact, I like it that major companies decide not to develop software for us (games not included), because it means that open source projects really take off, I've even aggressively argued against porting non-free software, like utorrent or photoshop, to linux because it will severely stunt the growth of GIMP or Transmission. Maybe slack just does this to you, huh? ;)

[chris200x9]

Just wondering. I used to be one of those linux newbies like almost everyone else here, 'there should only be one distro' or 'everyone should use linux' or 'all software should be distributed in this format' etc. But for the past few months, I've grown increasingly satisfied with linux's current standing, somewhat obscure but easy enough to use. In fact, I like it that major companies decide not to develop software for us (games not included), because it means that open source projects really take off, I've even aggressively argued against porting non-free software, like utorrent or photoshop, to linux because it will severely stunt the growth of GIMP or Transmission. Maybe slack just does this to you, huh? ;)

You high son?

[Dustin2128]

maybe arguing against porting popular software is taking it a bit far come to think of it...

[Noz3001]

maybe arguing against porting popular software is taking it a bit far come to think of it...

I see your point. We'd have another Flash on our hands, and we all know how annoying Flash can be.

[earthpigg]

maybe arguing against porting popular software is taking it a bit far come to think of it...

eh. i have no objections to porting popular software, as long as it isn't something that distributions could be reliant upon for basic functionality.

the proprietary replacement for X, for example, that will run GNOME and KDE without modification? burn it with fire. do not download it, install it, test it, or wish anything but bankruptcy upon those that created it or support it.



but Flash, video drivers, and video games? eh, go for it. they are toys.

paint shop pro? go for it, but keep GIMP installed by default. if users wish to shell out the $900 rather than learn to use GIMP, i have no objection to making that choice available to them.

rms has taken it a bit to far with his criticism of distributions that make it 'to easy' to install non-free software. everything should be easy, from installing proprietary software to designing thermonuclear weapons.

if it's easy to install proprietary software, and you feel it is unethical: tell the person you see doing it how you feel.

if it's easy to design thermonuclear weapons, and it's illegal: call the police when you see someone doing it.

i will always object to artificial software limitations. making it artificially harder to install or use non-free software isn't much different than DRM.

[phrostbyte]

eh. i have no objections to porting popular software, as long as it isn't something that distributions could be reliant upon for basic functionality.

the proprietary replacement for X, for example, that will run GNOME and KDE without modification? burn it with fire. do not download it, install it, test it, or wish anything but bankruptcy upon those that created it or support it.



but Flash, video drivers, and video games? eh, go for it.

Flash is the binary blob that almost everyone universally has installed. So in a way distros "depend" on it, even if it's not installed by default. It's also a mess that still can't do full screen video on quad-core processors without dropping frames. Poster child for proprietary software? :)

[Dustin2128]

Flash is the binary blob that almost everyone universally has installed. So in a way distros "depend" on it, even if it's not installed by default. It's also a mess that still can't do full screen video on quad-core processors without dropping frames. Poster child for proprietary software? :)
no doubt its a mess, but distros hardly depend upon it. I can browse the net all day with a flash block plugin and I rarely encounter a site that doesn't render properly. Maybe it's just the sites I visit though.

[earthpigg]

Flash is the binary blob that almost everyone universally has installed. So in a way distros "depend" on it, even if it's not installed by default. It's also a mess that still can't do full screen video on quad-core processors without dropping frames. Poster child for proprietary software? :)

it's funny, cuz i installed flash... then installed flashblock immediately after.

once youtube goes html5, ill be fine without flash. can't speak for everyone, though.

[Dustin2128]

once youtube goes html5, ill be fine without flash. Can't speak for everyone, though.
+1

[TheNerdAL]

I just need Flash for Hulu but it lags on my computer because I have a one core 1.8 Ghz processor, I wonder if dualcore can handle full screen Flash better. :P

[Khakilang]

I can't afford it!

[unit13]

Just wondering. I used to be one of those linux newbies like almost everyone else here, 'there should only be one distro' or 'everyone should use linux' or 'all software should be distributed in this format' etc. But for the past few months, I've grown increasingly satisfied with linux's current standing, somewhat obscure but easy enough to use. In fact, I like it that major companies decide not to develop software for us (games not included), because it means that open source projects really take off, I've even aggressively argued against porting non-free software, like utorrent or photoshop, to linux because it will severely stunt the growth of GIMP or Transmission. Maybe slack just does this to you, huh? ;)asically

Basically Dustin, it is my hatred for Microsoft that drove me to Linux! Now I love Linux and open source. The way computing was meant to be!

[Barrucadu]

The GNU/Linux traditionalists crowd is the best crowd :)

[handy]

The GNU/Linux traditionalists crowd is the best crowd :)

Get back to your Hurd! [Edit:] ;)

[NCLI]

I just need Flash for Hulu but it lags on my computer because I have a one core 1.8 Ghz processor, I wonder if dualcore can handle full screen Flash better. :P

Don't get your hopes up. Even a high-end i7 can have trouble doing that.

[szymon_g]

The GNU/Linux traditionalists crowd is the best crowd :)

no, quite often 'traditionalists' are harmful to FOSS society. 'i don't wanna commercial products to be ported to linux!' (sure, it is better when users have no choice but using crappy, semi-functional software- it's sure best from ideological point of view) is probably the stupidest thing i've heard recently- without professional support, linux now would be in the same development-state as hurd. multiple package formats? yeah, it is better when producer have to publish software in >1 formats; it's definatly easier for him (yes, i know- there is LSB, but some distributions don't follow it)

in short- less ideology, more pragmatism

[TheNerdAL]

Don't get your hopes up. Even a high-end i7 can have trouble doing that.

Awww. :(

[Spice Weasel]

I like Linux the way it is, I just wish there was more choice in distributions. I'm yet to find one which suits my needs. :(

I don't want commercial games developers to develop for Linux, and I agree with what you said on uTorrent and Photoshop. I find GIMP + Transmission better anyway.

e: In my opinion, what Linux distributions developers should be focussing on is improving compatibility. Make Linux run on any modern PC, Phone, Music Player and Alarm Clock in the world and then we can get busy with other things. :P

[oldos2er]

Maybe slack just does this to you, huh? ;)

Praise Bob!

[Simian Man]

Do you guys really still have trouble running Flash? I have been using it on Linux for years on 2 machines and it has never given me any trouble or noticeably eaten my CPU. And never with a processor with more than 2 cores.

[Tristam Green]

Do you guys really still have trouble running Flash? I have been using it on Linux for years on 2 machines and it has never given me any trouble or noticeably eaten my CPU. And never with a processor with more than 2 cores.

They're imagining they're using an iPad or iPhone.

[Frogs Hair]

I'm not sure what a Linux traditionalist is because, Linux is diverse and offers many choices. If traditional means using Linux in the way I see fit , I would say yes.

[RiceMonster]

Do you guys really still have trouble running Flash? I have been using it on Linux for years on 2 machines and it has never given me any trouble or noticeably eaten my CPU. And never with a processor with more than 2 cores.

It was fine until I started using the 32 bit wrapped version on 64 bit, which I have had happen numerous times. Also, youtube doesn't fill the full screen on full screen with dual monitors, but for some reason, other sites work fine.

[yunone]

i think what drove me to Linux was its differences and cool factor in being different with a side note on security and upgrading cost. I really enjoy the security of knowing that my computer is not as easy to take over with virus, or malware, etc and i like that Linux is free. I really enjoy my money and not having to spend it on a simple upgrade.

Does all this make me a traditionalist? not sure what defines anyone in the Nix world as a traditionalist. I still need windows for itunes and need it for certain business works, but all my computers are now running a Nix variant. My wife uses linux and has come a long way with it in the last year, my two year old will be a nix user..i will remain a nix user...that makes me a traditionalist in my eyes...

[red_Marvin]

I find myself disagreeing with almost all claims that on summarisation would start like "Linux needs to ..." at least when it comes to ideas on what would make linux attract more users. So yes.

Wanting companies to not develop for linux simply because that they create closed source software is taking it a bit too far thoug, however my sentiments about the underlying parts of the system are comparable to earthpigg's (http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=9700461&postcount=5) and extends to any type of file format or communication protocol.

[Dustin2128]

For the record, I'm a 32 bit user and have few problems with flash. The few problems I do have are big though, like not being able to use any controls in fluxbox, or it using way too much RAM (hundreds of MB) for the service its providing. The move to a more open standard should happen relatively soon; it has similar problems on windows with memory usage. Imagine if all the normal stuff could be done without flash, nobody would download it and it would fade out of public knowledge.

As far as claims of 'what linux needs to do to attract more users', I also disagree with almost all of them. We should work on making the experience better for us, not trying to become a popular OS.

[harlan]

Just wondering. I used to be one of those linux newbies like almost everyone else here, 'there should only be one distro' or 'everyone should use linux' or 'all software should be distributed in this format' etc. But for the past few months, I've grown increasingly satisfied with linux's current standing, somewhat obscure but easy enough to use.

The freedom to use, develop, configure, etc. as you please is what makes free software what it is.
Free to choose implies the effort of 'do it yourself' and the posibility to make mistakes, of course.
This could be annoying at first, being used not to have alternative.
But after trying the sweet taste of freedom, who misses the ball and chain?

[handy]

On the Flash aside; I've been using the 64bit plugin & the Flashblock Firefox plugin in an effort to protect myself from any possible security issues.

I just select whatever Flash file that I want to see by clicking on it, all others are blocked.

I like it that way even if there were no 64bit Flash security issues.

Oh, & Flash works fine.

[MCVenom]

Do you guys really still have trouble running Flash? I have been using it on Linux for years on 2 machines and it has never given me any trouble or noticeably eaten my CPU. And never with a processor with more than 2 cores.
Agreed. I never really encountered any problems with Flash.

[JDShu]

ehhh.. Flash has its quirks especially for 64bit. I've kinda grown out of trying to tinker and getting things working, and Flash for me, anyway, needs some tinkering.

I dunno what a Linux traditionalist is but lurking around here and other Linux forums has been pretty educational with the wide range of opinions. For me, I don't really care whether commercial software like Photoshop gets ported to Linux because there is often an oss equivalent that, while it may not be as good, is definitely enough for most people. As an aside, personally, everybody in real life I know that uses Photoshop pirated it anyway. Which gets into a weird situation where I am told about Photoshop's superiority from somebody who pirated it. Ah well.

[handy]

A diamond is still the same diamond when it is in the thief's pocket. :)