Is lubuntu really that bad?

[Redsandro]

First I installed Lubuntu on my way old laptop, because people were convincing me it was very fast. And indeed, my laptop seemed usable again.

I quickly installed it on my fathers' netbook. First thing he sais to me: My USB sticks are not working anymore! And he is right! It doesn't work on my laptop either! Ofcourse I can do some medieval console jumbo to manually get it mounted somewhere, but frankly that's annoying and no option for my father.

Last week I took my laptop to my friend to do some scanning. I had Xubuntu previously, and I would just plugin the scanner and I could scan using xsane. Now, exact same scanner and laptop, either using Simple Scan or xsane (apt-get), no scanner connected!

The other day, my broser (Opera) was taking ages to crash, so I just clicked hibernate a few times to continue some other day. When waking up, it immediately went to hibernate like 3 times!

I won't mention that terminal that has invisible chrome which hasn't had an update since Lubuntu 10.04 was released, but there are other small bumps.



Is it really that feature-incomplete? There were a lot of fans and I went through a lot of trouble to get it installed, because my laptop cannot boot from anything and I had to chainload stuff from a leftover tiny WinXP partition. I just want to mention that BASIC STUFF DOES NOT WORK to anyone concidering Lubuntu out there, because it's not fair that people are nothing but positive.



What is your experience? Did you go back to Xubuntu? Did you encounter different problems? Are there easy fixes?

[snowpine]

Why do you think Lubuntu is faster than Ubuntu? It's because they leave stuff out. :) You may call this "feature incomplete" but the Lubuntu developers' goal is to provide a minimalist platform. Since Lubuntu and Ubuntu use the same repository of software, you should be able to install the identical support for USB, scanners, etc. as in Ubuntu. Indeed, you could, if you wanted to, easily install everything that comes with Ubuntu into a Lubuntu install, in which case you would lose any "lightweight" performance benefit. ;)

Furthermore, Lubuntu is a Beta release and is not officially endorsed by Canonical. It is unfair to expect it to have the same level of polish and functionality as the official Ubuntu release.

[Austin25]

Try slax.

[Simian Man]

LXDE is beta software at best.

[Redsandro]

Yes but keeping a feature out is not a lightweight alternative, right?

Mounting a USB stick is not rocketscience, it's more of a IF BLEEP DO BLOOP, it works on the lamest of laptops. And a library for scanners and stuff just sits on the harddrive, right? It doesn't make Lubuntu any slower, it just adds a feature. If the files (scanner driver?) are accessed, then there is some overhead. It's not like everything is loaded and configured in a registry like in Windows, or am I wrong? But either way, I installed cups and (x)sane and I still cannot get scanners to work.


Lubuntu is a Beta release and is not officially endorsed by Canonical. It is unfair to expect it to have the same level of polish and functionality as the official Ubuntu release.

True that, but a lot of zero-day fanboys made Lubuntu look like a golden rocket to me, so yeah quoted for truth and shown in a glass display housing for any considerer to see.


Try slax.

The Lubuntu boys were much more convincing and that didn't work out good either. :P

[dragos240]

LXDE is beta software at best.

It's very stable! What's wrong with it. I use it!
161226

[snowpine]

Yes but keeping a feature out is not a lightweight alternative, right?

Mounting a USB stick is not rocketscience, it's more of a IF BLEEP DO BLOOP, it works on the lamest of laptops.

Lubuntu's "lightweight alternative" is:


sudo mount /dev/sdb1 /media/flash

Sorry I don't have the experience to help with your scanner problem.

ps I'm not trying to defend Lubuntu; I don't personally use it for the reasons I described above. But it is important to distinguish between "Lubuntu CAN'T do X" and "Lubuntu doesn't AUTOMATICALLY do X like I'm used to from Ubuntu." :)

[kabloink]

The USB problem is odd. I never had problems with that. Typically, I only need to open the file manager and click on the usb drive listed in the left panel to open it.

Personally, I think the Fedora LXDE or the PCLinuxOS LXDE spins are much more polished than Lubuntu at the moment. Though, that may change by the time 10.10 comes out.

[MonsterTrimble]

The USB problem is odd. I never had problems with that. Typically, I only need to open the file manager and click on the usb drive listed in the left panel to open it.

Personally, I think the Fedora LXDE or the PCLinuxOS LXDE spins are much more polished than Lubuntu at the moment. Though, that may change by the time 10.10 comes out.

I agree that the USB thing is strange. I haven't had issues with that since Lubuntu 9.10 Alpha.

I also agree that Lubuntu is severly lacking in polish - especially with respect to the vast changes Canonical is dumping into Ubuntu itself, although as the flagship product versus what is essentially a community respin that is understandable. My biggest concern is the lack of CI overall. There has been very little activity on Launchpad for Lubuntu and Lubuntu.net doesn't really show any progress on either Lucid or Maverick either. I fear that Lubuntu is not long for the *buntu world.

[philinux]

@redsandro,

I tried lubuntu on an old machine and then I tried peppermint. The later proved much better.
http://peppermintos.com/

[ubunterooster]

peppermint is nice. Lubuntu I like, but it is lacking. Mint LXDE is nice, though.

[MCVenom]

I like LXDE. Lubuntu however, was extremely unstable when I installed a week ago. Mint LXDE was much better, however considering what I want to use the PC for, I'll probably end up using Xubuntu or Mint 9 XFCE (anyone know when that's coming? It was MIA a week ago). :P

My advice to anyone thinking of using Lubuntu in it's current state; it's got a long way to go to being stable and usable. Of course, it *is* still in development.

[koleoptero]

I just did a minimal openbox ubuntu install and it is lighter and with fewer problems than lubuntu. Plus it doesn't have that infernal lxde panel.

[MonsterTrimble]

Has anyone tried both Peppermint & Mint LXDE? Which do they prefer. I'm not into the cloud computing end of it, but I'm open to anything.

[ubunterooster]

I prefer Mint (except for the green!!)

[y6FgBn)~v]

It's not easy being green (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hpiIWMWWVco) ):P

[Stancel]

LXDE really *is* that bad.

I installed it, it wouldn't recognize any kind of file. Not even one of the most basic files, .png! I mean, what the hell kind of desktop environment is that? A useless one.

[MCVenom]

LXDE really *is* that bad.

I installed it, it wouldn't recognize any kind of file. Not even one of the most basic files, .png! I mean, what the hell kind of desktop environment is that? A useless one.
Sorry to hear that your experience is the same as everyone else's. :roll:

LXDE doesn't suck, something was simply misconfigured is all. A bug perhaps. :P

[K.Mandla]

Is lubuntu really that bad?
No.

[koleoptero]

LXDE really *is* that bad.

I installed it, it wouldn't recognize any kind of file. Not even one of the most basic files, .png! I mean, what the hell kind of desktop environment is that? A useless one.

And a quick search would have shown that it was a problem with the default pcmanfm in ubuntu's repos, which has been fixed. Exactly how long ago did you try lubuntu?

[Stancel]

Sorry to hear that your experience is the same as everyone else's. :roll:

LXDE doesn't suck, something was simply misconfigured is all. A bug perhaps. :P


And a quick search would have shown that it was a problem with the default pcmanfm in ubuntu's repos, which has been fixed. Exactly how long ago did you try lubuntu?

No need to take it so.....personally. I am not a very technical person. I installed Lubuntu the same way I installed Xubuntu (never got around to trying Kubuntu). By installing lubuntu-desktop in the terminal with aptitude (from this (http://www.psychocats.net/ubuntu/xubuntu) info here, I just changed the x to l).

I was not trying to say my experience with LXDE was the same as everyone else's, or assuming it was a problem with LXDE, but it sure looked that way to me. I had problems with Lucid but I never say it is everyone else's problems either.

[jerrylamos]

Lubuntu works fine with my oldest pc, a Thinkpad. LXDE faster than Gnome but not as full function, and KDE with all the "eye candy" definitely slowest.

Jerry

[Shakz]

@redsandro,

I tried lubuntu on an old machine and then I tried peppermint. The later proved much better.
http://peppermintos.com/

My hunk of crap netbook runs like a dream on peppermint OS. +1

http://peppermintos.com/

[SunnyRabbiera]

Well LXDE might be beta but man does it it show loads of promise, even more so then XFCE

[Redsandro]

Woah, I only now got a notification email, I thought no one had replied yet but there's a whole page.. :P

I think I pass on peppermint. I don't know what aspect is 'cloud' but I like to be 100% offlineable if you know what I mean.

Mint was also mentioned, that one could be interesting.. based on Ubuntu/Debian, I like, because ofcourse I am used to that.

But how is Mint LXDE better than Lubuntu? I am currently in doubt between going back to Xubuntu (slow) or trying to fix USB+Scanner in Lubuntu, and a bit hesitant to go Mint because Lubuntu was recommended to me in the same way.

[ubunterooster]

Mint tries to be stable in the areas that Ubuntu tries to be cutting edge. Mint Lxde is not very different from Mint Gnome, Mint Xfce, or Mint KDE. The mints are all very similar, Use less resources then the *buntus and, oddly, seem to be more stable than were they came from.

[slooksterpsv]

I must be a minimalist then. I like Lubuntu, but I'm only running it in a VM cause I like Ubuntu best. Anyways I've found just how tech-gadget-savvy-laxed I am.

1. I don't use scanners or printers, if I have to sign and send something back, I use my Wacom tablet to do so.
2. I don't really use Jump Drives, I have one just in case, but I don't really use it.
3. I don't use external hard drives - I need to get one
4. Other external peripherals besides mouse and speakers/earphones are about the only items I do use.

I'm very tech-savvy, but tech-gadget-ownership-savvy, I'm pretty low on the bar.

I seem to forget about the other people need external peripherals to do their work or do what they want. Hmmm...

[Redsandro]

So Mint is kinda like between Debian and Ubuntu?
Do they also work with 6 months cycles, LTS, or how does it work?

[Legendary_Bibo]

I use Lubuntu, it used to be slow, but sped up on its eventually, I don't know how. I use it on my old machine, but to be honest I preferred puppy because it looked better and ran crazy fast. I just couldn't figure out how to install it to my hard drive. (I couldn't reformat ext4 to ext3 :( )

Would peppermint work better on an old machine? To be honest I only use this thing for an internet browser, my beef with it is that it has issues with transparency with its panels which kind of makes it difficult to customize the look.

[ubunterooster]

Yes, Mint is to Ubuntu the way Ubuntu is to Debian in ease of use and most other areas.

They sfollow the 6 month release and Isadora is a LTS.

Mint Gnome closely follows Ubuntu's release; all other Mint DE tend to be later in release.

[Khakilang]

I install Lubuntu on my old computer and everything work fine including the USB port. Of course I just use it to download Distro, software, movie, song and some browsing.

[Redsandro]

Mint tries to be stable in the areas that Ubuntu tries to be cutting edge. Mint Lxde is not very different from Mint Gnome, Mint Xfce, or Mint KDE. The mints are all very similar, Use less resources then the *buntus and, oddly, seem to be more stable than were they came from.

But I read this on wikipedia:

Linux Mint decided to abandon its code-base and changed the way it built its releases. Starting with version 6 "Felicia" each release was now completely based on the latest Ubuntu release and built directly from it.and on linuxmint.com

[Linux Mint 9 LXDE is] based on Lubuntu 10.04
So... there is no other difference except for cosmetic?

Like mentioned before, I cannot simply try a live USB stick (if they do that) because I cannot boot from USB or disc. I have to fit the installer on my XP partition and try to chainload the installer from Windows.

Can anyone verify automatic USB mounting works in Mint? And scanner detection while you're at it? :D :D

[andrewabc]

But I read this on wikipedia:
and on linuxmint.com

So... there is no other difference except for cosmetic?

Like mentioned before, I cannot simply try a live USB stick (if they do that) because I cannot boot from USB or disc. I have to fit the installer on my XP partition and try to chainload the installer from Windows.

Can anyone verify automatic USB mounting works in Mint? And scanner detection while you're at it? :D :D

You can try running lubuntu in a virtual machine.
Install virtualbox (works on winxp/ubuntu)

EDIT:
My bad, you are talking about linuxmint lxde.
I know nothing about that. But you can still run it in a virtual machine if you don't want to install it.

[beastrace91]

Why do you think Lubuntu is faster than Ubuntu? It's because they leave stuff out. :)

Thats not it at all... LXDE is *much* more light weight than Gnome (and XFCE even!). That being said, LXDE itself is not fully finished yet and as such I've found some hacking has been required on my part to get certain things working on my system with it.

THAT being said - I've had Lubuntu on several system and never had any issues with it using flash drives.

~Jeff

[beastrace91]

So... there is no other difference except for cosmetic?

There are a good number of difference between Ubuntu and Mint. Google around and I am sure you will find some ;)

~Jeff

[ubunterooster]

There are a good number of difference between Ubuntu and Mint. Google around and I am sure you will find some ;)

~Jeff
Or I can just click the nice link in your signature

[dzon65]

I always do a ubuntu minimal.Lxde hardly worked,pcmanfm only installed partially and a bunch of other issues.So,a good option would be something like minimal/openbox/thunar/mplayer/prism/performance tweaked FF/even gnome panel (it's not THAT much heavier).......Everything works out of the box really and is very fast.

[Lucradia]

I'd rather use open box on a custom installation of debian anyway. At least until Plymouth is fixed to not be required to be installed.

[Redsandro]

Hey I'm just a *user*, a normal installation from one of the big repo's already takes two weeks of my time getting common stuff running, so I am sure not gonna try out my luck with custom installations.

I am really curious though why some people (claim to) have no problems with USB sticks. I really did a clean install of Lubuntu and there was no problem with Xubuntu USB. This makes me wonder if my Scanner problem is also *my laptop specific*.

I cannot test out this stuff on a virtual machine because that one has simple and compatible hardware, not like my laptop.

If I find the time I will chainload Mint live-usb and see if usb works out of the box and scanner works after installing sane.

[yossell]

wait -

lubuntu works wonderfully on both my laptop and desktop. It's not the prettiest, but it's incredibly zippy and for me it makes a great work environment.

[squilookle]

I've used LXDE a few times with mixed results. Mostly negative, a few positives but there you go. Personally, if I was going light weight, I like Openbox + Rox filer, and a few other apps I pick myself, rather than going for LXDE.

Still, give it time. The objectives are good, and like most other software in the repos, it will get better in time.

[Redsandro]

Guys guys! Weirdness!

I travelled to my folks' town because I promised to fix my dads netbook (Win XP was slow, I put Ubuntu Netbook Remix on it heheh, it's fast goodlooking and awesome. How come normal Ubuntu can't be fast like that? Really).

I put an usb stick in my laptop (the Lubuntu one) to 'Unetbootin' Ubuntu on there, and I got a PCmanfm2 usb inserted popup!

Next, I plugged in a scanner and I just scanned a page!

I am confused but not unhappy. It is possible that usb communication just doesn't work (properly) *sometimes* after suspend or hybernate. My laptop is not fully compatible with the system. Sometimes my video is all screwed up after wake from sleep. If I wake and sleep again it usually works normal again. I should try if it's the same for USB next time!

On another note, I just finished downloading Mint LXDE and I was wondering if I should install it anyway. I hear a lot of good things about Mint, and I like the typable application menu.

Can I get someone with experience in both to offer me some Ubuntu vs Mint or Lubuntu vs Mint LXDE discussion? :)

Final tip for people with slow computers (most people reading a topic about Lubuntu probably do): Managing big files (downloading and unetbootin-ing ubuntu image for example) becomes real annoying real quick if your home folder is encrypted. You'd think the encryption is a small overhead, but on my laptop extracting an image from the encrypted home dir freezes the system entirely. Making your download dir outside of your home is recommended. :KS

[Redsandro]

Ubuntu will automatically take over my previous encrypted home folder at installation. Does Mint do that too?

[beastrace91]

Ubuntu will automatically take over my previous encrypted home folder at installation. Does Mint do that too?

It should. Mint is basically Ubuntu with just extra goodies.

~Jeff

[ubunterooster]

It should. Mint is basically Ubuntu with just extra goodies.

~Jeff
And (as I remember) a different (newer?) Kernel

[Redsandro]

Oh damn me, gparted couldn't shrink my WinXP partition, (after reboot it was always back to normal?) so I tried a copy of paragon software that came with a hard drive. After a reboot: Please insert the recovery CD.

So I broke my laptop in two and attached the hard drive to my desktop and I installed Plop Boot Manager (http://www.plop.at/en/bootmanager.html) in a tiny partition so I could boot from USB and install Mint Linux.

First difference is when waking from suspend, my mouse cursor is always gone! I have to switch to a different TTY and go back for the mouse cursor to appear. That wasn't the case with Lubuntu. Anyone knows how to fix this?

The good difference is that it looks prettier out of the box and more software is in the repo's. I can apt-get install opera without adding something. What repo does that? I want to add those to my other *buntu machines!

BTW I pressed Ctrl+Z after breaking the laptop so it's okay.

[Redsandro]

Could somebody pretty please tell me how to get SAMBA shares working?

The General Properties tab from Shared Folders is supposed to be all Samba. I got smbd and all, yet I cannot choose Samba shares in the create share dialog. I did an NFS share, but I cannot find my own laptop using a MacBook pro.

Oh it's so annoying that this laptop is 'deaf' to connectivity, but it will take some time for me to get rich enough to afford something new. ;)

[samigina]

Mint LXDE... everything works for me...

[Redsandro]

Lucky you..

But I bet at least your terminal (ctrl+alt+T) doesn't have a proper titlebar :P And you cannot do samba shares. :P

[NormanFLinux]

The same is true of XFCE. What is it with those DE's not being able to do samba shares? Is this still 2005?

[Redsandro]

Not really true, you can mount SAMBA shares with Xubuntu out of the box using Gigolo or PyNeighborhood.

Lubuntu and Mint LXDE also come with PyNeighborhood preinstalled but double-clicking a share to mount always messages "Samba Mount Failed."

I've tried al three distro's in the same network environment.

[SeePU]

Lubuntu is just awful. I'm really disappointed. I need a lightweight DE for my older Thinkpad. I liked Debian Squeeze LXDE but I wanted a more stable release but still up-to-date package distro. I was going to have Debian my 'other distro' and have an Ubuntu-based LXDE distro as my main one.

But, Lubuntu is full of bugs. Why would they release this crap?!? It's unbelievable.

One HUGE bug and I mean it is so bad... the LXTerminal doesn't work properly. It doesn't 'paint' the upper border every time so there are times in which you can't move the window. Then when you move the window, it doesn't re-paint properly. This distro looks like it's still in Alpha or Beta.

I can't use it. So, my options are now Ubuntu + LXDE or xfce or Peppermint or Mint LXDE? Which one should I use and what makes those different? Are the packages at the same version?

I was hoping the release of Lubuntu was half decent but it's a mess. No one else is finding these issues?!? :-|

[SeePU]

Lucky you..

But I bet at least your terminal (ctrl+alt+T) doesn't have a proper titlebar :P And you cannot do samba shares. :PYou have that too? The terminal titlebar is 'corrupted?' Also, if you do get the terminal to open 'properly,' when you move the window, the titlebar doesn't paint back properly.

[cariboo]

I installed the mini.iso cli + Lubuntu desktop on a 1.8 Ghz Celereon with 128MB ram, I find it runs quite well considering the hardware, and aside from CD's and usb devices not mounting automagically, I haven't run into any real problems.

What I like, is that it barely uses any ram at all:


free -m
total used free shared buffers cached
Mem: 118 114 4 0 3 55
-/+ buffers/cache: 55 63
Swap: 345 8 337

[SeePU]

It's a given, isn't it, about the memory usage. But, that's the LXDE.

What about Lubuntu's bugs? The Terminal titlebar bug seems major. The distro was released in May, wasn't it? But, very little report on this and still no fix?

What's up with that?

[SeePU]

How do you file/report bugs? The SourceForge / LXDE forum or bug tracker site?

Messing around, I found that if you resize the window, the title bar will appear but it'll be 'corrupted' and not properly painted or displayed. But, one can move the window afterwards.

I'm sure they know about it but I could report on what one user did and what happened? Not sure if it helps but... it seems like something that shouldn't take long to fix?

[cariboo]

It's a given, isn't it, about the memory usage. But, that's the LXDE.

What about Lubuntu's bugs? The Terminal titlebar bug seems major. The distro was released in May, wasn't it? But, very little report on this and still no fix?

What's up with that?

I don't see that particular bug.

I'm not sure Lubuntu has been officially released yet, the release in May was the Final Stable Beta.

[SeePU]

This bug is close in appearance:

http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=2970294&group_id=180858&atid=894869

It doesn't seem like devs are too interested in addressing these issues? On the Lubuntu page, it shows the distro as 'release.'

But, the title bar issue seems major. Also, like I said, you can resize the window to temporarily fix it but then it becomes corrupted again and there's artifacts in the title bar.

Also, I cannot mount my usb flash drives. Is this also typical? :(

[cariboo]

You can report Lubuntu bugs at bugs.launchpad.net.

As far as I know CD/DVD's and usb device don't auto mount yet. I know it's being worked on. I mount both manually.

[WinterRain]

I can't use it. So, my options are now Ubuntu + LXDE or xfce or Peppermint or Mint LXDE?
Don't be so dramatic. ;) I would give peppermint a shot, worked good for me. If not, just keep trying different distros. Puppy anyone? Btw, I think puppy 4.2.1 was the best ever and still use it on my old lappie.

[WinterRain]

the release in May was the Final Stable Beta.
Isn't that an oxymoron?

[cariboo]

Isn't that an oxymoron?

That's what I though when I saw the announcement. :)

[Joe Awsome]

I haven't had a lick of trouble with lubuntu. The only thing that bugs me is the lack of themes avaliable and that my volume applet on the toolbar won't work. I've been trying to install it on my HP N3390 (aka lappy 5000 for u strongbad fans out there). It's got a P3 600Mhz, 192MB RAM, a 10gig HDD, and I have to use a PCMCIA adapter to use an ethernet cable. I've wanted to do a barebones ubuntu install w/ LXDE or openbox but it won't get conected to my home network. Any ideas? (sorry for thread jacking OP)

[snowpine]

Lubuntu is just awful. I'm really disappointed. I need a lightweight DE for my older Thinkpad. I liked Debian Squeeze LXDE but I wanted a more stable release but still up-to-date package distro. I was going to have Debian my 'other distro' and have an Ubuntu-based LXDE distro as my main one.

I haven't tried Lubuntu, so I can't comment on that. :)

If you are looking for a "stable Debian-based LXDE distro" you are making a big mistake by leaving Debian for its derivatives. Debian Lenny (the current release) is very, very, very stable, more so than anything the Ubuntu family can offer. Squeeze is also shaping up to be a nice release, it should become Debian Stable probably later this year. Again, all in my opinion. :)

I know Lenny uses older packages compared with less-stable releases, but if you need a newer version of an application, OpenOffice for example, it's easy to install.

[SeePU]

I haven't had a lick of trouble with lubuntu. The only thing that bugs me is the lack of themes avaliable and that my volume applet on the toolbar won't work. I've been trying to install it on my HP N3390 (aka lappy 5000 for u strongbad fans out there). It's got a P3 600Mhz, 192MB RAM, a 10gig HDD, and I have to use a PCMCIA adapter to use an ethernet cable. I've wanted to do a barebones ubuntu install w/ LXDE or openbox but it won't get conected to my home network. Any ideas? (sorry for thread jacking OP)Well, then we're using TWO entirely different versions or you're just making it up!

I'm serious. Did you read the title of this thread?!? Anyway, the latest issue is a complete FREEZE.. A hard lockup in which one can't recover... well, not without a lot of work. This isn't a relase. It's an Alpha/Beta with no business being called anything close to a release.

I also have a Pentium 3 and would probably install whatever I decide to use on my Thinkpad laptop. Why would you need an adapter for your network/ethernet card? It should be compatible as drivers are probably available by now. I think you have to give the readers here the info of the hardware (i.e. chipset info). It probably needs 'non-freeware' firmware/drivers installed. Or it's a worse situation in which the card is fried but I'm betting on the prior theory.

[SeePU]

I haven't tried Lubuntu, so I can't comment on that. :)

If you are looking for a "stable Debian-based LXDE distro" you are making a big mistake by leaving Debian for its derivatives. Debian Lenny (the current release) is very, very, very stable, more so than anything the Ubuntu family can offer. Squeeze is also shaping up to be a nice release, it should become Debian Stable probably later this year. Again, all in my opinion. :)

I know Lenny uses older packages compared with less-stable releases, but if you need a newer version of an application, OpenOffice for example, it's easy to install.Maybe I should. It's just my laptop. I can experiment on my desktop.

The only issue or concern I would have is there are a few packages I need to use at the latest (or a later) version. One e.g. is Pidgin. But, I guess the thing to do is to temporarily enable the repository for Squeeze and install the latest version. Isn't that what you do? I haven't really done that much. I have used Lenny but a while ago and I don't recall 'mixing versions/repos' very much. I've also used Squeeze as is. I think one can get into trouble if not careful, though.

[snowpine]

But, I guess the thing to do is to temporarily enable the repository for Squeeze and install the latest version. Isn't that what you do?

Goodness gracious no, I would never do that!!! :(

http://www.backports.org/
or
http://www.pidgin.im/

[Redsandro]

You have that too? The terminal titlebar is 'corrupted?' Also, if you do get the terminal to open 'properly,' when you move the window, the titlebar doesn't paint back properly.

Yes, it's both in Lubuntu and Linux Mint LXDE. I think the bug is probably introduced upstream. Maybe in LXDE? Both distro's are still RC (release candidate), I am pretty sure they're aware of the bugs because everybody presses Ctrl+Alt+T sooner or later.

BTW, this bug, though visually very big, is the least of my concerns. Even though the chrome (titlebar) isn't there, it's always clickable. Just imagine where it is and you can move your terminal.


As far as I know CD/DVD's and usb device don't auto mount yet. I know it's being worked on. I mount both manually.

Actually, my USB sticks do get automatically mounted both in Mint LXDE and Lubuntu! I am not sure, but maybe you need an update. It didn't work for me at first. Maybe I was missing an update, or maybe I never tried it after a clean boot. Sometimes after suspend or hibernate, it doesn't work anymore.


Isn't that an oxymoron?
I think Cariboo907 means it's considered a Release Candidate, which means it should be free of blunt bugs.


Debian Lenny (the current release) is very, very, very stable, more so than anything the Ubuntu family can offer. Squeeze is also shaping up to be a nice release, it should become Debian Stable probably later this year. Again, all in my opinion. :)

When *Buntu 9.10 was too buggy for me, I installed Lenny on two of my laptops (one of them is this 10 years old one that I use Mint LXDE on now) and networking wouldn't work out of the box. I know Debian is the father of Ubuntu, Mint and what not, but after failing me for the second time it got boring pretty quickly.

If it works for anyone, it's mega-stable and very recommendable. But apparently also too slow to catch up with a 10 year old laptop. I'll go for *buntu LTS.

[snowpine]

When *Buntu 9.10 was too buggy for me, I installed Lenny on two of my laptops (one of them is this 10 years old one that I use Mint LXDE on now) and networking wouldn't work out of the box. I know Debian is the father of Ubuntu, Mint and what not, but after failing me for the second time it got boring pretty quickly.

"Recognizes my network card out of the box" is a poor reason to choose a distro, IMHO. It takes about 10 minutes to install a driver, versus the many hours you will be using a distro over the months and years. But I agree that Debian requires a certain kind of user and is not right for everybody.

[Redsandro]

"Recognizes my network card out of the box" is a poor reason to choose a distro, IMHO. It takes about 10 minutes to install a driver, versus the many hours you will be using a distro over the months and years. But I agree that Debian requires a certain kind of user and is not right for everybody.

You are so right, for a certain kind of user.

Although I am technically pretty savvy, after I have once spent 2 weeks on getting my video card to work (admittedly, back in the day, but also considered 'a 10 minute fix'), I've totally changed my attitude towards OSses and distro's.

If basic hardware doesn't work with the distro out of the gawddamn box, I won't touch it. Unless it's uncommon hardware like a microwave or a toiletseat.

Stupid huh? Well at least distro's who do their job right get a statistical bonus of +1 user in their base. :)

[SeePU]

You are so right, for a certain kind of user.

Although I am technically pretty savvy, after I have once spent 2 weeks on getting my video card to work (admittedly, back in the day, but also considered 'a 10 minute fix'), I've totally changed my attitude towards OSses and distro's.

If basic hardware doesn't work with the distro out of the gawddamn box, I won't touch it. Unless it's uncommon hardware like a microwave or a toiletseat.

Stupid huh? Well at least distro's who do their job right get a statistical bonus of +1 user in their base. :)Imho, Debian is especially useful for those who like to tweak their systems themselves. That's why there's so many devs out there that have taken the core of it and developed or tweaked it themselves for their own distro. It might be another reason that lots of Linux users call it a 'server' distro. It's stable, solid and a good core to work with.

Other devs might want certain things to look a bit different so they tweak it. The negative with this is that the family of devs or group is a lot smaller than the pure Debian one. You get one advantage and one disadvantage, maybe?

Anyway... you said..

Yes, it's both in Lubuntu and Linux Mint LXDE. I think the bug is probably introduced upstream. Maybe in LXDE? Both distro's are still RC (release candidate), I am pretty sure they're aware of the bugs because everybody presses Ctrl+Alt+T sooner or later.

BTW, this bug, though visually very big, is the least of my concerns. Even though the chrome (titlebar) isn't there, it's always clickable. Just imagine where it is and you can move your terminal.Maybe. But, it's more than the titlebar. I can move the window around once I get it but then artifacts form and the title bar is all 'corrupted.' Half of is transparent with the desktop screen if you know what I mean. I also had a system freeze or lockup. There's many issues and I think them calling it a 'release' is a bit silly. Maybe it's only a few changes of code but if you add everything up, it looks really unstable to me.

[snowpine]

If basic hardware doesn't work with the distro out of the gawddamn box, I won't touch it.

Fair enough; though if I took that approach with my hardware, I'd be stuck with Jollicloud instead of this nice Debian Squeeze install I'm typing from. ;)

[Redsandro]

The negative with this is that the family of devs or group is a lot smaller than the pure Debian one.

Definitely not true for Ubuntu :D

Debian
Ubuntu
http://www.google.com/trends/viz?q=debian,+ubuntu&graph=weekly_img&sa=N



it's more than the titlebar. I can move the window around once I get it but then artifacts form and the title bar is all 'corrupted.' Half of is transparent with the desktop screen if you know what I mean.
Yes I know what you mean. It's as if it copies whatever graphics is underneath the titlebar, very ugly and unacceptable for a Release Candidate.

But, it's purely cosmetic. I can drag, close, etc. the terminal just fine. Looking for the maximize/minimize button is a pain but I hardly use that anyway.

What I mean is that bugs like these are more serious:
Mouse cursor gone after wake up sleeping computer
Screen distorted after closing and opening the lid real quick
Unable to mount Samba shares
Unable to create samba shares (only NFS)
Unable to hotmount USB after sleep (sometimes)
(new) Opera often loses keyboard input (Mint LXDE only, not Lubuntu.)
These are not just cosmetic, these are real bad.

Still, I use Mint LXDE because the speed allows me to keep my blood pressure within normal ranges when using my old laptop, but I agree with you a lot of this (including that cosmetic terminal bug) is too big to be in a Release Candidate.

[Redsandro]

Fair enough; though if I took that approach with my hardware, I'd be stuck with Jollicloud instead of this nice Debian Squeeze install I'm typing from. ;)

Wow, another cloud distro I didn't know about.. I guess clouds are the new XTC, no? :P

I used to be that computer guy, always fixing things. One week of fixing, one evening of joy. Something just snapped. Let other people who enjoy it fix things. I'm done fixing things. Mac OSX would be perfect for me, if I didn't hate it so much. And I don't stick to Windows either because compared to Linux it does 1/10th and costs http://upload.wikimedia.org/math/d/2/4/d245777abca64ece2d5d7ca0d19fddb6.png times as much.

You see, if I have to fix one thing I probably end up fixing a lot of things. Not necessarily true but statistically odds are.

In Linux, I always end up fixing stuff anyway, but if I have to START by fixing something, I completely lose interest.

[SeePU]

Definitely not true for Ubuntu :DSorry, I don't know what I'm supposed to be looking at (re: graph). I was comparing distros such as Mepis, sidux, maybe Mint (although, technically, it's build on Ubuntu), Knoppix, etc. etc. that may have smaller groups of devs and teams than the Debian. Could be mistaken but I think that's safe speculation. The Ubuntu team is probably bigger than Debian or comparable. At least, their marketing team is way bigger.... (oops, burn... ;) ).


Yes I know what you mean. It's as if it copies whatever graphics is underneath the titlebar, very ugly and unacceptable for a Release Candidate.

What I mean is that bugs like these are more serious:
snipped for brevity
These are not just cosmetic, these are real bad.

Still, I use Mint LXDE because the speed allows me to keep my blood pressure within normal ranges when using my old laptop, but I agree with you a lot of this (including that cosmetic terminal bug) is too big to be in a Release Candidate.I hear ya. I don't blame you for wanting a light resource desktop.

I'm quite pleased with the potential and perceived speed of my laptop with a ligher DE. I like LXDE, in general, although I might like xfce if I used it (more). But, I read that LXDE is faster or a smoother experience than xfce. I was using Debian Squeeze with LXDE until I borked it. As long as integration with other apps (whether they use KDE or Gnome by default) that are typically found in other desktop environments, is smooth and usable, then I'm a big fan of LXDE and its potential. I like it enough that I'd consider using it on my desktop if the bugs and issues can be worked out. Also, of course, if the integration with other software is any good. I like Kaffeine, k3B and other apps that are KDE-based and I'm sure there might be Gnome-based utilities I'd be a fan of. But, imho, KDE 4 is a bit bulky now and there may be supporters who will beg to differ regarding the bloat but I like my computer to not be bogged down.

At least, this is 100% necessary on my laptop. :) Centrino M processor and 2GB of RAM plus a Radeon Mobility 9000 (RV250) card doesn't give a lot of power to work with. Anything that allows for some more speed and doesn't push the cpu too much is good! :D

[SeePU]

So????

1) LXDE is beta?
2) Ubuntu doesn't care about other DEs... only care about Gnome?
3) Lubuntu devs don't care much... no concern or attention given to usb issues (usb devices)
4) no one in the entire *buntu division cares about either LXDE, Lubuntu or whether usb devices work

[Redsandro]

1) yes 2) yes 3) no 4) no?

As I mentioned before, I don't have any USB (or scanner) problems anymore, which makes it a lot more usable for me.

I think the Lubuntu devbase is very small. I know how it is. I made an Arcade Browser (for ROMs) and I wanted to update it with some features. Now it's a year later and I haven't touched it.

Jobs, lives, sex, drugs, rock'n'roll and online poker get in the way of getting development stuff done. You don't have that problem if you have a big developerbase and financial bounties for stuff like with Ubuntu.

-edit-

About the graph (other reply), it's the score for the Google index (Google Trends) for both Debian and Ubuntu. Ubuntu's is like 10 times higher, which sais something about popularity and I think also about the size of the 'family'. It's no wonder that the Debian devs have complained multiple times that the Ubuntu devs "don't give enough back".

[SeePU]

Nah, I cannot agree with you. Sorry.

Look, I have Debian Squeeze LXDE on my laptop. I had similar issues mounting the usb drives. However, I was able to eventually have them detected and mounted. Trying the same process or steps in Lubuntu didn't make a difference. So, it should be a simple solution for devs. There's even a similar distro (or at least, Debian) to use as a guide. I don't see why this issue isn't solved or improved yet.

Mounting usb-based drives should not be rocket science.

[Redsandro]

Well, I just cannot answer you. Maybe you should try to contact (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/ContactUs) one of the folks over at Mint/LXDE (http://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?f=151&t=22891) or the Lubuntu (http://lubuntu.net/) team to comment on your points.

And if you get someone to respond, be nice and quote it in this thread. :D

[SeePU]

I give up... how do you contact the 'Lubuntu team?'

I went to the link/website and I can't find even one way to contact them.

I cannot do it via irc because, for some reason, I cannot install any irc software. Also, I don't think I should have to report on the issues.

Lubuntu want ppl to join but don't want you to contact them?

[Redsandro]

I mean no offence, but you start to sound a bit like a little kid..


how do you contact the 'Lubuntu team?'

Clickable links: Lubuntu on Launchpad (https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-desktop)
Lubuntu on Ubuntu Wiki (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/ContactUs)


I cannot do it via irc because, for some reason, I cannot install any irc software.

Well, OSS teams are groups of people, and IRC has always been the #1 way for contact and communication. There are also wiki's, forums, mailinglists, but only a lazy person cannot get IRC to work, or a person who has a parental guard blocking IRC communication. There are many clients, probably even websites that can connect to any server.


Also, I don't think I should have to report on the issues.

Well, you're complaining the hardest at the moment, so instead of doing that to people like me who cannot help it, you might as well invest that energy into something that can make a difference.



I started this topic to get some insight in pro's and con's considering the amount of fans. Turns out, most of my con's have workarounds or aren't important enough for me to be bothered about.

My biggest con at the moment is not being able to create or mount SAMBA shares, but no one has commented on that.

I don't use SAMBA that much, so meanwhile I just wait for updates in silence.



Seems like you should either: Change distro to a cloud one (very light, two are mentioned in this topic)
Change distro to a non-beta one (Xubuntu, Feather, Puppy, etc)
Communicate to people who know stuff (Lubuntu team)
Change to Debian Squeeze LXDE (seems to work for you)
Stop complaining but get back to this topic when you've got something to add

[cimh]

Redsandro

I cant resist a comment here - even tho the thread is old. Just to say that I have been using Lubuntu for over a year and I have a soft spot for it. I have had no problems with usb sticks and simple things but anything a bit more complex - even linking to scanners could be more problematic. (In fact I switch to ubuntu in a different partition for more complex tasks).

LXDE is designed to be lightweight and fast and it is. But there is a price to pay in that you lose the easy flexibility and finish of the bigger desktops such as Gnome or KDE.

So I would advise people to only use the lightweight distros if they have to because of old hardware or because its your passion. My guess is that LXDE will always be a minority desktop for these reasons. If it was to be as finished and flexible as gnome then it would also gain weight and probably become slower too.

I'm not surprised you have trouble with Samba - networking is something I have never mastered in Linux (or windows for that matter either!)

In my experience if you have old hardware then Puppy is the way to go. It also has really helpful forums, another important factor to think about when choosing a distro.

I've been using linux for about 4 years in that time the most helpful forums were Mepis then Puppy then Ubuntu then the rest. I hear a lot of great things about mint - I must give it a go.

It all comes down to personal preference in the end.

Good luck with Samba!

cimh
eee901 Lubuntu, ubuntu, ubuntu netbook

[SeePU]

Why direct that to Redsandro? He's another user who only cares about his own issues or what task that HE is having trouble with.

This is one of the problems on such a large user group/board.

I usually disregard such sentiments or attitudes as he has portrayed. What's wrong with criticizing the lack of attention in Lubuntu and various bugs that even effect Ubuntu? I was told there's like 200 devs but thousands of bugs. So?

That still says nothing about the value of attention give to various bugs/issues that hamper the user experience.

Even XFCE has 'XFCE-related' software but LXDE seems to have hardly any LXDE-specific software. The whole reason to use a lighter DE is to lessen the amount of dependencies that some of the other software seems to require. Also, the point of choosing LXDE or XFCE is because, KDE, for e.g., requires a lot of other things running in the background. It's not just whether KDE or Gnome is getting more bloated, it's the perception it is.

[utilitytrack]

If Ubuntu it's bad then Windows it's more deep bad :))

[phillw]

Hi,

just to repeat, lubuntu is a young project. There are LX versions of applications being added, the team is concentrating on those areas that bring in a whole load of dependencies. Pynighbourhood is no more as pcmanfm2 is taking over for linking samba devices.

10.04 was released as a stable beta, not a finished project. But, for those interested in its progress


Hi,

The Lubuntu Maverick Alpha 3 iso is now available for testing.

Please note that Lubuntu Maverick is based on Ubuntu Maverick, same
warning apply :

"Pre-releases of Maverick are *not* encouraged for anyone needing a
stable system or anyone who is not comfortable running into occasional,
even frequent breakage. They are, however, recommended for Ubuntu
developers and those who want to help in testing, reporting, and fixing
bugs."

== What's new ? ==
Since Alpha 2 :
- New theme, made by Rafael Laguna
- New slideshow available during the installation
- Lubuntu include now some small games, powered by ace-of-penguins.
- Evince is now used for reading PDF.
- LXDE is now HAL-free. Lubuntu still depends on HAL for CD-burner, but
by removing it, you can obtain a HAL-free system.
- And the usual updates of LXDE and Lubuntu components packages.

Since the beginning of Maverick :
- Updates on programs installed by default :
* Update-notifier was added
* Xpad was added
* Parcellite was removed
* Pyneighborhood was removed
* LXtask was added, to replace Xfce4-taskmanager
- A new meta-package (lubuntu-core) is available to install only core
packages of Lubuntu.
- A new meta-package (lubuntu-restricted-extras) is available to install
restricted packages for Lubutnu (such as flash, java and extra codecs
for chromium)
- Add support for indicator applets on lxpanel (turn off by default)
- And the usual Ubuntu updates.

== Specific Lubuntu changes ==
Lubuntu contains 2 specific changes still not available on Ubuntu
official repository :
- Support for lxdm in ubiquity
- Lubuntu slideshow for ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu

== Testing needed ==
We'll appreciate some feedbacks about the followings recent additions :
- The slideshow, especially the text, to be able to start translation.
- Feedback on the new theme.

== Known bugs ==
* Start menu of the Live-CD is not correctly translated.
* Install menu entry in the Live-CD doesn't work.
* Keyboard layout is not correctly set on the Live-CD session.
* The splash screen on Live-CD session may fall-back to Ubuntu text one.

== Reporting bugs ==
You can find information on how to report bug on this wiki page :
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/ReportingBugs

== Download ==
Torrent:
http://people.ubuntu.com/~gilir/lubuntu-maverick-alpha3.iso.torrent
Download: http://people.ubuntu.com/~gilir/lubuntu-maverick-alpha3.iso
Md5 : http://people.ubuntu.com/~gilir/md5sum.txt

Happy testing :)

Regards,
Julien Lavergne

Regards,

Phill.
P.S. you can usually find me on the #lubuntu IRC channel, don't be afraid to pop on, we do not bite :-)

[Redsandro]

@cimh:

Thanks for giving your opinion. But as you could have read some posts back, both the usb automount and scanner compatibility started to work. Although it works out of the box in any other *buntu, in Lubuntu you get a scanner identification popup that wants to download drivers from the internet. So there is no problem, as long as you have internet access.

And although I use Linux Mint 9 LXDE, which is essentially the same but less ugly, I like Lubuntu too. But there are certainly big annoyances.

Note that I like to point out, as many people seem to get this wrong, that automount and hardwaredetect (scanner) etc are not the price you pay for a lightweight and fast desktop environment since these features are just a "beep" from the Hardware Abstraction Layer (or whatever they use now) which is pretty much the same in every DE.

The difference between a 75 MB DE and a 400 MB one is lots of bloat, efficiëncy, extra fancy features, debugging symbols, whether or not a sh**load of drivers is already available (Ubuntu) or you need to connect to the internet to download specific ones (Lubuntu), whether or not for example SAMBA configuration is fully integrated with the DE (Gnome) or not, etc.

Problems Lubuntu and the likes have with basic hardware IO (usb, scanner, etc) are solely the problem you get when using beta or RC software.

In the end, I use Ubuntu, Xubuntu and Linux Mint 9 LXDE (Lubuntu). I know what's best when. I understand the differences, although I still don't understand why for example the difference in footprint between LXDE and Gnome needs to be so big.


the team is concentrating on those areas that bring in a whole load of dependencies. Pynighbourhood is no more as pcmanfm2 is taking over for linking samba devices.
Good to hear! Although I'm sure it worked for everyone else, I never ever got to mount anything through PyNeighbourhood in LXDE. This probably means that one of my biggest annoyances gets fixed! :)

Although I promised myself to stay away from non-LTS releases since *buntu 9.10 was such a terrible waste of my time.. :(

[frank cox]

I have had few problems with lubuntu 10.10 and it is very fast.It runs much cooler than Puppy on my old tabletpc. The difference between it and xubuntu is not night and day but it is there, it is much faster than Mint. One of my biggest attractions to Linux is it runs on older hardware.
Less than 2 gigs of ram and Mint will barely run but I do like it . Lubuntu runs well on 500 megs , puppy on 256.
Puppy is a great program but for a lot of people Ubuntu and its variants are less threatening. Have not tried dialup on Lubuntu but I suspect it is not well supported. For that Puppy 431 is the way to go unless you use serial/harwqare modems in which case it makes little difference.

For a person who is not at all up on Linux I would go with Ubuntu ,Mint etc. if they have the resources and Xubuntu if they don't. That being said my cousin is totally computer illiterate period and he does fine with Lubuntu, a lot depends on what you do with it. It's prettycool that there is a wacom driver set made just for Fujitsu TabletPC's running Lubuntu .

[NormanFLinux]

Lubuntu 10.10 is stable and has a better GUI than Puppy. And Puppy's developers need to overhaul the pet. package manager interface. It takes forever just to connect to Ubuntu even on broadband! I still needed to download and install the wireless drivers via Ethernet but once it was set up, it worked. And I have to pull everything needed via Synaptic for its not a complete system and repositories still have to be added... but once done, its surprising usable desktop.

[NormanFLinux]

Lubuntu 10.10 is stable and has a better GUI than Puppy. And Puppy's developers need to overhaul the pet. package manager interface. It takes forever just to connect to Ubuntu even on broadband! I still needed to download and install the wireless drivers via Ethernet but once it was set up, it worked. And I have to pull everything needed via Synaptic for its not a complete system and repositories still have to be added... but once done, its surprising usable desktop.

[Redsandro]

@frank cox good sir,

Saying Mint is like saying *buntu.

You cannot compare Lubuntu to 'Mint'. I have Mint LXDE, which is an official Mint distro, on my ancient laptop and it runs awesome. I had Lubuntu before that, it runs exactly the same, but Mint LXDE is much prettier.