Help in choosing new computer

[MeanEYE]

Hi everyone.

I am thinking about buying a new computer and I need your help. I might sound weird at the moment but please bare with me...

Currently I have ASUS Pundit P1-AH2 which is great little computer but it lacks some things I need (additional DVI and HDMI connector to be specific). I want to buy something that is small, quiet with AMD processor and nVidia graphic card. I need at least 2 DVI and 1 HDMI outputs. Any price range is fine but I want it to be a brand-name computer, not custom made.

Please if you suggest something, do specify a model number, so I can Google it later, and your experience with that hardware.

Thank you all in advance.

[Sef]

Moved to Community Cafe.

[Breambutt]

Any price range is fine but I want it to be a brand-name computer, not custom made.
Why? :/

Warranty, customer service, insufficient proficiency in hardware fidgeting or something else? Usually small and quiet don't go hand in hand very well unless they use an external power brick, which I haven't seen in a lot of big name non-laptops. Also does this extend to PCI-E NVIDIA cards or integrated chips because AMD is unfortunately a bit more ATI these days. You'll probably need some kind of an extrnal DVI/HDMI splitbox anyway with 3 outputs.

Good luck on your crusade anyhow.

[McRat]

Hi everyone.

I am thinking about buying a new computer and I need your help. I might sound weird at the moment but please bare with me...

Currently I have ASUS Pundit P1-AH2 which is great little computer but it lacks some things I need (additional DVI and HDMI connector to be specific). I want to buy something that is small, quiet with AMD processor and nVidia graphic card. I need at least 2 DVI and 1 HDMI outputs. Any price range is fine but I want it to be a brand-name computer, not custom made.

Please if you suggest something, do specify a model number, so I can Google it later, and your experience with that hardware.

Thank you all in advance.

All the big name allow you customize their computers when ordering online at no significant penalty.

You are probably going to be looking for a machine with 2 video card, or a built-in card plus a dedicated card.

It just will be tough to find 2 DVI ports in a shrinkwrapped computer I think.

[MeanEYE]

Why? :/

Warranty, customer service, insufficient proficiency in hardware fidgeting or something else? Usually small and quiet don't go hand in hand very well unless they use an external power brick, which I haven't seen in a lot of big name non-laptops. Also does this extend to PCI-E NVIDIA cards or integrated chips because AMD is unfortunately a bit more ATI these days. You'll probably need some kind of an extrnal DVI/HDMI splitbox anyway with 3 outputs.

Good luck on your crusade anyhow.

Well am not looking for THAT small :) so that I need an external power brick. This is how big my current machine is:
http://parker1.co.uk/pundit-p1/pundit1.jpg

It's not that I can't build a good machine... I just don't want to. Barebone machines are usually a lot smaller, use less power and overall better integrated.

Unfortunately I know AMD has gone ATI. Only reason I'd like nVidia is because their support for Ubuntu is far better than ATIs. With ATI there's always a good chance something will fail with drivers.

I already have DVI splitter and it's not giving me the results I want. My current machine has 1 SVGA, 1 DVI and 0 HDMI. I just purchased big 40" Toshiba TV hoping that splitter will do it's work. Well I got a big and 'nice' surprise.

Before I needed HDMI output I was prepared to live with one Analog and one Digital output for my monitors. But now problems are piling up and my 2-3 year old computer is fit for replacement.

[MeanEYE]

All the big name allow you customize their computers when ordering online at no significant penalty.

You are probably going to be looking for a machine with 2 video card, or a built-in card plus a dedicated card.

It just will be tough to find 2 DVI ports in a shrinkwrapped computer I think.

Am aware I'll probably have to go with video cards in SLI mode. I did see some Asus barebones who have PCI-E for extension but they are ugly as hell. :D

Do you have any good experiences with brand-name computers. Maybe some suggestions about brand or model?

[Breambutt]

It's a real pita about ATI and NVIDIA. Could really use a properly functioning integrated chip on this machine, my 7900GT is a bit of an overkill and you could still play a bunch of recent games on moderate settings with it.

About the power brick, it's not only a matter of size. Power bricks have no fans (well, some do) and PSUs with bricks produce most of the heat outside the case which will be better on the hardware and allow for more silent operation. I just don't trust those small scale PSUs, usually the smaller the fans the more noise they make.

Maybe I'm just going a little overboard with the noise sensitivity, but it's because I record acoustic instruments on my rig.

[McRat]

Am aware I'll probably have to go with video cards in SLI mode. I did see some Asus barebones who have PCI-E for extension but they are ugly as hell. :D

Do you have any good experiences with brand-name computers. Maybe some suggestions about brand or model?


I've bought mostly HP/Compaqs or Dells for work. Maybe 3 IBMs? A couple eMachines? Built a few clones too.

HP/Compaq have had a lot of troubles in the last 5 years, I think I'm quiting.

Dells have been very good. Can't remember the last time I had one bust.

If I had to buy new tomorrow, it would be Dell or a Clone.

[MeanEYE]

It's a real pita about ATI and NVIDIA. Could really use a properly functioning integrated chip on this machine, my 7900GT is a bit of an overkill and you could still play a bunch of recent games on moderate settings with it.

About the power brick, it's not only a matter of size. Power bricks have no fans (well, some do) and PSUs with bricks produce most of the heat outside the case which will be better on the hardware and allow for more silent operation. I just don't trust those small scale PSUs, usually the smaller the fans the more noise they make.

Maybe I'm just going a little overboard with the noise sensitivity, but it's because I record acoustic instruments on my rig.

I agree on external PSUs but am afraid it will die on me and I won't be able to get it replaced easily. I work as a programmer, so sound is not really an issue but I like it quiet. Not in the 5-fans-jet-engine-of-a-computer way quiet. :D

[MeanEYE]

I've bought mostly HP/Compaqs or Dells for work. Maybe 3 IBMs? A couple eMachines? Built a few clones too.

HP/Compaq have had a lot of troubles in the last 5 years, I think I'm quiting.

Dells have been very good. Can't remember the last time I had one bust.

If I had to buy new tomorrow, it would be Dell or a Clone.

HPs are easy to find in my country. They look ugly though :)

Dell - NEVER again. I have 2x19" LCD displays I paid a lot more than average. Both of my screens were delivered with at least some dead pixels. After many fights with Dell I got them both replaced but they still have imperfections and one screen makes irritating high frequency noise. I don't want to go through that stuff again.

Clone... is that a company name? (sorry if question is stupid)

[cascade9]

SLI in something small? Rare at best.

You might be able to get 2xDVI and 1xHDMI working from a single card, like this one-

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125311

Pity its a dual-slot design, it wont fit in this shutle system thats worth a look-

http://us.shuttle.com/barebone/Models/SA76G2.html

[MeanEYE]

SLI in something small? Rare at best.

You might be able to get 2xDVI and 1xHDMI working from a single card, like this one-

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125311

Pity its a dual-slot design, it wont fit in this shutle system thats worth a look-

http://us.shuttle.com/barebone/Models/SA76G2.html

That video card looks nice but comments say it really loud and despite heaving 2 DVI ports it CAN'T push 2 displays. Although, guy said it can't push 2x30" which is quite a resolution.

Shuttle systems, I completely forgot about them. Thanks for bringing them up. I'll have a look.

It seems to me that I'll have to make a custom machine after all.

[KingYaba]

I want it to be a brand-name computer, not custom made.

That seems silly because you have some pretty specific requirements and putting parts you ordered from TigerDirect and or Newegg would fulfill it easily. Not to mention you'd save money in the process.

[cascade9]

That video card looks nice but comments say it really loud and despite heaving 2 DVI ports it CAN'T push 2 displays. Although, guy said it can't push 2x30" which is quite a resolution.

You mean the comment on the newegg page? "Single dual-link DVI output, despite two DVI ports. Can't drive two 30" monitors." Dual-link is waht is needed to push very big resolutions-


With a single DVI link, the largest resolution possible at 60 Hz is 2.75 megapixels (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megapixels) (including blanking interval). For practical purposes, this allows a maximum screen resolution at 60 Hz of 1915 x 1436 pixels (standard 4:3 ratio), 1854 x 1483 pixels (5:4 ratio) or 2098 x 1311 (widescreen 16:10 ratio)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_Visual_Interface

As long as you are under those resolutions, it will display to 2 monitor via DVI just fine. ;)

True, it will be a very loud card, but you could always just change the stock heatsink/fan for something a lot quieter.


Shuttle systems, I completely forgot about them. Thanks for bringing them up. I'll have a look.

It seems to me that I'll have to make a custom machine after all.

If you do have to go custom, try to find a 'e' series AMD CPU (low wattage) or even a 'u' series (ultra-low wattage). The 'u' series havent got as much go as the normal AMD CPUs or the 'e's.

[MeanEYE]

That seems silly because you have some pretty specific requirements and putting parts you ordered from TigerDirect and or Newegg would fulfill it easily. Not to mention you'd save money in the process.

True, it would fulfill my requirements easily but then again, I'd have to go with midi ATX case at least with 600W PSU and all other noisy things. That's the thing I want to avoid. :) Money is not the issue... :)

[MeanEYE]

You mean the comment on the newegg page? "Single dual-link DVI output, despite two DVI ports. Can't drive two 30" monitors." Dual-link is waht is needed to push very big resolutions-


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_Visual_Interface

As long as you are under those resolutions, it will display to 2 monitor via DVI just fine. ;)

Yup, that's what I though :D when I said 30" is quite big. I have 2x19" with 1440x900 resolution. :)



True, it will be a very loud card, but you could always just change the stock heatsink/fan for something a lot quieter.


Am considering finding 2 cards with passive cooling system. That way they can be quiet and :D I'd have my requirements for output connectors fulfilled.



If you do have to go custom, try to find a 'e' series AMD CPU (low wattage) or even a 'u' series (ultra-low wattage). The 'u' series havent got as much go as the normal AMD CPUs or the 'e's.
Thanks a lot... that's actually what I wanted to :D find out with this thread. I'll look into it :)

[cascade9]

True, it would fulfill my requirements easily but then again, I'd have to go with midi ATX case at least with 600W PSU and all other noisy things. That's the thing I want to avoid. :) Money is not the issue... :)

Nah, you wouldnt need to go to MidiATX or 600watts.

Easy to get a microATX motherboard.....you can even get AMD/ATI microATX motherboards with crossfire in case you need 2 cards-

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128445

As for the power supply, have a look at this-

http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cases/display/system-wattage.html

And-

http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cpu/display/power-consumption-overclocking.html

Yes, teh 2nd article does concentrate on power consumption with overclocking, but it does give 'base' unoverclocked power consumption figures.

BTW, if did feel that you wanted 600watts ('to be sure') then have a look at this-

http://www.silentpcreview.com/Seasonic_X650

Yep, a 6500watts PSU that will operate in totally fanless mode at low loads ;)

[Breambutt]

The wattage link is a load of horse crap. The PM300 meter used is legendary for being a horrid piece of f- ... you know. I own one among a couple of other similar gadgets. Well, it works on linear loads such as light bulbs and toasters, but you can get completely random readings with ATX power supplies without proper power factor correction. And by random I mean half of the actual value or twice the actual value.

Edit: Okay, I just read it now. It's not a load of horse crap but the meter is.

See this for fun if you own a cheap generic wattage meter (they're not all bad): http://www.hiit.fi/files/admin/publications/Technical_Reports/hiit-tr-2009-1.pdf

But anyway, there's an abundance of compact cases suitable for your purposes even if they're labeled as HTPC cases. The silent, energy efficient mediaputer trend works to everyone's advantage if you ask me. Not even above average powerful PCs require that much power apart from the graphics card, so in case you aren't going for hardcore gaming with 4 power-hungry cards even a measly 350W might be enough. Doesn't hurt to have a bit higher, of course.

Some 9xxx NVIDIA card (or even 8-series) might work worders, given they have the necessary outputs. The new ones have been known to perform even worse, but they have support for the latest fancy schmancies.

I think I should stop rambling uncontrollably now. Coffee time.

[cascade9]

The wattage link is a load of horse crap. The PM300 meter used is legendary for being a horrid piece of f- ... you know. I own one among a couple of other similar gadgets. Well, it works on linear loads such as light bulbs and toasters, but you can get completely random readings with ATX power supplies without proper power factor correction. And by random I mean half of the actual value or twice the actual value.

Edit: Okay, I just read it now. It's not a load of horse crap but the meter is.

LOL, I was just about to say "but they arent using that PM300 meter". But you just figured it out ;)


But anyway, there's an abundance of compact cases suitable for your purposes even if they're labeled as HTPC cases. The silent, energy efficient mediaputer trend works to everyone's advantage if you ask me. Not even above average powerful PCs require that much power apart from the graphics card, so in case you aren't going for hardcore gaming with 4 power-hungry cards even a measly 350W might be enough. Doesn't hurt to have a bit higher, of course.

+1. Some of the HTPC cases are even good (but like everything, a lot of them are awful).

[MeanEYE]

The wattage link is a load of horse crap. The PM300 meter used is legendary for being a horrid piece of f- ... you know. I own one among a couple of other similar gadgets. Well, it works on linear loads such as light bulbs and toasters, but you can get completely random readings with ATX power supplies without proper power factor correction. And by random I mean half of the actual value or twice the actual value.

See this for fun if you own a cheap generic wattage meter (they're not all bad): http://www.hiit.fi/files/admin/publications/Technical_Reports/hiit-tr-2009-1.pdf

But anyway, there's an abundance of compact cases suitable for your purposes even if they're labeled as HTPC cases. The silent, energy efficient mediaputer trend works to everyone's advantage if you ask me. Not even above average powerful PCs require that much power apart from the graphics card, so in case you aren't going for hardcore gaming with 4 power-hungry cards even a measly 350W might be enough. Doesn't hurt to have a bit higher, of course.

Some 9xxx NVIDIA card (or even 8-series) might work worders, given they have the necessary outputs. The new ones have been known to perform even worse, but they have support for the latest fancy schmancies.

I think I should stop rambling uncontrollably now. Coffee time.

Hehe, right you are, about the coffee time.

[MeanEYE]

I think am gonna go with some of compact cases and custom built machine. I found newer versions of ASUS Pundit but they are so ugly I can not describe.

Thank you :D both... ^^

[cascade9]

No problem.

BTW, if you want quiet, get a case with 120mm fans, and replace the fans that come with the case with noctua fans :)

[MeanEYE]

No problem.

BTW, if you want quiet, get a case with 120mm fans, and replace the fans that come with the case with noctua fans :)

Oh, great... they are also available in my country :D
Thanx

[Breambutt]

Yeah, yeah! The 500 RPM undervolted (?) ones. And... and...

Can we build the computer for you? We're already halfway to erection.

[MeanEYE]

Yeah, yeah! The 500 RPM undervolted (?) ones.

Not sure which ones. There aren't many of them in this store.



And... and...

Can we build the computer for you? We're already halfway to erection.

Haha, well, sure :)... I've decided to go with this video card (http://www.gigatronshop.com/products/show_product/18883/10) and to go with AMD Phenom II X4 925... any suggestions about other hardware... am thinking this (http://www.gigatronshop.com/products/show_product/19680/8) case would be quite nice. Not sure about memory and motherboard :D

[Breambutt]

It's always fun suggesting hardware on non-localized forums. Just grab whatever is available or you'll never get it done, the worst part about building your own rig. Maybe fast-forward through a couple of reviews of mobos and other hardware that look good on paper.

The Noctua fan I meant is probably more commonly referred to something like "the most popular fan in the world" or "the newer version of" the aforementioned. Noctua and Scythe and ... well, haven't been following the tuning scene lately, some of them are better for blowing cool air in than hot air out, but who gives a poo.

[MeanEYE]

It's always fun suggesting hardware on non-localized forums. Just grab whatever is available or you'll never get it done, the worst part about building your own rig. Maybe fast-forward through a couple of reviews of mobos and other hardware that look good on paper.

The Noctua fan I meant is probably more commonly referred to something like "the most popular fan in the world" or "the newer version of" the aforementioned. Noctua and Scythe and ... well, haven't been following the tuning scene lately, some of them are better for blowing cool air in than hot air out, but who gives a poo.

Yeah, I was left out of hardware advances for some time. :) When it comes to "finishing" something... am quite a stubborn fella, so I guess I won't have any problems with that. Once I decide I really want to buy a new computer that is.

Thanks again :)

[cascade9]

Not sure which ones. There aren't many of them in this store.

A lot of fans can be run undervolted, and the noctua fans can normally be run at 5 volts (not the standard 12volts). At low voltage, the fans spin slower, and are quieter.



Haha, well, sure :)... I've decided to go with this video card (http://www.gigatronshop.com/products/show_product/18883/10) and to go with AMD Phenom II X4 925... any suggestions about other hardware... am thinking this (http://www.gigatronshop.com/products/show_product/19680/8) case would be quite nice. Not sure about memory and motherboard :D

A GTX 470?!?!?? Power hungry, hot and huge gaming cards. Not what you want for a small quiet system. It wont fit in that case anyway-


Case dimensions h x w x d 360 x 100 x 455mm http://www.gigatronshop.com/products/show_product/19680/8


Standard Graphics Card Dimensions:Height4.376 inches (111 mm) Length9.5 inches (241 mm) WidthDual-slot http://www.nvidia.com/object/product_geforce_gtx_470_us.html

'Height' in video cards = 'width' in cases. A 110mm card isnt going to fit into a 100mm case.

BTW, those 'slim' cases tend to have very limited power supplies avaible, and I doubt that you will find a slim power supply that can run a GTX 470 and a X4 925.

[MeanEYE]

A lot of fans can be run undervolted, and the noctua fans can normally be run at 5 volts (not the standard 12volts). At low voltage, the fans spin slower, and are quieter.



A GTX 470?!?!?? Power hungry, hot and huge gaming cards. Not what you want for a small quiet system. It wont fit in that case anyway-

http://www.gigatronshop.com/products/show_product/19680/8

http://www.nvidia.com/object/product_geforce_gtx_470_us.html

'Height' in video cards = 'width' in cases. A 110mm card isnt going to fit into a 100mm case.

BTW, those 'slim' cases tend to have very limited power supplies avaible, and I doubt that you will find a slim power supply that can run a GTX 470 and a X4 925.

Yeah, I realized that myself after I posted here.

[sidzen]

Check out Shuttle -- you;ll be surprised!

[MeanEYE]

Check out Shuttle -- you;ll be surprised!

Any series suggestion?

[rewyllys]

Hi everyone.

I am thinking about buying a new computer and I need your help. . . . Any price range is fine but I want it to be a brand-name computer, not custom made.

I'm not sure what you meant by "brand-name computer", but since you're presumably going to be using Linux on your new machine, I'd suggest that you consider System76 and ZaReason, both of which build a variety of machines using Linux, in particular, Ubuntu.

http://www.system76.com/

http://zareason.com/shop/home.php

Anyone else care to suggest a Linux- or Ubuntu-oriented manufacturer?

[MeanEYE]

I'm not sure what you meant by "brand-name computer", but since you're presumably going to be using Linux on your new machine, I'd suggest that you consider System76 and ZaReason, both of which build a variety of machines using Linux, in particular, Ubuntu.

http://www.system76.com/

http://zareason.com/shop/home.php

Anyone else care to suggest a Linux- or Ubuntu-oriented manufacturer?

Oh, great... didn't know about System76. Sad thing is, my country is a bit weird when it comes to importing electronics... but I'll see what I can do...

[cascade9]

Oh, great... didn't know about System76. Sad thing is, my country is a bit weird when it comes to importing electronics... but I'll see what I can do...

System 76 wont ship outside the US and Canada-


We only ship within the United States and Canada. We offer Ground, 3 Day, 2nd Day, and Next Day shipping options to addresses within the United States. Most orders ship via UPS however occasionally an order will ship via DHL.

http://www.system76.com/article_info.php?articles_id=14

[sidzen]

Any series suggestion?

AMD -- http://us.shuttle.com/barebone/Models/SA76G2.html

intel -- http://us.shuttle.com/barebone/Models/SG41J1_PLUS.html