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Mr James
June 5th, 2010, 01:29 AM
Hello, I am new here and new to Unix and it's relatives as well. After searching the web for what was a proper distro to install for a noob (noob in Unix, not computers, Windows or Windows programming), almost always the answer was Ubuntu. I must say I am definitely sticking with this OS. The Unix architecture is nothing short of genius and Debian along with Ubuntu have done a wonderful job of creating an OS that makes easy common tasks for the general population while not offending the intelligence of the more technical users.

Reading a Windows vs Ubuntu thread here, I feel a need to point out to the community the following:

1. Microsoft has done, over it's time, significantly more good than bad for the economy, the computer industry and the community. Let me tell you why:
1a. Microsoft has provided the US with a vast number of jobs, directly and indirectly (Ads alone...).
1b. No other driving force has pushed the computer industry (hardware and software) more than Microsoft. The PC is what it is today because of the success the DOS\PC had in the original IBM PC.

2. While I now am loving Ubuntu and Unix in general, I am not an advocate (perhaps I may not be understanding it or it's implications completely, and if so, please feel free to correct me) of the open source movement. I do encourage, for educational or humanitarian reasons, the spreading of open source software while not having a mindset that proprietary closed source and commercial software (not donations but actual capitalism) are evil.
Look at it this way: The creation of games such as Tomb Raider requires the employment of actors, choreographers, musicians, researchers for history and geography, so on and so forth. No advertising can cover the costs. No amount of spin-off products such as tee shirts or caps can cover it. There is no technical servicing or user specific customizations required. It is a single-player game and as such no ISP will fund it because, for sake of argument, gamers are online playing and thus the ISP is profiting. I see no way a company such as this, providing an excellent game such as this is going to make money off of or even be able to come up with such a game if it was free in price, or open source as people would not pay for a binary they can download the source code for and compile at home.
I thus believe that this movement will hurt the economy (correct me if I am wrong) and the computer industry as a whole (the big picture).

3. Ubuntu is, in my opinion, a better (game support aside) OS than Windows in terms of architecture and possibilities. The learning curve is not steep and Gnome (I have not as of yet tried KDE) is logical in its GUI implementation. The terminal is also now my hand and foot. I like Unix.

4. I am against the idea of paying for or being bound in legal contracts for the use of standards and file formats. In this regard open source is right. Patents on such stuff hinder competition and this is never good.

Of course, I may bee wrong. Feel free to comment. If you do wish to comment, please do so logically, providing reasons do back up your view.

McRat
June 5th, 2010, 01:37 AM
Welcome fellow newbie. :)

I had selected Ubuntu simply because it is the current leader of the Linux distros, so i figured there would be more peer support.

I was pleasantly surprised how easy it was to get up and going. I tried to put Linux on an IBM in about 1999, and I could not get the mouse or CD drive to work, so I gave up the same day.

Things have changed alot.

I don't believe that without MS that desktop computing would have stalled. In fact, it's possible it would have advanced faster starting in 1995 due to Microsoft's aggressive stance against competitors.

I don't run Linux because it's free. I'm switching because it works.

kaldor
June 5th, 2010, 01:45 AM
I run Linux because I love UNIX and it works better than Windows for me. On top of that, it's easier with package management. I'd rather not buy software and risk losing activation codes, disks, etc.

sdowney717
June 5th, 2010, 01:47 AM
MS wants to bury Linux in the grave, so you can understand some of the sentiment regularly displayed here.
They threaten patent infringement against linux users so if companies dont pay they might sue them out of existance.
that type of thing.

jerenept
June 5th, 2010, 01:50 AM
MS wants to bury Linux in the grave, so you can understand some of the sentiment regularly displayed here.


I can see why. Vista got people disillusioned. :lol:

Besides, your avatar? Did somebody (http://www.apple.com/macosx/) inspire it?

jerenept
June 5th, 2010, 01:51 AM
BTW, it's LINUX or GNU/Linux, not Unix.

wilee-nilee
June 5th, 2010, 01:52 AM
Nice example of projection, (op) but hey welcome to the forums.;)

sdowney717
June 5th, 2010, 01:55 AM
I like cats and this is a baby tiger.
It is sort of how I feel about what goes on in this world, being somewhat powerless to make needed changes yet still with a lot of potential.

http://www.dailytech.com/Ballmer+Compares+Macs+to+Trucks+Disses+Google+OS/article18618.htm

Personally S Ballmer sounds intimidated by Chrome OS and belittles it just like a bully would.

NibbleAbit
June 5th, 2010, 02:03 AM
I personally don't see this as an either/or situation. Proprietary systems like Windows and Apple are good, and so are open source systems like Linux and BSD. Both are good for the economy of the nation and the world. There are many companies like redhat, IBM, Novell and Canonical that rely on Linux for their revenue.

Personally, my only disagreement with Microsoft is their anti competitive practices. When you are in a competitive industry, like selling pencils, then it is good to have a fair fight in the marketplace. Once you have a monopoly, like Microsoft does, the laws actually change and you need to behave differently to allow competitors into your market space. AT&T was broken into the many phone companies we have now as a result of abuse of a monopoly. I'm not suggesting Microsoft be broken into pieces, but something needs to be done to make it obey the laws. Every time it goes to court, it looses, it pays the fines, but it becomes irrelevant because in the 5 years it takes to prosecute, the competition has virtually disappeared, and the technology they were fighting over is now antique.

Windows, the product is good. Many things Microsoft does is good. Anti-competitive behavior is bad.

Just my opinion after watching the industry for over 30 years.

Mr James
June 5th, 2010, 02:08 AM
MS wants to bury Linux in the grave, so you can understand some of the sentiment regularly displayed here.
They threaten patent infringement against linux users so if companies dont pay they might sue them out of existance.
that type of thing.

I understand. But is this not competition as found in every company? When it comes to work and ones livelihood, nobody likes a competitor. If Linux is working within the law, as I believe it is, it has nothing to worry about. Yes? Is is not the same with Intel\Amd, Nvidia\ATI?


BTW, it's LINUX or GNU/Linux, not Unix.
Is that directed at me? If so, I say Unix because Linux is it's cousin. Not much different in terms of general architecture.


Nice example of projection, (op) but hey welcome to the forums.;)
Thank you, I am happy to find such quick responses. I am merely trying to be fair. I see both as having thier good and bad sides.

Sealbhach
June 5th, 2010, 02:08 AM
Most code written for Linux is by paid developers:

http://www.osnews.com/story/22786/75_of_Linux_Code_Written_by_Paid_Developers


.

Mr James
June 5th, 2010, 02:13 AM
I personally don't see this as an either/or situation. Proprietary systems like Windows and Apple are good, and so are open source systems like Linux and BSD. Both are good for the economy of the nation and the world. There are many companies like redhat, IBM, Novell and Canonical that rely on Linux for their revenue.

Personally, my only disagreement with Microsoft is their anti competitive practices. When you are in a competitive industry, like selling pencils, then it is good to have a fair fight in the marketplace. Once you have a monopoly, like Microsoft does, the laws actually change and you need to behave differently to allow competitors into your market space. AT&T was broken into the many phone companies we have now as a result of abuse of a monopoly. I'm not suggesting Microsoft be broken into pieces, but something needs to be done to make it obey the laws. Every time it goes to court, it looses, it pays the fines, but it becomes irrelevant because in the 5 years it takes to prosecute, the competition has virtually disappeared, and the technology they were fighting over is now antique.

Windows, the product is good. Many things Microsoft does is good. Anti-competitive behavior is bad.

Just my opinion after watching the industry for over 30 years.

I posted before being seeing your post. You are correct, I agree completely - except for the part of open source as I do not yet fully understand. The open source philosophy, correct me if I am wrong, is about making ALL software open source and hoping for the complete disappearance of proprietary software, correct?

McRat
June 5th, 2010, 02:55 AM
Open Source for operating systems stops a company from customizing the O/S to harm competing application developers.

It gives all application developers an even footing on new developments in the O/S. They are published in advance of general release.

It allows application developers to put resources into developing the O/S. Democratic Design.

I don't believe all software should be free, nor will that ever happen. However, free programs with open source have been around forever. Using code or algorithms from other apps has been a foundation of computer programming from the beginning. REGARDLESS of what the US Patent Office was told by corporate lawyers.

Open Source for operating systems stops companies from patenting operating system structures like Directory Structures. What a counter-productive concept that is. Demanding incompatiblity??

sdowney717
June 5th, 2010, 04:03 AM
I understand. But is this not competition as found in every company? When it comes to work and ones livelihood, nobody likes a competitor. If Linux is working within the law, as I believe it is, it has nothing to worry about. Yes? Is is not the same with Intel\Amd, Nvidia\ATI?

Lawyers and judges interpret laws and are swayed one way or another by plaintiffs arguments, So being within the law may not be applicable. You can of course appeal a decision, but it gets kinda expensive and companies may feel pressure to just pay up money to MS or be harassed to death in the court system. Sometimes those with the greatest resources get the justice.

jerenept
June 5th, 2010, 05:11 AM
This is why i love Shakespeare. Henry VI.