Smoking/Smokers?

[kaldor]

Keep this off the political side, I'm not trying to start a war here.

Canadian and American cigarettes seem to be a lot unhealthier than European/South American brands. I notice that everyone from around here who smokes always regrets it, while Europeans I meet are more casual about it and enjoy every bit of it.

What's everyone's take on smoking?

My personal opinion...

There's nothing wrong with smoking; it's abusing tobacco that causes problems. I've smoked numerous times over the last 3 years and I haven't gotten addicted/had health issues and I get no cravings; it's just a social thing and I don't even intend on smoking in the future. I think all these health issues all boil down to abuse. Maybe that's why cigar smokers are usually much healthier than chain/cigarette smokers? People get addicted to smoking because cigarettes come in packs of small sticks. A cig only lasts ~5 minutes, so people are more likely to grab another one later. Over time, that causes addiction because of the amount of nicotine. Cigar users, on the other hand, don't inhale the smoke and usually don't smoke often; they seem to just enjoy sitting back and relaxing with a smoke, not worrying about feeding a craving.

Moral: In moderation, anything is fine. Abuse of anything will never lead to anything positive.

[bigseb]

I completely disagree with you

:)

[RiceMonster]

I used to smoke cigarettes with my friends, but I quit that almost 2 years ago. I was always having a few drinks when I was smoking, and later I realized how discusting it is and how much I actually hated it. I dislike cigars just as much. I'm very glad I stopped before it became a habbit.

[ssj6akshat]

Smoking sucks.I smoked once 6 years ago when I was 8(with a bunch of spoiled teenagers) and hated it.

[dragos240]

Honestly, I can't stand smoking. But I usually keep my opinions to myself.

[swoll1980]

I've been been struggling with quit attempts for a year. The longest I went was 6 months w/o. Cigarettes are the devil Bobby.

[Frogs Hair]

My father had a choice , quit or die , I am glad he quit.

[dragos240]

I've been been struggling with quit attempts for a year. The longest I went was 6 months w/o. Cigarettes are the devil Bobby.

I thought you quit swoll! Stupid cigarettes.

[swoll1980]

I thought you quit swoll! Stupid cigarettes.

I did for 6 months. I've been on and off since. It's been really disappointing.

[forrestcupp]

European cigarettes are healthier than American cigarettes? Lol. Now I've heard it all.

[JDShu]

Canadian and American cigarettes seem to be a lot unhealthier than European/South American brands. I notice that everyone from around here who smokes always regrets it, while Europeans I meet are more casual about it and enjoy every bit of it.

Is your second statement your reason for thinking the first?

[kaldor]

Is your second statement your reason for thinking the first?

No, it's Europeans that have told me that there are less additives in European brands. It was only a statement =p

[JDShu]

No, it's Europeans that have told me that there are less additives in European brands. It was only a statement =p

I see, so why do you think European brands are healthier?

[ELD]

I smoke and i know it is unhealthy, but people who say terrible things about it and shun people for it when they sit back and chug their alcohole away are just as bad.

Note: Yeah i drink too, but people who do one and annoy people with their "wisdom" about the other annoy me.

I agree with the OP - Moderation people.

[madnessjack]

I smoke and i know it is unhealthy, but people who say terrible things about it and shun people for it when they sit back and chug their alcohole away are just as bad.

Note: Yeah i drink too, but people who do one and annoy people with their "wisdom" about the other annoy me.

I agree with the OP - Moderation people.
Agreed, binge drinkers are hypocrites! However, a drink every now and then isn't an issue, whereas smoking cigarettes is still inhaling narcotics, even just the odd one once or twice a week, it's gonna do you harm.

What I don't get is old folks where I live. They all used to smoke 30 a day into their forties, then they stopped, and now they're happily living into their 80s. !?

[JDShu]

I smoke and i know it is unhealthy, but people who say terrible things about it and shun people for it when they sit back and chug their alcohole away are just as bad.

When you drink alcohol, you're hurting yourself. When you smoke, you're hurting yourself and the people around you. Its perfectly natural to shun a smoker, at least when he or she is smoking.

[whiskeylover]

Ex smoker here. Quit 4+ years ago. Haven't touched a single cigarette since then.

Now, I'm married to a woman who hates smoking. So, I know if I start, she's gonna beat the **** out of me. Thats another factor that keeps me from going back : )

[samalex]

The problem with smoking and smokers is a conundrum. If you decided to play Prodigy at 100dB around a smoker I bet most would complain it's too loud, but if they smoke around someone who starts complaining many smokers will say it's their right to smoke. Just as it's the right of everyone to not have loud music blasted into their ears isn't it a right to breath clean air?

Personally I have asthma and allergies, so if I even pass through a smokers cloud my eyes start watering, throat locks-up, sinuses kick in, and I'll have a cough for days or even weeks just from a short exposure. So if it's the right of a smoker to smoke in public where's the line drawn between that and my right to enter a store or restaurant without breathing toxic air and getting sick? I have literally lost days of work because I was around smokers for an extended amount of time because I didn't want to speak up -- but not anymore now that I'm older.

I don't care if someone smokes in their house or car, I can choose not to enter those places. But if I'm going to the grocery store, the post office, work, or leaving a store with one entrance, I can't easily avoid someone being inconsiderate and smoking right outside the door. I have asked people to smoke elsewhere, and 100% of the time I've gotten rude replies. Per my prior comment if someone walked up to a Chili's or WalMart entrance with a jambox playing loud music wouldn't someone say something to them??? Why not do the same with a smoker? Our town has smoking and noise ordinances, so why is one enforceable and the other not?

I guess I'm just not sure why that line is hazy... The right to breath clean air is pretty clean cut to me, and unless someone creates a smokeless cigarette smoking should be left at home or in your car. Or in those little smoking tents or buildings that some businesses are starting to build.

Not to start an argument or flame, but if someone does smoke and disagrees with me... why so?

Sam

[madnessjack]

Now, I'm married to a woman who hates smoking. So, I know if I start, she's gonna beat the **** out of me. Thats another factor that keeps me from going back : )

Respect! In a similar boat atm... isn't easy at all.

[kaldor]

I see, so why do you think European brands are healthier?

Like I mentioned, apparently the fact there are less additives means that there are less dangerous chemicals. Roll-your-own cigs are also more common in Europe (according to Dutch people in the family) meaning that it's fresher and no chemicals added to allow longer shelf life. Think about it a bit too.. do cigarettes really smell like just burning plant matter to you? Marijuana smoke smells plantish, while tobacco smoke usually smells horrible and dirty. Cigars/some european brands these Dutch people smoked smelled less heavy and less crappy than what I commonly smell walking down the street around here.

My grandfather has smoked hand-rolled cigarettes since he was 15, and he's now 83 with absolutely no health problems and is still active and smokes 3-4 cigs a day. A bit abusive, but maybe there's a correlation?

Edit: About rights..

Of course it's their right to smoke, so let them. But it's very rude when smokers start to smoke around you without even asking if you mind, or walking down the street with a lit cigarette. In parts of Japan, it's considered very rude to walk while smoking due to the fact you're carrying a burning object through crowds and the possibility to burn people is higher.

[mhgsys]

Dutch smoker here;
Rolling your own cigarettes is really common here indeed ; we call it a shaggy.;(pronounced shekkie)

Btw; Am I suppose to feel bad after reading lot's of my fellow forumers are non smokers / drinkers?
(except @ELD)

Sure,I know it's bad for my health,.
(In fact.. it's really really bad.... and I really plan to stop doing that all before I've got kids...)

It's just that I enjoy life more; sitting here in the sun , drinking my whiskey, smoking my joint , ...rolling my "shekkies"

+: All the cars around me, and all the fabrics are producing toxic fumes, So if it's cancer I should worry about there a lot's of more factors triggering that.
Think of stress, toxic fumes of fabrics and cars, manipulated food, injected and grown with chemicals.
Not to even mention the bio-industry..(I'm a vegetarian ).. But even if your not.. consider the fact they grow these animals under bad conditions, (fear etc) and inject them with hormones.

To get back to the original post questioning about the fact european cigarettes are healthier ; I doubt it.. In my opinion all things that are unnatural are unhealthy..So yeah,.. I Guess it would be better to smoke pure marihuana then to mix it with shag/ tabacco..And best not to smoke anything at all.

[LowSky]

Anyone who smokes is knowingly killing themselves, except for this 2 year old boy whose parents need to be beaten:

http://www.bostonherald.com/news/regional/view/20100527butt-smoking_baby_draws_global_outrage/srvc=home&position=recent

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3YdVZNq99lg&feature=player_embedded

[ELD]

When you drink alcohol, you're hurting yourself. When you smoke, you're hurting yourself and the people around you. Its perfectly natural to shun a smoker, at least when he or she is smoking.

People are capable of moving away and smokers are capable of smoking away from others. If people don't want me smoking near them i gladly move away that is such a common and stupid response.

@mhgsys i'm with you there, rolling your own saves money and you can be sure they don't have all the additives packaged ones do. Not for the joint part though, i'm not a fan of that heh.

[madnessjack]

People are capable of moving away and smokers are capable of smoking away from others. If people don't want me smoking near them i gladly move away that is such a common and stupid response.

The assumption should be that people don't want smokers near them full stop.

Even before the smoking ban (living in England here), I made sure I kept well away from the nearest person when smoking in public. Smoking outside from a public place was common in England even before the smoking ban (except some nightclubs and pubs full of drunk kids).

[Little Bones]

I'm an occasional cigar smoker, and like it was mentioned moderation is the key for the majority of things. I'm also a health student so I definitely know the consequences. Regular smoking is absolutely horrible for you, and I will never do that. But a cigar every other month or so isn't going to kill anyone. It would be the same for drinking, if you get drunk more then 4 days a week you'll have a problem, but if you get drunk once and awhile you'll be fine.

[mhgsys]

Well @ELD;

I guess if we get a discussion about the risks or benefits of marihuana we could just open a new topic. . LOL.

Btw, I'm not so sure about "shag" doesn't have all the additives packaged cigarettes do....

12 mg tar can't be good for you.
and the 0,9 mg of nicotine seems very addictive.

(smoking for to long now..)

[DougieFresh4U]

Just to be clear: I am not mocking or hating anything in your post and I do not mean any ill harm :):)


Our town has smoking and noise ordinances, so why is one enforceable and the other not?


anywhere

Sam

We have smoking and noise ordinances here as well and most towns and cities do, but the noise ordinance is 'Town-wide', meaning anywhere within the town limits and when the smoking ordinance was put into effect (at least here where I live) it was drafted saying 'no smoking in restaurants' 'no smoking in the malls', etc. etc., what it did not have in the ordinance was, 'do not smoke in front of walmart', 'do not smoke in restaurant parking lot'
I do not care either way, as I am not bothered. I would hope that most people have better things to do than be the smoke and noise police

[forrestcupp]

My grandfather has smoked hand-rolled cigarettes since he was 15, and he's now 83 with absolutely no health problems and is still active and smokes 3-4 cigs a day. A bit abusive, but maybe there's a correlation?


I'm sure I could come up with a hundred examples of people who smoked at least a pack a day of regular, "unhealthy" cigarettes and they lived into their 80s. European and hand-rolled cigarettes are not any healthier than anything else.

[Velnias]

Seems you need some information about smoking:

Happy smokers (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lung_cancer#Small_cell_lung_carcinoma_.28SCLC.29)

...The occurrence of lung cancer in nonsmokers, who account for as many as 15% of cases...
...Across the developed world, almost 90% of lung cancer deaths are caused by smoking...
...In addition, there is evidence that lung cancer in never-smokers has a better prognosis than in smokers,[42] and that patients who smoke at the time of diagnosis have shorter survival times than those who have quit...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Cancerous_lung.jpg

[juancarlospaco]

It produce sexual problems, you will need Vi@Gr@ soon...

[JDShu]

People are capable of moving away and smokers are capable of smoking away from others. If people don't want me smoking near them i gladly move away that is such a common and stupid response.


No its a very common and non-stupid response. Don't blame the people who shun you when you smoke for doing so.

[marcottebj]

hmmmmmm... don't know. I'm pretty sure they all cause cancer, lung disease, emphysema, and have the potential to complicate pregnancy. I think we should all quit (myself included).

[Eisenwinter]

Two weeks ago I was in a trance party in some club.

Everywhere I looked, someone was holding a cigarette. It was disgusting, very much so.

Couldn't breath, and my eyes were burning, there was smoke all over the place.

I had to go outside every few minutes just to catch my breathe back and allow my eyes to relax.

As far as the party itself though, it was still awesome. One of the best parties I have ever been to.

[NCLI]

I hate smoke, and I hate smokers even more. Yes, that's right, I hate people who smoke. I can't stand it, it makes me feel sick, it makes it hard for me to breathe, and will make me leave a room and/or cross the street to the opposite sidewalk to get away from it.
Just like I wouldn't want to be in the same room as a running diesel engine, or walk behind a car, I won't be in the same room, or general area, as a person who smokes.

I can't wait for a total ban on smoking, at least then I can call the police when I see people smoking.

I'd like to see a total ban on alcohol as well, in line with other dangerous drugs and substances, but that's for another thread :)

And for the people who say "I know many people who have smoked all their life and are perfectly healthy," these people are a minority. By far most smokers don't live very long. Maybe the people who smoke and die at 85 could have lived to a 100 if they hadn't. Food for thought.

[marcottebj]

crazy

[chessnerd]

Personally, I try to keep away from all forms of drugs. I don't even like to take over-the-counter medication for colds or headaches. I'm very grateful that I chose a group of friends who don't participate in the consumption of tobacco and alcohol.

My life has not been completely sheltered, though. I have been offered tobacco before, in the form of cigarettes and pipe tobacco, but I always have turned it down.

I don't condemn smokers, or alcohol users, or over-the-counter medication users for that matter. All I ask is that they respect my choices and I will respect theirs. I do have a hard time tolerating the idea of second-hand smoke however, so excuse me if I take a wide path around those who smoke...

[ELD]

No its a very common and non-stupid response. Don't blame the people who shun you when you smoke for doing so.

I wasn't and no one ever has, i am considerate with these sorta of things.

It is a stupid response for the fact either party if they have half a brain or consideration for the other party they can move.

If i was sat outside a pub smoking and someone came to sit right next to my table knowing we was already there and then complained then quite frankly, their an idiot.

[kaldor]

*sigh* these D.A.R.E.-style responses really aren't needed. If people smoke, they know the consequences, no need to start saying it's a boring thread just because smoking is bad for you.

And yes, if you're sitting down in public and somebody sits down next to you and complains, it's not the smoker's fault. If the smoker sits down next to you and smokes, they're inconsiderate jerks. And why ban smoking? Maybe take Canada's approach; ban smoking in all public buildings including bars, and ban smoking in cars if there is anyone under age 18 present. What's wrong with smoking in your own home? It's your body, do what you want with it. It's not for the person next door to say what is right and not right for you!

I smoke from time to time, but I still find it rude when someone sits down near me and starts smoking. For all they know, I could have chronic bronchitus and get severely sick from the smoke yet they still are rude enough to smoke around you anyway. Demonizing smokers is another trend; governments and schools want you to see smoking as uncool so that you don't smoke. It's no different than when people used to make fun of you for _not_ smoking.

[98cwitr]

I quit 6 months ago, transferred my addiction to nicotine lozenges. When cigs went to $5 a pack...I knew it was now pointless to smoke



And for the people who say "I know many people who have smoked all their life and are perfectly healthy," these people are a minority. By far most smokers don't live very long. Maybe the people who smoke and die at 85 could have lived to a 100 if they hadn't. Food for thought.

Who the hell would want to live to a 100? sh*t, kill me before 85...please.

[germanix]

I do smoke, and yes I know that it is not healthy. I do not smoke in my house nor in my car and before i light a cigarette in public I move away so as not to disturb any non-smokers. There are mainly two reasons why I smoke:
1. My grandmother used to tell me that cigarettes are from the devil and should be burned. I took her by her word and i now burn them, a pack a day.
2. I do not drink, lie, steal, eat meat or cheat on my wife. I am scared that if I now also stop to smoke i will grow two wings on my back.

[98cwitr]

you don't eat meat?! WTF.

I'm going to quote House here and say "Everybody lies."

http://www4.obamiconme.pastemagazine.com/entries/1040765-everybody-lies.gif


I don't smoke, but if you want to smoke and I have a problem with it...then I should be the one to walk away. Stop being vagges....

[KiwiNZ]

any smoking is very bad period.

Those things should not be on the market , if it were a medicine or a car or some other product linked to so many deaths it would have been banned from sale , the suppliers sued to oblivion and probably jailed long ago.

To say Brand A cigarette is safer than Brand B is self delusional or the result of clever marketing.

Cigarettes and related products should be banned.

[98cwitr]

any smoking is very bad period.

Those things should not be on the market , if it were a medicine or a car or some other product linked to so many deaths it would have been banned from sale , the suppliers sued to oblivion and probably jailed long ago.

Cigarettes and related products should be banned.

"Well, the real demonstrated #1 killer in America is cholesterol. And here comes Senator Finistirre whose fine state is, I regret to say, clogging the nation's arteries with Vermont Cheddar Cheese. If we want to talk numbers, how about the millions of people dying of heart attacks? Perhaps Vermont Cheddar should come with a skull and crossbones."

-Thank You For Smoking

The only problem with your analogy is that those who smoke are fully aware of the consequences, and yet there is still a high demand for the product. Thus, simple economics shows us where there is demand, there will be a market to supply it. It is still legal because it does not inhibit the user to carry out day to day functions, and alcohol is still legal because we have been down the prohibition road once before and don't want to go down it again (here in the states).

[KiwiNZ]

"Well, the real demonstrated #1 killer in America is cholesterol. And here comes Senator Finistirre whose fine state is, I regret to say, clogging the nation's arteries with Vermont Cheddar Cheese. If we want to talk numbers, how about the millions of people dying of heart attacks? Perhaps Vermont Cheddar should come with a skull and crossbones."

-Thank You For Smoking

The only problem with your analogy is that those who smoke are fully aware of the consequences, and yet there is still a high demand for the product. Thus, simple economics shows us where there is demand, there will be a market to supply it. It is still legal because it does not inhibit the user to carry out day to day functions, and alcohol is still legal because we have been down the prohibition road once before and don't want to go down it again (here in the states).

Ever heard of addiction generated demand :rolleyes:

[Frogs Hair]

Smoking is banned in all pubs in my state , and it's nice to go watch live music and not have to throw your clothes / jacket in the wash because of few hours at a pub.

[wilee-nilee]

I wont argue against the evidence that smoking has harmful effects. But we live in a world polluted with PCBs' mercury and a whole host of other much more dangerous pollutants, that can't be seen tasted or realized when ingested. So focusing and maligning cigarettes seems like a waste of time, and a pop cultural point of view.

Tobacco is part of many cultures around the world as a part of rituals, especially the Native Americans.

Anything abused will have a negative effect generally. We also should be taking into account the additives in cigarettes, You can purchase additive free organically grown tobacco, and when used in moderation will have very little side effects unless you have a genetic predisposition.

[KiwiNZ]

Smoking is banned all in pubs in my state , and it's nice to go watch live music and not have to throw your clothes / jacket in the wash because of few hours at a pub.

It is banned in all public places like Pubs , Cafes , Malls any covered areas , Sports Stadiums , Public transport, Workplaces. You cannot smoke in the grounds of many hospitals here in New Zealand.

No smoking is allowed anywhere on my properties inside or out.

[98cwitr]

Ever heard of addiction generated demand :rolleyes:

yes? :popcorn:

[bigseb]

Honestly, I can't stand smoking. But I usually keep my opinions to myself.
lol

[new_tolinux]

whereas smoking cigarettes is still inhaling narcotics
I'm sorry, drugs can be some sort of narcotics.
Cigarettes (shag) are not supposed to contain narcotics as far as I know.

Yes, I'm a smoker. Yet for over 15 years and I like it.
I tried to quit long time ago, not so much because I wanted it, but because everyone was pushing me.
I was sick at home all week long, and then I decided it was not even my wish to quit, so the trouble wasn't worth it at all. I went to the shop, smoked a cigaret and a few minutes later I was fine again.

That was the first time and probably also the last one, except that I will probably stop smoking about the same time I stop breathing ;)

I know that it's said that it's a possible health issue, but around here many people who don't smoke die far before their 50's, where several smokers reach ages of 80-90.

If I'm supposed to stop everything that could kill you..... at first I should have to stop eating. But that will kill you too (and probably way faster than smoking does :P)

In my own house, I respect people with for example asthma or other breathing problems. No problem at all, I just smoke, only I go to another room to do it when they're visiting.
I don't do that for ex-smokers and other people without medical issues. If I'm at their house, I smoke outside, because I respect it's their house and they don't smoke, but if they visit me, they know that I smoke. If someone doesn't like that, he/she knows the way out. If not, I'm even willing to tell them :P

I always try not to bother anyone with my smoke by not blowing it to where they are. But I do smoke and I enjoy every minute of it.

I would like it either when all those non-smokers weren't trying to take that little pleasure from me. Just have a look at your own not-so-nice habits before you're pointing your finger at a smoker. As soon as you're really 100% perfect you can start telling others what their doing wrong in your eyes. Before that, mind your own business.

[Legendary_Bibo]

I'm a cross country/long distance/marathon runner/body builder for life. I will never touch anything like cigarettes ever. Alcohol is fine if it's a small glass of whatever to help relax, or sometimes something stronger for my insomnia, but it's never to get drunk. Besides I grew up with a smoking addicted mother and sister all my life who couldn't go five minutes without lighting up a cig. Also you'd think that having health problems as a baby because your mom smoked during pregnancy would get it her to quit, but smokers have quite an odd mindset. :confused:

[MC_Sketch]

i live in Vermont and i've been smoking cigarettes since i was 13, and i dont regret it at all. there's nothing like a nice Camel Filter to chill you out after a fresh tattoo, or really for any reason at all lol

[Frogs Hair]

It is banned in all public places like Pubs , Cafes , Malls any covered areas , Sports Stadiums , Public transport, Workplaces. You cannot smoke in the grounds of many hospitals here in New Zealand.

No smoking is allowed anywhere on my properties inside or out.

Our ban includes more than pubs , but that part of the ban was put to referendum twice because pub owners thought they would lose money and that has been proven fulse.

[MCVenom]

i live in Vermont and i've been smoking cigarettes since i was 13, and i dont regret it at all. there's nothing like a nice Camel Filter to chill you out after a fresh tattoo, or really for any reason at all lol
I really hope you're kidding. :lolflag:

[wilee-nilee]

I'm a cross country/long distance/marathon runner/body builder for life. I will never touch anything like cigarettes ever. Alcohol is fine if it's a small glass of whatever to help relax, or sometimes something stronger for my insomnia, but it's never to get drunk. Besides I grew up with a smoking addicted mother and sister all my life who couldn't go five minutes without lighting up a cig. Also you'd think that having health problems as a baby because your mom smoked during pregnancy would get it her to quit, but smokers have quite an odd mindset. :confused:

Body builder, kind of a pot calling the kettle black eh. ;)

[samalex]

Just to be clear: I am not mocking or hating anything in your post and I do not mean any ill harm :):)

We have smoking and noise ordinances here as well and most towns and cities do, but the noise ordinance is 'Town-wide', meaning anywhere within the town limits and when the smoking ordinance was put into effect (at least here where I live) it was drafted saying 'no smoking in restaurants' 'no smoking in the malls', etc. etc., what it did not have in the ordinance was, 'do not smoke in front of walmart', 'do not smoke in restaurant parking lot'
I do not care either way, as I am not bothered. I would hope that most people have better things to do than be the smoke and noise police

Here's the exact ordinance linked from our city website (http://library7.municode.com/default-test/home.htm?infobase=11666&doc_action=whatsnew) regarding outdoor smoking, which properly so is listed under the NUISANCES chapter:


Sec. 16-121. Smoking prohibited in certain public areas.
A person commits an offense in violation of this article if he/she smokes or possesses a burning tobacco, weed or other plant product in any of the following indoor and/or enclosed areas:
(1) Public or private preschools, primary or secondary schools, public or private colleges or universities, child-care facilities; or
(2) Elevators, museums, libraries, galleries, public transportation facilities open to the public and service lines of establishments doing business with the general public; or
(3) City buildings or any portion thereof owned or leased by the city and used for city purposes; or
(4) Any building which is used for or designated for the purpose of exhibiting any motion picture, stage drama, lecture, musical recital, athletic event or any other event whenever open to the public, including all restrooms and any area commonly referred to as a lobby; however, smoking, which is a part of a stage performance, is permitted; or
(5) Any retail or service establishment serving the general public, including but not limited to, any food products establishment, department store, restaurant, grocery store, private club, bingo parlor, bowling center, drug store, shopping mall, hair styling salons, including service lines; or
(6) All restrooms open for public use; or
(7) All areas in a Laundromat open to and available to use by the public; or
(8 ) Within all areas available to and customarily used by the general public in all businesses and nonprofit entities patronized by the public, including, but not limited to, commercial, financial and professional offices, including banks, hotels and motels; or
(9) Within 20 linear feet of any entrance of any establishment or facility where smoking is prohibited except outdoor patio areas where food or alcoholic beverages are served; or
(10) In any public area of a health care facility or hospital, including, but not limited to, clinics, physical therapy facilities, doctor's offices, nursing and convalescent homes, residential treatment centers/homes and dentist's offices except in bed space areas of health facilities if all patients within the room are smokers and such smoking is ordered on the health care facility's admission form by an attending physician, in keeping with the guidelines established by the facility; or
(11) Any establishment or facility, or any portion thereof, that has been designated as nonsmoking by the owner, operator, manager or other person who controls any establishment or facility.
(Ord. No. 2002-0320, § 2, 6-4-02; Ord. No. 2009-651, § 1, 11-17-09)


Most of this says in areas used by general public, but (9) specifically says within 20 linear feet of any entrance. So yes, this would cover smoking in front of a WalMart entrance.

And I'm not saying there needs to be noise or smoking police, but people who do smoke often think it's their right to do so anyplace and that it doesn't affect anyone but them. I know the health problems that come with smoking, drinking, etc, and honesty I don't care what people do in the privacy of their own home. More power to them I say. It's when smoking and drinking affect others outside of their home that I have concerns.

Sam

[Legendary_Bibo]

Body builder, kind of a pot calling the kettle black eh. ;)

Not steroids if that's what you're implying. I guess I should've said weight lifter eh?

[samalex]

*sigh* these D.A.R.E.-style responses really aren't needed. If people smoke, they know the consequences, no need to start saying it's a boring thread just because smoking is bad for you.

And yes, if you're sitting down in public and somebody sits down next to you and complains, it's not the smoker's fault. If the smoker sits down next to you and smokes, they're inconsiderate jerks. And why ban smoking? Maybe take Canada's approach; ban smoking in all public buildings including bars, and ban smoking in cars if there is anyone under age 18 present. What's wrong with smoking in your own home? It's your body, do what you want with it. It's not for the person next door to say what is right and not right for you!


Canada banned smoking in cars with people under 18? Honestly I think that's a great idea. Nothing burns me more than walking into a restaurant with kids and even babies sitting in the smoking section. In our community restaurants can have smoking sections, but they have to be either a completely different building or there must be a wall with separate ventilation systems between the smoking and non-smoking sections. But still walking by the smoking sections, most of which have huge clouds of smoke bellowing around, and seeing kids in there with ignorant parents really makes me mad.

Again, I don't care what someone does to their own bodies, but especially for kids who can't defend themselves or don't know any better, they shouldn't be exposed to this. Society protects their bodies with safety seats, so why not their lungs by not allowing smokers to be around kids?

Sam

[McRat]

"Any wuss can stop smoking, it takes a Man to face cancer" - John Wayne RIP.

[Lightstar]

I would gain nothing from smoking.
So I do not smoke.

[wilee-nilee]

Not steroids if that's what you're implying. I guess I should've said weight lifter eh?

No I wasn't implying that just trying to nicely point out the dichotomy of obsession, whether it be a addiction to a harmful substance, or a social norm. Just giving you a lighthearted nudge. ;)

This thread is full of good and evil concrete-isms, that are based on personal opinions that have very little real world values, or any understanding of the nature of addictions. Or the exposure to other substances that are part of out polluted world. Most people reason with dichotomies, including myself, it is a natural state, but once realized that this occurs it is helpful to know its limitations.

I am a smoker and I am sure to ask anybody who is near, even if in a allotted smoking area if they are okay, and I am willing to move if it does bother them. As one person suggested only a whiff of the smoke causes problems for them. I don't like second hand smoke myself either, and do my best to not expose others to it. This demonetization of the smoker is a response really to the companies that produce it, and have been found to be lying under oath before the government, a misplaced anger and opinion set at the least.

[yester64]

I've been been struggling with quit attempts for a year. The longest I went was 6 months w/o. Cigarettes are the devil Bobby.

Smoking is an addiction. Most people can not just quit because they want to.
If it was easy, no one would smoke.
Some people however having it easier to quit then others.
Smoking is like any other addiction.

I smoke for 25 years now, but i never chainsmoked and usually are more controlled to an extend. I wished i never started it, but its to late for that.
So i envy anyone who never smoked in his life. You don't know how lucky you are.

btw. who is bobby?

p.s. its just a general quote and to your respond really.

[Legendary_Bibo]

No I wasn't implying that just trying to nicely point out the dichotomy of obsession, whether it be a addiction to a harmful substance, or a social norm. Just giving you a lighthearted nudge. ;)

This thread is full of good and evil concrete-isms, that are based on personal opinions that have very little real world values, or any understanding of the nature of addictions. Or the exposure to other substances that are part of out polluted world. Most people reason with dichotomies, including myself, it is a natural state, but once realized that this occurs it is helpful to know its limitations.

I am a smoker and I am sure to ask anybody who is near, even if in a allotted smoking area if they are okay, and I am willing to move if it does bother them. As one person suggested only a whiff of the smoke causes problems for them. I don't like second hand smoke myself either, and do my best to not expose others to it. This demonetization of the smoker is a response really to the companies that produce it, and have been found to be lying under oath before the government, a misplaced anger and opinion set at the least.

Life is boring without addictions. I remember going a month not doing anything I was addicted to or finding new addictions. Whether they're good or bad addictions, in the end without them, you're left in a worse mental state. I find boredom is unhealthy, and smokers just probably didn't find something better to be addicted to first.

Slightly off topic, but who thinks is a worse addiction.

People addicted to Farmville/gambling, or people addicted to smoking?

[wilee-nilee]

Life is boring without addictions. I remember going a month not doing anything I was addicted to or finding new addictions. Whether they're good or bad addictions, in the end without them, you're left in a worse mental state. I find boredom is unhealthy, and smokers just probably didn't find something better to be addicted to first.

Slightly off topic, but who thinks is a worse addiction.

People addicted to Farmville/gambling, or people addicted to smoking?

Any addiction that effects you in a negative way, or those that interact with you may be a problem, but this negative effect must have a base of actual truth not a pop cultural perspective. Don't be a lemming and follow the crowd as they may be misinformed. Many things in the history of the world at large were accepted social norms, but now are considered to be wrong, through a more robust understanding of the human condition. Black and white are the colors at each end of the spectrum there are many in between, over 30,000.

[schtufbox]

I smoked from the age of 15 up until I was 33, in September 2008.
I used to enjoy smoking when I was younger, but as I got older I began to notice how it was affecting my health more..but I just couldn't manage to quit.

It was the birth of my 3rd son in 2006 that finally prompted me to quit, but it still took me a few attempts, finally in 2008 I managed it, it was so easy that time..I guess I had finally just 'had enough'.

Might have helped that I took up motorbiking, and the money I used to spend on smokes now pays for biking!

[sjelliott]

I smoked for longer than most of you have been alive. I tried to quit several times, but never managed to stop completely. Finally I tried an electronic cigarette. I am now an non-smoker. I no longer subject those around me to second hand smoke. No, I'm not nicotine free but I get less nicotine than I would get with a patch or gum. Any comments?

[JDShu]

I have to wonder. For those people who say they smoke and are fully aware of the consequences. When the time comes that they are diagnosed with lung cancer, or whatever, will they think back to when they started smoking and think "I was aware of the consequences. I have no regrets".

[smellyman]

everybody should not smoke and your lungs will be fine!

http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2008/08/25/gerkin460x276.jpg
http://bbs.chinadaily.com.cn/attachments/month_0905/Air-pollution-in-London--001_02BOttv8LMP0.jpg

[wilee-nilee]

I have to wonder. For those people who say they smoke and are fully aware of the consequences. When the time comes that they are diagnosed with lung cancer, or whatever, will they think back to when they started smoking and think "I was aware of the consequences. I have no regrets".

Is this the there are no atheist in foxholes argument.

Personally I have been at deaths door on two occasions, I should not be alive anyway. I have no belief system so my death is no big deal to me, don't get me wrong it may be a tragedy to others, but when you have survived death already you look at life a little differently.
I would just clarify that my near death experiences involved a head injury on a motorcycle that required brain surgery and had a 25% survival rate, if any at all. The second was a head on collision that had me pinned in the car with it on fire, and unconscious, with injuries that needed multiple surgeries and about a 3 month recovery. A cigarette seems like death lite to me.

Also remember that your perceptions are yours alone and do not represent anybody else even if you think so.

[KiwiNZ]

@ smellyman , I think they all should give up

[wilee-nilee]

@ smellyman , I think they all should give up

Welcome to the real world do you recognize it. ;)

[KiwiNZ]

Welcome to the real world do you recognize it. ;)

I have probably seen more of it than you my friend ;-)

[JDShu]

Is this the there are no atheist in foxholes argument.

Personally I have been at deaths door on two occasions, I should not be alive anyway. I have no belief system so my death is no big deal to me, don't get me wrong it may be a tragedy to others, but when you have survived death already you look at life a little differently.
I would just clarify that my near death experiences involved a head injury on a motorcycle that required brain surgery and had a 25% survival rate, if any at all. The second was a head on collision that had me pinned in the car with it on fire, and unconscious, with injuries that needed multiple surgeries and about a 3 month recovery. A cigarette seems like death lite to me.

Also remember that your perceptions are yours alone and do not represent anybody else even if you think so.

My point was that if it is indeed true that a smoker with lung cancer could look back and have no regrets, it would imply full rationality and in that case more power to them. If not, then they're not being rational and not truly aware of the consequences.

[McRat]

Full body condom, 50hp electric car that goes 35mph, organic soybean burgers, SPF-50 coating every morning, a legal assistant following you everywhere, get a physical every day, no guns or any sharp objects, champagne with no fizz (deadly corks), etc.


And you'll still die.


The object to life is not to get out of it alive. You won't.

If you live life, it will always be dangerous. If you spectate, it's much safer. But few people regret things they DID on their deathbed, they regret the things they didn't do. Go figure.

That being said, I'd rather live as a lion for a day than a sheep for a lifetime.

[golanbatrac]

The one good argument I can think of in favor of smoking is that smokers tell better stories. There's nothing worse than sitting around the lunch table with a bunch of boring non-smokers. I want to hear tales of debauchery and fornication during my lunch hour, and the smokers are the only ones who seem to care enough to lead a life that revolves around themselves.

[JDShu]

Cancer and other smoke related symptoms is more suffering than just the death at the end.

[KiwiNZ]

And there is the affect on those around the smoker
Damage to assets
Cost to community eg medical cost
The mess

[wilee-nilee]

I have probably seen more of it than you my friend ;-)

Can I imagine that in the Darth Vader voice, it has much more resonance.

Addictions are a drag on the person with it, friends and family, and society in general, but this is the real human condition.

I know several people with lifetime opiate addictions, over 25 years. They are functional contributing members of society, it would probably kill them to stop the treatment they get with methadone.

[kaldor]

Full body condom, 50hp electric car that goes 35mph, organic soybean burgers, SPF-50 coating every morning, a legal assistant following you everywhere, get a physical every day, no guns or any sharp objects, champagne with no fizz (deadly corks), etc.


And you'll still die.


The object to life is not to get out of it alive. You won't.

If you live life, it will always be dangerous. If you spectate, it's much safer. But few people regret things they DID on their deathbed, they regret the things they didn't do. Go figure.

That being said, I'd rather live as a lion for a day than a sheep for a lifetime.

Soy is said to cause cancer!

[xaegis]

Smoking... Meh... I just don't see the point in doing crappy drugs. Go big or go home, but don't waste your time.

[lisati]

I've been a smoker for nearly 30 years. Reading through this thread has served to remind me that it might be time for both of us here in the Lisati household to renew our efforts to stop.

It's expensive ($NZ10 or more for a pack of 20), smelly, hard on the body.......

[Timmer1240]

I used to smoke Pot Big time now I cant handle the stuff makes me paranoid to the max!Now I just smoke 5 or 6 cigs a day I know its bad and plan to quit!Seems like every thing is bad for you now days Im not a heavy smoker but it still bothers me to think about it .Gonna have to qiut soon!46 now wanna at least get another 20 30 years but who knows!

[Legendary_Bibo]

If you quit smoking then you save so much more money so you can do more interesting things in life. Lets say you used that money to go on adventures, or fun wild adventures, you probably won't regret your life when you die (See Big Fish, you'll get what I mean). If you thought that your money was better invested in cigarettes to kill yourself faster, make those around you uncomfortable, and damage your health to where you feel like **** on a daily basis then I have to ask if you're actually satisfied with life, or are you just satisfying the addiction.

Oh and I'm not addicted to maintaining my health, I'm just out to prove to myself that I can keep going and shouldn't give up. I'm 19, but have hips, knees, joints (dislocated shoulder, bad elbows, wrists, and neck) and a back like a 60 year old man from being hit by a car when I was 15, it hurts like hell to run and walk. Hell I still remember having to get a physical at the doctors a week before my the marathon I ran and he told me it was time to call it quits, but I told him the human spirit is a damn curious thing. He signed off on my physical and off I went. It messed me up more, but I'm still going.

My point is that you shouldn't waste your life on something as idiotic as a cigarette. I get it as a culture thing, and a relaxation method (personally I like the smell of cigars when they're not lit). Unfortunately my fellow Americans don't understand the concept of moderation. If you can go a week without a cigarette, then you are addicted and need to call it quits before it hurts others around you. Be addicted to something that doesn't hurt anybody, they're called hobbies. Start, or plan and save for an adventure. If you can spend all that money on cigarettes then you can surely save for an expensive trip out of the country, across the European/American/Oriental countryside. My dream trip is to fly out to China and make a run across the Great Wall of China (or at least the parts that are open to the public :) ).

[yester64]

I used to smoke Pot Big time now I cant handle the stuff makes me paranoid to the max!Now I just smoke 5 or 6 cigs a day I know its bad and plan to quit!Seems like every thing is bad for you now days Im not a heavy smoker but it still bothers me to think about it .Gonna have to qiut soon!46 now wanna at least get another 20 30 years but who knows!

Pot doesn't cause cancer. So you are good. :)

Cigs are different. I actually enjoy smoking.
My favorite is having a coffee a smoke and reading a newspaper. I do that outside, since its almost always sunny in SoCal.
One of these habits.
But i do not smoke inside anywhere. Not in the car or room. So it limits me somewhat.

[yester64]

If you quit smoking then you save so much more money so you can do more interesting things in life. Lets say you used that money to go on adventures, or fun wild adventures, you probably won't regret your life when you die (See Big Fish, you'll get what I mean). If you thought that your money was better invested in cigarettes to kill yourself faster, make those around you uncomfortable, and damage your health to where you feel like **** on a daily basis then I have to ask if you're actually satisfied with life, or are you just satisfying the addiction.

Oh and I'm not addicted to maintaining my health, I'm just out to prove to myself that I can keep going and shouldn't give up. I'm 19, but have hips, knees, joints (dislocated shoulder, bad elbows, wrists, and neck) and a back like a 60 year old man from being hit by a car when I was 15, it hurts like hell to run and walk. Hell I still remember having to get a physical at the doctors a week before my the marathon I ran and he told me it was time to call it quits, but I told him the human spirit is a damn curious thing. He signed off on my physical and off I went. It messed me up more, but I'm still going.

My point is that you shouldn't waste your life on something as idiotic as a cigarette. I get it as a culture thing, and a relaxation method (personally I like the smell of cigars when they're not lit). Unfortunately my fellow Americans don't understand the concept of moderation. If you can go a week without a cigarette, then you are addicted and need to call it quits before it hurts others around you. Be addicted to something that doesn't hurt anybody, they're called hobbies. Start, or plan and save for an adventure. If you can spend all that money on cigarettes then you can surely save for an expensive trip out of the country, across the European/American/Oriental countryside. My dream trip is to fly out to China and make a run across the Great Wall of China (or at least the parts that are open to the public :) ).

Its called addiction for a reason. If it were easy to just quit because its bad, then everyone would just quit.
Not for no reason are there patches and all. Problem is, its hard to rewire your brain and body.
Yes, there are the urges and they can be ignored if you are strong. It might be easier to quit on an island than in a city where you see other people smoking.
I am not saying that you can't quit, its just not that simple.

If you never smoked, i think that is great and you should never even try to smoke.
But i like to point out, that there are also other addiction like food. There is a reason why so many people have big bellies and don't eat healthy.
Addiction as a whole is a problem but it is not easy won. Not at least in saying, its bad.

[lisati]

It's not just addiction but habit as well. If used properly, the lozenges and gum go some way to helping with both. I've tried both, as well as the patches, but didn't really notice any difference with the patches.

[yester64]

Tried the patches. Did not work for me.
Was the other thing a medication? I might try that next time.

I heard in the radio last time, that you can do also hypnosis. Sounds kinda great. Did someone tried it?

[roll out shelves Miami]

No matter where the cigarette comes from, it will still boil down to one thing, It is Dangerous to ones health. Lucky for you you are not addicted to nicotine just yet, or you may be just saying thatwithout you knowing you are hooked already. causally you may not develop any symptoms just yet but eventually you will.

[Legendary_Bibo]

Tried the patches. Did not work for me.
Was the other thing a medication? I might try that next time.

I heard in the radio last time, that you can do also hypnosis. Sounds kinda great. Did someone tried it?

You should look up something called Chantrix (I think that's the spelling). It's a prescription medication that helps people quit smoking, but there is one thing about it. IT WILL ONLY MEET YOU HALFWAY. My sister and mom did it, and they expected it to stop their smoking magically. They've been doing it for over a month and still smoke just as much because they have very weak will power. It does work, but you have to understand that you have to try to quit.

[wilee-nilee]

http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/abstract/278/5335/45
http://www.informaworld.com/smpp/content~content=a713688119&db=all
http://www.nature.com/nrn/journal/v5/n12/abs/nrn1539.html

Addiction has about a 90% recidivism rate on the average all across the board. here are a couple of links that the abstract give kind of a glimpse of the factors involved. Myself I am a college student a middle aged one, and I have access to the full documents, and the full worldwide databases of everything offered in the college library. If any of you have this same sort of access you might want to look up studies on addiction you may find that your opinions on cures and ease of travel are flawed. These links are from Google scholar.

[ssj6akshat]

I can understand liquor because its..um..liquid, but Smoking?What is the point of inhaling smoke that burns your lungs :confused:

[sxmaxchine]

I wont start smoking for 3 reasons.
1. The price of them seems to go up every year (currently about $20 a pack in Australia)
2. Bad for your health
3. Im not old enough to smoke

[sxmaxchine]

I can understand liquor because its..um..liquid, but Smoking?What is the point of inhaling smoke that burns your lungs :confused:

alcohol is like acid in a way it still burns you.

[alket]

I smoke since I was 14 now I'm 20, it's very difficult to quit something that you grow up with. I started smoking because of one girl, she used to smoke and I wanted to get in touch with her, she quit, I'm cursed with nicotine, I hate smoking I really hate but when I don't smoke for a while I get mad and do bad things, I tried quiting it several times and I have fights with my friends and family. So if you don't smoke , please never ever consider starting it, neither for fun , because at first you do for fun, than becomes problem, then financial problem, health problem , stink problem etc. You can't even stay at bus longer than 3h or classes.

So don't start it, we have many problems in life, why would we add one that makes our problems even bigger.

[Linye]

Smoke weed a lot. Never tried a cigarette. Don't mind people who do it.

[Jose Catre-Vandis]

I am surprised no-one has thrown in the electronic cigarette as an alternative to "public" smoking. "Vapers", as they are known, emit no smoke and no smell, but give the smoker the same "hit" and fulfil their addiction, and they are legal in all public places (afaik). Cheaper than the really thing, cleaner, no mess, no accelerated lung cancer. I am not selling this, just offering an alternative to smokers.

Here's a link (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electronic_cigarette)

As a long time smoker, I have quit several times, tried the patches, gum, hypnosis, Allen Carr, e-ciggie, but enjoy it too much! There are two sides to the addiction in my opinion - the drug which seems to take only a few days to a couple of weeks to clear out of your system, to the habit and rituals which I have found much harder to break. I agree with much that has been said on the thread, it does limit your ability to socialise, have a normal family life, restrict where you go and what you do, if you allow it to. Moderation is the key and if you must smoke - set yourself rules to live by - not in the house, not in the car, not in front of the children (don't teach them your bad ways) - my eldest (16) didn't know I smoked until she was 14, not in public ( I tend to be a private smoker - in fact most people I know don't know I smoke). Before long your own rules have stopped you smoking! Best of all find something else to do :)

[kpholmes]

Smoke weed a lot. Never tried a cigarette. Don't mind people who do it.

thats HORRIBLE!!! do you know how many people have died from smoking too much pot!?! haha:popcorn:

[smellyman]

I wont start smoking for 3 reasons.
1. The price of them seems to go up every year (currently about $20 a pack in Australia)
2. Bad for your health
3. Im not old enough to smoke

I remember when I was young........

[sjelliott]

If you smoking cigarettes, Quit, and Quit now. If you have tried to quit, and can't, or you would just like an an alternative to cigarettes with no second or third hand smoke, no tobacco oder or smoker's breath, try an electronic cigarette.Most electronic cigarette companies do not sell to minors and discourage anyone who has never smoked to buy their products. These are not marketed as an aid to quitting smoking ( at least by any reputable dealer), but many people report being able to quit or reduce their cigarette habit using them. If you are considering it, do your research, many forums exist and are very helpful. Nicotine is addictive, but then so are caffeine, alcohol and many other substances we put in our bodies daily. Most electronic cigarettes also have a no nicotine option. Do I sound like a commercial? Maybe, I don't care. I don't drink alcohol, limit my fat and salt and don't eat meat. I "vape" (use an electronic cigarette) and drink coffee. Have to have a few vices.

[ELD]

Smoke weed a lot. Never tried a cigarette. Don't mind people who do it.

If you use bacci in your joints or bongs then it's no different ;)

[new_tolinux]

If you smoking cigarettes, Quit, and Quit now. ........
As I said before:

I would like it either when all those non-smokers weren't trying to take that little pleasure from me. Just have a look at your own not-so-nice habits before you're pointing your finger at a smoker. As soon as you're really 100% perfect you can start telling others what their doing wrong in your eyes. Before that, mind your own business.

[ELD]

As I said before:

Perfectly said my friend! Couldn't have put it better!

[sjelliott]

Just offering some alternatives to those who want to continue to use nicotine for what ever reason. I don't have any smoking related health problems and swore I would never give it up, it was my right.I enjoyed smoking. What finally changed my mind was not the health issues or the smoking bans, it was when I saw how much of my money was being paid for taxes and not for the cigarettes. Just giving my money to the government so that they can tell me what a bad person I am just seemed wrong.

[golanbatrac]

A word of advice to non-smokers:

No matter your intentions, offering advice on how to quit or offering evidence of the dangers of smoking does nothing to help a smoker break the habit. Quite the opposite. Every time you open your mouth or roll your eyes, a smoker digs his heels in a little further.

If you want to help someone out, the best thing you can do is shut up about it. There's nothing you can say that a smoker doesn't already know.

Advice from former addicts is always welcome though.

[ibuclaw]

I have a friend who quite literally can't quit, else it causes more physical damage and pain to his system, in a twist of irony.

I have never seen him cough blood, until the time when he spent 4 weeks without one. He has been happily smoking ever since...

[odiseo77]

I smoked for more than ten years and used to smoke two packs a day before quitting, about 2 and a half years ago. I know there are many many ways people use to quit, but my advice to smokers who want to quit is, be aware that it will be hard at the begining but you will feel better later, after some time (believe me)... and don't get discouraged if you have little relapses at the begining.

Greetings!

[kaldor]

Apparently eating ginger helps for the nausea.

[rainbowagent7]

Hi all. I've been a smoker for 22 years and I can honestly say I am as healthy as any non-smoker. I can hike mountains all day long, jog 5 miles without getting winded, and do any amount of physical labor (actually I'm a house leveler) that anyone who doesn't smoke can. My blood pressure, heart rate, lungs, and everything else health related is perfect. I probably couldn't say that if I was still smoking the disgusting mass produced, chemical laden cigarettes that 99% of the population smokes (the smoking population that is). I switched to American Spirit organic tobacco about 10 years ago and have never been happier.
It's really disturbing once you find out what is added to cigarettes to keep people hooked. I heard (and it's just a rumor so far) that gunpowder is added to the concentric rings that are around cigarette papers to make them burn faster and so they won't go out when you set them down (marketing techniques). Not only that, but I have a piece of paper front and back (small type) that lists hundreds of known chemicals that are added to tobacco including arsenic and many, many others. The only thing added to my tobacco is soil, sunlight, water and carbon dioxide (in the air). It smells really good and I have many non-smoker friends and family who think the same as well.
I guess having knowledge of what they add to our products helps us understand what we're doing to ourselves, that and the desire to seek purity in all we do. There is nothing wrong with smoking, but if you do smoke then you have to do things to counter the effects. But smoking is not the only thing in this world that causes major health issues, if people had any clue of the plethora of garbage that others will sell just to make a buck and how they harm us, I bet you'd soil yourselves.
Anyway, sorry for the novel, but as you can tell I've got a lot to say on the subject. Simply put, the major brand, mass produced, chemical pesticide and fertilizer ridden, fast burning, make our government hundreds of billions, keep you hooked with additives, etc... "coffin nails" will more than likely cause major health problems. When I smoked them I could go through 2 packs in a day without any real satisfaction. Now I only want like 3 cigarettes a day because real tobacco burns forever and it tastes really good. If you want your health then you have to go organic!!! I can't stress that enough. Like I said before, I'm as healthy as any non-smoker and I can and will prove it!

[McRat]

Well, when they get rid of tobacco, they will go back to getting rid of alcohol.

Should they succeed at that point, #1 public enemy will the automobile. It already is if you are 16-25.

As far as quitting smoking goes:

Zyban can fuzz your thoughts, if it doesn't, it's reduces the urge.

Don't drink when you're into the your first 90 days. Alcohol and tobacco are best buddies.

Chant'x is $$$, and can give you "vivid dreams". If it's a nightmare, be prepared for an adventure you'll remember for awhile.

Best way IMO:

Make a list of 20 things you want to get done. Put it on the fridge. Have a last smoke, chuck all your matches/lighters/cigarettes.

When you get up that next morning, grab that list and hold it with both hands when you aren't actually working on the tasks. Avoid caffeine at first. STAY BUSY all the time. Cold turkey, not even 1 puff, try to avoid smokers for the first week.

You will get mean, so always write down what you want to say before saying it. Or take up talking to yourself out loud.

Second best way?

Most prisons now ban smoking ...

[Velnias]

A word of advice to non-smokers:
...There's nothing you can say that a smoker doesn't already know.


Wrong. 99.9% of smokers only THINK they know something about it.
I wish all smokers should spend a few days with terminally ill smokers...

[NCLI]

I quit 6 months ago, transferred my addiction to nicotine lozenges. When cigs went to $5 a pack...I knew it was now pointless to smoke



Who the hell would want to live to a 100? sh*t, kill me before 85...please.

People who are ~20-35 now will be nothing like the people who are 80 now when they turn 80. We live longer, and better, than the past generations. Remember that when you say things like this ;)

Hi all. I've been a smoker for 22 years and I can honestly say I am as healthy as any non-smoker. I can hike mountains all day long, jog 5 miles without getting winded, and do any amount of physical labor (actually I'm a house leveler) that anyone who doesn't smoke can. My blood pressure, heart rate, lungs, and everything else health related is perfect. I probably couldn't say that if I was still smoking the disgusting mass produced, chemical laden cigarettes that 99% of the population smokes (the smoking population that is). I switched to American Spirit organic tobacco about 10 years ago and have never been happier.
It's really disturbing once you find out what is added to cigarettes to keep people hooked. I heard (and it's just a rumor so far) that gunpowder is added to the concentric rings that are around cigarette papers to make them burn faster and so they won't go out when you set them down (marketing techniques). Not only that, but I have a piece of paper front and back (small type) that lists hundreds of known chemicals that are added to tobacco including arsenic and many, many others. The only thing added to my tobacco is soil, sunlight, water and carbon dioxide (in the air). It smells really good and I have many non-smoker friends and family who think the same as well.
I guess having knowledge of what they add to our products helps us understand what we're doing to ourselves, that and the desire to seek purity in all we do. There is nothing wrong with smoking, but if you do smoke then you have to do things to counter the effects. But smoking is not the only thing in this world that causes major health issues, if people had any clue of the plethora of garbage that others will sell just to make a buck and how they harm us, I bet you'd soil yourselves.
Anyway, sorry for the novel, but as you can tell I've got a lot to say on the subject. Simply put, the major brand, mass produced, chemical pesticide and fertilizer ridden, fast burning, make our government hundreds of billions, keep you hooked with additives, etc... "coffin nails" will more than likely cause major health problems. When I smoked them I could go through 2 packs in a day without any real satisfaction. Now I only want like 3 cigarettes a day because real tobacco burns forever and it tastes really good. If you want your health then you have to go organic!!! I can't stress that enough. Like I said before, I'm as healthy as any non-smoker and I can and will prove it!
Just because you don't feel it now doesn't mean that you won't in the future. Organic tobacco is no more healthy than ordinary tobacco, that's just nonsense.

[McRat]

Wrong. 99.9% of smokers only THINK they know something about it.
I wish all smokers should spend a few days with terminally ill smokers...

Hmm... What do you THINK you know about it? Show us how average life expectancy has climbed as smoking has declined, but also how the average life expectancy went up as smoking increased in 1940's. Seems the two aren't closely tied together. The "every year you smoke takes 2 years off your life" crap that was fed to everyone in 1970's was a complete fabrication.

I'm not saying smoking is no risk. I'm saying there is a lot of deliberate lying about it, mostly to raise taxes. People are pretty stupid in general and will believe anything if you wrap it well.

Let's put it this way, Japan has twice the ratio of smokers as most other developed countries, and has a solidly higher life expectancy. Until recently Japan had more smokers than non-smokers. It's about 50% for men in Japan today.

So yes, smoking is a risky behavior. Is the risk accurately protrayed by the Liberals factions? No, they exaggerate the heck out of the data.

And yes, I watched my grandmother die of lung cancer at 70. But she never smoked, nor did her husband or children.

[sjelliott]

Does anybody have an opinion on electronic cigarettes?

[golanbatrac]

Wrong. 99.9% of smokers only THINK they know something about it.
I wish all smokers should spend a few days with terminally ill smokers...

I've had two grandparents die from smoking (one from Lung Cancer and one from Emphysema). I've seen it up close and personal (and I'd dare say that most people have seen it up close and personal given how many people die of smoking related diseases each year). Seeing someone die of emphysema doesn't change the nature of the addiction. Often times it intensifies the addiction. You see, that's the thing about addictions (whether it be to food or cigarettes or alcohol or heroin) -- an addict acts against his own best interests, often with full knowledge of the consequences.

[McRat]

Here's a great question:

When smoking is actually outlawed, or dropped to negligible levels, where is are those billions of tax dollars that are lost going to come from?

Are they going to be able to ID "ex-smokers" and just raise their taxes? Not yet they can't.

If 25% smoke a pack a day, and the taxes are $4 a pack, that's $365 a year tax increase for the non-smokers when they outlaw it.

Health care costs increase because of new technology combined with longer life expectancy. The new technology won't go away, but if the anti-smokers are indeed right, the increase in health care costs will climb sharply as well. Luckily, their numbers are wild exaggerations. Costs will climb, but at about the same rate as before.

[kaldor]

Nothing should be outlawed, especially when it's already legal. I think the alcohol prohibition proved this. Al Capone anyone?

Same problem with cannabis these days. MILLIONS use marijuana and use it responsibly. But, it's illegal. So what happens? People abuse the fact that it's illegal and can sell it for HUGE prices without being taxed and make a few million dollars a year easily. Then, weapons are often brought into it because the growers can't get any help from the authorities when they are attacked. This then causes a lot of violence.

Now, let's make cigarettes illegal. Now what?

[McRat]

Nothing should be outlawed, especially when it's already legal. I think the alcohol prohibition proved this. Al Capone anyone?

Same problem with cannabis these days. MILLIONS use marijuana and use it responsibly. But, it's illegal. So what happens? People abuse the fact that it's illegal and can sell it for HUGE prices without being taxed and make a few million dollars a year easily. Then, weapons are often brought into it because the growers can't get any help from the authorities when they are attacked. This then causes a lot of violence.

Now, let's make cigarettes illegal. Now what?

There is a serious drug war going on 150 mi south of us right now.

But it's not only grass, it's coke, heroin, and meth fueling it as well. The President of Mexico wants US to ban gun sales because the warring drug factions in Mexico are buying US weapons.

Duh? Huh? You mean if you outlaw something legal, that it won't be available through smuggling anyways? The guy is a loon...

[kaldor]

There is a serious drug war going on 150 mi south of us right now.

But it's not only grass, it's coke, heroin, and meth fueling it as well. The President of Mexico wants US to ban gun sales because the warring drug factions in Mexico are buying US weapons.

Duh? Huh? You mean if you outlaw something legal, that it won't be available through smuggling anyways? The guy is a loon...

No, I meant that it will be available through smuggling/grow ops meaning that there could be weapons involved due to the risk factor.

[Velnias]

Well, sorry, seems some people don't care until is too late.

[rainbowagent7]

Sorry, I disagree. People in this day and age don't know how to have faith or heal themselves. You're right, I don't feel it now, and I won't later down the road. Once you develop an intimate knowledge of your inner workings (including your soul) you can do things to counteract any negative. I work very hard to maintain my health and will continue to do so. Anyway, I won't argue about it because people think they know everything, but anyone who claims to know anything will be proven wrong. Just because you don't smoke does not mean you will be healthier than anybody else, a lot of our health comes from our minds, ever hear of Deepak Chopra? If not you should read something of his, his approach on healing is where it's at.

People who are ~20-35 now will be nothing like the people who are 80 now when they turn 80. We live longer, and better, than the past generations. Remember that when you say things like this :wink:
I think it probably infuriates people to know that a smoker can best them at almost anything.

[KiwiNZ]

Governments around the World should tax the Tobacco Company's 100% on their Gross earnings. Problem solved.

[McRat]

Governments around World should tax the Tobacco Company's 100% on their Gross earnings. Problem solved.

Yes, that's why heroin is not available in countries where they actually execute those who produce it.

Wait ...

[KiwiNZ]

Yes, that's why heroin is not available in countries where they actually execute those who produce it.

Wait ...

??

[McRat]

??

Kinda like the Marijuana Tax Stamp thing the USA tried to pull.

They did not have legal grounds to ban marijuana, so they passed a law that you needed a tax stamp to legally possess marijuana.

And then they just don't sell the tax stamps.



Yes, you could "outlaw" something via absurd tax laws, but it doesn't stop production, nor does it normally stand up in court anyhow.

If they taxed legal tobacco growers out of operation, there would be illegal growers instead. Heck with the way some tobacco tax laws are, it might even reduce consumer costs. In many areas, you cannot smoke in public anyways, so it would no different than pot.

[KiwiNZ]

Couldn't ban marijuana ? good grief , did here .

[ibuclaw]

Couldn't ban marijuana ? good grief , did here .

And a Class B drug here too... indeed, good grief.

[McRat]

Couldn't ban marijuana ? good grief , did here .

At the time, the Federal government did not have authority over drug laws, it was a state decision. There are areas in the US where alcohol is illegal as well by state or county law, but it is no longer illegal on the Federal level.

When the USA was founded, it was supposed to a collective of states where the Federal laws were limited; most laws were left to the states. Kind of like a bunch of countries loosely working together. Today, the Federal government has most the power.

Marijuana is still a highly controversial topic in the US. Some states made small amounts legal to own. At one time, the Federal anti-marijuana laws could put you in prison for 5 years for having 1 marijuana cigarette.

Making tobacco illegal from the Federal level would be unconstitutional in the US. So they just tax the snot out of it.
And it might provoke a civil war (but not likely), because the Southern States are where the tobacco is grown.

It was England's love of tobacco that created the USA. Not religious freedom.

[new_tolinux]

Governments around the World should tax the Tobacco Company's 100% on their Gross earnings. Problem solved.
I did not mention that before, because the COC says:

Religion/Politics threads:
Conversations about religion are disallowed at all times, as are all political discussions that are not directly related to free and open source software concerns.But as you speak of it.....
They already do at some places, although the taxes are payed by the smokers and not by the companies. And it should be considered a crime against smokers. Governments probably can't do without those taxes, so they have to put higher taxes on it as more people quit. That's nothing else but stealing.

[kaldor]

To go more on topic, however, how is it that "organic" tobacco isn't healthier than normal cigarettes?

Wouldn't common sense tell you that breathing in tobacco + arsenic and preservatives is worse than breathing in JUST tobacco?

[JDShu]

They already do at some places, although the taxes are payed by the smokers and not by the companies. And it should be considered a crime against smokers. Governments probably can't do without those taxes, so they have to put higher taxes on it as more people quit. That's nothing else but stealing.

This is called internalizing a negative externality.

[chriswyatt]

I don't see much harm in it now and again, I'm not a regular smoker but occasionally (usually when drink is involved) I have the odd one. Haven't noticed any negative side effects. It's a nice effect but I wouldn't wanna do it all the time. I do know some heavy smokers who seem perfectly healthy, my great-grandad drank sherry and smoked pipes and lived into his 90's.

I don't agree with the extreme view that 'smoking will kill you', that's far too blunt. Neither do I agree that they're harmless. Also some people seem to be more resilient to the negative effects than others so I think it really depends on the person.

[kaldor]

Genetics and moderation is the key I think.

My mother's side of the family were all smokers except for her mother.

My 83 year old grandfather still alive and very well today lives in a very small town of only 200 people. He smokes a lot, but has no problem quitting if he needs to. He ended up catching a flu last week, and gave up smoking for that entire week to let himself recover better. He had no side effects or withdrawal, but he went out and bought two packs as soon as he got better. The doctors said that he had better blood pressure and heart rates than many people in their 20's. It makes sense, because he's very active.

My mother's uncle died last month at age 88. He had alzheimer's and was a chain smoker.

My 50 year old uncle (mother's brother) smokes about 2 cigarettes a day and has been doing so since he was about 12. He also is very healthy and doesn't even have a "smoker's cough".

My mother was a chain smoker from her late teens to late 30's. She quit cold-turkey when she found out she was pregnant with me, and had no withdrawal symptoms.


The first time I tried smoking, I didn't feel any discomfort or even cough when I inhaled. I liked it, but I know that once addicted you don't get those fuzzy nicotine highs and it becomes more of a chore.

I think it mainly boils down to how you use it. People who smoke cigars are usually much healthier than cigarette smokers because they don't inhale; they puff on them. Same with pipe smokers. Inhaling cigar smoke would be disgusting anyway; too much!

Just think about it. The reason people keep getting sick is due to the way tobacco is often marketed. 20 rolled up sticks of tobacco in a package; that's just asking to be abused! It's an addiction feeder, not a fun/relaxing thing to do. Way back when tobacco was popular, say the 1800's, who would have ever thought people'd be smoking 20+ sticks of tobacco a day to feed addictions?

Edit: My father's side, however, is a different story. Nobody smokes and everybody has heart problems. I guess that balances me out? Very healthy, chain smoking mother's side + heart disease/high blood pressure non smokers on my father's side? :)

[kaldor]

Comments on some new tobacco laws...

Parts of Canada made it illegal to sell single cigars or cigarillos and must now be bought in packs of 20 or more. Expensive! My opinion is that this is just creating more issues and encouraging more chain smoking. It's now also illegal to display tobacco products to customers. Everything is now covered up.

Isn't this being done a little bit poorly? :roll:

[whiskeylover]

I see, so why do you think European brands are healthier?


http://pagingdrgupta.blogs.cnn.com/2010/06/01/u-s-cigarette-brands-tops-in-cancer-causing-chemicals/?hpt=T3

[1800wheelz]

i think smoking or not is a persons decision, it only bugs me when people smoke around me because i hate the smell.

[Legendary_Bibo]

http://pagingdrgupta.blogs.cnn.com/2010/06/01/u-s-cigarette-brands-tops-in-cancer-causing-chemicals/?hpt=T3

I think they use a different tar free tobacco then Americans do. It's probably more expensive to grow and maintain so our tobacco industry cut costs. Not to mention American tobacco companies put harmful chemicals in it to make people more addicted to it, and sometimes for "flavor". Those are the harmful chemicals that cause cancer. There's probably health benefits to smoking (i.e. stress relief), but not with our cigarettes. I think Hookah is the closest Americans can get. It also makes the second hand smoke smell horrible, and I based this on the fact that I had a friend who would import certain European cigarettes it had ginger and other spices in them that made them smell pleasant, and the cigarette itself produced very little smoke. It's something in American cigarettes that's the cause of all this crap.

Edit: I just gained a bit of an education on the tar matter. Turns out there's a process to remove the tar. The quick dirty way is cheaper, and takes less time, but it doesn't remove it all. The other way is slower and more expensive, but it removes the tar that would form when the cigarette is lit.

[kaldor]

I notice American cigarettes are always way too strong, smelly and dark. Canadian cigarettes are a lot brighter in colour, the tobacco is kinda orange.

[EarlGrey167]

The trend around here is to ban smoking in bars. I'm not a smoker, had a brother that was a smoker drop over of a massive heart attack at the age of 42, so I'm not even someone who approves of smoking. But as far as I'm concerned if it's legal it should be legal in bars and casinos and places like that. I think the no smoking within 25 feet of a door in public places is a good thing, but to say you can't smoke is just another infringement on our freedoms.

[Legendary_Bibo]

The trend around here is to ban smoking in bars. I'm not a smoker, had a brother that was a smoker drop over of a massive heart attack at the age of 42, so I'm not even someone who approves of smoking. But as far as I'm concerned if it's legal it should be legal in bars and casinos and places like that. I think the no smoking within 25 feet of a door in public places is a good thing, but to say you can't smoke is just another infringement on our freedoms.

Places like parks and campuses should have a ban on smoking and it should be strictly enforced.