Ambience vs. OS X Snow Leopard Theme

[murderslastcrow]

I was thinking about it, and to me, the default theme in Lucid Lynx looks better to me than the theme in the more recent OS X releases. I never really liked that theme anyway, but a lot of people say it's da' shiz.

So, I came up with a few reasons why I think it's better.

1. Light on dark, not dark on light. This is easier on the eyes. As Maddox once said, light grey on darker grey is easier to read, and won't kill your eyes. The idea of making a computer use the stark contrast of paper is unnecessary.

2. You can tell what the window controls will do before hovering over them.

3. Sticks to 2-3 colors that blend well together, doesn't overdo the contrast to make your computer look like a pile of jellybeans. The theme is consistent, as well as stylish. There's no point in making the scrollbars a different color than the window border it's attached to, other than to distract the eyes.

All in all, the smooth edges and consistent, eye-friendly color scheme are a great improvement over themes I've seen in the past. I've gotta' say, I really like it.

Do you guys think these are valid points? I'm not saying OS X is ugly, here. I just think these reasons step outside the usual opinions and preferences argument and into visual functionality.

[madnessjack]

There's a lot of difference between the two, such a comparison can't be so easily made :D

I'm interested on you light on dark point. Not sure which one is better?

After using Ambiance for awhile now one of my gripes is with the buttons- there's virtually no contrast. Other than that and the font's being to big (usual gripe) freakin' love it :)

[arnab_das]

if there's one thing i dont like on a mac, its the buttons on the windows. it looks so ancient to be honest!

[NightwishFan]

I like how Ambiance is much better suited to different kinds of wallpapers and icons than the older default themes.

[murderslastcrow]

Ditto on the icons/wallpapers. Before I used to go out and find a theme to specifically blend with whatever icon set or WP I wanted to use, which was fun, but now, even though I'm not into 'Mac-ish' themes, there are few I find good reason to switch to, so I still have Ambience.

[rottentree]

2. You can tell what the window controls will do before hovering over them.


I think you can tell it on OS X too (provided that you have used a computer before)
It doesn't take too much brain juice. You have: close,minimise,fullscreen
Red means danger so it's close because that's the most dangerous.
Yellow is a mild warning so that has to be minimise because it's the second most dangerous of the three(OMG my window has disappeared OHNOES!)
Green is a pretty encouraging colour to click so it's fullscreen because everyone likes fullscreen :D

[Chrysantine]

I was thinking about it, and to me, the default theme in Lucid Lynx looks better to me than the theme in the more recent OS X releases.
Opinions are opinions.


2. You can tell what the window controls will do before hovering over them.
Seriously, isn't this a bit far fetched? Once you've pressed each button in OS X, you know what they do and they perform the same function everytime, in every window.


3. Sticks to 2-3 colors that blend well together, doesn't overdo the contrast to make your computer look like a pile of jellybeans
A sample screenshot of OS X - clicky me (http://img717.imageshack.us/img717/1247/scr5s.jpg) (No, this is not my desktop, merely something I spotted from Deviantart)

Does that look like jelly beans?


Do you guys think these are valid points?
No, you're trying to make an argument from straws for the sake of making one.

[murderslastcrow]

I wasn't trying to mask my opening statement as anything but opinion, and I agree that the differences are kind of negligible. I was just trying to pinpoint what exactly it was that turned me on to it, since it's never really been my style.

Does OS X give an option for taking away the green/yellow/red from the window controls, or is that just because the window wasn't focused in your screenshot? I was referring to the blue scrollbars and the rainbow circle for loading and other shiny things. Seems overcomplicated.

Perhaps it's all just a matter of preference, but from a design standpoint, it just seems easier to look at Ambience for longer. Doesn't mean the design is better or more glamorous, and people who don't like dark themes may not really care if it's light on the eyes. Like you said, opinions are opinions.

[Chrysantine]

Does OS X give an option for taking away the green/yellow/red from the window controls, or is that just because the window wasn't focused in your screenshot?
The guy who made the screenshot switched to the "Graphite" version (it's in the preferences) which turns all the buttons grey and changes the UI a little.


I was referring to the blue scrollbars and the rainbow circle for loading and other shiny things. Seems overcomplicated.
They're all customizable and with graphite they're grey - it's pretty easy to change all the scrollbars and stuff with just a few little tweaks.


Perhaps it's all just a matter of preference
And here's where we agree :-)


P.S. Welcome to the forums, Chrysantine :D. 4 posts in 2 years, are you more of an openSUSE person? Or just not a geek like me? XD
Nah I was just testing Lucid to see what it's like and I like the forum layout here so I've been starting to post here again + there seems to be pretty reasonable people from both sides of fence here in the generic discussion even if it gets a little heated at times (plus the beans don't mean how many posts, I think they're +rep or something - I haven't actually even looked at what they are :-) )

The openSUSE forums went nuts with the layout and alienated a lot of people (they've partially reverted lately but it seems they'll re-implement the "all in one screen" version) so I decided to stop posting there.

[Sand & Mercury]

As it stands, Ambiance has a great amount of potential as a theme but nowhere near the polish it needs. The art team are headed in the right direction but the theme currently looks awful, it's just half-finished compared to some of the other themes out there.

Aqua is fantastic, it looks and feels wonderful to use.

Ironically, the only thing I'm not totally fond of in Snow Leopard's theme is the window buttons, whereas in Lucid the window buttons are the only thing that I really like.

[murderslastcrow]

Oh, lol. Yeah, I was looking at their forums recently and I felt a little confused. I can't believe I spaced Graphite, since I used to use it all the time (prior OS X Tiger user). I must've thought it was a hack I applied or something, thanks for the info!

Yeah, I've seen a lot of people get heated about the silliest things, lately, especially this theme. It's received a lot of negative attention when it's actually a pretty nice improvement, and you can always change your GTK theme back to something on the other side with a couple clicks. I don't see what the huge deal is, honestly.

Glad you chose to stop by, since we can always use a few more reasonable people here. XD

Sand & Mercury, yeah, just look at the theme from 2 months ago- the controls still had huge chunks hanging out. @_@ It is an LTS, after all, so we'll have to see what comes of the next release. There are plenty of amazing GTK themes out there, though, so this shouldn't discourage anyone from checking them out.

[NightwishFan]

It is just a debate, pros/cons and the like. In fact usability and aesthetics are things I am mainly interested in discussing. I will post more if this thread keeps up. I am a bit busy now.

I think the radiance theme has potential. They need to fix the 'off white' color of the menu bars in applications. The panel looks amazing with it though.

[ibuclaw]

1. Light on dark, not dark on light. This is easier on the eyes. As Maddox once said, light grey on darker grey is easier to read, and won't kill your eyes. The idea of making a computer use the stark contrast of paper is unnecessary.


I actually don't think Light on Dark makes it any easier on your eyes, infact - it could make it arguably worse.

This is my reasoning:


Examine the image below. You should be able to read it very well. Your eyes should be attracted to the header because of it's size, and "white space" positioning.

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Intrepid/Release_with_a_dark_theme?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=dark-issue1.png

In comparative, the image below, while formated in the exact same way, should be much harder to read. Our eyes don't react do a black canvas with white text as well as it does to a white canvas. Our brains our designed to ignore white space and look at items that are darker or contrast their background.

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Intrepid/Release_with_a_dark_theme?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=dark-issue2.png

It's for this same reason that people but backlights behind their monitors or televisions. The light allows your pupils to relax and not have to strain as much to see the color of your screen in a dark room.

Now, look at the next image.

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Intrepid/Release_with_a_dark_theme?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=dark-issue3.png

Where did your eyes go first? I can guess. You probably looked at either the blue accented text or the header first. It's for the same reason that a theme should be minimally invasive to a users experience. It's hardwired into our minds and is reflected in media all around us. It's akin to going out in the dark with a single bright flashlight and trying to find items outside. It's the same way with a dark theme, your mind and eyes have to work harder to find what they're looking for. The theme should contain little contrast in general with color or dark items placed to draw your eye.


Regards

PS: Images taken from ubuntu wiki.
PPS: If you are going to quote me, remove the [IMG] tags. thanks :)

[techunit]

The ambience theme is one of the best I have used. I would move the windows controls but they seem to work best on the left.

[juancarlospaco]

My brain dont follow ibuclaw's standard...

[murderslastcrow]

Ibuclaw, you bring up some very good points. Thanks for the examples- however, light grey on dark grey produces similar effects. Just using a bit deeper grey than WHITE does help quite a bit, though. :3 You're giving me good ideas for a new theme. You don't need a lot of contrast, just enough to make the words come out.

Backlights are great. XD

[murderslastcrow]

I just realized why the window controls looked kind of familiar to me- they're just like the buttons in KDE 4! Oh, I've been wondering if someone would make a KDE 4 theme for Gnome, but this one's so much better- best of both worlds, it seems. :3 I love balance.

[ceelo]

I can't say I really prefer one over the other. I was very impressed with the Ambiance theme upon my first look though. I love light themes with dark accents. Much like the Dust theme, though Ambiance has a much more soothing look and feel.

[bigsmitty64]

(plus the beans don't mean how many posts, I think they're +rep or something - I haven't actually even looked at what they are :-) )


From the Forum FAQ'S

What's the deal with coffee cups/beans and the funny titles?
Beans are posts. The post/bean count can be turned off by the user if so desired.

[PryGuy]

As it stands, Ambiance has a great amount of potential as a theme but nowhere near the polish it needs. The art team are headed in the right direction but the theme currently looks awful, it's just half-finished compared to some of the other themes out there.

Aqua is fantastic, it looks and feels wonderful to use.

Ironically, the only thing I'm not totally fond of in Snow Leopard's theme is the window buttons, whereas in Lucid the window buttons are the only thing that I really like.

+1 except for the MacOSX buttons thing. The red 'close' button looks so cheap. Hope they'll polish the theme in the future.

[Chrysantine]

Beans are posts. The post/bean count can be turned off by the user if so desired.
That's funny, I swear I've posted a few more.. weird weird :-)

[antenna]

I don't think beans increment for posts in Community Cafe (making the whole thing pointless perhaps?)

[bigsmitty64]

Most people look at a high bean count and think it means that person has more knowledge because he or she has more posts (probably mostly true), therefore in the community cafe they aren't counted because its not considered "tech support topics"

[schauerlich]

http://grab.by/grabs/04579bb933d5184e669ee777a6ed04fe.png

wut wut

Even though I use OS X 90% of the time, it still messes me up that the window buttons moved to the left. I wish I could change all of the keyboard shortcuts to be the same as OS X, though. Swapping super and control isn't really the same.

[metalmaniac248]

i also prefer Ambience to OS X's default theme, i like the splashes of dark in ambience, i'm not a fan of the white menus and bright blue in OS X nor the grey window elements. I also think some of the finder controls in OS X are a bit clunky/untidy looking, and the glossy blue scroll bar can be nice but i think it's just to glossy and looks ugly when it is really small. That being said, things like imovie, and iphoto really put there linux equivalents to shame in terms of aesthetics.

[TheNessus]

I love dark themes but they are not suit for daily use. The reason being that when browsing the web, webpages are most of the time very bright, white, and light. a black theme makes too much contrast.