The future of payment methods

[sudoer541]

What do you think about the current payment methods? To be specific...do you think our current payment methods will be obsolete? I keep hearing here and there (not on this forum) that money will be replaced by a implanted chip. The chip will track the user and the user will be able to shop fast and easy. what do you think? I personally dislike the fact that it tracks the user. any other opinions regarding the future of payment methods?

[jrusso2]

I refuse to have any chips implanted or tattooed with any UPC codes.

[RevKeltina]

The whole idea of these new payment methods and such disturbs me. My boss has this key-fob that is, in actuality, a very tiny electronic bank card. All she has to do to purchase something is to wave it around in front of the p-o-s (point of sale) terminal and it debits her account. Now, granted, you are dealing with someone here who can not even manage to use the standard ATM card (can never remember the pin and just have hubby get money for me when I want some), but it's just weird to me.

I wonder how she keeps from buying stuff for everybody when she walks around the store????? Alien technology! lol

[crlang13]

I prefer cash because it's much easier to keep track of your spending. I have nothing to hide, but the privacy of using cash is always nice. I think people will continue to use cash mainly for that reason, but we'll see more and more easy electronic ways to pay for things beyond just a bank card.

[Lightstar]

Seen those swipe-and-go type of credit cards?
no need to swipe, just place it near the beeper, it connects to the chip, and then you can leave.

It's quick and easy, even elder people do it!
It's also easy to steal a card and use it, since you just need to beep it and go.

I think the best payment method is to connect your eye-scan to your bank account and get an eye scan thingy at every store! and to buy online, just use your webcam! yay!

[JDShu]

Cards or whatnot with limited credit stored inside are very convenient. Letting those cards access your bank account is something else entirely.

[Psumi]

Credit = Something I don't care about.

if someone else cares about credit; it's their own fault.

I've never had a credit card, never will, and you cannot force me.

I will continue to pay my bills with cash/check. I always buy products with cash when I can; this includes computers. if they force me to use a card of any type, I'll be glad never again to get anything new.

I'd rather starve or die than to touch another card.

[handy]

The problem with RFID chips, retinal scan's or whatever else that can not be removed from the individual, is that:

1) if you upset the authorities, you can have your access turned off - to everything.

2) if there is a technical error number "1" above happens anyway.

We don't want to put all of our eggs in one basket for a variety of reasons. Our financial/social security being not the least of them.

[Khakilang]

All my life I never have a credit card. Its not that i don't trust them it just easier to keep track of my cash.

[sudoer541]

The problem with RFID chips, retinal scan's or whatever else that can not be removed from the individual, is that:

1) if you upset the authorities, you can have your access turned off - to everything.

2) if there is a technical error number "1" above happens anyway.

We don't want to put all of our eggs in one basket for a variety of reasons. Our financial/social security being not the least of them.

OMG!!! thats scary!!! My friends keep talking about the RFID chips.
They are saying that many countries currencies will merge and we will have to use those chips to buy
food. One thing that bothers me is the privacy issues with the chip.
I am sure no one would like to use them.

[Post Monkeh]

cards are good because you always have a record of what you're spending your money on, but i can't see money disappearing anytime soon. although being forced to swipe your card when visiting a strip club might be fun.

[Slug71]

I refuse to have any chips implanted or tattooed with any UPC codes.

This!

[nubimax]

Here where I live over 100 people have had there bank accounts stripped of all there monies this is in a community of about 10,000 people. All of the scams trace back to using debit cards in ATM machines. So I do not think that I will be using electronic withdrawals until there is more security with them.
M.

[Psumi]

cards are good because you always have a record of what you're spending your money on, but i can't see money disappearing anytime soon. although being forced to swipe your card when visiting a strip club might be fun.

So do checking accounts. I also have a credit union, and they're pretty good with money.

[handy]

OMG!!! thats scary!!! My friends keep talking about the RFID chips.
They are saying that many countries currencies will merge and we will have to use those chips to buy
food. One thing that bothers me is the privacy issues with the chip.
I am sure no one would like to use them.

Some people in the States, have had their new born children RFID chipped!

Though I do tend to suspect them of being somehow involved in the beginnings of a scam to convince Joe/sephine average that RFID chipping your children is the best thing that you can do for them...

[sudoer541]

Some people in the States, have had their new born children RFID chipped!

Though I do tend to suspect them of being somehow involved in the beginnings of a scam to convince Joe/sephine average that RFID chipping your children is the best thing that you can do for them...


[shocked] OMG!!! when did they started doing this? This chip takes away our freedoms. [shocked]

[jrothwell97]

[shocked] OMG!!! when did they started doing this? This chip takes away our freedoms. [shocked]

I suspect it's helicopter parents who want to be able to keep an eye on little Jimmy without, y'know, actually supervising him.

Anyway, implanted chips are still quite a way off - the next wave, as it were, will be RFID-equipped smartcards. These are already used on the London Underground and buses (Oyster cards), where they work well and have done so for some years - it's more convenient than a magnetic stripe/chip-and-PIN card, since you just need to touch the card against the reader and you're through the ticket gates. (It's also not necessary to tie an identity to them, which makes it perfect for the paranoid.)

The next step (which is already in progress) is rolling this out to credit and debit cards. I believe Barclays are running it in greater London, where a so-called "paywave" card can be used for small sub-£10 purchases, and also as an Oyster card. It makes sense - use the same card to buy a coffee and a newspaper, and then use it again to get on the train to work.

[Shpongle]

I refuse to have any chips implanted or tattooed with any UPC codes.
++

[aysiu]

I prefer cash because it's much easier to keep track of your spending. I recently switched to cash from credit, and it has been great. Credit is a dangerous road to go down. All you see are numbers, and as long as you sign for everything, then it's "paid for." With cash you know exactly how much you're spending, and it's easier to make little quotas for yourself ("I'll pull this much cash for the week and whatever I have I have").

There are other side benefits to using cash: Fewer receipts to keep. I've had charged errors before and have been glad I kept receipts for those. If you use cash, there can be no error, though, so there's no need to keep a receipt (unless there's a purchase you might want to refund or get reimbursed for). More of your money goes to the store. When you use a credit card to pay for something, the store has to pay a fee each time to your credit card company. That means more money to the credit cards and less money to the business. I'd prefer to give more money to the business I'm shopping at. The credit card companies have had enough of my money. This is particularly true of locally owned businesses.

[Post Monkeh]

I recently switched to cash from credit, and it has been great. Credit is a dangerous road to go down. All you see are numbers, and as long as you sign for everything, then it's "paid for." With cash you know exactly how much you're spending, and it's easier to make little quotas for yourself ("I'll pull this much cash for the week and whatever I have I have").

There are other side benefits to using cash: Fewer receipts to keep. I've had charged errors before and have been glad I kept receipts for those. If you use cash, there can be no error, though, so there's no need to keep a receipt (unless there's a purchase you might want to refund or get reimbursed for). More of your money goes to the store. When you use a credit card to pay for something, the store has to pay a fee each time to your credit card company. That means more money to the credit cards and less money to the business. I'd prefer to give more money to the business I'm shopping at. The credit card companies have had enough of my money. This is particularly true of locally owned businesses.
the business also has to pay for an external company to come and remove the money from the premises. plus less cash held in store = less robberies. and i find the opposite. if i pay for a major item with cash i have to keep a receipt in case anything goes wrong with it within its warranty period, or if i don't get what i paid for. when i pay on my debit card (don't forget, not all cards are credit cards) then i have an electronic receipt in the form of my bank statement.


there are advantages and disadvantages to both sides

[pricetech]

I don't cash disappearing any time soon either.

But who knows ?? Our governments are the ones who create the documents that we call money. Who's to say they won't just stop making them ??

Not being paranoid, just throwing it out there as food for thought.

Meanwhile, which is best is more a matter of personal preference. Credit cards / bank cards are fine if used responsibly. If not, then it quickly becomes a nightmare for the irresponsible who use them carelessly.

[aysiu]

the business also has to pay for an external company to come and remove the money from the premises. I don't think all businesses do that, but even if they did it's a lump sum per removal.
plus less cash held in store = less robberies. How do burglars know how much money you have on the premises? Most businesses I go to do a mix of cash and credit/debit. The only cash-only places I go to are extremely cheap so would not have such large sums of money there anyway.
and i find the opposite. if i pay for a major item with cash i have to keep a receipt in case anything goes wrong with it within its warranty period, or if i don't get what i paid for. So keep the receipt for cash, too, then. The difference is that for a credit card, you have to (or at least should) keep the receipt for all transactions. For cash, you can choose to keep the receipt for only items you think you might return.
when i pay on my debit card (don't forget, not all cards are credit cards) then i have an electronic receipt in the form of my bank statement. When I've charged stuff in the past, I've kept the paper receipt to keep the bank or credit card company in line, not just the place I shopped at. You can't always trust the electronic receipt.

I also know some folks who have had their credit card numbers or identities stolen. Using cash doesn't prevent that from happening, but it minimizes the chances somewhat.

Of course there are pros and cons either way, but I think the pros of cash far outweigh the cons.

[crlang13]

I don't cash disappearing any time soon either.

But who knows ?? Our governments are the ones who create the documents that we call money. Who's to say they won't just stop making them ??


And we must remember that it actually does cost money to print money. Which is why there is always that debate as to whether or not the U.S. should keep the penny!

[Post Monkeh]

I don't think all businesses do that, but even if they did it's a lump sum per removal. true but then it's an extra expense of having cash as opposed to electronic payment. plus there's the administrative duties involved (storage prior to banking, end of day counting, and i'm sure there's more work involved that i'm not remembering right now, it's a long time since i worked in retail)


How do burglars know how much money you have on the premises? Most businesses I go to do a mix of cash and credit/debit. The only cash-only places I go to are extremely cheap so would not have such large sums of money there anyway.

well i don't know where you're from, but here in n ireland, it's never a big store that gets robbed, it's small local shops getting robbed for a few hundred quid. less money in the till = less money lost, and if criminals get wise to more and more transactions becoming electronic, i'd say they'd stop holding shops up because there'd be nothing in it for them, but yeah, i'm only guessing here.


So keep the receipt for cash, too, then. The difference is that for a credit card, you have to (or at least should) keep the receipt for all transactions. For cash, you can choose to keep the receipt for only items you think you might return.
When I've charged stuff in the past, I've kept the paper receipt to keep the bank or credit card company in line, not just the place I shopped at. You can't always trust the electronic receipt.

but i have a receipt (of a kind) for anything i pay for using my debit card. i have hard proof that i have paid a certain sum of money to a certain company. if anything goes wrong with that item, i don't need a receipt to prove i bought it there - i have the proof on my bank statement. i keep receipts anyway of course because they could still argue that the payment could have been for anything, but it's unlikely. i just don't understand why you have to keep receipts more for electronic purchases than for cash purchases. for cash purchases the ONLY proof of the transaction you can have is a receipt. for electronic ones you always have proof that there was a transaction.
maybe you've had trouble with being overcharged by your bank, it's never happened to me personally but i know of people who've been overcharged by the shop but they've never had a problem getting it refunded and if that's where you're coming from then yeah, i can see why you'd need to keep a receipt. i know people who've had things like this happen but a phone call to their bank was all that was required, they never had to send receipts or anything



I also know some folks who have had their credit card numbers or identities stolen. Using cash doesn't prevent that from happening, but it minimizes the chances somewhat.

Of course there are pros and cons either way, but I think the pros of cash far outweigh the cons.
that;s the big problem with doing everything electronically. identity theft is nigh on impossible if you only ever use cash, but then on the other hand, it's harder for a person to pick pocket you successfully if you're only carrying cards (provided your pin isn't something daft like 1234) and even if they do mug you and force you to provide your pin, most atms are covered by cctv these days, and even if they did get money, most accounts (here in the uk anyway) are limited to £300 or so of atm withdrawals per day.


i don't think cash has enough disadvantages to stop using it (i still use it for most of my purchases of everyday consumables) but there are definite advantages to using cards, especially when buying anything that has a warranty. credit cards are even better for this since they have their own payment insurance for anything over £100 (i think it's £100) but they come with their own drawbacks so i don't have one anymore.

[audiomick]

I can live with credit cards and bank cards, particularly since here in Germany you practically can't avoid having one, but those RFID chips really frighten me. I saw on Television that some woman in Florida (I think) had allowed her children to be fitted with chips, and I was absolutely horrified.

[sudoer541]

I can live with credit cards and bank cards, particularly since here in Germany you practically can't avoid having one, but those RFID chips really frighten me. I saw on Television that some woman in Florida (I think) had allowed her children to be fitted with chips, and I was absolutely horrified.


I knowwww!!! if the government doesn't like you, they can always turn off your chip and you cant buy food. I also heard they will implement a special tattoo. It looks looks like a bar code or something and it will "supposedly" be easier to shop and avoid fraud.
scary stuff!!

[Post Monkeh]

I also heard they will implement a special tattoo.

that was in a film from the 80s. don't believe every piece of scaremongering you hear.

[handy]

I don't think the RFID implant routine will get very far. It is rife with possibilities for identity theft/fraud.



Some food product labels apparently already have RFID chips incorporated into them.

Imagine marketroids being able to collect statistics on where their peanut butter goes & how long it stays on the person who bought it's pantry shelf.

What an interesting vocation.

[audiomick]

I don't think the RFID implant routine will get very far. It is rife with possibilities for identity theft/fraud.



Some food product labels apparently already have RFID chips incorporated into them.

Imagine marketroids being able to collect statistics on where their peanut butter goes & how long it stays on the person who bought it's pantry shelf.

What an interesting vocation.
Not just food products. The things are in the tags of all sorts of things.

[handy]

& apart from identity theft/fraud, there is always the likely hood of a technical glitch traceable or otherwise that turns you off.

If all your eggs are in one basket, in a system where you no longer exist or are now someone else, due to a glitch.

Not a pleasant set of thoughts really.

[murderslastcrow]

This is just like all the technology we thought would be common by now. We have a lot of the crazy stuff from Sci-Fi films, like projected displays, holograms, virtual environments, but no one uses them. You know why?

They're not practical.

People much prefer their cool touch-based computer to be in tablet or smartphone form- it's more mobile and discreet that way, and doesn't have them typing on their friends' faces next to them. It just makes more sense, and it probably won't change too much, except it will likely be stretchable in the near future.

Same with these chips- credit and debit cards are just far more convenient and flexible than an implantation or global identity. Some people really don't want a central identity unless it's entirely under their control.

However, if it were implemented slowly through a certain kind of service, or with something already common like a cellphone, then it could catch on. But it certainly wouldn't be a standard, and to think you'd get the poor people along with the objectors using it is... well, farfetched.

[mobilediesel]

Any RFID tag/device powerful enough to be used to track you is big enough to detect and dispose of. Any RFID tag/device small enough to avoid your detection has a limited transmit range and cannot be used to track you beyond a few feet as they don't have their own power source.

[Old Marcus]

Just put an electromagnet in your larder. sorted.

[t0p]

Any RFID tag/device powerful enough to be used to track you is big enough to detect and dispose of. Any RFID tag/device small enough to avoid your detection has a limited transmit range and cannot be used to track you beyond a few feet as they don't have their own power source.

RFID currently have a rather limited range. But that will change in the future... and probably sooner than I think.

I'm not suggesting that the black helicopters will be out reading the tags on our tins of beans. Just clarifying the point.

[mobilediesel]

RFID currently have a rather limited range. But that will change in the future... and probably sooner than I think.

I'm not suggesting that the black helicopters will be out reading the tags on our tins of beans. Just clarifying the point.

The range of passive RFID devices wont change much unless there are new advances in electromagnetic theory. Battery-assisted RFID devices will remain large enough to be easily visible for the foreseeable future.

[linux-hack]

may be we'll not need to pay any more in the future :D

[t0p]

The range of passive RFID devices wont change much unless there are new advances in electromagnetic theory. Battery-assisted RFID devices will remain large enough to be easily visible for the foreseeable future.

What do you mean by "foreseeable future"? 25 years ago I never dreamt I'd own a cellphone as small as the one I've got now. In 1940, who woulda thunk that in less than 30 years men would be bouncing around on the moon (or a film set of the moon, if you prefer)?

[MooPi]

The idea will miss the less fortunate or economically disadvantaged. I have delivered to poor neighborhoods and cash rules and there is great effort to stay undocumented in certain circles. Unless you have experience the neighborhoods in question It's hard to grasp the level of anonymity.

[mobilediesel]

What do you mean by "foreseeable future"? 25 years ago I never dreamt I'd own a cellphone as small as the one I've got now. In 1940, who woulda thunk that in less than 30 years men would be bouncing around on the moon (or a film set of the moon, if you prefer)?

The foreseeable future of antenna size and frequency being tied to one another. Higher frequencies also require higher energy input. That's why cellphones have actually started growing in recent years. They're using higher frequency ranges and need bigger batteries to support the power-hungry transmitter. Bigger screens and "apps" were thrown in to hide the fact that phones are growing again instead of continuing to shrink.

[OrangeMadness]

Payments in cash have already become extremely rare and people who make big payments in cash (say a few thousands) raise suspisions for the origin of those money. In some countries people use their credit cards even for buying cigarettes so the need for even carrying cash in their wallets is already fading.

Your transaction history is already fully traceable by gooverments and there are programs implemented among banks to monitor big and suspicious transactions (mainly for terrorism). There is no need to implant a chip on ones skin to do this. When a financial crime is investigated accounts are already frozen with a phone call ("switch you off" someone said in a previuos thread).

Considering for how many years cash and coins have been used on the world, and that 50 years ago we were still using a cheque book the future of payments is already here. Chipped credit cards, e-wallets, online banking and so on. Hopefully implanted chips will remain only a part of SciFi movies for many years to come.

[johnb820]

In the future, we will have these little round thin cylinders made from precious earth metals that people will carry around in their pockets. Their convenience and simplicity will be heralded as a major feat of economic engineering. They won't get easily damaged and their value will remain steady. And if you were concerned about aesthetics, they will all have fancy designs on them to make sure that everyone knows exactly how much it will be worth.

But alas, it must be a pipe dream.