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lovinglinux
February 13th, 2010, 10:02 PM
Gnome 3 won't be the default on Ubuntu 10.04, but Gnome Shell will be available for installation. On the other hand, Kubuntu Lucid will be shipped with KDE 4.4, which is very exciting. I used Gnome for more than a year, but after testing Gnome Shell, I decided to give KDE another shot. I have been using KDE 4.3, over a command-line installation of Ubuntu, for a few months already and yesterday upgraded it to KDE 4.4.

I was already very happy with 4.3, but KDE 4.4 is truly amazing. Among the things I liked the most is the new tabbed windows feature, that allows to group and switch windows just like Firefox switch tabs.

I have to admit that I didn't explore Kwin before, because I was addicted to Compiz, so I'm not sure which features are new. But I have already ditched Compiz and found that Kwin is not only simpler to configure, but also provides all the features I used the most, like Window Picker, Window Rules and Place Window Compiz plugins. You can create rules for each application/window directly from it, in contrast to Compiz, that requires to enter the CCSM and switch between several plugins.

I'm also finally grabbing the concept behind the activities, which allows me to have different wallpapers and different widgets associated with each virtual desktop. This very useful for those who like too many widgets. Not to mention the dashboard, that can be display it's on widgets or the widgets of the current desktop/activity.

..and it looks damn good!

So, I'm was wondering if there will be an exodus from Gnome with the release of Gnome 3 and KDE 4.4? I believe it will. There are already posts on the forums about Gnome users wanting to try KDE 4.4. What is your opinion?

PS: see discussion about KDE 4.4 release here (http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1402599).

cariboo
February 13th, 2010, 10:13 PM
It's pretty hard to tell what Gnome 3 is going to be like, when it isn't even in the alpha stage. I would suggest waiting until the details are published before deciding what you are going to do.

I, as a diehard geek welcome the changes that have been talked about so far, and yes I do use gnome-shell on both my desktop systems.

Merk42
February 13th, 2010, 10:20 PM
Gnome 3 won't be the default until Ubuntu 10.10, but KDE 4.4 will be already included on Lucid Linx, which is very exciting.
Source?
Yes GNOME 3 is scheduled for September so 10.10 is the earliest it could be default, but that's not to say come 10.10 it will be default.

lovinglinux
February 13th, 2010, 10:32 PM
Source?
Yes GNOME 3 is scheduled for September so 10.10 is the earliest it could be default, but that's not to say come 10.10 it will be default.

OK, wrong choice of words. I wanted to say what you said.

lovinglinux
February 13th, 2010, 10:42 PM
It's pretty hard to tell what Gnome 3 is going to be like, when it isn't even in the alpha stage. I would suggest waiting until the details are published before deciding what you are going to do.

I, as a diehard geek welcome the changes that have been talked about so far, and yes I do use gnome-shell on both my desktop systems.

Well, I don't think I will switch back to Gnome any time soon, unless they came up with something so freaking awesome. But from what I have seen so far from the available version of Gnome Shell and KDE 4.4, I will continue to use KDE for a long time.

ElSlunko
February 13th, 2010, 11:54 PM
I would've said yes a few months ago. Now, maybe not. Should be no surprise since time to actually work on the project has passed.

Ric_NYC
February 14th, 2010, 12:03 AM
It is possible.

Simian Man
February 14th, 2010, 12:05 AM
I think that people who use Gnome would be much more likely to switch to Xfce than KDE if Gnome 3 doesn't go the way they want it to. Xfce is quite like Gnome 2 and is even better in many ways.

I personally have never liked KDE and wouldn't use it no matter how many features they implement. I don't mean anything against the project. I think it's amazing, it's just not what I want.

lovinglinux
February 14th, 2010, 12:13 AM
I think that people who use Gnome would be much more likely to switch to Xfce than KDE if Gnome 3 doesn't go the way they want it to. Xfce is quite like Gnome 2 and is even better in many ways.

I personally have never liked KDE and wouldn't use it no matter how many features they implement. I don't mean anything against the project. I think it's amazing, it's just not what I want.

Good point.

SuperSonic4
February 14th, 2010, 12:23 AM
No, I believe a few others will switch to KDE but many will stay with GNOME. It goes without saying that those who like the bleeding edge will stay

Warpnow
February 14th, 2010, 12:38 AM
No. In general, I think people who dislike Gnome 3 will also dislike KDE 4. I don't think there's much crossover in Gnome 3 haters and KDE 4 likers. I think more people will flock to Xubuntu, though.

XubuRoxMySox
February 14th, 2010, 12:51 AM
I think that all three (or four, if Lubuntu is ready) versions of the distro will LOOSE (as in untie, liberate) many more people from those expensive OSes.

Will Gnome LOSE (as in suffer loss) users in the new version? I kinda doubt it, but I switched from Ubuntu to Xubuntu when Karmic came out, and really love it. And it's a huge bonus that Xubuntu didn't (nor will it in the next release) ship with that troublesome PulseAudio default. And no Mono either, if that matters to you. THAT may do more to bring users from Ubuntu to Xubuntu than any changes in Gnome.

-Robin

yester64
February 14th, 2010, 01:00 AM
I have to say that Gnome Shell is a good approach for making the desktop easier to navigate. Especially for people who are not familiar with computers.

I am not sure why most people object gnome 3. From what i see so far, it looks nice.
I can not compare to KDE since i do not run it. But if people have sentiments they can run different desktops. There are so many choices.

But you have to wait until its out and to see the final version of it.

lovinglinux
February 14th, 2010, 01:03 AM
I think that all three (or four, if Lubuntu is ready) versions of the distro will LOOSE (as in untie, liberate) many more people from those expensive OSes.

Will Gnome LOSE (as in suffer loss) users in the new version? I kinda doubt it, but I switched from Ubuntu to Xubuntu when Karmic came out, and really love it. And it's a huge bonus that Xubuntu didn't (nor will it in the next release) ship with that troublesome PulseAudio default. And no Mono either, if that matters to you. THAT may do more to bring users from Ubuntu to Xubuntu than any changes in Gnome.

-Robin


:oops: Sorry for the misspelled LOSE. English is not my first language, so I guess I get a free pass :)

23meg
February 14th, 2010, 01:03 AM
No, just like there was no "KDE exodus" over the controversial transition to KDE 4. People who preferred KDE for what made it KDE kept using it in the long run, despite the occasional mishaps here and there, which they tolerated. Similarly, since GNOME 3.x will retain the values and overall approach to user experience that made GNOME 2.x what it is, it will retain its current users too, for the most part.

As I said recently elsewhere (http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=8812109&postcount=980), if you're dissatisfied with GNOME Shell for whatever reason, and don't want to help shape it into something you'll be satisfied with for whatever reason, you still don't have to switch to anything. Metacity and GNOME Panel will likely be maintained for years, and you'll be able to use the rest of GNOME 3.x with them.

But I guess many people enjoy playing the "switching" card, even with free software that they can hack on, participate in the development of, get/pay others to modify to their liking, develop plugins/extensions on top of to their liking, so on. It's a desire to find social alignment in a period of flux more than anything else. You'll witness most "angry switchers" returning to the environment they're used to shortly.

Ric_NYC
February 14th, 2010, 01:08 AM
No, just like there was no "KDE exodus" over the controversial transition to KDE 4. People who preferred KDE for what made it KDE kept using it in the long run, despite the occasional mishaps here and there, which they tolerated. Similarly, since GNOME 3.x will retain the values and overall approach to user experience that made GNOME 2.x what it is, it will retain its current users too, for the most part.

As I said recently elsewhere (http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=8812109&postcount=980), if you're dissatisfied with GNOME Shell for whatever reason, and don't want to help shape it into something you'll be satisfied with for whatever reason, you still don't have to switch to anything. Metacity and GNOME Panel will likely be maintained for years, and you'll be able to use the rest of GNOME 3.x with them.

But I guess many people enjoy playing the "switching" card, even with free software that they can hack on, participate in the development of, get/pay others to modify to their liking, develop plugins/extensions on top of to their liking, so on. It's a desire to find social alignment in a period of flux more than anything. You'll witness most "angry switchers" returning to the environment they're used to shortly.


I disagree. There was an "exodus". Many users switched to Gnome.

XubuRoxMySox
February 14th, 2010, 01:08 AM
:oops: Sorry for the misspelled LOSE. English is not my first language, so I guess I get a free pass :)

YOU get a free pass! But it's such a common mistake among people who should know better, I thought I'd nitpick this time, lol.

-Robin

lovinglinux
February 14th, 2010, 01:11 AM
I just realized I shouldn't have created this thread, since it is just another Gnome Shell/DE-Switch discussion. Instead, I should have focused on the new KDE 4.4 and should have included a poll asking what people think about it.

I'm going to ask a moderator to lock this up...or should I say lock it down?

23meg
February 14th, 2010, 01:13 AM
I disagree. There was an "exodus". Many users switched to Gnome.

And then shortly switched back to KDE, when 4.x became "usable" according to their criteria once again, which is my point.

It's hard to establish exactly what number or percentage of people stopped using KDE, so we can speculate all day whether or not there was an "exodus". But the overall popularity of KDE doesn't seem to have suffered with existing KDE users.

handy
February 14th, 2010, 01:24 AM
I downloaded & installed the http://www.phoronix-test-suite.com/, yesterday.

I ran it this morning, even though Firefox was running with 13 tabs open, 2 torrents were happening with Transmission, Worker was open, & there were 4 tabs going in Sakura; one of them being htop. The machine had been running for 50 hours plus, & there is still a memory leak in Ghostery, so I had a little more than half of the 1GB of RAM available. Both CPUs were just about idling before the tests though.

Here are the results on the Phoronix website (I should have named the test differently :oops: :

http://global.phoronix-test-suite.com/index.php?k=profile&u=anon-15774-26987-2834

The first 3 games running at an average of around 30 fps, really presented incredibly well. I was surprised at the speed of game-play & the quality of the 3D.

The last one, Nexuiz, ran too slow to be playable, looked good, though there were display aberrations flashing on the screen from time to time.

My glxgears is currently a little over 1600 fps.

Hardware is a 2007 model, alu' 24" iMac, technical spec's can be found here:

http://support.apple.com/kb/SP16

The only change to the above spec's is that I upgraded the 320GB drive to a 1.5TB WD Green, with 32MB cache.

All of the related Radeon open-source packages are .git 20100129 & kernel26-git 20100117-1, on Arch 64bit, this is a kernel26.2.6.33. version (Phoronix mistook it for .32?)

handy
February 14th, 2010, 01:29 AM
Sorry, wrong thread. :oops:

sertse
February 14th, 2010, 01:30 AM
No, just like there was no "KDE exodus" over the controversial transition to KDE 4. People who preferred KDE for what made it KDE kept using it in the long run, despite the occasional mishaps here and there, which they tolerated. Similarly, since GNOME 3.x will retain the values and overall approach to user experience that made GNOME 2.x what it is, it will retain its current users too, for the most part.


The main difference is that there is no similiar alternative to KDE, you're forced to adapt for go to completely quite different.

For Gnome however, there is Xfce which is similiar enough to "old Gnome" in many ways. The shock from switching is no where as great. Heck, Xubuntu even (visually) make itself look similiar Ubuntu, with the dual panels, "Application, Places" menus etc to drive home the point.

That said, questions of Gnome's downfall are greatly over exaggerated. It too shall pass...

durand
February 14th, 2010, 01:36 AM
I'm really not sure what I'd do. The only reason why I wouldn't want to use gnome shell is because I'd miss compiz effects. I use expo, scale, cube and fire a lot and I don't really want to lose them. I can't see myself switching to KDE4 as it doesn't integrate well with compiz either, same goes for xubuntu. I also use openbox with gentoo but that's hardly an alternative to gnome+compiz...

cariboo
February 14th, 2010, 01:38 AM
The op requested we close this thread.

overdrank
February 14th, 2010, 01:38 AM
Closed at request of the op.