Can a real noob learn by doing with chance for free computer?

[Chris Edgell]

Some of you may know how much of a beginner and plus how dense I can be while trying to grasp the concepts.

You may remember that I was given this computer by a friend a few months ago...now he has offered me another one if I want to play with it. THIS one he set up for me with Jaunty. (He's a computer expert and he has gotten quite a few 5-year-old Dells from a school that lost its funding.)

He asked if I want it wiped clean or as is with some kind of MS, or even installed with Jaunty or now even Karmic.

My inclination is to get it as is and navigate through any steps to get it in working order and ultimately with the next best LTS. (Will that be 10.4 ?)

I would appreciate the benefit of your knowledge and experience before jumping off, so what's your opinion?

[raymondh]

Some of you may know how much of a beginner and plus how dense I can be while trying to grasp the concepts.

You may remember that I was given this computer by a friend a few months ago...now he has offered me another one if I want to play with it. THIS one he set up for me with Jaunty. (He's a computer expert and he has gotten quite a few 5-year-old Dells from a school that lost its funding.)

He asked if I want it wiped clean or as is with some kind of MS, or even installed with Jaunty or now even Karmic.

My inclination is to get it as is and navigate through any steps to get it in working order and ultimately with the next best LTS. (Will that be 10.4 ?)

I would appreciate the benefit of your knowledge and experience before jumping off, so what's your opinion?

Get it as is .... get under the hood by doing/experimenting partitioning, installation, termial, etc. on your own .... have fun doing so (as it is a spare computer, anyways)

happy ubuntu-ing.

Raymond

[staf0048]

Get it as is .... get under the hood by doing/experimenting partitioning, installation, termial, etc. on your own .... have fun doing so (as it is a spare computer, anyways)

happy ubuntu-ing.

Raymond

Agreed. If you already have a production computer you're happy with and your getting this one for free, take it as is and giver 'er 'ell!!! You'll learn so much more by diving in yourself, possibly/probably/hopefully screwing it up, and then fixing it.

I'm so jealous....

[bodhi.zazen]

Some of you may know how much of a beginner and plus how dense I can be while trying to grasp the concepts.

You may remember that I was given this computer by a friend a few months ago...now he has offered me another one if I want to play with it. THIS one he set up for me with Jaunty. (He's a computer expert and he has gotten quite a few 5-year-old Dells from a school that lost its funding.)

He asked if I want it wiped clean or as is with some kind of MS, or even installed with Jaunty or now even Karmic.

My inclination is to get it as is and navigate through any steps to get it in working order and ultimately with the next best LTS. (Will that be 10.4 ?)

I would appreciate the benefit of your knowledge and experience before jumping off, so what's your opinion?

Take it either with Windows (if you use windows), those liscences do not come free, or wiped clean (if you are paranoid). It is not *that* hare to partition and install an OS and that is the only way for you to play and learn for yourself.

Of course, Ubuntu is Open Source, which means if you break it you get to keep both pieces.

[Ghost|BTFH]

Definitely take it as-is...you should learn the step-by-step needed to set up your own computer anyhow with Ubuntu.

However, what I would suggest is that after you have done so, also set up the new computer with everything exactly how you'd like it - all the software, everything.

Basically, live on that computer until it is EXACTLY how you like it.

After that, decide which of your now TWO perfectly good computers you'd like to use for experimenting on.

Whichever one you decide, you now have the experience and confidence of adding and removing software on your own. From there, the sky's the limit. Curious about something? Try it out on your test box first.

Eventually though, if you could, I'd swipe the ram from the one and put it in the other to double your RAM and have more fun with your "keeper."

:D

Cheers,
Ghost|BTFH

[Chris Edgell]

Thanks for all these responses.

Could you elaborate on that about the RAM, how does that look, how does that work? Is it hardware or what?

Not that I'd expect it, but what if there were viruses or firewalls? How would that go? Would a wipe remove everything regardless?

[JKyleOKC]

I finally got here to add my opinion -- and I'm solidly with the majority. You'll have a machine that simply won't matter if you break it, and that should remove lots of the trepidation you feel about making changes.

As far as viruses and firewalls are concerned, they won't make a bit of difference once you install Ubuntu. The installation program will ask you whether you want to use the whole disk, or just the largest block of free space. Selecting "whole disk" will wipe everything off first, while "largest block" will preserve whatever system is already there, clear off some space, and install in that cleared space. To me, the best learning procedure would be to first try it with "largest block" (just to see how it does it) and then after playing with it for a while, re-install using "whole disk" (to have the maximum room in which to experiment).

I'd also recommend that you NOT try Karmic right now; it's had quite a bit of change from Jaunty and even more from Hardy, so what you would see would be quite different on it. I'm seeing lots of posts about problems with it, on the forums here.

For the first time around, at least, I'd use the same version that your present system has (which as I recall is Hardy LTS, the same as I'm using here on all but one system that runs Jaunty). Doing this will make what you learn on the "sacrificial" box apply to your "good" one also!

[Chris Edgell]

Up until three months ago I WAS running Hardy, but with this computer, I have Jaunty. I can see that it would be good to have the same on both (I'd wished I COULD have kept Hardy because of the LTS, but my friend had put in the Jaunty for some reason).

Shall I be checking out the size of the space, or because it's 5 years old will I assume I should be using XUbuntu? Will the first step be seeing if I can burn a live CD of XUbuntu -- Jaunty?

[Miljet]

See my reply in your other thread.

[mikewhatever]

Up until three months ago I WAS running Hardy, but with this computer, I have Jaunty. I can see that it would be good to have the same on both (I'd wished I COULD have kept Hardy because of the LTS, but my friend had put in the Jaunty for some reason).

Shall I be checking out the size of the space, or because it's 5 years old will I assume I should be using XUbuntu? Will the first step be seeing if I can burn a live CD of XUbuntu -- Jaunty?

I don't know nor remember anything about you, sorry about that. ;) With that very important question settled, I think forcing yourself to use Hardy is meaningless, if you already have Jaunty installed and working well. It's a different story if Jaunty gives you problems, but otherwise, there is no benefit of having 'the same on both'.

[Chris Edgell]

I didn't say too clearly. The one I have now is Jaunty, I wouldn't want to install Hardy on the one I'll be getting just because I once liked it. Jaunty is working for me and working well, so I'll accept the advice of people I trust and put the same on both machines...it makes good sense to me too.

Thank you for your comments.

[Ghost|BTFH]

RAM is definitely a hardware thing. What I could do for you is, when you get your other system, before hooking it up and turning it on and all that - open the case and take a photo of what's inside and send it to me.

I'll point out where the RAM is located and tell you how to remove it IF we find out it's the same as what you have in your other computer.

As for the one person's suggestion on sticking with Hardy - pish tosh. I know you're using Jaunty, just go ahead and get Karmic, it works just fine and I doubt you'll note much difference between Jaunty xubuntu and Karmic xubuntu except maybe that everything works a little smoother. ;)

Cheers,
Ghost|BTFH

[sailthesea]

I don't know nor remember anything about you, sorry about that. ;) With that very important question settled, I think forcing yourself to use Hardy is meaningless, if you already have Jaunty installed and working well. It's a different story if Jaunty gives you problems, but otherwise, there is no benefit of having 'the same on both'.

If you have an "oldish" Dell running Jaunty stick with it and learn.
Hardy made my REALLY old Latitude jump out of its skin and Jaunty has been great on it although it gets a bit hot
As said if it aint great find something a bit more suited

[JKyleOKC]

I'd say your first experiment should be burning a Live CD of Jaunty (or Karmic, which might work just fine for you) but I'd stay with Ubuntu rather than going to Xubuntu. I use Xubuntu here because my first installations were on ancient equipment, nothing newer than the 1990s, and my past experiences with Gnome and KDE on such old gear were not good (although I did manage to make Linux work after lots of experimenting). I got used to the Xubuntu look and feel, and have stuck with it. It's quite a bit different from Ubuntu, which uses Gnome, in appearance and commands so having it on one machine and Ubuntu on the other could be a bit confusing.

RAM can be quite confusing. My four active boxes here use three different kinds of RAM; only the two ancient ones use the same kind (PC-133) while the one my son gave me last year uses DDR and the one I bought in November to replace the 1995 unit that gave up the ghost uses DDR2. The different kinds aren't interchangeable. The reason for so many different kinds is that RAM technology keeps advancing; even the PC-133 sticks are a vast improvement over the original DIMMs of the early 90s or their predecessors, the huge memory boards.

When you go to burn the Live CD, be careful to have the burner program do an "image" burn rather than a "data" burn. Otherwise the disc will not be bootable. This is possibly the most common first-time error when one begins to deal with CD burning!

[Chris Edgell]

Let me state clearly: I have one 5 year old computer and here's what I found out at some time.

Kernal Linux 2.6.28-17-generic GNOME 2.26.1
Memory: 495.9 MiB
Processor: Intel(R) Pentium(R) 4 CPU 2.00 GHz
Avail. disk space 14.0 GiB

It is my understanding that the machines my friend has are all alike as they were set up by one man for one school. (If not, I'll say so). But when he set this one up, he chose XUbuntu - Jaunty. That decision was based on his knowledge about the age and size. So THIS IS what I have now and that's what I'm thinking I should plan to put in the "new" one, so that I can try something on one (the test machine) and if it works, dare to put it on, what shall I call it, the "regular" machine. If you think otherwise, convince me.

Oh, can I still download Jaunty to a live CD? Are all versions still available?

[presence1960]

Get it as is .... get under the hood by doing/experimenting partitioning, installation, termial, etc. on your own .... have fun doing so (as it is a spare computer, anyways)

happy ubuntu-ing.

Raymond

The best way to learn & gain experience/knowledge is to roll up your sleeves and jump in there especially since you have another working machine. So what if you mess up on the second one- you have the other working machine & you can go there and request help on here from that machine.

Seriously though the best learning comes when you break something and have to get help with it. If you are observant & inquisitive you will not only learn the fix for the problem but also why it broke in the first place.

I say go for it as it will only make you more computer savvy.

[raymondh]

Oh, can I still download Jaunty to a live CD? Are all versions still available?

http://releases.ubuntu.com/9.04/

Aside from learning your new system/os .... you can/will also develop a good, strong google-fu ;)

Regards,

Raymond

[Chris Edgell]

Oh, Raymond,

I just went and looked at that link.

I don't see one that says: Jaunty 9.04 XUbuntu 32 bit, do you?

[presence1960]

Oh, Raymond,

I just went and looked at that link.

I don't see one that says: Jaunty 9.04 XUbuntu 32 bit, do you?

http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/xubuntu/releases/9.04/release/

Download PC (Intel x86)

[Chris Edgell]

Ah, thank you Presence1960,

I plan to be doing this step come Monday Jan 11th.

[raymondh]

Oh, Raymond,

I just went and looked at that link.

I don't see one that says: Jaunty 9.04 XUbuntu 32 bit, do you?

Chris .... I apologize .... had xubuntu, kubuntu, edbuntu, mythbuntu and Masonux (for older systems) bookmarked, since you had asked for 'other versions', but just copy/pasted the regular ubuntu to my post. My bad.

Thanks presence1960 :)

Raymond

[Chris Edgell]

I'm going out today and pick up a cheap monitor, also some burnable CDs. I read somewhere to download a distro it's better to use the cheap ones, is that true?)

I also read I should download with torrent, which I know nothing about. I'm hoping someone will tell me about it or at least point me in the right direction for when I get back.

Oh someone told me I should install Ubuntu instead of XUbuntu but I'm thinking I'd rather put in just the same as I have on this one.
......................

But truly I'm in no hurry so I'll take my time and find out what I need to know as I go along. I'm loving all the support I feel. As Tiny Tim (...no, the one in A Christmas Carol...lol) has said, "God bless us, every one."

[JKyleOKC]

I use CD-RW discs; the RW means ReWritable. They can be re-used and there's no significant cost difference. I also don't worry about brand names; it's my belief that most of them come from the same few factories anyway! Be sure, though, to check the capacity of the discs. Some hold only 650 MB and most distributions need the 700-MB size. Avoid "audio" discs, which may work but are priced a bit higher and are supposedly optimized for audio recording rather than data.

Keep warm! I hear that your area is even colder than OKC, and our high here today is forecast as 18 degrees!

[staf0048]

Oh someone told me I should install Ubuntu instead of XUbuntu but I'm thinking I'd rather put in just the same as I have on this one.

If you feel more comfortable using Xubuntu for now, I say stick with it. It's really all just your preference. I think the main Ubuntu distro would work ok from what I remember of your computer's specs, possibly a little tight on hard drive space, but that's only if you start saving a bunch of files or adding a lot of programs to it. IMO, if you're going to use this as a "learning" computer, go at your own pace, venture beyond your comfort zone when and where you want.

[Exodist]

Some of you may know how much of a beginner and plus how dense I can be while trying to grasp the concepts.

You may remember that I was given this computer by a friend a few months ago...now he has offered me another one if I want to play with it. THIS one he set up for me with Jaunty. (He's a computer expert and he has gotten quite a few 5-year-old Dells from a school that lost its funding.)

He asked if I want it wiped clean or as is with some kind of MS, or even installed with Jaunty or now even Karmic.

My inclination is to get it as is and navigate through any steps to get it in working order and ultimately with the next best LTS. (Will that be 10.4 ?)

I would appreciate the benefit of your knowledge and experience before jumping off, so what's your opinion?
Hey Chris,
If he is offering you a free PC, Take it.. :)
As far as the OS is concerned, I would defently go with Xubuntu Karmic on it and then Lucid Lynx. Now as far as OS, a 5 year old PC cant be that slow. In all regards my PC is basicly a 5 year old mix of new and old.

First thing I would do it just take it as is carry it home and clean it, inside and out with pressured air. Make sure the power supple is dust free, the cpu heatsink/fan is dust free. Make it look brand new. Even slap the outside of it with glass cleaner.

Second thing is why you have it open see if you have a video card slot, either an older AGP slot or a newer PCI express slot. Just incase the on board video is crap-o-la. If you wish to put a nvidia in the PC, a low end nvidia can be very cheap and run cooler then the top end models. Also check to see what type of RAM you have in the system, possibly what the manufacture of those sticks are and how many more open slots you have. Just in case down the road you wish to upgrade.

Third thing, while you have the cover off and it opened up. I am pretty sure since its a dell its got a Intel CPU, they are not bad but the factory heat paste is CRAP! Have your friend pickup some new thermal paste and help you put some new between the heatsink and CPU. This will insure it last another 5 years more with you and prevent premature CPU failure.

Forth thing would be to boot up on a live Xubuntu CD and see what hardware you have. Ifs its pretty decent hardware, like at least a dual core and such with at least 2GB of RAM. Your in business. I would still stick with XFCE since your already familiar with it by now. If it runs really good you may be able to get Win7 for dual booting down the road if you have some software that you need that doesnt run on Linux.


Hope this helps...
Cheers,
Exo

[Chris Edgell]

Whoa...I'm flyin' off this galloping horse... No really, I loved your post, Exo.

Let me hear your opinion of this view of the matter. I wonder if you noticed when Bodhi.zazen said maybe not wipe it because it has Windows on it and as Bodhi said, why throw it out if you got it free.(my paraphrase)

Can I go about it in a different order. Can I NOT open it up, get a Jaunty in there. Analyze it from that point and then when I've learned a little more...then open it up and do the great job you recommend.

I don't want to put the cart before the horse, but it would slow that horse-y down. lol

This clean start sounds great but...

Let me get a second opinion about the necessity of all this learning and work right away...Can it be postponed, or will I just be procrastinating and not do it ever...does it have to be done...will I EVER go top shelf...??? I'm sure it's a truly professional approach, let me think. Actually, I'M the one on high-speed, you are the one saying, "Lets go step by step and do this right." Let me see if I can slow down?

BTW I just got back from my trip looking for a $10 monitor and have come home with a $71.02 purchase. I jumped out there and took a chance on this, 19" FLAT SCREEN.....ta da.....and it works great. It's a ViewSonic, which I'd barely heard of...but it's great. I was so scared!!! I had been wondering how my living quarters would look like with TWO humongous monitors. I'm so elated.


Cheers
Christine

[phillw]

Of course, Ubuntu is Open Source, which means if you break it you get to keep both pieces.

I gotta remember that one !!!

Phill.

[phillw]

As mentioned, take your time - don't keep anything important on it. Go break it a few times. At 5 year old it should take Ubuntu okay, but, if you're happier in xfce, stay with it.

Do bear in mind that some of the drivers for Dells' can be a bit troublesome - so, use the LiveCD in 'try before you buy' mode & make sure the video output is ok. There is a dell area on the forums --> http://ubuntuforums.org/forumdisplay.php?f=342 which will be handy if you have graphics / sound / networking problems - they'll point you to where to get them. Dell are one of the 'better' ones, in so far as they do actually make the drivers available !!

Get your teeth into it enjoy yourself. Give it 12 months and you'll have both of them chatting to each other and making your breakfast for you !!

Regards,

Phill.

[vinnywright]

Let me state clearly: I have one 5 year old computer and here's what I found out at some time.

Kernal Linux 2.6.28-17-generic GNOME 2.26.1
Memory: 495.9 MiB
Processor: Intel(R) Pentium(R) 4 CPU 2.00 GHz
Avail. disk space 14.0 GiB

It is my understanding that the machines my friend has are all alike as they were set up by one man for one school. (If not, I'll say so). But when he set this one up, he chose XUbuntu - Jaunty. That decision was based on his knowledge about the age and size. So THIS IS what I have now and that's what I'm thinking I should plan to put in the "new" one, so that I can try something on one (the test machine) and if it works, dare to put it on, what shall I call it, the "regular" machine. If you think otherwise, convince me.

Oh, can I still download Jaunty to a live CD? Are all versions still available?

I totaley agrey with you.................. try somthing new on the new box get the Karmic 9.10 Xubuntu for it....it should run great.

if you'r liking the 9.04 ver youll love the 9.10 I just net upgraded my lappy runing 9.04 to 9.10 last night and it look's good

but have the 9.04 cd standing by incase you dont like it .........LOL

acualey you mite want to try the strate Ubuntu or Kubuntu .......I have that on a 700MHz CPU 383RAM box and thay do well.......:D

VINNY

[JKyleOKC]

Let me get a second opinion about the necessity of all this learning and work right away...Can it be postponed, or will I just be procrastinating and not do it ever...does it have to be done...will I EVER go top shelf...???

BTW I just got back from my trip looking for a $10 monitor and have come home with a $71.02 purchase. I jumped out there and took a chance on this, 19" FLAT SCREEN.....ta da.....and it works great. It's a ViewSonic, which I'd barely heard of...but it's great.I don't see any need for you to open the box up right away. While I've rebuilt most of my systems several times, and eventually you may want to be able to do that too, it's not at all necessary to be a hardware expert to learn the software side of your systems.

If (or when) you do decide to open up the case and see what's inside, the offer someone made several pages back -- to mark up a picture to let you know what is what -- is a great way to start. Be careful about touching anything on the inside. It's possible to actually destroy chips by static electricity that's not enough for you to even feel a tingle. Back in 1981 I did just that to not one but two TRS-80 Model 3 systems, and that was just by using them! I learned to spray Downy fabric softener on the carpet of my office after that... Modern systems aren't quite as sensitive, but careful handling is still essential.

EDIT: To find out what's in your system without opening the box, go to the Terminal application after you install Jaunty, and type "sudo lshw" which will give you a very long list showing full details about all your hardware. Most of it will not be very meaningful to you initially but it will help if you go shopping for additional memory, and so on. To save the list to a file, make the command "sudo lshw >hw_list.txt" and you'll find the file "hw_list.txt" in your home directory...

Viewsonic is a great brand. I've got a 19-inch one on my wife's machine. It's not widely known outside the industry, but they made great CRT monitors back in the early 90s. You shouldn't have any problems with it.

[Chris Edgell]

Thanks

I've made a screenshot of the output of sudo lshw >hw_list.txt
for the machine I'm using now...what can you tell me about THIS list.

I appreciate your time and attention, all of you.

[JKyleOKC]

It looks as if "lshw" might be a bit different in Jaunty, Your screenshot indicates that the program didn't recognize what you wanted it to do, and gave you a list of valid options!

I'll try it on my Jaunty box and get back to the thread with a command for you that works. Meanwhile if you can find a file in your home directory named "hw_list.txt" you might attach it to the thread... However I suspect that since lshw gave you the help display, it didn't create the file.

[raymondh]

Ms. Christine,

I am on jaunty and this is my


sudo lshw

Looks like man pages, your attachment.

Regards,

Raymond

[JKyleOKC]

I'm posting from Jaunty now and get results similar to those of raymondh. To get the options list that you got, I had to enter "sudo lshw --help" so I'm not at all certain why you don't get the list of hardware. Try "sudo lshw -short" to see if you get a very short list of hardware items. It won't tell you all you need to know about each item but will verify that the "lshw" program is working properly for you. If it is, try with some of the other options shown in your original attachment.

The ">" character in the command I originally suggested redirects output from the screen to the file named immediately following. If the file doesn't exist, it is created; if it does exist, all content is wiped out and replaced with the new output. Little or nothing should show on the screen when you use this "redirection" feature.

[Chris Edgell]

Let me show you my lshw output:
chris@computer:~$ sudo lshw
[sudo] password for chris:
computer
description: Desktop Computer
product: OptiPlex GX260
vendor: Dell Computer Corporation
serial: 9LHWX11
width: 32 bits
capabilities: smbios-2.3 dmi-2.3 smp-1.4 smp
configuration: administrator_password=enabled boot=normal chassis=desktop cpus=1 power-on_password=enabled uuid=44454C4C-4C00-1048-8057-B9C04F583131
*-core
description: Motherboard
vendor: Dell Computer Corp.
physical id: 0
serial: .. .
slot: PCI1
*-firmware
description: BIOS
vendor: Dell Computer Corporation
physical id: 0
version: A09 (11/01/2004)
size: 64KiB
capacity: 448KiB
capabilities: isa pci pnp apm upgrade shadowing escd cdboot bootselect edd int13floppytoshiba int5printscreen int9keyboard int14serial int17printer acpi usb agp ls120boot biosbootspecification netboot
*-cpu
description: CPU
product: Intel(R) Pentium(R) 4 CPU 2.00GHz
vendor: Intel Corp.
physical id: 400
bus info: cpu@0
version: 15.2.4
slot: Microprocessor
size: 2GHz
capacity: 3060MHz
width: 32 bits
clock: 400MHz
capabilities: boot fpu fpu_exception wp vme de pse tsc msr pae mce cx8 apic sep mtrr pge mca cmov pat pse36 clflush dts acpi mmx fxsr sse sse2 ss ht tm up pebs bts
configuration: id=0
*-cache:0
description: L1 cache
physical id: 700
size: 8KiB
capacity: 16KiB
capabilities: internal write-back data
*-cache:1
description: L2 cache
physical id: 701
size: 512KiB
capacity: 512KiB
capabilities: internal varies unified
*-memory
description: System Memory
physical id: 1000
slot: System board or motherboard
size: 512MiB
capacity: 1GiB
*-bank:0
description: DIMM SDRAM Synchronous 266 MHz (3.8 ns)
physical id: 0
slot: DIMM_A
size: 256MiB
width: 64 bits
clock: 266MHz (3.8ns)
*-bank:1
description: DIMM SDRAM Synchronous 266 MHz (3.8 ns)
physical id: 1
slot: DIMM_B
size: 256MiB
width: 64 bits
clock: 266MHz (3.8ns)
*-pci
description: Host bridge
product: 82845G/GL[Brookdale-G]/GE/PE DRAM Controller/Host-Hub Interface
vendor: Intel Corporation
physical id: 100
bus info: pci@0000:00:00.0
version: 01
width: 32 bits
clock: 33MHz
configuration: driver=agpgart-intel module=intel_agp
*-display UNCLAIMED
description: VGA compatible controller
product: 82845G/GL[Brookdale-G]/GE Chipset Integrated Graphics Device
vendor: Intel Corporation
physical id: 2
bus info: pci@0000:00:02.0
version: 01
width: 32 bits
clock: 33MHz
capabilities: pm bus_master cap_list
configuration: latency=0
*-usb:0
description: USB Controller
product: 82801DB/DBL/DBM (ICH4/ICH4-L/ICH4-M) USB UHCI Controller #1
vendor: Intel Corporation
physical id: 1d
bus info: pci@0000:00:1d.0
version: 01
width: 32 bits
clock: 33MHz
capabilities: bus_master
configuration: driver=uhci_hcd latency=0 module=uhci_hcd
*-usb:1
description: USB Controller
product: 82801DB/DBL/DBM (ICH4/ICH4-L/ICH4-M) USB UHCI Controller #2
vendor: Intel Corporation
physical id: 1d.1
bus info: pci@0000:00:1d.1
version: 01
width: 32 bits
clock: 33MHz
capabilities: bus_master
configuration: driver=uhci_hcd latency=0 module=uhci_hcd
*-usb:2
description: USB Controller
product: 82801DB/DBL/DBM (ICH4/ICH4-L/ICH4-M) USB UHCI Controller #3
vendor: Intel Corporation
physical id: 1d.2
bus info: pci@0000:00:1d.2
version: 01
width: 32 bits
clock: 33MHz
capabilities: bus_master
configuration: driver=uhci_hcd latency=0 module=uhci_hcd
*-usb:3
description: USB Controller
product: 82801DB/DBM (ICH4/ICH4-M) USB2 EHCI Controller
vendor: Intel Corporation
physical id: 1d.7
bus info: pci@0000:00:1d.7
version: 01
width: 32 bits
clock: 33MHz
capabilities: pm debug bus_master cap_list
configuration: driver=ehci_hcd latency=0 module=ehci_hcd
*-pci
description: PCI bridge
product: 82801 PCI Bridge
vendor: Intel Corporation
physical id: 1e
bus info: pci@0000:00:1e.0
version: 81
width: 32 bits
clock: 33MHz
capabilities: pci bus_master
*-network
description: Ethernet interface
product: 82540EM Gigabit Ethernet Controller
vendor: Intel Corporation
physical id: c
bus info: pci@0000:01:0c.0
logical name: eth0
version: 02
serial: 00:08:74:2e:21:5b
size: 100MB/s
capacity: 1GB/s
width: 32 bits
clock: 66MHz
capabilities: pm pcix msi bus_master cap_list ethernet physical tp 10bt 10bt-fd 100bt 100bt-fd 1000bt-fd autonegotiation
configuration: autonegotiation=on broadcast=yes driver=e1000 driverversion=7.3.21-k3-NAPI duplex=full firmware=N/A ip=192.168.1.64 latency=64 link=yes mingnt=255 module=e1000 multicast=yes port=twisted pair speed=100MB/s
*-isa
description: ISA bridge
product: 82801DB/DBL (ICH4/ICH4-L) LPC Interface Bridge
vendor: Intel Corporation
physical id: 1f
bus info: pci@0000:00:1f.0
version: 01
width: 32 bits
clock: 33MHz
capabilities: isa bus_master
configuration: latency=0
*-ide
description: IDE interface
product: 82801DB (ICH4) IDE Controller
vendor: Intel Corporation
physical id: 1f.1
bus info: pci@0000:00:1f.1
logical name: scsi0
logical name: scsi1
version: 01
width: 32 bits
clock: 33MHz
capabilities: ide bus_master emulated
configuration: driver=ata_piix latency=0
*-disk
description: ATA Disk
product: ST320011A
vendor: Seagate
physical id: 0
bus info: scsi@0:0.0.0
logical name: /dev/sda
version: 3.75
serial: 3HT5FW5K
size: 18GiB (20GB)
capabilities: partitioned partitioned:dos
configuration: ansiversion=5 signature=bb27bb27
*-volume:0
description: EXT3 volume
vendor: Linux
physical id: 1
bus info: scsi@0:0.0.0,1
logical name: /dev/sda1
logical name: /
version: 1.0
serial: 563245ef-637c-4187-a4ab-ebbccd05f79f
size: 17GiB
capacity: 17GiB
capabilities: primary bootable journaled extended_attributes large_files recover ext3 ext2 initialized
configuration: created=2009-10-06 18:11:34 filesystem=ext3 modified=2010-01-10 07:00:34 mount.fstype=ext3 mount.options=rw,relatime,errors=remount-ro,data=ordered mounted=2010-01-10 07:00:34 state=mounted
*-volume:1
description: Extended partition
physical id: 2
bus info: scsi@0:0.0.0,2
logical name: /dev/sda2
size: 713MiB
capacity: 713MiB
capabilities: primary extended partitioned partitioned:extended
*-logicalvolume
description: Linux swap / Solaris partition
physical id: 5
logical name: /dev/sda5
capacity: 713MiB
capabilities: nofs
*-cdrom
description: DVD-RAM writer
product: TF-DVDRW TSH652D
vendor: MAD DOG
physical id: 1
bus info: scsi@1:0.0.0
logical name: /dev/cdrom
logical name: /dev/cdrw
logical name: /dev/scd0
logical name: /dev/sr0
version: MD00
capabilities: removable audio cd-r cd-rw dvd dvd-r dvd-ram
configuration: ansiversion=5 status=nodisc
*-serial UNCLAIMED
description: SMBus
product: 82801DB/DBL/DBM (ICH4/ICH4-L/ICH4-M) SMBus Controller
vendor: Intel Corporation
physical id: 1f.3
bus info: pci@0000:00:1f.3
version: 01
width: 32 bits
clock: 33MHz
configuration: latency=0
*-multimedia
description: Multimedia audio controller
product: 82801DB/DBL/DBM (ICH4/ICH4-L/ICH4-M) AC'97 Audio Controller
vendor: Intel Corporation
physical id: 1f.5
bus info: pci@0000:00:1f.5
version: 01
width: 32 bits
clock: 33MHz
capabilities: pm bus_master cap_list
configuration: driver=Intel ICH latency=0 module=snd_intel8x0
*-network DISABLED
description: Ethernet interface
physical id: 1
logical name: pan0
serial: 76:58:a6:13:eb:b0
capabilities: ethernet physical
configuration: broadcast=yes driver=bridge driverversion=2.3 firmware=N/A link=yes multicast=yes
chris@computer:~$

[bodhi.zazen]

FYI you can use the -html (or other flag) to output the information in an page (file) nicly formatted in html.

You then view the page with firefox (or any browser).


lshw -html

There is also an option -sanitize to remove potential sensitive info if you wish to post the results and -short if well a short output is sufficient.

[Chris Edgell]

I didn't intend to have the print be blue, I'd used blue before and it must have remembered the code or I triggered it somehow.

Anyway, I DO like reading this long printout in the scroll form. Now, Jim, I have gotten the -short that you spoke of. Here's that:

chris@computer:~$ sudo lshw -short
[sudo] password for chris:
H/W path Device Class Description
================================================== ====
system OptiPlex GX260
/0 bus Motherboard
/0/0 memory 64KiB BIOS
/0/400 processor Intel(R) Pentium(R) 4 CPU 2.00GHz
/0/400/700 memory 8KiB L1 cache
/0/400/701 memory 512KiB L2 cache
/0/1000 memory 512MiB System Memory
/0/1000/0 memory 256MiB DIMM SDRAM Synchronous 266 MHz
/0/1000/1 memory 256MiB DIMM SDRAM Synchronous 266 MHz
/0/100 bridge 82845G/GL[Brookdale-G]/GE/PE DRAM Con
/0/100/2 display 82845G/GL[Brookdale-G]/GE Chipset Int
/0/100/1d bus 82801DB/DBL/DBM (ICH4/ICH4-L/ICH4-M)
/0/100/1d.1 bus 82801DB/DBL/DBM (ICH4/ICH4-L/ICH4-M)
/0/100/1d.2 bus 82801DB/DBL/DBM (ICH4/ICH4-L/ICH4-M)
/0/100/1d.7 bus 82801DB/DBM (ICH4/ICH4-M) USB2 EHCI C
/0/100/1e bridge 82801 PCI Bridge
/0/100/1e/c eth0 network 82540EM Gigabit Ethernet Controller
/0/100/1f bridge 82801DB/DBL (ICH4/ICH4-L) LPC Interfa
/0/100/1f.1 scsi0 storage 82801DB (ICH4) IDE Controller
/0/100/1f.1/0 /dev/sda disk 20GB ST320011A
/0/100/1f.1/0/1 /dev/sda1 volume 17GiB EXT3 volume
/0/100/1f.1/0/2 /dev/sda2 volume 713MiB Extended partition
/0/100/1f.1/0/2/5 /dev/sda5 volume 713MiB Linux swap / Solaris partition
/0/100/1f.1/1 /dev/cdrom disk TF-DVDRW TSH652D
/0/100/1f.3 bus 82801DB/DBL/DBM (ICH4/ICH4-L/ICH4-M)
/0/100/1f.5 multimedia 82801DB/DBL/DBM (ICH4/ICH4-L/ICH4-M)
/1 pan0 network Ethernet interface
chris@computer:~$

[Chris Edgell]

Thank you Bodhi, and all, (I'm going to have to put you guys in my will. lol *Disclaimer -- guys is used here in the non-gender specific.)



FYI you can use the -html (or other flag) to output the information in an page (file) nicly formatted in html.

You then view the page with firefox (or any browser).


lshw -html If I put this code IN, how is it going to get to a file nicely formatted in html?

There is also an option -sanitize to remove potential sensitive info if you wish to post the results and -short if well a short output is sufficient.

To tell you the truth, I don't even know what IS sensitive.

[I feel like I'm asking you to read my tea leaves...it is nearly inscrutable to me...]

[JKyleOKC]

The definition of "sensitive" here depends on one's degree of paranoia; some folk think that publishing serial numbers of their hardware could expose them to identity theft. My own opinion is that nothing shown by lshw is "sensitive" so I don't bother with that option.

The tea leaves indicate that you have a system that will work nicely with Xubuntu, but might be considered borderline for the newest releases with only 512 MB of memory. They also show that your motherboard has only two memory slots, both occupied, so in order to add more memory you would have to replace both memory sticks with 512-MB ones to get a total of 1 GB. I don't think this is necessary at this point; my Jaunty box (a 2006 model) has only 447 MB of usable memory (it's diverting the rest for video) and while it's nowhere near as speedy as the newer systems it does nicely for browsing and experimenting.

If you're puzzled by the "MiB" and "GiB" abbreviations in some of the list, here's what they mean: In the metric system, kilo, mega, and giga prefixes indicate multipliers of 1,000, 1,000,000, and 1,000,000,000 respectively. However since the days of the IBM 360 mainframes, computer folk measure things in powers of two. They took kilo to indicate a multiplier of 1024 (2 to the 10th power), mega to mean 1024*1024 or 1,048,576, and giga to mean 1024*1024*1024 or 1,073,741,824.

Hard disk manufacturers stuck with the original metric meanings in rating storage capacity: a 10-GB drive can hold 10,000,000,000 bytes of data (unformatted, but that's another story) although most of us geeks expect it to hold 10,737,418,240 instead -- which is more than 700 million bytes more. As the numbers get bigger, so does the discrepancy!

To distinguish the two different interpretations, the "i" character was added to the abbreviations. Thus "GiB" is a "geek gigabyte" although many of us, myself included, omit the i in casual conversation... The lshw program is attempting to avoid any confusion; in a few instances, it reports size in both units just to be clear about its actual value.

[Chris Edgell]

So am I correct in assuming that each release has a full size AND a more streamlined size?

Ubuntu/Jaunty XUbuntu/Jaunty, and so on.

I liked your post a lot...reading my leaves.

You say: To distinguish the two different interpretations, the "i" character was added to the abbreviations. Thus "GiB" is a "geek gigabyte". So does that "i" actually indicate the smaller, really round number with zeroes, or the odder number with the 24, 240 etc? I'm thinking the odder with the i, is the odder GiB with the 24, 240 etc., and the more mod approach is the GB with the all zeroes. (IS this much ado about next to nothing, or is that the point, by the time you get to a GB there is a discrepancy of more than 700 million.)

[JKyleOKC]

Actually there are three major versions of each release, plus several other variants. The majors are Ubuntu (using the Gnome desktop), Kubuntu (using the KDE desktop), and Xubuntu (using XFCE). Xubuntu is a bit lighter than the other two so is better suited to older equipment, and I personally like the XFCE desktop much better than either Gnome or KDE (but it's a matter of personal preference in this regard; they're all good).

You're right that GiB is the bigger and odder number; the difference comes about because computers use the binary number system with base 2, while people think in the decimal system and base 10 (probably because we have ten fingers). 1024 is the closest power of two to a thousand, which is why we began using "kilo" as a prefix but for a multiplier of 1024 rather than 1000. I think the "i" comes from "binary" but am not certain of its origin by any means.

And it IS much ado about nothing, except for the fact that people are often upset because their "500-GB" drive can't actually store 500 GiB. If you look at your lshw listing, your 20-GB drive is only 18 GiB, and as the size increases, so does the discrepancy between the two values. The major point here is to take any info about sizes that's in "MB" or "GB" with a grain of salt, because it MAY really be in MiB/GiB or it may not!

[Chris Edgell]

I thank you for your clear explanations...for all of you and your help this far. I have lots to think about.

[Yavatar]

This is getting to be a year old and you may have discovered these items already, but for benefit of possible future readers...


If the systems have512mb, it is most likely they came with 2 - 256mb RAM chips. The school district probably just ordered a bunch of stock computers of which typically the manufacturer (Dell in this case) will go with the cheapest way for your configuration which 5 years was 2 - 256 ram chips instead of 1- 512 mb chip).

You probably have 3 slots at most for installing RAM chips, but likely only two. In that case, grabbing RAM from another system won't help any. If you pour out a half gallon of milk and then empty half a gallon from another milk container into the first container, you still only got one gallon of milk. Unless you got the Pentium math bug then its 3.99999 gallons (google pentium bug if you don't get it ;) ).

If you goto http://support.dell.com you can have the support site scan your Dell system for your 'support tag' and your current system configuration (hardware-wise).

It doesn't really matter home or small business option. It all still works the same. For this example I just picked home and possibly avoid some fluff they throw in for business.

It'll bring up a new page. On the LEFT there will be a column. Look for:

Product Support
Troubleshooting (http://support.dell.com/support/DPP/Index.aspx?c=us&cs=19&l=en&s=dhs&%7Eck=anavml)
Manuals (http://support.dell.com/support/topics/global.aspx/support/my_systems_info/manuals?c=us&cs=19&l=en&s=dhs&%7Eck=anavml)
System Configuration (http://support.dell.com/support/topics/global.aspx/support/my_systems_info/details?c=us&cs=19&l=en&s=dhs&%7Etab=2&%7Eck=anavml)

You want System Configuration. (Click on that)

If you just want to see how the system was built, enter the service tag by hand. It'll be a small 6 alphanumeric (letters and numbers) character tag most likely on the back of the system with a barcode. Not the serial # mind you. That's something different. The tag will be by itself. That will tell you what came with your system originally.

If you let it scan (search for your tag), and this works better with Internet Exploder, it will tell you also on a 2nd tab what your current system configuration is. It probably hasn't been modified if both systems are the same. I don't have a Dell system or tag in front of me, but it should say something about memory or RAM. Possibly 'DIMM'. It might not tell you the total RAM, but it will indicate how many RAM chips you have, like 2 - 256MB DIMM 133 or such. That 133 will be the speed of the chip in this example. There might be some other junk with it but you can ignore the rest.

Just plan on getting more info than you need to know when you want something basic, and when you want more detail it will give you less. ;)

Also, you might want to invest in a cheap 3D graphics card as you probably got on-board Intel video which shares with your main memory. If you are lucky there is an AGP slot (better) but likely you only have PCI slot (standard). It'll free up your main memory for your OS whether it be Win or Linux and help speed up your desktop and graphics.

Yav