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HappinessNow
December 2nd, 2009, 01:11 PM
Interesting article overall:


"There are risks with staying off the Cloud as well," he says. "For example, vendor lock-in is always an issue, because if you marry your application to one platform, you will find it more difficult and costly to move to another platform."

The economics of Cloud use are just too attractive for companies to overlook, Parann-Nissany says, and just like they are prepared to take risks off-line, they will be prepared to take risks online.

"It's not a matter of risk, but risk analysis - looking at the problems and the solutions," he says. "And that is where we in the security industry come in."http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?apage=1&cid=1259243047077&pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull

pwnst*r
December 2nd, 2009, 01:22 PM
again overall:

yay for companies, boo for personal use.

HappinessNow
December 2nd, 2009, 01:24 PM
again overall:

yay for companies, boo for personal use.right, the cloud will be most beneficial for businesses Not personal use, this is quite obvious.

Excedio
December 2nd, 2009, 01:34 PM
again overall:

yay for companies, boo for personal use.

Agreed. I have no problems with backing up to my external drive and bringing it to another machine for use. Also, to my knowledge... The company that I work for doesn't use Clouds for data share.

HappinessNow
December 2nd, 2009, 01:36 PM
Agreed. I have no problems with backing up to my external drive and bringing it to another machine for use. Also, to my knowledge... The company that I work for doesn't use Clouds for data share.clearly stated in the article linked:


Although Cloud use - i.e., the number of
companies that have moved their systems online - is still limited, Parann-Nissany agrees with Resnick and Catteddu that it will grow exponentially in the coming years, regardless of the security risks.
http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?apage=1&cid=1259243047077&pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull

pwnst*r
December 2nd, 2009, 01:38 PM
right, the cloud will be most beneficial for businesses Not personal use, this is quite obvious.

it's not obvious for most on this forum.

HappinessNow
December 2nd, 2009, 01:41 PM
it's not obvious for most on this forum.ahhh...you may be right, I stand corrected. :P

Excedio
December 2nd, 2009, 01:41 PM
it's not obvious for most on this forum.

True, there seem to be a good number of people using some cloud or another, or at least searching for one. Not to mention, Canonical obviously thinks it's a good idea. Hence Ubuntu One.

HappinessNow
December 2nd, 2009, 01:42 PM
True, there seem to be a good number of people using some cloud or another, or at least searching for one. Not to mention, Canonical obviously thinks it's a good idea. Hence Ubuntu One.Very Good Point! indeed.

t0p
December 2nd, 2009, 01:49 PM
I'm not a great fan of this "cloud" idea. The most cloudy thing I do at the moment is back-up some of my files to a Gmail inbox via the Gspace (https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/1593) Firefox add-on; but that's just extra back-up used for redundancy, I certainly wouldn't trust the "cloud" with anything really important.

Unfortunately, online computing is becoming more and more prevalent, what with things like Ubuntu One and Google's Chrome OS. People such as myself who insist on having stuff stored locally are going to become a shrinking minority. Then massive and widespread network failure will bring the world economy to its knees, and Doctor No will seize power. Or maybe Goldfinger. So long as he can refrain from explaining his scheme to James Bond before failing to kill the guy. Supervillains can be sooo stupid at times...

jwbrase
December 2nd, 2009, 02:12 PM
Only thing I do on the cloud is E-mail. And I hope to keep it that way.

Dragonbite
December 2nd, 2009, 03:34 PM
I like the cloud for some personal use but would much rather a merge of cloud and local.

With cloud computing I am able to, during lunch, breaks, etc., work on my own stuff (articles, plans, etc.) in Google Docs, use Calendar to keep track of what's going on and use Reader for much of my news (and of course Gmail).

When I am at home, though, I would prefer to use local apps, so I with there was better integration with the Docs and being able to open them locally in OpenOffice or the like. I would want to access it like a remote drive.

That way, a presentation would be better able to handle the projector than via a web browser connection.

For the most part, though, businesses will see the biggest benefit of cloud (and private cloud) computing.

PartisanEntity
December 3rd, 2009, 11:37 AM
"There are risks with staying off the Cloud as well," he says. "For example, vendor lock-in is always an issue, because if you marry your application to one platform, you will find it more difficult and costly to move to another platform."

Well vendor lock-in occurs on or off "the cloud".

The biggest aspect that is being ignored is control over your files.

If you upload your life (photos, emails, documents, videos, music, finances, etc..) to one "cloud vendor" then you have the following to deal with:

- what laws apply to your files?
- who owns your files?
- how secure are your files?
- what happens if the vendor goes belly-up?
- what happens if the vendor sells, markets, shares your files?
- government access to your files? (under terrorism and piracy pretexts)

By keeping your files and life on your local system, you do not eliminate these problems, but you greatly minimize them.

Why do I need a cloud if i have remote desktop?

The other day I was in Berlin for a conference. I had to edit some photos and upload them to the company website. The office laptop I was using didn't have any proper software on it for this task.

I emailed them to myself, logged in to my home computer through a remote desktop session, edited the photos and uploaded them from the home computer to the company website.

In what way would cloud services be better? I still have to upload the photos to a service, edit them and then upload the photos to our company website.

A remote desktop session is my preferred way to go.

HappinessNow
December 3rd, 2009, 11:45 AM
Why do I need a cloud if i have remote desktop?

The biggest flaw in this argument is the "I" factor, as previously stated this is not ideal for an individual PC owner but more for corporations, if you have 10 to 20 thousand employees the "I" factor becomes much less important as the assets and security of the corporate entity will take precedence overall.

Dragonbite
December 3rd, 2009, 02:43 PM
The biggest flaw in this argument is the "I" factor, as previously stated this is not ideal for an individual PC owner but more for corporations, if you have 10 to 20 thousand employees the "I" factor becomes much less important as the assets and security of the corporate entity will take precedence overall.

Or if you have multiple locations or to give a your sales force access.

That's why "Private Clouds", owned and operated by the corporation is the way (I predict) things will go. That way a corporation owns and controls the files and policies but everybody (again, multiple locations and external sales force included) get access to the same as the internal people and upgrading is a helluvalot easier than going through 100 computers one-at-a-time.

There is an opportunity, though, for somebody to start a site that provides cloud computing to individuals and companies and is as transparent or "you have control, we don't" as possible right up front. The key to this model is you have to keep that reputation spit-shine-clean at all times. It would be a business based on trust.

HappinessNow
December 4th, 2009, 07:34 AM
Or if you have multiple locations or to give a your sales force access.

That's why "Private Clouds", owned and operated by the corporation is the way (I predict) things will go. That way a corporation owns and controls the files and policies but everybody (again, multiple locations and external sales force included) get access to the same as the internal people and upgrading is a helluvalot easier than going through 100 computers one-at-a-time.

There is an opportunity, though, for somebody to start a site that provides cloud computing to individuals and companies and is as transparent or "you have control, we don't" as possible right up front. The key to this model is you have to keep that reputation spit-shine-clean at all times. It would be a business based on trust.
Great idea over all it could be called Cirrus or Cirrus Cloud. :p

FuturePilot
December 4th, 2009, 08:37 AM
again overall:

yay for companies, boo for personal use.

This

chillicampari
December 4th, 2009, 08:43 AM
My company stuff ain't going in the cloud, it's staying right here on the ground where I can see it.

lisati
December 4th, 2009, 08:47 AM
it's not obvious for most on this forum.

Some thoughts here: http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=7706151&postcount=6341

BenAshton24
December 4th, 2009, 09:10 AM
NO NO NO NO NO NO NO go away cloud! It will come and destroy all that is good about computers today. Diversity and freedom is one of the most amazing thing about the internet, a realm where anything is possible and everything is personal.

Why would I want my computer and everything on it sent to some server for goodness knows who to sift through my files? Why would I want my computer to turn into a web application, totally dependant on an internet connection and in what way could the cloud possibly benefit me. I have a Seagate backup drive and as far as I'm concerned this is easily enough data security and as for logging on around the world, Oh yes, I cannot wait to have my online identity COMPLETELY stolen the second someone shoves a keylogger on whatever computer I'm using.

Sure there are benefits, like catching criminals and copyright thieves, but that is basically the only possible good that could come out of the cloud. An industry tool that will no doubt be completely hijacked at some stage, resulting in some random guy in his mom's cellar having detailed profiles on everyone.

Stop the cloud, we don't want it to rain on our computers!

Ok did I just go over the top? I think I did a bit :P But point made!

Ben.

papangul
December 4th, 2009, 12:14 PM
NO NO NO NO NO NO NO go away cloud!
You stay happy with your "cloudless desert" and let me stay happy with my "perennially cloud-covered terrain".;)

cascade9
December 4th, 2009, 12:25 PM
Well vendor lock-in occurs on or off "the cloud".

The biggest aspect that is being ignored is control over your files.

If you upload your life (photos, emails, documents, videos, music, finances, etc..) to one "cloud vendor" then you have the following to deal with:

- what laws apply to your files?
- who owns your files?
- how secure are your files?
- what happens if the vendor goes belly-up?
- what happens if the vendor sells, markets, shares your files?
- government access to your files? (under terrorism and piracy pretexts)


Exactly. That, and lisatis post are the main reasons why I worry about cloud computing. I'm also not a fan of thin clients in any form, and thats where the cloud is headed.

Which reminds me, I really should see if I can finally get computer components that will fit into the old 'bull' netstation I have hanging around. Current use- a monitor stand for my flatmates 19''.

http://etherboot.sourceforge.net/bull/

openuniverse
December 4th, 2009, 12:55 PM
.

Pasdar
December 4th, 2009, 12:56 PM
Best thing would be to have a built in program that encrypts everything you upload to the online drive and at the same decrypts when you attempt to open or download the file.

HappinessNow
December 5th, 2009, 01:13 PM
You stay happy with your "cloudless desert" and let me stay happy with my "perennially cloud-covered terrain".;)A walk in the clouds.


Best thing would be to have a built in program that encrypts everything you upload to the online drive and at the same decrypts when you attempt to open or download the file.You mean Google Chrome OS?

Pasdar
December 7th, 2009, 11:06 AM
A walk in the clouds.

You mean Google Chrome OS?
No, just like a said. To have a program that encrypts your files and then sends it to the google servers.

Dragonbite
December 7th, 2009, 03:02 PM
No, just like a said. To have a program that encrypts your files and then sends it to the google servers.

I think you are talking about when you click "save" your file is saved (locally), encrypted and then passed up to anybody's server and sits there in an encrypted file format.

Using TrueCrypt doesn't quite cut it too. It would allow you to mount a directory, open/edit/save the files located in that directory and then if that "blob" can be pushed up to the cloud servers it would sit there as an encrypted file inaccessible to anybody who does not have the key(s).

The problem then is that in order to access/update any of the files in that directory you need to up-/download the entire directory which can be gigs in size!

The advantage with TrueCrypt is that it is cross-platform, so you can have your Linux machine update it and then access it via your Windows machine too.

Ok, so for a "personal-orientated cloud" business concept you would want
A system where you can control the storage, access and delete behavior, or at least have it spelled out clearly up-front have the directory or individual files encrypted on the server and you are the only person with the passphrase all up/down loading is done securely

What am I missing?

Dragonbite
December 7th, 2009, 03:25 PM
Oh, a quick update.

I got google-docs-fs installed and running on my Fedora machine and mounted it to a directory. I had to install the requirements first (python, fuse-python and gdata-python) and run the installation as root. Now I'm trying to figure out how to run the installation line and either populate the password or better yet prompt me for a password.

I did not get access to all of my files. It seems it only grabs those with word processor files, which are stored or viewed as .doc. I do have .pdf, spreadsheet and presentation files in there too. I only saw .doc and it did not have even half of my folders (4 out of 12?).

As the system I got it installed on has KOffice (1.6) and not OpenOffice, I was not able to open it up and see how well it worked.

I'll fiddle with it some and see how it goes.

HappinessNow
December 18th, 2009, 04:59 AM
Oh, a quick update.

I got google-docs-fs installed and running on my Fedora machine and mounted it to a directory. I had to install the requirements first (python, fuse-python and gdata-python) and run the installation as root. Now I'm trying to figure out how to run the installation line and either populate the password or better yet prompt me for a password.

I did not get access to all of my files. It seems it only grabs those with word processor files, which are stored or viewed as .doc. I do have .pdf, spreadsheet and presentation files in there too. I only saw .doc and it did not have even half of my folders (4 out of 12?).

As the system I got it installed on has KOffice (1.6) and not OpenOffice, I was not able to open it up and see how well it worked.

I'll fiddle with it some and see how it goes.So how did it go?