About feeding the trolls

[Bölvaður]

That is what we are doing on this forum.

You get 5 times the attention if you are a troll. You get 5 times less attention than trolls if you have something constructive to say.


My idea is that we should stay away from titles that look like a flame bait.

The argument is simple: People that write titles like the one with the ID number 0 (↓see↓below↓) are not as easy to communicate with as the ones that write title similar to the one with the ID 1.
There are many reasons why the poster of ID 0 might be difficult to communicate with, and I might list down at the bottom of this post.


The experiment.
ID: 0
Title: rythmbox is worse than Hitler
Content : if people want christmas song plugin for rythmbox (not likely to get revisits)
Time : 43 minutes
Hits : 36

ID: 1
Title: Amarok has a few bugs
Content : something everyone here agrees on but do not really go by
Time : 23 minutes
Hits: 4

ID0 = 50.2 hits per minute
ID1 = 10.4 hits per minute


The data is very inaccurate but gives an idea on what we are dealing with. But this experiment was cut short by dmizer, but the data is a clear indicator for what we already knew.


Why not reply?

Person with topic like ID:1 is more viable to answer in regards to persons helped per hour than ID:0

Person behind topic ID:1

Want's help. Is polite.

Doesn't need help, is pointing out bugs that need fixed, is polite.




Person behind topic ID:0

It is a person that is very angry and just wrote that in his/her rage and left (will not read the replies nor reply to them)

Person that goes to the forum to get help but is filled with rage and really wants everyone to understand how really mad that person really is.

It's a troll which is just looking for lolz. Any jokes are welcome and high view count welcome.

Might not speak good enough English and expresses himself in an angry manner. I've seen that happen with gamers, and clanmates excusing their clanmates with that excuse.
This person might have hard time understanding the replies and as an engineer student... you can help more people that understand you in the same amount of time as you'd be helping him/her is not worth it. Also that person might find it difficult to google answers as the person doesnt speak the language the tutorials and how-tos are written in... so on average all work done to help that person is worth less than one that understand the message clearer.


*you contribute to the list*

[NoaHall]

I thought those posts weren't very you.

[ticopelp]

Yeah, as I said in the original thread that spawned your experiment -- attention is the currency of internet forums, and being "controversial," inflammatory or rude will get you more of it. People are more likely to react to polarizing or extreme statements than polite, well-reasoned ones. I've seen this happen time and time again, and it's unlikely to change en masse.

[RiceMonster]

Most of the posts accused of trolling here are not actually trolls. Yes they may cause a lot of ruckus, they may be controversial, or they may *god forbid* disagree with you, but this does not mean they are doing it for the soul purpose of trying to start a flamewar. Remember, a troll doesn't care what they're talking about, and they're often not even expressing their own views; they just want to anger people for the fun of it.

[Pasdar]

Are you advocating genocide of troll-men by method of starvation? :o

This hatred filled topic should be locked. [-X

[dmizer]

Unfortunately, trolls are a fact of life and unavoidable.

Conversely, there will always be many people who reply to trolls.

As a long time moderator here as well as other forums I both moderate and administrate I can say with a great deal of confidence that there is no amount of education that will change those two facts.

[Bölvaður]

Most of the posts accused of trolling here are not actually trolls. Yes they may cause a lot of ruckus, they may be controversial, or they may *god forbid* disagree with you, but this does not mean they are doing it for the soul purpose of trying to start a flamewar. Remember, a troll doesn't care what they're talking about, and they're often not even expressing their own views; they just want to anger people for the fun of it.
I take you are referring to what I wrote:


Person that goes to the forum to get help but is filled with rage and really wants everyone to understand how really mad that person really is.


What I am saying is that the time you use helping those might be better spent helping others that aren't rude, due to the likely hood of helping a guy with a post with a ranting title might take much longer than one with a polite one.





Unfortunately, trolls are a fact of life and unavoidable.

Conversely, there will always be many people who reply to trolls.

As a long time moderator here as well as other forums I both moderate and administrate I can say with a great deal of confidence that there is no amount of education that will change those two facts.



So I guess I will be ðe only one that will stop clicking ðose links :(

[ticopelp]

So I guess I will be ðe only one that will stop clicking ðose links :(

Not the only one...

[RabbitWho]

Someone already posted a thread almost identical to this in the past.. . except without the experiment, more a case study.

Nothings going to change, people go for sensational headlines :(

[bruno9779]

Maybe we should have a policy, where:

- Flamebaits from people with less than 10 posts get removed right away.

- Flaimbaits from Linsux people too

This would bring back some of the cosy feeling that UF has been losing lately

[The Toxic Mite]

Maybe we should have a policy, where:

- Flamebaits from people with less than 10 posts get removed right away.

<snip>

This would bring back some of the cosy feeling that UF has been losing lately

Although I haven't heard much about the Linsux guys, I believe that they have been good to the community, but that's just my own opinion. Like I said, I haven't heard much about the Linsux guys.

:)

[Tristam Green]

Maybe we should have a policy, where:

- Flamebaits from people with less than 10 posts get removed right away.

- Flaimbaits from Linsux people too

This would bring back some of the cosy feeling that UF has been losing lately

Yeah, because "my freedom is the only kind of freedom you should be experiencing".

If you think Linsux is simply a rage forum then you clearly don't know the variety of topics discussed over there.

[ZankerH]

I haven't noticed much trolling in here myself, but then again, this is just about the only section of this forum I read regularly.

[Tristam Green]

I haven't noticed much trolling in here myself, but then again, this is just about the only section of this forum I read regularly.

It's blatantly easy to spot when it *does* happen, though.

Also, the best weapon against any troll on UF is this little tool right here:
http://ubuntuforums.org/images/buttons/report.gif

[The Toxic Mite]

It's blatantly easy to spot when it *does* happen, though.

Also, the best weapon against any troll on UF is this little tool right here:
http://ubuntuforums.org/images/buttons/report.gif

Weapon?! Why would you call that a weapon?!

Jeez :P

[Tristam Green]

fine, sanitizer? repellent spray?

[chucky chuckaluck]

this is awesome! we haven't had a "don't feed the trolls" thread in over a week.

[Bölvaður]

this is awesome! we haven't had a "don't feed the trolls" thread in over a week.

but this time it has a twist.

now it both has some numbers to back it up AND it is more leaning towards the absolute beginners talk rather than the café.

[The Toxic Mite]

fine, sanitizer? repellent spray?

Neither would work.

The Report Abuse button is not a weapon, it's simply another way of communicating with the Staff, but about the post in particular.

[bruno9779]

If you think Linsux is simply a rage forum then you clearly don't know the variety of topics discussed over there.

I know linsux forum and the healthy environment there.

I also know (as far as my experience goes) that they do not usually bring that healthy atmosphere on their posts here.

3 over 4 flame threads I have been active on here, where started of fired up by some (-grubby?) linsux guy

[The Toxic Mite]

I know linsux forum and the healthy environment there.

I also know (as far as my experience goes) that they do not usually bring that healthy atmosphere on their posts here.

3 over 4 flame threads I have been active on here, where started of fired up by some (-grubby?) linsux guy

Erm...

Accusations can actually get you into trouble here... :|

I am very sure that -grubby isn't a member of Linsux, but I would know for sure that he would lurk there, amirite -grubby?

[Icehuck]

I highly recommend a change of topic before the thread gets locked.

[ElSlunko]

Don't forget these : http://xkcd.com/386/

[sudoer541]

ubuntu is ****! jk OMG!!! look at me I am a troll!

UF staff edit: snip

This is a joke!!

[ticopelp]

I'm quoting Seth Godin twice in two threads here, but he posted something recently that I found highly amusing and accurate:


How to lose an argument online

1. Have an argument. Once you start an argument, not a discussion, you've already lost. Think about it: have you ever changed your mind because someone online started yelling at you? They might get you to shut up, but it's unlikely they've actually changed your opinion.

2. Forget the pitfalls of Godwin's law. Any time you mention Hitler or even Communist China or Bill O'Reilly, you've lost.

3. Use faulty analogies. If someone is trying to make a point about, say, health care, try to make an analogy to something conceptually
unrelated, like the space shuttle program, and you've lost.

4. Question motives. The best way to get someone annoyed and then have them ignore you is to bypass any thoughtful discussion of facts and instead question what's in it for the person on the other end. Make assumptions about their motivations and lose their respect.

5. Act anonymously. What are the chances that heckled comments from the bleachers will have an impact?

6. Threaten to take action in another venue. Insist that this will come back to haunt the other person. Guarantee you will spread the word or stop purchasing.

7. Bring up the slippery slope. Actually, the slope isn't that slippery. People don't end up marrying dogs, becoming cannibals or harvesting organs because of changes in organization, technology or law.

8. Go to the edges. This is a variant of the slippery slope, in which you bring up extremes at either end of whatever spectrum is being discussed.

So, what works?

Earn a reputation. Have a conversation. Ask questions. Describe possible outcomes of a point of view. Make connections. Give the other person the benefit of the doubt. Align objectives then describe a better outcome. Show up. Smile.

[lisati]

Um, why am I thinking of the Monty Python sketch about arguments (http://www.mindspring.com/~mfpatton/sketch.htm) all of a sudden?

[RiceMonster]

Um, why am I thinking of the Monty Python sketch about arguments (http://www.mindspring.com/~mfpatton/sketch.htm) all of a sudden?

No you aren't.

[lisati]

No you aren't.

Yes I am. :)

[KiwiNZ]

Erm...

Accusations can actually get you into trouble here... :|

I am very sure that -grubby isn't a member of Linsux, but I would know for sure that he would lurk there, amirite -grubby?

We are not going to allow inter site sniping. It stops here.

Thread closed