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View Full Version : In the Matrix, which pill would you take, the red or the blue?



mstlyevil
February 14th, 2006, 07:00 AM
I just read an interesting article on the Matrix Philosophy. After reading it I would have to say I would take the red pill myself because I have always questioned everything in life in my search for the truth.


The film as a whole and especially the choosing scene is deeply compelling. Why is the choice between what you believe you know and an unknown 'real' truth so fascinating? How could a choice possibly be made? On the one hand everyone you love and everything that you have built you life upon. One the other the promise only of truth.

Think about this. Are you willing to give up everyone and everything you know and love just for the promise of the truth? Or are you content to just accept things the way they are even if it means you are living a lie? What would you sacrifice for the truth even if the truth meant a harsher reality than the one you already live in? I know this is a deep thread but these are things that deep down I have always wondered about. Here is a link to the article. After you read it post your thoughts on this subject and the action you are willing to take.

The red or blue pill (http://www.arrod.co.uk/essays/matrix.php)

briancurtin
February 14th, 2006, 07:15 AM
none because i hate that movie and any sequels to it

mstlyevil
February 14th, 2006, 07:21 AM
none because i hate that movie and any sequels to it

I hated the sequels. But this is not about the movie per se but about some of the philosophies espoused during the movie.

nalmeth
February 14th, 2006, 07:23 AM
Naturally since we're on the outside of the film, and since we know what the truth in question is, it's easy to say you'd take the red pill.

I just hope that this doesn't turn into "I took the red pill when I installed ubuntu", because the entire series was far beyond being about a simple struggle between deception and truth. It was an incredibly ambitious series, and really touched on a lot more than the struggle between man and machine. It's too bad most people were distracted from the ideas by all the hollywood.

cro.smiley
February 14th, 2006, 07:24 AM
red

mstlyevil
February 14th, 2006, 07:28 AM
Naturally since we're on the outside of the film, and since we know what the truth in question is, it's easy to say you'd take the red pill.

I just hope that this doesn't turn into "I took the red pill when I installed ubuntu", because the entire series was far beyond being about a simple struggle between deception and truth. It was an incredibly ambitious series, and really touched on a lot more than the struggle between man and machine. It's too bad most people were distracted from the ideas by all the hollywood.

I actually did not intend this thread to even be about Ubuntu but about the philosophy behind the original movie. You are right about it being far from a simple struggle between deception and truth. Of course niether one of these concepts are simple because neither one is clear cut. I just hope people don't just choose the red pill just to be cool but that they read the article from the link and think about how they really feel about their own life. There are no right or wrong answers here.

nalmeth
February 14th, 2006, 07:31 AM
Sorry, I wasn't implying that was your motive at all. I just pictured a lot of people coming in and blurting that out. A lot of people make that allusion, and I just hoped I might stop the oncoming lameness from getting in the way of some more interesting discussion.

EDIT: I'd like to add this, even though its not about the philosophy, but Keanu Reeves drives me totally nuts. A poorly manufactured machine would speak less monotone than him.

mstlyevil
February 14th, 2006, 07:32 AM
Sorry, I wasn't implying that was your motive at all. I just pictured a lot of people coming in and blurting that out. A lot of people make that allusion, and I just hoped I might stop the oncoming lameness from getting in the way of some more interesting discussion.

Agreed.

Iandefor
February 14th, 2006, 08:20 AM
I think I'd be afraid of what the red pill would show me. In one fashion, I want to know the truth, but, in another fashion, I'm afraid to see what that truth might be. What if it invalidates everything? What if I find my life is a tangle of lies and deceit? I don't think I'd jump for it.

Then again, I have no reason to believe there is a truth deeper than we may probe.

mstlyevil
February 14th, 2006, 08:29 AM
I think I'd be afraid of what the red pill would show me. In one fashion, I want to know the truth, but, in another fashion, I'm afraid to see what that truth might be. What if it invalidates everything? What if I find my life is a tangle of lies and deceit? I don't think I'd jump for it.

Then again, I have no reason to believe there is a truth deeper than we may probe.

This is what precisely makes this a very difficult decision. First off you have to have a sense there is a deeper truth out there and second are you willing to let go of everything you have always embraced and believed.

Iandefor
February 14th, 2006, 08:33 AM
This is what precisely makes this a very difficult decision. First off you have to have a sense there is a deeper truth out there and second are you willing to let go of everything you have always embraced and believed. Oi vei... curse you for posing difficult philosophical questions! Curse me for considering them!

kanem
February 14th, 2006, 09:33 AM
I voted red, and ideally that would be the truth.

But if it went down like it did in the movie: some shady characters with guns talking crazy and offering what looks like drugs... Well a person would be stupid to take the red or the blue.

Anyway, once I knew something else was out there, I'd have to know about it. It wouldn't be about being in the know vs being ignorant and happy. As soon as I suspected something else was out there I wouldn't be happy anymore until I found out.

Artificial Intelligence
February 14th, 2006, 09:44 AM
What would happen if you take both?

byen
February 14th, 2006, 09:52 AM
What would happen if you take both?
Well.. thats what Tom Cruise did in real life.. and look how he ended up!:-#

Tinuz
February 14th, 2006, 10:02 AM
I'd probably go for the red one, considering that it'd show me thruth. Because, if it would show me thruth and only thruth it would not change my life if all was thruth. If it would change my life, my life wasn't thruth and I'd want to know what is.
As someone above said, I cannot be ignorant and happy(and yes, I sometimes envy people who can), I have a very deep desire to know what is real, to know how things work and why things are that way.
On the other hand, what if the thruth would destroy me, if I would not be able to cope with it. Then I would have the possibility of destroying myself and knowing the thruth or living and knowing that it might all be lies. The question which rises is "Would I be able to live life knowing that it *might* be a lie?".
I find the possibilty of it all being a lie a very demotivating prospect, and as such, I would take the red pill. But I can imagine that not everybody would do so, and than again, I am 21 years old, I can imagine that in 10 years, having an 'evolved' life(wife, perhaps kids, job, etc.) I'd be choosing the blue one too.

Arktis
February 14th, 2006, 10:36 AM
You're all liars.

Metaphoricly speaking, 99% of people take the blue pill every day. Take the red pill? You guys are all lying to yourself and eachother.

Maelgwyn
February 14th, 2006, 10:44 AM
I'd take the blue pill.

Until there was 'proof' to show me that life would be 'better' by taking the red pill, then I would happily continue life as normal..

Remember



All I offer is the truth.


He does not say the 'truth' is going to be better... And the blue pill means that you'd forget that there were pills to choose from in the first place!

Lanrond
February 14th, 2006, 11:00 AM
I think most of people (me included) will say to choose the red pill. Anyway everyone, day by day, is gulping the blue one.

And, ironically enough, in the result the "red" answer is displayed in blue and viceversa.

Leo_01
February 14th, 2006, 02:47 PM
Sometimes i really wonder if this is the real world.
KNOWING THE TRUTH DOES NOT MEAN YOUR LIFE CAN GET BETTER.
Some people is so brainlessly attached to this "better" life that they can forgo the chance to live real.
If given a chance i would personally live as a real person rather than some unreal world.
Basically speaking, i can't really know what i "SEE", "TOUCH" or "SMELL" is not just my another lie from my senses . \\:D/

Stormy Eyes
February 14th, 2006, 03:14 PM
Basically speaking, i can't really know what i "SEE", "TOUCH" or "SMELL" is not just my another lie from my senses . \\:D/

If you don't trust your own senses, if you don't trust yourself, then what can you trust?

Personally, I'd ask a few questions before making my choice, because I like to know what I'm getting into before I decide on a particular course.

earobinson
February 14th, 2006, 03:19 PM
lol funny poll the red pill bar is blue, and the blue pill bar is red!

Kvark
February 14th, 2006, 03:30 PM
But if it went down like it did in the movie: some shady characters with guns talking crazy and offering what looks like drugs... Well a person would be stupid to take the red or the blue.
Precisely my first thought. Morpheuses gang looks really suspicious, no sane person would get into a car with them and thus no sane person would get as far in the movie as to being offered the weird pills.


But on that philosophical question the article speaks a lot of mumbo jumbo about...

I can't see any difference between absolute thruth and blind faith, just look at history. The earth wasn't the center of the universe, neither was the sun and neither was the milky way. The 4 elements turned out to not be the smallest building blocks, neither was athoms, neither was protons and neutrons, even quarks doesn't seem to be the smallest. Just as we today know that a lot of past theories where wrong, in the future they will know that a lot of what we blindly believe to be absolute thruth today was in fact wrong too.

I pick the blue pill. Perhaps the red pill would show me that something I belived to be true is in fact wrong, but there is no way to know that what the red pill suggests instead is really the final truth. I would just be back in the same situation as before believing blindly in the new red pill instead of the old blue pill.

super
February 14th, 2006, 03:34 PM
i would take the blue

unless truth is going to benefit me, my family or mankind in general there is no point. besides, do you think all those human in the matrix are gonna be happy waking up to a completely destroyed, dark, cold earth?

the matrix has you neo!
muwahahaha! :D

tekwarren
February 14th, 2006, 04:49 PM
i would take the blue

unless truth is going to benefit me, my family or mankind in general there is no point. besides, do you think all those human in the matrix are gonna be happy waking up to a completely destroyed, dark, cold earth?

the matrix has you neo!
muwahahaha! :D


What...IS real, is it something you can "see" or "touch" perhaps "smell". The human senses are nothing more than electrical impulses translated by our minds telling us what "should" be... Maybe you don't really have a family...maybe my wife is a simple program with the sole purpose of keeping my sublevel concious and thoughts busy while my real purpose continues to be that of a copper top... I don't think anyone could "decide" which path to take based on if it will create "benefits". Once you are free, the life...the world you thought you knew is no longer.

mstlyevil
February 14th, 2006, 05:17 PM
What would happen if you take both?


Well.. thats what Tom Cruise did in real life.. and look how he ended up!

ROFLMAO! You would be one confused individual. I cand still see Stan in South Park saying "Dad! Tom cruise wont come out of the closet!".

mstlyevil
February 14th, 2006, 05:21 PM
You're all liars.

Metaphoricly speaking, 99% of people take the blue pill every day. Take the red pill? You guys are all lying to yourself and eachother.

I wouldn't say we are all liars. I personally have embraced things in life that have put me at odds with everyone I love. But I would say that there are some that just pick the red pill in the poll and don't actually ponder what it means to do so. I expected some people to do that because it is easy to say you would be willing to swallow the truth when you really do not know the implications of doing so.

mstlyevil
February 14th, 2006, 05:25 PM
Sometimes i really wonder if this is the real world.
KNOWING THE TRUTH DOES NOT MEAN YOUR LIFE CAN GET BETTER.
Some people is so brainlessly attached to this "better" life that they can forgo the chance to live real.
If given a chance i would personally live as a real person rather than some unreal world.
Basically speaking, i can't really know what i "SEE", "TOUCH" or "SMELL" is not just my another lie from my senses . \\:D/

This is precisely why people would actually swallow the blue pill. The truth does not offer a better existance but only a real existance. I learned a long time ago you can not trust your senses to guide you. Mine have lied to me before and caused me great grief. Truth means letting something besides your senses guide you.

mstlyevil
February 14th, 2006, 05:30 PM
If you don't trust your own senses, if you don't trust yourself, then what can you trust?

Personally, I'd ask a few questions before making my choice, because I like to know what I'm getting into before I decide on a particular course.

That I don't know. Who or what can you really trust? This is a age old question as old as mankind itself. Of course how do we really know the truth being offered to us is not just another deception? I suspect this is why the blue pill will be appealing to most in real life.

mstlyevil
February 14th, 2006, 05:34 PM
Precisely my first thought. Morpheuses gang looks really suspicious, no sane person would get into a car with them and thus no sane person would get as far in the movie as to being offered the weird pills.


But on that philosophical question the article speaks a lot of mumbo jumbo about...

I can't see any difference between absolute thruth and blind faith, just look at history. The earth wasn't the center of the universe, neither was the sun and neither was the milky way. The 4 elements turned out to not be the smallest building blocks, neither was athoms, neither was protons and neutrons, even quarks doesn't seem to be the smallest. Just as we today know that a lot of past theories where wrong, in the future they will know that a lot of what we blindly believe to be absolute thruth today was in fact wrong too.

I pick the blue pill. Perhaps the red pill would show me that something I belived to be true is in fact wrong, but there is no way to know that what the red pill suggests instead is really the final truth. I would just be back in the same situation as before believing blindly in the new red pill instead of the old blue pill.

And yet most people today follow what they believe to be true today with blind faith. You posed a good question in making a decison.

mstlyevil
February 14th, 2006, 05:37 PM
maybe my wife is a simple program with the sole purpose of keeping my sublevel concious and thoughts busy while my real purpose continues to be that of a copper top

This describes my ex-wife perfectly. Ever heard of the operating system Wife 1.0? :mrgreen:

Stormy Eyes
February 14th, 2006, 05:40 PM
That I don't know. Who or what can you really trust? This is a age old question as old as mankind itself. Of course how do we really know the truth being offered to us is not just another deception? I suspect this is why the blue pill will be appealing to most in real life.

Until I have good reason not to, I will continue to trust my senses and my ability to reason.

mstlyevil
February 14th, 2006, 05:42 PM
Until I have good reason not to, I will continue to trust my senses and my ability to reason.

Good point.

TrendyDark
February 14th, 2006, 07:39 PM
Just an interesting observation, the "red pill" bar in the poll is blue and the "blue pill" bar is red.

Anyways, I'd like to know as much as I could, so I'd take the red.

Bandit
February 14th, 2006, 08:06 PM
Damn hard question.
Since I watched the movies, I would now say BLUE PILL. Ignorance is bliss...
I am not sure I would like to eat protein slop and wear rags. Steak and Polo is more my choice...

But if I was in Neo's shoes, I prob would have chosen RED PILL becuase I am a very curious sport. Plus Trinaty in the latex outfit really does something to me.. :mrgreen:

bored2k
February 14th, 2006, 08:18 PM
Blue.

mstlyevil
February 14th, 2006, 08:21 PM
Damn hard question.
Since I watched the movies, I would now say BLUE PILL. Ignorance is bliss...
I am not sure I would like to eat protein slop and wear rags. Steak and Polo is more my choice...

But if I was in Neo's shoes, I prob would have chosen RED PILL becuase I am a very curious sport. Plus Trinaty in the latex outfit really does something to me.. :mrgreen:

Trinity would be a big motivating factor. (I like skin tight latex outfits on gorgeous women.) \\:D/

angkor
February 14th, 2006, 08:41 PM
lol funny poll the red pill bar is blue, and the blue pill bar is red!

*lol* So what _is_ the truth?



btw. I've already chosen the red pill a couple of years ago.

mstlyevil
February 14th, 2006, 08:46 PM
*lol* So what _is_ the truth?



btw. I've already chosen the red pill a couple of years ago.

That is a good question and one that none of us really knows.

Bragador
February 14th, 2006, 10:49 PM
Red

I want the truth.

So many people are working hard for the simple reason they need the survive. We make children without even knowing why. We just make them because we can and we want the species to survive. But why do we need to survive ?

If we all found out that there is no afterlife (like I think), then there is no reason for the survival of our species, for our evolution.

We could all stop making babies, live peacefully and die out.

So if reality is something different than that, I would want to know.

chimera
February 14th, 2006, 11:03 PM
Red, because you get to dodge bullets and fly around:mrgreen:

super
February 14th, 2006, 11:42 PM
*lol* So what _is_ the truth?

isn't that the same question pontius pilate asked jesus christ? :-k

mstlyevil
February 14th, 2006, 11:45 PM
isn't that the same question pontius pilate asked jesus christ? :-k

Verrrrrrrrrrrrry interesting!

kyoushu
February 15th, 2006, 12:00 AM
I think for people to truly answer this question they need to stop thinking of this as the matrix. In the Matrix only part of the truth is revealed. Neo still has to find other answers to many other unanswered questions. Anyways, I would choose the red pill.

angkor
February 15th, 2006, 12:06 AM
That is a good question and one that none of us really knows.

Probably because the truth isn't an absolute concept, at least I think so. I believe there are many truths.


isn't that the same question pontius pilate asked jesus christ?

Really? Didn't know that...*smiles* so what was Jesus' answer?

super
February 15th, 2006, 12:34 AM
Really? Didn't know that...*smiles* so what was Jesus' answer?
he didn't give one.

according to the 'new international' translation


37 "You are a king, then!" said Pilate. Jesus answered, "You are right in saying I am a king. In fact, for this reason I was born, and for this I came into the world, to testify to the truth. Everyone on the side of truth listens to me."

38 "What is truth?" Pilate asked. With this he went out again to the Jews and said, "I find no basis for a charge against him.


draw your own concusions.