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View Full Version : Why are subtitles and not dubbing used on movie DVDs



t0p
October 2nd, 2009, 11:20 AM
I watch a lot of movies on DVD with a couple of mates. We sometimes get foreign language movies by mistake, and this enrages my friends. Enrages them because they hate reading subtitles.

I don't mind subtitles per se. But I do hate it when subtitles are too small to read on the TV screen. So I share some of my friends' annoyance.

What they continually want to know is: why can't the DVD manufacturers put multiple language speech soundtracks on a disk? Would alternate audio tracks take up too much disk space? Or is it an aesthetic reason that dictates the choice of subtitles?

Странник
October 2nd, 2009, 11:21 AM
I like subtitles. It makes you listen to the original language and I hate dubbed films

Nevon
October 2nd, 2009, 11:30 AM
Because dubbing is absolutely horrible? Also, it's a lot of work to have to dub a film just in case someone won't read the subtitles.

I actually tend to turn on subtitles even if I'm watching a movie in English.

Chronon
October 2nd, 2009, 11:31 AM
Maybe it's a budget issue. Larger budget movies tend to have multiple language tracks (I seem to recall that some of my daughter's Harry Potter DVDs have multiple language options). I would guess that many foreign films probably don't have the same budget and it's cheaper to simply have the script translated into multiple languages than having voice actors come in and do whole new voice tracks for each language. Plus, bad voice acting is much worse, IMO, than having to read subtitles.

xpod
October 2nd, 2009, 11:32 AM
The last film/s i watched with subtitles were Red Cliff 1 & 2 but i hate when that particular type of film has some terrible dubbing over it.The movies themselves are just far more authentic with the subtitles.

Paqman
October 2nd, 2009, 11:40 AM
Dubbing = expensive
Subtitles = cheap

It's as simple as that.

koshatnik
October 2nd, 2009, 11:42 AM
Also

Dubbing=Crap and annoying
Subtitles=Good

t0p
October 2nd, 2009, 11:51 AM
A lot of responses to my OP have claimed that subtitles are better than dubbed speech. Surely you can see that's an opinion, not a statement of fact?

Also, what about my point that subtitles can be too small to read, especially on a small screen? What about the fact that some people can't read English fast enough to keep up? Or can't read English at all? Shouldn't such people be able to enjoy a movie just like you do?

Also, I want to know: would it be possible to put multiple speech soundtracks on a movie DVD? Is there enough disk space?

Bachstelze
October 2nd, 2009, 12:09 PM
A lot of responses to my OP have claimed that subtitles are better than dubbed speech. Surely you can see that's an opinion, not a statement of fact?

You were also answered that subtitles were cheaper to make than dubs. Tha'ts all there is to it.

Mornedhel
October 2nd, 2009, 12:09 PM
A lot of responses to my OP have claimed that subtitles are better than dubbed speech. Surely you can see that's an opinion, not a statement of fact?

So is the opposite opinion. However, here's a statement of fact for you that others have pointed out : dubbing is expensive, so good dubbing is very expensive and rare. Most dubbings are just crap.

Also, when the movie was not marketed to other countries, and there never was an incentive to localize it to other languages, you can't expect it to be dubbed at all, can you ?


Also, what about my point that subtitles can be too small to read, especially on a small screen? What about the fact that some people can't read English fast enough to keep up? Or can't read English at all? Shouldn't such people be able to enjoy a movie just like you do?

About the small fonts : I don't know much about hardware DVD players, I don't own any, but in most software you can set the font size.

About lack of English reading skills : I'm assuming you're talking about native English speakers here (since foreigners would use their native language subtitle track). You won't solve an illiteracy problem with dubbed foreign movies, you know. Anyway, those people have a bigger problem in their day-to-day lives than subbed foreign movies (street signs, warning labels...).


Also, I want to know: would it be possible to put multiple speech soundtracks on a movie DVD? Is there enough disk space?

Most used space on a DVD comes from the video track, not the audio track. Get a video clip, dump the audio track to a separate file, compare the sizes. Space is most likely not the problem.

koshatnik
October 2nd, 2009, 12:32 PM
Also, what about my point that subtitles can be too small to read, especially on a small screen?

Move closer to the screen? Get a bigger screen?



What about the fact that some people can't read English fast enough to keep up?

Maybe foriegn films aren't appropriate viewing then. Or maybe watch the film again? I often watch films twice anyway.




Or can't read English at all? Shouldn't such people be able to enjoy a movie just like you do?



If you can't read english, why would you select your subtitles in english? Surely you would select the language you speak from the menu?

Tristam Green
October 2nd, 2009, 01:01 PM
I get the distinct feeling I'm missing the point of this thread.

Subbing is way cheaper than dubbing.

In many cases, dubbing is just horrid too. Take the film "Night Watch", for instance. The English dubbing in that film was horrific, and was a real detriment to the movie. I had a headache watching it like that.

However, watching it with subtitles in the original Russian? Actually way better, and I could understand it more easily.

hessiess
October 2nd, 2009, 01:36 PM
Becouse dubs, by definition never match the mouth movements that well and the voice acting often isn't as good.

chriskin
October 2nd, 2009, 01:49 PM
I watch a lot of movies on DVD with a couple of mates. We sometimes get foreign language movies by mistake, and this enrages my friends. Enrages them because they hate reading subtitles.

I don't mind subtitles per se. But I do hate it when subtitles are too small to read on the TV screen. So I share some of my friends' annoyance.

What they continually want to know is: why can't the DVD manufacturers put multiple language speech soundtracks on a disk? Would alternate audio tracks take up too much disk space? Or is it an aesthetic reason that dictates the choice of subtitles?

dubbing sounds too annoying
when one watches a Japanese film for example it would be too strange to have the Japanese people speak English, and even worse, have them sound like they are speaking English through dubbing.

chriskin
October 2nd, 2009, 01:50 PM
Maybe it's a budget issue. Larger budget movies tend to have multiple language tracks (I seem to recall that some of my daughter's Harry Potter DVDs have multiple language options). I would guess that many foreign films probably don't have the same budget and it's cheaper to simply have the script translated into multiple languages than having voice actors come in and do whole new voice tracks for each language. Plus, bad voice acting is much worse, IMO, than having to read subtitles.

that might mean that movies that are targeting children have dubs to make it easier for them

forrestcupp
October 2nd, 2009, 02:21 PM
Actually, a lot of American made movies that I have bought on DVD do have dubbing, usually for French and Spanish. But those are usually box office movies that have made enough money to do that type of thing. It's really kind of funny when you know what the actor's voice sounds like, and the French counterpart sounds nothing like them. I'm sure Low B foreign films may not have the budget for that type of thing, or they just don't care.

The best dubbed DVD I've seen was for Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon. The Theater version was only subtitles. But the DVD was dubbed in English. They did such a good job it was hard to tell the movie wasn't filmed in English.

anaconda
October 2nd, 2009, 02:31 PM
I like subtitles. It makes you listen to the original language and I hate dubbed films

+1 for that.

pwnst*r
October 2nd, 2009, 02:52 PM
I like subtitles. It makes you listen to the original language and I hate dubbed films

winner

koleoptero
October 2nd, 2009, 03:31 PM
I watch a lot of movies on DVD with a couple of mates. We sometimes get foreign language movies by mistake, and this enrages my friends. Enrages them because they hate reading subtitles.

I don't mind subtitles per se. But I do hate it when subtitles are too small to read on the TV screen. So I share some of my friends' annoyance.

What they continually want to know is: why can't the DVD manufacturers put multiple language speech soundtracks on a disk? Would alternate audio tracks take up too much disk space? Or is it an aesthetic reason that dictates the choice of subtitles?

Subtitles are better in all aspects. If someone can't keep up with reading subtitles then they should practice reading more often.


dubbing sounds too annoying
when one watches a Japanese film for example it would be too strange to have the Japanese people speak English, and even worse, have them sound like they are speaking English through dubbing.

Don't you agree that the people that do the voice dubbing in Greek sound insane? I absolutely hate them.

chriskin
October 2nd, 2009, 03:37 PM
Don't you agree that the people that do the voice dubbing in Greek sound insane? I absolutely hate them.


not just Greek

try watching "Let the right one in" in English instead of Swedish

but yeah, Greek dubbers might be the worst out there

SunnyRabbiera
October 2nd, 2009, 04:56 PM
Because dubbing is absolutely horrible? Also, it's a lot of work to have to dub a film just in case someone won't read the subtitles.

I actually tend to turn on subtitles even if I'm watching a movie in English.

Yeh a vast majority of dubbed films are horrible, though some are better then others.

forrestcupp
October 2nd, 2009, 07:53 PM
The original Mad Max movie was dubbed in English because the actors' Aussie accents were too strong. Great movie, but they did a poor dubbing job.

NoaHall
October 2nd, 2009, 08:00 PM
Trust me, when you spend most of your life watching films in another language, subtitles are better. And they are also a great way of learning another language. Dubbing is like a crime against ears and eyes.

RiceMonster
October 2nd, 2009, 08:04 PM
I hate dubbing with a passion. The voice acting is always bad, it looks awkward and ruins the show/movie.

lisati
October 2nd, 2009, 08:09 PM
Making movies can be a lot of hard work. Dubbing is more work. Doing both well can is even more work.

I enjoy flicking through the different spoken languages on some films. On a couple of the DVDs in my collection they even dubbed the songs for a couple of the languages (they're musicals).

The only DVD I have which doesn't have an English soundtrack is "La Vie en Rose". Reading the subtitles sufficiently quickly to keep up with the story is a bit of a challenge at times but worth it.

If you're into comedies, it might be worth checking out Tongan Ninja (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0352925/), parts of which were made to look as if they were dubbed.

Firestem4
October 2nd, 2009, 08:20 PM
I like subtitles. It makes you listen to the original language and I hate dubbed films

I agree. I enjoy watching movies in their original language and subtitles do not take away from my enjoyment.

t0p
October 2nd, 2009, 09:22 PM
Lots of people who have replied to this thread say they hate dubbing and subtitles are much better. I agree with them, up to a point. But if dubbing is done well, it is by definition no longer crap. And if a viewer prefers dubbing to subtitles, then that viewer is not being catered to. Is it too much to hope that a DVD manufacturer might cater for viewers who like dubbing as well as those who prefer subtitles?

I'm surprised that so many of you have no sympathy for the illiterate, the dyslexic, those with poor sight, those who own TVs with small screens. As long as you are okay, that's all that matters, huh?

Some of you have cited cost as the reason for the lack of dubbing. This is probably the chief reason. But DVDs are extremely cheap to make, and there is a huge profit margin in sales of movie DVDs. It wouldn't kill a manufacturer to put a dubbed soundtrack on a disk.

Nevertheless, it's clear that there isn't much demand for dubbed movies. So it'll never happen for the majority of disks. A great shame.

Mornedhel
October 2nd, 2009, 09:38 PM
Some of you have cited cost as the reason for the lack of dubbing. This is probably the chief reason. But DVDs are extremely cheap to make, and there is a huge profit margin in sales of movie DVDs. It wouldn't kill a manufacturer to put a dubbed soundtrack on a disk.

Nonono, the cost doesn't come from adding an audio track to a DVD. The cost comes from producing the audio track in the first place. You need to pay the voice actors, rent the studio and hardware, pay attention to lip-syncing...

Subs only need a translator and the script.

alphaniner
October 2nd, 2009, 09:46 PM
I'm surprised that so many of you have no sympathy for the illiterate, the dyslexic, those with poor sight, those who own TVs with small screens. As long as you are okay, that's all that matters, huh?

...

Nevertheless, it's clear that there isn't much demand for dubbed movies. So it'll never happen for the majority of disks. A great shame.

That's the free market at work. It's not the perfect economic system, it's just the only one that works. If the situation bothers you so much, why not do something about it rather than try and book everyone else on your guilt trip?

hessiess
October 2nd, 2009, 09:53 PM
I'm surprised that so many of you have no sympathy for the illiterate, the dyslexic, those with poor sight, those who own TVs with small screens. As long as you are okay, that's all that matters, huh?


I am dyslexic and have no problem reading subtitles.

anaconda
October 6th, 2009, 11:13 AM
I once saw a film, which was dupped by ONE person. Seriously...

He spoke for all actors.. Male or female. And with a monotonous voice. It was HORRIBLE.

By the way.
Subtitles also help children learn to read faster. I remember when I had just learnt to read. It was really annoying, that I couldn't read fast enough for subtitiles. Just had to learn "speed reading"... LOL

koshatnik
October 6th, 2009, 11:19 AM
But if dubbing is done well, it is by definition no longer crap.

No matter how well it is done, I still would prefer it with subtitles in the original language, because I have no problems with that.



And if a viewer prefers dubbing to subtitles, then that viewer is not being catered to. Is it too much to hope that a DVD manufacturer might cater for viewers who like dubbing as well as those who prefer subtitles?

Yes, because multinational media companies don't give two stuffs about their customers, just their share price. Welcome to capitalism.



I'm surprised that so many of you have no sympathy for the illiterate, the dyslexic, those with poor sight, those who own TVs with small screens. As long as you are okay, that's all that matters, huh?

Lots of people have disabilities. Ever tried getting to most shops in a wheelchair? I have a friend that is wheelchair bound and has enormous problems with this. The world in general, only caters to the able.



Some of you have cited cost as the reason for the lack of dubbing. This is probably the chief reason. But DVDs are extremely cheap to make, and there is a huge profit margin in sales of movie DVDs. It wouldn't kill a manufacturer to put a dubbed soundtrack on a disk.

"We can make lots of money from sticking subtitles on a film... or make slightly less money by dubbing it as well... I know, lets make less money"

This will never happen.



Nevertheless, it's clear that there isn't much demand for dubbed movies. So it'll never happen for the majority of disks. A great shame.

A great relief. Learn to read them. Its just practice. Seriously, once you manage it, you'll never watched a dubbed film again.

Bachstelze
October 6th, 2009, 11:26 AM
Some of you have cited cost as the reason for the lack of dubbing. This is probably the chief reason. But DVDs are extremely cheap to make, and there is a huge profit margin in sales of movie DVDs. It wouldn't kill a manufacturer to put a dubbed soundtrack on a disk.

Rubbish. Big movies are dubbed, and small ones do not make a lot of profit.

LookTJ
October 6th, 2009, 11:33 AM
I turn subtitles on no matter what movie I watch regardless of the language. I am "hard of hearing".

And I hate dubbing.

starcannon
October 6th, 2009, 11:42 AM
I watch a lot of movies on DVD with a couple of mates. We sometimes get foreign language movies by mistake, and this enrages my friends. Enrages them because they hate reading subtitles.

I don't mind subtitles per se. But I do hate it when subtitles are too small to read on the TV screen. So I share some of my friends' annoyance.

What they continually want to know is: why can't the DVD manufacturers put multiple language speech soundtracks on a disk? Would alternate audio tracks take up too much disk space? Or is it an aesthetic reason that dictates the choice of subtitles?
Voice over actors cost more than translators. And for the additional cost of hiring the actors, paying the production crew to dub the voice overs in, and then repackaging as "languageX" version, it still ends up sucking.

Subtitles are less expensive, and do not ruin the film.

Just my .02

agroody
October 6th, 2009, 11:49 AM
hmm, I hate dubbing and avoid dubbed films the best I can. An Italian friend of mine blamed dubbing for her bad English and I have to say I agree to some extent. Here in Finland, where I currently reside, young people speak amazingly good English and apart from animation films and kiddie's cartoons, nothing is dubbed.

Having separate dub options on DVD's would be funny though. Just one click and Megan Fox is speaking Hungarian. How would that work on multilingual films like Inglourious Basterds, I wonder.

Warpnow
October 6th, 2009, 03:06 PM
A lot of responses to my OP have claimed that subtitles are better than dubbed speech. Surely you can see that's an opinion, not a statement of fact?

It is, however, an extremely shared opinion amongst the more educated, and is extremely shared amongst those who visit Independent Movie theaters, or attend film festivals, which is where most of the market for foreign films seems to be these days.

To many people, your title looked something like this,

"Why are Steaks and not dog food served at fancy restaurants?"

solitaire
October 6th, 2009, 03:20 PM
I am dyslexic and have no problem reading subtitles.
Same here!!

I'm dyslexic and i like subtitles, rather than dubbing. The only reason Crouching tiger... was a good dub was that the entire cast was brought in to dub the English version if i remember correctly, so the voices matched the actors (I'll have to pull out my DVD to check...).

I find, you tend to read the subs without realizing it and still keep tack of what's going on on screen (especially in all those Asian action movies I love to watch..) ^__^

mkendall
October 6th, 2009, 09:36 PM
Subtitles are preferable to dubbing because they maintain the artistic integrity of the film. The question is almost like asking "Why don't they colorize all those black and white films?" Dubbing may give you the same story but it most definitely is not the same film.

And subtitles are cheaper.