Wow vista really does sux

[mdgrech]

Had a friend come over today, she bought a new laptop and wanted me to kind set it all up for her. Which pretty much amounted to me installing antivirus, firewall, a better web browser, a safer crossplatform messaging client (pidgin) and getting rid of all the unnessecary sh*t. All of this of course is unecessary on ubuntu. Sure the windows vista interface is shiny but wouldn't really call it polished. After dealing with windows for a half hour today glad to be back to Ubuntu, been using solely linux for about 2 yrs now and loving it. My favorite part is how I can bookmark remote computers and just access them as if they were on my local computer.

[unknownPoster]

I'm sure your 30 minute experience is a valid evaluation of an Operating System.

[Majorix]

That what you describe is not unique to Vista. You have to do that all with just any edition of Windows. You have to be grateful that you didn't have to install drivers (which you would have to if you were installing XP or older).

[Mmmbopdowedop]

I like Vista.

ESET Security software sorts out Anti-Virus and Firewall, all that's left is to isntall firefox, which takes ~2 mins.

I would rather use the normal WLM client than Pidgin, who cares if it's not cross-platform, it's only going to be run on Windows and at least with it you can use sounds, proper file transfers and all the other stuff.

Ubuntu comes with the same amount of crap as does Windows.

I prefer Debian over Vista, but not to the extent that it's worth bashing it just because it needs an anti-virus installing and may need to have some stuff uninstalled that every user may not want/need.

[The Real Dave]

You have to be grateful that you didn't have to install drivers (which you would have to if you were installing XP or older).

Vista is just as much of a driver hell as XP, thankfully though, most computer makes I deal with have good support sections, with plenty of driver downloads available.

@mdgrech, of course your not going to like using Vista, you've been with Linux for two years, its what you know, what you like. Its the same for anything like that. Also, Linux has plenty of issues of its own, some just as bad as Window's issues, but, Windows ain't got forums like these to help you out =]

[Mmmbopdowedop]

...
@Pey Tudor, of course your not going to like using Vista, you've been with Linux for two years, its what you know, what you like. Its the same for anything like that. Also, Linux has plenty of issues of its own, some just as bad as Window's issues, but, Windows ain't got forums like these to help you out =]
Think you aimed that at the wrong person or misread my post, I never said Windows was bad. :-)

[The Real Dave]

Think you aimed that at the wrong person or misread my post, I never said Windows was bad. :-)

Whoops, indeed I did, sorry =]

[Arup]

I like Vista.

ESET Security software sorts out Anti-Virus and Firewall, all that's left is to isntall firefox, which takes ~2 mins.

I would rather use the normal WLM client than Pidgin, who cares if it's not cross-platform, it's only going to be run on Windows and at least with it you can use sounds, proper file transfers and all the other stuff.

Ubuntu comes with the same amount of crap as does Windows.

I prefer Debian over Vista, but not to the extent that it's worth bashing it just because it needs an anti-virus installing and may need to have some stuff uninstalled that every user may not want/need.

What an understatement, try finding drivers, .net, other runtimes, latest updates. About Ubuntu coming with same amount of bloat as Windows all I can say is :lolflag:

[chriswyatt]

WLM's pretty rubbish these days. The interface has really gone down hill in my opinion.

[Sockerdrickan]

About Ubuntu coming with same amount of bloat as Windows all I can say is :lolflag:
yeah :lolflag:

[Mmmbopdowedop]

What an understatement, try finding drivers, .net, other runtimes, latest updates. About Ubuntu coming with same amount of bloat as Windows all I can say is :lolflag:
I didn't need any drivers other than my nVidia graphics & Realtek HD Audio drivers, which are needed on Linux too, where's the problem with that?
Could never find a proper working wireless driver for my Wireless on Linux, though...

.net isn't really much of an issue either, it will give you a link to download it on most cases, so I have to install another thing manually and not have Aptitude or Synaptic do it for me, so what.

Updating is one click too.

And Ubuntu is heavily bloated with crap, granted, not as much, but there is a lot.

This post isn't me saying Windows is better, because I feel it isn't in some cases, where others it is. All this has been said before, anyway.

And the "lolflag"x7 is real mature btw...

[Viva]

You just pissed off a lot of Microsoft apologists
Anyway, http://badvista.fsf.org/

[Sockerdrickan]

And the "lolflag"x7 is real mature btw...
That was 6 :lolflag: actually. One failed irl.

[realzippy]

Ok,I have a Vista hd for gaming,and found a trick :

Using a Gnome backround image
It works...until you click something..

[armandh]

it is not the time and $ to install it is the constant time and $ to maintain that has vista sucking!

vista and the other programs, AV, and hardware drivers were always calling home then requesting you $update$ and always at inconvenient times or the AV was window cleaning sucking most of the speed.

A TOTAL IRRITATION note above use of the past tense

[stwschool]

Vista is Windows at its worst. I just don't like using it. I prefer 7 or XP if I must use Windows. I would say that my Gnome set-up is more attractive, and Linux suits my workflow better. Windows is better at one thing however, games. Everything else I need runs in Linux, or Wine (amusingly some games which won't work in Windows will work in Wine).

[epsolon77]

I have a confession to make. I have Vista installed on both of my home computers. Now before anyone judges, let me explain. My wife REQUIRES a microsoft product (until I upgrade her again to "Windows 7" --read as kubuntu with a microsoft looking skin--). I also spend all day and night maintaining microsoft products, at least until I can get all the required apps to run on a linux base (have a hell of a time with some programs that use .net and IE). I also find myself not using it as much as my linux machines at work. I took these old crappy P4's that no one could stand to run XP on and converted them to ubuntu just for the fun of it. Now one is my private terminal server and the other is a fax server. I still find myself doing most of my work on them because they are faster, smother, and just plain work! And I WILL NOT install Vista on any PC at my office. Setting up sharing is a NIGHTMARE, as well as all those nifty security packages that enable themselves every couple weeks and require the system owner to shut down. I've used Vista for almost 2 years and can't stand it. If I actually used my PC at home, it would at LEAST be dual booted.

[ade234uk]

Had a friend come over today, she bought a new laptop and wanted me to kind set it all up for her. Which pretty much amounted to me installing antivirus, firewall, a better web browser, a safer crossplatform messaging client (pidgin) and getting rid of all the unnessecary sh*t. All of this of course is unecessary on ubuntu. Sure the windows vista interface is shiny but wouldn't really call it polished. After dealing with windows for a half hour today glad to be back to Ubuntu, been using solely linux for about 2 yrs now and loving it. My favorite part is how I can bookmark remote computers and just access them as if they were on my local computer.

You must be reading my mind. My new laptop arrived yesterday, it must have taken 15 - 20 mins just doing the initial setup, and saying NO NO NO to registering all the crap that came on it. Then a popup asked if If I wanted to create a factory restore disk. This required 3 DVDs, yes 3 DVD's.

I got 50% through the burning the first DVD and got a write error. I tried again and it worked. After this I removed Vista completely and installed Ubuntu.

Just one of the reasons why I love Ubuntu.

I think it's disgusting that they don't even supply the OS on disk anymore.
I know the restore partition has been going for some time now, but what is the bloody hardship in the manufacturers doing both, a proper factory restore disk and recovery partition for customers, or what about Microsoft supplying it on Disk without the crap.

Windows 7 will end up being the same once the manufacturers add all the **** to their laptops. I don't understand the idea with these manufacturers that more is better. I hope they continue doing this, because it just mean more people come to Ubuntu and other distros.

[Johnsie]

Vista sucks. On the other hand Windows 7 is pretty good. I'm a Technet subscriber so I'll be downloading my copy of Windows 7 Final tomorrow :-)

Looking forward to installing it.

[RiceMonster]

a safer crossplatform messaging client (pidgin)

safe, as in storing your passwords in plain text?

[geoken]

You must be reading my mind. My new laptop arrived yesterday, it must have taken 15 - 20 mins just doing the initial setup, and saying NO NO NO to registering all the crap that came on it. Then a popup asked if If I wanted to create a factory restore disk. This required 3 DVDs, yes 3 DVD's.

I got 50% through the burning the first DVD and got a write error. I tried again and it worked. After this I removed Vista completely and installed Ubuntu.

Just one of the reasons why I love Ubuntu.

I think it's disgusting that they don't even supply the OS on disk anymore.
I know the restore partition has been going for some time now, but what is the bloody hardship in the manufacturers doing both, a proper factory restore disk and recovery partition for customers, or what about Microsoft supplying it on Disk without the crap.

Windows 7 will end up being the same once the manufacturers add all the **** to their laptops. I don't understand the idea with these manufacturers that more is better. I hope they continue doing this, because it just mean more people come to Ubuntu and other distros.

In fairness, I think people should realize that many of the issues being raised with vista in this thread have nothing to do with Vista itself but are actually the fault of the manufacturers.

For example, a clean Vista install asks no more questions than a basic Ubuntu install. It will fire up a partitioner (which like Ubuntu, can be told to just look for the largest free partition) ask you some language and localization questions, then proceed with the remainder of the install by itself.

Also, Microsoft will not sell you a copy of Windows without a disk so your issue with restore partitions should obviously be directed at OEM's.

[Majorix]

Vista is just as much of a driver hell as XP, thankfully though, most computer makes I deal with have good support sections, with plenty of driver downloads available.

Well my copy of Vista didn't require ANY additional drivers to be installed. Neither did Windows 7.

Don't get me wrong, I am not a fanboy of Windows, not at all. I just had to react because the OP made an unfair comment.

[Johnsie]

I prefer the windows installers. While the Ubuntu installer has improved it is still a fail at the partitioning stage. A user should not be presented with a whole bunch of technical jargon at this stage. User who want the jargon should have a medium-advanced mode for installation. The slider is a good idea, but all the other technical stuff just makes it confusing for newbies. Keep it simple stupid. Not everyone wants or has time to learn what ext3 and boot partitions are, that's for hobbyists and technical professionals.

Also, Ubuntu should release a .exe download that automatically burns the cd or makes a USB stick for Windows users who don't know what iso files are or how to burn them.



What would you like to do?

1. Burn an Ubuntu installer cd
2. Put an Ubuntu installer on your pen drive






Thanks, your Ubuntu cd/usb is now ready. You will need to restart your computer. Click here to find out how to boot from a your cd or usb stick.







Little things like that would make it easier and more convenient for people to switch to Ubuntu.

[BrokenKingpin]

I'm sure your 30 minute experience is a valid evaluation of an Operating System.
This ^

I used Vista for about 6 months on one of my machines. I didn't hate it as much as I expected. The biggest problem I had with it is that it started to "breakdown" after a few months.

I have higher hopes for Windows 7.

[sydbat]

I prefer the windows installers. While the Ubuntu installer has improved it is still a fail at the partitioning stage. A user should not be presented with a whole bunch of technical jargon at this stage. User who want the jargon should have a medium-advanced mode for installation. The slider is a good idea, but all the other technical stuff just makes it confusing for newbies. Keep it simple stupid. Not everyone wants or has time to learn what ext3 and boot partitions are, that's for hobbyists and technical professionals.I disagree. If you are installing any OS, you really should have some clue as to what you are doing.


Also, Ubuntu should release a .exe download that automatically burns the cd or makes a USB stick for Windows users who don't know what iso files are or how to burn them.


Quote:
What would you like to do?

1. Burn an Ubuntu installer cd
2. Put an Ubuntu installer on your pen drive

Quote:
Thanks, your Ubuntu cd/usb is now ready. You will need to restart your computer. Click here to find out how to boot from a your cd or usb stick.


Little things like that would make it easier and more convenient for people to switch to Ubuntu.I like this idea. It would solve alot of problems people have understanding what an .iso is and how to properly burn it.

@epsolon77 - Your "My wife REQUIRES a microsoft product (until I upgrade her again to "Windows 7" --read as kubuntu with a microsoft looking skin--)" idea is, IMHO, really bad. Trying to fool someone into believing that they are using something they are not will only result in anger toward you for lying, and hurt the trust your wife has for you.

[sydbat]

This ^

I used Vista for about 6 months on one of my machines. I didn't hate it as much as I expected. The biggest problem I had with it is that it started to "breakdown" after a few months.

I have higher hopes for Windows 7.Why do people always fall for this. I can guarantee that people with the same "it'll be better cuz it's new" attitude, will be posting here and elsewhere that Windows 7 sux, etc and complain about giving Microsoft yet more of their money for the same old, same old.

All OS's have their problems. Some are minor, some are major. But I would rather have a few minor problems with a free open source OS than minor AND major problems with an OS that I continue to pay, and pay, and pay, and pay, and pay (get the idea?) for...

My $.3/4

[Arup]

I didn't need any drivers other than my nVidia graphics & Realtek HD Audio drivers, which are needed on Linux too, where's the problem with that?
Could never find a proper working wireless driver for my Wireless on Linux, though...

.net isn't really much of an issue either, it will give you a link to download it on most cases, so I have to install another thing manually and not have Aptitude or Synaptic do it for me, so what.

Updating is one click too.

And Ubuntu is heavily bloated with crap, granted, not as much, but there is a lot.

This post isn't me saying Windows is better, because I feel it isn't in some cases, where others it is. All this has been said before, anyway.

And the "lolflag"x7 is real mature btw...


Your statement that Ubuntu is as bloated as Windows is quite mature, you haven't the foggiest about Linux or Ubuntu in general, you are just one of those typical dyed in wool M$ fanboi trolling around in Ubuntu forum just for the heck of it.

Downloading and installing .net is one click? You need to find it first in MS's confusing web interface. Same goes for all the drivers, first you need to identify the drivers, then the manufacturers and finally the latest drivers. Its not an out of box one click affair as you so put it. Where is the HIPS, AV bloat in Ubuntu? Have you seen how long it takes for Windows to come to a functional desktop compared to Ubuntu or Fedora? I am sure you will deny that as well How did you come up with that wild conclusion is beyond logic in every sense. Updating in Windows is one click?????? First you go to Windows update site, it then updates your browser with latest update version, then after a prolonged search, it finds and recommends updates. To install any software, all I have to do is go to synaptic or add remove, in case of Windows, I need to do a search on web or Filehippo, Fileforum and similar sites. If I need latest version of the installed program updated, all I need to do in Ubuntu is add the requisite PPA, not so in Windows even though programs like SUMO etc. are making a feeble attempt to emulate the Linux model of upgrade path. Also don't forget the validation headache MS puts you through for upgrade and that dont' work with any other browser except IE, same goes for Windows update.

The fact you call Ubuntu a bloat comparable to Windows and yet hang out in Ubuntu forum clearly defines your true intent.

[frup]

I have been using nothing but Linux from the day I installed Linux for the first time in 2005.

I equate my ability to use nothing but Linux from the get go to Linux's usability; for me it is ready for the Desktop. This obviously is not so for all people.

Since vista was released I have had various experiences with Vista and XP on other peoples machines. These have never lasted more than 30 minutes and have all been horrible. A lot of Vista machines really are unusable. It is hard to explain some of the problems that occur like wireless just going down, reinstall is the only thing that fixes the problem.

It's weird but you'd think Linux should have these problems but it doesn't.

But what I find important to remember is that as time goes by I am becoming less and less familiar with the windows environment. It doesn't react as I expect it to. This isn't a windows problem it is my own unfamiliarity.

Recently I installed windows on a friend of mine's (I have a German/English mental blank on how this should be spelt/used right now) computer. In 2005 this would have been easy for me, but it was very hard.

It didn't help that no ethernet drivers were detected out of the box on a sp2 disc where the computer is only a p4 whitebox machine.

What I am trying to say I guess is windows is bad, I personally hate it, I began using Linux because it didn't work for me. But what I am finding is that most of the problems I have are because I don't know how to use it any more.

To someone who doesn't know how to use Linux, Linux is possibly just as bad but most of us understand it. Many of us no longer understand windows.

In 4 years I have only ever used windows at my various work places (all win2000 ironically). At work I am not using windows but the apps which run on top of it (various propriety databases, lotus notes, etc.)

Just wanted to add my perspective.

[Mmmbopdowedop]

Your statement that Ubuntu is as bloated as Windows is quite mature, you haven't the foggiest about Linux or Ubuntu in general, you are just one of those typical dyed in wool M$ fanboi trolling around in Ubuntu forum just for the heck of it.

Downloading and installing .net is one click? You need to find it first in MS's confusing web interface. Same goes for all the drivers, first you need to identify the drivers, then the manufacturers and finally the latest drivers. Its not an out of box one click affair as you so put it. Where is the HIPS, AV bloat in Ubuntu? Have you seen how long it takes for Windows to come to a functional desktop compared to Ubuntu or Fedora? I am sure you will deny that as well How did you come up with that wild conclusion is beyond logic in every sense. Updating in Windows is one click?????? First you go to Windows update site, it then updates your browser with latest update version, then after a prolonged search, it finds and recommends updates. To install any software, all I have to do is go to synaptic or add remove, in case of Windows, I need to do a search on web or Filehippo, Fileforum and similar sites. If I need latest version of the installed program updated, all I need to do in Ubuntu is add the requisite PPA, not so in Windows even though programs like SUMO etc. are making a feeble attempt to emulate the Linux model of upgrade path. Also don't forget the validation headache MS puts you through for upgrade and that dont' work with any other browser except IE, same goes for Windows update.

The fact you call Ubuntu a bloat comparable to Windows and yet hang out in Ubuntu forum clearly defines your true intent.

Erm, what?

As I said, I prefer Debian over Windows, yes, that makes me a MS fanboy, surely.

The debate wasn't about `synaptic`, it's just stupid what you are doing by dissing an OS just because it does things differently.

MS doesn't have access to all the drivers and such as someone pointed out in a post, they can't include everything nor have everything in one place to update with one piece of software, that's fine.

And again, the same with drivers as I said earlier, you need to do the same in Linux, idiot.

I could describe every step to install/set something up in Ubuntu and make it sound as tedious as you make it sound in Windows, but it's pointless.

Think about what you're saying, you sound more of a Linux fanboy than I do a MS one.

[ibuclaw]

Locked. Original post is not being addressed.