The Reason Linux Video Editors are Lame

[Anastasis]

The reason? I have no idea. I just know they are. It's not that they are lame, it is that they are counter-intuitive and have a sharp learning curve. This is not the case with Windows Movie Maker. It is intuitive, simple, and effective for the average user who wants to make family video presentations, slide show and music mashups, etc...

I thought my problems were solved. I thought I had found the answer in Kdenlive. But alas, my day has ended in disappointment. Kdenlive claims that its program is easy and intuitive - but it isn't. In fact, it doesn't make much sense at all. Yes, most of the abilities of WMM are available, but some are not, and that is what makes it SO annoying. And the user interface is emphatically counter-intuitive.

This is really disturbing. And before someone clamours up that Linux editors are just are easy and good as Windows Movie Maker, I as a loyal and ardent Ubuntu user am here to tell you that you are wrong and are blinding yourself to the truth of the matter.

Fact is, Windows Movie Maker has the Linux Video Editor beat around a tether pole. And until a smart and creative programmer or group of programmers comes to this realization and decides to change the tide, Linux will continue to alienate would be users.

And what is really remarkable about this whole scenario is, this one single issue could play a major factor in why are great majority of PC users simply could not make the switch to Linux. It just won't quite do what Windows will yet. And that is just enough to make it annoying enough to refuse.

[NFblaze]

I havent used any Vid Editors on Linux. I can say for a fact tho that Windows Movie Maker is utter garbage. Too simple, garbage effects. I'd suggest Sony Vegas

[keplerspeed]

Have you tried other video editors such as avidemux, kino or ubuntu studio packages? Learning curves are not BAD, they are learning. Learning is good.

I think it depends on what you are trying to do. I think blind statements such as 'linux video editors are lame' are pointless. How about explaining what you need to do and the issues you are having. Maybe you havnt found that 'nonlame' editor you are after.

Windows Movie Maker is probably fantastic (sounds like its rubbish though lol...). If these linux editors are so counter-intuitive, why dont you help make them less 'lame'??

Options:
PiTiVi ( http://www.pitivi.org/wiki/Main_Page )
LiVES ( http://lives.sourceforge.net/ )
Open Movie Editor ( http://openmovieeditor.sourceforge.net/HomePage )
Avidemux ( http://fixounet.free.fr/avidemux/ )
Cinelerra ( http://cvs.cinelerra.org/ )
kdenlive ( http://kdenlive.sourceforge.net/ )

[Anastasis]

I havent used any Vid Editors on Linux. I can say for a fact tho that Windows Movie Maker is utter garbage. Too simple, garbage effects. I'd suggest Sony Vegas

You're wrong. Windows Movie Maker may be simple, but that is the very reason it is so good for the average non-technical user. It is intuitive and does everything that an average user wants and needs in a non-technical 'youtube' machine. This has nothing to do with high end video editors. Linux is rife with those, and they fill a need for the technical and professional user. But as far as reaching and availing itself to the average user in simple and intuitive video editors, Linux gets an F. And there are a lot of people who agree with my sentiments. They are same lot of people who will never be able to switch to Linux until Linux begins to address the average user on the same scale as does Microsoft.

[Anastasis]

Have you tried other video editors such as avidemux, kino or ubuntu studio packages? Learning curves are not BAD, they are learning. Learning is good.

I think it depends on what you are trying to do. I think blind statements such as 'linux video editors are lame' are pointless. How about explaining what you need to do and the issues you are having. Maybe you havnt found that 'nonlame' editor you are after.

Windows Movie Maker is probably fantastic (sounds like its rubbish though lol...). If these linux editors are so counter-intuitive, why dont you help make them less 'lame'??

Two things: I have tried them all, and learning curves ARE bad. Learning curves are bad in regard to dinky video editors because Windows Movie Maker has absolutely no learning curve at all. It is purely intuitive and powerful enough for the average home user.

The point I'm trying to make is the very point that I am certain will seem the most distasteful to the Linux affection-ado, of which I myself am one - Linux video editors SUCK!

[ad_267]

Honestly, I tried Windows Movie Maker once and couldn't figure it out. Maybe I'm stupid. I tried Kdenlive recently and it all made sense and was pretty easy to use.

[keplerspeed]

We are all granted an opinion. When was learning ever a bad thing?

I can see where you are coming from. Ubuntu is not as easy sometimes as win. That is because win is aimed at the masses, of any technical level. To develop easy to use software takes time, and time is usually money. Remember this is open source software.

The only way to improve this software is to support it.

[Anastasis]

Honestly, I tried Windows Movie Maker once and couldn't figure it out. Maybe I'm stupid. I tried Kdenlive recently and it all made sense and was pretty easy to use.

I've tried them both, and on the surface, Kdenlive does seem to be pretty intuitive. And I'm sure that once one has passed the learning curve involved, Kdenlive is and can be a very powerful video editor. But in comparison between the rate of learning the actual functions of the user interface, I can honestly say that I learned everything I would ever need to know or do with WMM in about 3 hours. Not so with Kdenlive. It took massive search on the internet just to figure out how to insert an MP3, and when I figured out how to do so, it was the 'intuitive' guess that made any sense.

What I'm saying is Windows is the Cut N Paste / Drag N Drop King. Windows invented and has slowly perfected the idea through the decades, in in sheer dumb no-brainer usage, they still have a slight edge on Linux, though Ubuntu is rapidly changing that paradigm.

My point in all of this is that the door is still wide open for video editing programs for Linux. There is a real and tangible consternation under the surface about this situation and one may see evidence of it on the net. Why do you suppose that so many are searching for a Linux clone of Windows Movie Maker? When they write that, that is exactly what they mean. They don't want a high end video editor. Nor do they want a retarded product like Kino, or one overly obtuse and counter-intuitive like OME or Kdenlive. THEY WANT A WINDOWS MOVIE MAKER CLONE. Pure and simple.

I don't know how Microsoft, a company which has championed unstable and unworthy platforms for years could get it so right on a basic video editor, but they did.

[ad_267]

So what are you doing to help? There's one of these "Linux video editors suck" posts every day. If you care so much go out and support one of the video editors to make it better.

[keplerspeed]

'perfected'... slight exaggeration.. Maybe im biased but microsft and perfection usually dont go together.

I think you should try avidemux. Or maybe you could start coding the WMM clone?

[Anastasis]

We are all granted an opinion. When was learning ever a bad thing?

I can see where you are coming from. Ubuntu is not as easy sometimes as win. That is because win is aimed at the masses, of any technical level. To develop easy to use software takes time, and time is usually money. Remember this is open source software.

The only way to improve this software is to support it.

The only time when a learning curve is bad is when it shouldn't exist. It didn't exist when learning Windows Movie Maker and it shouldn't exist in learning the Linux alternative, which does not exist.

I am aware and empathetic that this is open source software. I am grateful and thankfull to all Linux developers and especially Ubuntu in all its respective forms. But my point still stands. This is a real need that has not been filled by Linux as a whole. The door is wide open for someone or many to fill this void.

If it is filled and filled in the right way, you might be amazed at how many more Linux users would arrive on the scene. I would build a Windows Movie Maker clone from scratch if I had the time just to be rid of the annoyance. But I don't have time and I can't exactly go and get a basic degree in computer science and programming at the moment, otherwise I WOULD.

[ad_267]

You would probably be better off helping an existing project rather than creating yet another Linux video editor. And there are other things you can do to help than just programming.

[dmizer]

Since this isn't really a request for support, I've moved this to recurring discussions.

Thank you :)

[Anastasis]

I fully realized when I made these remarks that they shood a fair chance of being met with smug contempt. But I'm making them anyway because they need to be made.

This little issue about video editors is a much bigger issue than previously thought especially when one considers that we live in the age and advent of YouTube and all its respective clones of late.

Contemn the issue if you will, but development in this area will only shoot itself in the foot if the problem is not addressed in a real way.

[ad_267]

This isn't the place to raise the issue. You're talking to Ubuntu users here, not developers, and we get plenty of threads complaining about video editors in Linux. You're not helping by adding to the pile. If you want to help things then contact the developers of applications with advice on how you think the application interface could be improved.

[feardotcom]

'perfected'... slight exaggeration.. Maybe im biased but microsft and perfection usually dont go together.

Aint that the truth!!!

If you donjt like linux or the video editors, why dont you just go back to windows and quit complaining about it. Obviously you are hear to stir the ***** in the pot. Other wise you would have asked for help instead of complain.


I don't know how Microsoft, a company which has championed unstable and unworthy platforms for years could get it so right on a basic video editor, but they did.

Because Windows Movie Maker is made for idiots, not professionals. I personally hate windows movie maker, i think its garbage and waste of hard drive space, but thats just my thoughts on it. Most linux video editors that i have seen are for professionals, doing REAL video work, with effects, green screening, and compositing. Not just for adding fade effects, and swirl effects and a song in the background.

[keplerspeed]

I was being a little cheeky, I didnt seriously mean another editor... I think a focused approach would be more effective.


Aint that the truth!!!

Oh yes.

[feardotcom]

I mean comparing windows media player to some of the linux video editors is like comparing an apple to a banana.

Its like comparing windows recorder to pro tools. One is simple and useless, the other is very effective BUT can also be complicated.

[Anastasis]

Here's what I'll do to help; and as an added bonus, I would like all the naysayers and blindly loyalistic Linuxofiles to understand that I do not care one wit for your snides. I'm complaining and going to keep complaining because I LIKE Linux and want this stupid and unnecessary issue resolved. And it can be easily solved if a programmer will simply learn how to make a user interface. And here is the solution to making a user interface that will solve all the whining about Linux Video Editors and end the problem once and for all.

TASK

Import


From Digital Video Camera
Videos
Pictures
Audio or Music

Edit



Imported Media
Effects
Transitions
Titles and Credits

Publish to



This Computer
DVD
Recorable CD
EMAIL
Digital Video Camera

Then add a Timeline and/or Story board bar and YOU'RE FINISHED. That's it. That all the user interface has to be. It isn't hard. It isn't rocket science. It's just a dumb video editor that actually works, is intuitive, requires no learning curve to be overcome, and fit for the average user who wants to make YouTube mashups in about 20 minutes.

So are you telling me that you bunch of Linux mergatroids and geniuses can't smack something like that up in about a week or so? Ridiculous.

Do you have any idea how many more people would be attracted to Linux if you did? A LOT!

[NFblaze]

Two things: I have tried them all, and learning curves ARE bad. Learning curves are bad in regard to dinky video editors because Windows Movie Maker has absolutely no learning curve at all. It is purely intuitive and powerful enough for the average home user.

The point I'm trying to make is the very point that I am certain will seem the most distasteful to the Linux affection-ado, of which I myself am one - Linux video editors SUCK!

Ok, well if you want to use something simple to produce simple videos than why not keep Windows installed and use it to produce your videos. Simple as that.

I dont know what it is with users nowadays or if its just because with every new release of Windows they make it more computer-friendly and oversimplify so that users no longer feel like they need to learn or to think. It seems like Windows breeds a dependence on point, point, click, enter. I mean, nowadays I dont always feel like learning something the official way (aka reading the manual) like with GIMP I usually solve this 2 ways. I either load up GIMP and just start playing around discovering new things, or I use a preferred alternative that I have knowledge on how to use (like Paint.NET in Windows).

Although, not everything can be like that like switching to Linux from Windows. Sometimes to complete it you have to take the learning curve, fortunately for you, you have the other option of using WMM.

[gashcr]

yeah, being able to be on youtube is the thing that will put linux on the masses...

serioulsly dude, complaining to us will do nothing to solve your issue. Complaining anywhere won't solve your issue. Supporting a project, damn, that would maybe solve your issue. Realize most of the software written as FOSS is made by its users, to solve their issues, in the way they thought more convenient. If you have some suggestions, contact the developers of those apps and work with them, but please, stop complaining.

[Anastasis]

Ok, well if you want to use something simple to produce simple videos than why not keep Windows installed and use it to produce your videos. Simple as that.

I dont know what it is with users nowadays or if its just because with every new release of Windows they make it more computer-friendly and oversimplify so that users no longer feel like they need to learn or to think. It seems like Windows breeds a dependence on point, point, click, enter. I mean, nowadays I dont always feel like learning something the official way (aka reading the manual) like with GIMP I usually solve this 2 ways. I either load up GIMP and just start playing around discovering new things, or I use a preferred alternative that I have knowledge on how to use (like Paint.NET in Windows).

Although, not everything can be like that like switching to Linux from Windows. Sometimes to complete it you have to take the learning curve, fortunately for you, you have the other option of using WMM.

The short answer to that question is that I hate Windows. Honestly, I really and actually have had years of grief from Windows through unstable bugs in the platform itself, poor performance, egregiously expensive software, and unnessary viruses by which an anti-virus/virus empire has been built which never should have had to be built. I'm finished with Windows. But I'm not going to let Linux alone until it is superior in every way to Windows. Because the fact of the matter is Linux is both now superior to Windows and can be far more superior to anything Microsoft can produce and it can do so with community support and development alone. I believe there is enough talent in the Linux community to beat Microsoft in every way conceivable. Making a video editor which fills a void and a real need for the average PC user is just one of those ways.

[NFblaze]

Here's what I'll do to help; and as an added bonus, [snip] And it can be easily solved if a programmer will simply learn how to make a user interface. And here is the solution to making a user interface that will solve all the whining about Linux Video Editors and end the problem once and for all.

TASK

Import


From Digital Video Camera
Videos
Pictures
Audio or Music

Edit



Imported Media
Effects
Transitions
Titles and Credits

Publish to



This Computer
DVD
Recorable CD
EMAIL
Digital Video Camera


[snip]

So are you telling me that you bunch of Linux mergatroids and geniuses can't smack something like that up in about a week or so? Ridiculous.

Do you have any idea how many more people would be attracted to Linux if you did? A LOT!

Also, why are you complaining to us? Most of the normal users are like you, lacking any/enough skill to write a program to your specifications. If you want something like that so much, can you bankroll a project like that? If, so they have a ton of coders in India who will take your order like that, and will try to implement everything you specified.

[Anastasis]

yeah, being able to be on youtube is the thing that will put linux on the masses...

serioulsly dude, complaining to us will do nothing to solve your issue. Complaining anywhere won't solve your issue. Supporting a project, ***, that would maybe solve your issue. Realize most of the software written as FOSS is made by its users, to solve their issues, in the way they thought more convenient. If you have some suggestions, contact the developers of those apps and work with them, but please, stop complaining.

What I've written could be taken positively or negatively. If you're a stupid, arrogant *******, you'll probably only find contempt for what I've written. If you're smart and a programmer, you'll capitalize on it.

[Anastasis]

Also, why are you complaining to us? Most of the normal users are like you, lacking any/enough skill to write a program to your specifications. If you want something like that so much, can you bankroll a project like that? If, so they have a ton of coders in India who will take your order like that, and will try to implement everything you specified.

Why am I complaining about this issue on an Ubuntu forum among my fellow Ubuntuers? Simply put because I believe in chaos theory and the butterfly effect.

[NFblaze]

Yet, again most of us arent coders. So, maybe if you started complaining to the right people or organizations you'd have a better chance of resolution. That or bankroll a project.

Well, I have to go try and see if I can meet Stephen Colbert. So good luck.

[Anastasis]

Yet, again most of us arent coders. So, maybe if you started complaining to the right people or organizations you'd have a better chance of resolution. That or bankroll a project.

Well, I have to go try and see if I can meet Stephen Colbert. So good luck.

Thanks NF. I understand your point of view. But in an etherial environment like the Internet where every one point A is connected with every other point B, we have in effect a microcrosmic 4th dimensional universe which obeys the same laws as the bigger universe. Therefore I can be certain that this same chaos effect will occure within this environment.

My Wind of Whinning will be blown to its proper place through the etherial currents.

[feardotcom]

Dude, seriously, chill, go take some prozac, or your anti-psychotic meds, and have a beer or two. Take a deep breath and log on to a linux development forum asking for a request, or just simply start a sourceforge project.

[feardotcom]

AND its not just that simple. Coding a program like you want is complicated, far beyond my level of knowledge, Sure the user interface is easy to design. But its not just something you can code in realbasic in a matter of hours. I dont think you could even code that in realbasic, it probably either has to be java or c/c++.

[Anastasis]

Dude, seriously, chill, go take some prozac, or your anti-psychotic meds, and have a beer or two. Take a deep breath and log on to a linux development forum asking for a request, or just simply start a sourceforge project.

I would do the whole thing if I had the wherewithal. But my programming doesn't run that far, and I simply don't have the time. I've done what I can and that is give a user-view of what a video editor should be instead of a programmer-view. That's worth gold in and of itself.

And I'm not worried. This is the net. There's a million people out there right now just wondering how in the world Linux will ever obtain a simple, intuitive, and practical video editor as good as and even superior to WMM, and some of those people are programmers.

As far as my current manic phase of bipolar disorder is concerned, I wouldn't worry too much about it. Every one is bipolar to begin with, and besides, I've spent a long frustrating day with video editors and far too much Starbucks.

Here's the plan.

TASK

Import


From Digital Video Camera
Videos
Pictures
Audio or Music

Edit



Imported Media
Effects
Transitions
Titles and Credits

Publish to



This Computer
DVD
Recorable CD
EMAIL
Digital Video Camera

Then add a Timeline and/or Story board bar and YOU'RE FINISHED. That's it. That all the user interface has to be. It isn't hard. It isn't rocket science. It's just a dumb video editor that actually works, is intuitive, requires no learning curve to be overcome, and fit for the average user who wants to make YouTube mashups in about 20 minutes.

[gashcr]

What I've written could be taken positively or negatively. If you're a stupid, arrogant *******, you'll probably only find contempt for what I've written. If you're smart and a programmer, you'll capitalize on it.

No, as a smart developer, which I happen to be, I only see contempt for what you've written. I see a lot of complaining about other's work and no contribution at all. I would never start a project motivated by the fact some random guy complained in a forum because he thought none of the solutions offered freely by the community were enough. And I'm sure no developer for those projects would neither.

You want results, give constructive feedback to the right people.

Oh, if you are so sick of windows, and so dissapointed of linux video apps, get a mac, imovie is pretty nice (and years ahead of WMM by the way)

[TheNosh]

What I've written could be taken positively or negatively. If you're a stupid, arrogant *******, you'll probably only find contempt for what I've written. If you're smart and a programmer, you'll capitalize on it.

"stupid, arrogant *******" can pretty much be taken only one way

[Anastasis]

No, as a smart developer, which I happen to be, I only see contempt for what you've written. I see a lot of complaining about other's work and no contribution at all. I would never start a project motivated by the fact some random guy complained in a forum because he thought none of the solutions offered freely by the community were enough. And I'm sure no developer for those projects would neither.

You want results, give constructive feedback to the right people.

Oh, if you are so sick of windows, and so dissapointed of linux video apps, get a mac, imovie is pretty nice (and years ahead of WMM by the way)

I can appreciate that.

Now here's the basic plan

TASK

Import


From Digital Video Camera
Videos
Pictures
Audio or Music

Edit



Imported Media
Effects
Transitions
Titles and Credits

Publish to



This Computer
DVD
Recorable CD
EMAIL
Digital Video Camera

Then add a Timeline and/or Story board bar and YOU'RE FINISHED. That's it. That all the user interface has to be. It isn't hard. It isn't rocket science. It's just a dumb video editor that actually works, is intuitive, requires no learning curve to be overcome, and fit for the average user who wants to make YouTube mashups in about 20 minutes.

[feardotcom]

Again its not that easy. Have you thought about checking WineHQ AppDB to see if WMM runs?

[TheNosh]

Again its not that easy. Have you thought about checking WineHQ AppDB to see if WMM runs?

i just checked, and it seems the answer is no

[Anastasis]

AND its not just that simple. Coding a program like you want is complicated, far beyond my level of knowledge, Sure the user interface is easy to design. But its not just something you can code in realbasic in a matter of hours. I dont think you could even code that in realbasic, it probably either has to be java or c/c++.

c++ is a good suggestion. A developer might want to use that very language for building the nuts and bolts of this simple and intuitive user interface. I don't think it would be too overly difficult to muster for one adept in c++ either. There are in fact several basic video editors already written in c itself that are open source.

You might look into this.

[TheNosh]

Now here's the basic plan

TASK

Import


From Digital Video Camera
Videos
Pictures
Audio or Music

Edit



Imported Media
Effects
Transitions
Titles and Credits

Publish to



This Computer
DVD
Recorable CD
EMAIL
Digital Video Camera


must you really repeat your task list again?

[Anastasis]

must you really repeat your task list again?

It was only for the sake of user friendly and intuitive continuity within the thread.

[feardotcom]

Seems like REALBasic MIGHT offer the ability to do what you need it to.

I dont know c++ and im not going to have classes on c++ for a while.

[Anastasis]

Seems like REALBasic MIGHT offer the ability to do what you need it to.

I dont know c++ and im not going to have classes on c++ for a while.

I tell you, it might be a very good learning exercise for someone trying to improve his REALBasic stills.

The thing is it would be a truly valuable addition to the Linux community as well. And it wouldn't necessarily have to be limited to a WMM clone. What it would do functionally however is demonstrate to the average user that they would have to give up nothing in video editing in making the switch from Windows to Linux, and that in fact they could do much more in video editing if they wished.

Listen, this may not be the best place for talking up such a project, but it's what I know. And I may well be a psychotic jerk, but if I am in this case it's for a greater cause and every so often some anomaly of nature occurs and I have a good idea.

This is one of those times.

[feardotcom]

lol, yeah let me see what i can come up with. Its not just going to take a few hours, i may be a few weeks, or even months. Classes start in 3 weeks, so who knows. I will work on what i can to find out how to get video to work in realbasic.

[dmizer]

Have you by chance seen Handbrake (http://handbrake.fr/)?

[feardotcom]

Handbrake looks like its for converting video not combining and compositing.

[Anastasis]

Have you by chance seen Handbrake (http://handbrake.fr/)?

No, d, I have not tried this one. Hadn't even heard of it before now. But at this point I'm willing to try anything. Desperate times call for user friendly and intuitive user interfaces on movie editors. And I'm a stranger in a strange land trying to find my way to that Mecca, that Oasis of joy and ease once again.

[keplerspeed]

And as mentioned earlier, why build 'another' video editor?? There are plenty of projects underway.

Open software is developed by US. Not me atm, as I still learning the basics. Its takes time, time that excellent programmers and developers DONATE to the community.

I think you will find that many current editing projects have a similar 'plan' that you keep repeating Anastasis. Your plan is already underway my friend... it just needs time, effort, plus a lot of coding. Which takes time.

[Anastasis]

And as mentioned earlier, why build 'another' video editor?? There are plenty of projects underway.

Open software is developed by US. Not me atm, as I still learning the basics. Its takes time, time that excellent programmers and developers DONATE to the community.

I think you will find that many current editing projects have a similar 'plan' that you keep repeating Anastasis. Your plan is already underway my friend... it just needs time, effort, plus a lot of coding. Which takes time.

Well it's like fdc said, it's something that can be looked into. And I'm sure you're right that there are projects underway, I'm simply saying that I believe the door for such a project is still wide open. And one of the elements that many involved in these projects might be missing is the 'stupid' factor. The 'stupid' factor is that very quintessential factor that we are aiming at in making cheesy youtube videos of say, my worthless cat chasing crows out in the field, or my dog trying to mate with my neighbour's leg and so forth.

And furthermore, the one who actually made such a simple WMM-like user interface would be like King Arthor pulling the sword out of the stone. He would be like the gladiator who restored the Republic. People would say, Who made such a wonderful program which has restored the good name of Linux and video editors everywhere? And then the citizenry would state collectively it was Maximus the programmer. Maximus the just and noble.

[feardotcom]

...or my dog trying to mate with my neighbors' leg and so forth...
That would actually be pretty damn funny.

but yeah, these things take time.

[feardotcom]

Oh and have you tried Kino? I think its really good. Its alittle more complex, not much, than WMM but does alot more. I tinkered around with it Sat morning.

[Anastasis]

Oh and have you tried Kino? I think its really good. Its alittle more complex, not much, than WMM but does alot more. I tinkered around with it Sat morning.

Kino is more powerful than WMM. Kino is more capable that WMM. Kino is more evolved than WMM.

BUT

Kino is not more intuitive than WMM. And that's the rub.

AND

For the average user, and I do gringe to say it and shudder in fear and loathing at the spite of the Linux community worldwide, WMM is better suited for the purpose it was created.

I've done all I can do. It is now in the hands of those far more capable than I to see the Vision made a reality.

But if the vision were ever capitulated, it would set Ubuntu forth on a grand new saffari and make the Kaola, the Ibex, and the Jackalope, along with all their future heirs the very top of the platform food chain.

And besides, just imagine how good it would make the Linux community feel to be able to finally shut people like me up for good.

I mean, just imagine the possibilities.

[feardotcom]

Yeah, Yeah, calm down. Those possibilities may not even be there, im not sure if i can even do this in realbasic. Not like its something i know how to do already.

[bolex100]

I have to agree with the O.P.
kino crashes more often than starbug.
I just got Cinelerra to run MP4. However I haven't been able to render anything to an AVI format (no frames found).
Movimaker just works.

However I have attempted post like this myself and the result is just to get flamed and told to support the project. I tried to find out who actually uses audio creation software. Everyone said it was easy and I should stop asking questions but no one actually confessed to actually using it successfully. I suspect that video is the same.

I suspect that the main reason is that the manuals are incomplete and out of date. I would like to support these project by adding to the manuals (The online cinelerra one seems to be from 2004) or reporting bugs however.

IN ORDER TO HELP, I NEED TO HAVE SOFTWARE THAT WORKS. THESE DON'T. THEY JUST DON'T


Go one then. Flame me (but realise that its just ignorant bravardo - or tell me (and anyone else on the forum) how to make it run - or shut up.

[Changturkey]

What about kdenlive?

[yoasif]

IN ORDER TO HELP, I NEED TO HAVE SOFTWARE THAT WORKS. THESE DON'T. THEY JUST DON'Ti would recommend that you file bugs and ask for help with specific issues, since it's a lot easier to help when people know what you are trying to do.

a blanket complaint like "make it like movie maker" isn't very helpful, especially if the developers haven't used it.

also, if you want to talk about a good movie editor, i think the comparison should be to older versions of apple's imovie, or their final cut pro product. movie maker is... not so good (not that the linux movie apps are better, i honestly haven't tried any).

[feardotcom]

I said i was going to try and see if realbasic would be able to handle this project and its needs, if not then i will learn c/c++, but its going to take time.

[Anastasis]

The Toufee Solution www.toufee.com

After a long evening of once again searching for some video editing solution for linux that would be apt for the average, inexperienced, non-technical home user, I think I finally have found the thing that will do the trick. It's flash video, but that's on the right path for youtubing and other such online video hosting sites anyway.

But before I do, I would simply say that those who can only find condescension in their hearts for WMM are fooling themselves. I and many others beside myself recognize the fact that Windows Movie Maker is the very piece of software from which about 90 percent, if not more, Youtube videos come. It is a well designed, well thought out, intuitive, and inclusive piece of software for the home user. Microsoft has multi-million dollar budgets in order to make sure that, while their platform itself continues to be bug ridden, unstable, memory hungery, and extravagantly expensive, their software is easy to use and usually almost void of any added learning curves. It is for that reason and that reason alone that Microsoft Windows and its respective software remains numero Uno in the world. And as much as people may hate to hear that, it remains the truth of the matter. Ubuntu Linux is the only actual Linux alternative in existance right now for the real market. The Ubuntu development is the only branch of Linux developement that has ever acknowledged the reality of why Windows beats the rest of the pack with an inferior product. It is because Windows developement understands and also has understood this one principle -- it's about the user interface, stupid!

Now, to the solution that is actually workable for the average user of Linux who wants to make home movies to upload on the net that actually have Text and Title implements which may be found by someone other than the person who wrote the program.

TOUFEE.COM The world's easiest flash video editor. Here is a real example of what intuitive is all about. No learning curves are presented. It's simple, effective, and perfectly suited to the home user trying to put together mashups for this, that, and the other. It's online, but we can live without right now since the intuitive Linux based video editor is a concept currently foreign to the world.

I can do most of what I can do on WMM, and I won't have to leave Ubuntu to do it now.

So, problem solved ... for the moment. But Linux video editing developers had better get their act together. But I have tried every conceivable video editor for linux in the past 3 days and they are all rife with unnessesary complexities and bugs, and what's even more annoying is that when ever you do actually find out how to do something such as add text and titles you find that you are not able to do it in any fashion at all that is desirable or will not take up far too much of your time.

So I conclude my rant. And I am satified for the moment. But this linux video editor situation must change and change quickly if linux stills wants to be taken seriously.