torrent legality question

[cody7002002]

Is torrenting a movie illegal if you already own a physical copy of said movie and are using it for backup purposes only?

[mister_pink]

It probably depends on where you live (and of course, I'm not a lawyer), but I'm pretty sure that in general the answer is no. (Edit: Just realised this isn't clear - I meant no, its not legal!)

In fact, in general, whenever anyone has to ask "Is X legal?", the answer is probably no.

[Tibuda]

This is a interesting question. I can only say it is as legal as ripping it for backup purposes.

[Sealbhach]

I'd imagine torrenting comes under "unauthorized distribution".

.

[Depressed Man]

Is torrenting a movie illegal if you already own a physical copy of said movie and are using it for backup purposes only?

In most courts around the world (sadly) I would say yes. Because torrenting also involves uploading pieces of the file to others.

[CJ Master]

Is torrenting a movie illegal if you already own a physical copy of said movie and are using it for backup purposes only?

Yes, but if you want a backup just rip the dvd. :)

[Groucho Marxist]

Is torrenting a movie illegal if you already own a physical copy of said movie and are using it for backup purposes only?

Due to the dastardly "Digital Millennium Copyright Act," the process of breaking the encryption codes on a commercial DVD (which is necessary for ripping and burning said information) is what lands everyone in the "Big House."

In short, it is definitely illegal even for the purposes of archiving information.

[ad_267]

Is torrenting a movie illegal if you already own a physical copy of said movie and are using it for backup purposes only?

Even if it's for backup purposes only, you're actually sharing that movie with many other uses by torrenting it. So definitely no.

[Therion]

Assuming you are in the United States, you are legally entitled to make ONE, personal use backup of your legitimately purchased media under Fair Use laws.

However, it is NOT legal to upload, or download, "copies" of copyrighted material for either distribution or personal use. So, while it IS legal for you to make a personal-use backup of your movie, it is NOT legal to do so by downloading it from Pirate Bay (for example).

[SunnyRabbiera]

I say screw "legal", with all this crap with the MPAA and RIAA I side more with the media pirates anymore.

[Depressed Man]

Assuming you are in the United States, you are legally entitled to make ONE, personal use backup of your legitimately purchased media under Fair Use laws.

However, it is NOT legal to upload, or download, "copies" of copyrighted material for either distribution or personal use. So, while it IS legal for you to make a personal-use backup of your movie, it is NOT legal to do so by downloading it from Pirate Bay (for example).

Sadly the Fair Use laws are hindered by the DMCA. In order to make a one personal use backup of your purchased DVD it requires breaking the encryption of the DVD (a DMCA violation).

Which is why I frankly hate all these laws and wish they would go away.

[Eviltechie]

You break encryption = jail

If you can get it without encryption somehow, like videotaping it as you play it, you're good.

[CJ Master]

You break encryption = illegal

If you can get it without encryption somehow, like videotaping it as you play it, you're good.

Fixed.

[qjmoss]

get a seedbox!!!


; )


everyone who agrees +1 it):P

[The Real Dave]

Is torrenting a movie illegal if you already own a physical copy of said movie and are using it for backup purposes only?

If you already own a physical copy, why torrent it? Make a copy your self, using (sorry Windows tools) DVD Shrink and DVD Decrypter, or to convert it to mpeg, DVD Shrink and Handbrake (universal go here (http://handbrake.fr/?article=download)for the .deb)

Oh and in response to your question, who cares? So many people do it, what are the chances that your gonna be spotted?

TPB :D :D


And remember, laws about copyright are usually specific to your area. American rules dont apply elsewhere. They can compalin, but prob wont help Pirate Bays Legal Section (http://thepiratebay.org/legal)

[The Real Dave]

get a seedbox!!!


; )


everyone who agrees +1 it):P

+1

If I had a proper ISP (10Gb Traffic Limit ](*,)) I would do it myself :D

[OffHand]

it's morally legal so who cares?

[Dawei87]

you could also argue over the fact that you "should" legally be allowed to watch the movie anyway you can get your hands on it without giving it to others. technically (i researched this a lot, but forgot some of the terms and specifics so i might make a mistake) when you purchase a dvd you are only purchasing the right to view the media, you dont actually OWN it, which is why they say you cant make copies (the way i understood it, it almost sounded like when you buy a dvd you are permanently renting it). and technically, if you lose or break a dvd but still have your proof of purchase, you should be able to get a free copy sent to you because you already purchased the right to view the media whether you have the original disc or not. but they will still try and screw you in this way and it seems they just pick and choose laws that help them. like how they say you can make a personal backup, but then turn around and say you cant break the encryption, so your stuck. hopefully all this BS goes away eventually though, i mean, its not like they will stop torrenting anyway

[glotz]

Due to the dastardly "Digital Millennium Copyright Act," the process of breaking the encryption codes on a commercial DVD (which is necessary for ripping and burning said information) is what lands everyone in the "Big House."

In short, it is definitely illegal even for the purposes of archiving information.

The DMCA is a yankee doodle. The rest of the world is still free.

[The Real Dave]

The DMCA is a yankee doodle. The rest of the world is still free.

And three cheers for that :lolflag:

[benj1]

my under standing of this is that you are technically breaking the encryption anyway when you play a DVD by software that hasn't been okayed, such as the codecs on medibuntu. (although i may be wrong, feel free to correct me).

[t0p]

The DMCA is a yankee doodle. The rest of the world is still free.

Not necessarily. Take, for instance, the European Union and its infamous Copyright Directive (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EU_Copyright_Directive). Like the USA's DMCA, the Copyright Directive makes circumvention of copy protection (like decrypting a DVD) illegal.

The EU brought about the Copyright Directive in order to comply with the World Intellectual Property Organization Copyright Treaty (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WIPO_Copyright_Treaty), to which the EU is a signatory. Since an awful lot of countries have signed the WIPO Copyright Treaty (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_parties_to_international_copyright_treatie s), I think we'll see a lot more laws like these being passed around the world.

[t0p]

my under standing of this is that you are technically breaking the encryption anyway when you play a DVD by software that hasn't been okayed, such as the codecs on medibuntu. (although i may be wrong, feel free to correct me).

You're not wrong. The libdvdcss is a device that enables circumvention of copy protection, and therefore is illegal.

A lot of this kind of stuff hasn't been tested by the courts yet. But it is still frightening enough that ISPs scurry to obey lawyers bearing takedown notices.

[benj1]

You're not wrong. The libdvdcss is a device that enables circumvention of copy protection, and therefore is illegal.

A lot of this kind of stuff hasn't been tested by the courts yet. But it is still frightening enough that ISPs scurry to obey lawyers bearing takedown notices.

yeah ive just double checked it on google.

this really annoys me, how can they have the right to stop me watching my own legally bought dvd, it also doesn't say that i need an official codec to watch the dvd on the back of the box either.

i suspect if this ever went to court (which i doubt) if the user was watching legally bought dvds i would hope that a court would find in favour of the user. i don't worry about it though if they want to sue me for watching my own legally bought dvds let them try.

[t0p]

i suspect if this ever went to court (which i doubt) if the user was watching legally bought dvds i would hope that a court would find in favour of the user. i don't worry about it though if they want to sue me for watching my own legally bought dvds let them try.

Although they obviously do sometimes persecute the little guy, the focus of their wrath is more often the distributer rather than the end-user. So the girl who back up her dvds on her pc shouldn't worry too much. But the girl who makes libdvdscc available for download may one day find herself on the wrong end of a takedown notice and a claim for "damages".

[Therion]

Sadly the Fair Use laws are hindered by the DMCA. In order to make a one personal use backup of your purchased DVD it requires breaking the encryption of the DVD (a DMCA violation).

Which is why I frankly hate all these laws and wish they would go away.
DMCA legislation is at odds with Fair Use legislation, it doesn't trump it. One could just as readily argue that encryption breaks Fair Use laws. If it was pushed, it would probably be up to a judge or jury to decide on a case-by-case basis.

Frankly, I don't see the courts sending Joe Schmoe to the slammer for making a backup copy of his kids "Monsters Inc." DVD. Once you put that same copy of "Monsters Inc." on Pirate Bay, however, logic suggests you just opened up a whole 'nuther can of worms.

There are a lot of areas like this where the water is deeply muddied because the courts simply don't move nearly as fast as the technology does.

[TBOL3]

Assuming you are in the United States, you are legally entitled to make ONE, personal use backup of your legitimately purchased media under Fair Use laws.

However, it is NOT legal to upload, or download, "copies" of copyrighted material for either distribution or personal use. So, while it IS legal for you to make a personal-use backup of your movie, it is NOT legal to do so by downloading it from Pirate Bay (for example).

No your not. The one and only thing that applies to is software packages. And even that was just do to a fluke.

[TBOL3]

Oh, but you can make copies of tapes, and give them to your friends.

[NFblaze]

Well, first off your in a Western Hemisphere country its probrably illegal. Especially, if the MPAA has used its lobbying and interest groups to pervade your nation. Secondly, I really cant see someone going to jail, in America, when they are allowed to make a general backup copy for the items that they have purchased. So, if you were to go to court against some allegation that you pirated a movie, but were able to show that you indeed were only making a copy thru downloading, because it's currently illegal to bypass encryption schemes on the DVD (or that your not technically advanced enough to even do so), and that you weren't gaining anything commercially from it, I definitely do not think you'd have much issue.

The other day I sat on my DVD of "A History of Violence". So, I simply downloaded another copy. I didnt save any evidence of the destroyed DVD but doesn't really matter because where I am at MPAA copyright schemes dont apply.

[Dimitriid]

As mentioned only to westerns. In a lot of countries like mine, you actually need substantial proof of actual commercial speculation ( money ) being made from the copyrighted material otherwise, its technically not illegal ( its illegal but there is no stipulated penalty at all which makes it impossible to prosecute ).

I think that is the sane way to go about copy protection ( potential sales are not actual sales, threating it like an actual crime is ridiculous ). If you live in the western world however, too many ISPs will throttle or report bit torrent traffic even if its perfectly legit ( downloading one of the thousands of Linux distributions wiht torrent ) so you could try to tunnel all torrents through VPN I hear people has gotten great success with that technique.

[Therion]

Originally Posted by Therion
Assuming you are in the United States, you are legally entitled to make ONE, personal use backup of your legitimately purchased media under Fair Use laws.

However, it is NOT legal to upload, or download, "copies" of copyrighted material for either distribution or personal use. So, while it IS legal for you to make a personal-use backup of your movie, it is NOT legal to do so by downloading it from Pirate Bay (for example).


No your not. The one and only thing that applies to is software packages. And even that was just do to a fluke.
Wrong, wrong, wrong.

See: ABKCO Music, Inc. v. Stellar Records, Inc., 96 F.3d 60, (2d Cir. 1996) and/or Leadsinger, Inc. v BMG Music Publishing, CV-04-08099-VAP (9th Cir. January 2, 2008) for only two cases involving music downloading and sharing versus fair use. See (Wright v. Warner Books, Inc., 953 F.2d 731 (2d Cir. 1991) regarding fair use and text based material. I could go on if you'd like. Fair use laws cover all sorts of artistic endeavors, not just software. Not by a very, very, VERY long shot.

Or perhaps you have some relevant court summaries to provide in support of your position?

[ambersdarkfox]

well some torrents are legal some arent it is a grey area really and depeneds on where you at and local laws but i say again some torrents are legal some people put their stuff up for the purpose of shareing and back up copys the law used to be you could have one back up copy if you had the special archival back up disks and were not shareing just incase that the origanal messed up but they changed that a few years back now that isnt legal because at that time not as bad now tho well in my area at least a few sold to make things like their rent tho i didnt sale them i didnt know what torrenting was at the time like i said it was a while ago the true getter why many want to stop torrentineg and back up copys is because money isnt goiing into their pockets they make millions alone from peeps going to the theater to see it and alot like to go even if they torrent but because some joe made a buck they want to raise holy hell and go off on the whole world because that money didnt go in their pocket after makeing millions at the theaters alone to many greedy people anymore that would rather shoot you and take all your money then look at you i may torrent but i dont sale copys or anything like that just watch stuff and that used to be ok as long as you didnt sale copys but greed has made em tighten the lease to make you go buy their products or go see their movies in theaters not that it isnt good to have a store bought dvd get the package and in most cases the special features which you often no get in torrents so forgive me if i dont feel sorry for the king on high type that made millions at the theater and acts like he cant do nothing wants the money out of everyone else to make him more richer when their are alot of people that prefers to buy store bought makeing them alot more money they would rather punish some poor sap trying to keep his bills paid and so many loseing their jobs already because he would get one movie most people that torrent get for purposes of watching or the like not to resale note that some do torrenting isnt evil yes mabbeh there are torrents that dont need to be there which torrenters usealy speak up and dont seed the bad stuff but i stop rambleing i guess hehe and leave you with the truth legal speaking for torrents some are legal some arent sometimes its hard to tell which but use sites with verifiyed torrents peeps will tell you :)

[sydbat]

well some torrents are legal some arent it is a grey area really and depeneds on where you at and local laws but i say again some torrents are legal some people put their stuff up for the purpose of shareing and back up copys the law used to be you could have one back up copy if you had the special archival back up disks and were not shareing just incase that the origanal messed up but they changed that a few years back now that isnt legal because at that time not as bad now tho well in my area at least a few sold to make things like their rent tho i didnt sale them i didnt know what torrenting was at the time like i said it was a while ago the true getter why many want to stop torrentineg and back up copys is because money isnt goiing into their pockets they make millions alone from peeps going to the theater to see it and alot like to go even if they torrent but because some joe made a buck they want to raise holy hell and go off on the whole world because that money didnt go in their pocket after makeing millions at the theaters alone to many greedy people anymore that would rather shoot you and take all your money then look at you i may torrent but i dont sale copys or anything like that just watch stuff and that used to be ok as long as you didnt sale copys but greed has made em tighten the lease to make you go buy their products or go see their movies in theaters not that it isnt good to have a store bought dvd get the package and in most cases the special features which you often no get in torrents so forgive me if i dont feel sorry for the king on high type that made millions at the theater and acts like he cant do nothing wants the money out of everyone else to make him more richer when their are alot of people that prefers to buy store bought makeing them alot more money they would rather punish some poor sap trying to keep his bills paid and so many loseing their jobs already because he would get one movie most people that torrent get for purposes of watching or the like not to resale note that some do torrenting isnt evil yes mabbeh there are torrents that dont need to be there which torrenters usealy speak up and dont seed the bad stuff but i stop rambleing i guess hehe and leave you with the truth legal speaking for torrents some are legal some arent sometimes its hard to tell which but use sites with verifiyed torrents peeps will tell you :)I am sorry, but I could not read this.

You may have made some valid points, but I stopped reading after the first line. I suggest you use proper punctuation, sentence structure and paragraphs for us to understand what you are saying. It will be appreciated by everyone.

[Garrovick]

I believe everyone has the right to safe guard the media files they have purchased. Movies, Audiobooks, TV DVD sets or music, even e-books. We should be allowed to use any means available to us.

I also believe, IMO, that those individuals who down load every thing they want, with out making the original purchase are no different then those who walk into a store and walk out without paying for it.

Just my opinion.

[Chronon]

Due to the dastardly "Digital Millennium Copyright Act," the process of breaking the encryption codes on a commercial DVD (which is necessary for ripping and burning said information) is what lands everyone in the "Big House."

In short, it is definitely illegal even for the purposes of archiving information.

But this also makes it illegal for you to watch your own legally purchased movies. Ridiculous.

I am reminded of this XKCD: http://xkcd.com/488/

[aaaantoine]

Well, some torrents are legal, some aren't. It is a grey area, really, and depends on where you are and local laws. But I say again: some torrents are legal. Some people put their stuff up for the purpose of sharing and back-up copiies.

The law used to be you could have one back up copy if you had the special archival back up disks and were not sharing, just in case the original messed up. But, they changed that a few years back. Now, that isn't legal because, at that time, not as bad.

Now though, well, in my area at least, a few sold copies of movies to make things like their rent, though i didn't sell them. I didn't know what torrenting was at the time. Like i said, it was a while ago.

The true reason why many want to stop torrenting and make back-up copies is because money isn't going into their pockets. They make millions alone from peeps going to the theater to see it, and a lot like to go even if they torrent. But because some Joe made a buck, they want to raise holy hell and go off on the whole world, because that money didn't go in their pocket. After making millions at the theaters alone, too many greedy people today would rather shoot you and take all your money than look at you.

I may torrent, but I don't sell copies or anything like that. I just watch stuff, and that used to be okay, as long as you didn't sell copies. But greed has made em tighten the leash to make you go buy their products, or go see their movies in theaters. Not that it isn't good to have a store-bought DVD -- get the package and, in most cases, the special features which you often don't get in torrents.

So forgive me if I don't feel sorry for the king-on-high type that made millions at the theater, and acts like he cant do anything. He wants the money out of everyone else to make him richer, when there are a lot of people that prefer to buy store bought, making them a lot more money. They would rather punish some poor sap trying to keep his bills paid, and so many losing their jobs already, because he would get one movie.

Most people that torrent get movies for purposes of watching or the like, not to resale. Note that some do torrenting isnt evil [sic]. Yes, maybe there are torrents that don't need to be there, which torrenters usually speak up, and don't seed the bad stuff.

But I stop rambling, I guess, hehe, and leave you with the truth: legally speaking for torrents, some are legal, some aren't. Sometimes, it's hard to tell which, but use sites with verified torrents. Peeps will tell you. :)

Fixed. I think.

[mamamia88]

my question i have is if you have the dvd why would you waste bandwith downloading torrents? just rip an iso with brasero or rip it to divx with handbrake. either way you will be getting much better quality than any torrent

[bodyharvester]

i support the torrent community

i downloaded the DOOM movie and if id had to pay for it i would have ripped The Rocks nuts off

i downloaded Gran Torino and intend to buy it coz its worth the money and i want to support those who deserve it

[Chronon]

I get and distribute free software (OS) and media via bit torrent.

[gn2]

Bands are better because of Piracy (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/8097324.stm), Robin Pecknold, Fleet Foxes.

And my own personal favourite from Captain Beefheart:

http://www.beefheart.com/filtered/quote.jpg