[Rant] I hate my school so much

[burvowski]

If I weren't entering my senior year, I would be working on transferring, but **** do I hate my school's backwards technology policies.

First, they are "requiring" all incoming freshman to have either an iPod Touch or an iPhone so they can...ready for it?....download lecture podcasts:

http://www.columbiamissourian.com/stories/2009/05/07/school-journalism-requires-ipod-touch/

The reason it's labelled a requirement is so students can scam federal aid and put a 2-year AT&T phone plan and an overpriced phone on their loan statements.


And now this, the school is switching their email service to Microsoft's Live service. The best part is when I tried to access the site in FF, I couldn't open the page and got this error:

"mailtools.um.umsystem.edu uses an invalid security certificate."

I know I can create an exemption for FF to access the site, but come on, if a secure browser is saying it's an insecure site, then that should be raising some red flags with the IT people. [-X

Now to get my gmail to import all mail from the crappy Microsoft account.

[pwnst*r]

that's the dumbest thing i've ever heard. you're right, your school sucks.

[burvowski]

I've already committed to not donating a single dollar in alumni donation after graduation. Don't really know what else to do *shrugs*

[lisati]

If I were in your position I'd probably not be too happy either. It sounds like they're leaving themselves open to complaints and trouble.

[hanzomon4]

Don't follow their policies.. Civil disobedience, smack em down with a little Thoreau


.... And shame on me for not reading the article before posting. *(Virtual Slap)* Relax, it's optional they only made it an UN ENFORCED requirement so you could tack it on to your financial aid. Nothing wrong with a school wanting to try something they think is innovative. They're pretty ignorant sure for thinking that students only know about apple products, but it even says in the article that students can use whatever they want to listen to the lectures. Chill

[gmjs]

Tell them they must obey open standards and provide all lecture notes, videos and podcasts in OASIS document formats, Theora Vorbis and OGG Vorbis! ;)

In their defence, the security certificate thing can be fixed by them purchasing/updating it. It's the same for any https:// site without a valid/up-to-date security certificate.

[burvowski]

You know what would be interesting? If everyone on the forums who was in a position to do so emailed the school's administration and let them know they will absolutely not be hiring any of the school's graduates or taking them on as interns (except me! :P ) with such a backwards technology policy that promotes one company's closed formats over others'. Not sure if that would have an effect, but would be interesting to see.

[VastOne]

Don't follow their policies.. Civil disobedience, smack em down with a little Thoreau

:twisted: Absolute perfect answer!

[aysiu]

First, they are "requiring" all incoming freshman to have either an iPod Touch or an iPhone so they can...ready for it?....download lecture podcasts:

http://www.columbiamissourian.com/stories/2009/05/07/school-journalism-requires-ipod-touch/ Maybe you should read more carefully the article you linked to:
The requirement will not be enforced, however, and there will not be a penalty for students who chose not to buy an iPod touch or iPhone, Brooks said. So you don't actually have to get an iPod Touch or an iPhone. You can listen to podcasts on your Sandisk player or iRiver.



And now this, the school is switching their email service to Microsoft's Live service. The best part is when I tried to access the site in FF, I couldn't open the page and got this error:

"mailtools.um.umsystem.edu uses an invalid security certificate."

I know I can create an exemption for FF to access the site, but come on, if a secure browser is saying it's an insecure site, then that should be raising some red flags with the IT people. All it means is that your school is cheap and doesn't want to pay to get an SSL certificate (which is hundreds of dollars). It doesn't mean the site is insecure.

[burvowski]

Maybe you should read more carefully the article you linked to: So you don't actually have to get an iPod Touch or an iPhone. You can listen to podcasts on your Sandisk player or iRiver.

All it means is that your school is cheap and doesn't want to pay to get an SSL certificate (which is hundreds of dollars). It doesn't mean the site is insecure.

I know. I included mention of that in my original post, saying the requirement was there so students can scam federal aid statements. The requirement is there to drive Mac sales at their Apple campus store. The school also "strongly recommends" (their words) in a letter sent out to all future students that all incoming freshman purchase a Mac, and goes on to say their campus store happens to conveniently stock Macs. 99% of incoming students, thinking that if they don't purchase a Mac, they would not have the same edge as other students, end up getting one.

http://mac.blorge.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/10/071002_missouri_macs.jpg

[RATM_Owns]

Heh. Bring in a eeePC running a CLI-only Arch install. :D

[Pogeymanz]

That picture just gave me the creeps...

[clonne4crw]

WOW. I though my (Private) school sucked @$$. To REQUIRE iPhones is really surprising, because at my school, any 'electronic devices' are banned. But nobody cares, and I see friends in the bathrooms all the time calling each other.

It doesn't exactly help that the principle and vice principle know absolutely NOTHING about anything that goes on at the school, and are notorious for making ridiculous rules that do absolutely nothing (ei: tucking in shirts, no standing while eating, etc).

What's surprising is that the computer classes there might actually be worth something. The teacher is nice, and actually knows jack (unlike previous years/schools). She uses DSL Linux, and other stuff, and she is actually a respectable person. Now, that doesn't mean that the classes are boring, and I spend most of the time in the labs playing around, (the machines are all Windows XP) and doing things that make teachers cringe.

I'll be very surprised if someone actually took the time to read this, but I'll be glad if you did. ;)

[lisati]

WOW. I though my (Private) school sucked @$$. To REQUIRE iPhones is really surprising, because at my school, any 'electronic devices' are banned. But nobody cares, and I see friends in the bathrooms all the time calling each other.

It doesn't exactly help that the principle and vice principle know absolutely NOTHING about anything that goes on at the school, and are notorious for making ridiculous rules that do absolutely nothing (ei: tucking in shirts, no standing while eating, etc).

What's surprising is that the computer classes there might actually be worth something. The teacher is nice, and actually knows jack (unlike previous years/schools). She uses DSL Linux, and other stuff, and she is actually a respectable person. Now, that doesn't mean that the classes are boring, and I spend most of the time in the labs playing around, (the machines are all Windows XP) and doing things that make teachers cringe.

I'll be very surprised if someone actually took the time to read this, but I'll be glad if you did. ;)

Read! And noted that the principal and vice-principal have principles and vice-principles respectively. And what about "pull up your socks"?????????

[clonne4crw]

I know. I included mention of that in my original post, saying the requirement was there so students can scam federal aid statements. The requirement is there to drive Mac sales at their Apple campus store. The school also "strongly recommends" (their words) in a letter sent out to all future students that all incoming freshman purchase a Mac, and goes on to say their campus store happens to conveniently stock Macs. 99% of incoming students, thinking that if they don't purchase a Mac, they would not have the same edge as other students, end up getting one.

http://mac.blorge.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/10/071002_missouri_macs.jpg

Bleh. That's reason enough for me NOT to get a Mac. I say "Screw it. I'm different." That's why I got a Sansa instead of an iPod. I want to be unique.

[hanzomon4]

I know. I included mention of that in my original post, saying the requirement was there so students can scam federal aid statements. The requirement is there to drive Mac sales at their Apple campus store. The school also "strongly recommends" (their words) in a letter sent out to all future students that all incoming freshman purchase a Mac, and goes on to say their campus store happens to conveniently stock Macs. 99% of incoming students, thinking that if they don't purchase a Mac, they would not have the same edge as other students, end up getting one.

http://mac.blorge.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/10/071002_missouri_macs.jpg


Looks like my school, where macs are required but it's an art school their entire platform is Mac with a little Unix Tru64, and a few OpenSuse labs

[pwnst*r]

Bleh. That's reason enough for me NOT to get a Mac. I say "Screw it. I'm different." That's why I got a Sansa instead of an iPod. I want to be unique.

i guess, if consider getting a different piece of hardware making you "unique".

i get what works for me. i'm unique because of who i am, not what i do or do not buy, ***.

[aysiu]

I know. I included mention of that in my original post, saying the requirement was there so students can scam federal aid statements. The requirement is there to drive Mac sales at their Apple campus store. The school also "strongly recommends" (their words) in a letter sent out to all future students that all incoming freshman purchase a Mac, and goes on to say their campus store happens to conveniently stock Macs. 99% of incoming students, thinking that if they don't purchase a Mac, they would not have the same edge as other students, end up getting one.

http://mac.blorge.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/10/071002_missouri_macs.jpg
Well, unfortunately, people just think Macs and iPods/iPhones are the hip thing to get anyway (see Microsoft ad where the only reason the person doesn't get a Mac is that she is too poor or "not cool enough" to own a Mac).

It is a shame the school is fake-requiring, but at least they aren't forcing you to get one.

[hanzomon4]

i guess, if consider getting a different piece of hardware making you "unique".

i get what works for me. i'm unique because of who i am, not what i do or do not buy, ***.

Message!

[pwnst*r]

and i just saw that my first sentence made absolutely no sense. cool.

[Dharmachakra]

i guess, if consider getting a different piece of hardware making you "unique".

i get what works for me. i'm unique because of who i am, not what i do or do not buy, ***.

I'm pretty sure you missed some sarcasm there... save me the attitude in your response.

Schools make rules, that's just how it is. They obviously aren't forcing you to use one so I just see it as something inconvenient... not earth-shattering.

EDIT: Too late.

[pwnst*r]

there was no sarcasm in his/her post, sorry.

[clonne4crw]

I'm pretty sure you missed some sarcasm there...

Schools make rules, that's just how it is. They obviously aren't forcing you to use one so I just see it as something inconvenient... not earth-shattering.

Yeah, but rules are meant to be broken.:D

[yoasif]

Bleh. That's reason enough for me NOT to get a Mac. I say "Screw it. I'm different." That's why I got a Sansa instead of an iPod. I want to be unique.better way to be unique: don't get a DAP at all.

[lisati]

Yeah, but rules are meant to be broken.:D

<aside>You sure about that? Is it OK to break the rule that says I shouldn't kill you?</aside>

[hanzomon4]

better way to be unique: don't get a DAP at all.

Rock an old school walkman


<aside>You sure about that? Is it OK to break the rule that says I shouldn't kill you?</aside>
We are not going there... I'm ending it, some rules should be broken others should be respected,.. cool? Cool

[clonne4crw]

<aside>You sure about that? Is it OK to break the rule that says I shouldn't kill you?</aside>
I'm not saying that. (Even though it's been done before) I'm just saying that schools need to lose the ever-controlling set of rules that they have acquired.

I hope that makes sense and isn't misinterpreted.

[lisati]

Ah yes - a potential can of worms. Good rules can and should be respected, bad rules need to be fixed, discarded or replaced.

EDIT: and where we disagree there is probably some room for intelligent discussion.

[Rainstride]

If I weren't entering my senior year, I would be working on transferring, but **** do I hate my school's backwards technology policies.

First, they are "requiring" all incoming freshman to have either an iPod Touch or an iPhone so they can...ready for it?....download lecture podcasts:

http://www.columbiamissourian.com/stories/2009/05/07/school-journalism-requires-ipod-touch/

The reason it's labelled a requirement is so students can scam federal aid and put a 2-year AT&T phone plan and an overpriced phone on their loan statements.


And now this, the school is switching their email service to Microsoft's Live service. The best part is when I tried to access the site in FF, I couldn't open the page and got this error:

"mailtools.um.umsystem.edu uses an invalid security certificate."

I know I can create an exemption for FF to access the site, but come on, if a secure browser is saying it's an insecure site, then that should be raising some red flags with the IT people. [-X

Now to get my gmail to import all mail from the crappy Microsoft account.

i don't think the IS an IT department. its probably a chimp with a bar of soap and a box of broken crayons.:D.

[Dark Aspect]

First, they are "requiring" all incoming freshman to have either an iPod Touch or an iPhone so they can...ready for it?....download lecture podcasts


Thats the stupidest thing I have ever heard of, but why complain? If you can scam federal aid for a free ipod than whats the problem? FF doesn't like my colleges homepage either sadly but at least I don't get a security error.

[burvowski]

Thats the stupidest thing I have ever heard of, but why complain? If you can scam federal aid for a free ipod than whats the problem? FF doesn't like my colleges homepage either sadly but at least I don't get a security error.

For me, it's an ethical issue more than a practical one. Yes, I know the rule is easy to ignore, but I just have a problem with a public institution funded by our tax money (just like federal aid loans) being used to promote and endorse a single company's closed format. Instead of the school saying (in the case of the iPod requirement), "Hey, instead of learning to use skills that you can bring to any smart phone that you might have to use, you should just learn to use Apple's format. We don't know IT from our asses and are to lazy to teach it properly, so just take the idiot's path." I could care less if a private school did this, but it bothers me on an ethical level that our tax money is being used for this.

PS - I just tried to get Outlook Live to foward all my email to Gmail, but I can't find anything about POP settings. Am I screwed and going to have to use Outlook? :(

[clonne4crw]

i don't think the IS an IT department. its probably a chimp with a bar of soap and a box of broken crayons.:D.

:lolflag:

[Dark Aspect]

http://mail.google.com/support/bin/answer.py?hl=en&answer=77689

And truth is, your tax dollars are going to far worse but I understand.

[burvowski]

http://mail.google.com/support/bin/answer.py?hl=en&answer=77689

And truth is, your tax dollars are going to far worse but I understand.

No no, vice versa. On my old school account, I had all mail automatically retrieved from it into Gmail, so all I ever had to check was Gmail in my browser to see all my accounts. I tried to set up the new account in Gmail but various combinations of the server address don't work... pop.outlook.com, imap.outlook.com, etc. Gmail wants me to use a pop address, and I don't see anything in the Live account (that's in my browser, not Outlook the application) about POP, which wouldn't surprise me, knowing those cheeky bastards, they probably want to prevent Gmail from pulling emails from them.

[MaxIBoy]

http://mac.blorge.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/10/071002_missouri_macs.jpg
http://www.moviecritic.com.au/images/creepy-kids-with-glowing-eyes-carpenters-village-o1.jpg

[hanzomon4]

No no, vice versa. On my old school account, I had all mail automatically retrieved from it into Gmail, so all I ever had to check was Gmail in my browser to see all my accounts. I tried to set up the new account in Gmail but various combinations of the server address don't work... pop.outlook.com, imap.outlook.com, etc. Gmail wants me to use a pop address, and I don't see anything in the Live account (that's in my browser, not Outlook the application) about POP, which wouldn't surprise me, knowing those cheeky bastards, they probably want to prevent Gmail from pulling emails from them.

With live you have to pay for pop access... it doesn't even have imap

[burvowski]

Well, isn't that great! I'll just set up an automatic response saying to use my other email address.

Ok good, I just checked, and they at least allow us to have automatic replies :lol:

[albinootje]

All it means is that your school is cheap and doesn't want to pay to get an SSL certificate (which is hundreds of dollars).
There's SSL certificates for free, e.g. from CaCert : http://www.cacert.org/

[Hyper Tails]

I think that school hates microsoft and Linux

If i went to that school with my laptop computer which has xp,vista,7 and ubuntu I think I would be expelled right away.

That school is S**T
Even I thought my old school was bad it's gold comparing to this

although I use my laptop in school for taking notes and doing work on and all my other classmates use pencil and paper (i do sometimes)

and I think my classmates are jeilious of me using it to because they make fun of me by saying I'm looking at porn or playing games (which i'm NOT!!!!) so I really don't see the need of using an ipod touch or iphone as a requirement, it should be optional.. :|

[hanzomon4]

I think that school hates microsoft and Linux

If i went to that school with my laptop computer which has xp,vista,7 and ubuntu I think I would be expelled right away.

That school is S**T
Even I thought my old school was bad it's gold comparing to this

although I use my laptop in school for taking notes and doing work on and all my other classmates use pencil and paper (i do sometimes)

and I think my classmates are jeilious of me using it to because they make fun of me by saying I'm looking at porn or playing games (which i'm NOT!!!!) so I really don't see the need of using an ipod touch or iphone as a requirement, it should be optional.. :|

Linux Youth! No really most people don't hate computer programs, geeks do. I mean c'mon!!! Listing to some people you'd think people were being lynched over the operating system they use.

[burvowski]

Linux Youth! No really most people don't hate computer programs, geeks do. I mean c'mon!!! Listing to some people you'd think people were being lynched over the operating system they use.

well...

http://linuxlock.blogspot.com/2009/03/tempers-flare-as-recession-creeps-into.html

:lol:

[Dngrsone]

Thats the stupidest thing I have ever heard of, but why complain? If you can scam federal aid for a free ipod than whats the problem? FF doesn't like my colleges homepage either sadly but at least I don't get a security error.

For one thing, it's fraud. Second, it's an educational institution that is encouraging fraud. I'm thinking the first student with a dorm-lawyer who gets busted for plagiarizing is going to bring that up in his lawsuit.

[Markfwb]

I think that schools should teach a beginners Unix class instead. APPLE is proprietary crap. I hate Itunes. APPLE IS BUYING AND KEEP CONSUMING. My POS linux systems run better than state of the art Apples. I think they are worse than Microsoft if you ask me. I think all Universities should use some form of Linux, BSD, or Unix. ](*,)

[pwnst*r]

i'm not an OS fanboi either way, but lol @ that pic

[nmccrina]

I know. I included mention of that in my original post, saying the requirement was there so students can scam federal aid statements. The requirement is there to drive Mac sales at their Apple campus store. The school also "strongly recommends" (their words) in a letter sent out to all future students that all incoming freshman purchase a Mac, and goes on to say their campus store happens to conveniently stock Macs. 99% of incoming students, thinking that if they don't purchase a Mac, they would not have the same edge as other students, end up getting one.

http://mac.blorge.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/10/071002_missouri_macs.jpg

:shock: For some reason that is really scary. Kind of the opposite vibe of the 1984 commercial, no? :)

[drawkcab]

I teach online courses for a big 10 school. They unnecessarily require their students to buy microsoft windows and office.

[Lajik]

That picture makes me sick, not for the fact that they ALL got ripped off by buying an overpriced unix machine ROFL, but also because of the disrespect to classroom learning that having a computer in front of you does to the professor. I'm sure 50% of those kids are on facebook, chatting it up. I never bring a laptop to class (unless it is a completely worthless professor/class, which doesn't happen to to often thankfully) because I always get distracted by this or that on the laptop.

[drawkcab]

That picture makes me sick, not for the fact that they ALL got ripped off by buying an overpriced unix machine ROFL, but also because of the disrespect to classroom learning that having a computer in front of you does to the professor. I'm sure 50% of those kids are on facebook, chatting it up. I never bring a laptop to class (unless it is a completely worthless professor/class, which doesn't happen to to often thankfully) because I always get distracted by this or that on the laptop.

+1 When I walk into class about 1/2 my students are already on facebook. The other 1/2 text on their phones at some point during class. And then they come to my office wondering why their grade is so low.

[MaxIBoy]

I never pay attention in Math class. I just read the textbook when I do the homework.

Other then that, my laptop is usually used for taking notes, doodling in GIMP or silly games like Tetris. It's just something to do with my fingers, I really am paying attention.

And before one of the many teachers here takes issue with this, I get nearly straight A grades.

[Rainstride]

http://mac.blorge.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/10/071002_missouri_macs.jpg

proof that we're all doomed. when not a one of these sorry pricks in collage paying $50,000 to $100,000 a year, who can barely buy food, realises they could have got a computer for $500-$1000 and just changed the OS. instead they just go ahead and add the extra $2000-$4500 onto a student loan. i hope they enjoy the crippling debt they gained. (next thing you know you won't be able to go to school if you don't have a mac)

atleast they look cool,lol:D.

[hanzomon4]

I think that schools should teach a beginners Unix class instead. APPLE is proprietary crap. I hate Itunes. APPLE IS BUYING AND KEEP CONSUMING. My POS linux systems run better than state of the art Apples. I think they are worse than Microsoft if you ask me. I think all Universities should use some form of Linux, BSD, or Unix. ](*,)

OS X is a UNIX... Your POS linux and BSD are not

The only free UNIX I can think of is opensolaris, I was under the impression that the others cost money

[hanzomon4]

]
well...

http://linuxlock.blogspot.com/2009/03/tempers-flare-as-recession-creeps-into.html

:lol:

](*,)

sorry for the double post, I just had to

[MaxIBoy]

well...

http://linuxlock.blogspot.com/2009/03/tempers-flare-as-recession-creeps-into.html

:lol:That guy just makes me want to... http://encyclopediadramatica.com/Image:Rageoriginal.jpg

[stwschool]

My take on this is that the OP is a bit of a brat. Nothing personal, I was the same at that age.

Regarding the school rules thing, actually the rules are about giving kids discipline. At the school where I teach, we have a few problems due to poor management in the past, which we're working on now. Most were caused by non-enforcement of rules, which has led to kids being unruly. Now, that may be fun for the kids but how much do they learn? Not a lot. And how does this affect their chances after they leave school? It's not great.

A classroom needs to be an environment where you can learn, and it's also where you learn self-discipline, the ability to follow rules, and to respect others so that they can learn, just as you do.

We had an interesting experience when we took our kids to an army base for scout camp (it's a Thai thing). The soldiers were united, had lots of what the kids thought were 'silly rules' and the kids hated it at first. At the end they loved the soldiers. They were happy, well-behaved, and showed each other respect. 'Silly' rules exist to help the teacher keep a classroom running the right way. No gadgets? That's cos you'll listen to your music and not your class. Boring? Tough, you need it. No eating? That's cos you leave your crap all over the floor when we let you. You get the idea.

In terms of what we teach.. I'd love to teach my kids how to hack about with linux, program in php, etc. I'd love it. But the reality is if I cater for the 3 students like our OP, I'm leaving out 90% of my class, and that's not really fair. A teacher has to provide foundations for students to then further their education or employment after school, and has to make decisions about where best to distribute his/her time, to make sure that the largest number of students get the most help. With that in mind, my approach is to guide my higher students in the direction of resources so that they can drive themselves forward, as that's the most effective way with these students, and also allows me to strike that balance without killing half of my class with work.

Remember, teachers are people too, and while I can't speak for your teachers, I know personally I'm always trying to figure out things that will help my kids. If I'm out shopping and see something I can use at school to teach something, I buy it, even though the school's not funding it, out of my own pocket. Lots of teachers do the same.

So instead of acting like a brat because the rules aren't to your liking, think about what your teachers do for you.

[monsterstack]

My take on this is that the OP is a bit of a brat. Nothing personal, I was the same at that age.

Regarding the school rules thing, actually the rules are about giving kids discipline. At the school where I teach, we have a few problems due to poor management in the past, which we're working on now. Most were caused by non-enforcement of rules, which has led to kids being unruly. Now, that may be fun for the kids but how much do they learn? Not a lot. And how does this affect their chances after they leave school? It's not great.

A classroom needs to be an environment where you can learn, and it's also where you learn self-discipline, the ability to follow rules, and to respect others so that they can learn, just as you do.

We had an interesting experience when we took our kids to an army base for scout camp (it's a Thai thing). The soldiers were united, had lots of what the kids thought were 'silly rules' and the kids hated it at first. At the end they loved the soldiers. They were happy, well-behaved, and showed each other respect. 'Silly' rules exist to help the teacher keep a classroom running the right way. No gadgets? That's cos you'll listen to your music and not your class. Boring? Tough, you need it. No eating? That's cos you leave your crap all over the floor when we let you. You get the idea.

In terms of what we teach.. I'd love to teach my kids how to hack about with linux, program in php, etc. I'd love it. But the reality is if I cater for the 3 students like our OP, I'm leaving out 90% of my class, and that's not really fair. A teacher has to provide foundations for students to then further their education or employment after school, and has to make decisions about where best to distribute his/her time, to make sure that the largest number of students get the most help. With that in mind, my approach is to guide my higher students in the direction of resources so that they can drive themselves forward, as that's the most effective way with these students, and also allows me to strike that balance without killing half of my class with work.

Remember, teachers are people too, and while I can't speak for your teachers, I know personally I'm always trying to figure out things that will help my kids. If I'm out shopping and see something I can use at school to teach something, I buy it, even though the school's not funding it, out of my own pocket. Lots of teachers do the same.

So instead of acting like a brat because the rules aren't to your liking, think about what your teachers do for you.

Wait, so requiring students to buy an iPod teaches them discipline? Complaining about having to get an expensive piece of kit when many times more affordable devices which accomplish the exact same thing are available somehow makes him a brat? The OP said absolutely nothing about them avoiding teaching Linux, either. I'm sorry, but did you even read the original complaint?

I feel for you, OP. I once left my computer running in my campus dorm. I left it in an X-less terminal session for some reason or other. Anyhow, the cleaners came in later whilst I was in class and reported me to the tech staff for having a mysterious black and white hacking operating system, or something. The tech guys didn't care, though. They actually knew what Linux was.

That doesn't make them all that great, though: when you use the school's computer system, the default Firefox home page is a big text message telling you not to use Firefox because it is unsafe and incompatible with many sites. Sheesh.

Oh, and by the way:

http://i717.photobucket.com/albums/ww177/stuffandstuffand/071002_missouri_macs.jpg

Never truer words have been spoken.

[stwschool]

Wait, so requiring students to buy an iPod teaches them discipline? Complaining about having to get an expensive piece of kit when many times more affordable devices which accomplish the exact same thing are available somehow makes him a brat? The OP said absolutely nothing about them avoiding teaching Linux, either. I'm sorry, but did you even read the original complaint?

I feel for you, OP. I once left my computer running in my campus dorm. I left it in an X-less terminal session for some reason or other. Anyhow, the cleaners came in later whilst I was in class and reported me to the tech staff for having a mysterious black and white hacking operating system, or something. The tech guys didn't care, though. They actually knew what Linux was.

That doesn't make them all that great, though: when you use the school's computer system, the default Firefox home page is a big text message telling you not to use Firefox because it is unsafe and incompatible with many sites. Sheesh.

Oh, and by the way:

http://i717.photobucket.com/albums/ww177/stuffandstuffand/071002_missouri_macs.jpg

Never truer words have been spoken.

Nope, requiring them to buy stuff like that is pretty retarded. I set all my homeworks in such a way as they can be completed in open or closed source software, on whatever platform a student has (within reason - I usually check what my kids have and modify my plans as needed). That said, schools do sometimes need to tell kids/parents to buy stuff. Our kids kept throwing bottles away in the class after buying bottled water from the canteen. We now tell parents to buy their kids proper containers, so the kids will look after them.

Now as for your leaving a computer in your dorm on an x-less terminal, frankly that's just dealing with non-techies. Some people just don't get it, and think that The Matrix is real. The techies didn't have a problem, so really you're getting worked up over nothing.

Honestly, I agree that here the techies don't know what they're doing. Not every school has that, but to be honest it IS a problem, in that most people who work in schools don't have industry experience. I think my experience in the business has helped me to teach more effectively and also to keep one step ahead of the kids.

I would love to see more people in the IT industry make the move to teaching to give kids a real proper idea of what real-world IT is about, as most IT teachers don't have the ability to do that. I find myself correcting our textbooks almost constantly (and ditched them completely for all but the upper grades where it's a requirement for exams) due to some blatant garbage in them. I tell the kids what they need for the exam, but also point out how it is in the real world, so they're not brainwashed by this junk.

The caveat here is of course that most IT people really wouldn't make great teachers, often lacking the communication skills to effectively teach (frankly I was that way myself when I was younger). That does limit the number of people that can make the jump. But, if you do, while it can be intensely frustrating it can also be incredibly rewarding.

Btw, I went the other way, on some internal systems I've built, I've put a nag on for anyone NOT using firefox, as I don't have the time to test 3 browsers, teach, build new stuff, mark work, prepare lessons, research to keep up to date and have a life, so everyone uses firefox or else here!

[Giant Speck]

My hometown's school district ran primarily on Macs. It wasn't until high school that I used Windows at all. Our high school had a mix of OS X, Windows XP, and a few Linux systems.

Is this related at all to the story at hand? Probably not. We were highly discouraged from bringing personal electronics to school.

[Dngrsone]

My hometown's school district ran primarily on Macs. It wasn't until high school that I used Windows at all. Our high school had a mix of OS X, Windows XP, and a few Linux systems.

Is this related at all to the story at hand? Probably not. We were highly discouraged from bringing personal electronics to school.

Well, grade-school and college are two different creatures. Apple dominates in the classroom in large part because they have been investing in there for years-- pretty much since the Mac came out, Apple has been donating hardware and such to elementary schools across the US, so it's not surprising at all that you grew up on an Apple appliance in the lower grades.

College-level courses require the student (who often pays for the privilege to be there) to have a certain level of maturity and also be able to take notes in a rapid function. It used to be handheld tape recorders, not laptops, that helped student absorb the information in the classroom where they actually digested it elsewhere.

Computers are not absolutely necessary, but are extremely useful tools for the classroom: a typed page (where allowed) is almost always easier read than a hand-written one, editing is certainly much easier than when I was in high school banging away on a type-writer.

Teachers are better organized (or can be, anyway) and have more tools available to them.

[Hyper Tails]

:shock: For some reason that is really scary. Kind of the opposite vibe of the 1984 commercial, no? :)

Agree That school is on macs (LOL)
I was overwhelmed to see how much macs there are and no pc's with windows or linux whatsoever

[burvowski]

My take on this is that the OP is a bit of a brat. Nothing personal, I was the same at that age.

Regarding the school rules thing, actually the rules are about giving kids discipline. At the school where I teach, we have a few problems due to poor management in the past, which we're working on now. Most were caused by non-enforcement of rules, which has led to kids being unruly. Now, that may be fun for the kids but how much do they learn? Not a lot. And how does this affect their chances after they leave school? It's not great.

A classroom needs to be an environment where you can learn, and it's also where you learn self-discipline, the ability to follow rules, and to respect others so that they can learn, just as you do.

We had an interesting experience when we took our kids to an army base for scout camp (it's a Thai thing). The soldiers were united, had lots of what the kids thought were 'silly rules' and the kids hated it at first. At the end they loved the soldiers. They were happy, well-behaved, and showed each other respect. 'Silly' rules exist to help the teacher keep a classroom running the right way. No gadgets? That's cos you'll listen to your music and not your class. Boring? Tough, you need it. No eating? That's cos you leave your crap all over the floor when we let you. You get the idea.

In terms of what we teach.. I'd love to teach my kids how to hack about with linux, program in php, etc. I'd love it. But the reality is if I cater for the 3 students like our OP, I'm leaving out 90% of my class, and that's not really fair. A teacher has to provide foundations for students to then further their education or employment after school, and has to make decisions about where best to distribute his/her time, to make sure that the largest number of students get the most help. With that in mind, my approach is to guide my higher students in the direction of resources so that they can drive themselves forward, as that's the most effective way with these students, and also allows me to strike that balance without killing half of my class with work.

Remember, teachers are people too, and while I can't speak for your teachers, I know personally I'm always trying to figure out things that will help my kids. If I'm out shopping and see something I can use at school to teach something, I buy it, even though the school's not funding it, out of my own pocket. Lots of teachers do the same.

So instead of acting like a brat because the rules aren't to your liking, think about what your teachers do for you.

So you just presuppose something and then avoid proving it? Very convenient. Can I do that, too?! I'm going to go ahead and assume you have zero reading comprehension. First of all, nothing in your above post actually explains how I am a brat. I would have taken your post less personally if you had gone on to explain what about my original post was so brat-like. You open the post with a blatant insult to me, and then leave it at that, going on with the rest of the post about how great of a teacher you are (and most of the post has nothing to do with the discussion at hand).

You say the rules are about giving the kids discipline, but avoid saying how. If they are, please go ahead and explain how so. I don't see how that has anything to do with anything, but ok, would you like a cookie?

"Teachers are people, too." From your post, I can also see some of them can be morons, as well. The thread's discussion is about the school's administration, not the teachers. I have nothing but the utmost respect for my university teachers.

Either way, thanks for the insult towards me.

Edit: PS - Does the time I spent with the Israeli military before coming to school give me any discipline, or are you going to keep assuming moronic things without any basis?

[stwschool]

Frankly your post pretty much proves that you are a brat. You throw a tantrum and throw your toys out the pram because you can't get what you want. That, for me, is the definition of a brat.

I have already explained how discipline is helped by having rules. You just didn't read my post. Poor reading comprehension? Look in the mirror.

You're complaining about your school. You made no distinction between teachers and administrators that I recall (I would bother to go back to the original post to check but honestly, with this tonne of marking I've better things to do).

Nope, not telling you how great a teacher I am, just telling you what I think is the right way for a school to do things. Your interpretation is up to you, and honestly, comes off bratty.

Frankly I think your time with the Israeli military failed, as you come off as being a spoilt brat, and no soldier I've ever met would put up with that.

[Mistrblank]

If I weren't entering my senior year, I would be working on transferring, but **** do I hate my school's backwards technology policies.

First, they are "requiring" all incoming freshman to have either an iPod Touch or an iPhone so they can...ready for it?....download lecture podcasts:

http://www.columbiamissourian.com/stories/2009/05/07/school-journalism-requires-ipod-touch/

The reason it's labelled a requirement is so students can scam federal aid and put a 2-year AT&T phone plan and an overpriced phone on their loan statements.


And now this, the school is switching their email service to Microsoft's Live service. The best part is when I tried to access the site in FF, I couldn't open the page and got this error:

"mailtools.um.umsystem.edu uses an invalid security certificate."

I know I can create an exemption for FF to access the site, but come on, if a secure browser is saying it's an insecure site, then that should be raising some red flags with the IT people. [-X

Now to get my gmail to import all mail from the crappy Microsoft account.


Maybe you should point out (in protest) you don't need an iDevice to download/watch/listen podcasts.

Though beyond all of this, my CS department required I have a computer, is that really different? Is it really any different than being required to buy your books for classes? All of that stuff can be pushed off on student aid and federal aid. Hell, an iPod Touch is only $229 and I've had courses with $300+ in books.

Maybe you should vote by transferring, it's never too late.

[burvowski]

Many schools don't like to take on students with only a year left. Either way, I think I missed next year's application cycle deadlines. I'll be applying to law school soon either way, and my current school definitely won't be one I'll be applying to.


Frankly your post pretty much proves that you are a brat. You throw a tantrum and throw your toys out the pram because you can't get what you want. That, for me, is the definition of a brat.

I'm not going to bother replying to your whole post just because it's clear you're trying to troll the thread and get a rise out of me, but I didn't realize I was literally throwing my toys around :lol: You don't understand the definition of the word 'definition', do you? :lol: :popcorn:

[PmDematagoda]

Ok, I think this thread is just about starting to get out of hand. Therefore I am going to close this thread.