Breezy is unfortunately the worst release of Ubuntu

[nerval]

First of all, I don't want to be mean; if I hurt the feelings of any staff member; I'm deeply sorry.

My experience with Breezy begun on trying the candidate versions. I had several problems with it, and turned back using Hoary until the official release of Breezy. (I had a similar problem with the candidate version of Hoary, it was solved with the official version)

So, after the official release of Breezy i upgraded the distribution thru apt-get. I had a very important sound recording problem with it, alongside programs related to it (such as audacity). (I'm an amateur songwriter, and I have to use it)

I hate when people comes and asks questions on forums without searching if it was asked already. So I searched the message and added that I had the same problem. After a generous recommendation from a newbie, my sound system was screwed up totally. However, I fixed that later on; yet no one has still received a pefect solution on sound recording issue. Apparently, it works better on the live version of Breezy.

I have Gentoo on my second harddisk, but Gentoo became "careless" after its founder, Daniel Robbins was "purchased" by Microsoft. My sound recording works fine on that one, but there are so many troubles I can't solve even though I was a moderator on Gentoo Turkish forums. (That's why I left the forum, because I wasn't even able to solve my own problems with Gentoo)

So, I ended up backing up important info into 4 cds and deleting my Ubuntu partition to install Breezy from the official release cd. I did it once, and I got the "unable to install initrd-tools" message while installing. I checked it here on the forums and on the web, and realized the possibility of "bad burning" the iso image. So, even though I burned it slowly (x2) before, I burned it again; and just in case I burned another back-up cd. (So with the first one, I burned a total of 3 cds with the same content)

Second try with the second cd, the same problem; the third try with the third cd again the same problem. Isn't there a solution ? Surely there is, ignoring the problem and installing the rest anyway. However, then one will have to deal with this specific problem later on; hopefully not on a serious issue. Thus, I refuse on principle to "jump ahead" without solving any problem on any distribution. Especially on Ubuntu, a perfect distribution like this shouldn't have this kind of troubles at basic installation. Perhaps it might be my problem, and my cd-burner might not work well (even though it worked on creating my 4 back-up cds).

I think Ubuntu Warty was the best Linux distribution of 2004, and Hoary was the best of 2005. Yet, Breezy doesn't even get close to those two distributions' perfection.

Maybe it's the main problems of the released Debian Sarge's failure (as it can be viewed from their mailing list and forums, people faces similar problems). I wonder if architects of Breezy haven't faced any sound recording or installing conflict; or even some feedback during its candidate versions; maybe they did and maybe they didn't...

I hope that Ubuntu can release the best Linux distribution of 2006 with Dapper Drake, just like they did in 2005 and 2004. Until then, let's forget about Breezy; it was the worst (and hopefully will always be) release of Ubuntu.

Once again, especially the ones helping for free, you are doing an amazing job. Probably not many appreciates your work, and contributing on Gimp, Yoper, Debian, Gentoo and a lot of websites and games I have felt the same way (even though I admit that I haven't contributed at all on most of them except telling what to do and not to do). Increasing your abilities on these occasions will pay back once you will try to do something on your own.

For those who works for money, it's time for Mark Shuttleworth to fly into Canonical Ltd. instead of flying into space and yell a little.

I believe I will wait until Dapper Drake release (or maybe try the candidate soon), but until then I'm taking my hands off Breezy; for the same reason I'm not using Windows XP.

Cheers; and have a wonderful year.

Onur Aydin
a.k.a "`NeRVaL"

Recommendation 1 : Forget about debian's installer, try to implement it on Anaconda or same sort of installer. Debian-installer is one of the weakest part of Debian; it's set-up for 2002 structures of personal computers and it has not been properly updated since. (Severe issues on many laptops on recognizing the keyboard and the mice; which can be solved by using an additional keyboard or mice)

Recommendation 2 : Have every element of your release working on every platform. "The basic use" of an operating system is "not" what a human being can do with a pen and a paper. It is what he can see, hear or compute with it. If some part of it is not working, then don't use it.

Recommendation 3 : Guide yourselves thru "Ubuntu Guides". There are many third-party programs or web-sites on how to make Ubuntu better for the end-user. The "help" document and option is great, yet including java, codecs, proper video-playing capabilities thru browsers, alongside many useful edit should not be that hard; just like it isn't for the end-users.

Golden Recommendation : Believe from the bottom of your heart, that one day more people will use Ubuntu than Windows. Leave the rest to your souls, they will lead you. (Well it can sound childish and religious; yet I'm a grown-up and Agnostic. Synergy is the base of every success.)

P.S : English is my fifth language, if I wasn't understantable at any point (even though I did a spell-check); I'm sorry.

[soops1966]

Sorry to hear your troubles.

With regard to your problems installing Breezy, it seems that the iso image was at fault not your burning, did you check the MD5 checksums? I'd have another go at downloading the iso and install from that.

It would be almost impossible to test if Breezy worked with every possible hardware configuration out there, at some point in the testing procedure you have to just go with it and release. At least you increase your user base and bring to light the obscure bugs which end up getting fixed.

A lot of stuff can't be installed with the release disks because in some countries it is illegal to supply the programs or the license for the programs do not permit distribution. These are generally referred to as 'non free'.

I believe Automatix is one way to install all of these extras very simply, although I did mine by hand so I can't recommend it personally.

Ubuntu is far and away the best Linux distribution that I've ever used, my personal experience of Breezy is of faultless installation and running.

Hope your luck improves.

Soops

[Ocxic]

maybe ubuntu is not for you, I switch from using windows XP and tho i've had my share of problems, i have never been happier to use my computer. the fact that i have to use the command line is exiting to me, and a fun way to impress your friends.

[PryGuy]

Ubuntu is far and away the best Linux distribution that I've ever used, my personal experience of Breezy is of faultless installation and running.Absolutely agree!!!:D

[23meg]

Did you do a md5 sum check on your iso image? Did you try installing from a pressed (Shipit) CD? Did you try installing the missing packages via apt?

Do you care to tell us what exactly your recording problem is, so that maybe we can help you about it?

[Lord Illidan]

I remember having some problems with the disk I downloaded. The official cds worked fine. Subsequent downloads also worked. Check the md5 sums.

I have to disagree with you. Breezy definitely beats Hoary when it comes to speed, and stability. Kubuntu is now quite solid (not rock solid but quite close).

[nerval]

Hocam zaten Breezy'i distro-upgrade secenegi ile bir suredir kullaniyordum, (hatta ilk haftasindan beri sanirim) ses kaydetme problemim vardi; forumlarda da hala sorulu bir sekilde duruyor ve cevabi yok.

Belirttigim gibi, en uyuz oldugum; insanlarin forumlarda daha once sorulmus sorulara bakmadan soru sormasidir. Gentootr forum'larindakyen de cok gicik olurdum. (Misal benim sound recording - ve install probleminin envai cesidini; cogunu cozulmemis bir sekilde bu forumlarda bulabilirsin)

Ses kaydetme sorunu icin habire ikinci harddisk'deki gentoo'ya donup duruyordum, ardindan hem uzun suredir back-up yapmadigim; hem de maceraperest oldugum icin back-up'lari alip en basindan temiz temiz cd'sinden yukliyeyim dedim. 1 denedim olmadi, 2 defa daha burn ettim neme lazim (md5 sum da var, burn ettikten sonra diskleri de kontrol ettim; duzgun sekilde dosyalar duruyor yerinde) ayni sorunla karsilastim.

Dapper Drake'i indiriyorum simdi, merak ettim nasil.

Installation da bahsettigim sorun sadece bende degil, debian ve debian bazli Sarge kulllanan bir cok kiside cikiyor. Ilk arkadas da zaten bu konuda dir cevap verdi, herseyi tutmasi imkansiz diye. (Ki dogru da diyor)

Sound-recording bir yana, (ki cok vahim bir durum, sarki yazarim arada bir; audacity olmazsa olmaz) ; eger bana Debian'in muhnevi installation'inin duzgun oldugunu ikna etmeye calisirsan; dilersen en basindan baslayip (tasarim), autopartition bozukluklarindan tutup, windows ile beraber uyumsuzluguna, kurulum hatalarina kadar bin tane hatasini anlatirim. Hatta bana sormana gerek yok, google'dan ara; sanirim binlerce kisi su ana kadar anlatmistir sorunlarini; hepsine tek tek cevap ver seni memnun kilarsa.

Daha cok fikir sunmak icin yazmistim; her sorunun cevabi bu forumda ve google'da dogru duzgun aranirsa bulunulur. Zaten cozumune de anlattim, ignore et; ardindan sonra ilgilen diye ama ..

Kizdirdiysam, uzduysem, affola :)

Saglicakla kal;
Onur

[hillbilly]

Hey whoa, do stick to english will ya !!

I had no problems with installing ubuntu onto my laptop. I had ordered for 5 official cds and I passed them onto my friends. One of them had the same problem as you, it couldnt install the base system.
So after struggling for an hour and then taking a break, we finally used another cd to install and this time it went throuhg without a hitch !! So i guess its probably your cd or iso which is at fault.

So do try breezy and dont just give up on it.

[nerval]

As I said, maybe it might be my mistake too. I'm downloading again from a different server; maybe the iso I have downloaded didn't work right.

My only hope its sound recording and audacity works properly.

Cheers;
Onur :)

P.S : It's turkish by the way, seeing the reply from Istanbul; it was kind of easier to tell it fast in my maternal language :)

[PryGuy]

Check your hardware also. It's probably a coincidence, but it usually happens this way for some reason. Pay attention to memory.

[mike998]

One solution would be to burn your CD at a slightly higher rate. I have had .iso files that didn't burn correctly when I burned them at a slow rate. x24 is usually about the rate that they should burn at.

Sounds silly, but it's worked for me in the past... Oh yeah, and checking the md5 sums is also a really good idea.

The only problems I had with Breezy were with the pre-release versions when the X system wouldn't start correctly (problems with fonts, I believe). I'm running Dapper right now, and it's fine.

[nerval]

Thanks everyone for interest, i said it in Turkish; let me repeat :) The problem isn't bound to Ubuntu; it is an installation problem that every debian or debian-based distro user faces.

So to be honest, it would be unfair to blame Ubuntu for it.

I think my main problem is about the burning of iso on that one, (i downloaded again from a different source as I said, but not burned yet; I'm trying Dapper now, this is quite good!) However, it isn't in the beginning .. It's after guided partitioning, once the installing starts it gets stock in some part.

Let me examine Dapper now, i'm quite impressed at first sight.

[h4ck3r]

Ha, I think breezy badger is the best one yet.

[Azriphale]

If you get your installation working, i might be able to suggest a possible method of fixing your audio problems (although I don't know the cause, or the effect).

I do know, however, that the version of alsa included with Breezy does not always work perfectly. This can be fixed by downloading the alsa source from www.alsa-project.org and comiling it yourself. It is really easy.

download the following components:
Driver
Library
Lin-Plugins
Utilities
OSS Compat. Library

you might want to check the list of supported cards to see which driver your card uses so that you don't waste time compiling all drivers.
"tar xvjf" all of the files (extract them)
cd alsa-driver-xxxxxx
you need to pass the configure script the --with-cards=xxx flag to compile only your driver. For instance, I would go

./configure --with-cards=hda-intel
make
sudo make install
for all the rest a simple

./configure
make
sudo make install
is required.
when installing the lib-plugins, it configure may complain about jack not being there, use synaptic to install libjack dev files (search libjack, i cant remember the full name)
You will also (obviously) need all the build-essential and stuff like that.

Hope that helps. I know its not very well written, sorry about that.

[nalmeth]

Maybe just me, I thought breezy was totally awesome.

Keep it up developers, and like neval says, make Dapper the best distro ever!!! :D

[franklee]

I gotta state myself and for the record that as yet, from the cds mailed out to me, the Ubuntu 5.10 is a breezy badger to install and run.

Mind you, Ive been around Linux for a while and choose expert installation so I can play with bits and pieces to suit my tastes and my system.

ah well....

[s_spiff]

Compared to other distro's I think, this is the best thing happened !

[146lily]

I'm a newbie to ubuntu, but I use a repeat approach until I get things right. Audacity has repeated problems related to sound output on a fully updated system running very few extra packages, but lame has been added!? I hav'nt used md5, yes maybe someone is trying to f**k up ubuntu when mp3 support is added. This does not happen on suse 10 or fedora 4.....
Ubuntu has the right ideas....'they' will try to kill it!

[dcstar]

First of all, I don't want to be mean; if I hurt the feelings of any staff member; I'm deeply sorry.

My experience with Breezy begun on trying the candidate versions. I had several problems with it, and turned back using Hoary until the official release of Breezy. (I had a similar problem with the candidate version of Hoary, it was solved with the official version)
.......
Breezy is my 3rd version of Ubuntu, and I would say it has gone backwards from Hoary IMHO.

This is not to say that it's a bad distro, in fact I still rate it as very good, it is just that there have been far too many technical issues experienced from those of us using Breezy (just look at these forums for proof of that........).

If these issues can be ironed out in the next release, then all will be good again and the path to a more viable alternative user desktop for the masses will be further travelled.

[DarkW0lf]

I had installations issues as well.

It would report the detection of firewire and bluetooth devices and fail to configure them on my laptop. Which is true since neither exist in that machine.

Both my laptop and dell optiplex would fail the installation reporting that a package was corrupt or not enough space. I couldn't make a partition larger than 2 GB and it wouldn't install if I formatted a completely empty 2 GB partition and let the installer use all of it.

I got breezy installed by first installing 5.04 again and removing evolution and gnomemeeting (I don't plan on using either). Then I let synaptic update all the packages.

All this was after the first CD I tried blew up in the drive (I am serious).
Good thing I was sent 5.

Now I find out that pmount has errors, having a few problems with bash and my modem is not supported (my fault on that one).

[s_spiff]

Breezy is my 3rd version of Ubuntu, and I would say it has gone backwards from Hoary IMHO.

This is not to say that it's a bad distro, in fact I still rate it as very good, it is just that there have been far too many technical issues experienced from those of us using Breezy (just look at these forums for proof of that........).

If these issues can be ironed out in the next release, then all will be good again and the path to a more viable alternative user desktop for the masses will be further travelled.

I think they definitely will do that. I'm a noob to linux as such, but have tried several distros before ubuntu, and this is the only distro that didn't give me any sort of problems. Now yes, if I were a technical person I would have probably found glitches as such, and say something about it, but for a newbie, this is an amazing distro.

[kairu0]

let's forget about Breezy; it was the worst (and hopefully will always be) release of Ubuntu.

Amen to that. Let's make Dapper the best Ubuntu yet!

[poofyhairguy]

I agree that Breezy is the worst so far. Thats my personal opinion, but it did not depress me because I expected it before release.

I must warn that such a thread might bring flames though....

[mstlyevil]

I found Breezy Kubuntu to be a breath of fresh air. Hoary Kubuntu was slow and klunky. It frequently crashed on me to the point I deleted it and instaled Ubuntu. All those glitches were fixed in the Breezy version of Kubuntu. As far as Ubuntu goes, I have not had a problem whatsoever in breezy since they fixed the Nvidia sound issues and the DMA issues. I felt Breezy was a improvement from my stand point for my hardware. But then again different hardware may have created a different experience for others. I agree with the sentiment that I hope
Dapper is the best Ubuntu ever.

[BoyOfDestiny]

First of all, I don't want to be mean; if I hurt the feelings of any staff member; I'm deeply sorry.

My experience with Breezy begun on trying the candidate versions. I had several problems with it, and turned back using Hoary until the official release of Breezy. (I had a similar problem with the candidate version of Hoary, it was solved with the official version)

So, after the official release of Breezy i upgraded the distribution thru apt-get. I had a very important sound recording problem with it, alongside programs related to it (such as audacity). (I'm an amateur songwriter, and I have to use it)

I hate when people comes and asks questions on forums without searching if it was asked already. So I searched the message and added that I had the same problem. After a generous recommendation from a newbie, my sound system was screwed up totally. However, I fixed that later on; yet no one has still received a pefect solution on sound recording issue. Apparently, it works better on the live version of Breezy.

I have Gentoo on my second harddisk, but Gentoo became "careless" after its founder, Daniel Robbins was "purchased" by Microsoft. My sound recording works fine on that one, but there are so many troubles I can't solve even though I was a moderator on Gentoo Turkish forums. (That's why I left the forum, because I wasn't even able to solve my own problems with Gentoo)

So, I ended up backing up important info into 4 cds and deleting my Ubuntu partition to install Breezy from the official release cd. I did it once, and I got the "unable to install initrd-tools" message while installing. I checked it here on the forums and on the web, and realized the possibility of "bad burning" the iso image. So, even though I burned it slowly (x2) before, I burned it again; and just in case I burned another back-up cd. (So with the first one, I burned a total of 3 cds with the same content)

Second try with the second cd, the same problem; the third try with the third cd again the same problem. Isn't there a solution ? Surely there is, ignoring the problem and installing the rest anyway. However, then one will have to deal with this specific problem later on; hopefully not on a serious issue. Thus, I refuse on principle to "jump ahead" without solving any problem on any distribution. Especially on Ubuntu, a perfect distribution like this shouldn't have this kind of troubles at basic installation. Perhaps it might be my problem, and my cd-burner might not work well (even though it worked on creating my 4 back-up cds).

I think Ubuntu Warty was the best Linux distribution of 2004, and Hoary was the best of 2005. Yet, Breezy doesn't even get close to those two distributions' perfection.

Maybe it's the main problems of the released Debian Sarge's failure (as it can be viewed from their mailing list and forums, people faces similar problems). I wonder if architects of Breezy haven't faced any sound recording or installing conflict; or even some feedback during its candidate versions; maybe they did and maybe they didn't...

I hope that Ubuntu can release the best Linux distribution of 2006 with Dapper Drake, just like they did in 2005 and 2004. Until then, let's forget about Breezy; it was the worst (and hopefully will always be) release of Ubuntu.

Once again, especially the ones helping for free, you are doing an amazing job. Probably not many appreciates your work, and contributing on Gimp, Yoper, Debian, Gentoo and a lot of websites and games I have felt the same way (even though I admit that I haven't contributed at all on most of them except telling what to do and not to do). Increasing your abilities on these occasions will pay back once you will try to do something on your own.

For those who works for money, it's time for Mark Shuttleworth to fly into Canonical Ltd. instead of flying into space and yell a little.

I believe I will wait until Dapper Drake release (or maybe try the candidate soon), but until then I'm taking my hands off Breezy; for the same reason I'm not using Windows XP.

Cheers; and have a wonderful year.

Onur Aydin
a.k.a "`NeRVaL"

Recommendation 1 : Forget about debian's installer, try to implement it on Anaconda or same sort of installer. Debian-installer is one of the weakest part of Debian; it's set-up for 2002 structures of personal computers and it has not been properly updated since. (Severe issues on many laptops on recognizing the keyboard and the mice; which can be solved by using an additional keyboard or mice)

Recommendation 2 : Have every element of your release working on every platform. "The basic use" of an operating system is "not" what a human being can do with a pen and a paper. It is what he can see, hear or compute with it. If some part of it is not working, then don't use it.

Recommendation 3 : Guide yourselves thru "Ubuntu Guides". There are many third-party programs or web-sites on how to make Ubuntu better for the end-user. The "help" document and option is great, yet including java, codecs, proper video-playing capabilities thru browsers, alongside many useful edit should not be that hard; just like it isn't for the end-users.

Golden Recommendation : Believe from the bottom of your heart, that one day more people will use Ubuntu than Windows. Leave the rest to your souls, they will lead you. (Well it can sound childish and religious; yet I'm a grown-up and Agnostic. Synergy is the base of every success.)

P.S : English is my fifth language, if I wasn't understantable at any point (even though I did a spell-check); I'm sorry.

Well I definately agree about sound (in fact that was the only issue I had/have). On my laptop esd is disabled, sound works decently well (sometimes with many apps at the same time it doesn't do too well).

On my desktop, both with breezy, and now dapper testing, I have an audigy2... My sound experience is excellent. I can have literally dozens of apps open, and sound can play simultaneously without fault...

My main point, I felt sound was it's major flaw, and I blame it on ESD (the enlightened sound daemon). Yes I'm bitter, I'm betting all those people who ran into sound trouble (especially when new) were unable to fix it. I hope alsa (With dmix for software mixing if the soundcard can't do it in hardware) will replace it.

Anyway, Ubuntu is the only thing I run on the machines I call my own. I'm more than pleased with it.

As for verifying your cd, after you burn it, you can do md5sum (it contains a file list with checksums on the burnt disc). As for mysterious install issues, I always recommend a bios upgrade.

Sometimes it's tricky to update if you don't have a floppy drive (like on my laptop), but it is pretty easy to download a floppy iso, mount it, add bios, then burn onto a cd (preferably a re-writeable). Just google for it.

As for the installer, I prefer it to the windows installer (if popularity is an issue). I found it easy, especially if doing a new install and keeping your /home partition intact). Granted it's not for everyone, but I always hope it is a choice.

[Thirsteh]

Breezy rocks. Ubuntu gets better with each implementation. Quit sobbing! :D

[Buffalo Soldier]

For me Breezy is the only Ubuntu release that handles my laptop smoothly. Everything from close lid-sleep function, wifi, to the FN keys (internal/external monitor switching, wifi on/off, volume control, lcd brightness) works fine from default install.

Even the Network Settings Location function works smoothly. Changing my wifi settings from one network to another is a lot easier in Ubuntu Breezy than in Windows.

[poofyhairguy]

I agree that Breezy is the worst so far. Thats my personal opinion, but it did not depress me because I expected it before release.

And I must say....it did give me somethings I did not expect (like a decent totem-xine).

[Derek Djons]

Wauw, it's very rare to seem a person with so many problems with Breezy. But I do understand your problems. I also had very difficult period using rpm distro's and had to solve problems which were far beyond my knowledge and logic. These problems drove me towards debian (based) distro's. Also with those distro's I had a couple of hard issues but now with Beezy they are all solved.

I hope your experience will grant Ubuntu a new chance with the upcoming 6.04 release.

Good luck!

[Fyrzen]

I'd like to add that problems are something one should always be prepared to encounter whilst using a linux system(and maybe not just linux), when i moved from Hoary to Breezy i did a clean install because i found Hoary's dismissal to necessitate such actions.

All the new HOWTO's were for breezy, Hoary had bugs i learned to live with and never found solutions for, i hoped Breezy would have fixes for them. When i installed breezy i ended up reinstalling it 9 times until i gradualy came upon a viable solution for a problem with foreign keyboards and was able to start exploring breezy. First of all i was not surprised to see the exact same bug i had everytime i installed hoary, my user name never gets added to sudoers by the installer, a quick fix i'm used to. And as i soon learned, aside from fixing Hoary bugs, Breezy came with a set of it's own, this is why i did 9 reinstalls.

In the end i realised my orignal plan of installing two breezys, i called them Breezy stable and Breezy unstable. The idea was to follow various guides and install allsorts of software cautiously, step-by-step on unstable, having succeeded i then applied the same to stable. Stable was for work, it had to have 0 games and it's eye candy was limited to gnome themes only, it had to have stable precompiled software, unstable was for compiling a custom kernel with all the bells and whistles, compositing, games and enlightenment, experimenting with the latest software.

What i learned from this ordeal, is that stubborn persistance can get you through any problems. I tackled bugs for days, but in the end all of them had a solution. Now both my breezy OS's are free of any "native bugs" which can't be fixed until the next release. In fact i'm using the unstable one mainly because it's so... stable! It just doesn't crash, ever.

My recommendation when facing a problem, is to see it more as a challenge, when you complete it, you will become that much richer in experience and knowledge of linux, what i like to call "Computer Competence".

I think "fully-functional out of the box" is something that can only be achieved with a mac and for now, in the realm of pc's is more of an ideal, which microsoft desperately tries to realise.

[rock freak]

well this is my first ubuntu distro and linux distro actually and im amazed its well ibn a different world to windows im partially there on the switch between the two! just settign up harddrives files finding all the programs i need and i will be ready to go... also im very impressed with dapper at first looks got it today i like some of the new grpahics and its noticble quicker on boot up i rekon!!!!

dapper i think is going to be the best distro of ubuntu!!!

[blueturtl]

I too have to sadly say that Breezy did appear a bit flimsier than Hoary at first look, and I didn't even use APT-GET (something in my head, perhaps from the times I used Windows tells me upgrading cannot work) so I did a fresh install from a CD. One of the first things that caught my attention was that unlike in Hoary I was getting trouble with my OpenGL. Some screensavers would freeze and using screenshots in screensavers wasn't working like it does in Hoary. Also for reasons unknown I had my CPU peaking at almost 100% while not really doing anything.

It doesn't take many errors for me to be frightened since I used Windows and I absolutely hated the feeling of things not working. I was not about to go back on usability and thus I returned to Hoary. The only things I really miss is a few new apps and menu editing, but I can live with what I've got in Hoary. I admit it may have been a rush-decision and the few bugs I encountered may have been fixed or even had work-arounds, but often first impressions do make a difference, and I for one prefer the solid safety Hoary has given me. It just works. Perhaps I will give Dapper a try when it comes out and find it even better than Hoary.

[Titan1958]

I have flushed Windows 1 year ago (too many wasted years). Used Mandrake and now that I have found this Linux distros....and I will stick with it. I love it :)