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Stavro
March 1st, 2009, 09:04 PM
I’m just curious, does anyone agree with me that I think software is becoming increasingly bloated, maybe especially on Windows. This is a bad thing I believe, and it means the average user does not really notice much of a speed increase should they upgrade their hardware.

I like many linux applications because they do tend to be light and functional. I know that there is also a trade-off between functionality and keeping an application light, but sometimes extra functionality is not of the utmost-importance (take an instant messenger program for example) and a reliable program with less features is probably better than one which crashes often. Yahoo Messenger springs to mind, I’ve seen that go wrong quite a few times, whereas Pidgin is excellent and handles all the protocols!

I don’t think anyone will disagree that Vista is very bloated, and I really don’t like how Microsoft have changed perfectly working and well standardized API’s which served well previous versions of Windows (backwards compatibility to Microsoft’s credit has always been a strong point). Most likely this was done not in the interest of user at all, but to encourage developers to write needless Vista only applications so as to help boost and force new license sales.

Does anyone here though, also think that Linux is becoming unnecessary bloated in certain departments. Being open-source, I can imagine it will have a very modular nature which might tend to lead towards this, but maybe something’s could be slimmed down a little. Further, it could be that there are far too many flavors of Linux. The standardized Windows API that I was talking about above has served Windows very well, applications work on most occasions as expected on many computers. Perhaps if Linux was to take more of the market share it needs to advertise itself as one-clear distribution that is generalized in a way that Windows is and is most suitable for meeting the needs of a variety of different users (musicians, graphic-design, novelists etcetera). Of course, there will always be the more technically inclined who might specifically seek out a system which is highly customized for their needs, but this does not help getting the word out. Most computer users are creatures of comfort, you go to a friends place and you have the familiar Start button, task-bar, my computer that you might see on your computer at work, your own and so-forth. There is a familiarity and it makes it easier to solve problems. Whereas there seems to be a bit of a silly competition between KDE, Gnome even XFCE, and some applications that work on one don’t work on the other. They need to be merged somehow.

I wonder if anyone agrees?

will1911a1
March 1st, 2009, 09:16 PM
There are alternatives to GNOME, KDE, and Xfce that are light and will work with just about any gui app you're looking to use.

Have you checked out openbox?

As far as Linux distros merging, I don't see the point. There is a variety because people want different distros for different reasons. If you homogenize everything you'll end up with Windows.

Some software hogs a little too much space and resources for my taste, but there is usually an alternative.

davec64
March 1st, 2009, 09:20 PM
Perhaps if Linux was to take more of the market share it needs to advertise itself as one-clear distribution that is generalized in a way that Windows is and is most suitable for meeting the needs of a variety of different users

Hi Stavro! In your quote above you inadvertently answered the question. Linux will never be one clear distribution because in it's variety of distro's, it caters for users who are looking for a specific area.
i.e.
Debian if you want something rock solid
Arch if you want something lightening fast
DSL of you want a very small footprint
and the list goes on!

For me it's the variety that makes it different and as such it shouldn't change to try and compete against MS on their terms but complete against them on our own terms highlighting the variety available! Which MS can't compete against because it is so generalised.

All the best :)

Grant A.
March 1st, 2009, 09:31 PM
Unless you're willing to devote atleast 12 hours to reading an install guide, you're stuck with Ubuntu.

If you are willing to devote some time, check out Arch Linux.

kerry_s
March 1st, 2009, 09:35 PM
a bit of a ramble, a little hard to guess exactly what you asking. :lolflag:

is software becoming bloated? yes, has been for years, no matter what os.

should desktops merge? no, it's about choice.

there is a difference in the way the desktops function, you need to look past the look/theme/appearance, that is all it is, just a different way to accomplish the same tasks.

i choose not to use any desktop, i use a window manager, jwm, but i do like the desktop look, so i set it up to get that. the only real difference is i use less to do the same thing. i mix and match programs from different desktops that i like.
example:
i use gnome-mplayer from gnome
i use thunar and xfce4-panel from xfce4
i don't have any kde programs right now, cause there's not really any i want to use, but i would use it, if i wanted.

smartboyathome
March 1st, 2009, 09:45 PM
Unless you're willing to devote atleast 12 hours to reading an install guide, you're stuck with Ubuntu.

If you are willing to devote some time, check out Arch Linux.

NOT TRUE! Arch Linux is very easy to install, just looks scary hard for those who are stuck in the GUI mindset.

Grant A.
March 1st, 2009, 09:49 PM
NOT TRUE! Arch Linux is very easy to install, just looks scary hard for those who are stuck in the GUI mindset.

I use Arch, and takes me on average about 6 hours to get the desktop exactly to my likings.

It's such a pain to install that I always back it up with partimage.

LookTJ
March 1st, 2009, 09:56 PM
I use Arch, and takes me on average about 6 hours to get the desktop exactly to my likings.

It's such a pain to install that I always back it up with partimage.Same here. I have Debian installed right now,

I will install Arch back on my PC in June. And WILL use partimage thiis time, because I screwed up my Arch box.

namegame
March 2nd, 2009, 01:11 AM
I use Arch, and takes me on average about 6 hours to get the desktop exactly to my likings.


Configure != Install

I can install Arch faster than I can install Ubuntu...

Heck, it would take me more time to configure Ubuntu to the way I want. (Mostly strip it of the stuff I don't want.)

After I have arch installed and Xorg/Alsa set up. "sudo pacman xfce4 firefox wicd" and I'm good to go. :P

LookTJ
March 2nd, 2009, 01:41 AM
Configure != Install

I can install Arch faster than I can install Ubuntu...

Heck, it would take me more time to configure Ubuntu to the way I want. (Mostly strip it of the stuff I don't want.):PGood points, I agree

jimi_hendrix
March 2nd, 2009, 01:49 AM
install arch, dont install X, no bloat

namegame
March 2nd, 2009, 02:01 AM
install arch, dont install X, no bloat

Or just install X, but don't start it until you want to. It's what I do. The Ubuntu users at my school are amazed at how well I can function without a GUI. Links + Vi and I'm good to go.

Rokurosv
March 2nd, 2009, 02:41 AM
I think there are some apps getting a little bloated, for example Amarok 2, still lacking the functionality of 1.4 but it consumes a lot more memory than it's predecesor. If you want a small but functional DE try LXDE, it's very good.

About installing Arch. Installing it takes about 20 minutes or less then about 2 hours to getting a DE up and running. It's not that hard.

init1
March 2nd, 2009, 02:55 AM
I’m just curious, does anyone agree with me that I think software is becoming increasingly bloated, maybe especially on Windows. This is a bad thing I believe, and it means the average user does not really notice much of a speed increase should they upgrade their hardware.

I've found that Windows users tend to like big applications that do a lot of things. For example, I found a very simple Windows application once that did just one thing: record sound. All of the reviews for it complained that it was useless since Audacity does that and so much more.

adamlau
March 2nd, 2009, 06:06 AM
sudo pacman xfce4 firefox wicd? No way. PKGBUILD it with makepkg-git!