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View Full Version : so, what's wrong with bloat?



chucky chuckaluck
December 23rd, 2008, 03:51 AM
is it really bad, or just immoral? i know the more you put on windows, the more clogged it gets. is this true with linux? if not, shouldn't bloat be the proof of the pudding, so to speak? (can you tell i'm trying to justify my recent swing to the plaid side?)

loell
December 23rd, 2008, 03:56 AM
nothing, its all about speed and resources. :)

say if one is overweight as an elephant, but can run with the speed of a horse. ;)
then its all good. :D

SunnyRabbiera
December 23rd, 2008, 03:57 AM
well bloat is associated with slowdown and sluggishness.

KiwiNZ
December 23rd, 2008, 04:00 AM
It is not what you have , its how its managed.

-grubby
December 23rd, 2008, 04:00 AM
Oh god. I think we've lost you, Chucky...

chucky chuckaluck
December 23rd, 2008, 04:02 AM
Oh god. I think we've lost you, Chucky...

c'mon, dude, when i have i ever stuck with anything?

-grubby
December 23rd, 2008, 04:03 AM
c'mon, dude, when i have i ever stuck with anything?

I suppose that is a very good point ... but usually you are hopping between lightweight things, and not heavy things. Then again, I guess there was your KDE4 phase...

RiceMonster
December 23rd, 2008, 04:04 AM
Speaking of which, I'm waiting for pacman to finish download GNOME right now. I keep getting nostalgic. I'll be surprised if I last longer than 15 minutes on this haha.

-grubby
December 23rd, 2008, 04:06 AM
Speaking of which, I'm waiting for pacman to finish download GNOME right now. I keep getting nostalgic. I'll be surprised if I last longer than 15 minutes on this haha.

I was looking for something pretty, so I installed Openbox. Of course, it's gone now.

chucky chuckaluck
December 23rd, 2008, 04:07 AM
I suppose that is a very good point ... but usually you are hopping between lightweight things, and not heavy things. Then again, I guess there was your KDE4 phase...

i'm embracing the bloat, as one might embrace the universe.



Speaking of which, I'm waiting for pacman to finish download GNOME right now. I keep getting nostalgic. I'll be surprised if I last longer than 15 minutes on this haha.

15 minutes is an awful long time.

shadylookin
December 23rd, 2008, 04:08 AM
bloat has the connotation that it's unwanted and that means it's bad. Of course one man's bloat is another man's amazing program(or feature of a program).

Of course mainstream distros are going to keep adding more programs and features(bloat for some) because computers on average keep getting faster and their not going to stagnate because someone wants to run a it on an excessively old computer.

Dr Small
December 23rd, 2008, 04:13 AM
I was looking for something pretty, so I installed Openbox. Of course, it's gone now.
No! Say it isn't so!!!

chucky chuckaluck
December 23rd, 2008, 04:15 AM
i'm using openbox, now. i guess in another hour, i'll be downloading minix.

KiwiNZ
December 23rd, 2008, 04:18 AM
i'm using openbox, now. i guess in another hour, i'll be downloading minix.


*whisper mode* Get a Mac and get OSX :P

-grubby
December 23rd, 2008, 04:19 AM
No! Say it isn't so!!!

Nobody can drag me away from Wmii. Not nobody not no how!

chucky chuckaluck
December 23rd, 2008, 04:26 AM
*whisper mode* Get a Mac and get OSX :P

[loud]i'm too cheap.[/whisper]

RiceMonster
December 23rd, 2008, 04:51 AM
Well that was annoying. I tried to use GNOME for about 10 minutes, got annoyed with it, then quickly removed it. Ran into a bit of dependency hell doing so too. That was annoying, even though I got around it quickly.

Dr Small
December 23rd, 2008, 04:53 AM
Well that was annoying. I tried to use GNOME for about 10 minutes, got annoyed with it, then quickly removed it. Ran into a bit of dependency hell doing so too. That was annoying, even though I got around it quickly.
GNOME is annoying period, not to mention all the strings attached.

SomeGuyDude
December 23rd, 2008, 05:15 AM
"Bloat" is a suggestive thing because it's defined (to me) as anything that takes up resources that you'd rather not have there. For many people, a full-fledged KDE4 install has things they want to be there and consider none of it "bloat". For others, anything but a trimmed-down TWM is bloated and wasteful.

If it's doing what you want it to do and there's nothing unused wasting space, it's not bloated, whatever it may be.

zmjjmz
December 23rd, 2008, 05:18 AM
For others, anything but a trimmed-down TWM is bloated and wasteful.


Have you ever actually tried to use TWM?
I recommend that you don't. DWM is perfectly fine if you need something really lightweight.

chucky chuckaluck
December 23rd, 2008, 05:19 AM
twm is insane. i'd rather go back to file cards.

SomeGuyDude
December 23rd, 2008, 05:20 AM
Have you ever actually tried to use TWM?
I recommend that you don't. DWM is perfectly fine if you need something really lightweight.

TWM = Tiling Window Manager in this case. If there's a specific WM that uses that abbreviation I'm not aware of it.

DWM is the closest I've come to a usable TWM, but no go.

TheOrangePeanut
December 23rd, 2008, 05:22 AM
TWM is the window manager that comes with x.org, and it really is a pain in the ***.

-grubby
December 23rd, 2008, 05:22 AM
DWM is the closest I've come to a usable TWM, but no go.

Have you tried Wmii? It's the biggest and most user friendly (for non-tiling natives) Tiling window manager I know of.

chucky chuckaluck
December 23rd, 2008, 05:23 AM
TWM is the window manager that comes with x.org, and it really is a pain in the ***.

it's like a fat penny.

zmjjmz
December 23rd, 2008, 05:27 AM
vtwm is awesome though.
As for a tiling window manager, I use XMonad. It has a ton of Haskell bloat though.

KiwiNZ
December 23rd, 2008, 05:29 AM
One mans bloat is another mans good dollop of useful Apps

It's all a matter of choice .

chucky chuckaluck
December 23rd, 2008, 05:34 AM
i'm sensing the absolution.

SomeGuyDude
December 23rd, 2008, 05:37 AM
Have you tried Wmii? It's the biggest and most user friendly (for non-tiling natives) Tiling window manager I know of.

Looking back at my notes, WMII was apparently my favorite, not DWM. My only problem was simple logistics. I could never find a configuration of tiled windows I liked. That might be a matter of adjusting, but no matter how many times I tried it just wasn't there for me. Not to mention I really like the aesthetics of a floating WM. Sure there's some wasted space, but I can deal for the other perks of using OpenBox. :guitar:

magmon
December 23rd, 2008, 07:01 AM
Well, I guess it depends on your definition of bloat. But yes, I see it as bad because theres soooo much to keep track of lol.

chucky chuckaluck
December 23rd, 2008, 07:06 AM
Well, I guess it depends on your definition of bloat. But yes, I see it as bad because theres soooo much to keep track of lol.

i think bloat, well intended bloat that is, is often the result of setting up a system that keeps track of things for you. when that enabling bloat isn't around, you have to keep track of it yourself.

loell
December 23rd, 2008, 07:08 AM
bloat doesn't mean multiple softwares either, you can have one, yet someone will call it bloat.

magmon
December 23rd, 2008, 07:09 AM
i think bloat, well intended bloat that is, is often the result of setting up a system that keeps track of things for you. when that enabling bloat isn't around, you have to keep track of it yourself.

I dont trust things to watch my security/anything for me. I like to know exactly whats going on and how I can perfect it. Luckily, linux saves me alot of time and effort installing things and making it secure.

chucky chuckaluck
December 23rd, 2008, 07:31 AM
I dont trust things to watch my security/anything for me. I like to know exactly whats going on and how I can perfect it. Luckily, linux saves me alot of time and effort installing things and making it secure.

for perspective's sake, i just did a full installation of ubuntu after using arch for about eight months. once the novelty wears off, i'll probably go back to arch, or do a minimum install of ubuntu. right now, i'm following the advice my cousin once gave me when we were trying to decide between a case, or just a twelve pack: "anything worth doing is worth overdoing."