RIAA to stop suing file sharers

[Grant A.]

http://blog.wired.com/business/2008/12/riaa-says-it-pl.html

Perhaps this could help remove the need of DRM?

[blakjesus]

Unfortunately, they will be going above your heads to get your ISP to cut off your IP address from the internet if they detect copyright infringement. Not much of an improvement if you ask me.

I don't think the RIAA will ever truly stop.

[myusername]

they're just doing it so they can take the law into their own hands and not go to court

[dannytatom]

I can only hope my ISP doesn't go for this. :/

[zmjjmz]

This isn't good. It's prosecuting someone without due process, and without a venue for the victim to make claims otherwise.
On the bright side, the worst punishment will now be a lost internet connection.

[myusername]

thats true. but i'd rather take my chances with a judicial system

[KiwiNZ]

The risk is easily mitigated ... buy them

[gn2]

The risk is easily mitigated ... buy them

Good advice, but perhaps the price could be adjusted to reflect the much lower costs of distribution over the internet?

In the UK an official download album (at a lower quality than the CD) can cost more than the CD.

If the price was fair, more people might be prepared to pay?

[Skripka]

If the price was fair, more people might be prepared to pay?


Nope. I doubt it.


Linux is $$ free, yet most people would sooner get am illegal copy of Windows. Yes, somewhat spples and oranges comparison...but.....

The problem we have now-is that the notion of Intellectual Property (in computing specifically) has become so abstract that most people figure if they aren't actually getting any really "physical" thing--why pay for it? I know teens and younger-that regularly talk about Limewire and the like-with no qualms about not feeling guilty about theft. They might know they are doing something bad--but they figure that since all their peers do it, why lose sleep over it? The same applies to software-peer groups pass around software, with not a single lost minute of sleep.

CDs really changed things-in that one could play a studio quality recording anywhere--and the cost of a CD is less than going to a show often....when CDs could be ripped into files, the last vestiges of any sense of "Property" really vanished "They are just bits, why should we have to pay for them?" There is a similar problem in software, that is often exacerbated by prohibitive prices and absurd EULAs. All you get now is a CD or DVD, not even hard manual (just a PDF file on the disc...that sometimes has DRM on it to prevent you from printing it---to force you to buy the manual).

My protest to the RIAA is to only buy music from freelance artists, or to share CDs quid pro quo with friends...last I knew sharing physical media was not only nearly impossible to track, but it is also not something people have been sued over (people have been doing it since the days of tape).

[zmjjmz]

The risk is easily mitigated ... buy them

Need I remind you of this (http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/06/05/the-inexact-science-behind-dmca-takedown-notices/)?

[Depressed Man]

This won't result in any changes. Just the courtroom battles will change (since the RIAA was begin to lose pretty badly and odds were getting stacked against them). Now the ISPs that go along with this will be in the courtrooms as well.

[blastus]

ISPs are going to bear significant expenses on behalf of the RIAA if they have to investigate every letter/email the RIAA sends them. Based on the history of RIAA litigations, they are going to be a lot of letters/emails. The result is that ISPs will ultimately have to charge more for services. Even if you don't violate copyrights, you'll still end up paying more for Internet access. This is load of crap; first there was the levy on blank media, and now this.

Why doesn't the RIAA just lobby the government to add a RIAA-tax to all Internet access? I wouldn't be surprised if they try this in the future.

[Spr0k3t]

We are all pirates...

http://xkcd.com/488/

The RIAA is only there to sell us back our rights which we have lost due to political ignorance.

[lifestream]

Unfortunately, they will be going above your heads to get your ISP to cut off your IP address from the internet if they detect copyright infringement. Not much of an improvement if you ask me.

I don't think the RIAA will ever truly stop.


Will?
I did customer support for a local ISP (who runs on xxxxx (can't say other well known's DSL company name) phone lines.

We DID shut down some guy's internet, not just the IP. This was.... *thinks*... November 2006.


Shame. Was the Sopranos show really worth it?! xD

Needless to say, that man never renewed his service. Don't blame him.

[MikeTheC]

We are all pirates...

http://xkcd.com/488/

The RIAA is only there to sell us back our rights which we have lost due to political ignorance.

+1 for a profound truth being expressed through a clever turn of phrase.

[MikeTheC]

Will?
I did customer support for a local ISP (who runs on xxxxx (can't say other well known's DSL company name) phone lines.

We DID shut down some guy's internet, not just the IP. This was.... *thinks*... November 2006.


Shame. Was the Sopranos show really worth it?! xD

Needless to say, that man never renewed his service. Don't blame him.

Well, my question here is where are ISPs' true loyalties? Where is the incentive? Threaten your customers and you might lose them. Cut them off and you'll almost certainly lose them. Cut-off letters = cut-off customers = fewer customers = reduced revenues.

This goes right back to points I've raised elsewhere about the legalized over-extension (gross over-extension, perhaps?) of company policy enforcement on the general public. As Spr0k3t basically said above, this is occurring due to ignorance, on the political and legislative levels, which in turn is capable of being allowed to happen due to ignorance on the general public's level.

But let the general public get smacked around long enough and hard enough, and there will be a reaction. Unfortunately, the general public usually requires a large amount of relatively sudden pain to do anything about it.

[Dr. C]

Need I remind you of this (http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/06/05/the-inexact-science-behind-dmca-takedown-notices/)?

The University of Washington study shows haw easy it is to set up the RIAA or MPAA and an ISP who cooperates with them to fail in a big way.

In the study they "frame" innocent IP's belonging to say a printer or a router and generate DMCA take down notices. This is done by setting up fake torrents on site such as TPB that pretend to contain infringing content at the IP in question. This can be done from anywhere in the world.

So what happens if say 10,000 subscribers of a RIAA friendly ISP who are totally innocent are cut off because of false accusations of copyright infringement decide on a class action against the ISP and the RIAA?

[I-75]

The University of Washington study shows haw easy it is to set up the RIAA or MPAA and an ISP who cooperates with them to fail in a big way.

In the study they "frame" innocent IP's belonging to say a printer or a router and generate DMCA take down notices. This is done by setting up fake torrents on site such as TPB that pretend to contain infringing content at the IP in question. This can be done from anywhere in the world.

So what happens if say 10,000 subscribers of a RIAA friendly ISP who are totally innocent are cut off because of false accusations of copyright infringement decide on a class action against the ISP and the RIAA?

Good points, I download Alex Jones videos ( he encourages people to "share (his) videos on the file sharing networks") and can see how this whole ISP/RIAA alliance could get out of hand.

I think this is a backdoor to be used as a excuse to censor the internet. For instance...if someone downloads copyright free videos , but politically incorrect videos like Alex Jones. All the powers that be have to say it was RIAA/copyrighted material when in fact it wasn't and there goes your internet.

[wmcbrine]

Unfortunately, they will be going above your heads to get your ISP to cut off your IP address from the internet if they detect copyright infringement. Not much of an improvement if you ask me.I think getting cut off is a lot less brutal than being sued, especially with the insanely inflated awards they were seeking. In principle, one can always just go to another ISP. Although, with all the consolidation of ISPs now, that could be a problem.


I don't think the RIAA will ever truly stop.I think this change is a huge defeat for them, and I expect more defeats to come.

[treepolitik]

+1 for a profound truth being expressed through a clever turn of phrase.

Wait a minute!--The answer appears to be politics. We are not allowed to do anything that is against the law. If the RIAA can lobby, so can we. We can put a request in to change the law. It is not wrong to publicize about changing the law, although it is wrong to advocate breaking the law.

It is my understanding that people in official positions must take the side of the law and thus avoid being biased. However, corporations are able to change the law so that a great deal of what they do, despite difficulty for others, is legal. Why shouldn't we try as well?

For the record(no pun intended), I'd also like to say that I'm not a big fan of music nowadays. In the U.S.A. of the 1960s everybody wrote their own music, but everybody performed everybody else's music--not to copy--but so that the anti-war message would spread. What if we saw beyond the red tape and simply ignored the industry, returning to folk music? The industry would crumble.

[smartboyathome]

I think getting cut off is a lot less brutal than being sued, especially with the insanely inflated awards they were seeking. In principle, one can always just go to another ISP. Although, with all the consolidation of ISPs now, that could be a problem.

Actually, I would expect a "pirate list" to come out, which would be shared between IPs like the card counter list in Casinos, so you couldn't get internet no matter where you go.

[jleewach]

For the record(no pun intended), I'd also like to say that I'm not a big fan of music nowadays.

Agreed. There is very little mainstream music left anymore. Just overprocessed product. The RIAA should be paying US to listen to that crap!

[solitaire]

All ISP's should follow this guys lead..

http://news.cnet.com/8301-1023_3-10127841-93.html

I can see the email exchanges now between ISP Owner & RIAA:
Owner: "OK. You want me to track down and cut off these 'alleged' pirates?"
RIAA: "YES!"
Owner: "I'll do that. What's your Billing address?
RIAA: "Our What?"
Owner: "You Billing address. I need to know where to send the Invoice?"
RIAA: "Why would you need to Invoice us?"
Owner: "Well i'f I'm going to be you're police force and kick of my paying customers. I want to be paid to do it."
RIAA: "..."

[bp1509]

The risk is easily mitigated ... buy them

more like boycott them. and use smaller ISPs rather than the conglomerates that will do their bidding..

[pp.]

The risk is easily mitigated ... buy them

I can't afford to buy an ISP.

[Skripka]

more like boycott them. and use smaller ISPs rather than the conglomerates that will do their bidding..

Uh huh. There are a total of two ISPs in my neck of the woods-Time Warner and Alltel. That is it-all the littls guys got bought out.


BTW-Verizon is no cooperating with them according to Ars



Despite the RIAA's unwillingness to identify the ISPs that are currently involved in the program, Ars has confirmed that Verizon is not participating at the moment. Requests for comment to AT&T and Comcast were not returned.


http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20081221-riaa-graduated-response-plan-qa-with-cary-sherman.html

[zmjjmz]

BTW-Verizon is no cooperating with them according to Ars



http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20081221-riaa-graduated-response-plan-qa-with-cary-sherman.html

Thank god Verizon has FiOS here.

[koffeinöverdos]

This is all just a burden for the ISPs. The RIAA has to be forking over a big amount of money to the ISPs for this. The whole reason they stopped the lawsuit mania strategy was because they were throwing money away. I don't understand the logic behind this. Its burdening the ISPs with tons of extra work and costing them customers, what do they get out of it?

[wmcbrine]

It is not wrong to publicize about changing the law, although it is wrong to advocate breaking the law.It's not necessarily wrong to advocate breaking the law, either. "Illegal" is not the same as "wrong".

[Frak]

I use CableONE (Washington Post) and they are atm cooperating with the RIAA. They decided to email me a warning telling me they've cut off my connection for a day and to get back to them to review the situation. Low and behold, I gave them the good 'ole "It's illegal for you to be looking into my data transfers, hang up, bring my connection back up, or I'll call my lawer and they can handle this for me".

What'ya know, it was up in the next 5 minutes. Peerguardian blocks all the tracing IP's, so the only thing they could do is look into my connection. What I know that they don't know I know, is that:
1. It's illegal for them to look at what you're doing
2. They must abide by the law and make their domains/IP's public knowledge
3. Personal use of a file inside the United States (i.e. no sharing back out to others) is fully legal

[Grant A.]

All ISP's should follow this guys lead..

http://news.cnet.com/8301-1023_3-10127841-93.html

I can see the email exchanges now between ISP Owner & RIAA:
Owner: "OK. You want me to track down and cut off these 'alleged' pirates?"
RIAA: "YES!"
Owner: "I'll do that. What's your Billing address?
RIAA: "Our What?"
Owner: "You Billing address. I need to know where to send the Invoice?"
RIAA: "Why would you need to Invoice us?"
Owner: "Well i'f I'm going to be you're police force and kick of my paying customers. I want to be paid to do it."
RIAA: "..."

Ha! That gave me a good laugh :D

Don't worry about a blacklist though, it is illegal to share private information on web browsing, due to the United States Internet Security Act of 1988. Perhaps the best damn piece of litigation ever written.

[koffeinöverdos]

I use CableONE (Washington Post) and they are atm cooperating with the RIAA. They decided to email me a warning telling me they've cut off my connection for a day and to get back to them to review the situation. Low and behold, I gave them the good 'ole "It's illegal for you to be looking into my data transfers, hang up, bring my connection back up, or I'll call my lawer and they can handle this for me".

What'ya know, it was up in the next 5 minutes. Peerguardian blocks all the tracing IP's, so the only thing they could do is look into my connection. What I know that they don't know I know, is that:
1. It's illegal for them to look at what you're doing
2. They must abide by the law and make their domains/IP's public knowledge
3. Personal use of a file inside the United States (i.e. no sharing back out to others) is fully legal

Way to stick it to the man:guitar:

[Frak]

Way to stick it to the man:guitar:
Washington Post has been in bed with the RIAA and other anti-piracy organizations for a very long time. I prepared when I switched to them as an ISP. My first offence was, ironically, breaking Ubuntu copyright by illegally downloading an Ubuntu iso over bittorrent.

[Skripka]

Washington Post has been in bed with the RIAA and other anti-piracy organizations for a very long time. I prepared when I switched to them as an ISP. My first offence was, ironically, breaking Ubuntu copyright by illegally downloading an Ubuntu iso over bittorrent.

You NAUGHTY person. Get off our forum, illegal!! :lolflag:

[Grant A.]

Washington Post has been in bed with the RIAA and other anti-piracy organizations for a very long time. I prepared when I switched to them as an ISP. My first offence was, ironically, breaking Ubuntu copyright by illegally downloading an Ubuntu iso over bittorrent.

Stealing from a non-profit organization? How dare you! :lolflag:

[Frak]

You NAUGHTY person. Get off our forum, illegal!! :lolflag:


Stealing from a non-profit organization? How dare you! :lolflag:

I was sure that when I booted into gentoo they were going to get me for stealing source codes too... :lolflag:

I've just learned to snarl back when somebody growls.

[sportscrazed2]

so as long as you don't share your own music you don't have anything to worry about?

[Frak]

so as long as you don't share your own music you don't have anything to worry about?
Aye

You can download as much as you want, but you cannot upload anything back. That is within the law. I've had AT&T, Verizon, and CableONE (Washington Post) tell me this, and verified by a lawyer.

[sportscrazed2]

cool most stuff i have but i don't feel like ripping entire cd just to get 1 song i can dl in 30 seconds

[MikeTheC]

I've no issue with actual "copyright" law. I have no issue even with the basic concept of "intellectual property". But what I do have a problem with is how we have allowed private industry to enforce company policies with the full weight and force of the law.

Yes, I have a mighty big problem with that.

[MikeTheC]

For the record(no pun intended), I'd also like to say that I'm not a big fan of music nowadays. In the U.S.A. of the 1960s everybody wrote their own music, but everybody performed everybody else's music--not to copy--but so that the anti-war message would spread. What if we saw beyond the red tape and simply ignored the industry, returning to folk music? The industry would crumble.

+1 to this...

Additionally, if you're interested in finding artists you'd like to support who would, directly or indirectly, assist in "ignoring the industry", you might want to check out Fresh Tracks Music Festival (http://www.freshtracksfestival.com) as well as listen to other indie artists, such as Acoustic Eidolon (http://www.acousticeidolon.com/) and [http://www.myspace.com/sampacetti]Sam Pacetti[/url].

These are all each excellent sources of indie music. In the case of Eidolon and Sam, I've also heard them in person, and they're quite a treat to see!

[treepolitik]

So what happens if say 10,000 subscribers of a RIAA friendly ISP who are totally innocent are cut off because of false accusations of copyright infringement decide on a class action against the ISP and the RIAA?

But how do they find each other if they don't have internet? We would naturally hope that they all receive(and read) the same publication with the same ad for the class action suit, unless the major media covers it, or is paid to cover it. It seems to me that, if this class action were to be undertaken, the spread of the message to join the suit would need to precede the publication by most media.

[treepolitik]

It's not necessarily wrong to advocate breaking the law, either. "Illegal" is not the same as "wrong".

I was just covering for myself because I saw that someone got kicked off the forums for trying to give advice on how to copy DVDs. I just wanted to bring it to other users' attention that Ubuntu Forums is allowed to be stricter than the law, if they so choose.