"Defecting From Linux as a Rational Act"

[nitehawk777]

Interesting. Beranger (and his blog) have had a large linux following. Now he posts this,...(with all the subsequent postings that followed his "announcement")

http://beranger.org/index.php?page=diary&2008/12/10/23/43/18-the-big-move-defecting-from-linu

So,...what would YOUR ideas on his announcement be? Linux works for me,....so I don't share his particular views. However,..he does present some interesting and valid points.

PS: His site has some great listings of apps and stuff.

[cardinals_fan]

I was waiting for this to pop up here. I've posted in the comments on his blog under my evil pseudonym "toast".

Overall, it's his choice. I think many of his complaints are valid, while some are absurd, but it's still his decision.

[Bölvaður]

I couldnt bare reading more than few lines in fear of spewing out my breakfast and some chicken I had for lunch.

[Bachstelze]

Oh, please, no...

This guy is an idiot. Do not waste your time and energy talking about him.

[Sealbhach]

Yeah, whatever, bye.


.

[dannytatom]

He makes some good points at the first of the article, but as the article went on it seemed to be less about fact and more about opinion/emotion. :/

[jrusso2]

Funny thing is most of what he says is true, Linux did blow it and for those reasons.

Yet I still enjoy it rather others do or not.

[aaaantoine]

It took a philosophical drive to get me to where I am with Linux today. A superior work envioronment is keeping me here, even though he makes several valid points.

[MikeTheC]

I couldnt bare reading more than few lines in fear of spewing out my breakfast and some chicken I had for lunch.
+1

Oh, please, no...

This guy is an idiot. Do not waste your time and energy talking about him.
+1

Yeah, whatever, bye.
+1


The dude's entitled to his choices and opinions. He may be an idiot and a moron, but he's entitled to his idiocy. It's still a free cosmos, isn't it?

[Changturkey]

He has some good points, but then some of it is just puge rage. I wonder, what is he going to do when XP is not supported anymore?

[Vince4Amy]

Some of the things in that blog have been reasonably valid and I do agree somewhat with some of the things that have been posted now and in the past. The Rant about JFS not be included in some distros for example.

Of course some of the information on there is just opinionated too, but there some valid points in various articles on there.

[Twitch6000]

He makes some good points at the first of the article, but as the article went on it seemed to be less about fact and more about opinion/emotion. :/

Agreed I started reading his thoughts and one or two I was like yeah and this is why I use this instead and keep reading then I just seen pure incorrect statements and emotions running wild lol..

[pp.]

Poor prose, long on the opinion side, a bit short of facts. I don't quite see where 'defection' comes into it, and "rational acts" usually are, well, based on facts and ratio.

[EdThaSlayer]

Mike - December 11, 2008 at 02:38:31 GMT

Don't let the door hit you on the *** on the way out.

:lolflag: I sincerely agree!
This guy is acting a bit whack, well, some people just can't take the pressure(that's why there are a lot of "average joe's around").

I bet that he will come back though after a year or so. :KS

[zmjjmz]

The font made my eyes bleed.

[mentallaxative]

He makes some decent points about the stability of distributions, though I'm not sure if his idea of stability is truly realistic. In any case, the real worth of Beranger can be measured in the length of his projects page, not his blog.

[WaeV]

Linux is not UNIX — it's more and more like Windows Millennium Edition with Compiz added

I disagree, but still lol'ed.

[chucky chuckaluck]

good points about kde4 and compiz. they're like open source versions of fake breasts.

[MikeTheC]

To be honest, I was wondering what he was smoking as he wrote that article. I mean, it must have been some pretty good, um ... stuff ... and maybe I could use a pound or two.

Heck, anything that good, we all could use a pound or two.

[Skripka]

To be honest, I was wondering what he was smoking as he wrote that article. I mean, it must have been some pretty good, um ... stuff ... and maybe I could use a pound or two.

Heck, anything that good, we all could use a pound or two.

.....And odds are it isn't even legal in the Netherlands....

[Cracauer]

Interesting. Beranger (and his blog) have had a large linux following. Now he posts this,...(with all the subsequent postings that followed his "announcement")

http://beranger.org/index.php?page=diary&2008/12/10/23/43/18-the-big-move-defecting-from-linu

So,...what would YOUR ideas on his announcement be? Linux works for me,....so I don't share his particular views. However,..he does present some interesting and valid points.

PS: His site has some great listings of apps and stuff.

Wow, the guy is really on target. I think if you'd force me to use Fedora I wouldn't use Linux anymore either. KDE and GNOME I don't use anyway. All that HAL, udev etc is half-baken and should be one integrated subsystem. I just turn most of it off. Even Ubunto broke udev things lately they wouldn't be broken without it. Undocumented mess. Xorg is a great example of software actually breaking a lot of what was traditionally working. All in the name of new functionality I don't really need and is only marginally useful for me. I want my fixed X11 working at the resolution I specify in the config file. Fine, now I can switch on the fly, but I get resolutions I don't want all the time (on notebooks you can't kick out the native resolution) in the first place. This wasn't the case in Xorg 1.2, and it's the tip of the iceberg.

Major Linux subsystems have definitely become too eager to please users who want everything automatic lately, with Fedora being one huge "subsystem" like that.

[magmon]

Dont like it, dont use it... Its that simple!

[original_jamingrit]

His comments on the community were a little unnerving, but the sentiment that expressed at the end was what really bugged me. "There is no such thing as freedom".

It's interesting, the word freedom has so many different uses. Free as in free speech and free as in free beer are the two main uses that get thrown around here. But free as in free lunch? I totally agree that there is no such thing as a free lunch. But free as in free lunch isn't quite the same as the first two freedoms.

The first two freedoms are achievable. The third one is like getting something from nothing, and it's a logical fallacy. But I do believe that everyone deserves a system that works for them, and if this guy needs Windows for his ideal system, then I simply hope that he's satisfied.

[Mr. Picklesworth]

...and so he goes back to Windows XP, which is violently competed against and intentionally crippled by Microsoft themselves?
(See XP licensing for netbooks if you need an example).


with Linux you have distro makers who fail to understand why people would need a system that actually works and keeps working!So I'm a random guy who got sick of his touchpad, so is tweaking the Synaptics touchpad driver to be superbly cool and satisfying with kinetic pointer glide. I am not affiliated with "the distro maker;" I just want my computer to be nice and I have the power to make it so.

The Linux community is not divided, because a lot of it is propped up by individual efforts within major projects. As long as those projects work in a hierarchy, each contributing to each other with upstreams and downstreams, and as long as individuals are free to do what they choose where they choose, it all fits together perfectly. The fact is, Linux would not work if we had one mega distro or one single way of doing things. It would be too crowded for people to contribute in the friendly and open way they can today, and it would be too difficult for a technology to become adopted.
See, the great thing with PulseAudio and the like is that it starts in one distro, then because it is a Good Idea, it spreads into others. Bad ideas, on the other hand, stay with single distros and ultimately die.


there is no such thing as freedom nowadays.Sounds like this guy has given up on a lot more than just Linux.

[handy]

In over 22 years I have never had a desktop that suits me better than Arch/Xfce. I have never had an OS/distro that is so simple to configure & that gives me all of the control in setup & configuration;- how I want it to work, what I want to be a part of it & what I don't, it gives me the ability to change my mind & install something incredibly quickly after which I can change my mind again & uninstall it even quicker. I have never had anything that even comes close to satisfying my computing needs as this combination.

The rolling release - not having to reinstall the system is fine by me.

Having had 2 problems in over 8 months is pretty remarkable in my book. Both sets of problems came from upstream, the 1st a kernel bug, the 2nd caused by changes in X in combination with the Catalyst drivers trying to cope with the new X (I think). Even though I still consider myself to be both a Linux & Arch beginner, both problems did not take a great deal of time to sort out, due to the magnificent Linux COMMUNITY, in the sorting you can actually benefit other people with & help them get through their problems quicker, or even avoid them all together. (& of course learn new things :-))

You can't buy a community.

As far as the unintelligent Arch installer is concerned, that is part of the Arch way, things are not hidden behind graphical screens with buttons & done for you; what gets done is done because you told it to be done & it is done how you told it to be done. Unless of course you inherited a bug from upstream. :lolflag:

As far as I'm concerned there are 2 things that need to be fixed in GNU/Linux:

First & foremost the X.server needs to be developed to the point where it is no longer the prime source of difficulty for new users & old.

Secondly, we need a tool that works across as large a variety of DE/WM's theming systems as possible, giving a simple interface to change their colours, the time & frustration saved by this tool would be enormous.

The second one is a distant second, & I'm sure many would have other things that they would place far above it, I don't.

[EnGorDiaz]

i think hes the emo grow up

he obviously does not know how to operate a computer it takes the meaning operating system to a new level of depression what an idiot

[barisurum]

If I were him I wouldn't list my reasons to defect from linux. I would tell the people about it in a short message and I would easily change the blog and ads. Then I would start to write about how XP can be tweaked to suit the user's needs. It doesn't make sense unless he has received a great deal of money or proportions. He may even be using linux at home as we speak :lolflag:

[Tomosaur]

I use Windows at work, and Ubuntu at home. Both are annoying in their own special way, but at least Ubuntu will break when I mess up, not when some random component of some background process that I never actually launched decides to jump off a bridge.

It's a tough one. I don't like using Windows - it just feels awkward, slow, and irritating. Maybe I just prefer the default behaviour of Ubuntu and Linux in general for certain things. Neither is perfect - far from it, but at least Ubuntu doesn't randomly slow down for 5 minutes because Almighty Bill has deemed that 'this is the time for indexing' or something ridiculous.

[MikeTheC]

.....And odds are it isn't even legal in the Netherlands....

True.

[lukjad]

Whatever. I think he has some good points, but, really, he should get over it.

[sges]

His points on KDE4 are valid. Also when GNOME switched to GVFS they introduced a SAMBA bug that is still open (although a near final patch is available). Python also kills backward compatibility in every version. Linux does have a unnecessary rewrite problem and abandons older versions too quickly. This may be a manpower problem. However he is incorrect with his "distro freeze" and "rolling release" comment. Ubuntu for example has a Backports repository so you can go for the latest and greatest, or stick to what was released by disabling Backports. Also all upgrades are optional and any application can be tagged "do not upgrade"

Red Hat walked away from the desktop as they have to answer to shareholder very quarter. Mark Shuttleworth can try and retry as the desktop gets better. Remember Windows was released in 1985 but it was not until 1990 that we had something usable, and Microsoft had no competition (except apple who were in a niche market with different more expensive hardware) while Linux on the desktop has Microsoft trying to crush it at every turn.

[theApokalypsis]

sounds like hes an idiot...

he does not seem to get or care about what OSS truly is. its always about change. new things. new ways. sometimes you have to redo things.

but that is the main point of no?

:)

[Mr. Picklesworth]

As far as installing newer versions of software seperate from the OS release is concerned, as Ubuntu's ecosystem grows (and if Deb packaging ever gets easier) that option gets more visible. Banshee is a nice example of an application that can be installed in seconds regardless of what Ubuntu release you have (just so long as it's still supported).

I think what we need is something like a Package Kit for packaging, which abstracts the entire Autotools / Debian Tools / dpkg / RPM / whatever other packaging tools people use under a simple (optional) file-manager-like interface. Then someone could build for Packaging Kit, press a button and have their project in the appropriate format for all the big distros :)

[mentallaxative]

Python also kills backward compatibility in every version.

Python has been backward-compatible for the entire 2.xx series. Where'd you get your info from?

[BigSilly]

No operating system is perfect. It's early days yet for his trip back into Microsoft waters. He may find before long a whole lot of problems he never originally envisaged, and may even come to regret his overtly public "passion" for his change of heart.

There are pluses and minuses for using XP, but for me, on a very basic level, I enjoy the freedom of my computer just too darned much with Linux to want to go back to Windows.

[KiwiNZ]

He omitted one fault the Linux community has ... That is the inability to take criticism well.

Complaints should be viewed as a gift , some cares enough to complain and to advise us of the complaint.

We do not suffer complaints well and that I believe hold us back and why we end up with a mess like KDE.

[MikeTheC]

We do not suffer complaints well and that I believe hold us back and why we end up with a mess like KDE.

Don't look at me, man... I use Gnome. :)

[KiwiNZ]

Don't look at me, man... I use Gnome. :)

Well done :p

[handy]

Don't look at me, man... I use Gnome. :)

Try Xfce? :-)

[Giant Speck]

He omitted one fault the Linux community has ... That is the inability to take criticism well.

I wholeheartedly agree with and endorse this statement.

[red_Marvin]

Any sufficiently large general purpose system will fail to cater to some specific needs. He just found it (mis-)matching his. Big deal. I hope he gets happier with his choice.

He seems to know his way around a linux system, but I can't see the rationality in asking for a state of the art kernel (with all features) to run as snappy as Windows 98. You needed the SE version to get native usb support after all.
And if he really wanted he could compile his own kernel and strip out all that he don't expect to need.

...Meh.

[Onyros]

Béranger has always been an opinionated ***, but that's how he catered to his audience.

I see some validity in a few points he mentioned, as these last few months have had some radical changes in things we were pretty much used, too. A few were not as well planned and executed, sometimes seeming to lack an underlying conjugation of actions. Xorg 7.3 to 7.4 comes to mind, as it seemed to stem from cut-off islands of software development.

But other than that, why should we care about this guy? He's just an ***, and now he's a Windows XP using ***. His criticism over the time was mostly unwarranted and didn't bring anything new to the table. Whenever he wasn't ranting or recycling someone else's opinion (or set of opinions), what was he positively bringing to the Linux community?

Good friggin' riddance, if you ask me.

[|{urse]

It's not hard to find the problems with any system, the question is whether he is actively fixing the problems of a system or just being a user, if he's just a user then windows is good for him.

[mrgnash]

Faulty arguments, poor reasoning, and atrocious grammar. Where, exactly, are the "valid points" that some posters have claimed that he has made? I am not asking this as a "Linux fanboy";I do think that there are legitimate criticisms to be made regarding both Linux and the Ubuntu distribution, I just don't think that he made any.

[MikeTheC]

Wow. Like seriously. Why are we still discussing this looser? Let's bury this thread and be done with it. 500,000,000 million posts about some dude who thinks Windows is better than Linux, and proprietary closed-source is better than GPL'd open-source is enough, don't you think?

[toupeiro]

... kde4 and compiz. they're like open source versions of fake breasts.

lol!

[Cracauer]

Wow. Like seriously. Why are we still discussing this looser? Let's bury this thread and be done with it. 500,000,000 million posts about some dude who thinks Windows is better than Linux, and proprietary closed-source is better than GPL'd open-source is enough, don't you think?

Because inside the waffling he makes excellent points about avoidable mistakes?

Because he shows that even semi-ignorant people, not just Unix l33t people, suffer when people like Redhat, GNOME and Xorg break traditionally working things in the same of being more beginner-friendly?

[klange]

Almost all of the statements he made are neither rational nor valid. A number of programs on his application list are wrongly noted (ie, Paint.NET is marked as freeware, when it is very much open-source)

He also called "me" and "you" retarded, for which I can take legal action.

[Giant Speck]

He also called "me" and "you" retarded, for which I can take legal action.

Well, you do that, and I'll grab the :popcorn:.

[smoker]

why do people who give up on linux and go back to windows feel the need to tell everyone about it, and then justify themselves with 'explaining' all the faults of linux?

bye, bye, won't miss ya!

[Giant Speck]

why do people who give up on linux and go back to windows feel the need to tell everyone about it, and then justify themselves with 'explaining' all the faults of linux?

Because the same thing happens when people give up on Windows and start using Linux? They also feel the need to tell everyone about it, and then justify themselves with "explaining" all the faults of Windows.

And:

bye, bye, won't miss ya! doesn't sound like it's coming from a supposedly friendly user community, does it?

[sges]

Python has been backward-compatible for the entire 2.xx series. Where'd you get your info from?

Sorry Every Major Version. 3.0 breaks backward compatibility.

[Dixon Bainbridge]

One day, people will just get on with using what works best for them and being productive, and spend less time banging on about why what works best for them is better than anything else.

I don't give two craps about what OS someone uses. Who the hell actually cares about that? Why would anyone write a blog about that? "Boo-hoo, I dont like linux, I'm going back to Windows..." WTF? What next, "Boo-hoo I don't like cornflakes I'm going back to muesli...?"

Can someone invent a nerd bomb?

[dannytatom]

doesn't sound like it's coming from a supposedly friendly user community, does it?

Thanks for not being a sheep, Giant Speck.

[Giant Speck]

Thanks for not being a sheep, Giant Speck.

I can't tell if that's a compliment or sarcasm... :(

[SomeGuyDude]

I noticed he bitched about the 6-month release cycle, the megafreeze cycle, and the rolling-release cycle. As soon as I noticed that, I discarded the entirety of the article.

[Cope57]

He has his own right to be a troll, please stop feeding the troll...

[dannytatom]

I can't tell if that's a compliment or sarcasm... :(

Hah, it's a compliment. Every reply I've seen of yours (in this thread and others) is unbiased and educated. Not just "EVERYONE HATES MICRO$OFT I HATE MICRO$OFT," and all that jazz. You even say things like "What's Micro$oft," which make me lol 'cause noone answers you. :(

Totally not stalking you, though.

[MikeTheC]

bye, bye, won't miss ya!

doesn't sound like it's coming from a supposedly friendly user community, does it?

Guess it doesn't matter since wasn't satisfied here to begin with. :-k

[cardinals_fan]

Faulty arguments, poor reasoning, and atrocious grammar. Where, exactly, are the "valid points" that some posters have claimed that he has made? I am not asking this as a "Linux fanboy";I do think that there are legitimate criticisms to be made regarding both Linux and the Ubuntu distribution, I just don't think that he made any.
Here's one:

Recently, X.Org adopted the Windows-like philosophy of an “automatic detection”, leaving xorg.conf absolutely uninformative (http://beranger.org/index.php?page=diary&2008/03/18/07/35/55-the-value-of-a-meaningful-xorg-c), and also it seems to have started to ignore some of the settings specified there. This is not Unix-like anymore, this is doomsday.

[klange]

Here's one:
That's almost entirely false. The only settings that are ignored are mice and keyboards that use old, unsupported drivers. Dropping extra, deprecated baggage is very Unix-like.

[cardinals_fan]

That's almost entirely false. The only settings that are ignored are mice and keyboards that use old, unsupported drivers. Dropping extra, deprecated baggage is very Unix-like.
So that was all wrong? He says
Section "Device"
Identifier "Configured Video Device"
EndSection
which is certainly more than a mouse or keyboard.

Some links backing him up:

http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=760401
http://grumpymole.blogspot.com/2008/01/dude-wheres-my-xorg.html
http://www.debianhelp.org/node/14017
http://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=60064

I have to say that I find that behaviour [Xorg's, not yours ;)] absolutely infuriating.

[Cracauer]

That's almost entirely false. The only settings that are ignored are mice and keyboards that use old, unsupported drivers. Dropping extra, deprecated baggage is very Unix-like.

Not true.

For example, Xorg-7.3 will always run your 1400x1050 laptop display in 1400x1050, no matter how hard you delete that resolution it from Xorg.conf. That is exactly why that blogger has a point.

It might not concern many, and most people want to run their 1400x1050 screen at 1400x1050. Fine.

But in my case it really blew, because I wanted a second X11 server. As in, at the same time, and then XF9/F10 between them. The second one should have the native resolution of a conference room beamer I was trying to use. No go. And this was not the case in Xorg-7.2.

They also break the keyboard when you don't use the XKB extension, but the extension never worked right for all cases. People like me didn't bother to report too much since we just turned XKB off. Now the official policy is you have to use the extension and who cares it's broken?

Xorg-7.3 is without doubt in the category of breaking previously working things in the same of being more beginner-friendly.

[klange]

Not true.

For example, Xorg-7.3 will always run your 1400x1050 laptop display in 1400x1050, no matter how hard you delete that resolution it from Xorg.conf. That is exactly why that blogger has a point.

It might not concern many, and most people want to run their 1400x1050 screen at 1400x1050. Fine.
I'll have you know my laptop is running at 1024x768 and it's a 1280x800 display...

[daynah]

This particular paragraph struck me...

"Yes, Microsoft is a bunch of thieves. They don't like to support XP anymore, so they push people into Vista. Sure thing, there are morons here too (in the 90% percent of the world population), people who don't understand why would anyone want to use XP instead of Vista, but they're just regular people — with Linux you have distro makers who fail to understand why people would need a system that actually works and keeps working!"

I'm a regular person and though I've been using Ubuntu since Breezy, I don't understand most of what he said. It seemed to be talking a lot about development stuff.

But Ubuntu has always just worked and has always kept working for me. And Windows? Didn't. I have Vista dual booted for my iphone and every time I get on it it gives me troubles.

My roommate (not just a "regular person" but actually a complete idiot) had troubles with windows and asked me to install Ubuntu. I did and she hasn't had any problems or even questions. This girl also asked me "Where do I put the chicken?" She didn't know if it went in the fridge or the pantry. But she hasn't a problem with Ubuntu yet.

So, no, at least with Hardy Heron, I don't think anyone can argue that Ubuntu isn't idiot proof. I've tested it on a true idiot, and it's ready.

[Cracauer]

I'll have you know my laptop is running at 1024x768 and it's a 1280x800 display...

What driver are you using?

It's no problem if the driver can't detect the display, e.g. the VESA driver.

[notwen]

Plenty of valid complaints listed and if those are enough to discourage him from using Linux, then it's completely his choice to do so.



The irrational “we must release every 6 months” mantra of the majority of non-enterprise distros. This way, most bugs never get fixed, while new bugs are constantly introduced.

Completely agree w/this here. Long time Debian user and while I use Ubuntu on my laptops, I tend to always remain a release or two behind just to make sure the majority of issues that would have affected me have surfaced and hopefully have a solution. In the past I enjoyed constantly tinkering w/ my Linux installs and critiquing them, but nowadays I'm too busy w/other aspects of life to be concerned w/ whether or not my pc works as I need it.



The idiotic “we must release every 6 months” idea of the GNOME project. They have unfixed bugs in Gedit for years (that's kinda Notepad, right?), yet they focus on the constant change of everything that works.

Same as above, what's the rush? Projects always seem to be rushing out new releases and in doing so they tend to alter/change/ruin the things that were working perfectly fine, although some new features are a very welcome thing, but new features shouldn't always ruin previous features/options.



One of the major needs for a modern desktop, that is hibernation, is not of major interest for the Linux kernel developers, no matter Windows had this for a very long time. As a consequence, hibernation (suspend-to-disk) and sleep (suspend-to-RAM) is a constant hack under Linux, and once you got it working, you'll never know whether the next kernel or the next distro release will break it or not (most likely, it will break it again).

Never had a machine(Out of 6) that I've ran Linux(Mandrake, Debian, Ubuntu or CentOS) on to have both fully functioning hibernate/suspend options. I've troubleshooted this issue for more days of my life than I care to admit. I'm far from the Linux expert, but I consider myself to be somewhat knowledgeable and this area of Linux in particular has always been a particular eyesore of mine.



While the “knights of the open source” constantly complain of the lack of penetration of Linux on the corporate desktop (let's ignore the other trend, where junkies believe that everybody is secretly using Ubuntu), the #1 Linux company, Red Hat Inc., officially asserts that they don't believe in Linux on the desktop as a viable business model. So why would I believe in something that even Red Hat is despising?!

Being a rebel among a Windows world, no one can deny the effect Red Hat has had on getting Linux known in the business market and if they don't yet see a desktop option as feasible, then I would agree it's not quite ready for the masses.


All that being said, I don't see myself going anywhere anytime soon. I'll continue using Linux as my main OS and hope to see the day when most if not all of these issues has been addressed and hopefully resolved. It always depends on the end user's choice and if he chose a OS other than Linux, then I wish him nothing but the best. =]

[crl0901]

I don't understand why it's got to be only one way or the other? Ever OS has it's own strengths and weaknesses. They're tools for you to use, why not use multiple OSs according to what you need to do? Hard drives are so cheap these days, dual-booting is a viable and useful option.

[aysiu]

I think those are all good reasons.

None of them deter me from sticking with Linux, though, as I could write "defecting from Windows as a rational act" and "defecting from Mac as a rational act," too.

Of course, if I wrote either of those, I'd be called a "Linux fanboy."

[dannytatom]

Of course, if I wrote either of those, I'd be called a "Linux fanboy."

To be fair, I don't think he's getting the nicest response from the majority of people in this thread.

[aysiu]

To be fair, I don't think he's getting the nicest response from the majority of people in this thread.
I haven't seen any accusations of "Windows fanboy" in here. Disagreeing is one thing. Namecalling is another thing altogether.

I would love to see a few more polite responses here. Sure.

[dannytatom]

I haven't seen any accusations of "Windows fanboy" in here. Disagreeing is one thing. Namecalling is another thing altogether.

I would love to see a few more polite responses here. Sure.

Well nobody said "Windows fanboy," but there were a few name callings goin' around:


Oh, please, no...

This guy is an idiot. Do not waste your time and energy talking about him.


i think hes the emo grow up

he obviously does not know how to operate a computer it takes the meaning operating system to a new level of depression what an idiot


sounds like hes an idiot...

he does not seem to get or care about what OSS truly is. its always about change. new things. new ways. sometimes you have to redo things.

but that is the main point of no?

:)


Wow. Like seriously. Why are we still discussing this looser? Let's bury this thread and be done with it. 500,000,000 million posts about some dude who thinks Windows is better than Linux, and proprietary closed-source is better than GPL'd open-source is enough, don't you think?

Not that I care on way or the other about the above quotes, I was just pointing out that there is some name callin' goin' on, and I think idiot is more of an insult than <product> fanboy.

[aysiu]

Hm. Good point.

[Changturkey]

Why does he hate KDE 4 so much?

[aaaantoine]

Why does he hate KDE 4 so much?

Maybe he's only tried 4.0.