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Thread: Will Canonical change icons in 8.10?

  1. #31
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    Re: Will Canonical change icons in 8.10?

    Quote Originally Posted by acelin View Post
    Indeed it does. I guarantee if Linux looked as seamless and beautiful as OS X by default, more people would use it.
    I have to disagree too. Observing the current state of OS market share, and following your logic, it may be concluded that Windows XP is the most beautiful looking OS on earth. Perhaps, to support your claim, you can try explaining why OSX has around 8% of the market share.

    Quote Originally Posted by tel93 View Post
    When I saw Ubuntu's default I saw an intelligently designed thing of beauty that looked a lot less childish than OS X.
    +1. It also was something refreshingly different from Windows.
    Last edited by mikewhatever; August 2nd, 2008 at 02:26 PM.

  2. #32
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    Re: Will Canonical change icons in 8.10?

    No, in fact, I think most people have to buy Windows because they have to buy it. None of the OSes has such a vast selection of software and games written for it. I think there are two different reasons why people buy Macs and Windows: For Macs it is beauty, for Windows it's software. Windows is a huge architectural failure IMHO, but man, it has software...

    Yet I really do not know what 'beauty' is in terms of software. Yes, MacOSX launchpad (or how do they call it?) looks cool, but Windows/Linux taskbar is far more functional IMHO.

  3. #33
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    Re: Will Canonical change icons in 8.10?

    Quote Originally Posted by mikewhatever View Post
    Perhaps, to support your claim, you can try explaining why OSX has around 8% of the market share.
    Because Macs are more expensive?
    Because Windows has been a mainstream OS for a lot longer?
    Because Apple's target audience is different (and a lot smaller) than Microsoft's?

    I think the real question here is if OSX would have anywhere near that 8% if it wasnt designed so well.

    Quote Originally Posted by acelin View Post
    Indeed it does. I guarantee if Linux looked as seamless and beautiful as OS X by default, more people would use it.
    Very possible. If not use it more, they'd certainly enjoy it more. I for one feel absolutely no desire to play designer in my spare time, looking for themes and icon sets and what not.

    It looks alright out of the box. I'd still use it if it looked **** but I'd be more satisfied if it looked more polished by default.

  4. #34
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    Re: Will Canonical change icons in 8.10?

    Quote Originally Posted by kirsis View Post
    It looks alright out of the box. I'd still use it if it looked **** but I'd be more satisfied if it looked more polished by default.
    That's what I'm saying! Ubuntu made a great number of great steps in these 4 years. Ubuntu is the face of Linux now, so it's probably high time to make it's face more attractive (to the end users)?! Ubuntu is about WOW! to end users if you make a few mouse clicks in compizconfig-settings-manager with Compiz Fusion turned on, but Ubuntu's attractiveness is still not out of the box.

  5. #35
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    Re: Will Canonical change icons in 8.10?

    I have to say.. Ubuntu can look amazing and awesome... with some tinkering. If Canonical wants Ubuntu only to appeal to tinkerers, not end-users.. It's fine the way it is. Personally, I think my Ubuntu looks awesome (also, different from yesterday...), but I don't think it did out of the box. I think it looked old, ugly, and I was almost dissuaded. I thought, well.. I don't want to look at this blocky, old OS every time I turn on my computer. Of course, later, I found how amazing it is... but the first time I booted up, it just wasn't fun to look at, and I couldn't do much else..
    I don't know what direction Canonical wants to head with Ubuntu, but if it's a broader base of users, make it look nice, put a handy set of icons on the desktop for applications newbies are likely to use.. And show some skin. I don't know many people I would expect to figure this out easily. So figure it out for them and the comfort-lovers will thank you.

    EDIT: "figure it out for them" makes me think of Microsoft and its inflexible "daddy knows best" approach. All I'm saying is, give them something nice to start out with.
    Last edited by Lexicon101; August 5th, 2008 at 10:33 AM. Reason: To better get across the meaning.

  6. #36
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    Re: Will Canonical change icons in 8.10?

    Before answering some of the above posts, I'd like to stress that the beauty of the default theme is subjective. There is no way Canonical can satisfy every single user, and imo, there is no point trying. They've done great job at looking distinctly different, thus drawing attention and curiosity. Does it matter if some think Ubuntu is ugly? I think not. Please see my replies as opinion exchange, not as counter arguments.

    Quote Originally Posted by PryGuy View Post
    No, in fact, I think most people have to buy Windows because they have to buy it. None of the OSes has such a vast selection of software and games written for it. I think there are two different reasons why people buy Macs and Windows: For Macs it is beauty, for Windows it's software. Windows is a huge architectural failure IMHO, but man, it has software...
    Don't you think this is rather shallow? What about security or software/hardware integration? I think people buy PC with Windows because they don't think about an OS when doing it. You get a computer, it works, (what's an OS?), who cares about the default theme.


    Quote Originally Posted by kirsis View Post
    Because Macs are more expensive?
    Because Windows has been a mainstream OS for a lot longer?
    Because Apple's target audience is different (and a lot smaller) than Microsoft's?
    Doesn't it imply that looks are not so important after all? I think users want functionalities first and design and appearance are secondary as long as products are not particularly repulsive. Be as it may, it's obvious that Ubuntu's themes did not prevent it from becoming the most popular linux distro.


    Quote Originally Posted by Lexicon101 View Post
    I don't know what direction Canonical wants to head with Ubuntu, but if it's a broader base of users, make it look nice, put a handy set of icons on the desktop for applications newbies are likely to use..
    God forbid! This was always one of the first things I removed from Windows desktop. I think Ubuntu is almost as easy to use as it gets, provided it runs on supported hardware, and a user is open to learning something different. The WOW factor would only interfere and distract, rather then help.

  7. #37
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    Re: Will Canonical change icons in 8.10?

    2 major contributors to Apples (and Microsofts) success over Ubuntus :

    1. They can advertise.If Ubuntu could put the same kind of dollar into making fancy stands at every Tech-shop as Apple can and advertise in fancy lifestyle magazines, then...

    2. Joe Smoes generally think "Quality costs money, better quality, then I have to pay more. *fallacy being comitted* Reversely that must mean that I should avoid GPL-stuff 'cos it's free*.

    Yeah, money and ignorance, those are the sinners. I, like a little kid throwing a tantrum, think it's absurdly unfair that those two influences dominate the marketplace in a world which should be based squarely on products competing on their individual merits, and not an opaque, ****-yellow cloud of irrelevance and misdirection which does nothing else than hinder technological progress.

    I can't blame Apple for creating a brand of their own with their particular design-line (I for one can't stand it, I think it's ugly), but there are limits to how much one can contribute to design, especially when you pit your product against something as customizable as Linux.

  8. #38
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    Re: Will Canonical change icons in 8.10?

    Quote Originally Posted by mikewhatever View Post
    The WOW factor would only interfere and distract, rather then help.
    I agree. The WOW factor is a shallow attraction. That's why I dislike spinning cubes and such.

    However, you should not equate an elegant, well designed look with a look that's designed to WOW people. Add a few rounded corners here and there, make some color gradients more subtle, have a well designed UI font, have an attractive color palette, be consistent (very important) from app to app... that's the sort of thing that makes a system pleasant and attractive to me.

    Quote Originally Posted by mikewhatever View Post
    Doesn't it imply that looks are not so important after all? I think users want functionalities first and design and appearance are secondary as long as products are not particularly repulsive. Be as it may, it's obvious that Ubuntu's themes did not prevent it from becoming the most popular linux distro.
    No, it does not imply that looks are not important. How big would their market share be without their distinctive appearance? They're more expensive than ordinary computers with other OSes. They get the job done but they don't get the job done any better than computers with other OSes (and sometimes they don't get the job done at all, due to a smaller number of available applications. Though that's probably a fringe scenario). Yet they still see their market share increasing and churn out super expensive laptops without basic features people take for granted (see Macbook Air).

    And don't forget that among certain crowds, it's a status/style symbol. Ever noticed how many students use Apple computers? Wouldn't a student be better off getting a cheaper Linux/Windows laptop if all they cared for was getting things done? Students need all the money they can get for booze, after all

    The 'Macs are stylish' message was even a big part in their Macs vs PC ads.

    Their UI look + design is definitely a big factor in their success.

    I think that for an OS to be successful, it needs a mixture of functionality and appearance. When a certain level of functionality is reached, the look and feel of the system becomes more important. If for no other reason, then because people have more time to pay attention to it, as they're not busy figuring how to get stuff done.

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