View Poll Results: What does "ready for the desktop" mean to you?

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  • Any person can install it on any computer without any problems

    1,609 34.95%
  • Anyone can use it once it's already been installed and configured

    2,414 52.43%
  • Every commercial application works on it

    453 9.84%
  • Nothing--it's a nonsensical term

    704 15.29%
  • It automatically detects most hardware without the need to hunt down drivers

    2,236 48.57%
  • It comes preinstalled on computers so novice users don't have to install it

    889 19.31%
  • It's suitable to the needs of most beginner users but not necessarily to most intermediate ones

    568 12.34%
  • Windows and nothing else... not even Mac OS X

    46 1.00%
  • Works on my desktop

    1,199 26.04%
  • Other (please explain)

    166 3.61%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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Thread: Linux Desktop Readiness Thread

  1. #7281
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    Re: In Five Years' Time

    Quote Originally Posted by moffatt666 View Post
    Many a true word you write there, aysiu. Mac OS is just about the pinnacle of desktop readiness as it has to come preconfigured for the target hardware.
    Ah, but Mr. Jobs and crew don't have to worry, as they can custom-compile drivers for all their hardware and stick that on every production machine, since they're all white, semi-translucent clones of each other....With Linux and Windows that is not so.
    Gandhi once said: "We must be the change we wish to see in the world."
    So you want a separate /home partition?|Ubuntu World Map|Linux IS NOT Windows

  2. #7282

    Re: The Linux Desktop Readiness Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by aysiu View Post
    And non-English languages will be "ready for the desktop" when 40-year-old American linguistic experts who've never spoken them before can pick them up more easily than a five-year-old can.

    Yes, the stipulation is completely ridiculous.
    Um, I'm a native Spanish-speaker person... I could translate Linux stuff to Spanish, I just don't know how to XD... (and yes, pure, neutral Spanish, not with modisms or lingos, I hate those when it comes to translations ¬¬).

    On topic though, Ubuntu is greatly advanced and it could easily be the best Linux distro around, both for novice and advanced users ...but it lacks good, commercial-quality games (there are only a few GOOD ones though, and I've been able to get Lineage II C4, Q3A/Q4, WoW and the NFS series to run, but that's not everything if you get what I mean...) and that's a big obstacle that makes it hard for the desktop user.

    For example... a friend of mine who doesn't like to get complicated with stuff has been going on and off the Linux realm every now and then. Recently though, with my help and his own research he's been able to get Ubuntu running nice 'n dandy, with Beryl and all (he even released his first Beryl video on youtube... his name's fedddeh or something like that ) but I bet it has costed him lots to learn.

    Speaking in MSN today at work, he told me he wasn't in Linux and I asked him why. He told me that "there was nothing else to do"... and he's mostly right. For someone who's a gamer and wants to get off the Windows realm, gaming is something that matters. There are hundreds of gamers out there using Windows for various reasons, and I'm sure a big percent of them is because of gaming.

    When Linux (and not Ubuntu) gets more support for recent games (sorry, running Diablo II or Q3A isn't the hype now) or cooler native games, more people will migrate to Linux.

    "What will this bring?" you say, "the thing isn't about how much people is into Linux, but if Linux is ready for the desktop or if it isn't".

    Well, I'll tell you something: The more people who get into Linux, the more future programmers there will be (hopefully)... or at least, more people getting into the roots of Linux and contributing with their grain of sand. Some people get really interested and motivated when they see new stuff and want to try it out, customize and experiment with it - the fruits and results of that experimentation will help others, who in order will help others, and so on, like a chain.

    If there's a common interest between a big group of people, then a goal can be archieved. I'm living that right now with my i-team online game project for Linux, and if it can happen with a simple game, it can happen with a bigger project.

    Linux is all about choices right? then let's give users more things to choose. Some might don't like the way Nautilus looks - then modify and submit your modifications! - others might prefer a skinnable WinAmp clone with modern skins - then look how can you contribute to make that a reality! - others might prefer a different GUI lookalike - then learn how to contribute to a WM/DE project or make your own one!... the more choices the new user has, the more stuff the user can combine to feel "at home" in Linux.

    The thing is, make the person stay in Linux. Give them enough choices, give them stuff they're used to use. With a mentality like "Linux/Ubuntu isn't like Windows nor it's gonna be like it" you're scaring most Windows users off ... of course, they can choose if they want to stay with Windows or not, it's not a war about who gets more users to their OS, but if the person can stay in Linux and handle itself like it handles in Windows, then that will help it to get curious with time and explore different things...

    Only those who have read my post novel (sorry, lol!) can understand what I mean, if they're clever enough .
    Last edited by DARKGuy; May 17th, 2007 at 03:53 AM.

  3. #7283
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    Ubuntu 7.10 Gutsy Gibbon

    Re: The Linux Desktop Readiness Thread

    Desktop ready. Hmmm. Too many variations on the idea of what that means, so I'll just chime in with my 2 cents.

    I am a former windows user, started with 3.xx and worked up to XP pro. Knew I'd not be doing the Vista thing, but that was after I even installed Ubuntu.

    I was always pretty technically proficient enough to handle problems which came along with the territory of using Win, and I also have experience building my own PC's, so obviously, I'm not afraid to get a bit dirty. For a person like ME, yes it's ready for the desktop.

    However, I can't help but think about all of the less than technical minded individuals who would bite their nails off in terror at some of the things they might have to get into w/Linux.

    For example, right now, I'm simply trying to figure out how to install a GAME. A lot of people migrating to Linux will want to at least know that they have the possibility of gaming. So I'm having this problem installing Actioncube, even WITH the .deb files, as it's giving me an error saying "dependencies not satisfiable" I have no idea of what that means, but I'm trying to figure it out.

    I rebuilt my source.list updated synaptic, and still, nothing. Which of course brings me to... dependency hell. I've had decent luck in this area so far, but to be honest, dependencies COULD be handled better, and if the Ubuntu devs wanted to do something worth while, I think it should be a dedication to get a lot more games into the repo's. As it stands, it's not wholly difficult to get certain things up and running if you have someone give you copy and paste stuff, but in a lot of cases, it's not even that simple.

    A lot of times some code just doesn't work for some reason, and then you have a post in which there are 4 people trying to help, and then what you get is a mess of code that starts looking like a bundle of twine, and I guarantee that the "average" Windows user, will NOT be able to handle that.

    While it's true that there's a learning curve for everything, especially something like a new OS, there are certainly things which COULD be made more easy to install, or better yet... a lot more automated. After all, this is Linux, where it would make sense to have everything centralized, unlike in Windows, where you have TONS of third party vendors pushing software which then requires different patches, codec packs or service packs or plain ol MS authentication etc...

    On the other hand, if I handed my father a new PC loaded w/Ubuntu and his primary point of using the machine was to do word processing, e mailing, browsing the web, listen to music, watch movies or even chatting with family on an IM client, then yes, I'd say it's ready. He would hardly ever have to do anything but auto update, and otherwise not have to worry about virus', spyware etc.. and just work.

  4. #7284
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    Hidden!

    Re: The Linux Desktop Readiness Thread

    Run
    Code:
    sudo dpkg -i <location of file>
    and it will say you have missing dependencies
    then run
    Code:
    sudo apt-get -f install
    should work

  5. #7285
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    Re: thought this was easy

    Quote Originally Posted by eentonig View Post
    To start: Forget "Like in windows"

    If you want "Like in windows", stay in windows. Ubuntu and Linux in general is NOT like windows. And it will never be like that.

    Concerning your issue, just try the 'restricted drivers' and see what happens. It's a pop-up to inform you it might not work, but it doesn't garantuee that it wont work.

    Allthough I strongly recommend you to improve your english skills if you want to install things like this under linux. Most support you'll need is available, but in english.
    That is arrogant, and you are not nice.

    If you are a sampling of ubuntu, I think ubuntu is in big trouble.

    bye
    smaker

  6. #7286
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    Re: thought this was easy

    Quote Originally Posted by Soybean View Post
    The warning isn't saying that there's anything wrong with the driver, it's just letting you know that, unlike everything else in Ubuntu, that driver isn't open source. None of your Windows drivers are open source, so if you're happy with Windows, there's no reason to worry about this warning. Microsoft doesn't provide support for your NVidia drivers any more than Ubuntu does.

    Also, Mandriva would use the same driver. If there's no warning message there, it just means they're not telling you about it.
    I dont get the error message in either windows or mandriva..does this mean neither of them care about me as much as ubuntu ?

    bye
    smaker

  7. #7287
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    Re: thought this was easy

    Quote Originally Posted by srt4play View Post
    It is ironic that you "want support you can trust like windows installer."

    It wasn't meant to be helpful, I already tried that. At this point in the thread I was trying to point out the insanity of your eagerness to trust Windows and unwillingness to trust Ubuntu, which is quite backwards from reality.
    That might be your reality ( not meant to be helpful) , but its not the reality of millions of others 'windows' users for whom their giant monopoly maintains a ( and rightfullly so based on the arrogance and mean spiritedness I see here ) 98% marketshare. The ONLY thing linux has going for it is that its basically free; its not because its more stable. The only app I"ve had crash lately in windows, is Firefox..imagine that, a OSS application. Make sure nvidia knows about that so they can make sure to release better drivers in the future . I think you might just have something to use against them now hmmmm .

    No sir, what I find backwards is the willingess of the NIX community to be so overwhelmingly arrogant whilst at the same time ( some of you anyway) thinking they may get larger numbers of useers trying it, and then again all while demanding better vendor suppport , - and demanding that companies 'open source' their drivers while thinking they operate from a position of power. They hold a VERY tiny % marketshare atm. That is some awesome denial .

    I think that atm NIX Is nothing more than a fart on the horizon and mostly because of attitude. It spreads over the culture, stinking and laying around like a blanket of thick fog carrying alot of bad mojo,- and you whine about bad support..well hello !

    That is what I think of when I see your mean comments,- coupled with the fact that no one has the guts to call you on them.

    Wow, go linux

    That apperance is what some people will see, so it is no wonder that linux is not very successful yet, leaping out at the public with such huge market share numbers.

    The fact that no one seems to be even the slightest bit annoyed or embarrased by this treatment of me by their famed collleagues, is immensely indicative of the fact that many of the hordes of linux are just GAAS.

    I have given my opinion and Im sure I will be attacked because thats just what teh linux machine does ,- so I see no reaon to behave like the famed fart on the wind that I try desperately not to emulate so I wont stick around much.

    Linux deserves MUCH better, because it offers hope to those wanting more security, stability ( maybe not firefox? ) , openness and affordability ( you may not be poor, but that does not change the reality that for 'some' people linux IS a alterative to the poor house ).


    bye 4 now.
    smaker
    Last edited by smaker; May 18th, 2007 at 04:29 PM.

  8. #7288
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    Re: thought this was easy

    Wow for someone that's not really good at English from looks of the first few posts, you sure seem more articulated in your last post.

  9. #7289
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    Re: thought this was easy

    Quote Originally Posted by smaker View Post
    That might be your reality ( not meant to be helpful) , but its not the reality of millions of others 'windows' users for whom their giant monopoly maintains a ( and rightfullly so based on the arrogance and mean spiritedness I see here ) 98% marketshare. The ONLY thing linux has going for it is that its basically free; its not because its more stable. The only app I"ve had crash lately in windows, is Firefox..imagine that, a OSS application. Make sure nvidia knows about that so they can make sure to release better drivers in the future . I think you might just have something to use against them now hmmmm .

    No sir, what I find backwards is the willingess of the NIX community to be so overwhelmingly arrogant whilst at the same time ( some of you anyway) thinking they may get larger numbers of useers trying it, and then again all while demanding better vendor suppport , - and demanding that companies 'open source' their drivers while thinking they operate from a position of power. They hold a VERY tiny % marketshare atm. That is some awesome denial .

    I think that atm NIX Is nothing more than a fart on the horizon and mostly because of attitude. It spreads over the culture, stinking and laying around like a blanket of thick fog carrying alot of bad mojo,- and you whine about bad support..well hello !

    That is what I think of when I see your mean comments,- coupled with the fact that no one has the guts to call you on them.

    Wow, go linux

    That apperance is what some people will see, so it is no wonder that linux is not very successful yet, leaping out at the public with such huge market share numbers.

    The fact that no one seems to be even the slightest bit annoyed or embarrased by this treatment of me by their famed collleagues, is immensely indicative of the fact that many of the hordes of linux are just GAAS.

    I have given my opinion and Im sure I will be attacked because thats just what teh linux machine does ,- so I see no reaon to behave like the famed fart on the wind that I try desperately not to emulate so I wont stick around much.

    Linux deserves MUCH better, because it offers hope to those wanting more security, stability ( maybe not firefox? ) , openness and affordability ( you may not be poor, but that does not change the reality that for 'some' people linux IS a alterative to the poor house ).


    bye 4 now.
    smaker
    You want it to be more like windows? We could drop the warning message but it still wouldn't make the driver open source. That is what mandriva did, they didn't implement the warning. Things will always be different in linux. That is a good thing, if people wanted to switch to something like windows, then they should use windows.

    People need a reason to switch. If your switching just to switch or because you heard about how much better linux was, then I suggest you return to windows. Not because I don't want you here, but because you will have a better user experience.
    *Don't PM me directly for support, open a new thread
    *Looking for a MythTV quick start guide?

  10. #7290
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    Re: thought this was easy

    Quote Originally Posted by smaker View Post
    That is arrogant, and you are not nice.

    If you are a sampling of ubuntu, I think ubuntu is in big trouble.

    bye
    smaker
    Exactly what part didn't you find nice? As my post wasn't put to bring him down.
    Maybe my comments were a bit to cryptic.
    Originally Posted by eentonig View Post
    To start: Forget "Like in windows"
    Linux isn't windows. And if you want to use linux, all the knowledge you gathered using windows is practically useless. So if you keep comparing it to what you know in Windows, it's just a way to get frustrated.
    So this wasn't meant to pick on Windows. If someone wants to use windows, I support them with whatever question they have. Just as I'll do over here.

    If you want "Like in windows", stay in windows. Ubuntu and Linux in general is NOT like windows. And it will never be like that.
    Same as above. Don't use linux if you want it to be a free windows replacement. It is a free Windows replacement. But it's definitly not the same. Be prepared for that.
    Concerning your issue, just try the 'restricted drivers' and see what happens. It's a pop-up to inform you it might not work, but it doesn't garantuee that it wont work.

    This has been explained enough in the previous posts, I guess?

    Allthough I strongly recommend you to improve your english skills if you want to install things like this under linux. Most support you'll need is available, but in english.

    And this is the one that most likely fired you up. correct?
    I'm not a native english speaking guy myself (hence the obvious errors in my writing.). And using and installing linux doesn't necessarely require you to even speak it. Most distributions have tons off translations that allow regular users to work in almost any language they desire. But as soon as you start playing with what's under the hood, you'd better be able to fluently read and understand what the people write about in the support forums.
    And so far, I have only found decent, system wide, support on english forums. I'm dutch speaking myself, fluent in French and adequate to understand German. I know some good fora in those languages, but they never cover all my needs.

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