Mr. Tambourine Man

[IYY]

I am curious, fusia, what do you get from 'Rainy Day Woman # 12&35' ("everybody must get stoned")?

I'm not Fusia, but if I'll give my answer. I think this song is fairly obvious: it's saying how society (the government? the establishment?) finds a way to fsck you no matter what you do, where you are and who you are. Furthermore, Dylan states that while it may appear that this only happens to you, it really happens to every single person in this, and any other country.

And of course, the pun is that 'get stoned' also means to smoke Marijuana. This could be a simple joke, an implication that the way people are treated by the government is the same as being drugged (clouded judgement, hidden truth), or a suggestion that smoking Marijuana is a way to rebel against the establishment and see clearly.

Either way you look at it, the song revolves around a very clever pun.

[23meg]

And "for the people and made by the people" ...that counts for my home-made techno too...It's all so personal and impossible to discuss...

Techno is folk by that definition, with which I agree. Today's "urban folk" may very well be electronic music made on crappy computers in small bedrooms.

But folk music in the way it's usually thought of, as Dylan himself keeps saying, had a very different and important role in the non-mediated past: at a time when the mass media didn't exist, people got to learn about things that happened in far away places via songs. If a new bridge was built, a song was made about that, and it spread. If a hundred people died in an accident, the same. Music had a documentary role. Hard to believe? But it's real, and it was one of the functions of the music. It still is in many places. It can also still be seen in the work of artists such as Springsteen and Dylan, as well as other artists influenced mainly by the folk music of their lands.

There's a story I remember reading about this song: in a gathering where Bob Dylan and Donovan were both present, Donovan being a young, relatively unknown singer then, Donovan started singing Mr. Tambourine Man, allegedly not knowing Dylan was in the room. Someone asked Dylan "that's nice, is this a folk song?", and Dylan responded "no, not yet".

[Peepsalot]

Saying that techno is folk is really stretching it IMO. When I think of folk, I think a lot of it is about having a message or some form of storytelling. The majority of techno I have heard has no lyrics, which I makes it pretty hard to do such a thing.

Edit: Er, sorry I sort of replied without finishing reading your post. I think we are pretty much in agreeance.

[fuscia]

I meant to mean, observing and discerning communication skills and tendencies were a difference.

clearly, humans are far better at discenring verbal communication (unless animals truly have figured out that there just isn't that much to say). other than that, i think animals are better observers of communication than humans. in my experience, most humans are at their most observant when listening to themselves talk.

I am curious, fuscia, what do you get from 'Rainy Day Woman # 12&35' ("everybody must get stoned")?

nothing in particular. my suspicion is that he was just 'winging' it.

[rjwood]

I'm not Fusia, but if I'll give my answer. I think this song is fairly obvious: it's saying how society (the government? the establishment?) finds a way to fsck you no matter what you do, where you are and who you are. Furthermore, Dylan states that while it may appear that this only happens to you, it really happens to every single person in this, and any other country.

And of course, the pun is that 'get stoned' also means to smoke Marijuana. This could be a simple joke, an implication that the way people are treated by the government is the same as being drugged (clouded judgement, hidden truth), or a suggestion that smoking Marijuana is a way to rebel against the establishment and see clearly.

Either way you look at it, the song revolves around a very clever pun.

There is of course no correct or incorrect intrepretation to art. I realize my interpretations reveal more about me than about the artist or the art itself.

I can definatly appreciate your interpretation. It allows me to consider something new in the song. Thank you for that!

I get a bit of different image from this although similar to yours. The music suggests a party atmosphere and the idea of being stoned is there which gives many casual listeners the idea of drugs and getting high. I see the music as the abstract part of this piece. I see the lyrics as people stoning one another through insults or accusations, whether they be accurate or not. It's a stoning party rather than a party to get stoned as in high. People judging one another moralisticly is like a past time for far too many of us in american society. Throwing accusations about without being personnaly privy to the inside and out of a situation is common here. The media makes a nice living at it. The GOP uses it to get their canidates elected..... and so on.

[rjwood]

clearly, humans are far better at discenring verbal communication (unless animals truly have figured out that there just isn't that much to say). other than that, i think animals are better observers of communication than humans. in my experience, most humans are at their most observant when listening to themselves talk.

Clearly, from a phyco-analytical standpoint, I agree. However, in a casual sense, I'm not so sure. About humans that is.

Animals seem to me to be much more instinctive and therefore reactionary of things that move.