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Thread: novice, non-programmers, read before install

  1. #1
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    novice, non-programmers, read before install

    I just went thru a week of trying to figure out what went wrong with Ubuntu.
    first of all, before doing anything go here http://www.ubuntu.com/certification/desktop/
    if you don't see your computer on the list, forget ubuntu. (if you bought a toshiba with win8 and don't like win8 do a google search for "Classic Shell', that's a safe, compatible little program that turns ugly win8 into win7, easy.)
    of the hundreds of messages I've scoured thru to find some info and pointers, this is one of my favorites--
    http://answers.yahoo.com/question/in...8121540AAyaG0r
    it starts with, "I want to access to a wireless connection in a PC with linux (ubuntu 10.04). But I can't find any connection."
    Rickie answers with, "Weeks after weeks ppl keep asking this question. The answer is because you are using a free linux that mostly relies on opensource technology and insanely restrictive laws in the USA do not allow to integrate proprietary drivers in open source technology.
    Ubuntu is a cute little linux but a nightmare for ppl using wifi, forget about installing the drivers yourself unless you are a programmer".
    then Alessandro T gives a pointer to the Ubuntu Forums and some links for programmers like, https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Wi...er/Ndiswrapper
    good luck.

  2. #2
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    Re: novice, non-programmers, read before install

    Quote Originally Posted by marcretired View Post
    of the hundreds of messages I've scoured thru to find some info and pointers, this is one of my favorites--
    http://answers.yahoo.com/question/in...8121540AAyaG0r
    it starts with, "I want to access to a wireless connection in a PC with linux (ubuntu 10.04). But I can't find any connection."
    Rickie answers with, "Weeks after weeks ppl keep asking this question. The answer is because you are using a free linux that mostly relies on opensource technology and insanely restrictive laws in the USA do not allow to integrate proprietary drivers in open source technology.
    Ubuntu is a cute little linux but a nightmare for ppl using wifi, forget about installing the drivers yourself unless you are a programmer".
    then Alessandro T gives a pointer to the Ubuntu Forums and some links for programmers like, https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Wi...er/Ndiswrapper
    good luck.
    Ubuntu 10.04 is 3 years old, linux moves fast, the wireless on my laptop is supported out of the box. Have you tried Ubuntu 13.04?
    // Blog

  3. #3
    prodigy_ is offline May the Ubuntu Be With You!
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    Re: novice, non-programmers, read before install

    Quote Originally Posted by marcretired View Post
    Rickie answers with, "Weeks after weeks ppl keep asking this question. The answer is because you are using a free linux that mostly relies on opensource technology and insanely restrictive laws in the USA do not allow to integrate proprietary drivers in open source technology.
    Ubuntu is a cute little linux but a nightmare for ppl using wifi, forget about installing the drivers yourself unless you are a programmer".
    Now the only question is who the hell is Rickie and why does he talk about something he doesn't have a clue about? :)

    Proprietary drivers aren't included in Linux kernel because Linux tries its best to be open source. There's no law that would prohibit kernel maintainers to integrate binary blobs but any such blob is essentially a "black box" - you never know what exactly it does and what bugs it could introduce.

    And while getting Wi-Fi to work can take some effort sometimes, I have 3 different laptops running Linux and on all of them Wi-Fi worked out of the box. It mostly depends on Wi-Fi brand. Intel works like a charm, for Atheros and Broadcom you often need to edit some config files. Less known brands may not have Linux drivers at all.
    Last edited by prodigy_; August 11th, 2013 at 01:14 AM.

  4. #4
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    Re: novice, non-programmers, read before install

    I work with wireless issues and in most cases the wireless will work with a little tweak if not out of the box.

    You are talking about Rickie's comments made about 10.04, and we are at 13.04 and while it is not perfect it has come a long way.

    If you ask for help in the networking section there is usually someone there that can help get your wireless working.

    How much easier could it be then to copy and paste commands that someone asks you to into the terminal to get your wireless working?

    You do not even have to understand them or rewrite them.

    Also when I started I was a windows user and had never seen linux, I am not a programmer that is way over my head but programming is not needed to get wireless working.
    Last edited by Wild Man; August 11th, 2013 at 01:24 AM.

  5. #5
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    Re: novice, non-programmers, read before install

    marcretired, there is obviously something you do not understand about Linux of any flavor vs. Windows. With Windows you are fairly well limited to doing what Microsoft, i.e. Bill Gates, wants you to do in the way they want you to do it. Linux, on the other hand intends you for the most part to do things the way you want to. With that power comes a certain amount of complexity and responsibility. The large, large majority of problems I have heard about installing Linux or Ubuntu arise from operator error or just simply not reading the instructions. To someone totally new and not particularly conversant with computers this may seem overwhelming, but most find it really isn't. The are many people here and elsewhere willing to help if you know how to pose a question. People are even willing to help you learn how to pose a question so others can help you. But, if you are afraid of the complexity and are not willing to take the responsibility for the way things work, please do not blame Linux or Ubuntu. That is generally not where the fault lies. In that case, and you are certainly not alone, you will be much happier in the more limited and confining world of Windows.

  6. #6
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    Re: novice, non-programmers, read before install

    Quote Originally Posted by marcretired View Post

    "forget about installing the drivers yourself unless you are a programmer".
    As myself a programmer, i can say this is totally untrue.

    When it comes to ubuntu, im about as amateur as it gets, the workings of an OS have very little to do with the programming unless you do it yourself, or put some research into. The programming does all the work in the background, thats what its there to do, you don't see it and barely touch it, what you do is use the tools that the people who did program ubuntu have made.

    The people who know how to use these tools are the valuable ones when it comes to resolving problems with wifi, or resolving anything else in ubuntu and they are a damn sight better at it then i am.
    Boab1993

  7. #7
    prodigy_ is offline May the Ubuntu Be With You!
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    Re: novice, non-programmers, read before install

    Quote Originally Posted by agillator View Post
    With Windows you are fairly well limited to doing what Microsoft, i.e. Bill Gates, wants you to do in the way they want you to do it.
    You're taking it a bit too far. Windows is a general purpose OS, pretty much like common Linux distros. It's very hard to find a typical end user task that no Windows application could possibly perform. Advanced scripting is also possible, especially now with VBScript and PowerShell.

    Windows does have limitations. It's closed source, so you cannot easily hack kernel or system libraries. It doesn't have a realtime kernel. It's not suitable (except Windows Server) for supercomputers or computer clusters in general. But those are special and rare cases. I've been using Windows for 20 years and the only serious obstacle I can recall is HDD SMART monitoring being blocked by drivers in fakeRAIDs.

  8. #8
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    Re: novice, non-programmers, read before install

    hehehehehehe, starting to look like a union meeting up in here.
    I just went thru an unpleasant experience and thought I'd leave a message for other computer illiterates to read and think about before venturing into ubuntu land. the takeaway was, "first of all, before doing anything go here http://www.ubuntu.com/certification/desktop/
    if you don't see your computer on the list, forget ubuntu." good luck, happy computing.

  9. #9
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    Re: novice, non-programmers, read before install

    Quote Originally Posted by marcretired View Post
    "first of all, before doing anything go here http://www.ubuntu.com/certification/desktop/
    if you don't see your computer on the list, forget ubuntu." good luck, happy computing.
    My computer is not on the list. The manufacturer of my computer isn't even on the list. I am running Xubuntu 12.04 without issue.

    Please advise.

  10. #10
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    Re: novice, non-programmers, read before install

    Originally Posted by marcretired "first of all, before doing anything go here http://www.ubuntu.com/certification/desktop/
    if you don't see your computer on the list, forget ubuntu." good luck, happy computing.
    Morbius1
    My computer is not on the list. The manufacturer of my computer isn't even on the list. I am running Xubuntu 12.04 without issue.

    Please advise.

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