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Thread: Nautilus has no global menu. Huge usuability issue and confusing

  1. #11
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    Re: Nautilus has no global menu. Huge usuability issue and confusing

    Well I didn't mean to send things off topic, so apologies, but I do feel that this sort of problem was inevitable once you step outside of the arena and begin your own forks. Mint will no doubt be feeling the strain too, doubly so now they've decided to fork Nautilus themselves because of the new changes.

    I think what confuses me most between Gnome and Ubuntu, is that essentially the goals are the same, are they not? A one size fits all approach to the desktop/tablet area. Like I say, with this in mind, what exactly was the argument again? Unity and Shell are very similar in many ways and aim for the same goals, so why does Canonical suddenly feel the changes being made to Nautilus are not to their taste? Surely it fits their own paradigm?
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  2. #12
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    Re: Nautilus has no global menu. Huge usuability issue and confusing

    Stay on the topic guys. This thread is about Nautilus usability issue not discussion about Unity and Gnome shell.

    Regards.

    I DON'T EVEN KNOW WHAT A QUANTAL QUETZAL IS...BUT IT SOUNDS LIKE PRETZEL AND I LIKE PRETZEL

  3. #13
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    Re: Nautilus has no global menu. Huge usuability issue and confusing

    Quote Originally Posted by GreatDanton View Post
    Stay on the topic guys. This thread is about Nautilus usability issue not discussion about Unity and Gnome shell.

    Regards.
    Of course. Again, apologies. I felt the similarity of issues warranted the points.
    AMD Phenom X4 945, 4Gb Crucial 800Mhz DDR2 RAM, 1Tb SATA III HDD, nVidia 9800GT 512Mb

  4. #14
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    Re: Nautilus has no global menu. Huge usuability issue and confusing

    Have nautilus-scripts also been ditched as well?

  5. #15
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    Re: Nautilus has no global menu. Huge usuability issue and confusing

    Quote Originally Posted by GreatDanton View Post
    Stay on the topic guys. This thread is about Nautilus usability issue not discussion about Unity and Gnome shell.

    Regards.
    I beg to differ, I think the reason why Nautilus has no global menu, causing confusion and huge usability issues, is caused by Unity and not Nautilus.
    Therefore I mean that the discussion of integration of Nautilus, or lack of the same,in Unity, is highly relevant.

  6. #16
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    Re: Nautilus has no global menu. Huge usuability issue and confusing

    I agree with stinger . This is part and parcel of the decision to fork away from the mainline development of Gnome in such a radical way . Incompatibilities will inevitably arise ,requiring workarounds that can rapidly build into a house of cards that cannot stand . That is the train wreck I mentioned above .
    if it ain't broke you haven't tweaked it enough

  7. #17
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    Re: Nautilus has no global menu. Huge usuability issue and confusing

    It's not only Ubuntu that doesn't see GnomeShell as something their target user wants.

    And it's not like Gnome folk don't know what Ubuntu is and that it uses Gnome and Unity. Maybe the solution for this problem would be global menu by default in Unity and "local menu" option with menu button.

    But for something like that to happen Gnome and Ubuntu folk should plan together and talk months ahead not silly little actions over night and then some folk arguing on forums if Unity or GnomeShell is better. Ubuntu uses Unity on top of Gnome and get over it why waste time arguing over this.

    I don't know if folk involved knows this but we are past "hobby time", Linux desktop is starting to gain some traction and folk involved will have to start behave more professionally if they like it or not.

  8. #18
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    Re: Nautilus has no global menu. Huge usuability issue and confusing

    Well in my defence I'm not arguing over which is better. I'm simply looking at how similar they are. I'm not disputing Unity or Gnome; I love to use either or, personally, and have both installed.

    As you say, I'd love to see them collaborate like the "old days", and have less of the need to fork. I can't see Ubuntu wanting to fork Nautilus in all honesty, even though the Mint team already have. I just hate to see the separated, wasted effort. My concern is this gets harder and harder as time goes on, especially as Gnome is very much on its path now.
    AMD Phenom X4 945, 4Gb Crucial 800Mhz DDR2 RAM, 1Tb SATA III HDD, nVidia 9800GT 512Mb

  9. #19
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    Re: Nautilus has no global menu. Huge usuability issue and confusing

    Yes if folk involved will work against each other they lose and we lose and everybody else that has nothing to do with Linux on desktop win, because Linux on desktop folk did it again!

  10. #20
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    Re: Nautilus has no global menu. Huge usuability issue and confusing

    When I compare unity with gnome shell. Gnome shell has some hopes of becoming functional, only after you add 25 extensions. Unity is functional from the start, but can't be customized, that's their main flaw. But to me, unity is the sensible default.

    Believe it or not, most users care about stuff that works out of the box and would rather not tweak their systems. Which is bad to gnome-shell which requires you to spend 20 man-hours looking for the right combination of extensions. Worse, after adding all those extensions to gnome-shell, I noticed it becomes cinnamon... Between cinnamon and unity, gnome-shell really has no reason to exist. It is a project with an "elegant", impractical idea of keeping you going to the same corner every 5 seconds, and spending 2 of those seconds watching animations.

    Forks are part of the way FOSS works. Eventually, some of the forks will persist and be merged and other will die. It is survival of the strongest and this will ensure that at the end only the best ideas will remain in the spotlight. That future benefit of course comes at the prize of the difficulty we are facing right now. But, big deal? What's the worst thing that could happen? We will still have less than 1% of users? So what?

    Making unity a gnome-shell extension would not have saved Canonical any work to do. Unity is already a compiz extension, so it is not like unity was reimplementing window or desktop management at all. Most of the work canonical spent is in the launcher, the dash and the global menubar. It would have taken canonical the same amount of work to implement them as extensions to gnome-shell or compiz. But as gnome-shell extensions, it would have rendered canonical even more subject to the whims and caprice of gnome's. Every time the gnome-shell version number increases by 0.1 half of the extensions in the extensions site stop working.
    Last edited by vexorian; August 16th, 2012 at 05:29 PM.
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