Before ranting about bugs...

[3rdalbum]

I'd just like to advise users here: If you've been using Ubuntu for a year or more, and you've just upgraded to 10.04, and you complain or rant that Ubuntu 10.04 is buggy... well, I'm going to ask you if you did your duty and actually helped test the betas.

Bugs in Ubuntu can't be fixed if nobody knows about them.

If you do come across bugs in Ubuntu 10.04 and want to report them for possible inclusion in Post-Release-Updates, then I'd recommend you use the "apport-bug" command; for instance, for a bug in GDM, you'd run:

apport-bug gdm

It will automatically grab log files and relevant information about your system and attach it to the bug report, which makes the developer's job easier.

[Endolith]

Reporting bugs is a lot of work, and basically futile. Unless you expect everyone to go to school for computer science for 4 years, it's not something we can fix. So we try to do the right thing and report bugs, we sit back, and... nothing happens. The bugs go unfixed and the bug reports go ignored for years. So what's the point? You can even get yelled at for making a mistake in your report, or not reconfiguring your entire system so you can do a stack trace, or filing a duplicate bug report even though you searched very carefully beforehand.

[3rdalbum]

I've never been yelled at for a duplicate bug report. The Ubuntu triagers are very respectful. It's not hard to file a bug report either - the apport-bug utility collects all relevant information to attach, all you have to do is describe what you're doing when the problem occurs.

There are bugs in Lucid that I have reported and that have not been fixed or even commented-on. If somebody complains about those bugs, then fair enough - they've been reported and not fixed, probably not even looked at. But many bug reports have been looked at and fixed - yours might be one of them, if only you'd reported it.

But people who are well able to test SHOULD. It's in all of our best interests to. Ubuntu is free, and this is a chance to give something back not only to Ubuntu, but to the whole community.

[julianb]

well, I'm going to ask you if you did your duty and actually helped test the betas.

I tested the betas, but I disagree that it is a "duty" to do so.

You are right on the money with your statement that bugs that are never reported are never fixed, though. So:

If you find a bug, report it!

AND if you want to make it easy to report bugs, help us make sure the Reporting Bugs documentation is clear and concise!

[pazuzuthewise]

I'm going to ask you if you did your duty and actually helped test the betas.

Ubuntu's motto was "Linux for Human Beings" and not "Linux for people with computer know-how", and not even "for linux enthusiasts" so testing beta-software is not a duty, but a personal option, limited by the user's knowledge and available time. If one has to work on a system, having to meet a deadline etc., that person cannot be reasonably expected, at the same time, to test betas.

[cariboo]

Testing, may not be a duty, but because of all the different hardware configurations, it would be nice if more people took part in testing. You don't have to be a computer whiz to do it. Bug reporting has become pretty automated. As the op stated using the bug reporting feature really helps make Ubuntu better.

One of the reason some bugs go a long time with out any attention, is that if it only affects one or two people, there has to be really good documentation eg: what you did yo do to create the failure, complete computer specs and an other information you think will solve the problem.

Another reason some bugs seem to have no action, is because Ubuntu relies on the upstream to repair bugs too. For example, a few releases back there was a bug where the screensaver would start up while watching a movie using vlc, the maintainer of the screensaver flat out refused to fix the problem, as it didn't affect him, fortunately others have stepped up to the plate and created work arounds, so this is no longer a problem.

We don't pay Canonical anything to use Ubuntu, so in return it would be nice if the users gave something back, and bug reporting is one of the simplest ways.

[aysiu]

I'd just like to advise users here: If you've been using Ubuntu for a year or more, and you've just upgraded to 10.04, and you complain or rant that Ubuntu 10.04 is buggy... well, I'm going to ask you if you did your duty and actually helped test the betas.

I did, and none of those bugs has been fixed.

Here's one from September 2008:
network manager slow to reconnect after suspend/resume

It got confirmed a while ago and it appeared to be somewhat fixed in Karmic but has come up again in Lucid and never got fixed before final release.

Here's another one I reported back in October 2009:
Internal mic doesn't work with default settings (need to use line-in)

Never got fixed or even confirmed. No one asked me questions about it.

From October 2009 (not fixed for Karmic or Lucid):
bcmwl kernel source needs to be reinstalled for Broadcom 4312 to work

Odd that Broadcom 4312 works out of the box with Ubuntu 9.04. Regression much?

Related: Lucid Alpha 3: hardware drivers can't fetch STA drivers for Broadcom

Reported in March:
Network Manager prompts for already saved password upon resume (makes me click Connect without re-entering password)

No response.

Reported a couple of weeks ago:
Official Ubuntu Documentation wiki pages Inaccessible from Android

No acknowledgement.

Hey, I know the developers work hard. I know it's a thankless job. But I don't like people insinuating that those who complain have not filed bugs. Filing bugs doesn't magically make those bugs go away. In fact, I've found the vast majority of bugs I've filed have been completely ignored.

[23meg]

But I don't like people insinuating that those who complain have not filed bugs. Filing bugs doesn't magically make those bugs go away. In fact, I've found the vast majority of bugs I've filed have been completely ignored.

I don't think anyone is saying that filing bug reports makes bugs go away.

Filing bug reports is a necessary condition of bugs getting fixed; not a sufficient condition.

[Irihapeti]

I think ranting is a waste of time, anyway. It solves nothing. It only raises the blood pressure and annoys other people.

[aysiu]

I don't think anyone is saying that filing bug reports makes bugs go away.

Filing bug reports is a necessary condition of bugs getting fixed; not a sufficient condition.

But the problem is not bugs not being reported. The problem is bugs not getting fixed. Some are upstream bugs. Some the developers just can't get to in time. That's fine. I understand that.

I just don't see the issue being "Hey, we could have put out a better release if people had just reported more bugs."

There are enough bug reports.