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Thread: Update Manager Offers a "Partial Upgrade"? Read This.

  1. #41
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    Re: Update Manager Offers a "Partial Upgrade"? Read This.

    Quote Originally Posted by aimwin View Post
    Are you saying that in the Final and the Stable Release, they won't put this feature, Partial Upgrades, as a default function?
    No, what I'm saying is that the Partial Upgrade requests are probably less common on a final release and usually required. The thing with the Beta version is that it is under heavy development, so Partial Upgrades are more frequent and sometimes should not be applied, as already explained by the OP.

  2. #42
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    Re: Update Manager Offers a "Partial Upgrade"? Read This.

    Quote Originally Posted by lovinglinux View Post
    No, what I'm saying is that the Partial Upgrade requests are probably less common on a final release and usually required. The thing with the Beta version is that it is under heavy development, so Partial Upgrades are more frequent and sometimes should not be applied, as already explained by the OP.

    Then my comment will be valid that the warning of 23meg's message, at the beginning of this thread, should accompanied the "Partial Upgrade Message" then.

    I cannot file the bug report at lunchpad nor Brainstorm.
    I spend an hour already, I hope someone from there got my complain so they would compile with other complains so they can judge better of what they should do.

    Thanks everyone.

  3. #43
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    Re: Update Manager Offers a "Partial Upgrade"? Read This.

    Quote Originally Posted by aimwin View Post
    Then my comment will be valid that the warning of 23meg's message, at the beginning of this thread, should accompanied the "Partial Upgrade Message" then.

    I cannot file the bug report at lunchpad nor Brainstorm.
    I spend an hour already, I hope someone from there got my complain so they would compile with other complains so they can judge better of what they should do.

    Thanks everyone.
    Yes, your suggestion is valid, I never said it wasn't.

  4. #44
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    Re: Update Manager Offers a "Partial Upgrade"? Read This.

    Quote Originally Posted by lovinglinux View Post
    No, what I'm saying is that the Partial Upgrade requests are probably less common on a final release and usually required. The thing with the Beta version is that it is under heavy development, so Partial Upgrades are more frequent and sometimes should not be applied, as already explained by the OP.
    As long as you don't have broken packages, Update Manager will never offer a Partial Upgrade in a stable release, so it's a non-issue.

  5. #45
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    Re: Update Manager Offers a "Partial Upgrade"? Read This.

    Quote Originally Posted by 23meg View Post
    This causes package management tools such as Update Manager, which are mainly meant to be used with stable releases of Ubuntu where the package archive is always consistent,
    Thanks for all the thread and the good explanation. And just this text I quote is what I most wanted to know.

    There is only one thing I'm cuious about and would like to have even better clear. Why it is possible to make it consistent during release lifetime and not during development?

  6. #46
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    Re: Update Manager Offers a "Partial Upgrade"? Read This.

    Dear Guru_s

    1. I would like to edit my previous posts, since I understood "Partial Upgrade" to a large extent now. So to make the post more beneficial to Newbies like me and less "whining" but still represent the serious of the weakness of information display in the "Testing Version" for Normal User like me.

    Can I or should I try to edit them?

    2. The current message of Partial Upgrading.


    3. my suggested new message.


    Not all update can be install.

    Do not run Partial Upgrade if you are not a developer team or an advance ubuntu tester.
    Because Partial Upgrade could result in destruction of your current Ubuntu,
    and at certain conditions could result even in lost of data in your hardisks
    (even they are in other partitions).

    You should instead use "aptitude"
    sudo apt-get update followed by sudo apt-get upgrade ??



    ???? I don't fully understand the alternative to Update Manager
    and what VMC wrote "I don't use update manager and instead use aptitude????

    4. My question ==(after read all the posts and "learning the basics of using development releases is a prerequisite for doing useful testing,
    @ the https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelo...opmentReleases)

    still is

    What should a normal user like me do?
    when I want to help testing, but also would like to upgrade or update the installed Ubuntu.

    I don't really understand "aptitude" that VMC said.

    I reinstall 9.10 beta already but cannot decide how to update,
    since I got the Partial Upgrade message immediatly after flesh installation and click on update manager.

    Thanks in advance againAttachment 132286
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by aimwin; October 18th, 2009 at 12:49 PM.

  7. #47
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    Re:Partial UPGRADE and Partial UPDATE?

    Is partial UPDATE the same as partial UPGRADE? It shouldn't be.

    I installed Karmic beta directly through a Karmic beta DVD. When I click on Update Manager, it says not all updates can be installed and give an option for partial UPDATE.

    I had previously upgraded my Jaunty to Karmic beta (on another machine) and it offered partial UPGRADE. That I understand one shouldn't do in most cases.

    But what about partial UPDATE? How do I update my Karmic beta if its offering me partial updates?

  8. #48
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    Re: Update Manager Offers a "Partial Upgrade"? Read This.

    Ok. I just did a sudo apt-get update followed by sudo apt-get upgrade.

    It showed no packages would be removed and some 451 to be upgraded. Thats fine I suppose?

  9. #49
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    Re: Update Manager Offers a "Partial Upgrade"? Read This.

    Quote Originally Posted by manfer View Post
    Thanks for all the thread and the good explanation. And just this text I quote is what I most wanted to know.

    There is only one thing I'm cuious about and would like to have even better clear. Why it is possible to make it consistent during release lifetime and not during development?
    I still would like an explanation, an answer to that question if possible.

    And would like to point something else. People can decide to test an ubuntu release and even have no idea of the existence of ubuntu forums, so do you think a sticky on forums is enough? to say "DON'T DO PARTIAL UPGRADES", I'm going to exagerate a little, "YOU STUPID NEWBIE TESTING, DON'T LET US AND YOU WASTE TIME. READ STICKIES. NEVER DO PARTIAL UPGRADES" (I know this is done nowhere so rude, the ubuntu community is always there to help).

    I repeat, a person can start testing ubuntu and don't know anything about ubuntu forums (they read an article on a blog and decide to test, a friend recomends them ubuntu, ....). And many many more now during BETA realease because even ubuntu home page is suggesting it and with a very very big ad: "Ubuntu 9.10 coming soon! can't wait? Download the beta now. Test it and give us your feedback to make an even better release" (and the only warning it has is "don't use in production environments", I don't see any don't do partial upgrades warning, do you think people are going to magically know about ubuntu forums and read stickies before testing?).

    So I think it is a big big big mistake the way update manager works during development suggesting partial upgrades that (at first) noone have to magically know are not safe (at least me had the idea I could trust on the update system till I get into trouble and learned I couldnt). I think it is a big big mistake that people can't trust in the OS update system.

    And when I learned I could not trust on update manager, the first thing comming to my mind was "wow, and is this the same during release lifetime? I'm not going to trust update manager anymore". And my perception of how good was Ubuntu as OS went into a spin.

    Now, at least, I'm glad to hear during release lifetime you can trust because:
    The package archive is always consistent.
    As long as you don't have broken packages, Update Manager will never offer a Partial Upgrade in a stable release, so it's a non-issue.
    But still I think it is a big big mistake that during development it is not and a big big mistake an OS update system giving wrong suggestions during development.

    Just to finish and in my modest opinion the update system is one critical piece of an OS and should be always reliable.
    Last edited by manfer; October 18th, 2009 at 11:32 AM.

  10. #50
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    Re: Update Manager Offers a "Partial Upgrade"? Read This.

    And I was forgeting, I totally agree with aimwin you only have to look at the partial upgrade warning.

    Which button you think someone only involved on testing and not development is going to press with such a message? A warning that starts, "Run partial upgrade...". Of course, until for some reason they realize it is not safe (or they just know), they are going to run it thinking one of the listed causes is happening to him because an OS update system is supposed to be reliable. It can solve bugs and introduce others of course, nothing is perfect, but an OS update system breaking the system?,

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