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Thread: Random hangs - Does this happen to anyone else?

  1. #1
    tcoffeep Guest

    Random hangs - Does this happen to anyone else?

    I'm not sure if I'd be able to find a log for errors, as I wouldn't know where to look. I'm just getting used to the idea of logs. I'm just wondering if anyone else is getting random system hangs every 30-40 minutes? It usually only lasts for a few seconds, and a minute at most, but it gets annoying.

    It started when I began using Dosbox ( but it's not because of DOSbox, I know that ). Maybe it has something to do with the :

    INFO: using unknown version '/usr/bin/python3.0' (debian_defaults not up-to-date?)

    I've been getting with every update?

  2. #2
    tcoffeep Guest

    Re: Random hangs - Does this happen to anyone else?

    Noone?

  3. #3
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    Re: Random hangs - Does this happen to anyone else?

    Are you using the nvidia driver? If so can you reproduce it without it loaded, it is known to abuse the stack and cause unpredictable latency which might be what you are experiencing.

    Additionally is the problem linked to disk access, there are some known latency problems in the block layer and in ext3 which are being dealt with by the kernel developers. I don't know when fixes are hitting Ubuntu but I suspect that depend on issuing an SRU request with backported fixes. As a gapstop there are some ways to ease the pain a bit.

    Things that might help:
    Using the as io elevator
    ionice the kjournal processes into the realtime class
    switching ext3 to using data=writeback
    On strike during the Oneiric cycle due to ungratefulness of Ubuntu.


  4. #4
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    Re: Random hangs - Does this happen to anyone else?

    I've been hanging around here for a while, and yet those three suggestions are nicely cryptic.

    1) Add elevator=as (or elevator=deadline?) to the end of your GRUB kernel option (when booting press Esc, and E to edit the GRUB option).

    2) Initially I'm thinking "?". Quick search yields $ sudo ionice -c3 -p{pid} for idle, not sure -c? for realtime, but apparently this only works on CFQ so it shouldn't be combined with 1).

    3) I understand it, but can't remember how to do it.

    (Plus btw, "stopgap")
    1) Dell Studio 1749: i5 540 (2.5GHz), 8GB, ATi 5650, Intel 5300AGN XFCE@Manjaro-x64
    2) Lenovo X61: C2D T7200, 2GB, Intel HDA, iwlwifi, XFCE@Manjaro-x64
    3) Compaq Mini 311c: Atom N270 (OC@2.0GHz), 3GB, Nvidia ION, Broadcom G+BT XFCE@13.10x32

  5. #5
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    Re: Random hangs - Does this happen to anyone else?

    Quote Originally Posted by jfernyhough View Post
    I've been hanging around here for a while, and yet those three suggestions are nicely cryptic.

    1) Add elevator=as (or elevator=deadline?) to the end of your GRUB kernel option (when booting press Esc, and E to edit the GRUB option).

    2) Initially I'm thinking "?". Quick search yields $ sudo ionice -c3 -p{pid} for idle, not sure -c? for realtime, but apparently this only works on CFQ so it shouldn't be combined with 1).

    3) I understand it, but can't remember how to do it.

    (Plus btw, "stopgap")
    I am not here for hands holding, research is allowed as is asking questions politely. One reason to do this is to force people to learn about what the changes do, which is important as some of them may lead to very undesirable outcomes. Messing with the defaults for how your system does IO should not be taken lightly. This is also why he should start by eliminating known problematic modules such as the proprietary nvidia driver. The will cause problems and we cannot fix them. Only if the problem presists without that in use should he proceed to doing any of this.

    1) the most simple way would be adding it to grub yes, there is also the option to do it in runtime by doing:

    sudo -s
    echo anticipatory > sys/block/sda/queue/scheduler
    echo 64 > /sys/block/sda/queue/max_sectors_kb

    That last one is another tweak not related to scheduling as such but it might have an impact on how long a stall we can see for an fsync. Remember to apply to all devices in use not just sda if you have more harddrives.

    To have it applied at boot:

    sudo vi /boot/grub/menu.lst and add elevator=as to the end of the line that goes something like:

    kernel /vmlinuz-2.6.28-11-generic root=/dev/mapper/dawkins-root ro quiet splash

    or when grub comes up press esc to get to the menu, then e over the item that indicates the kernel you want to boot. go to the line mentioned above and press e. Then add elevator=as to the end, press enter and then b to boot.

    2) easiest way is to do:

    sudo -s
    for i in `pidof kjournald` ; do ionice -c1 -p $i ; done

    In some cases this may make stalling worse, it is a little like fishing with dynamite, quick and dirty.

    3)

    sudo vi /etc/fstab and change, for ext3 partitions only (do it for anything else and it is your fault when bad stuff(tm) happens).

    relatime to data=writeback,relatime

    save and reboot.

    There is a security risk involving multiuser setups doing this in case of crashes.

    You should not apply any of these changes unless you can afford the risk of data loss. It is intended only to narrow down the list of suspects. It is also not certain that they will help, nobody should apply these hoping for a smoother desktop experience. Stick with the defaults unless you have an io related problem and do not do anything you do not understand - research first, this is important and only apply when you feel you have an understanding of what a tweak does. This is for your safety and to help with any bug reporting at a later stage to know exactly what made a difference.

    Now do you understand why I do not give simple cut and paste commands?
    On strike during the Oneiric cycle due to ungratefulness of Ubuntu.


  6. #6
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    Re: Random hangs - Does this happen to anyone else?

    Yes, agreed. I probably should have added that the second two options were something I hadn't heard of and as such that post was my research for my future reference.
    1) Dell Studio 1749: i5 540 (2.5GHz), 8GB, ATi 5650, Intel 5300AGN XFCE@Manjaro-x64
    2) Lenovo X61: C2D T7200, 2GB, Intel HDA, iwlwifi, XFCE@Manjaro-x64
    3) Compaq Mini 311c: Atom N270 (OC@2.0GHz), 3GB, Nvidia ION, Broadcom G+BT XFCE@13.10x32

  7. #7
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    Re: Random hangs - Does this happen to anyone else?


  8. #8
    tcoffeep Guest

    Re: Random hangs - Does this happen to anyone else?

    Quote Originally Posted by gnomeuser View Post
    Are you using the nvidia driver? If so can you reproduce it without it loaded, it is known to abuse the stack and cause unpredictable latency which might be what you are experiencing.
    I am using the nvidia driver. But I am unable to understand what you mean with the bolded. I'm still trying to get an understanding of linux, so, please forgive my confusion. Are you saying that a smart way to try and fix this would be to delete the nvidia proprietary driver? Maybe the x.org nv driver would suffice?
    Last edited by tcoffeep; April 20th, 2009 at 02:45 AM. Reason: a question

  9. #9
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    Re: Random hangs - Does this happen to anyone else?

    Quote Originally Posted by tcoffeep View Post
    I am using the nvidia driver. But I am unable to understand what you mean with the bolded. I'm still trying to get an understanding of linux, so, please forgive my confusion. Are you saying that a smart way to try and fix this would be to delete the nvidia proprietary driver? Maybe the x.org nv driver would suffice?
    I'm pretty sure the message is to remove or disable the nvidia proprietary drivers. You can do this by going to system>administration>hardware drivers. From there it will allow you to disable the proprietary driver.

    Next reboot. Then test to see if the problem when away. Report back here with your results.
    Mac Pro 5,1 6-Core@3.33 GHz, 48 GB, ATI HD 5870
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  10. #10
    tcoffeep Guest

    Re: Random hangs - Does this happen to anyone else?

    Quote Originally Posted by crjackson View Post
    I'm pretty sure the message is to remove or disable the nvidia proprietary drivers. You can do this by going to system>administration>hardware drivers. From there it will allow you to disable the proprietary driver.

    Next reboot. Then test to see if the problem when away. Report back here with your results.
    Alright, though as I've stated, it's intermittent so it might take a few hours to get a real answer.

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