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ColmCille
September 15th, 2008, 11:45 AM
Hi all,

Completely new to Linux. Haven't even installed it yet. I'm still looking at versions. I am looking at either Ubuntu or Kubuntu. I have downloaded Ubuntu 7.10 because I heard 8.04 wasn't quite ready for prime time. Then again, the Kubuntu packages I am looking at use Kubunto 8.04, which is basically the same as Ubuntu 8.04 under the hood, isn't it?

Anyway...

What I want to do is install K/Unbuntu on my Vista system as a dual boot system.

As you probably know, most Windows systems these days don't come with OS restore disks, but with an image file on a partition, which you can burn to make system restore disks (in the case of HP, they only let you burn ONE copy... :mad:)

Anyway, I figure that installing Linux will change my partition tables, and I'm guessing that the restore program may have problems finding the image partition on the hard drive if the partition tables are changed. So I may have problems restoring from hard drive.

Of course, since the disks I made contains the system image as well as the restore program (I should think), the location of the HD partition shouldn't make any difference if I restore from the disks.

Nevertheless, I want to make sure my thinking is correct, and that there aren't any other issues of which I am unaware?

I just want to make sure I can restore my Windows OS if needed. [-o<

Advice/reassurance/dire predictions appreciated.

PS. Is either Ubuntu or Kubuntu better at photo and video editing, audio applications, etc.? I'm having a hard time finding good open source video editing software for Windows, and that's one of the things I am looking at Linux for.

Thanks.

--James

3rdalbum
September 15th, 2008, 11:52 AM
Hmm... I'd be interested in knowing about whether the restore disks will still be able to recognise the restore partition.

As for video editing software, there's Kdenlive which I quite like. Some people swear by Cinelerra or Avidemux. To be completely honest with you, you probably won't be satisfied with Linux-based open-source video editors either. You can try them and see what you think.

Audio editing has the excellent Audacity, and image editing has the equally-excellent GIMP.

northern lights
September 15th, 2008, 12:12 PM
Completely new to Linux. Haven't even installed it yet. I'm still looking at versions. I am looking at either Ubuntu or Kubuntu. I have downloaded Ubuntu 7.10 because I heard 8.04 wasn't quite ready for prime time. Then again, the Kubuntu packages I am looking at use Kubunto 8.04, which is basically the same as Ubuntu 8.04 under the hood, isn't it?

The core difference between Ku-, U-, Xu- and Fluxbuntu is the desktop environment and the resulting resource efficiency. Thus if 8.04 was "not ready for prime" Kubuntu wouldn't be either.

The good news is that this notion is entirely wrong in the first place. The version number is 8.04 cause it was released in April 2008. We're a few weeks short of the Intrepid release - if Hardy was still buggy, that'd be rather ridiculous.

ColmCille
September 15th, 2008, 12:37 PM
Hmm... I'd be interested in knowing about whether the restore disks will still be able to recognise the restore partition.

Do they need to recognize it?

I'm not sure why the disks should care about the restore partition. The only reason I can think of is to access the image, but the image is on the disks, so I would think the restore partition could be safely ignored.

I may be very wrong, though. That's what worries me.



As for video editing software, there's Kdenlive which I quite like. Some people swear by Cinelerra or Avidemux. To be completely honest with you, you probably won't be satisfied with Linux-based open-source video editors either. You can try them and see what you think.

Audio editing has the excellent Audacity, and image editing has the equally-excellent GIMP.I use both Audacity and Gimp in Windows. Actually, I use GimPhoto along with GimPad, which provides a pretty good Photoshop alternative.

I also use Avidemux, which isn't really what I'd call a video editor, but an encoder with some minor editing functions. There are no timelines, no transitions, no effects, etc. Just basic cutting functions, a few filters, and so forth. It works nice for what it is.

I need something a bit more full featured, to replace Windows Movie Maker which is rather limited in ability, buggy and enjoys a good crash often (I don't enjoy the crashes as much). But I also need some good, more basic editing tools, and wanted to try some of the Linux-only software.

Well, video editing isn't the only reason I want to try Linux. We'll see. For a full featured editor, I may have to splurge on Power Director or something. Jahshaka is apparently alive again and it may have some promise, but that's down the road.

fourthofjuly
September 15th, 2008, 01:51 PM
Hi all,

Completely new to Linux. Haven't even installed it yet. I'm still looking at versions. I am looking at either Ubuntu or Kubuntu. I have downloaded Ubuntu 7.10 because I heard 8.04 wasn't quite ready for prime time. Then again, the Kubuntu packages I am looking at use Kubunto 8.04, which is basically the same as Ubuntu 8.04 under the hood, isn't it?

Anyway...

What I want to do is install K/Unbuntu on my Vista system as a dual boot system.

As you probably know, most Windows systems these days don't come with OS restore disks, but with an image file on a partition, which you can burn to make system restore disks (in the case of HP, they only let you burn ONE copy... :mad:)

Anyway, I figure that installing Linux will change my partition tables, and I'm guessing that the restore program may have problems finding the image partition on the hard drive if the partition tables are changed. So I may have problems restoring from hard drive.

Of course, since the disks I made contains the system image as well as the restore program (I should think), the location of the HD partition shouldn't make any difference if I restore from the disks.

Nevertheless, I want to make sure my thinking is correct, and that there aren't any other issues of which I am unaware?

I just want to make sure I can restore my Windows OS if needed. [-o<

Advice/reassurance/dire predictions appreciated.

PS. Is either Ubuntu or Kubuntu better at photo and video editing, audio applications, etc.? I'm having a hard time finding good open source video editing software for Windows, and that's one of the things I am looking at Linux for.

Thanks.

--James
Hi James,

for the installation part...please DO NOT FORGET TO run disk defragmenter first in Windows before you resize (reduce) the Windows partition(s) to make space for *buntu installation

otherwise you may lose data from the Windows partition that is re-sized...

8.04 is definitely a stable (& not a test) release...

Ubuntu / Kubuntu? Depends on your personal taste... you are free to try both !!!

decide for yourself & do share your experience in Testimonials section... I prefer Ubuntu as I am more comfortable with GNOME than KDE...

cheers!

devang.

PS: As far as I know, most of the programs that run in KDE can run in GNOME as well and vice-versa.

handydan918
September 15th, 2008, 02:55 PM
Another useful thing about linux is that once it is installed, you can backup (or even clone) anything on your HDD-even Windows.
Where Windows is likely to say "Operation Not Permitted", linux will say "Yeah, you can do that..."

ColmCille
September 16th, 2008, 03:34 AM
The good news is that this notion is entirely wrong in the first place. The version number is 8.04 cause it was released in April 2008. We're a few weeks short of the Intrepid release - if Hardy was still buggy, that'd be rather ridiculous.

Well, that is indeed good news.

But, I'm sure you can understand that a first time user wants everything to go as smoothly as possible. Once I am more familiar with the OS, then I won't mind being more daring. Right now, I just want a good, solid build with the fewest possible problems to learn on.

So, seeing comments like this has made me leery about installing Hardy as my first Linux install:


"Hardy has all kinds of problems burning CDs. I've been searching for weeks for a solution but have yet to find one."And:


"it's a good thing I still have gusty as my main computer
this 8.04 seems like a rush job & it's been nothing but problems .
should still be beta LOL
I'll keep gusty my kubuntu install of gusty 7.10 is Rock solid"( http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=868551 )

Now maybe those comments aren't fair. I certainly understand that some users can treat software and the developers unfairly, and sometimes the issues are with them or something other than the software. Plus, those particular comments were a couple months ago. A lot can change in a couple months.

But, I have never read comments like that about 7.10 (though maybe they are there and I just haven't seen them), and that tends to makes me more comfortable trying it out and if all goes well, learning the OS with it.

No offense is intended.

I still have research to do before I decide what to try. I may end up being daring anyway. I may even go with Kubuntu 8.04 and KDE4 remix.

But I want to make very sure I can restore my system before I install any additional OS.

Thanks for the comments and info.

ColmCille
September 16th, 2008, 05:01 AM
Hi James,

for the installation part...please DO NOT FORGET TO run disk defragmenter first in Windows before you resize (reduce) the Windows partition(s) to make space for *buntu installation

otherwise you may lose data from the Windows partition that is re-sized...

8.04 is definitely a stable (& not a test) release...

Ubuntu / Kubuntu? Depends on your personal taste... you are free to try both !!!

decide for yourself & do share your experience in Testimonials section... I prefer Ubuntu as I am more comfortable with GNOME than KDE...

cheers!

devang.

PS: As far as I know, most of the programs that run in KDE can run in GNOME as well and vice-versa.


Howdy,

Thanks for the info. No, believe me, I won't forget to defrag. When I finally do this, I will have researched and have the steps all written out, with back up plans in case anything goes wrong, etc.

Now, I know Hardy is not a test release. The comments I mentioned are probably BS, but I'm paranoid about installing new OSes. It's just inexperience.

But I'll register your vote for Hardy being ok. Maybe I should take a poll? :)

As for KDE vs. GNOME, I think I get it now. The main difference is the GUI. Under the hood it's the same. So I just have to decide what GUI I like.

Also very useful to know how easy it is to backup with Linux. Windows is pretty picky, but that's because she is so sensitive. Hit the wrong button and she has a nervous breakdown. :lolflag:

Thanks.

northern lights
September 16th, 2008, 11:52 AM
I understand that as a new/future GNU/Linux convert, you want to avoid as much maintenance work as possible and pick the most stable system.

I might repeat myself, but the assumption that Gutsy is more stable (especially regardless of hardware) than Hardy is again simply not true.

Hardy is the second LTS release (Long Term Support) and as such aimed at an audience that requires stability more than anything.

When quoting trouble with Hardy, two questions immediately come to mind:

1. When was the trouble encountered?
2. Would the problem not have occured on an older version?

Here's why the answers to the are important:

1. If you quote a post from March/April/May it is vital tom realize that Ubuntu and it's repositories are updated constantly and subject to change even in between the half-annual releases.
2. Most often the answer is no, it would have occurred on Gutsy also, as Hardy dropped no hardware/architecture support.

ColmCille
September 17th, 2008, 01:57 AM
I understand that as a new/future GNU/Linux convert, you want to avoid as much maintenance work as possible and pick the most stable system.

I might repeat myself, but the assumption that Gutsy is more stable (especially regardless of hardware) than Hardy is again simply not true.

Hardy is the second LTS release (Long Term Support) and as such aimed at an audience that requires stability more than anything.

Good to know. I'm not really assuming anything. It's just a matter of perceptions and comfort zones. I had seen negative comments on Hardy, but none for Gutsy, and that made me feel more comfortable about Gutsy, even though the reality could well be different from the perception.

But, as I said, I had more research to do. And since my original comment I have done quite a bit more research. Enough that I am willing to give Hardy a try.




When quoting trouble with Hardy, two questions immediately come to mind:

1. When was the trouble encountered?
2. Would the problem not have occured on an older version?

Here's why the answers to the are important:

1. If you quote a post from March/April/May it is vital tom realize that Ubuntu and it's repositories are updated constantly and subject to change even in between the half-annual releases.Yes, as I said, the comments were a couple months ago, and a lot can change in that time, especially with open source.



2. Most often the answer is no, it would have occurred on Gutsy also, as Hardy dropped no hardware/architecture support.Well, the OP in the above linked thread was having problems burning CDs in Hardy, but not Gutsy. Burning CD/DVDs is very important to me.

Nevertheless, the good comments and reviews seem to far outweigh the negative, and you have convinced me to try it.

I have been playing with both Unbuntu 8.04 and Kubuntu 8.04 KDE3 from the live disks, and I think I prefer GNOME. No, I am positive I prefer it. :)

Neither one picked up my Atheros wifi adapter, so that will take some figuring out I guess (Internet is even more important than burning CD/DVDs). I didn't try burning DVDs. We'll see.

But, I will still have my Windows install (hopefully -- from the research I have done, it seems there should be no issues with my burnt recovery disks) so I can take my time to get Linux working properly.

Anyway, I do appreciate all the comments.