A true photoshop alternative....No not GIMP!! "PIXEL" actually

[abs]

hello all,

I came across a programme the other day, and as i cant use GIMP, as it just stresses me out just trying to do simple things, i know my GIMP comments will prompt a reaction from people, but i just wont to say in my defence, i tried many many times to use it but the usr interface and interaction is not user-friendly, click here and there then click here and here then once again...

anyhow, sorry about the bitching, am just a bit stressed these days. :(

anyway, Check out this programme

PIXEL (http://www.kanzelsberger.com/)
#### This is a TRAIL version, and not FREEWARE/opensource ####
#### Test it if you wish, it is still in development ######

it's still in development but i cant wait for it to be finished,

[Wally68]

Downloaded and installed it, it's trying to sell itself to me. I detest shareware. Looks OK, but why would I spend $32 on beta software, or $100 for v1.0, when I can get PaintshopPro for $60. What's so hard about the GIMP? I find it easier to use than paintshop.

[abs]

Downloaded and installed it, it's trying to sell itself to me. I detest shareware. Looks OK, but why would I spend $32 on beta software, or $100 for v1.0, when I can get PaintshopPro for $60. What's so hard about the GIMP? I find it easier to use than paintshop.

to be honest, i have always found Paintshop to suck!! ;)

and also, i am talking about it working on linux, am not sure if paintshop works on ubuntu, if does i still pay for Pixel over it.

:D

[kakashi]

how pathetic.*sorry i just felt that
you can't use gimp which is complete and free and has a strong kind user base.
but you recommend a non-opensource non-free program that is not complete, that does not have a great user base or documentation. wow you are amazing.

why don't you try gimp a little. did you just spend 5 mins on it a decide its not a photoshop clone so its not good.

also i am not sure if that thumbnail should be on ubuntu forums.
i like many other read this from school, office and libraries and we sure as hell don't want even a hint a that stuff (do you see the extent of skin showing on that girl) on our screen. could not have taken a screen shot of something better.

*well here ends my ranting that accumulated while reading your post

[jeffjj]

I would recommend reading Grokking the GIMP if you have troubles using GIMP. I found that my troubles with the GIMP was me not understanding how the program worked. I can accomplish anything my co-workers can do with their editors but we take different paths to get there. I read an article that talked about the different image programs and the general conclusion was people like what they are used to...especially with a complicated program like the GIMP or Photoshop.

That said I prefer to support free software, but I have no problem buying software if I need to. What bugs me is when commercial software tries to make you pay a ton. This program walks the line as they do want quite a bit of money although not a ridiculous amount. I would prefer to not pay over $50.00 for any one given program.

[abs]

how pathetic.*sorry i just felt that
you can't use gimp which is complete and free and has a strong kind user base.
but you recommend a non-opensource non-free program that is not complete, that does not have a great user base or documentation. wow you are amazing.

why don't you try gimp a little. did you just spend 5 mins on it a decide its not a photoshop clone so its not good.

also i am not sure if that thumbnail should be on ubuntu forums.
i like many other read this from school, office and libraries and we sure as hell don't want even a hint a that stuff (do you see the extent of skin showing on that girl) on our screen. could not have taken a screen shot of something better.

*well here ends my ranting that accumulated while reading your post

My oh my,

have I struck a cord with your nerves or something, i think your over reacting, I am not recommending it, nor saying people should go and buy it, I just wonted people to check it out, If you love Gimp then good for you, I love my ubuntu and OpenSource as a whole, but i don't like gimp or shall i say its not my thing, FREEDOME of Choice, I am all for opensource. and think the whol comunity is great,

All I did was give my view on it, I do apploigies if it seemed like i am recommending you go out and buy it, I just said " I ".

##Iv just changed the screenshots so you dont get all emotional again, god knows what you might end up doing with a bit of skin showing ;)

If the OpenSource community has alternatives to commercial products then great, but if not then someone is gona fill in the gab. easy as.

Thanks "jeffjj" for a good post and not an emotional one. :D

[kakashi]

please change the second screen shot as well. i wanna look at the interface but i can't since the hot naked (well 99% naked anyways )chick keeps getting in the way.
do you think i can open that in school

##Iv just changed the screenshots so you dont get all emotional again, god knows what you might end up doing with a bit of skin showing

the freaking point is not what you can do with a skin but how badly it reflects on you if that image opens in the library or in school or at work.
also don't even talk about what someone might do with a bit of skin since clearly you weren't DOING anything modifying a girls picture *wink wink

[endersshadow]

While I won't be buying Pixel, and I do like the GIMP as a whole, the fact that the GIMP completely takes over my taskbar has always annoyed me. I like the single window interface of Pixel, and would like to play with it, but I'm a poor college student, and I just don't want to pay for it or have to pay for it in the future.

P.S.-If anybody knows of a way to get the GIMP to be contained all in one window, please let me know. I will be forever grateful :)

[fuscia]

try gimpshop. the interface is set up almost exactly like photoshop. here's a review of it in PC magazine - http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,1759,1864648,00.asp?kc=PCRSS02129TX1K0000530

download - http://www.gimpshop.net/

[endersshadow]

Thanks! It doesn't come in deb, so I'm running alien on it right now...I'm excited :)

Update: Well, my excitement is crushed. The alien installed fine, and when I booted up GIMP, it gave me the gimpshop splash...I was pumped. And then...it looked just like the regular GIMP...and I couldn't find an option to change the interface. Oh well, I'll just live with it.

[Suzan]

Well, you tried to make a Photoshop-clone. For me, as someone who uses PS at work, GIMP is a little bit difficult, indeed. But the GIMP is free, it's OpenSource and it's good.

I think, the only thing you made here is an advertisement for your software. It's not free, not OpenSource - so then it's advertisement. And this forum isn't a place to put advertisement for any software, whatever it's good oder not.

[codejunkie]

why is everyone so upset about pixel not being free/opensource and not being gimp, pixel looks as it would be a good product given some time, i tried it and it seems to have some bugs, but it is a beta app come on people that is what beta products are for bug testing. and i think it's always good to have choice even if it's not foss software you don't see people complaning about buying vmware for linux and that cost's way more than $32 bucks, last time i checked it wasn't open source either. this is just what i've heard tons of people on these and other linux forums asking for an easy to use photoshop alternative. to the poster of this thread abs (http://ubuntuforums.org/member.php?u=26404) i say thanks, for bringing this to other people's attention it might actually convert some more windows users once it goes final.

[Vidar]

Yeah, what's the big fuss? Seems like an ok program for those of us that just can't stand the gimp-way of doing things. Linux needs some commercial products as well, in my opinion, just look at vmware or cedega for a couple of good examples.

The best thing about pixel is that it might actually inspire somebody to start working on an even better OSS-application that goes along the same lines. The problem with the GIMP is that it's become a standard, just like photoshop, only problem is it has no competition that Im aware of in the OSS-community.

[abs]

why is everyone so upset about pixel not being free/opensource and not being gimp, pixel looks as it would be a good product given some time, i tried it and it seems to have some bugs, but it is a beta app come on people that is what beta products are for bug testing. and i think it's always good to have choice even if it's not foss software you don't see people complaning about buying vmware for linux and that cost's way more than $32 bucks, last time i checked it wasn't open source either. this is just what i've heard tons of people on these and other linux forums asking for an easy to use photoshop alternative. to the poster of this thread abs (http://ubuntuforums.org/member.php?u=26404) i say thanks, for bringing this to other people's attention it might actually convert some more windows users once it goes final.


Thank god!! someone agrees with me,:p I just wonted to share this with the community in the hope that people who dont wont to use GIMP see an alternative,

Im "NOT" here to advertise things for people, :confused: am not a spammer nor do I have any connection with this guy who makes it, I thought everyone should at least be aware of it :)


use it don't use it, its your choice, and thats the point, you have a choice.


Thank you "codejunkie" & "Vidar" :D

[kakashi]

Yeah, what's the big fuss? Seems like an ok program for those of us that just can't stand the gimp-way of doing things. Linux needs some commercial products as well, in my opinion, just look at vmware or cedega for a couple of good examples.

The best thing about pixel is that it might actually inspire somebody to start working on an even better OSS-application that goes along the same lines. The problem with the GIMP is that it's become a standard, just like photoshop, only problem is it has no competition that Im aware of in the OSS-community.

yuo said it yourself. it needs competetion is OSS community. is this stupid software oss i ask you?
like i said its a beta (that takes money t use)that could be pwned by gimp (that is free)
spam spam spam

[claydoh]

I actually bought a license for Pixel back in my BeOS day, and recently bought a new one. It has come a very long way stability-wise, and it runs OK in Kubuntu. I think as a cross-platform tool, it is quite nice, but not quite in the Gimp/Photoshop vein, but more along the lines of Paint Shop Pro, version 7 or so, which I also own (and try running in wine when I get bored :) ).

I have and am willing to spend some $$ on a project if I like it, OSS or not.

[Wally68]

Just got home from work and deleted pixel. Don't need it. No, paintshop doesn't work in ubuntu, unless there's something else I don't know. There's lot's I don't. I tried it with wine once, the installer locked up solid. Thanks to fuscia for bringing up gimpshop, I'll be checking that out for my wife. Her paintshop is the only reason I still have windows installed ( I want my 15Gigs back), as well as the primary motivation for even looking at pixel. Like I said, I like the gimp.
Wally

[kakashi]

why is everyone so upset about pixel not being free/opensource and not being gimp, pixel looks as it would be a good product given some time, i tried it and it seems to have some bugs, but it is a beta app come on people that is what beta products are for bug testing. and i think it's always good to have choice even if it's not foss software you don't see people complaning about buying vmware for linux and that cost's way more than $32 bucks, last time i checked it wasn't open source either. this is just what i've heard tons of people on these and other linux forums asking for an easy to use photoshop alternative. to the poster of this thread abs (http://ubuntuforums.org/member.php?u=26404) i say thanks, for bringing this to other people's attention it might actually convert some more windows users once it goes final.

i never bought vmware.
i run qemu.

[abs]

yuo said it yourself. it needs competetion is OSS community. is this stupid software oss i ask you?
like i said its a beta (that takes money t use)that could be pwned by gimp (that is free)
spam spam spam

how Silly!!! ](*,)

[claydoh]

Spam???

You must be kidding! What's the difference in someone saying "Hey! look at this cool app, called Krita (http://www.koffice.org/krita/)!" as opposed to saying "Hey, look at this cool app, called Pixel!" ?

imnsho, the knee-jerk anti-commercial-software-OSS-is-the-only-Good-Way is more like spam than the initial post in this thread!

Pavel Kanzelsberger (http://www.kanzelsberger.com/pixel/?page_id=12) is no MS/Adobe/macromedia behemoth, just a guy who made a choice about his project. And choice is always a Good Thing.

[abs]

nicely put, :D

personally I would like to see Ubuntu being THE platform that people would use to develop there software to.(I mean on a commercial bases as well as OpenSource) more so than it is now. so if or when you buy a game/app it will say compatible with Ubuntu. and if you dont wont to fork out some money, just get the free version or similar

commercial software will have to be extremely competitive and innovative and CHEAP to survive, as there wont be a point in making an app that the FREE version can compensate for.

any-ways, peace out people, I leave u with a message that's encountered too often in these forms thankfully ;) , Ubuntu Rocks, :razz: :D :) ;)

[ngnr]

As a long time photoshop user, i have to say that for me it is not Spam, i need some alternatives for image editing under linux.

Gimp its a good program but i don't like the UI, krita looks promising, but it is in early development , i haven't tried gimpshop and for me pixel is a good competitor.

I'm using open source software but, if i can't find a open source replacement to do my job, why i can't buy a comercial software that runs on my favorite OS ? what's the BIG problem ?

[dbw]

omygod. People just went crazy on this one, didn't they? I just want to reaffirm, abs, that this post was completely reasonable and appropriate for this venue.

1. Open source is about choice. Never (this is a command) never get mad at someone for presenting an option.

2. Certain folks in the open source community always rail when they have to pay for software. If we want corporations to make open source software, or software for our happy little open source operating system, we are going to have to suck it up and pay said software. Period. If you want to tell me that I should just buy the free verion, I might have to refer you to point 1.

[kakashi]

Spam???

You must be kidding! What's the difference in someone saying "Hey! look at this cool app, called Krita (http://www.koffice.org/krita/)!" as opposed to saying "Hey, look at this cool app, called Pixel!" ?

imnsho, the knee-jerk anti-commercial-software-OSS-is-the-only-Good-Way is more like spam than the initial post in this thread!

Pavel Kanzelsberger (http://www.kanzelsberger.com/pixel/?page_id=12) is no MS/Adobe/macromedia behemoth, just a guy who made a choice about his project. And choice is always a Good Thing.


acutally i clasified my own post as spam. it served no purpose.

[BLTicklemonster]

Gosh, get off him. The dude doesn't like something you like, get over it.

I use paintshop pro for quick simple easy stuff that is right there where I can find it, photo shop for finished results, and irfanview to make images look way cleaner (no pixelization) when I enlarge them. Of course having xp in vmware player on ubuntu makes this possible, but I'm getting the hang of gimp.

I do have to say that making text look 3d with shadows and all is a total pain in gimp, so yes, I'll stick to layering them in photo shop until gimp comes up with a better way of doing it. (yes, I have a 40 page tutorial on how to make 3d fonts in gimp sitting on my desk right now. what a joke!)

But that program right there looks way sweet!!! Can't wait til it is released! Great find, thanks a lot!

[BLTicklemonster]

i never bought vmware.
i run qemu.
Buy vmware? I'm using the player:

http://www.hawkwinds.com/tickle/xpoem.jpg

[kakashi]

Buy vmware? I'm using the player:

http://www.hawkwinds.com/tickle/xpoem.jpg

that could mean you either downlaoding (pirated) vmaware or downloaded the image (pirated xp) or went throught the trouble of making one using qemu.

[BLTicklemonster]

using qemu in the initial setup, yes, why? it's not like I use qemu to run xp, so what's your point? I'm just saying that I use VMware player in case anyone thinks they have to pay for vmware to have xp run in ubuntu. And what's with the Sherlock Holmes stuff there?


Okay, the affront has worn off. I'm curious, how well does XP run in qemu?

[jozmak]

Thanks a lot for telling me about this program. It is impressive. I also use the Gimp but I don't like its interface and Pixel seems a real Pearl for me. It is not impossible that at some point the developer will release it as an open source product. Today, I've read a post on their forum where someone brought up this question. The developer didn't dismiss it out of hand, in fact, he said he was thinking about it-a good sign. He is developing and managing the program all by himself, which doesn't leave much time for him to promote it. He started the project in 1997 and their forum has only 58 registered users, which means that not so many people know abut it. I think, this app needs a force behind it and the open source community would be a natural choice for that.

Regards,
J. Mak

[JuanC]

Why Pixel don't have a native version for amd64?

Programs that are 32 bits running in 64 bits , like OpenOffice , crash in my system a lot.

[BLTicklemonster]

Wow, it's pretty danged easy, too

http://www.hawkwinds.com/tickle/pixelrocks.jpg

[kperkins]

Why Pixel don't have a native version for amd64?

Programs that are 32 bits running in 64 bits , like OpenOffice , crash in my system a lot.
I think he's working on a 64 bit version, but remember he's one man, and he's putting out at least 3 other 32 bit versions, by himself.(which is a good argument for open sourcing it--or at least getting some help, of some kind) (and how does Gimp do on amd64s, by the way?)

[abs]

hello everyone,

Thanks for all your posts and i am glad you appreciate the Pixel ;), I also hope one day it will become open-source, however, if not then it would be good if he gets some help as this programme would be such an asset to the Linux Platform, probably will even convert a few more people over to Linux (Ubuntu :D ), sweet... :)

I have told the main and only developer that i will test Pixel and report the bugs,

so hopefully one day it will be stable,

:p

[Darling]

XaraX is now XaraExtreme
Well, it's not exactly a photoshop-like program, but it was my favorite windows graphics program.
And they're porting it to linux and mac (and making it open source!!!)
http://www.xaraxtreme.org/faqs.html
http://www.xaraxtreme.org/download.html

[abs]

good stuff, i never knew they were doing that,

I use to use this programme 4years ago to make logos and loved it, but lost touch now, I am sure once its released on Linux ill get a handle of it again.

.. thanks for sharing it with us :D , i hope to see more programmes like it being released for Linux.

Free on Linux, as in FREE BEER :D

[Minyaliel]

Dunno, personally I prefer GIMP, mainly because I just can't afford a penny on software :P And I've found, it's much easier to produce great graphics for any purpose in the GIMP than the program I used while on Windows, (an admittedly pirated copy of) Paintshop Pro. Does anyone know if Terragen runs on Ubuntu?

[BLTicklemonster]

Terragen? Like UT mapping Terragen, terrain generator?

[towsonu2003]

I also hope one day it will become open-source

oh well, not gonna use when there is OPEN SOURCE alternative. I'm learning to use GIMP and it seems it's not worse than photoshop. gotta learn how to use... just like linux...

I would wait till it's open source (if ever), then help them fix bugs and stuff...

[BLTicklemonster]

XaraX is now XaraExtreme
Well, it's not exactly a photoshop-like program, but it was my favorite windows graphics program.
And they're porting it to linux and mac (and making it open source!!!)
http://www.xaraxtreme.org/faqs.html
http://www.xaraxtreme.org/download.html
Yay, I've got something else that doesn't do anything but sit there!!! Odd.

[Minyaliel]

Terragen? Like UT mapping Terragen, terrain generator? Err... yes? I quite liked fiddling around with it when I had Windows.

[BLTicklemonster]

Cool, have you tried using it in Wine? I'm a mapper/scriptor ( www.utmappers.com ) and am having problems with mapping in linux. I had to make a virtual drive for windows in linux just to use the editor, I wonder if terragen works in wine? But then that would be a pain to have to go back and forth between the two. Sure would be nice if someone could get linux to use stuff like unrealed. I see it's got a version for mac, so I'm sure it wouldn't be hard to get it to linux.

[BLTicklemonster]

http://www.openscenegraph.org/

Check that out. For Linux. If you figure out how to make it work, would you please share this info with this total noob? I keep seeing neat stuff in synaptic (where you can also find and install this under libopenscenegraphc2), and installing them, then I never see the stinking things again. No idea where they go, how to start them, anything....

[etc]

I love how some of you don't use the Gimp because it has a different ui than Photoshop. You are the same people who pledge that you shouldn't complain that Ubuntu isn't Windows.

[abs]

I love how some of you don't use the Gimp because it has a different ui than Photoshop. You are the same people who pledge that you shouldn't complain that Ubuntu isn't Windows.

Love your constructed criticism. Keep it up. :confused:

[kakashi]

Love your constructed criticism. Keep it up. :confused:
he is right though.
i argue a lot over gimp and photo shop with my freinds who only use windows. since they have never trie gimp they can't appreciate it. it takes weeks to learn and years to master a software. you ppl are used to photoshop cuz you spent so much time usng it. try using gimp for half that time and then saying its bad.

[kperkins]

I love Gimp, I use Gimp everyday, I haven't used Photoshop for over a year.
That being said, Photoshop does some things better, and makes some things easier to do than Gimp. (Like animated gifs--I had to download, and install gifsicle so that I could control how many times a gif cycles, because the only choice in Gimp is forever--or slicing images--I haven't found anything for Linux that makes slicing images as easy as in Photoshop, although svgslice for Inkscape looks promising, if I could figure it out. :D)

[Vidar]

The problem is that the gimp don't seem to be developed by people with the slightest idea of how to make a nice working enviroment for a professional artist.

Don't take that to seriously now, it's just the way I see it. I have been thinking about getting in touch with the gimp-developers, but having heard so much about the way the take to critisism and new ideas - I have not even bothered. I keep doing my professional work in photoshop through wine or at work.

[jasplund]

I thought this discussion was about Pixel and not about gimp. I think pixel looks promicing. especially since it works with 16-bit images and color management (well gimp 2.4 will work with CM as well)

[Vidar]

It sure does look promising, I really hope he decides to open up the project. :)

Although, I wouldn't mind to pay him a little something, but I often feel more at ease with donating for software.

[BLTicklemonster]

I've got to agree. Gimp with it's multiple windows (oops closed the wrong one, where'd it go?... never to be seen again because ... well, your average user shouldn't be bothered with something like that ever in the first place. I mean get real) (not to worry, I finally figured it out, it's just that I know other people who cuss when I say gimp) is just a tad bit too wierd. You'd think that they would have at least one time in their life opened up photoshop or paintshop and seen the ease with which they are navigated.

Shame there isn't some kind of "make your own gui" program for linux where you can just point and click in another program to decide what does what and where and make your own customized versions of things. That would totally rock. (first wiseguy who suggest I learn to write code and make one myself gets a ham sandwich in the kiester :razz: )

[fuscia]

wait! why would anyone pay for something when they can get gimp for free, by default even?

[BLTicklemonster]

That's understandable. And though I prefer photoshop and paintshop over gimp for ease of use and simplicity, Gimp is growing on me a little at a time. I would prefer layer manipulation as in photoshop so that I can make 3d logos and such, and everything in the same window would be nice, but Gimp's pretty cool once you get familiar with it's quirky multiple windows and ways to go about things.

[Vidar]

wait! why would anyone pay for something when they can get gimp for free, by default even?

Because you like the software and want to support the developer? Because you think that the software has qualities that overcome the pricetag by far? Because there's no equally good OSS application?

There's a lot of reasons to do this.

[kakashi]

really i use gimp to make animatted gif too. its quite easy

also whats with ppl against the multiple windows. i find it most convenient. instead of like in photoshop where multiple images and open up behind each other and get confusing here i can a make a one image on top and minimize the windows i don;t use.

[zetsurin]

yuo said it yourself. it needs competetion is OSS community. is this stupid software oss i ask you?
like i said its a beta (that takes money t use)that could be pwned by gimp (that is free)
spam spam spam

Kakashi, you are a moron. A 100% open source moron as well, if that makes you feel better. There is NOTHING wrong with a well written, quality closed source app made by a business who requires food, clothing and shelter. The point that needs to really be emphasised to you is that the word FREE in the Linux world comes from FREEDOM, not FREELOADING you tight wad. If you so oppose professional products, turn the other cheeck and let others in this community express their FREEDOM. I appeciate the efforts of the GIMP developers, but like the original poster it's not an app I care to use. Generally you get what you pay for and some people, like myself and the original poster agree that it's perfectly fare and above board to charge and not release the source for your apps.

The only gimp here is you my friend.

[abs]

Because you like the software and want to support the developer? Because you think that the software has qualities that overcome the pricetag by far? Because there's no equally good OSS application?

There's a lot of reasons to do this.
Totally true dude, a lot of people are always asking for a Photoshop alternative or at lease a programme that has a “friendlier” interface, I remember when I first used Photoshop, It took me minutes to figure my way around, and that’s what Pixel does. I am glad this programme has been made at lease now when people ask the all too familiar question on Linux forums, you can say "oh have you tried Pixel" everyone knows GIMP but if they were happy with it then the question of a Photoshop alternative would not have been asked in the begging,

I think GIMP is a great package but it just needs to change the UI or at least have the option too.

its like nokia phones, anyone who picks one up can very easily find there way around, with out having to read a manual. speaking from a design and ergonomics point of view,

Also you cant change the industry’s standard that easily,(not unless the product is truly innovative and people love it i.e. FIREFOX or you are the market leader ;) ), OpenOffice for instance is very similar to MS office in UI, people are all too well accustomed to MS office’s layout.

have you ever noticed how google does things, everything it does is designed to be as SIMPLE as possible, from the google Talk to google's picasa.

anyways, if GIMP dose not address these issues, then someone ells will, i.e. PIXEL. Just to reinforce this, Ubuntu is great because it is SIMPLE :p and easy to use, and the community is well tied with it's developers and ideas are never short, Wi-Fi applications, auto hard drive mounting and rest, its easy of use is what makes it a fantastic OS.

that’s why GIMP needs to start listing to people when they criticise it, especially people from the design world. Whither its about the UI or functions.

another instance is Apple, they work closely with the Graphics users and add new features or improve existing ones through there input.
;)

[Artificial Intelligence]

Depends, depends, depends....It really depends what I want to do. I use both Gimp, photoshop and pixel in linux. Everyone with its own strength.

[abs]

Kakashi, you are a moron. A 100% open source moron as well, if that makes you feel better. There is NOTHING wrong with a well written, quality closed source app made by a business who requires food, clothing and shelter. The point that needs to really be emphasised to you is that the word FREE in the Linux world comes from FREEDOM, not FREELOADING you tight wad. If you so oppose professional products, turn the other cheeck and let others in this community express their FREEDOM. I appeciate the efforts of the GIMP developers, but like the original poster it's not an app I care to use. Generally you get what you pay for and some people, like myself and the original poster agree that it's perfectly fare and above board to charge and not release the source for your apps.

The only gimp here is you my friend.

cheers for putting it so bluntly :D

I hope people make that distinction and understand what the word FREE in Linux means. (should be a wiki entry ;) )

[kperkins]

really i use gimp to make animatted gif too. its quite easy

also whats with ppl against the multiple windows. i find it most convenient. instead of like in photoshop where multiple images and open up behind each other and get confusing here i can a make a one image on top and minimize the windows i don;t use.
I use it for animated gifs also, but as I said, I have to use a different program to adjust the number of cycles for it. (I notice you said nothing about image slicing/mapping. :D)
Multiple windows sucks, because if you have other programs open in the same virtual desktop, then gimp gets lost--you have to click several times on the panel to bring up all the gimp windows, instead of just once. (and don't tell me to just put it on a different workspace--that's a crappy solution--I don't always want to have to switch between workspaces to use a program, and sometimes need it open in the same workplace for various reasons.)

[xmastree]

I was using Gimp recently, and one thing about the multiple windows really annoyed me.
I was using one of the built-in scripts, which opened a window. I clicked on the font select button and nothing happened. It took me a while (and a lot of hair pulling) before I realised that when I clicked that button, a window opened which was smaller than the one I was loking at, and was completely hidden behind it.
That's a real pain unless you're expecting it.

On the other hand, the picture I was working on was long and thin (horizontally) so I was able to arrange the windows I needed below it.

[kakashi]

ok if your so annoyed by gimps multi windows try using gimpshop. i think that is much more like photoshop, even the menus and options are named similar.

i suppose the reason i hated photoshop and did not use it is cuz it just too damn bloody expensive (my whole computer cost $250 so i am not spending more than that for 1 software) for me to use unless i resort to piracy. now however i have become used to gimp so a prefer it (but most ppl won't i know)

for all you ppl who can afford it go ahead use it. no body can convince you otherwise cuz in many ways photoshop is better. however it is constraned by the limits of closed source software, and from what i have read the fillters in gimp blow the filters in photoshop out of the water. also remember that photoshop is at version 7 and gimp at version 2.xxx. give it some devel tiome as well ppl.

also please join the gimp usability project if you find flaws in the interface. the developers are humans like you and me and probably so techy that it does not seem bad to them. HELP them out here
GIMP OpenUsability
(http://openusability.org/projects/gimp/)

[BLTicklemonster]

Let us take note real quick of the fact that just because we don't agree, that doesn't make any of us wrong. It's like when my kids argue because one of them says one thing is better than another, I have to intervene and let them know that it's a matter of preference.

It's perfectly okay for someone to like an interface so much that they will pay money to use it. Likewise, it's perfectly okay for someone to like that interface so much that they would like to see it used by other programs.

As far as all the gimpwindows, look at it like this: They are all inside your screen anyway, right? So then why not have them open in a main gimp window so that if nothing else, they are grouped together? What's the difference, except for at present, as was stated, they can get lost if you have more than one app going, which I did last night doing this to a buddy of mine:

http://www.hawkwinds.com/tickle/morph2.jpg

sloppy, yeah; just having some fun, not trying to win awards, but man, I kept losing my gimpwindows because I had mail and fox and ftp open all at once.

[kperkins]

I was using Gimp recently, and one thing about the multiple windows really annoyed me.
I was using one of the built-in scripts, which opened a window. I clicked on the font select button and nothing happened. It took me a while (and a lot of hair pulling) before I realised that when I clicked that button, a window opened which was smaller than the one I was loking at, and was completely hidden behind it.
That's a real pain unless you're expecting it.

On the other hand, the picture I was working on was long and thin (horizontally) so I was able to arrange the windows I needed below it.
That's a bug, and is taken care of in a newer version, I believe.

[kperkins]

ok if your so annoyed by gimps multi windows try using gimpshop. i think that is much more like photoshop, even the menus and options are named similar.

i suppose the reason i hated photoshop and did not use it is cuz it just too damn bloody expensive (my whole computer cost $250 so i am not spending more than that for 1 software) for me to use unless i resort to piracy. now however i have become used to gimp so a prefer it (but most ppl won't i know)

for all you ppl who can afford it go ahead use it. no body can convince you otherwise cuz in many ways photoshop is better. however it is constraned by the limits of closed source software, and from what i have read the fillters in gimp blow the filters in photoshop out of the water. also remember that photoshop is at version 7 and gimp at version 2.xxx. give it some devel tiome as well ppl.

also please join the gimp usability project if you find flaws in the interface. the developers are humans like you and me and probably so techy that it does not seem bad to them. HELP them out here
GIMP OpenUsability
(http://openusability.org/projects/gimp/)
Actually, I think that gimpshop has the same problem with multiple windows, I think that just the menus are changed.
Anyways, I just downloaded 2.3.5 and installed it. I has an option (under window management) called dock transient windows, and it takes care or the multi window problem of having to click each tab to bring each window up, and color management is there, too, so now I've nothing to bitch about.
Gimp 2.4 is gonna be a Photshop killer! :D

[BLTicklemonster]

I'm trying to install gimpshop, but I have to install darwinports, and to install darwinports, I have to install openssl. I did from synaptic. Darwinports said I didn't. I went and downloaded openssl from their site, and am installing it by hand, then I'll go back and try darwinports again, then gimpshop.

....okay got to have a perl parser, too. nice to have been warned of of all this....

Bam:

configure: error: Package requirements (libart-2.0) were not met.
Consider adjusting the PKG_CONFIG_PATH environment variable if you
installed software in a non-standard prefix.

Alternatively you may set the LIBART_CFLAGS and LIBART_LIBS environment variables
to avoid the need to call pkg-config. See the pkg-config man page for
more details.

I have 2.0.2


Forget it.

See why Linux is still light years from being accepted by average people? It's not Linux, it's the people who write the programs, and don't make an effort to tell people exactly what is to be done to install them. Go ahead and flame me, I know some of you propellor heads are aghast at me for even saying that, "you should learn linux, stupid", yeah, right. I'm not the one writing stuff and forgetting to make it usable. Maybe Arnieboy can teach people how to make installers...

Oh well, it was worth a shot, but personally, my time is not worth this silliness. I already have photoshop, and know well enough how to use it. Why would I care to be bothered to do all of this (with many many many different programs, not just gimpshop, mind you) when I can tweak Windows and make it work fast and stable and not be bothered with all this? Trust me, there's no way I'd put out something and not cover all the bases when writing an installation guide.

My rant for the moment is done.

Now to seriously consider if Ubuntu is really worth having, as I've run into this type of problem way too often. I have several projects I'm working on, and trying to get ubuntu to work the way I want it to is taking up way too much of my time. Surely one day all of this will maybe be fixed, but until then, I'm afraid Ubuntu is just a curiousity better left (as with all linux distros) to people who already know it, or have time to waste learning it.

I lied, I stil had ranting to do.

[MetalMusicAddict]

The rant doesnt match the sig man. "Goodbye Windows, hello freedom!!! :)"

I do understand the rant though. Ive often been driven mad by some of the linux ways. We have to understand though that most apps we love to use arent done by major co. like Adobe.

In the end we have to want to switch. I cant give up yet on my CS2. I paid too much damn money. :)

[BLTicklemonster]

The rant doesnt match the sig man. "Goodbye Windows, hello freedom!!! :)"

I do understand the rant though. Ive often been driven mad by some of the linux ways. We have to understand though that most apps we love to use arent done by major co. like Adobe.

In the end we have to want to switch. I cant give up yet on my CS2. I paid too much damn money. :)
Oh, right, sorry. Changed, and I'll be reclaiming my 80 gig hard drive to use for a spare drive for windows apps. It was fun, but a total waste of time.

[kakashi]

like i said my part in this DISCUSSION was useless since i only defend gimp. i did use photoshop in a course my school offered us so while i have used it i can't say i have used it much or remember much.
have fun using pixel if you like it. or photoshop. i will stay FREE for now.

[nighthawk39]

Adobe Photoshop is hands down the best software available. There is no denying it. I used GIMP for about 6 months before I got into Photoshop and Photoshop makes it loads easier to do simple things. Plus it can do lots more.

[kperkins]

like i said my part in this DISCUSSION was useless since i only defend gimp. i did use photoshop in a course my school offered us so while i have used it i can't say i have used it much or remember much.
have fun using pixel if you like it. or photoshop. i will stay FREE for now.
I'm with you on that. I use Gimp, and Love it, but know that it can be better. I used Photoshop for years, and never even tried to use it with Wine, after I deleted my Windows for good.
But this wasn't a thread about Photoshop, it was a thread about Pixel, and I say hurrah! for Pixel, and the developer who is taking the time to port it to different OSes, even though he isn't opening it up. It is buggy, and it is beta, but it has some features that I'd love to see in Gimp. And I'd pay the $70 (or whatever it was) if I could get it working on my system, without crashing every few minutes.

[jozmak]

I have a feeling that the pixel project goes to nowhere. It is a decade old and still hasn't reached a stable release. Recently, someone asked the developer about pixel tutorials. And it is incredible that after having been in development for so long, pixel had no tutorials. The same thing with documentation. If you add to this the 60 registered users, he could attract during this period, it becomes pretty obvious that the developer hit the plateau. I hope, he realizes this and releases pixel for the open source community soon.
On the Gimp:
I am hoping that at some point adventurous developers come along and fork the program. After all, it needs only a modern interface; but don't expect this from the current developers because they are so stubborn like the donkey of that mythological figure whose name is on the tip of my tongue but I cannot spit out..you know the guy with the hay...
I also follow the Gimp usability project, where everybody is frustrated because of the procrastinating developers. Many usability experts have already resigned from the project and I think, others will follow soon.
So let's hope that xara for Linux will be out soon because, sadly, that will be the only professional quality graphic application available for graphic artist on the Linux platform.

jozmak

[angrykeyboarder]

hello all,

I came across a programmer the other day, and as i cant use GIMP, as it just stresses me out just trying to do simple things, i know my GIMP comments will prompt a reaction from people, but i just wont to say in my defense, i tried many many times to use it but the user interface and interaction is not user-friendly, click here and there then click here and here then once again...

When it comes to image editing software, I'm the village idiot. I run Paint Shop Pro 9, PhotoImpact 10, Photoshop CS10 AND The GIMP on Windows. On Linux I run The GIMP and Krita (http://www.koffice.org/krita/) I'm still trying to adjust to Krita (http://www.koffice.org/krita/)).

Photoshop is overkill and complicated for non-pros. Paint Shop Pro is a nice balance between overly simplified and overly-complex. I've used it for years.

PhotoImpact is much like Paint Shop Pro but it has a few features I like that PSP does not and vice-versa.

The GIMP was difficult for me to pick up at first, but honestly I find myself going to it first when I'm running Windows and naturally the same is true in Linux.

Now, if you want something more Photoshop-like that isn't shareware or commercial, you might take a look at.

http://freshmeat.net/projects/gimpshop/.

I've not tried it myself, but then, I find Photoshop mostly difficult, so I rarely use it anyway. Therefore, I have no need for a Photoshop-like open source application. :-). The plain old GIMP 2.x is just fine.

YMMV

[chinaski]

I did not try Pixel and I won't.

I am pretty satisfied with The Gimp and yes, coming from Photoshop Gimp GUI it's not what you would like to see at first, but now that I am used to it I like it and find floating panels much more useful than single window.

I agree it's a good thing to have choice, and have no problem paying for software, but I am not keen to install non open source apps on my GNU/Linux box.

[factotum218]

meh, use what you want, i float in between gimp, inkscape, and photoshop 7 on my linux box.
Otherwise pretty much just just a text editor for writing markup and style-sheets. And yes, photoshop 7 on ubuntu

[curuxz]

Gimp beats photoshop once you give over the brainpower to learn it. This pixel crap, paying for a beta? wtf get this spam off can the mods step in here, no one is going to pay for something thats worse than the open source alternatives this is just an advert tread!!!

And don't you dare justify your advert by saying look at Vmware, because that is a company that gives a working product that is the best in its feild and worth the money, This advert is for a beta that is inferior and unstable.

Edit: Removed personal remark.

[abs]

Gimp beats photoshop once you give over the brainpower to learn it. This pixel crap, paying for a beta? wtf get this spam off can the mods step in here, no one is going to pay for something thats worse than the open source alternatives this is just an advert tread!!!

And don't you dare justify your advert by saying look at Vmware, because that is a company that gives a working product that is the best in its feild and worth the money, This advert is for a beta that is inferior and unstable. The closed source issue has nothing to do with it, your doing the same as advertising ms paint in a photoshop forum if you get flamed its your own stupid fault!


Edit: Removed personal remark.

[M3ta7h3ad]

lol not sure about wanting pixel. But if I can buy a trial version of that girl..

PHWOAR!!!!! :D

[mlomker]

lol not sure about wanting pixel. But if I can buy a trial version of that girl..


This is a long thread and I don't care to close it over a couple recent posts. Please make posts about the product and not each other.

[BLTicklemonster]

Pixel is pretty cool, psp and photoshop are pretty cool. mspaint is a joke. You'd think that Moft would have at least beefed it up a bit.

Anyway, I like gimp just fine now, I just wish it were all in one window (though if you think about it, your desktop can be that window) with everything where it can be found.

One problem I'm having in gimp is finding levels and saturation and such. Like if I have an image that's too dark or whatever, I have yet to find where to use levels to get it where I want it. I know it has a function like that, because I could swear I saw a reference to it somewhere. Rt click on the image, go to... and bam, can't find anything. Anybody know where that is?

[BLTicklemonster]

On Linux I run The GIMP and Krita (http://www.koffice.org/krita/) I'm still trying to adjust to Krita (http://www.koffice.org/krita/)).



And how would one get krita if one didn't want to install koffice?

[aysiu]

mspaint is a joke. It's not a joke. It's for very simple needs, and it doesn't take as long to load as Photoshop or GIMP.

You'd think that Moft would have at least beefed it up a bit. I agree with this, though. Kolourpaint is a lot like MSPaint but far more sophisticated.

[abs]

This is a long thread and I don't care to close it over a couple recent posts. Please make posts about the product and not each other.


sorry about the comments, ;)

just giving as good as i get. :)

anyhow, back to the main subject. Pixle, gimp, and photoshop showdown, :rolleyes:

[Knomefan]

And how would one get krita if one didn't want to install koffice?
Just a thought, but what about apt-get install krita?

[BLTicklemonster]

Just a thought, but what about apt-get install krita?
smartaleck.

lol thanks, duh.

[kperkins]

Pixel is pretty cool, psp and photoshop are pretty cool. mspaint is a joke. You'd think that Moft would have at least beefed it up a bit.

Anyway, I like gimp just fine now, I just wish it were all in one window (though if you think about it, your desktop can be that window) with everything where it can be found.

One problem I'm having in gimp is finding levels and saturation and such. Like if I have an image that's too dark or whatever, I have yet to find where to use levels to get it where I want it. I know it has a function like that, because I could swear I saw a reference to it somewhere. Rt click on the image, go to... and bam, can't find anything. Anybody know where that is?
Right click the pic (or from the menus at the top) choose Tools > Color Tools > Levels (or Saturation)
In the development branch (as of 2.3.5--which I'm running, as well as 2.2.8 ) colors have their own menu, instead of being buried in the tools menu. (Menus in general are much easier to navigate.)

[kperkins]

I would pay for pixel, if, I could get it to work without crashing every couple of minutes. I has some features that I like better (ie. work better for me) than Gimp's version of the same. But it still has many problems, and is too unusable for a release candidate.

[bobp0303]

...One problem I'm having in gimp is finding levels and saturation and such. Like if I have an image that's too dark or whatever, I have yet to find where to use levels to get it where I want it. I know it has a function like that, because I could swear I saw a reference to it somewhere. Rt click on the image, go to... and bam, can't find anything. Anybody know where that is?

Tools/Color Tools took me right to levels and saturation -- I agree with you about both the learning curve and Gimp being worth it in the end. Of course, in my case a lot of the learning curve is due to this being my first serious image manipulation tool! :)

(I'm using Gimp 2.2.8, in case you can't find the tools where I said I found them)
Bob.

[BLTicklemonster]

Bingo, thanks!

[pelle.k]

please change the second screen shot as well. i wanna look at the interface but i can't since the hot naked (well 99% naked anyways )chick keeps getting in the way.
do you think i can open that in school



the freaking point is not what you can do with a skin but how badly it reflects on you if that image opens in the library or in school or at work.
also don't even talk about what someone might do with a bit of skin since clearly you weren't DOING anything modifying a girls picture *wink wink

HAHAHA! LOL

Get a grip man. I'm sorry but thats just hilarious!
What country do you live in anyway? What school? What universe!? Trust me, if people will think less of you for browsing that second screenshot, man i would seriously consider moving somwhere else...
It's not the "freaking" 60s anymore.

[snowjunkie]

Thanks! It doesn't come in deb, so I'm running alien on it right now...I'm excited :)


Section 2.1 of the following page seems to have a link to a deb for GimpShop.

http://linux.suramya.com/tutorials/Install_GIMPShop/

It's not clear what version of the Gimp code base that GimpShop uses, or if it is updated as Gimp updates become available...

[eriqk]

Anyway, I like gimp just fine now, I just wish it were all in one window (though if you think about it, your desktop can be that window) with everything where it can be found.

Which, I suspect, is kind of the point.
On MacOS, most programs with floating windows behave like this. The desktop is your workspace. The Gnome and Gimp way of working is different in that on MacOS, the menus are always at the top of the screen (I believe KDE has this too, to an extent).
With multiple desktops, which Mac users have to do without, this isn't really a problem. Put Gimp on one desktop, Inkskape on another, the internet stuff on yet another one, &c.

Groet, Erik

[super]

do either of these gimp alternatives have debian packages as yet? i really would like to try them out. especially gimp-shop. :confused:

as for gimp, it's the program that i currently use. but the multiple windows make task switching a complete pain in the ****.

[ardchoille]

GIMP too hard to learn? I love the gimp. It took me a little while to learn it, but it's much better than paying for closed source software and I can't stand shareware.

[super]

do either of these gimp alternatives have debian packages as yet? i really would like to try them out. especially gimp-shop. :confused:

as for gimp, it's the program that i currently use. but the multiple windows make task switching a complete pain in the ****.

EDIT: nevermind, i missed snowjunkie's post.

[PhilOSparta]

Wow, the thread had a lot to say. I have been using the GIMP for well over a year and I don't think there is a replacement for the GIMP for me. Pixel, eat your heart out.;)

As a member of two photo clubs, I try to get other photographers interested in the GIMP as an alternative to PhotoShop(PS). Everyone else is using MS whatever and even though the GIMP has a version for their OSs, they arn't interested.

I believe that most people would "rather fight than switch".:smile:

People have a tendency to stick with what they first learn. Almost every printer, scanner and camera comes with a skinny version of PS.
Purchase a photography mag and see how many PS articles are in it.
Enough said.

Keep on Grokking (The GIMP)!

BTW 64Bit version is great.

[kakashi]

for those ppl who don't like a floating windows concept and would like a more a photoshop like behavior you can try out the latest gimp 2.3.6. it as a docking type feature does allows you to control the windows aat the same time.
here is a .deb for it.
http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=114213

or you can compile it from source

[jeff--]

I still use photoshop on windows because I don't want to have to learn something new, but Imight have to try Pixel, looks more similar to PS than GIMP does.

[Krigl]

please change the second screen shot as well. i wanna look at the interface but i can't since the hot naked (well 99% naked anyways )chick keeps getting in the way.
do you think i can open that in school



the freaking point is not what you can do with a skin but how badly it reflects on you if that image opens in the library or in school or at work.
also don't even talk about what someone might do with a bit of skin since clearly you weren't DOING anything modifying a girls picture *wink wink
Well the girl is obviously typical example of Photoshop Hottie, i.e. you take standard model and modify it - colour of skin, lights'n'shades etc. That's normal with model's pics. It's too late, dunno how the chick looked before putting interface in front of her but it looks she has a swimmingsuit, though minimalistic, so what's going on. At least she's not handcuffed and chained like the girl in my bash. Wait for the screenshot. Anyway, would you complain if he'd modifying guns pics? Would that be better than sexy girl (no offense, but I'm always curious)?
Btw. don't be ashamed in library, people there are used for much harder pornography,e.g. Microsoft logo.

[BLTicklemonster]

Well the girl is obviously typical example of Photoshop Hottie, i.e. you take standard model and modify it - colour of skin, lights'n'shades etc. That's normal with model's pics. It's too late, dunno how the chick looked before putting interface in front of her but it looks she has a swimmingsuit, though minimalistic, so what's going on. At least she's not handcuffed and chained like the girl in my bash. Wait for the screenshot. Anyway, would you complain if he'd modifying guns pics? Would that be better than sexy girl (no offense, but I'm always curious)?
Btw. don't be ashamed in library, people there are used for much harder pornography,e.g. Microsoft logo.


What's with the sarcasm? Dude made a request, honor it. Why do you people think if someone is asking you to do something, that they are trying to censor you? I have my own little office at work, and if I have a picture of a woman who is pretty, but in a freaking overcoat, there's this one dumba** who will, if he sees it, make lude and immature remarks about her loudly, and everyone in the office thinks ole Schroeder is in his office looking at pron. Perhaps the fellow has morons like that around him and doesn't want the attention? Maybe he's in a school environment, and wants to maintain some decorum?

You people really blow my mind they way you are always looking to start some intellectual debate you overhead once, and think you are witty enough to carry it on. Well you aren't so stop it. This post wasn't even close to being something that should have drawn that kind of a response.

Now show me the chick you're talking about!!!

[kakashi]

wow amazing thread. among the last 4 posts only one had anything to contribute and that was ignored for a sarcasmed remark. amazing. well i am off to unsubscirbe from this thread. by all.
last word. it seems most ppl woes are the mutl-windows display that causes you to lose windows. well the newest versions have a solution to that. here a link to a thread with a link to a deb package of gimp 2.3.6. try it and see. enjoy.
edit. here the link itself
http://rapidshare.de/files/10635040/gimp_2.3.6-1_i386.deb.html

[BLTicklemonster]

wow amazing thread. among the last 4 posts only one had anything to contribute and that was ignored for a sarcasmed remark. amazing. well i am off to unsubscirbe from this thread. by all.
last word. it seems most ppl woes are the mutl-windows display that causes you to lose windows. well the newest versions have a solution to that. here a link to a thread with a link to a deb package of gimp 2.3.6. try it and see. enjoy.
edit. here the link itself
http://rapidshare.de/files/10635040/gimp_2.3.6-1_i386.deb.html

I mean to thank you for that, but I got bent out of shape. My bad.

Thanks for the link.

[BLTicklemonster]

for those ppl who don't like a floating windows concept and would like a more a photoshop like behavior you can try out the latest gimp 2.3.6. it as a docking type feature does allows you to control the windows aat the same time.
here is a .deb for it.
http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=114213

or you can compile it from source


bill@ubuntu:~$ sudo dpkg -i gimp_2.3.6-1_i386.deb
(Reading database ... 132262 files and directories currently installed.)
Preparing to replace gimp 2.2.8-2ubuntu6 (using gimp_2.3.6-1_i386.deb) ...
Unpacking replacement gimp ...
dpkg: error processing gimp_2.3.6-1_i386.deb (--install):
trying to overwrite `/usr/lib/gimp/2.0/environ/pygimp.env', which is also in package gimp-python
dpkg-deb: subprocess paste killed by signal (Broken pipe)
Errors were encountered while processing:
gimp_2.3.6-1_i386.deb

What am I doing wrong?

[kakashi]

bill@ubuntu:~$ sudo dpkg -i gimp_2.3.6-1_i386.deb
(Reading database ... 132262 files and directories currently installed.)
Preparing to replace gimp 2.2.8-2ubuntu6 (using gimp_2.3.6-1_i386.deb) ...
Unpacking replacement gimp ...
dpkg: error processing gimp_2.3.6-1_i386.deb (--install):
trying to overwrite `/usr/lib/gimp/2.0/environ/pygimp.env', which is also in package gimp-python
dpkg-deb: subprocess paste killed by signal (Broken pipe)
Errors were encountered while processing:
gimp_2.3.6-1_i386.deb

What am I doing wrong?
well this one gimp package actually contains and replaces all the packages like libgimp,gimp etc.

i had the same erroe as you.
try this
sudo apt-get remove --purge gimp-python
and if that does not work
apt-get remove --purge gimp gimp-data libgimp2.0

that sould do it.
edit
oh yeah and thanks for the support.

[BLTicklemonster]

Yay, I've succeeded in removing Gimp, but I can't install the newer one!

checking for GLIB - version >= 2.8.0...
*** 'pkg-config --modversion glib-2.0' returned 2.8.0, but GLIB (2.8.3)
*** was found! If pkg-config was correct, then it is best
*** to remove the old version of GLib. You may also be able to fix the error
*** by modifying your LD_LIBRARY_PATH enviroment variable, or by editing
*** /etc/ld.so.conf. Make sure you have run ldconfig if that is
*** required on your system.
*** If pkg-config was wrong, set the environment variable PKG_CONFIG_PATH
*** to point to the correct configuration files
no
configure: error: Test for GLIB failed. See the file 'INSTALL' for help.


So I look in install, and I see I need glib, gtk, etc. upgraded.

So I go try glib first. 2.8.5. It installs fine, I try to ldconfig it, but can't for some reason that escapes me, but suffice it to say I don't think it likes me.

So I try to install gtk-2.8.9

checking for GLIB - version >= 2.7.1...
*** 'pkg-config --modversion glib-2.0' returned 2.8.0, but GLIB (2.8.3)
*** was found! If pkg-config was correct, then it is best
*** to remove the old version of GLib. You may also be able to fix the error
*** by modifying your LD_LIBRARY_PATH enviroment variable, or by editing
*** /etc/ld.so.conf. Make sure you have run ldconfig if that is
*** required on your system.
*** If pkg-config was wrong, set the environment variable PKG_CONFIG_PATH
*** to point to the correct configuration files
no
configure: error:
*** GLIB 2.7.1 or better is required. The latest version of
*** GLIB is always available from ftp://ftp.gtk.org/pub/gtk/.


There is no /etc/ld/so.conf, and I don't know about LD_LIBRARY_PATH or the other one...

[BLTicklemonster]

Okay, I have a GNU image manipulation program. (was looking for gimp, koff koff, and was like oh noes)

So what is this docking that I hear about in this very quickly loading little powerhouse I have now?

[kakashi]

Okay, I have a GNU image manipulation program. (was looking for gimp, koff koff, and was like oh noes)

So what is this docking that I hear about in this very quickly loading little powerhouse I have now?
yeah the quick loading is right. it loads faster than gedit does . lol.
file>>preferences>>window manegment. select the options here.

ps. did your glib problem fix??
i checked and i have glib-2.8.3

[BLTicklemonster]

Opps, sorry, Kak, I gave up on it.

[jsmidt]

I prefere gimp.

[tiggs_the_cat]

Hello there,

Well, I find Pixel32 pretty interesting. It has alot of features that you don't find in many apps besides PhotoShop, unfortunately not all of them are fully functional yet, and the brush engine is not the most robust. The GIMP has a nice set of tools, but the lack of non-destructive editing and an alot more flexible brush engine make texture/mattepainting and in general digital painting tedious. Also I'm not able to paint on very large documents in the GIMP without a major slowdown while I can still paint fine in PhotoShop on the same machine. Also one thing that bothers me a bit about the GIMP is that its developers are rather defensive and partly ignorant to any input from users. I find their attitute is the minority, because alot of OSS developers are very interested in user feedback and strife to make their application best usable for everybody (Ubuntu is one of the prime examples).

Anyway, I hope that P32 is able to maintain development, since it has such strong similarities to PhotoShop. If we all recall, Macromedia was sued by Adobe a while back and we see what happened to them.

[abs]

Hello there,

Well, I find Pixel32 pretty interesting. It has alot of features that you don't find in many apps besides PhotoShop, unfortunately not all of them are fully functional yet, and the brush engine is not the most robust. The GIMP has a nice set of tools, but the lack of non-destructive editing and an alot more flexible brush engine make texture/mattepainting and in general digital painting tedious. Also I'm not able to paint on very large documents in the GIMP without a major slowdown while I can still paint fine in PhotoShop on the same machine. Also one thing that bothers me a bit about the GIMP is that its developers are rather defensive and partly ignorant to any input from users. I find their attitute is the minority, because alot of OSS developers are very interested in user feedback and strife to make their application best usable for everybody (Ubuntu is one of the prime examples).

Anyway, I hope that P32 is able to maintain development, since it has such strong similarities to PhotoShop. If we all recall, Macromedia was sued by Adobe a while back and we see what happened to them.
true,

I think GIMP has come along way but it has not changed much, in terms of UI, if there is such a big split between users, then surly that acts as a big indicator to how the app is preforming,

what i hear from users all the time is that GIMP's UI is diffuclt and i have lost the number of times i come across this, developers need to take this on board and make a good App (GIMP) a greate one.

[centered effect]

I have not tried Pixel or Krita yet, but I may in the next few days. Pixel looks like a good Photoshop alternative that *seems* to be much easier to use than the Gimp. Krita looks good with a simplier work flow than the alternatives. It will be good to test them both.

I keep my Windows machine for my design work and game design/editing (Adobe CS suite, Macromedia, Quark, Lightwave, GTKradiant, etc) because I feel there are no Linux replacements that work easily for me (or stable at times).

To add to the Pixel/Gimp/Photoshop/whatever debate. I think any person should use what they are comforable with using. I have been using Photoshop since version 5.5 and I am acustomed to it. Using Gimp as an alternative was hard, but it lacked the work flow that I was used to, and it didn't have alot of web elements that PS and Image Ready have (granted Adobe may have spoiled everyone with that feature it is a good feature to have).

[BLTicklemonster]

To me, the biggest and baddest and best thing they could do to gimp would be to make creating 3d effects with text as simple as it is in photoshop. I have a 37 page tutorial printed out sitting here on my desk on how to make 3d effects with text in gimp.

(then they can make it like gimpshop ;) )

[anacron]

well at least im going to try pixel, looks nice and simple! - I've tryed gimpshop, but I think it's even worse than the original gimp(and im not really saying that gimp is bad), gimpshop isn't working because, changin' the names in menu doesn't change the inteface of program, and keyboard shortcuts doesn't make that either.

[BLTicklemonster]

Woo hoo, found some plugins and using fu script, I can make nice 3d fonts. muahahaha.

Now, last thing before they make it photoshop, lol, why are my images no where near as clean as in photoshop? I can take the same image and open it in the two of them, and the gimp image has no where near the clarity.


no wait, wrong forum. Sorry. (if anyone has suggestions, though, post away. and the k program totally stinks, btw)

[blud]

I came across a programme the other day, and as i cant use GIMP, as it just stresses me out just trying to do simple things, i know my GIMP comments will prompt a reaction from people, but i just wont to say in my defence, i tried many many times to use it but the usr interface and interaction is not user-friendly, click here and there then click here and here then once again...


I'm liking this a substitute for photoshop that isn't GIMP I'm sorry but it really iritates me when I ask people what an alternative to photoshop isa for Linux (I'm only a n00b) and the first reply is always GIMP I've been using GIMP for a little while in Windows and you try to explain to them that you require photoshop as well as GIMP and people don't understand that. What I don't like is the price tag sorry but that's one of the reasons I'm heading towards Linux and Open Source software am sick of paying a fortune for software I've spent more on software than what I have on the 3 computers I have sitting in my house I reckon.

You might like also to try Gimpshop yes it's still GIMP but it has a Photoshop interface have been using this in Windows alot easier than the standard interface I can actually understand it. the website is
www.gimpshop.net sorry not sure how to make it a link
the only downside is I'm not sure that it will work in Ubuntu as it is an RPM application not a DEB.


OK Sorry this post now seems a bit pointless as now having gone back and read the other post it has already been bought up I thought I'd use the spoace to post a reply on what I thought of the behavior and some of the posts in this thread have half it was just critisism for him giving people an alternative to GIMP that wasn't Opensource I believe that sort if thing is not required

PS Gee there was alot of complaing about this thread wasn't there I thought the whole idea of Linux was "Free" as kin freedom of choice not free beer his freedom of choice is to use Pixel ok you rchoice is to use GIMP doesn't mean you have to moputh of at him because he uses a different program than you REMEMBER FREEDOM OF CHOICE use whatever you wish if you want to pay for your software that's fine if you want to use Open Source that's fine to but don't critisise people coz they use a different program to you.

[Delvien]

Looks too much like a photoshop rip off.

[BLTicklemonster]

??? It may be set up to keep everything handy, but I dont' see it looking like a photoshop rip off. But then you might, so there's no arguement there, you say tomato, I say V8. Anyway, the image crispness. As stated, I notice that Gimp isn't near as clean as photoshop. Is there some resolution fix I can make to make my images cleaner? I can take a 800x600 bmp in photoshop and make it a jpg at 100k and it's clear, I take the same image in gimp, and it's not clear. What can I do?

[BLTicklemonster]

With GIMP
http://www.hawkwinds.com/tickle/gimp1.jpg

With PHOTOSHOP
http://www.hawkwinds.com/tickle/pshop1.jpg

(Yeah, we lost. Prolly shoulda picked one where we won)

[abs]

I'm liking this a substitute for photoshop that isn't GIMP I'm sorry but it really iritates me when I ask people what an alternative to photoshop isa for Linux (I'm only a n00b) and the first reply is always GIMP I've been using GIMP for a little while in Windows and you try to explain to them that you require photoshop as well as GIMP and people don't understand that. What I don't like is the price tag sorry but that's one of the reasons I'm heading towards Linux and Open Source software am sick of paying a fortune for software I've spent more on software than what I have on the 3 computers I have sitting in my house I reckon.

You might like also to try Gimpshop yes it's still GIMP but it has a Photoshop interface have been using this in Windows alot easier than the standard interface I can actually understand it. the website is
www.gimpshop.net sorry not sure how to make it a link
the only downside is I'm not sure that it will work in Ubuntu as it is an RPM application not a DEB.


OK Sorry this post now seems a bit pointless as now having gone back and read the other post it has already been bought up I thought I'd use the spoace to post a reply on what I thought of the behavior and some of the posts in this thread have half it was just critisism for him giving people an alternative to GIMP that wasn't Opensource I believe that sort if thing is not required

PS Gee there was alot of complaing about this thread wasn't there I thought the whole idea of Linux was "Free" as kin freedom of choice not free beer his freedom of choice is to use Pixel ok you rchoice is to use GIMP doesn't mean you have to moputh of at him because he uses a different program than you REMEMBER FREEDOM OF CHOICE use whatever you wish if you want to pay for your software that's fine if you want to use Open Source that's fine to but don't critisise people coz they use a different program to you.

I never relised that this post was gona get soo much attention, but hay, its all good, its freedom, freedom to post, freedom to review, question and rant if you need to, its FREEDOM. FREEDOM OF CHOICE.... \\:D/

I feel like brave-heart now ;)

[abs]

With GIMP
http://www.hawkwinds.com/tickle/gimp1.jpg

With PHOTOSHOP
http://www.hawkwinds.com/tickle/pshop1.jpg

(Yeah, we lost. Prolly shoulda picked one where we won)


Photoshop is a clear winner in this INSTANCE, with these comparisons, and its not just subtle difference, its too clear, :) :rolleyes:

[dudus]

I came across a programme the other day, and as i cant use GIMP, as it just stresses me out just trying to do simple things, i know my GIMP comments will prompt a reaction from people, but i just wont to say in my defence, i tried many many times to use it but the usr interface and interaction is not user-friendly, click here and there then click here and here then once again...


The new version of the gimp that will be in Dapper has designed it's menus as everyone complains about it.

The multi-window mode gimp works is very discussed either. And the developers seem to think it's better.

There is a GIMP verssion called GIMPshop (http://www.gimpshop.net/) that is the GIMP moded to look like Photoshop. The menus are in the same place and the documents share the same window. As you see it's no way an issue to trash the gimp.

[Delvien]

I tried out the well, trial, and im suprised on the performance. Its very fast, very intuative. But the 100 dollar price tag is a downer...

[BLTicklemonster]

The new version of the gimp that will be in Dapper has designed it's menus as everyone complains about it.

The multi-window mode gimp works is very discussed either. And the developers seem to think it's better.

There is a GIMP verssion called GIMPshop (http://www.gimpshop.net/) that is the GIMP moded to look like Photoshop. The menus are in the same place and the documents share the same window. As you see it's no way an issue to trash the gimp.
I had a friend named Chris Morrow from Sao Paulo, we called him Julio, back n the 80s in Atlanta. He was an art student. Great guy. I wonder what ever became of him... I had a hard time following his english, too. So what you are saying is that the gimp in dapper is redesigned, and is like the gimpshop? That would be nice! Can't wait to get dapper when it's ready for prime time! (don't worry, I have a hard time understanding everybody, you're doing okay)

[abs]

The new version of the gimp that will be in Dapper has designed it's menus as everyone complains about it.

The multi-window mode gimp works is very discussed either. And the developers seem to think it's better.

There is a GIMP verssion called GIMPshop (http://www.gimpshop.net/) that is the GIMP moded to look like Photoshop. The menus are in the same place and the documents share the same window. As you see it's no way an issue to trash the gimp.

not quite sure what you mean dude, if your saying that dapper comes with something similor to GIMPshop then great, if not I think they need to strip out all the little icons in the menus in GIMP as it just confuses me, and just make a version of GIMP called GIMPTU, or something like that, anyways has veryone checked out the novel survy about what people ownt ported over to linux, and Photoshop seems to be at the top. :D

[kaaredyret]

Fanatics usually only have one answer to any complex question. How can a little freedom of choice annoy so many, and how can they believe that the answer to their need is the answer to anyones need. Scary. Fanatism.

Some guys REALLY need a girlfriend.

[Delvien]

After playing around with Pixel ive found that its just a nicer knock off to Photoshop, but sitll performs well, has some nice features, but not worth paying for... Specially since Gimp is free. and adobe PS is free *cough *cough if you are that kind of user *cough *cough.

[BLTicklemonster]

After playing around with Pixel ive found that its just a nicer knock off to Photoshop, but sitll performs well, has some nice features, but not worth paying for... Specially since Gimp is free. and adobe PS is free *cough *cough if you are that kind of user *cough *cough.
I have CS, which one do you have? lol

[dudus]

I had a friend named Chris Morrow from Sao Paulo, we called him Julio, back n the 80s in Atlanta. He was an art student. Great guy. I wonder what ever became of him... I had a hard time following his english, too. So what you are saying is that the gimp in dapper is redesigned, and is like the gimpshop? That would be nice! Can't wait to get dapper when it's ready for prime time! (don't worry, I have a hard time understanding everybody, you're doing okay)

Ok I didn't make myself clear.

What I meant is that the new version of gimp in dapper will have menu structure improved.

And that there is another paralel version of gimp alled gimpshop that has the menus identical to photoshop.

That's 2 redesigns.... Ok it's sounds yet more confusing now.:-k

[BLTicklemonster]

No, that's better. The thing about english is, the less sense it makes, the more sense you make. lol

Anyway, thanks for the input. I'm upgrading to dapper now. (not because of this post, just thought I'd throw that in)

[dudus]

No, that's better. The thing about english is, the less sense it makes, the more sense you make. lol

Anyway, thanks for the input. I'm upgrading to dapper now. (not because of this post, just thought I'd throw that in)

Believe it or not I did an english course a couple of year ago. Useless thing.

I'm very excited about desit-upgrading either. But I'll try to hold myself till the beta release in march.

Good luck

[abs]

Fanatics usually only have one answer to any complex question. How can a little freedom of choice annoy so many, and how can they believe that the answer to their need is the answer to anyones need. Scary. Fanatism.

Some guys REALLY need a girlfriend.

true said, How things have spiralled out of control ;) , its all good, anyways at least now, people looking for Photoshop alternative can find this forum and see there some light at the end of the tunnel.

you know, if Adobe just port there amazing packages over to Linux then none of these arguments would even be necessary. ;)

or we could just dream of flying cows, :mrgreen:

[dudus]

true said, How things have spiralled out of control ;) , its all good, anyways at least now, people looking for Photoshop alternative can find this forum and see there some light at the end of the tunnel.

you know, if Adobe just port there amazing packages over to Linux then none of these arguments would even be necessary. ;)

or we could just dream of flying cows, :mrgreen:

Photoshop will allways be proprietary, even if they port it to linux. This is a plus for gimp (or PIXEL whatever). Only a designer with especific needs would rather buy the expenssive photoshop than use Gimp.

For most people an image processor like gimp is far beyond they needs.

I'd say that I miss Ilustrator more than I miss Photoshop. But that's just because Inkscape is still an early beta. With some time and some GPL magic Inkscape will do the jop as Gimp does today.

[abs]

Photoshop will allways be proprietary, even if they port it to linux. This is a plus for gimp (or PIXEL whatever). Only a designer with especific needs would rather buy the expenssive photoshop than use Gimp.

For most people an image processor like gimp is far beyond they needs.

I'd say that I miss Ilustrator more than I miss Photoshop. But that's just because Inkscape is still an early beta. With some time and some GPL magic Inkscape will do the jop as Gimp does today.

I know photoshop will stay proprietary, I dont mean that Adobe should make photoshop Opensource, that would be crazy, If GIMP is such an over kill for most users then they should make a cut down version or at least one that can be easly used by first time users,

I bet that if you stuck a new user at computer with GIMP and one with Photoshop/Paintshop they will pick up photoshop quicker, It's not the functions of each programe all though GIMP is limited on sum, I am and have always been talking about the uesr interface.

anyways, I think i should :-# cos I keep on talking ;)

[BLTicklemonster]

I'm headed to take classes in adobe photoshop cs starting tonight. I wonder if I'll learn anything useful?

[dudus]

I bet that if you stuck a new user at computer with GIMP and one with Photoshop/Paintshop they will pick up photoshop quicker, It's not the functions of each programe all though GIMP is limited on sum, I am and have always been talking about the uesr interface.

Have you tried gimpshop (http://www.gimpshop.net/)?

It's a gimp interface alternative that tries to mimic photoshop.
It would be easier to use gimpshop than gimp for the photoshopers.

check some screenshots here (http://plasticbugs.com/?p=241).

I disagree with you when it comes to new users. I find both interfaces intersting. They have different aproaches. Hard to say witch one is better.

anyways, I think i should :-# cos I keep on talking ;)
Talking is good!:)

[alfonz]

abs, Thanks for the heads up.

I've been a photoshop user for years and some of you might agree that going from PS to Gimp is a bit confusing. I have no dout in my mind that Gimp is as good as everyone says, however I have no problem paying $30-40 for software that has the same display and has the potential to be as feature full as PS. Its a matter of personal choice.

Besides $30-40 vs. $300 windows + $600 Adobe PS hmmmm

I'll take option #1 to go please :D

Cheers!

Gimp Shop does look interesting, I think I'll try it out

[alfonz]

I'm headed to take classes in adobe photoshop cs starting tonight. I wonder if I'll learn anything useful?

I've gone through those, it depends on your instructor and what he/she wants to teach you but its usualy the basics.

Best way is by trial and error and see what you can come up with using what is available to you. You'd be suprized what you can come up with.

[JuanC]

I think he's working on a 64 bit version, but remember he's one man, and he's putting out at least 3 other 32 bit versions, by himself.(which is a good argument for open sourcing it--or at least getting some help, of some kind) (and how does Gimp do on amd64s, by the way?)

Any update about an Amd64 native version of Pixel?

[abs]

abs, Thanks for the heads up.

I've been a photoshop user for years and some of you might agree that going from PS to Gimp is a bit confusing. I have no dout in my mind that Gimp is as good as everyone says, however I have no problem paying $30-40 for software that has the same display and has the potential to be as feature full as PS. Its a matter of personal choice.

Besides $30-40 vs. $300 windows + $600 Adobe PS hmmmm

I'll take option #1 to go please :D

Cheers!

Gimp Shop does look interesting, I think I'll try it out


no probs, and in comparison 30$-40$ seems a hell of a lot better, ;)
maybe adobe will port photoshop over after Novell's survy, although thats a long shot.

one day ay..... I would'nt hold my breath :(.....

[Koba]

yo, i personally want to thank you for introducing me to this program. this is very talented, and is great for me to use my graphics on Ubuntu. when this thread was made, there was no "this is better than Gimp, nananana!", all he was doing was showing a good peice of work to the community of people who like the way photoshop is layed out. I could care less which is "better" photoshop or gimp, they are both very different, they both have great capabilities, and they both have thier share of users. fighting over which is better is very childish, and i feel that half this thread was totally off topic. so i would like to thank you again for this peice of software, and please, go easy on the flaming.

[Sirin]

#### This is a TRAIL version, and not FREEWARE/opensource ####

So... how do you work a "trail version"? :confused:

[abs]

So... how do you work a "trail version"? :confused:

hay,


just download Pixel for the website and use it, its a DEMO really, i dont think its limited, its just cool to try. I have the full version, waiting for a STABLE release :-k

[buggzero]

im a true and blue photoshop fan, infact that and some games are holding me back from deleting my winxp install.

The gimp so far, ive found usable, i havent done anything in as much detail and elaboration as i have in photoshop, but for a free open source software, its worked for me.

Im particularly interested in gimp shop, because all the features are there, its just like most people said, the user interface is like running naked through cornfield backwards.

I have to admit, Pixel looks awsome, and it does excite me to see that this could boost up the improvement to design programs. But it says 30 day trial and watermarks? bogus to me. Ill be keeping an eye on it, but linux is suppost to be consumer liberation, not the monopoly man trying to sneak through the back door.

[GreySim]

So... how do you work a "trail version"? :confused:

:-k

It only comes with tools that would be useful for editing nature pics.

:D

[Swiss]

also i am not sure if that thumbnail should be on ubuntu forums.
i like many other read this from school, office and libraries and we sure as hell don't want even a hint a that stuff (do you see the extent of skin showing on that girl) on our screen. could not have taken a screen shot of something better.



Hear hear!

[IYY]

I read once about a mod that converts Gimp to be more like photoshop. Basically, just makes it all in one window, and rearranges the menus. Have you tried it?

[abs]

Hear hear!


I thought that as well. :twisted: I guess that dude should go around ubuntu forums with closed eyes, one way to avoid pictures.

[xrado]

does anyone have GIMP development release deb packages. i tryed 2.3.6 on slackware and i can tell you its much user frendly and very stable. i cant work with 2.2.10 any more. There is new 2.3.7 version out now.

[angrykeyboarder]

does anyone have GIMP development release deb packages. i tryed 2.3.6 on slackware and i can tell you its much user frendly and very stable. i cant work with 2.2.10 any more. There is new 2.3.7 version out now.

Welll you can either complie from source:

http://www.gimp.org/downloads/#mirrors

Or you might try Debian's Experimental Packages.

http://packages.debian.org/experimental/graphics/gimp

Try adding the Debian experimental distro to your sources.list file and then see if you can upgrade The GIMP without creating a mess.

deb http://DEBIAN-MIRROR/debian experimental main

But don't blame me if your hard drive melts, your power supply shorts out and/or your monitor explodes, starting a huge fire that burns down your neighborhood.

[kperkins]

I have gimp 2.3.6 working on my computer, with no problems. Loving it more than the 2.2 series. The interface is getting better and better.

[xrado]

i added

deb http://http.us.debian.org/debian experimental main

to my source.list, but after sudo apt-get update i get :

W: GPG error: http://http.us.debian.org experimental Release: The following signatures couldn't be verified because the public key is not available: NO_PUBKEY 010908312D230C5F
W: You may want to run apt-get update to correct these problems

...where do i get this key, and where do i put it?

[hap0]

I just read through every post, and as yet have not seen the following points mentioned. So I will offer them in response to why I just found $32 dollars was not too much to spend toward Pixel:

Pixel supports CMYK, GIMP does not (any scribus using printer/publishers out there?).
Photoshop experience is often listed as desirable by prospective employers.
Pixel offers a close approximation to Photoshop experience (inexpensively) regardless of operating system.
I tried Gimpshop early on and found it was an unsustainable one-time hack, which it will always remain unless the modification is ported into a localisation option for current GIMP development.

Cheers.

[kaaredyret]

Some people like the GIMP, the open source community's answer to Adobe Photoshop, but a recent survey by Novell showed that Photoshop is one of the top three applications Linux users want ported to their platform, which indicates the GIMP may not be meeting the needs of Linux users. Designers' efforts to improve the GIMP have failed in the past. Maybe now is the time for a more radical approach.

http://software.newsforge.com/article.pl?sid=06/03/07/1813207

[Jengu]

The GIMP's UI sucks for new users. I don't want to have to use virtual desktops. and I don't want have to memorize key presses to draw a line.

That people are considering costly alternatives over a piece of free software says something about the usability of the latter...

KDE has Krita, but I haven't tried it. Maybe give it a shot.

[mrgnash]

Bah. All Gimp requires is a little persistence and adaptability. As a long-time Photoshop user, it took me about a week to get fully acclimated to Gimp's way of doing things -- thanks in large part to Grokking the Gimp and Gimptalk.com

I'm not a professional designer or anything, but I think I can crank out pretty ok graphics and have no trouble using Gimp exclusively to do so. Some of its features are actually more intuitive than Photoshop, e.g: adjusting values such as brightness/contrast and hue/saturation per layer (Gimp has a seperate menu item for 'image' and 'layer') is more obvious than Photoshop, which can be a little confusing in this regard.

Of course, if you need to do something really uber, then Photoshop may be a requisite application. In that case, one could probably justify the price tag for the full suite; especially when you could claim the cost back on tax :) But I'm betting few of us would be in that boat. The reality is that most people who parrot on about Photoshop being the only program that meets their needs, have obtained it illegally. Gimp is truly free and I think it's a pretty exceptional program given that fact.

[jeremy]

I don't know if I missed something, but I deleted pixel after half an hour, I couldn't take a programme with such a pathetic jpg optimization interface seriously.

[Single]

I think sooner or later, Krita will be the true opensource replacement of Photoshop.

[dada1958]

I use Photoshop 7 on my Mac, it's a legal license. I use the Gimp on my Ubuntu PC and I like the Gimp unless it lacks CMYK support but when you use it with Scribus that shouldn't be that big problem because Scribus has its own CMYK conversion.
What I really miss in the Gimp are actions.

[colsinc]

I helped with making the school yearbook for a number of years, and we used Photoshop and PageMaker (later InDesign)-all commercial Adobe apps, running on OS X. Since leaving school, I've done a couple of similar jobs (for a different school). I used the GIMP and Scribus, and didn't have too many troubles with the 'migration'.

I do think commercial apps for linux are in general a good thing though - I'm a pov uni student so I doubt I would buy any - but for many businesses, Linux is out of the question as it won't run certain 'niche' commercial apps.

closed source is not always the enemy. Putting profits above the ideal of making good technology, vendor lock-in tactics, are. That said, the open source ideology is truly magnificent.

thanks for telling us about it abs!

[abs]

I can only compair Krita to windows Native BMP editor, It looks like it would need a few years yet,

anyhow, I cant belive that my Post has made it into the news, Hora, I am a little star struck ;)

I am happy that we, the comunity have raised there voice over a subject that everyone is passionate about. Image editting on linux. Gimp, Photoshop, pixel , which ever your prefrence maybe, It has showed that there is alot of disatisfaction with varios aspects. this disatisfaction should been seen as FEEDBACK, A programe should not take 1 week to learn. it should be easy to pick-up, has an easy to follow UI. stright forward functions.

if everyone thinks photoshop is great, ask your self why. from the begging photoshop was easy to use, that said, one must not ignor any radical ideas.

I would like to see GIMP take bold and innovative steps and change its UI, it dose not have to be like photoshop, it needs to be easy to use. from the very first time you use it.

GIMP celebrated 10years not long ago. lets make sure the next few years bring about change and not more of the same old 10years.


my nagging is over..... for now :)

[kperkins]

The problem with Gimp and it's UI is that the developers don't seem to care what the users have to say about it. Users have been bitching about the UI since, well, since just about when it started being developed, I think, and the devlopers keep insisting that their way is best. The 2.3.x series has addressed some of these issues (as well as CMYK support), but not all, or even most of them (the menus are definitely better, andtransient dock works ok, but not eactly like it should) . At this point, I think it would take a massive rewrite of Gimp to do something about the UI (maybe not, I've never really looked at the source code to see exactly what's going on)

[abs]

The problem with Gimp and it's UI is that the developers don't seem to care what the users have to say about it. Users have been bitching about the UI since, well, since just about when it started being developed, I think, and the devlopers keep insisting that their way is best. The 2.3.x series has addressed some of these issues (as well as CMYK support), but not all, or even most of them (the menus are definitely better, andtransient dock works ok, but not eactly like it should) . At this point, I think it would take a massive rewrite of Gimp to do something about the UI (maybe not, I've never really looked at the source code to see exactly what's going on)
it seems there is a general feeling that developers are, like you say not listening, I would find it hard if i was a developer, having a user bitching about the code i wrote, however, surly that this would be a big sign that I need to do things differently, Feedback is the key in all of this, developers need to interpret this feedback in the right way and act accordantly. its always been that way, the users command the market, well at least in the software world.

Great work by the GIMP developers, if only user feedback played a bigger part of it all.

never mind ay, if Photoshop does make the transition over to Linux, then this argument is setteld, as people would just get Photoshop, legal or *legal.



---

[regeya]

Bah. All Gimp requires is a little persistence and adaptability.

So how's that GIMP LAB-space working for you?

[mrgnash]

So how's that GIMP LAB-space working for you?

Never use it. Why would I? :confused:

[pizzach]

Meh. Gimp and Photoshop both have their learning pitfalls. I think more of the problems come from when you realize....I have to learn another huge image editing program!?!

I don't know what all you people mean by photoshop being single mode window. On my mac it has a bunch of windows. But they are a heck of a lot smarter than the GIMP ones. If you click another program they dissappear. Also, they never get hidden below other windows.

[takayuki]

hello all,

i've been a mac user since os 7.5.3, way back in the dark ages of computing ('97). i've used photoshop for nearly as long. i create websites part time to supplement my income.

the other day a pc fell into my lap and suddenly i'm staring at the ubuntu interface and i like it. i really like this os. the more i use it and learn about it, the more i want to take my whole website mysql, php, photshop, text-wrangler, mac os-based web development process and move it to ubuntu.

here's my, "can i make the move to ubuntu" thought process.

text editor: i can live without my favorite text editor, text wrangler, even though blue fish, imho, isn't as good. it's good enough.

mysql and php: install on ubuntu is easier than os x.

web site testing: better on ubuntu. i can install cross-over office and check my pages on ie6 for wintel no problems.

image editing: on the mac i use photoshop 7. image editing is my main obstacle to moving full-time to ubuntu. I tested gimpshop and was impressed at the speed, etc., but i kept bumping into limitations, having to do workarounds to get things done. a simple workaround for adding a drop shadow to text is fine if you have all the time in the world, but i don't. i have to get it done quickly and move on to the next task.

(side note on gimpshop's interface. it's fine as far as i'm concerned. in the mac version of photoshop all the pallettes are individual windows. i like it that way. it's all i've ever known, so it's a non-issue.)

enter pixel. it loads fast, has a great interface. loved the speed. it ain't bloated! i could use it instantly without having to re-think things, or to figure out how to do things. i just went into photoshop mode and started playing with it and fairly easily could get some things done.

*but* it is a bit buggy, especially dealing with text. i don't think pixel is ready for prime-time yet. i'm going to register, not b/c i'm going to put it to immediate use, but b/c i want pixel to succeed. think of all the new ubuntu/linux users who could come on board b/c suddenly there wasn't the "lack of photoshop" issue stopping them.

this isn't about open source, or everything should be free, it's about making linux a viable option for everyone.

takayuki

[mrgnash]

Yeah I don't know what the big deal is about having a single window interface. Back when I was using XP, I often wished that Photoshop had a multi-window interface similar to Gimp. I'm the sorta guy that likes to have multiple application windows present on the desktop all at once so I can easily switch/share data between them.

[kperkins]

hello all,

i've been a mac user since os 7.5.3, way back in the dark ages of computing ('97). i've used photoshop for nearly as long. i create websites part time to supplement my income.

the other day a pc fell into my lap and suddenly i'm staring at the ubuntu interface and i like it. i really like this os. the more i use it and learn about it, the more i want to take my whole website mysql, php, photshop, text-wrangler, mac os-based web development process and move it to ubuntu.

here's my, "can i make the move to ubuntu" thought process.

text editor: i can live without my favorite text editor, text wrangler, even though blue fish, imho, isn't as good. it's good enough.


Just FYI Bluefish isn't really a "text" editor per-se, it's a code editor. I'm sure you use textwrangler for coding, and I think that you'll find Bluefish is on par with it in that area. (If not there are many other code editors out there--Quanta for one.) For text editing you have gedit, abiword, and OOo--it's all about choice, and what feels right to you.


<snip>
image editing: on the mac i use photoshop 7. image editing is my main obstacle to moving full-time to ubuntu. I tested gimpshop and was impressed at the speed, etc., but i kept bumping into limitations, having to do workarounds to get things done. a simple workaround for adding a drop shadow to text is fine if you have all the time in the world, but i don't. i have to get it done quickly and move on to the next task.

(side note on gimpshop's interface. it's fine as far as i'm concerned. in the mac version of photoshop all the pallettes are individual windows. i like it that way. it's all i've ever known, so it's a non-issue.)


I don't have a problem with multiple windows, my problem is with how they act. If the Gimp devs want to keep the multi-window interface, they need it to work like it does on the Mac, so that all it's windows work together. (In the dev version--2.3.x--they have transient dock, which works, but not quite perfectly yet. So that's a step in that direction. Also, menus are much better , and more intuitive.)
As far as drop shadows, you don't need a work around. In the 2.2.x series got to Script-Fu > Shadow > Drop-Shadow in 2.3.x Filters > Light and Shadow > Drop-shadow--couldn't be simpler.

enter pixel. it loads fast, has a great interface. loved the speed. it ain't bloated! i could use it instantly without having to re-think things, or to figure out how to do things. i just went into photoshop mode and started playing with it and fairly easily could get some things done.

*but* it is a bit buggy, especially dealing with text. i don't think pixel is ready for prime-time yet. i'm going to register, not b/c i'm going to put it to immediate use, but b/c i want pixel to succeed. think of all the new ubuntu/linux users who could come on board b/c suddenly there wasn't the "lack of photoshop" issue stopping them.

this isn't about open source, or everything should be free, it's about making linux a viable option for everyone.

takayuki
Pixel may become a viable option, we'll see--the developer's been working on it for 7 years (if I remember right) and hasn't hit a 1.0 release, and it's still buggy as hell. I'd pay his price for it, if I could use it,right nowI can't.

[jasplund]

It would be great if someone could make repository files and directories and they will be hosted by Pavel/PIXEL

see this thread: http://www.kanzelsberger.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=239

[stoffe]

What a buggy piece of crap. And it sure has some strange ideas of workflow (or maybe that is just more bugs). Don't bother folks, check back in another 7 years or so, then it might be something...

[claydoh]

What a buggy piece of crap. And it sure has some strange ideas of workflow (or maybe that is just more bugs). Don't bother folks, check back in another 7 years or so, then it might be something...

Buggy? I don't find it so (but as a paying customer I have acces to the newest builds), it is less buggy for me than Krita has been recently. Krita being Gimp's only real competition atm. But to each his own....

[curtis1005]

Gimp is powerful, but the hard to use.

I hate the resize dialog.Default tool panel takes up too many screen space, also tools are lined up in 4 column, it is hard to look for a tool button. I have to assign hotkey to help myself quickly switch between different tools

hopefully, gimp's interface will soon be improved in future.

[unoobu]

how pathetic.

Holy crap.

[unoobu]

I love how some of you don't use the Gimp because it has a different ui than Photoshop. You are the same people who pledge that you shouldn't complain that Ubuntu isn't Windows.

Sorry, but that is bu******. GIMP can not do everything that Photoshop can, and the fact that the toolbars open seperate windows is ILLOGICAL! For a true graphic designer, GIMP is not an option.

However, Xara is something I am going to look into. I hope it can do the nifty layer shading and decoration techniques that Photoshop could... I used that more than anything for graphic design...

[commodore]

A program is just a tool. An artist makes the artwork, not the tool. A good artist can make a good piece of work with the worst app ever. Unoobu this means you can't do graphic design. You are just closed to Photoshop and you let it do your work.

[niviche]

An artist makes the artwork, not the tool.

But you can't hammer a nail with a screwdriver. Have you ever tried to do some professional print work with Gimp?

[abs]

all.

keep your eye out for Xara Lx (http://www.xaraxtreme.org/), its not photoshop but it is pritty damn good, and very quick at vector work, give it some time to mature (u can download it as it is now close to beeing fully functional) then the opensource community would gain a fantastic application.


--

[PingunZ]

I use Photoshop in windows and gimp in linux.
I mostly use photoshop when I am following howto's. Or making icons etc ...
I also suck in gimp ;) I've tried it for a couple of hours, it got lots of good things but I'm not made for it ;)

Edit: Pixel doesn't even work so can't compare -_-

Grtz PingunZ

[alphaomega]

I find that anything you have to pay for in Linux doesn't really meet expectations. Anyone with a bit of patience can manipulate what they need to in inkscape of gimp to get the job done. After suffering with Xandros and Mandrake trying to make me pay for open source, I am very distant when someone wants me to pay for software for Linux.

[OneSeventeen]

Sorry to drudge up an old thread.... I have tried pixel and I like the features (supporting vector filters is a neccessity for me, as I always make mistakes, change my mind, etc, and re-doing 10 steps just so I can chang ethe shape of something that has a bevel and a shadow just isn't my cup of tea.)

I prefer Photoshop CS atm, but for vector art I use Inkscape near exclusively. In fact, my website, woventhorns.com (http://www.woventhorns.com) was created all in linux, and the logo for my university's health fair (http://healthfair.unm.edu) was made in linux using inkscape. But when it comes to the shiny graphics on my widgets, I had to go back to photoshop, since I'm not too good with the gimp scripts.

I mainly use gimp for photo editing, resizing, rotating, and cropping, but not much else. I chalk this up to laziness on my part, and don't fault the gimp developers, but I definitely think they should fork the gimp and create a version that targets the lazy. I feel like I can do anything in the gimp that I can in PS, but it will probably take me 20 to 30 times longer, depending on the complexity.

(I still don't care for pixel though, because it never seems to work properly for me, even on windows)

[Richard, The One, The Onl]

I would recommend reading Grokking the GIMP if you have troubles using GIMP. I found that my troubles with the GIMP was me not understanding how the program worked. I can accomplish anything my co-workers can do with their editors but we take different paths to get there. I read an article that talked about the different image programs and the general conclusion was people like what they are used to...especially with a complicated program like the GIMP or Photoshop.

That said I prefer to support free software, but I have no problem buying software if I need to. What bugs me is when commercial software tries to make you pay a ton. This program walks the line as they do want quite a bit of money although not a ridiculous amount. I would prefer to not pay over $50.00 for any one given program.
I just downloaded the GIMP and gave it a try.
I think it's great, but I really need to know how to apply effects to text, similar to what Photoshop does with drop shadows, glows, fills, etc. in layering.
Any specific place I can find that out???

[Kimm]

Try Filters.
I dont know if there is any text-specific functions.

[CarpKing]

I really need to know how to apply effects to text

Dropshadow is found in Script-Fu -> Shadow; other functions may be found in Filters, Python-Fu, and Script-Fu, and all that I know of work on text as well as other layers. The GIMP manual can be found at http://docs.gimp.org/ and downloaded. IMHO it should really be included; if not with the program itself, then in distros that contain the program. But in any case, it should help you get started. Or there's always fooling around until you figure it out. I didn't look at the manual for some time after starting with the GIMP, and I still haven't read the whole thing, but I have a feeling I would be farther along now if I had done so earlier.

[ikilledclown]

Coming from photoshop to gimp I found quite easy, it's simple and if you ask me less comlicated than photoshop, why pay for anything else unless it makes you coffee as well.

[luca.b]

I have used GIMP to assemble figures that I then put in one of my scientific publications. I think that with the unstable branch (2.3.x) it's getting there feature-wise. What still bothers me is its horrid UI.

[markuman]

hm, i've tested pixel, but can't understand ...
i prefer gimp! it's more stable as pixel and runs realy faster for me!

i'll stay @ gimp!

[Artificial Intelligence]

Faster? The newest pixel, starts up in 1 secs. Also the (pay) version is quiet stable (at least for me).

[smartalecks]

Faster? The newest pixel, starts up in 1 secs. Also the (pay) version is quiet stable (at least for me).

Yep i just got the pay version of beta6

It works very well, very stable except when it comes to some file types and brushes in general (the brush engine was re-written and will come out in beta 7). It starts up in a second, and the filters are very fast. Its only $32 right now too, and all updates until v2 are included.

The only problem I had was there was a libSDL error- it would start but it would be far too bright and transparent. It was easy to fix tho, a workaround was on his site.

[jsimmons]

I'm trying to install gimpshop, but I have to install darwinports, and to install darwinports, I have to install openssl. I did from synaptic. Darwinports said I didn't. I went and downloaded openssl from their site, and am installing it by hand, then I'll go back and try darwinports again, then gimpshop.

....okay got to have a perl parser, too. nice to have been warned of of all this....

...snipped remainder of rant ...



10-4 brother. Endless hidden dependencies, the requirement to compile many of the components, and almost non-existant gracious help from those with the secret knowledge is going to keep Linux from being generally accepted on the desktop.

But wait! Most Linuz zealots don't care if it's ever accepted on the desktop! "We don't care if joe-blow-average understands it or not!" I actually got that response once from a group of zealots. Until the Linuz "elite" accept the inevitable conclusion that to beat Microsoft you have to play their game where usability and "dumbing down" is concerned, Linux is going to remain a hobby OS that amounts to little more than a curious little blip in computer history and will never un-seat Microsoft. Afterall, there are MILLIONS more desktop users than there are servers. And here's the last seemingly ignored factoid for the propeller heads - DESKTOP USERS WANT AN ALTERNATIVE TO WINDOWS, and guess what - they would FREAKIN PAY FOR IT IF WAS HALFWAY DECENT.

Oh yeah, I'm planted firmly in the "The Gimp sucks" camp. I would rather run Paintshop Pro or Photoshop under Wine then have to deal with The Gimp's idea of a multi-window application. At least Wine installs and runs without any complaints...

[kakashi]

10-4 brother. Endless hidden dependencies, the requirement to compile many of the components, and almost non-existant gracious help from those with the secret knowledge is going to keep Linux from being generally accepted on the desktop.

But wait! Most Linuz zealots don't care if it's ever accepted on the desktop! "We don't care if joe-blow-average understands it or not!" I actually got that response once from a group of zealots. Until the Linuz "elite" accept the inevitable conclusion that to beat Microsoft you have to play their game where usability and "dumbing down" is concerned, Linux is going to remain a hobby OS that amounts to little more than a curious little blip in computer history and will never un-seat Microsoft. Afterall, there are MILLIONS more desktop users than there are servers. And here's the last seemingly ignored factoid for the propeller heads - DESKTOP USERS WANT AN ALTERNATIVE TO WINDOWS, and guess what - they would FREAKIN PAY FOR IT IF WAS HALFWAY DECENT.

Oh yeah, I'm planted firmly in the "The Gimp sucks" camp. I would rather run Paintshop Pro or Photoshop under Wine then have to deal with The Gimp's idea of a multi-window application. At least Wine installs and runs without any complaints...
you do realize that wine is only easy to install cuz you get a nice deb for it. there are deb for gimp use them.

also the newer versions of gimp have awesome multi window ability. the version i posted 2.3.6 was already great but try the further versions like 2.3.9.

just because you can compile anything for a damn don't diss on linux.

[jsimmons]

you do realize that wine is only easy to install cuz you get a nice deb for it. there are deb for gimp use them.

also the newer versions of gimp have awesome multi window ability. the version i posted 2.3.6 was already great but try the further versions like 2.3.9.

just because you can compile anything for a damn don't diss on linux.

"Couldn't" compile wasn't anywhere in my statement. My complaint is that I *have to*. That's a crock. I want to do stuff, not spend countless hourse chasing down dependancies and compiling crap. I spend all day at work compiling crap, and I DON'T want to have to do it at home too. And I'm not "dissin' Linux". I'dm dissin' folks like - well - you who seem to think everyone should share your penchant for compiling everything you use on your system.

Oh yeah - Wine is an example of software that has a decent installer - and it should. It's been under development for a number of years.

[calande]

Ok, because GIMP can't be compared to Photoshop. It's been 4 years that I've tried to use GIMP with their online docs. It's just too crappy. Over the years they haven't improved it and added featured that people have been asking for. It's about time a good alternative to GIMP comes up.

[jehnx]

Ok, because GIMP can't be compared to Photoshop. It's been 4 years that I've tried to use GIMP with their online docs. It's just too crappy. Over the years they haven't improved it and added featured that people have been asking for. It's about time a good alternative to GIMP comes up.

You might want to try out GIMPshop (http://www.gimpshop.com), then. I used to really dislike The GIMP a while back, too, when I was on Caldera OpenLinux 2.3 I believe, and I hadn't tried it anymore til recently, and now I really like this new GIMPshop program.

[abs]

GIMPshop, I think XARA LX will is looking like a great little package, hope it picks up more developers,

[BrokeBody]

Pixel is a RGB, CMYK and HDR image editing, photo retouching and manipulating program available for many operating systems formerly known as Pixel32. It is available for Windows, Linux, Linspire, MacOSX, BeOS, Zeta, QNX, MorphOS, FreeBSD, eComStation, OS/2, SkyOS and even old plain DOS, for both x86 and PowerPC architectures.

http://img91.imageshack.us/img91/7114/thememn4.png (http://www.kanzelsberger.com/img/theme.png)

Pixel image editor has been developed by Pavel Kanzelsberger (Banská Bystrica, Slovakia) since 1997 (current version since 2003 after few rewrites) and is still in heavy development. In 2005, the first release candidates appeared and once all the bugs are fixed, a final release may be ready by end of 2005. Release Candidate 3 is already available to public. Release Candidate 4 will follow in July 2005 by latest, followed by final beta testing in August-December 2005. Final stable product will be released in 2006.

Even if it’s not finished yet, Pixel got few awards.

http://www.kanzelsberger.com/img/daolnwod.jpg http://www.kanzelsberger.com/img/softpedia.gif http://www.kanzelsberger.com/img/onekit.gif http://www.kanzelsberger.com/img/5stars.png http://www.kanzelsberger.com/img/pick.png … and others.

November 2004 - Image editors comparison in czech Computer magazine (21/2004). Pixel got 8/10 points and was better than GIMP and PhotoImpact. In some test categories even better than Paint Shop Pro and PhotoPaint.

September 2005 - Computer magazine (18/2005) is doing image editors comparison again, year after previous one and this time Pixel gets 2nd place with only 2% difference right after Photoshop CS2. PDF with article is here (http://www.kanzelsberger.com/img/computer_050922.pdf), magazine’s website is here (http://computer.zive.cz/h/computerComputer/AR.asp?ARI=125714). Pixel 1.0 RC4 is also included on their CD and DVD packaged with magazine.

[BrokeBody]

Just to know everyone. This is not a spam or something.;)

[abs]

hay pal,

you might wont to check my post out about pixel,

http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=89690

regards,

Abs

[BrokeBody]

I didn't know that there is one post about Pix32 already.:roll:

Besides, my post is better.:D

regards,

BrokeBody

[RAV TUX]

These threads have been merged:

http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=1286952#post1286952
http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=89690

[Shay Stephens]

I tried downloading, but the download page is busted. Anyone know how to reach it or the author to let him know.

A side question, does this do 16bit editing? Or is it 8bit only like gimp?

[commodore]

Someone start copying it really quick. PIXEL is even crappier than GIMP because it's not free software :)

[prokoudine]

A side question, does this do 16bit editing? Or is it 8bit only like gimp?
Any chance you have a look at Features page: http://www.kanzelsberger.com/pixel/?page_id=9 ? :D

It has far more information of Pixel's features that you could probably expect from a forum reader.

[Shay Stephens]

Any chance you have a look at Features page: http://www.kanzelsberger.com/pixel/?page_id=9 ? :D

It has far more information of Pixel's features that you could probably expect from a forum reader.
Yes I read that page, but it only indirectly references it. It says:
Color Management support for RGB, CMYK, Grayscale and CIE Lab modes (8-bit and 16-bit)

I can probably assume that this also means 16bit image editing is possible, but I thought I would ask someone who is using it to see if I could get some verification.

The download link still is not working, so I have not been able to try the software myself.

[regeya]

I bought a license mainly to support development.

Neither Pixel nor GIMP will ever be able to touch Photoshop. Well, maybe they will in some areas, but let's face it, no U.S. developers would be able to help with GIMP development if they ever tried to add in good RGB->CMYK support.

I always love to read peoples' replies on these. I used to be one of those guys who advocated The GIMP as a Photoshop alternative. Then I started using Photoshop professionally. There really is no alternative to the real thing, guys, and it's not just a matter of not understanding The GIMP, because believe it or not, I used The GIMP before I ever used Photoshop! Heck, I used it before there was a GTK+, back in the Motif days. In many ways The GIMP has grown since then, but in other ways, not so much.

If all you're doing is, say, light touchup work, or generating 2D GFX for websites, The GIMP will save you hundred$ on your budget. However, if you're wanting to get photos (especially bad photos) ready for publicantion, don't even think of advocating The GIMP. Just don't. You have as much right advocating that as I do advocating Perl (which I know nothing about.)

I know y'all mean well, but where I live, I can use Free Software, or I'm Free to buy a license to Windows XP or an OS X box and Free to buy a license to Photoshop and I'm Free to accept the licensing agreements to all those. That's true Software Freedom. Now if only I had true Freedom from Zealots...

[regeya]

Never use it. Why would I? :confused:

OMG. Seriously, if you don't know what LAB space is, in all seriousness, you lack the experience necessary to give me a qualified answer. Until you do, it's just hot air.

I know I'm flaming, but I feel it's justified. It's enlightened if it's pro-Free Software, but flaming if it's not, I know, but I'm a big boy, I can take it. :-D

[tiggs_the_cat]

Well, while I hope that the GIMP and Krita will continue development on a fast(er) pace, unforunately I feel they still have quite a way to go (as does Pixel) to be PhotoShop alternatives.

I read that Ubuntu actually has a repository for commercial software, now it would be great if they could bring PhotoShop and other apps like ZBrush to Linux; kind of like buying a license from Adobe etc. and then being able to install from the commercial repository if you own a valid license.

[lutosdemayo]

Why Photoshop tops most-wanted Linux app list
http://www.desktoplinux.com/articles/AT6362808891.html

A first look at GIMP 2.4
http://software.newsforge.com/article.pl?sid=05/09/28/1345228

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[tiggs_the_cat]

Why Photoshop tops most-wanted Linux app list
http://www.desktoplinux.com/articles/AT6362808891.html

A first look at GIMP 2.4
http://software.newsforge.com/article.pl?sid=05/09/28/1345228

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Hi,

Do you mean with your statement that GIMP 2.4 will be comparable in features to PhotoShop CS2 or even CS3 which is coming out in a while?

If so I'd like to ask what you have been using PhotoShop and the GIMP for?

For digital painting the GIMP has a prehistoric brush engine. Even resizing a bitmap brush on the fly is impossible. You should have a look at brush dynamics offered by PhotoShop and Painter, the GIMP is nowhere near any of those at the moment.

Also large images seem to be handled much worse in the GIMP, when working with 9000px sized images the GIMP slows down quite a bit and won't even open some files that I can work with in both PhotoShop and Painter.

Also of course the GIMP is missing proper color management and support for other color spaces, from what I have heard the first steps have been taken but there is still a lot of missing functionality.

Quite some of the filters found in PhotoShop can not be compared at the moment to the equivalents in the GIMP, just think of PhotoShop's Liquify filter (IWarp in the GIMP). Then there are adjustment layers and layer effects for non-dstructive editing, better transform tools, much better text support, vector layers, as well as very comfortable UI features like the rotatable canvas in Painter which is supposedly going to be in CS3 as well.

For photography you'll also need 16bit support and RAW import, as well as some of the other features that I have already mentioned.

For compositing the GIMP just lacks too many features, Cinepaint is geared far more towards that. Besides non-destructive editing you'll need 16 and 32bit support, EXR, DPX, CIN import/export etc.

Yes, I do like the GIMP, it has some great tools but it still has a lot of ground to cover until it is competitive in all the areas it offers. Also some of those features mentioned in these articles highly depend on GEGL, which seems on the distant horizon.

[CarpKing]

I don't think that lutosdemayo meant anything so specific. I found both links to be interesting reads. I'm now really looking forward to GIMP 2.4, as it sounds like it will have all kinds of cool features. It does seem that Photoshop has the edge on GIMP in many professional applications (especially those that involve printing), but for the home user, I see no reason to avoid the GIMP. I certainly have no need for a professional graphics program, and a Linux port would not change the fact that it is far out of my price range. I also don't see the justification for the angry rants that seem to appear in most threads that involve the GIMP (especially on forums other than this one).

[tiggs_the_cat]

I don't think that lutosdemayo meant anything so specific. I found both links to be interesting reads. I'm now really looking forward to GIMP 2.4, as it sounds like it will have all kinds of cool features. It does seem that Photoshop has the edge on GIMP in many professional applications (especially those that involve printing), but for the home user, I see no reason to avoid the GIMP. I certainly have no need for a professional graphics program, and a Linux port would not change the fact that it is far out of my price range. I also don't see the justification for the angry rants that seem to appear in most threads that involve the GIMP (especially on forums other than this one).


Hi there,

Yeah, I agree with you on what you said. :)

Unfortunately the problem is not solved though, there is still no alternative for PhotoShop on Linux or even a port of the application itself for professional sized graphics creation under Linux. There are lots of professional sized applications on Linux, both OS and commercial software, but the area of 2D graphics is not quite there yet. I really hope that the GIMP or Krita may catch up!

[CarpKing]

It is easy to create a simple dynamically-resizeable brush in the GIMP:
http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=105466
Don't miss the tip on adjusting hardness in post #18.

I hope in the future the GIMP includes such a brush by default, and maybe supports dynamic resizing for any brush, not just a simple one.

[tiggs_the_cat]

Hey,

Thanks a lot for coming back and posting that link. :)

Unfortunately that is not what I mean though, GIMP's parametric brushes are just like the plain "Airbrush" in PhotoShop. What I was referring to are custom brushes made from alphas. Here is a a quick overview of the paint tools in PS7: http://www.creativemac.com/2002/03_mar/features/ps7dynamics1.htm

Also Painter has a very advanced brush engine for natural media brushes.

:)

[bluntu]

When it comes to Photo editing/retouching PHOTOSHOP is not needed. You can use GIMP but.. when it comes to WEB DESIGNING like Layouts that is the problem.

GIMP and Inkscape can't do layout design, you can but it will be a lot of tweaking and non-productive.

[kaamos]

When it comes to Photo editing/retouching PHOTOSHOP is not needed. You can use GIMP but.. when it comes to WEB DESIGNING like Layouts that is the problem.

Just asking (been a few years since I've used photoshop), are you talking about ps/imageready generated layouts that use only tables? I always found those extremely clunky compared to just writing the css with a suitable editor.

[bluntu]

http://www.templatemonster.com/category.php?type=1,9,13

Due to lack of features like Dropshadow and adjustment layer makes it difficult to design Web Templates.

[tiggs_the_cat]

When it comes to Photo editing/retouching PHOTOSHOP is not needed. You can use GIMP but.. when it comes to WEB DESIGNING like Layouts that is the problem.

GIMP and Inkscape can't do layout design, you can but it will be a lot of tweaking and non-productive.

I'm not so much of a photographer, but I am sure you for high-res photography that goes to print you will still need many advanced features besides the print and color management ones. For example you don't want to convert your 16bit RAW images to 8bit to get them into the GIMP. To check out some software made for professional photo editing check out Aperture (http://www.apple.com/aperture/) and Lightroom (http://labs.adobe.com/technologies/lightroom/).

[Shay Stephens]

To check out some software made for professional photo editing check out Aperture (http://www.apple.com/aperture/) and Lightroom (http://labs.adobe.com/technologies/lightroom/).

But none of those run in linux...

[tiggs_the_cat]

But none of those run in linux...

Yeah, that's the problem! ;)

Edit: What I mean with that is, as I said earlier the 2D image creation and editing lags a lot behind under Linux. None of the big "industry standard" applications or even their smaller competitors run under Linux, and there are no alternatives that cover those areas (yet - I still hope for the GIMP, Krita, Pixel etc.).

[jeffc313]

i tried the PIXEL trial, liked it, but unless they at least make it free (as in beer) I will never use it. GO GIMP!!!

[rattlerviper]

Pixel is no Photoshop! If it's photoshop you want get Photoshop! If you don't feel like you need photoshop use Gimp it's free! About Pixel I'll keep my comments to myself. 2 years of training in college on Photoshop has made me picky...Gimp is better than Pixel;) nuff said.

[neko18]

Pixel looks pretty cool, but I'm used to GIMP so I probably won't be using it anytime soon. Thanks for pointing out the program to us anyway!

[Doovoo]

Pixel is no Photoshop! If it's photoshop you want get Photoshop!
Oh, I'm sorry, has Adobe released a Linux version of that? Wait, that's right, they didn't.

The GIMP is better than Pixel right now, but only because of stability. One Pixel reaches 1.0, it will be much better than The GIMP. The GIMP has a very user-unfriendly GUI, and no matter how much users complain, they don't change it (or at least give other options in the preferences). And what's the deal with The GIMP sticking with 8 bit color?

There are lots of tasks that The GIMP is good for, but I think it would be very hard to find any professional designer using it. Pixel offers capabilities and workflows that are actually useful to people working at a higher-level caliber. I think that it should be like Xara Xtreme and cost money on Windows and OS X and be free on Linux.

[ramjet_1953]

I downloaded the Pixel trial and have been playing with it for a couple of days.
For a beta edition, it has worked fine for me. No bugs have surfaced yet, although I wouldn't consider myself a power user.
I will probably buy it, as I have never been comfortable with GIMP, as I used Photoshop for years and Pixel just feels right.
I just wish that the developer could get a large company to back him further in his development and so that it could be released as open source.

Roger :D

[toykilla]

Well, I wanted to give it a shot, but cannot find any of the requires libs for x64. Bummer.

[apoth]

I'd rather use GIMP, but I would prefer an MDI - philosophies of that aside.

[darkhatter]

I'm already starting the convert to this program on windows, when I get Linux up and running I'll be using this from now on.

[!nkubus]

I really like gimp, I wish it would only use 1 window though, I find it really anoying to search your toolbars and layers all the time. I know the desktop trick but it dosen't feel right to me either.

Pixel however have a lovely ui ( I wish Gimp's developper would take ideas from Pixel). I Pixelwas open source I would use it in a heartbeat.

[nikkiana]

I'm debating buying it, to be honest... I find the fact that the GIMP isn't one window to be nearly intolerable and there are so many graphics related projects that I want to do but haven't because I open the program, get frusterated by the number of windows open, and then just quit because I'm overwhelmed.... I'm not the biggest fan of shareware, but meh.... $32 for something that solves my problem isn't too bad.

[tiggs_the_cat]

Well, the multi-window interface also has quite some advantages. For example if you have a dual display setup you can spread the dock and image window and two different displays and use the whole space of one for your image window. A lot of applications on Unix, also on MacOS, work like this. I also just realized that you can "hide" the docks and toolbox by hitting TAB to show the image window only. Or just maximize it with F11.

By the way, there is a new development version of the GIMP out, which looks very cool. I just wish they would get GEGL integrated some time in the nearer future and do something about the brush engine.

And I'd maybe change the name. :-k

:D

[Breepee]

Tiggs, would be nice you told us what is so cool about the new dev version of GIMP.

Pixel is very nice program, but it's instability is a showstopper. The GIMP is more an painting editor, whereas Pxel seems to be geared towars real photopocessing (where Photoshop does both and then some). The GIMP is really not suited for high-end photoprocessing and as such it's great to see an application fill this gap on Linux. I hope the bugs and stability issues of Pixel can be fixed.

[tiggs_the_cat]

Tiggs, would be nice you told us what is so cool about the new dev version of GIMP.

Pixel is very nice program, but it's instability is a showstopper. The GIMP is more an painting editor, whereas Pxel seems to be geared towars real photopocessing (where Photoshop does both and then some). The GIMP is really not suited for high-end photoprocessing and as such it's great to see an application fill this gap on Linux. I hope the bugs and stability issues of Pixel can be fixed.

Uhm, I posted my critique of the GIMP and its capabilities here: http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=1359707&postcount=208

Hi,

Do you mean with your statement that GIMP 2.4 will be comparable in features to PhotoShop CS2 or even CS3 which is coming out in a while?

If so I'd like to ask what you have been using PhotoShop and the GIMP for?

For digital painting the GIMP has a prehistoric brush engine. Even resizing a bitmap brush on the fly is impossible. You should have a look at brush dynamics offered by PhotoShop and Painter, the GIMP is nowhere near any of those at the moment.

Also large images seem to be handled much worse in the GIMP, when working with 9000px sized images the GIMP slows down quite a bit and won't even open some files that I can work with in both PhotoShop and Painter.

Also of course the GIMP is missing proper color management and support for other color spaces, from what I have heard the first steps have been taken but there is still a lot of missing functionality.

Quite some of the filters found in PhotoShop can not be compared at the moment to the equivalents in the GIMP, just think of PhotoShop's Liquify filter (IWarp in the GIMP). Then there are adjustment layers and layer effects for non-dstructive editing, better transform tools, much better text support, vector layers, as well as very comfortable UI features like the rotatable canvas in Painter which is supposedly going to be in CS3 as well.

For photography you'll also need 16bit support and RAW import, as well as some of the other features that I have already mentioned.

For compositing the GIMP just lacks too many features, Cinepaint is geared far more towards that. Besides non-destructive editing you'll need 16 and 32bit support, EXR, DPX, CIN import/export etc.

Yes, I do like the GIMP, it has some great tools but it still has a lot of ground to cover until it is competitive in all the areas it offers. Also some of those features mentioned in these articles highly depend on GEGL, which seems on the distant horizon.

You can't deny though that there has been done a lot on the plugins and on the interface, as well as the integration of new tools. I assume a lot of those much asked for features depend on the GEGL integration. Didn't they say sometime that they even want to have node-based, non-destructive editing in the GIMP?

I don't see however why you say that the GIMP is a "painting editor". One should ask on CGTalk (http://forums.cgsociety.org/) what features digital painters would like to see in the GIMP.

I really like Pixel and I think it is a great effort, last time I downloaded a demo though it was not more advanced than the GIMP either. Also quite instable as you said. If you need to work with higher bit depth, HDR and other color spaces I'd have a look at Krita (http://www.koffice.org/krita/).

With GEGL (http://www.gegl.org/) integrated the GIMP would finally have those features as well.

We want GEGL to be as widely useful as possible. We are working on high bit depths, color management, CMYK and L*a*b native editing, flexible tile based systems, multi-threaded image processing, and more.

[unlokia]

I hate to have to be the one to teach the ethics and reasons for the foundation of Free Software.. AGAIN....](*,) But I shall:

Foss... FSF.... Free Software... Open-source... whatever you call it....

We don't want some proprietory rubbishware "filling a gap" thanks VERY much!.
It seems some people just cannot be bothered to find out EXACTLY what open source and "free, as in free beer" is about. We keep our freedom of choice, our freedom to modify and distribute and share code/programs etc because OSS and FSF *DON'T* want the restrictions of proprietory company products, whereas the lazy a** world as a wh0le, seems VERY much to have lost it's morals and principals, and just DON'T CARE how they do a job, or with what tool, as long as it gets done.

Be the software counterfeit, "pirated" (I detest the analogy there :???: ) or paid for with X amount of £££/$$$ - had you DONE your background research, and were you REALLY interested in the wellbeing of the worldwide community as a wh0le, you wouldn't have been here in the first place, attempting to coax freedom fighters into using closed source trash, would you?!.

This is the wh0le crux of the problem - Microsoft/Adobe etc etc have succeeded SO well in convincing people that what they sell is good stuff, that the average person GENUINELY thinks that closed source "paid for" means that it is of a better quality and standard.

Oh dear - we need a ***LOT*** more evangelists out there, giving lectures and demonstrations of everyday situations using OSS, and giving people the TRUTH they so badly need, to flush out the residue left behind by society and its ugly brainwashing tactics.

[darkhatter]

I forgot to say this, but gimp users are scared whenever a new image editing program comes out, and it does better then gimp. I hope this program does take off, that way it'll start to open the market for other programs. Gimp is getting better I'm liking some of the things they are doing in the 2.3 series (2.4) but that isn't enough to take photoshops place. I played with the program a little I could get all my needs done, gimp is still gimpped but 2.4 is going to be a huge leap.

[carlgm]

What a load of rubbish some people in this thread sprout. In my opinion Photoshop is currently the best option for the money.

giving lectures and demonstrations of everyday situations using OSS, and giving people the TRUTH they so badly need, to flush out the residue left behind by society and its ugly brainwashing tactics.


If you knocked on my door and started telling me what I want is an free, and open source graphics application because I am using and paying for Photoshop which is made and owned by the evil Adobe, i'd either set my dog on you or closed the door on your face. :/

Freedom is choice that isn't defined by someone elses rules, with options being removed to restrict that freedom. I myself wouldn't take kindly to other people limiting my options of what I can say/do simply because they feel that they know of a better option.

I myself like idea of the open source community, especially when related to Educational programs, or programs designed for everyday use. It's great to be able to download the source and modify or just look at. That doesn't mean I would enforce my liking of the idea on someone else, or frown upon should some company which employs people have their software not free, or open source or even one guy writing a little application to do a small task.

[unlokia]

@carlgm - sit down, and grind some of those ubuntu beans for a nice cuppa coffee :D. I am not saying that the closed source world HAS to change its ways - that is going to be a MASSIVE job - my sister uses Photoshop CS and I dont try and stop HER. What I *AM* profoundly against, is closed source "me too!" companies, hiding their bad intentions behind the "we got something for Linux, now!" cloak - we don't WANT closed source apps in Linux - THAT was my point.

Your response was a tad over defensive and agressive - I certainly do NOT appreciate such stupidness as suggesting I'd EVER knock on your door... why would I?? LOL!!

Carry on with whatever prop apps you use - I'm sure a lot of them work great, but it is high time the CLOSED SOURCE world REALISED we DON'T need closed source rubbish in distros, LEAST of all UBUNTU!!!. What the thick greedy cheeses don't understand is ETHICS - they just see Linux as ANOTHER way to pipe money away from FOSS development, and into their spanish villas and the suchlike. Sorry if you took it the wrong way dude, but that just IS NOT my fault!.

:mrgreen:


Dude - you wanna meet Richard Stallman if you think ***I*** hate closed source. Think this is criticism?? you wouldn't know what had hit you when he has finished lectures - PROPS TO THE GUY HE INVENTED FOSS!!!!!!!!!!

[Shay Stephens]

A photographers point of view...

I take photos and edit them for a living. So I need a certain level or functionality and performance to do my job. Now, I come from a Windows background, but late last year I came around to seeing what was going on with activation, DRM, etc, etc. I have to make a change away from windows/photoshop.

I did the initial app tests, and nothing really stood out as being capable enough for what I was doing. But I kept trying. I finally got PS7 working in crossover office. A partial success, but I can't edit RAW. I found Bibble, it will let me edit RAW in a way I need. I could swap out PS7 for gimp if I could just get gimp to play back recorded actions. I don't need it to run PS actions, I just need it to record it's own actions. Scripting in gimp-fu or python-fu is not viable for the quick and dirty stuff I do daily. I also need 16 bit editing capability. When gimp offers these things (hopefully soon) I will be pleased as punch.

But each month I seem to make a little progress here, a little there. And with each advance, I grow a little less reliant on non-free (as in freedom) apps. I don't mind paying for working apps, but I do want to maintain my freedom.

My first goal is getting rid of windows. Then I can focus on getting rid of non-free (freedom) apps. The goals behind not allowing non-free apps is the right way to go because it guarantees that freedom will not be corrupted little by little over time until there is no freedom left (the boiling frog principle) as has been happening with Windows.

Well it appears that I am rambling now. The point I want to make is it can take a while to transition. In all practical terms, not everyone can go cold turkey. Do what you can when you, support freedom and those who offer it. Eventually, everyone can get there :-)

[Breepee]

BTW, an articel about GEGL:

http://www.linux.com/article.pl?sid=06/10/16/1342216

[TigerWolf]

You know the best thing about PIXEL - it might give adobe more reason to port photoshop to linux.

[unlokia]

That is a very valid point - as long as they release the SOURCE!!

Otherwise it is like giving a car away but keeping the keys.

[tiggs_the_cat]

You know the best thing about PIXEL - it might give adobe more reason to port photoshop to linux.

That would be nice but I doubt it greatly. Even Disney was not able to convince them to port it to Linux, that's why they tried pushing the GIMP for a while. I read their artists didn't get along with it and they rather spent some money to make WINE run PhotoShop.

In general I don't know exactly what the GIMP is targeted to be. As the discussion goes on Slashdot I read a lot about what the GIMP is not supposed to be used for. I intend to have a closer look at Krita again, it already has quite a few of the features that I have been listing and they are interested in supporting digital painting and natural media as well. And they seem to be quite open for the users' opinions.

[HanZo]

I'm an idealist. I really believe in all this free software thing... but it's 6 years I try to convert to linux and I just can't at least not on my main workstation. One of the reasons is photoshop. This app is the base of all my work, I am an illustrator and use a lot of photoshop for several different things.
I could write a list of 10 pages with all the reasons why any linux app won't work for me, and believe I've tried them all, and I continue to check anything out that gets released.
But if it was just gimp, I'll get it sorted out, the problem is linux as a whole is not well suited for what I do, so I'll probably get me a mac, and that's it.
but back to the topic, I am using ubuntu on several machines and it's great! I had it on my laptop until the poor thing died... and it's great for most tasks, but not for the creative tasks. I tried the audio and music apps, I tried video editing, I've tried Ktoon and scribus and gimp and krita... nice apps, but huge way to go. If I was somebody who just needed basic functionality I'd go for it, but I need professional standard, I need colour matching, I need duotone support and so on... I have go prepare images for print and there's enough things that can go wrong, I cannot risk to double them.
The main problem, as far as I see, is that right now oss is struggling hard to produce apps that really can cope with what's the state of the art applications for certain fields, but they lag way behind. I don't think having closed source apps on linux would be bad, I mean... there's people who have to feed a family with the coding stuff! I didn't want to do all my illustrations for free, although I've done work for free because I believed in it.
I'd really love to see pixel become a working full featured application, something I can use for my work, maybe spending even less than with photoshop... but I can say the same for Gimp...n personally I don't care if if it's open source or not... I think you will always have both things... and both need on each other. Oss should focus more on innovation, because it's where its strengh lays... OSS can dare to go where no commercial company would ever go!

[Shay Stephens]

I'm an idealist. I really believe in all this free software thing... but it's 6 years I try to convert to linux and I just can't at least not on my main workstation. One of the reasons is photoshop. This app is the base of all my work, I am an illustrator and use a lot of photoshop for several different things.

As more and more artists like you join the crowd, pressure is put on the apps to take directions that were not there or needed before. I think the next couple of years will be pivotal and we will see a lot of change in the direction of artistic use in linux.

[P_Badger]

Oof, well, I've been giving Gimp a good shot for the past couple of weeks, and it's not all TOO bad once one has gotten over the differences from photoshop.

But Gimp will NOT EVER become a professional piece of software unless the programmers can get over themselves and add 16/32 bit picture handling and CMYK. It's strange that they'd leave those completely out. Should mention that changing the brush size is a bit of a mess, too.

Hopefully Gimp 2.4 will come out in the next few decades, and improve on what's out now. Hell, I'd happily pay for a copy, too, but not for what's currently being pedaled. Maybe if we all got together and threw 20 bux at them or something, they'd feel more inclined to finish.

[tiggs_the_cat]

Oof, well, I've been giving Gimp a good shot for the past couple of weeks, and it's not all TOO bad once one has gotten over the differences from photoshop.

But Gimp will NOT EVER become a professional piece of software unless the programmers can get over themselves and add 16/32 bit picture handling and CMYK. It's strange that they'd leave those completely out. Should mention that changing the brush size is a bit of a mess, too.

Hopefully Gimp 2.4 will come out in the next few decades, and improve on what's out now. Hell, I'd happily pay for a copy, too, but not for what's currently being pedaled. Maybe if we all got together and threw 20 bux at them or something, they'd feel more inclined to finish.

Well, I don't think it's a question if 16/32 bit handling and different color spaces/color management etc. will be supported, only when. As far as I know that is all supposed to come with the GEGL integration after 2.4 is finished.

[cacharreo]

OK I'll try Pixel. But Gimp is GREAT!!!

[beefcurry]

I have been using ubuntu for sometime now (has it been that long? *stares at 5.04 disk*) And i can say that Nothing will replace photoshop for me. I have VMWARE for one purpose only, photoshop. Gimp just dosnt work out for me, neither does Pixel. I am a photographer and i Shoot in RAW, UFRAW is still not as flexible as AdobeRAW, and wine still dosnt support PS:CS2.

I think there is a number of reasons why so many people stay with photoshop, its more like a developers platform then anything else, people like me have invested quite a number of hours to use it, In terms of basic setup and basic functionality simular to photoshop i would say Pixel beats GIMP hands down as a graphical program, but there are differences. The name photoshop* <- it is MENT for the manipilation of Photos, if i wanted to edit some JPG picture of a logo somewhere, or CG some anime girl, hell even do illustrations GIMP (hense *image* manipilation program in the name, not photo manipilation program) would be very useful. But the type of taloring to photographers is VERY lacking, THAT SAME GOES WITH PIXEL. Pixel has an interface LIKE photoshop, but its functionality is alot lacking. I suppose it has many simular functions but without its RAW functionality, its many filters, filtermasks, blender modes, brush-types, plugin community/database it is no where close. By calling Pixel a "true" photoshop alternative is quite stupid since for people seriously using photoshop (not just some kid downloading a fake to play around with) its the flexibility and functionality for PHOTOGRAPHS*** that pixel currently is too short of functions (especially the vast plugin/filter community). BUT as a photoshop wanabee (trying to clone most of photoshops basic functions) it is in fact way over gimp, but once you tried the gimpshop hack you would start to wonder why ANYONE would pay for PIXEL. Yet again Krita is just as good as Pixel, if not better with a simular interface. But yet again i do expect GEGL to put the Photo into GIMP (lame XD), which will make pixel obsolete.

[Artificial Intelligence]

it is in fact way over gimp, but once you tried the gimpshop hack you would start to wonder why ANYONE would pay for PIXEL.

I would ;)
I use both gimp, pixel and photoshop on Ubuntu and agree, for serious pro work photoshop is the way (at the current state). Hopefully in some years both gimp and pixel gets better so they can compete with photoshop so the pro users can use that instead.

[Magnes]

Well, Photoshop is one of the applications that stop people from using linux. I use and like GIMP, but I'm not a photographer or illustrator and I understand why Photoshop is - for some people - better (look at the conceptart - GIMP is not suited for that work). But Pixel for me is worse than GIMP (and Photshop of course) in every single detail. And it's not free and not open sourced. Sorry, but thats my opinion.

[bullgr]

i use photoshop the last 7 years as a pro...
so, i can't get used gimp (and also the missed parts like cmyk support)
and pixel seems to developt too slow.

the solution for me is photoshop runing in vmware (works perfect and runs smooth)...

[dmn_clown]

Why do people continually compare The GIMP and Photoshop when on a technical level you can't compare them?

The GIMP is aimed at low end 8-bit per channel images whereas Photoshop is aimed at the high end 16/32-bit per channel images. The only piece of free (as in speech) software that can seriously be compared to Photoshop is Cinepaint, which is currently the #2 image editor in use in the special effects studios, right behind Photoshop.

If you want to compare the GIMP to a proprietary image editor you should compare it to one that is aimed at the exact same low end images (e.g. Paint Shop Pro). This is where your arguments are going to have technical merit.

Pixel, while being non-free software is a decent program but it is most definitely NOT a replacement for Photoshop (Which runs nicely in cross-over office, vmware is a bit of overkill for one program) or even Cinepaint. There are very few available plugins to augment the limited feature set and almost no features that aren't implemented better elsewhere.

Before anyone starts screaming at me, I should point out that I use the GIMP quite frequently but when I need to work on high end images I use Cinepaint because the GIMP is completely useless for anything high-end.