Bilizzard Petition

[soxs]

No matter if there will be more linux support caused by this petition, but it is worth at least the 3seconds it takes to fill in: http://www.petitiononline.com/ibpfl/petition.html

[Darganot]

Signed, but I wonder just how much these companies listen...just look at the way Valve treats us...

Start looking to indie developers. :)

[GSZX1337]

Signed, but I wonder just how much these companies listen...just look at the way Valve treats us...


Yeah, I'm not a programmer (unless you count HTML and CSS :P) but how hard can it be to code a .run file?

Start looking to indie developers. :)
I believe that the heart of PC gaming is in indie and Flash game developers. Indie and (especially) Flash game developers don't have to worry about revenue, piracy, release dates, audiences, etc. so they have time to debug the game, think of better control schemes, add in something cool, etc. (I do release that some indie game studios have to worry about release dates and some of those things I mentioned)
Also, from the way things look, SC2 looks like SC1 with updated graphics. I think I'd rather have a cool indie game ;)

Sorry for my mini rant about innovation in PC gaming.

[soxs]

Someway you are right, but Blizzard is since ~10 years hybrid developing for Win/OSX. So OpenGL is allready included and there is no huge wall to get over like all the nasty windows only games have with direct3d
Just sign, and we'll see what will happen (or not).

[MaximB]

Sorry to disappoint you but Blizzard doesn't give a **** about GNU/Linux, here is the replay I got about my "request" about making a GNU/Linux client for WOW as it's already have an OpenGL mode and converting "shouldn't" be a problem :

My Email :

"Hello.
As you know many of your users are using GNU/Linux and being forced to use wine in order to be able to play your great game WOW.
Wine is not perfect, and in many ceases WOW doesn't run well in wine.
WOW supports OpenGL and DirectX and in some stage of the development you had thoughts about making a GNU/Linux client but then you abandoned the idea.

Please rethink it all over, make your customers pleased and make a GNU/Linux client , it's really not THAT hard as you already have OpenGL support.
We need more game companies to support us like ID software and Epic which always making GNU/Linux client to their games.

I'm sure that many users will very much appreciate you more if you just support them.

If I sent this message to the wrong place please redirect me to the right place.

Thanks in advance.
Maxim."
--------------------------------------------------------------

The replay I got :

"Hello Maxim,

Thank you for contacting the Blizzard Entertainment Technical Support department with your Issue. My name is Chuck and I will be assisting you.

The game can be run in OpenGL but OpenGL is not a supported mode. It is primarily used as a troubleshooting step in order to detemrine where issues might be occurring. For the most part people that use OpenGL have reported a drop in performance.

Blizzard currently does not develop for the Linux platform; however, we are keeping an eye on the progress of Linux and may change in the future. Currently we only support our games on the platforms listed on the box/website. There are some issues with Linux that may interfere with a connection to our servers as well. Overall, we do not support the use of our games on Linux.


Thank you,
Chuck S.
Technical Support
Blizzard Entertainment
http://www.blizzard.com/support".

-----------------------------------------------------

Best of luck.

[vexorian]

These suits won't listen.

My advice is, screw them. Let them know that they are losing customers for them and stop trying to force WINE to do their work, let them lose the sell.

[BL00dFox]

Signed.

[matthewcraig]

Vote (http://www.linuxgamingworld.com/?q=node/124) with your wallet. Buy a title that actually supports (http://www.linuxgamingworld.com/games-catalog/) the way you use your computer.

[uDanimal]

Signed. I am SURE they will listen now...I said "PLEASE" in the comments field. :P

[soxs]

Sorry to disappoint you but Blizzard doesn't give a **** about GNU/Linux, here is the replay I got about my "request" about making a GNU/Linux client for WOW as it's already have an OpenGL mode and converting "shouldn't" be a problem :

My Email :

"Hello.
As you know many of your users are using GNU/Linux and being forced to use wine in order to be able to play your great game WOW.
Wine is not perfect, and in many ceases WOW doesn't run well in wine.
WOW supports OpenGL and DirectX and in some stage of the development you had thoughts about making a GNU/Linux client but then you abandoned the idea.

Please rethink it all over, make your customers pleased and make a GNU/Linux client , it's really not THAT hard as you already have OpenGL support.
We need more game companies to support us like ID software and Epic which always making GNU/Linux client to their games.

I'm sure that many users will very much appreciate you more if you just support them.

If I sent this message to the wrong place please redirect me to the right place.

Thanks in advance.
Maxim."
--------------------------------------------------------------

The replay I got :

"Hello Maxim,

Thank you for contacting the Blizzard Entertainment Technical Support department with your Issue. My name is Chuck and I will be assisting you.

The game can be run in OpenGL but OpenGL is not a supported mode. It is primarily used as a troubleshooting step in order to detemrine where issues might be occurring. For the most part people that use OpenGL have reported a drop in performance.

Blizzard currently does not develop for the Linux platform; however, we are keeping an eye on the progress of Linux and may change in the future. Currently we only support our games on the platforms listed on the box/website. There are some issues with Linux that may interfere with a connection to our servers as well. Overall, we do not support the use of our games on Linux.


Thank you,
Chuck S.
Technical Support
Blizzard Entertainment
http://www.blizzard.com/support".

-----------------------------------------------------

Best of luck.
Hmm.. no good news, but maybe 15000+ petition suscribers will make them think, maybe not, but giving up is as bad.
The other concept, not buying any blizzard games will more or less make no effect to them, they simply won't get the difference if 100.000 linux users less buying their upcoming starcraft2, which will be baught a hell often by windowsusers..

so I think a petition is the smartest way to do it...
maybe we should ask were exactly those linux problems are lyig borrowed and unburry them..

EDIT:
Maybe spaming theirsupport with 100.000 linux requests would make change? Maybe, maybe not...

[Artificial Intelligence]

Another petition....I dunno how many of these I have signed over the years *sigh*


Vote with your your money instead. That's something they can understand.

[MaximB]

Another petition....I dunno how many of these I have signed over the years *sigh*


Vote with your your money instead. That's something they can understand.

Well I'm sure that LOADS of GNU/Linux users already bought and subscribe to WoW even tough it doesn't natively run on GNU/Linux.
...no that Blizzard cares about it,the GNU/Linux users are buying it no matter what... :( .....if it runs somehow with Wine...

[GSZX1337]

I posted the petition over at the Anandtech PC Gaming Forum, but unforunately most of the posts were just people thread crapping. ](*,)
Two people said that they wish they could take off signatures. D-bags.


Another petition....I dunno how many of these I have signed over the years *sigh*


I don't know about you, but I don't value my time much so I sign petitions, even though it won't really do anything.

Vote with your your money instead. That's something they can understand.
I know I can't make as much of a dent as a WoW subscriber, but I know I'll be buying SC2 and Diablo 3 on release and when they work on Wine, I'll be playing them in GNU/Linux.

[Artificial Intelligence]

...and there's the problem, GSZX1337 and that's properly why we don't see more games for linux.

When companies think; oh well they guys at wine just doing our work for free, why bother.

[GSZX1337]

...and there's the problem, GSZX1337 and that's properly why we don't see more games for linux.

When companies think; oh well they guys at wine just doing our work for free, why bother.

*smacks forehead*
Thats right. So, would a boycott be better, or would that be pointless?

[Artificial Intelligence]

More or less. Well you don't change anything by buying a windows game if you want a linux game.

I only buy games now that are natively linux supported, yeah I know that's not many, but at least I support those who support us :KS
Not that I saying you have to, but as stated earlier, if you want to change something in the game industry it's via the money.

[TheTank]

Vote (http://www.linuxgamingworld.com/?q=node/124) with your wallet. Buy a title that actually supports (http://www.linuxgamingworld.com/games-catalog/) the way you use your computer.
I'd gladly buy a game that directly supports Linux but I will *not* buy a game that has been ported extra to Linux by a 2nd company.

Buying from a porting company only justifies the developers choice not to support Linux. They do not have to change the way they develop and are still selling the games.

We need more companies that directly support Linux.
And that sure as well won't happen if I buy 'made for Windoze' games.

I'd love to play Sins of a Solar Empire but will not buy it unless they offer a Linux version.

A petition is only a 'I am upset list'. If we want the comps to do anything, we have to show them the benefits.

Who is willing to put down their money on a 'well if you port it they will buy' idea?

F.i. SoaSE. If we would manage to get Stardock to allow linux preorders of the game and actually get people to order they could see that there are actually the numbers to match the claims.

Maybe we can have a sub-forum where people can start such lists for games which they can then forward to the developers.

But if we do this, we need to become the marketing division for these products. Then we can really see if the Linux community is as powerful as it claims to be.

[Cows]

This is what I commented on the petition when I signed it :

Games shouldn't be Platform specific. If someone wants to have a good time it should be accessible in any OS. OpenGL is a great Graphics Layer and OpenGL 2 should be better then Direct X 10 not just because it's open-source ( This community improvements ) but because it is adaptable in a variety of graphics cards.

[matthewcraig]

I'd gladly buy a game that directly supports Linux but I will *not* buy a game that has been ported extra to Linux by a 2nd company.
Sorry, gotta disagree with you on a couple point... First, those that I mentioned are not ports. (except the few noted exceptions) You can feel confident you're supporting developers who support Linux desktops.

Stardock is probably the most rabit pro-Microsoft developer out there. They sell add-ons for the WindowsXP-UI, and they dedicate a big part of their FAQ on why they will not program anything for Linux.

[basketcase421]

I am new here, so please forgive me. But, I don't see an end in sight for the MS monoply of developers. I mean, in this economy, they go where the money is or where the most can be made. If they only have to develop for one OS, my assumption is that there is less development time, which equals less production costs. And on top of that, there are millions and millions of Windows gamers and probably a few hundred thousand Linux gamers. You do the math.

All that being said, I hope that I am wrong. It would be a lot better if we weren't "forced" into using Windows. More choices is always better.

I am in the process of trying to figure out how to use linux. Not for any specific reason, I just feel like expanding my knowledge in the area. But, no matter what I learn, I have a feeling I will be keeping a Windows installation on my PCs, at least for gaming.

[Zelphien]

I signed, and I personally agree

Even though I got my World of Warcraft and Diablo 2: LOD working on Ubuntu 7.10, I still think all games(including Blizzard Inc. Games) should be playable on Windows, Mac, AND Linux.

It is fair.

We shouldn't have to use WINE(even though it is a great tool) to get the things we want/need. We should have it easier for us and play Blizzard games easily.

[TheTank]

Sorry, gotta disagree with you on a couple point... First, those that I mentioned are not ports. (except the few noted exceptions) You can feel confident you're supporting developers who support Linux desktops.
I have no issues with the list. Well except for the first one being a port ;)

In a different topic I had an argument with someone who was basically trolling forums getting people to buy ported Linux games.

My reply was just to set it clear that ported games != Linux support.


Stardock is probably the most rabit pro-Microsoft developer out there. They sell add-ons for the WindowsXP-UI, and they dedicate a big part of their FAQ on why they will not program anything for Linux.
What FAQ? Honestly, I am clueless. I looked on their site but nothing.

But they sound like many other game/software development companies I know. I can only presume they do not see the financial prospects of making commercial software in an environment such as ours. (I'd say not only them.)

Also from what I can tell, they mostly act like game resellers. If they see financial profit prospects in supplying a game for Linux, I doubt they would decline.

With their stance twards cd-protection (and the support they got for it) I would think they'd be open for it.

Finally I think it comes down to how 'the industry' views 'us'. As mentioned before, 'the industry' does not see us as potential customers.
I think it would be up to us to change that.

[matthewcraig]

I hunted down their essay (http://www.stardock.com/stardock/articles/endofos2.html) on deciding not to develop for Linux.

[basketcase421]

Here is a noob linux question... Do all version of Linux play games the same? I guess, since we are speaking on the "profitablity" of developing for Linux, are all versions the same? Or are they going to have to test their software on the many different varients of Linux? And I am asking seriously, as I don't know the difference between them all.

If they do need to test each version, you can probably see the problem with that. Endless testing cycles due to the multiple different versions of Linux to test on, as well as the standard Windows and Mac OS. IF that were the case (and I am not saying it is...) the Linux community is actually shooting itself in the foot, by not adopting one version as the standard.

On the other hand, the different varients of linux could all treat the software the same, and this may not be an issue. I am just thinking outloud...

[vexorian]

Here is a noob linux question.

A game would just use the right library, a blizz game just needs to use OpenGL, after that there are few issues:
- Architecture (which is an issue on windows and mac as well)
- Method of distribution.

Things like google earth have managed to have these ugly installers instead of using the distro's distribution method.

They could also just use SDL, that thing works on any modern distro I tried.

So, it is not going to be a bigger problem than apple in this regard imho.

They could just make the Linux version and let the community support it.

[Cresho]

I buy all the games up till neverwinter nights 2. Now I dont because I am ditching windows.

[basketcase421]

A game would just use the right library, a blizz game just needs to use OpenGL, after that there are few issues:
- Architecture (which is an issue on windows and mac as well)
- Method of distribution.

Things like google earth have managed to have these ugly installers instead of using the distro's distribution method.

They could also just use SDL, that thing works on any modern distro I tried.

So, it is not going to be a bigger problem than apple in this regard imho.

They could just make the Linux version and let the community support it.


So you admit is would require some extra work to make it happen. And Blizzard, for instance, is not the kind of company to turn over their support needs to the community.

It comes back to profitablitly for these companies. And I reiterate, I am not opposed to the idea of these games being Linux native, at all. I think it would be awesome if they did it. It would give everyone an actual choice in another OS. But, I am realistic, and I think it comes down to how much money they percieve they can make by adding this extra OS to support.

[twothird]

the thing is, WoW doesn't even have Vista support. You can play it, sure, but there are lots of bugs, which Blizzard isn't doing anything about.

[vexorian]

So you admit is would require some extra work to make it happen.

Sure, but it in no way would be worse than what's required for mac support.

[matthewcraig]

Rumor has it that there was a Linux client (http://linux.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=207932&cid=16952816) for this game, in the closed beta. Then they dropped it. If true, it really shows that it is not about having to put in extra work to get a working client... it is just that they want nothing to do with Linux users. Regardless, I do not know why anyone would give money to a software company that shuts them out. Must be one heck of a game.

In other news, did you hear that Savage 2 was released today? Now there's a team providing great Linux support, with an awesome title, that you can feel good about funding.

[dudeofthedead]

If Blizzard does not want my money, fine, I'll either keep it or hand it over to other, more deserving publishers. But don't you please give me that 'you can't have commercial games under Linux because it's against the whole idea' crap for yet another handful of recent titles will tell you what a baseless opinion this is. See, the problem with these major companies is they either keep relying on good old excuses to make up for their own inability to evolve or they are simply not willing to take risks. Well, guess what? Big part of life is about taking them risks. The bigger the company the more selfish and lazy, this I have noticed, not to mention those bring out nothing but an endless series of odourless sequels (most of the time). So when I see a smaller company like, for instance, Frictional Games, trying to reach the largest audience possible whereas they aren't exactly among the richest, they sure as hell deserve my support - don't they? What Frictional Games can do, Blizzard can too, the latter being just too damn old-fashioned and I just can't take any more of that mindset from stupid companies. Sure, it would hurt them a lot to spend one lousy million on a native sh/run installer + long term support. Okay, I'm sorry, now I understand why you're not doing this! But I'm still not giving you the money.

[raydeen]

Signed. 15023. That's actually pretty impressive. number wise Even if it gets them to offer advice or guidance on how to tweak or add to WINE, it will be worth it.

[thisismalhotra]

Signed

[flOOi!ghenTM]

Hmm quite a few people 15 000 but still i don't think that's enought. Maybe if linux will be much more easy to use and (idiot proof easy) older people and companies might think of switching but until then i seriously doubt that blizzard or any other company will make games for linux in the near future.So basicaly it's up to the community to do this. Well at least that's my opinion

[vexorian]

That opinion contradicts evidence, one of the most user-unfriendly OSes out there holds most of the market, so it doesn't make sense.

I let's just put our money where our mouth goes, stop buying games from companies that support MS' monopoly (and therefore go against users) and spend in cross platform games whenever they are released.

It is 2008 already and companies still think they are privileged to focus on a single platform and forbid customers from choosing them, it would be nice if their false advertisements would get challenged so instead of sayin 60 USD, they included the total cost, add windows' license to the price I say.

[hiro nakamatty]

number 15056 somehow i don't think that will be enough...:popcorn::guitar:

[TheTank]

I hunted down their essay (http://www.stardock.com/stardock/articles/endofos2.html) on deciding not to develop for Linux.
That is over 7 years old. Not quite up to date. ;)

We expect software to be free? No, we don't. If someone thinks that they have not yet figured it out.

Also it pretty much supports my claim that these guys do not know anything about 'us'.

[twothird]

15090, i support your case guys.

[soxs]

I guess a lot people could be reached, if everbody puts a link into his signature. (as me :-P)

[chronusdark]

you know guys i dont think petitions or boycotts are the way to get good linux games
i say tell everyone
tell your mom
tell your brother/sister
tell your friends at school/work
tell them all about linux and teach them to use it
then, perhaps companies will see it as a bigger market and will HAVE to make software for it or suffer losses
thats the only way i can see to get more linux commercial games

meanwhile nethack is really fun
*not sarcasm*

[mivo]

A better way than a petition would be to cancel your WoW membership if you use Linux (rather than playing it in Wine) and telling Blizzard about it. When you cancel an account, you can give a reason. If enough people did that, it would at least be noticed, though with the many customers they have, it's unlikely to even make a dent. But yes, money has a louder voice than a petition. :)

(I'll sign anyway.)

[finferflu]

you know guys i dont think petitions or boycotts are the way to get good linux games
i say tell everyone
tell your mom
tell your brother/sister
tell your friends at school/work
tell them all about linux and teach them to use it
then, perhaps companies will see it as a bigger market and will HAVE to make software for it or suffer losses
thats the only way i can see to get more linux commercial games

meanwhile nethack is really fun
*not sarcasm*
Nethack is THE game. People who haven't tried it are really missing something of great value.

I have signed anyway, even though I'm not a gamer, apart from a very limited selection. I just love it when Linux gets support, though and I hope we'll be getting somewhere. The number is increasing.

[NightwishFan]

I was amateur on Starcraft, perhaps with a Linux version I will go for the same on Sc2. Signed. Forget WOW though...

[finferflu]

Wow, no I mean WoW! Check this out: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=741714 :P

[soxs]

I call it an april fool...

[HermanChess]

I will get seriously disappointed if Blizzard blatantly ignores the Linux community with SCII, they seem like nice people though, so I have my hopes.

[soxs]

What they seem and what they are.. there are light years between.

[Ideastone]

I don't know if it will help, but I signed anyway.

[wouldya]

Will sign it later, but isn't there always a possibility to play Windows Games with Linux? I am new in Linux, hope my question is not too stupid.

[mivo]

Some Windows games will run, more or less well, in Wine. But it's not necessarily desirable to do that, since it does not motivate development studios to release native Linux versions.

[soxs]

Most, especially ew games, will not run under wine. So,.. at least I would like to see a lot more native installers like ET:QW has. It would boost the linux community. If Blizzard will move over to linux, we have one big bunny onboard. The next bunny to take would be steam, but for that, wen need a somewhat bigger boat...

[JohnnyC35]

bump

[lisati]

Two-year old thread closed. Rest in peace.