Praadur
January 17th, 2008, 04:42 AM
(I apologise if this is in the wrong area, but since this is related to games I think it'd be okay if I posted this here. If it's not, please move it.)
I had found myself in a bit of a mental quagmire of ponderances earlier, mostly regarding game genres and how we might help refine and improve them. From that line of thought, this thread was borne.
The purpose behind this thread, and therefore the reason I created it, is to share objective views on what you (the reader of this topic) might consider to be a fundamental flaw with any given genre. Perhaps even something that used to be found in a particular genre of a game but has been strip-mined for more generalised mainstream releases today.
This wouldn't be a thread for, as an example, why RPGs should be linear or open-ended, as that's more of a subjective preference than anything else, but something that you believe is a failing. If you can, also provide a proposed solution to the problem, and your ideas surrounding it.
That way, this thread might become food for thought for anyone who's working on an open-source or indy game, it might just provide someone with an idea they like or even a solution to a problem that they've seen that they don't really have a solution to. This thread could also be used for that, for someone to posit a problem and then see if they can't provide a solution.
So here's my shot at this...
Action/Adventure
Problem: Exploration isn't exploration.
A lot of replay value in these games today has amounted to nothing more than finding tiny dots under rocks, much like the (generally hated) pixel-hunting of old in pure adventure games. So the only real way a player can cite themselves as an 'explorer' of any sort is to find all of these hidden dots and show off their list of finds. I'd say this this is more the work of--and only because I couldn't think of anything more suitable--a microbiologist than an intrepid pioneer of paths and pitfalls.
Proposed Solution: Reshape rewards into new areas.
To start out, there are good examples of how this could be done but these days they seem to have been forgotten. One such example is Beyond Good & Evil, and another is Skies of Arcadia (even though that's an RPG). They're a good start, but they're still pretty flat and they could be expanded upon. Come to think of it, a good basis to begin from might even be the original Knytt... but that was all exploration, rather than exploration being a part of another genre.
For example, a bunch of leaves could be obscuring a cave entrance, and beind it might be a network of caves which--if traversed correctly--lead to a monstrous cavern, lit by beautiful crystals, and with heiroglyphs painted upon its walls perhaps detailing one of the more optional-to-know elements of thegame's storyline.
A number of other things could also lead to such things, such as perhaps a seemingly impossible jump that most players might not make as they assume they wouldn't be able to do it, or even giving the level completely optional puzzles which open up new areas of the game, offering the players something new to see. It'd be grand for example if I were to solve a bunch of puzzles in an ancient temple that allowed me to access an ancient, underground arboretum... and there I might find an incredibly alien race but timid race of reptiles caring for their young. The PC could then write about this find in his notebook or such, journalling it with self-drawn images, his own recollection of the enconter andsoforth.
The latter example would be a much more entertaining reward at the end of the game than a list of 'pixel-hunted' for items, I'd think.
In fact, the game could even have a complete side-story contained within more hidden areas, which is detached from the main storyline but helps shed light on it. Akin to what Assassin's Creed did but with the World staying connected as one, isntead of being split in two.
I don't really know what to add to my explanation beyond that, but when I think of exploration, I tend to think of poking out the secret little corners of the World that no one has seen, seeking out the unseen, and treading on grounds that have rarely been tread on, haven't been tread on for centuries, or generally haven't been tread on at all by another explorer's feet. This would also provide a real sense of accomplishment for an explorer, as they would be able to say that they were there, and they saw that.
Just to finish up, I will note that (and don't beat me over the head for this!) World of Warcraft had something like this in it, but it was completely unintentional. I think that patching that element out of the game was the most foolish thing Blizzard did, when opposedly they could've worked it into their MMO as an official element of the game. For those who don't know what I'm talking about here, do a little looking up on 'wall-walking'. There were lots of things to see, cities that the players weren't meant to find, a town of merrily dancing trolls, a rather steampunk airfield... and so on.
So that'd be my beef with that genre. Now (if you like) it's your turn.
I had found myself in a bit of a mental quagmire of ponderances earlier, mostly regarding game genres and how we might help refine and improve them. From that line of thought, this thread was borne.
The purpose behind this thread, and therefore the reason I created it, is to share objective views on what you (the reader of this topic) might consider to be a fundamental flaw with any given genre. Perhaps even something that used to be found in a particular genre of a game but has been strip-mined for more generalised mainstream releases today.
This wouldn't be a thread for, as an example, why RPGs should be linear or open-ended, as that's more of a subjective preference than anything else, but something that you believe is a failing. If you can, also provide a proposed solution to the problem, and your ideas surrounding it.
That way, this thread might become food for thought for anyone who's working on an open-source or indy game, it might just provide someone with an idea they like or even a solution to a problem that they've seen that they don't really have a solution to. This thread could also be used for that, for someone to posit a problem and then see if they can't provide a solution.
So here's my shot at this...
Action/Adventure
Problem: Exploration isn't exploration.
A lot of replay value in these games today has amounted to nothing more than finding tiny dots under rocks, much like the (generally hated) pixel-hunting of old in pure adventure games. So the only real way a player can cite themselves as an 'explorer' of any sort is to find all of these hidden dots and show off their list of finds. I'd say this this is more the work of--and only because I couldn't think of anything more suitable--a microbiologist than an intrepid pioneer of paths and pitfalls.
Proposed Solution: Reshape rewards into new areas.
To start out, there are good examples of how this could be done but these days they seem to have been forgotten. One such example is Beyond Good & Evil, and another is Skies of Arcadia (even though that's an RPG). They're a good start, but they're still pretty flat and they could be expanded upon. Come to think of it, a good basis to begin from might even be the original Knytt... but that was all exploration, rather than exploration being a part of another genre.
For example, a bunch of leaves could be obscuring a cave entrance, and beind it might be a network of caves which--if traversed correctly--lead to a monstrous cavern, lit by beautiful crystals, and with heiroglyphs painted upon its walls perhaps detailing one of the more optional-to-know elements of thegame's storyline.
A number of other things could also lead to such things, such as perhaps a seemingly impossible jump that most players might not make as they assume they wouldn't be able to do it, or even giving the level completely optional puzzles which open up new areas of the game, offering the players something new to see. It'd be grand for example if I were to solve a bunch of puzzles in an ancient temple that allowed me to access an ancient, underground arboretum... and there I might find an incredibly alien race but timid race of reptiles caring for their young. The PC could then write about this find in his notebook or such, journalling it with self-drawn images, his own recollection of the enconter andsoforth.
The latter example would be a much more entertaining reward at the end of the game than a list of 'pixel-hunted' for items, I'd think.
In fact, the game could even have a complete side-story contained within more hidden areas, which is detached from the main storyline but helps shed light on it. Akin to what Assassin's Creed did but with the World staying connected as one, isntead of being split in two.
I don't really know what to add to my explanation beyond that, but when I think of exploration, I tend to think of poking out the secret little corners of the World that no one has seen, seeking out the unseen, and treading on grounds that have rarely been tread on, haven't been tread on for centuries, or generally haven't been tread on at all by another explorer's feet. This would also provide a real sense of accomplishment for an explorer, as they would be able to say that they were there, and they saw that.
Just to finish up, I will note that (and don't beat me over the head for this!) World of Warcraft had something like this in it, but it was completely unintentional. I think that patching that element out of the game was the most foolish thing Blizzard did, when opposedly they could've worked it into their MMO as an official element of the game. For those who don't know what I'm talking about here, do a little looking up on 'wall-walking'. There were lots of things to see, cities that the players weren't meant to find, a town of merrily dancing trolls, a rather steampunk airfield... and so on.
So that'd be my beef with that genre. Now (if you like) it's your turn.