Excerpted from Raymond's reply to MS

[KingBahamut]

http://esr.ibiblio.org/index.php?p=208

To: “Mike Walters (Search Wizards)” <v-mikewa@microsoft.com> From: <esr@thyrsus.com>

I’d thank you for your offer of employment at Microsoft, except that it indicates that either you or your research team (or both) couldn’t get a clue if it were pounded into you with baseball bats. What were you going to do with the rest of your afternoon, offer jobs to Richard Stallman and Linus Torvalds? Or were you going to stick to something easier, like talking Pope Benedict into presiding at a Satanist orgy?

If you had bothered to do five seconds of background checking, you might have discovered that I am the guy who responded to Craig Mundie’s “Who are you?” with “I’m your worst nightmare", and that I’ve in fact been something pretty close to your company’s worst nightmare since about 1997. You’ve maybe heard about this “open source” thing? You get one guess who wrote most of the theory and propaganda for it and talked IBM and Wall Street and the Fortune 500 into buying in. But don’t think I’m trying to destroy your company. Oh, no; I’d be just as determined to do in any other proprietary-software monopoly, and the community I helped found is well on its way to accomplishing that goal.

On the day *I* go to work for Microsoft, faint oinking sounds will be heard from far overhead, the moon will not merely turn blue but develop polkadots, and hell will freeze over so solid the brimstone will go superconductive. But I must thank you for dropping a good joke on my afternoon. On that hopefully not too far distant day that I **** on Microsoft’s grave, I sincerely hope none of it will splash on you.

Cordially yours,

Eric S. Raymond

[Donshyoku]

One word for that: OWNED. :razz:

[Kyral]

One word for that: OWNED. :razz:
I second that!

[KingBahamut]

While Eric has done a number of things to put himself at odds with the FOSS community, I do feel that his response to MS was valid.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eric_Raymond

Therein lies his story. Hes definitely a go between. Stallman/Torvy/Morton/Tridgell dont want to own him, nor does MS. He clearly lets his temper get the best of him. Still I admire his ability to speak out against MS.

[drizek]

yaaay. job interview at MS.

http://www.appointmentquest.com/provider/2010224927

lets all sign up

[Kvark]

Whoa! *takes a few steps back*

What a response, sounds like the kind of zealot that can scare anyone away. Put him and Ballmer in a ring and you got the boxing game of the century.

[Brunellus]

Whoa! *takes a few steps back*

What a response, sounds like the kind of zealot that can scare anyone away. Put him and Ballmer in a ring and you got the boxing game of the century.
just crying out for a flash game, ala emogame....

[N'Jal]

Actually, has anyone heard of opensource street fighting? If not google for lug radio and listen to all of season two. It is so funny

[JacX]

I've read both the mail from MS and the response along with many threads both on the Ubuntu forums and others. I have to say that I have never read anything so embarrassing or childish since become involved with the open source /Linux community nor has anything I have read been damaging in that manner.

I am aware of Eric's work (well one book anyway! not sure if he's software is much (not a criticism not sure what he's worked on)) and I am anti Microsoft as the rest on the OS Linux community but the response sounded like it had been written by an un educated moron!! Instead of such an immature and pathetic response perhaps Eric could have take the (better) alternative of making a joke out of to MS's expense.

I'm sorry but the man needs disowning by the OS community.

[papangul]

http://geekz.co.uk/lovesraymond/archive/show-them-the-code
http://geekz.co.uk/lovesraymond/archive/microsoft-job-offer

[az]

Whatever.

More FLOSS in the news. Yay. That's about it.

[JacX]

I wouldn't want people reading about his response as it is not the impression people should get about this fantastic community!!

[Brunellus]

I wouldn't want people reading about his response as it is not the impression people should get about this fantastic community!!
You don't form your opinion of a town from the ravings of a street-corner prophet, do you?

[JacX]

No I totally agree. But if that town was trying to encourage people to move there the idiot might be asked to leave.

I know most people proably don't care but hey I just think it was a poor response. :-?

[primeirocrime]

mr. Raymond is an arrogant prick at times, the letter lacks elegance.

[JacX]

Hey I'm not into people bashing [-X

But you entitled to your opinion.

[primeirocrime]

http://geekz.co.uk/lovesraymond/archive/microsoft-job-offer

[poofyhairguy]

just crying out for a flash game, ala emogame....


Best. Idea. Ever.

[az]

Actually, has anyone heard of opensource street fighting? If not google for lug radio and listen to all of season two. It is so funny

*Love* lugradio. I wish Sparkes would come back (season one).

I just about pee my pants every episode. They pimped the ubuntuforums at the very end of the last episode (last episode of season two)

[Artificial Intelligence]

http://esr.ibiblio.org/index.php?p=208

To: “Mike Walters (Search Wizards)” <v-mikewa@microsoft.com> From: <esr@thyrsus.com>

I’d thank you for your offer of employment at Microsoft, except that it indicates that either you or your research team (or both) couldn’t get a clue if it were pounded into you with baseball bats. What were you going to do with the rest of your afternoon, offer jobs to Richard Stallman and Linus Torvalds? Or were you going to stick to something easier, like talking Pope Benedict into presiding at a Satanist orgy?

If you had bothered to do five seconds of background checking, you might have discovered that I am the guy who responded to Craig Mundie’s “Who are you?” with “I’m your worst nightmare", and that I’ve in fact been something pretty close to your company’s worst nightmare since about 1997. You’ve maybe heard about this “open source” thing? You get one guess who wrote most of the theory and propaganda for it and talked IBM and Wall Street and the Fortune 500 into buying in. But don’t think I’m trying to destroy your company. Oh, no; I’d be just as determined to do in any other proprietary-software monopoly, and the community I helped found is well on its way to accomplishing that goal.

On the day *I* go to work for Microsoft, faint oinking sounds will be heard from far overhead, the moon will not merely turn blue but develop polkadots, and hell will freeze over so solid the brimstone will go superconductive. But I must thank you for dropping a good joke on my afternoon. On that hopefully not too far distant day that I **** on Microsoft’s grave, I sincerely hope none of it will splash on you.

Cordially yours,

Eric S. Raymond


Hehehe...well put it.

:cool:

[Kyral]

Who cares if its elegent. Who expects programmers to have a master of the English language anyway? It got its point across rather nicely. Sometimes telling someone that they are BS is a good thing

[Artificial Intelligence]

Who cares if its elegent. Who expects programmers to have a master of the English language anyway? It got its point across rather nicely. Sometimes telling someone that they are BS is a good thing

Amen!

Nice to see someone who says as it is instead of hiding it in politeness. I think he show M$ that idealism can't be bought off with money.

.:=The AI Dude=:.

[matthew]

I've read several of the things ESR has written, some of it is pretty good. Overall, though, he comes across as a childish um... no, not that word...nice people in this forum...don't want to...hmm He often has good points that can be supported well through logic and mature discussion but instead tends to resort to name-calling and foolishness when the moment comes. He could be a star, instead he is a well-known big fish in a really small pond that usually hurts his cause at least as much (if not more) than he helps it.

FLOSS needs more people with the grace, tact, and ability to discuss things intelligently and coherently the way Linus does. That would work far better than Raymonds ranting (which can be comperable to Ballmer and I love the idea of a flash game R vs B!!) or Stallman's "I'm better than you" arrogance. Both have great ideas with poor implementation in the public arena.

[skoal]

[...]FLOSS needs more people with the grace, tact, and ability to discuss things intelligently and coherently the way Linus does. That would work far better than Raymonds ranting (which can be comperable to Ballmer and I love the idea of a flash game R vs B!!) or Stallman's "I'm better than you" arrogance. Both have great ideas with poor implementation in the public arena.
Whoa. Hey, matthew. Do you have an incision scar about 12 inches running up your right side? Mines on my left. I don't think I could agree more with that statement you made there. I think I finally found my co-joined twin.

By the way, I sense that you might be in danger, brother. Check the leg under your chair. I sense the duct tape holding it in place is about to give way...

\\//_

[Galoot]

Yeah, he's got some issues and he can be zealous to the point of abrasiveness at times, but... HAHAHAHAHAHA!!


HAHAHAHA!!!

[primeirocrime]

Who cares if its elegent. Who expects programmers to have a master of the English language anyway? It got its point across rather nicely. Sometimes telling someone that they are BS is a good thing


Elegance has nothing to do with beeing a poet or a retorics master. The fact is that that guy is abject. And programmers may not be masters in the use of english, but surely they should be masters in the use of language. What point did that guy get across realy except making a spotlight turning to him for a change. I for one only got mildly amused.
Why did he made it public in the first place, to amuse us or so we the public can have the perception of his high school ethical behaviour? Bloody useless.

[matthew]

What point did that guy get across realy except making a spotlight turning to him for a change. I for one only got mildly amused.
For a change??? I think if it were up to him he would ALWAYS be in the spotlight. By the way, I was also amused, but probably not for the intended reason. The MS bashing in the letter was trite, overused and repetitive. (See how I did the same thing i my critique? Clever, huh?) I was sadly amused that anyone would actually take it seriously. I felt like one of the perpetrators sitting back and watching a good practical joke as it happens. The party in the spotlight doesn't realize that they are the joke.

[RavenOfOdin]

I realize this thread is older than the Shady Acres retirement home's Bingo champion, and I apologize for digging it out of its grave. . .but I have to say one thing. . .

That was the BEST thing to come from Raymond and on to a page since "Cathedral and the Bazaar."

I can't say MS didn't deserve that. ;)

[lucia_engel]

The excerpt we didn't get to read...

From: “Mike Walters (Search Wizards)” <v-mikewa@microsoft.com> To: <esr@thyrsus.com>

Eric,

Thank you for your interest. When would you like to start?

Best regards,


Mike
How far will you go? (http://members.microsoft.com/careers/default.mspx)

Mike Walters
CST Senior Recruiter
Microsoft
One Microsoft Way
Redmond, WA 98052 (http://maps.yahoo.com/py/maps.py?Pyt=Tmap&addr=One+Microsoft+Way&csz=Re dmond%2C+WA+98052&country=us)


If you check the link, here's what Raymond said about his hostility:
UPDATE: For those of you who missed the subtlety (which was a surprising lot of you) I was quite polite to this guy on the phone.

[rcarring]

I was going to post here, but I had a better idea...

[KiwiNZ]

Why did a thread demonstrating bad manners get dug up.
Bad manners do not impress. Mr Raymond could simply say thankyou but I respectfully decline.

[John.Michael.Kane]

KiwiNZ Might be time to close it? to avoid any issues.

[KiwiNZ]

Yep